Bring back the Newton as Apple PDA [Archive]

Nebrie

11-12-2001, 08:47 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Fran441:
The Newton 2100 is a great handheld computer. It's power still rivals the Pocket PC handhelds of today.

What Apple needs to do is add a color screen to the 2100, Airport wireless in place of a PCMCIA slot, and more onboard memory.

If Apple was able to sell this type of device with a price tag of under $800, it would be a major hit.<hr></blockquote>

They might as well make it a tablet and compete head on with Microsoft rather than put it into thet overcrowded pda space. The size would be more suited for a tablet as well.

Logan Cale

11-12-2001, 08:49 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Michaelm8000:
...dose...<hr></blockquote>

Does, Mike, does! :)

btober

11-12-2001, 08:57 PM

The Newton rocks!
Check out some of my work on Newton Movie Player and Newton Audio Player at <a href="http://www.handshakecompanies.com/newton/" target="_blank">http://www.handshakecompanies.com/newton/</a>

Addison

11-12-2001, 09:06 PM

What made the Newton better than a Palm?

I have never used nor seen a Newton, this is not a troll.

What I do know is that for a PDA to be really sucessful it must sync with Mac, Windows and Linux. This is essential.

Many of us use a PC at the office and Mac at home, or visa-versa. My ageing Palm III is the only way I can keep the address book up-to-date on different machines etc.

In my opinion a Mac only soloution would limit the market for such a device to the small number of Mac users and may in fact not be attractive to them. If such a device was introduced it must be aimed at the biggest market possible.

Crusader

11-12-2001, 09:08 PM

Awsome btober! That software kicks! As for a new Newton, nah, not until the economy bounces back.

Red Hot Ryan

11-12-2001, 09:09 PM

The newton can sync with Macs and PCs but I don't know about Linux. Hmmm.

gordy

11-12-2001, 09:15 PM

I liked the Newton (I bought the first one), but I really think that it is done.

Apple can't really add anything to a PDA that isn't already available. That's what they seem to like doing--giving their devices an extra edge over the competition.

There isn't really any ground left for a PDA. The OS, features, and form factors are pretty competitive.

However, fran411, I first read this topic back in 1999. I admire your tenacity and devotion to such a cool device.

btober

11-12-2001, 09:19 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Red Hot Ryan:
The newton can sync with Macs and PCs but I don't know about Linux. Hmmm.<hr></blockquote>

Actually, you can do this. -snip-

EDIT: OK - link is messed up. Search on google for "Newton and Linux"

[ 11-12-2001: Message edited by: btober ]

Fran441

11-12-2001, 09:30 PM

Wow. The Newton covers 2/5 of all topics right now on Future Hardware. :D

Matsu

11-12-2001, 09:32 PM

Can you believe it??? All these old faces. Michealm even learned to spell a little better. I still remember your thread about the "SLOAT LOADING iMACS" :p

King Chung Huang

11-12-2001, 09:33 PM

[quote](via private message):

What do you mean about the newton turning on 6 computers?<hr></blockquote>

The Twentieth Anniversary Macintosh (TAM) has built-in Infrared sensors, like many Performas/Power Macs with built-in TV cards. So, by using "Sony Remote" on the Newton, and situating the TAMs in a semi-circle, I can press "Power" on the Newton and all the TAMs will simultaneously startup and play their wonderful startup sound fully synchronized. :)

In reality, most Sony TV remotes will control the TAM and other Macs. Not only can you turn them on an off, but you can adjust the volume, launch Apple Video Player (if you have a TV tuner) and switch channels, etc.

Fran441

11-12-2001, 09:35 PM

The more important question is: "How do you have 6 TAMs?"

DigitalMonkeyBoy

11-12-2001, 09:44 PM

Michaelm8000,
I don't think the iPod was in Apple's particular best interests either! But there it it.

I think if they had someone as superbly efficient as Wozniak around it'd be just the right thing to assert Apple as the innovator of the new millenium.

A "Newton" of some sort able to run a highly optimized GUI, unlike Aqua, with upgradeable AirPort socket, a new-age handheld device socket, static hard disk, water-proof, digital-display support, cellular module and built in camera and/or firewire port.

Imagine, Apple Innovation....revolution of communication!
Tired of not being able to communicate your ideas? The ability to visualise by distance...instantly.

What is this thing missing...floppy drive! ah...no wait..

khrome

11-12-2001, 09:55 PM

I think there are a lot of newton owners who don't realize that Apple subsidized them having technology many years ahead of it's time. The things were not ever profitable. The sad reality is that there are truly great products that are just money pits for the company making them, and the Newton is a prime example. The best thing Apple can do is cannabalize the technology and put it into devices they CAN make a profit with.

If Apple (back in "the day") were to have scaled the Newton back to something they could have made a profit with, they would have had a Palm... and now you can't even profit with those. Frankly, I think Apple is much more likely to release a phone with Newton features, than to re-enter the handheld market. It seems much more reasonable that in a few years the iBook might morph into something smaller and tablet-like as components become cheaper and smaller... the price isn't too far off from what the Ùber-Newton would cost anyway. So in the end, if you own Apple stock you would be wise to applaud Apple's restraint.

Mandricard

11-12-2001, 10:32 PM

Boy, Fran, the more things change, the more they stay the same....

:)

Good to see the boards up and running again.

Mandricard
AppleOutsider

neutrino23

11-12-2001, 11:42 PM

[quote]Originally posted by gordy:
I liked the Newton (I bought the first one), but I really think that it is done.

Apple can't really add anything to a PDA that isn't already available. ...
<hr></blockquote>

There is lots that could be done. Add airport, add a hard drive, add a colr screen.

Make the dingus seamlessly sync with your desktop via airport. No need for cradles, special sync instructions or anything. You just have a PDA folder on your desktop machine. Anything in there (or aliases in there pointing to other files) appears on your PDA and vice versa. When you are out of range stuff gets stored to the HD. When you come back in range it auto-syncs. I think something like this would add more value than cameras or other gadgets. It is not as flashy but you would use it every day.

Make the PDA run OS X lite. The benefit is that you don't have to learn new applications, new interfaces. Simplify your life.

Have optional voice recognition. Great for turning short ideas into searchable text. You could even put in little tags via voice that would trigger Applescripts to store these properly for future access.

Scooterboy

11-13-2001, 01:20 AM

I was recently at an Apple Store to check out the iPod, and when I brought out my Newton MP 2100, every employee in the place had to have a look at it. They'd never seen one, and I ended up spending more time demonstrating the Newt and answering questions than I did checking out the iPod. The Newton still impresses, and is so much easier to use than Pocket PCs or even Palms.
I don't think Apple will be bringing back the Newton any time soon, but if they did I'd only wish that it would auto-sync with a Mac like the new iPod can.

DrPizza

11-13-2001, 01:23 AM

[quote]Originally posted by neutrino23:
There is lots that could be done. Add airport,<hr></blockquote>
Bye-bye battery life.

[quote]add a hard drive,<hr></blockquote>
Yeah, that'll be novel for all the iPaq users with their IBM Microdrives (and Toshiba 5 Gbyte miniature drives like the iPod has...)

[quote]add a colr screen.<hr></blockquote>
Done many times over.

[quote]Make the dingus seamlessly sync with your desktop via airport. No need for cradles, special sync instructions or anything. You just have a PDA folder on your desktop machine. Anything in there (or aliases in there pointing to other files) appears on your PDA and vice versa. When you are out of range stuff gets stored to the HD.<hr></blockquote>
The bummer of the situation is that HDs kill the battery-life. Yeah, it's nice to be able to stick a bunch of MP3s on the thing and use it as a kind of iPod-alike device, but solid-state storage is better for longevity (and that's more important for a PDA).

[quote]When you come back in range it auto-syncs. I think something like this would add more value than cameras or other gadgets. It is not as flashy but you would use it every day.<hr></blockquote>
The downside is that you're heading dangerously towards making the device tethered to a power-point.

I want a PDA that rivals the cellphone I'm gonna buy (Ericsson T39m) in battery-life (300-odd hours for the small battery, 700-odd hours (that's ~30 days) for the big one). There isn't any need for a Gbyte of disk-space on a PDA -- no-one has that many contacts or appointments.

If you want it to be more than a PDA, sure, go right ahead. Make it a bit bigger, give it lots of storage. Give it relatively power-hungry airport.

But don't be under the illusion that it's still a PDA -- it's too short-lived, too bulky, for that. It's a sub-miniature computer, and needs to be capable of computer-type things.

[quote]Make the PDA run OS X lite. The benefit is that you don't have to learn new applications, new interfaces. Simplify your life.<hr></blockquote>
On a fricking PDA?

PDAs need PDA interfaces. A dock that takes up 90% of the screen will /not/ be helpful.

[quote]Have optional voice recognition. Great for turning short ideas into searchable text. You could even put in little tags via voice that would trigger Applescripts to store these properly for future access.<hr></blockquote>
You're gonna, what, stick a G4 in this thing?

Are you wanting it to be a PDA, or a sub-miniature computer?

They are different markets, they have different needs, and different specifications. It sounds like you're trying to sell a sub-miniature computer as a PDA, and that won't work, because it won't do PDA things.

Scooterboy

11-13-2001, 01:54 AM

You know, Newton apps are only around 50 KB to 150 KB, and documents take up far less space, so huge storage isn't really an issue. The Newton OS and GUI are near perfect as they are, and it's still the easiest computer that I've ever used. One problem with the Newton, as far as Apple is concerned, is that it cut into laptop sales.
If I can do all of my work (wp, spreadsheet, emails, fax), voice record, read books and news sites, web browse (sort of), why would I need a laptop? In it's day, the Newton was a good replacement for an 8 lb laptop.

AlbertWu

11-13-2001, 02:07 AM

My friend lent me his MP130 and it totally rocked my Palm Vx!

I seriously hope that apple releases something better, lighter, and cooler (as they have a habit of doing ;) )

long live the newton!

Retrograde

11-13-2001, 07:29 AM

I think some of you are missing it in terms of the question of novelty. Apple has just demonstrated with the iPod that groundbreakingly new is not necessarily where they want to go or even what is perhaps the most financially sound. By producing a device that is head and shoulders above what is currently available Apple thinks it can succeed. Let's hope that there is the market for it and that Apple one day will produce a neoNewton.

DigitalMonkeyBoy

11-13-2001, 09:39 AM

Dr.Pizza you missed me sexy ideas...a GUI UNLIKE OSX becuase you're right, you need a PDA interface.

The PDA should be a self contained unit, and not need to be "synced". Networked people, network! Its a computer too!

All this hand held organizer crap is screwing everyone's perception. The handheld computer should be a self-contained unit and have an HFS+ compatible file system.

Enigma

11-13-2001, 09:46 AM

Apple has no plans on releasing a PDA (Palm or Newton like) within the next few years. And if they do - I'll send each one of you guys who think they currently have a PDA in the works $5 ;)

Jobs, Schiller, and Rubinstein all have privately said, that 'they have no immediate plans to work with any type of PDA at this time' to workers at Apple. of course they could be lying, but if we knew for sure... where would the fun be? :D

neutrino23

11-13-2001, 09:51 AM

[quote]Originally posted by DrPizza:

Are you wanting it to be a PDA, or a sub-miniature computer?
<hr></blockquote>

I want something familiar that takes care of me rather than adding demands to my time and attention. To me that means tearing off a piece of my familiar desktop and taking it with me.

If it could run Tex-Edit Plus and maybe a text based browser and do email that would be very nice.

Voice input doesn't have to be as robust as it can be on a desktop. It could store a one or two minute memo or note-to-myself and then chew on it. would love to have this available as searchable text but I can't be bothered to carry around a keyboard every minute of the day.

I think there are ways around most of your objections. True, the drive doesn't need to be 5GB, it could work with one of the smaller and less power hungry IBM microdrives. Also, the drive doesn't need to spin continuosly. Similarly with the Airport card, it needn't be powered all the time. It could be set to check in at regular intervals and if you are travelling you could turn that off altogether.

You could run a stripped down OS X without much of the UI things such as shading, anti–aliasing, live updates and such to reduce much of the demand on the processor. This could run on a low power G3 such as IBM just announced. As long as it gets more than 24 hours or so of battery life that should be enough for most application. It may not be practical this month or next but before long this technology will exist.

As for the 100s of hours of life on the cell phone, I suspect that is in a kind of sleep mode. It can't last that long if it is always transmitting.

rok

11-13-2001, 09:53 AM

finally, the rok has come back to....

ah, forget it.

nice to be back. feels like home. smells like it, too. ;)

Retrograde

11-14-2001, 06:13 AM

I, too, have wondered whether I really want a PDA or a subnotebook. Escher has pointed out one of the obvious differences between the 2 before: that a subnotebook should run the full Mac OS whereas a PDA would run a pared down or alternative OS that would match its size and function. For me, the PDA would have to more than just a planner, it would have to be some sort of pocketMac and if so, even running a pared down OS, I wonder if I could get away with doing what I need to do with a pocketMac. Maybe I'm just greedy: I'd like to see a pocketMac and a 3lb subnotebook! :D

ihxo

11-14-2001, 06:48 AM

KAKA I actually remember Fran441 ...

after like 5 years there's still no NEWTON replacement (as promised in 1997)... the touchscreen of my newton is dead already .. probably coz I discharged it for too long ...

well actually if you look at Mac OS X closely u'll see that newton and OS X really looks similiar in some ways. so my request is a subnotebook that could SYNC with a desktop, ibook or powerbook..... is that too much to ask ?? ~~

Spec:
G3 processor (whatever clockspeed)
qwerty keyboard
about 8-9 inch screen
it could use the harddrive in ipod (it's freaking FAST)
USB X 1
Firewire X 1

Well that's pretty much everything I need so far .. I'll add stuff like builtin microwave or stuff like that later .

Belle

11-14-2001, 01:24 PM

Perhaps Palm will bring you the device you are looking for now it's bought out Be? I'd be much happier seeing Palm killed attempting such a project at this time than Apple.
[quote]after like 5 years there's still no NEWTON replacement (as promised in 1997)...<hr></blockquote>
Who made this promise? Can you post the text?

Matvei

11-14-2001, 01:51 PM

Not exactly a promise but...

<a href="http://www.msu.edu/~luckie/jobslet.htm" target="_blank">http://www.msu.edu/~luckie/jobslet.htm</a>

Tow:
"I emailed Steve Jobs this past weekend and received the following
response from him concerning the future of Newton:"

Jobs:
"Adam,

The Emate has a bright future - and it is for this reason
that I am pulling it back into Apple -which has the resouces
to market and sell it much more broadly. You can imagine
that a small spin-off company would not have such a large
sales force or marketing budget. With the appropriate
investments in sales and marketing, we hope that the Emate
can become a great success.

We are a little more confused about the MessagePad. Since
it costs more ($1K or more vs $700-799 for the Emate) and
has no keyboard, its market seems more limited than the
Emate. However, sales of the current MessagePad are brisk,
so who knows... What do you think?

Don't worry - we are pulling this group back into Apple so
that we can invest even more sales and marketing resources
into these products, rather than dumping the products into a
small spin-off which lacks such resources.

Best,
Steve"

Belle

11-14-2001, 03:24 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Matvei:
Not exactly a promise but...

...
<hr></blockquote>
As you say, not exactly a promise.

swissmac

11-14-2001, 04:12 PM

[quote]Originally posted by JW Pepper:
What made the Newton better than a Palm?

I have never used nor seen a Newton, this is not a troll.

What I do know is that for a PDA to be really sucessful it must sync with Mac, Windows and Linux. This is essential.
<hr></blockquote>

The difference between Newton and Palm is that a Palm is useless without a PC or a Mac in everyday work. You can't even put data into the device in an elegant and easy way. The Newton can stand for itself. Of cource with the sync with applications on Mac, Win or Linux it's even more useful. The Newton is a brilliant concept which could have been everything. From MP3 Player, Game Console, Webdevice, Remote Control, endless...
Now a Casio Cassiopeia is (after 4 Years) from the hardware in some areas on the same level like the Newton was. The Palm is still a Newton 1.0 from 1993. (Only a bit smaller)

nonhuman

11-14-2001, 04:19 PM

What about this:

A device that's just slightly longer and wider than an iBook keyboard, and somewhat thicker than an iPod.

Why are the dimensions based on an iBook keyboard and an iPod? Because it has an iBook keyboard, and the same drive used in an iPod. It also has a fold-down touch-screen LCD that's the same size as the iBook keyboard allowing it to close into a sleek iBook like package only much much smaller. With the diminutive dimensions necessary to accomodate the drive and keyboard there'd still be plenty of room for a generous battery and a low-power mobo that could be much more capable than your standard PDA. Add in a FireWire port for charging the battery and transfering files, and optional AirPort and you've got one hell of a sub-notebook that's small enough to be used as a PDA and is still a fully functional computer with plenty power for any of the tasks required by anyone from a gradeschool student to CEO (photoshop and games are not necessary...).

It would probably be a little pricy, but I think it would be feasable, and the higher price would keep it from competing with the iBook.

ihxo

11-14-2001, 07:46 PM

<a href="http://www.tmug.org/~smythe/Apple_eMate_Replacement_St.html" target="_blank">http://www.tmug.org/~smythe/Apple_eMate_Replacement_St.html</a>

"Apple has still not made good on the promise they made in early 1998 when they promised a replacement for the Newton in about a year."

They did make a promise (not in 1997 though :p ) anyways I think most newton users will remember that promise, because it's that promise that made so mant newton users posting on AI about apple's future PDA ...

Belle

11-14-2001, 07:59 PM

[quote]Originally posted by ihxo:
"Apple has still not made good on the promise they made in early 1998 when they promised a replacement for the Newton in about a year."<hr></blockquote>
This is one of the most misquoted Apple press releases. The <a href="http://www.apple.com/pr/library/1998/feb/27newton.html" target="_blank">document</a> states:
[quote]Apple is committed to affordable mobile computing, pioneered by the eMate, and will be serving this market with Mac OS-based products beginning in 1999.<hr></blockquote>
It does not promise a new Newton. It promises affordable mobile computers running Mac OS in 1999 - the iBook.

ihxo

11-14-2001, 08:39 PM

I guess you still don't understand ... Newton replacement = something to replace Newton, but not necessary Newton ....

so far they have made anything that could replace emate yet, you may say iBook could replace emate, but the problem is, it's still too big to be a newton replacement !!

Apple could release a 9xx-1000 dollars subnotebook, then I'll say that apple did make a newton replacement.

And trust me the word "newton replacement" is still echoing somewhere in my head. And yes they said nothing about a "newton replacement" in the press release, but those 2 words did come out from steve's mouth.

<a href="http://macweek.macworld.com/2000/10/15/1017rsapple.html" target="_blank">http://macweek.macworld.com/2000/10/15/1017rsapple.html</a>

do you understand why even places like macweek talks about "newton replacement" ? because some important ppl (iCEO) in apple did said that ..

Belle

11-14-2001, 08:54 PM

[quote]Originally posted by ihxo:
I guess you still don't understand ... Newton replacement = something to replace Newton, but not necessary Newton ....<hr></blockquote>
I understand completely that people want something to replace the Newton, and not necessarily something resembling the original. I just dispute the fact Apple ever "promised" such a device.
[quote]so far they have made anything that could replace emate yet, you may say iBook could replace emate, but the problem is, it's still too big to be a newton replacement !!<hr></blockquote>
Very true, but my point was still Apple didn't promise to replace the Newton.
[quote]And yes they said nothing about a "newton replacement" in the press release, but those 2 words did come out from steve's mouth.<hr></blockquote>
Which was the quote I was looking for in my original post.
[quote]do you understand why even places like macweek talks about "newton replacement" ? because some important ppl (iCEO) in apple did said that ..<hr></blockquote>
Well, the article you link to features opinions from people garnered by MacWeek, but I'm still 100% sure Steve Jobs did not ever promise a "Newton replacement".

Don't misunderstand me, I've no objection to people wanting one, or discussing it here, it just annoys me when people say something like "Apple promised us one" without having any evidence of such a promise.

plazman30

11-15-2001, 09:52 AM

Well, a couple of comments about the Newton....

The NewtonOS was just light years better than either the PalmOS or WinCE. It was just spectacular! I used a Newton at work for 6 months and it literally pained me to have to go back to a Palm IIIx. I can't even begin to tell you how user friendly the NewtonOS is or how intuitive it is. And the hardwriting recognition was just unbelievable!

What Apple really needed was a smaller machine with a smaller price tag on it. Newtons costing $1000 were just a bit too pricy for the average joe. I think Apple actually had MessagePad 3000 prototypes with color screens already made. I know that there's a webiste somewhere with Apple Newton prototypes on it.

The other uniuque thing about the Newton vs. other PDAs is that the Newton was the first device that let me do EVERYTHING on the device. I never felt the need to sync with my desktop. I just carried the Newton everywhere with me for the whole six months and only hooked up it up to my PC to install software. It came with an e-book reader was back in the early 90s and the screen on it was big enought to make it decent for e-book reading. I can't even imagine reading e-books on a Palm and PocketPC screen!

And one last note that I think you'll find amazing.... In 1995, when Windows 95 was released, the NewtonOS won OS of the Year at the Las Vegas CES, beating out Windows 95!

A new Newton should have the follwing features:

1. Color high resolution screen
2. SD and CF
3. Rechargeable
4. Screen larger than a Palm, but smaller than the old Newton
5. Stereo Sound
6. The awesome NewtonOS!

Anyone who is really into PDAs, should spend about a half an hour playing with a Newton and you'll really wonder why this thing was killed by Apple.

ihxo

11-15-2001, 10:13 AM

I totally agree with the poster above. I mean I can even print/ Fax / get on the internet from newton 5 years ago.
could it get any better ??

but the problem is how do we get apple to listen to us ?? :p

Belle

11-15-2001, 01:32 PM

[quote]Originally posted by plazman30:
Anyone who is really into PDAs, should spend about a half an hour playing with a Newton and you'll really wonder why this thing was killed by Apple.<hr></blockquote>
Um, I'm thinking they killed it because it ate $400 million in R&D costs, and made less than $60 million in pre-tax profits over the five years of it's fat, heavy life.

jutus

11-15-2001, 01:48 PM

Bottom line: There were not enough rich freaks to buy them.

I got mine (an MP120) used, and it still cost me 400 bucks at the time.

The question is: Can Apple offer something a big step up from the Palm/Handspring/WinCe device functionality-wise, in the same price range?

Given Apple's resources, current product direction, and the economy, I'd have to figure no.

ihxo

11-15-2001, 02:08 PM

[quote]Originally posted by jutus:
The question is: Can Apple offer something a big step up from the Palm/Handspring/WinCe device functionality-wise, in the same price range?<hr></blockquote>

The price range is from $100 to like $600, that's a freaking big range, but sorry my guess is yes, they can make a PDA at that price range. But just face it, Sony is going to eat Palm and Handspring alive really soon, and Steve think PDA is not the way to go, so it would be best for apple to not make a PDA.

jutus

11-15-2001, 04:47 PM

How is that Sony handheld selling these days?

Belle

11-15-2001, 05:06 PM

[quote]Originally posted by ihxo:
The price range is from $100 to like $600, that's a freaking big range, but sorry my guess is yes, they can make a PDA at that price range.<hr></blockquote>
But the real question is can Apple make a PDA in that price range that offers something others do not? I figure the answer is a definite "no". Mac OS-compatibility and great industrial design is not enough.

Compaq is having to offer huge rebates and a low-end model iPaq - once considered the ultimate handheld - because they're not selling.

Scooterboy

11-15-2001, 05:25 PM

I thinik one major problem with the Newton is that it was too good. I mean, if you bought a Newton, what use was a laptop? The Newton, as stated above, cost huge amounts of R&D money, and the ones sold ate into the very profitalbe Apple laptop sales.

I also agree about the Newton OS, and I feel that it is still the best OS out there. More intuitive than any other computer, and more integrated. Not only can you email, fax, web browse, spreadsheet, code HTML, program, etc. on it, but applications seamlessly work together like on no other OS that I've used. If I want to, say, email this web page, or fax a spreadsheet, or print via wire or IR, I need only tap the routing button, and tap my choice, enter in address or phone number (from drop down menu or manually) and tap "Mail", or "Fax", or "Print", or "Beam". That's it. So easy!

I wish our "modern" OSes could work that way. If the Newton OS had continuing development, it would be light years ahead of anything else on the market today, instead of only miles.

But, if it cost nearly as much as an iBook (or even Powerbook), it would have to be a choice between the Newton or the 'Book. I haven't even decided if I'll bother syncing up my MP 2100 with my new iBook, as it's done so well as my only computer for 3 years.

...My 200 KB (which would be a lot of memory on the Newton platform).

Caoimhín

Belle

11-15-2001, 05:34 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Caoimhín:
Not only can you email, fax, web browse, spreadsheet, code HTML, program, etc. on it, but applications seamlessly work together like on no other OS that I've used.<hr></blockquote>
I won't argue that the Newton had some impressive features, but I'd say there are four of six things in your list I'd absolutely hate to have to do on a Newton, or any other small pen-based device.

ihxo

11-15-2001, 11:45 PM

[quote]Originally posted by Belle:

But the real question is can Apple make a PDA in that price range that offers something others do not? I figure the answer is a definite "no". Mac OS-compatibility and great industrial design is not enough.

Compaq is having to offer huge rebates and a low-end model iPaq - once considered the ultimate handheld - because they're not selling.<hr></blockquote>

The problem you are concerning is those PDA doesn't sell, just face it apple could make a palm and put the type of screen they use in newton, and port the HWR to apple's palm, then there you go, a really solid Apple Palm OS PDA, and I challenge anyone that Newton's screen is not better than any palm screen out there, and Newton's HWR is not better and easier.

But the problem is it won't sell, that's the point I was talking about. Sony will still eat Apple's palm alive after eating handspring's and palm's.

Bogie

11-16-2001, 01:34 AM

there is definitely no interest in a Newton forum here ...

<img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />

Bogie

11-16-2001, 03:00 AM

<a href="http://forums.appleinsider.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=10&t=000069" target="_blank">http://forums.appleinsider.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=10&t=000069</a>

Please post there if you have Newton interest.

But make sure you don't make any references to the Newton in Suggestions ... or it'll magically get locked ...

plazman30

11-16-2001, 08:46 AM

What I think Apple SHOULD do, instead of making a new PDA is make software to ADD to a PDA, to make a Palm, more Newtonlike. I have a Palm IIIx and I like it. My big issue with it is the screen. It's too damn small. I fell the Newton screen was too damn big. Apple would be good to make a "Apple Mobile Connectivity Enhancement Pack" or iAssist and include the following:

1. The Newton HWR for Palm
2. Conduits for MacOS X Mail and Address Book
3. Some other custom apps with conduits for things like TextEdit.
4. Conduits to sync pictures between your Pictures folder in your home directory and a CF/SD card. Same with movies.
5. QuickTime for Palm
6. iTunes for Palm with sync

Sadly, we will never see a new Newton, as much as every person that ever owned a Newton wants one.

Now Apple probably could not make decent money on a handheld device, BUT I see no reason they couldn't sell the NewtonOS to another party outright and let them do what they want with it. In this economy, that would be a good thing for Apple.

Rumor has it that Apple has been contacted a number of times by third parties to buy the NewtonOS.

Belle

11-16-2001, 02:15 PM

[quote]Originally posted by ihxo:
But the problem is it won't sell, that's the point I was talking about. Sony will still eat Apple's palm alive after eating handspring's and palm's.<hr></blockquote>
I think we're now arguing the same point. I was just trying to say firstly that Apple never made any promises about a new Newton, and secondly that Apple would be foolish to release a PDA (Or any kind of handheld) in a market currently unreceptive to such devices.

Everyone can now go back to the fun speculation stuff. I'm done.