What's next for Apple notebooks?

[ua2006]

I was thinking the other day that the Apple notebook lineup (PowerBooks & iBooks) will need to be refreshed soon. The current design is still very nice but it has remained the same for a while now, so I'm sure Apple is preparing something new. What are your ideas on what the new notebooks could look like (what material will they be made out of, what sizes will be available, etc.)? And what may be the next specs? Your thoughts?

[Peter North]

Yeah, it is the notebooks turn. Everybody here is going to say carbon fibre but I am hoping for gunmetal.

[ua2006]

I'm not sure if Apple would use carbon fiber. It would definitely raise the price on the notebooks. I have a feeling Apple is planning to stay with aluminum for a while.

[iDave]

I think PowerBooks will remain pretty much the way they are until Apple can shoehorn a G5 into one next year sometime. There might be minor speed and spec bumps in the meantime.

As for the iBook, I'd expect a new enclosure before long. It'll probably be similar to the current iBook except for some kind of new exterior texture or material. Perhaps not though, since the new iMac has the crystal white look. The current iBook design has been around for three plus years. Even though it's popular, it seems ripe for a revamp.

[wizard69]

I'd love to see a die cast heavy duty aluminum framed model. Something that could compete with Panasonics Toughbook models. Yeah it would be a little bulky and maybe a bit heavier but the goal would be bullet proof construction, sort of an iBook enhanced if you would.

Frankly this would be another model entirely and like the Toughbooks low volmne. It would be nice to see Apple introduce niche variants of the Mac for specific markets, I think it would demonstrate confidence on the part of Apple as a corporation.

Dave


Originally posted by s_sarinana
I'm not sure if Apple would use carbon fiber. It would definitely raise the price on the notebooks. I have a feeling Apple is planning to stay with aluminum for a while.

[dmgeist]

Anodized aluminum colored shells, interchangeable or atmospherically
changing enclosures.

Biometric fingerprint scanners as part of the track pad.

OLED displays

Removable keyboards with underlying tablet surface.

Dual HD for RAID configurations using IPOD HD.

Fully user serviceable laptops

[admactanium]

i'd take a carbon fiber powerbook in a heartbeat.

[Peter North]

I hope they dont jam a crippled G5 chip into a 2.5 inch thick laptop that runs hot and gets 2 hours battery life.

[DHagan4755]

What's next for Apple notebooks?

Given Apple's public statements about the G5 in a PowerBook, I would venture to say that the next PowerBook will feature a 1.8GHz PowerPC 7448 from Motorola/Freescale. I know, I know. The speeds of the supposed 7448 have yet to be discussed, but I am assuming that because the iMac G5 is at 1.8 GHz, the PowerBooks will attempt to match the clock speed, albeit it will be a G4 processor and not a G5.

I think the next rev of PowerBooks will be the first to sport 100GB hard drives.

I don't know if an enclosure modification or complete make-over is in the works, but the current crop of aluminum clad PowerBooks have been around since January 2003 —_closing in on two years. Rumors of carbon fiber have been floated for quite some time — mostly from Mac OS Rumors. So who knows how true this is! :D

Regarding the iBooks — even longer still — their enclosures have remained relatively the same since they were released on May 1, 2001. I would expect both lines would receive a cosmetic make-over.

Which brings us to the when. I think it's a crap shoot at this point. I would say anywhere from the last week of September (when a promotion with PowerBooks ends) to MacWorld SanFran in January. The later we wait for an update, the more and more the liklihood that they will be getting a major redesign at MacWorld in January.

[farve]

I think the current Powerbook design is going to stick with us for quite some time. Its a very refined case and i dont think they'll update it withoute a real practical need for it. I don't really see the point of updating the form unless they find a way of making it even thinner or a way to buikd it more cost effectivly. They might strech it to experimenting with colour, it would be nice with some polished aluminum parts (back of Ipod) on on sufaces you keep your hands off (whatever that may be).
Aluminum detailes would also be great for the Ibook (to boost the resemblence to the i pod).

As for performance, they will be the fastest powerbooks Apple has ever made

[DHagan4755]

I think there is a reason to improve the exterior of the PowerBook...so they can make the interior more servicable. Look at the new iMac and its serviceability. I think this is more of a trend you will start to see on all Apple products. They have built the current iBooks and PowerBooks with such a compact internal design, it is costly to fix minor issues and components because of it's brutally compact unforgiving internal construction.

[drsuse]

Originally posted by farve
As for performance, they will be the fastest powerbooks Apple has ever made

well, yeah... ;)

i think mosr is actually pretty reasonable with what they think for the next update: freescale 7448, ati 9800, faster hard drive etc.

i don't think there'll be a new case unless they switch to the dual core g4 or g5...

[wizard69]

While there current case is certianly nice there is always room for improvement. You point out one very good direction to go in. Personally I'd like to see a stronger case for the PowerBooks, it seems that the iBook wins in case strength and durability.

It was mentioned on another thread but I'd love to see a miniBook also. This would be a machine with a small display and no spindles except possibly a micro drive. The idea would be to have OS/X in ROM! Supply a bunch of USB and Firewire ports and a graphics port and that is it for hard ports. Networking would be WiFi. Sort of like half way between a laptop and a PDA.

Dave


Originally posted by DHagan4755
I think there is a reason to improve the exterior of the PowerBook...so they can make the interior more servicable. Look at the new iMac and its serviceability. I think this is more of a trend you will start to see on all Apple products. They have built the current iBooks and PowerBooks with such a compact internal design, it is costly to fix minor issues and components because of it's brutally compact unforgiving internal construction.

[DHagan4755]

I got to thinking (uh oh!) and if there is no update before Christmas, it's a safe bet that PowerBooks will have a major revision come MWSF. In terms of what "major" improvements may be made, I think the following are all possible, second to the obvious faster G4 processor:

— New Enclosure
Taking a cue from the new iMac G5, a PowerBook design mindful of internal arrangement of components, therefore making it easy to upgrade and service. Carbon Fiber? Thinner? Possibly.

— Displays
A new PowerBook line that heralds a brighter, wider angle of view display with improved resolution.

— Battery Life
An increase in battery life would be a step in the right direction. Look for PowerBooks with new battery technology. This will have to be the case since the processors have gotten faster, and the displays brighter.

[earthtoandy]

i think the aluminum might stick around for awhile... seems that the brushed alum is the look they are going for for high end things (powermac and powerbook)

[IonYz]

What's all this talk of carbon fiber? Yuck. They will keep the same "metal" look for professional lines (PowerBook) and the white for consumer (iBook).

Other interesting parallels with the iMac G5 were made. With Apple playing up the G5 will they have a problem pitching a three grand laptop with an "old, slow, non-64-bit" G4 processor? Without a magically cooling process, or special "mobile line" for G5 chips how can we see them fitting in the current design?

[list=1] Apple continues using G4-variants, as they are "low power, embedded" processors, and meant specifically for platforms such as laptops
Introduce a heavier, thicker, hotter, power-hungrier PowerBook to the masses early next year
IBM creates a special "mobile" version of the G5
[/list=1]

Don't think for a second Apple will simply underclock the current G5 to 1.2GHz and attempt at passing it off as "Professional" and faster than a 1.5 or 1.8GHz G4.

As far as colors go. They should offer their consumer line in colors. iMac and iBook should be a rainbow.

[earthtoandy]

well as i said somewhere else i thought IBM was developing a g5 that would, with a little tweaking, work in laptops. They are working on G5's thats will work well in rack mounted servers. Same principles of heat and all. Just should make it a mobile variant. thats what they are working on i believe

[IonYz]

Originally posted by earthtoandy
They are working on G5's thats will work well in rack mounted servers. Same principles of heat and all.

Not necessarily no. While racks may be thin (1U = 1.75") they are commonly powered by very fast fans. A Power Mac G5 can't hold a candle to a 1U server. Its a step in the right direction but mobile requires smaller areas, much less power and a sliver of the cooling.

[earthtoandy]

COOL IT DOWN. Here's the connection: Rack-mounted blade servers share some of the same problems as laptops, namely, heat output and power consumption. Often measuring less than an inch thick, they must work in close quarters where ventilation is scant. For that reason, keeping them cool is difficult, with possible heat-extraction mechanisms limited due to the surroundings and the small physical enclosure of the server itself.

The simplest way to reduce heat is to trim the amount of power going into a chip. That's what IBM has probably done with its PPC blade servers, which are slated to hit the shelves in March, 2004. This implies that a low-power G5 laptop chip is only a small step away from the existing product. "The only thing lacking in the current 970 to make it a laptop is a low-voltage mode. The technology of the PPC 970 is very rapidly approaching the point where such things become slam dunks," says Glaskowsky.

[Peter North]

Originally posted by IonYz
What's all this talk of carbon fiber? Yuck.


Yeah, it seems so Honda Civicy modish

[Chris Cuilla]

I am beginning to wonder what else Apple could do with their laptops and (now) the iMac. At some point, it seems to me, you have exhausted all design options and you begin refining what you've got. With laptops, the limitations are more severe. How many different ways can you really build a laptop. Especially when the goals are, generally, smaller, lighter, thinner...and cheaper.

I expect Apple may stay with these basic designs for some time. I actually hope they do. Now, that doesn't mean the internals will not change (of course). And I can imagine Apple working hard to (as they do with iPod) to squeeze millimeters, ounces and dollars out of these product, while still trying to deliver better products.

The iMac is the same. The iMac G5 is basically a portable computer. Yes, a bug one. But look at it. It is simple a ginormous laptop. It's the best they can do with the G% right now. But the same question applies...how many different ways can you really design a computer before you are really stretching the boundaries of taste, reality, and what people want?

[iDave]

You're right Chris. Without doing something that's going to look silly, there's only so much that can be done with a laptop. I think a lot could be done to make them scratch and dent resistant. A full-size extended keyboard could be put in the PowerBook 17". Except for that, improved displays and better specs is about all that we'll see.

I suspect there's no chance of a new enclosure for the PowerBooks until there's a new CPU which might require it. The aluminum design just isn't old enough.

[satchmo]

Originally posted by iDave

I suspect there's no chance of a new enclosure for the PowerBooks until there's a new CPU which might require it. The aluminum design just isn't old enough.

Agreed.
And with respect to the iBooks, I can't see a change in colour either. Yes, it has remained relatively the same since the clamshell days. But it's white exterior have become synonomous with what an iBook is. You can spot them a mile away and not mistaken the Apple brand.

[DHagan4755]

Don't get me wrong...aluminum may stay. Mac OS Rumors says carbon fiber. Usually if they are right, then hell is freezing over. But a few of the supposed insiders that have posted here and elsewhere have stated carbon fiber is next up for the PowerBooks. Their claim for the switch to carbon fiber — Apple needs a stronger material for the PowerBook's enclosure when it comes to all of the grills they need to incorporate to vent heat.

[Peter North]

carbon fiber is ugly and 90's tacky though

[satchmo]

Originally posted by Peter North
carbon fiber is ugly and 90's tacky though

In most cases, it is extremely tacky.
However, it's already being used in at least one ThinkPad and surely Apple could do even better incorporating the material into a nice Ive-like package.

http://www.biosmagazine.co.uk/rev.php?id=165

The ThinkPad X40 includes lots of hardware technology and software solutions that aren't instantly obvious, but make computing on the move a lot more accessible than with competitor offerings. For instance, the laptop's enclosure is made of titanium composite carbon fibre reinforced plastic that is around three times the strength of ABS plastic. The system's thick metal hinges that connect the core of the base to the top cover might add a little weight, but it keeps the ThinkPad T42 extremely durable. A ThinkLight keyboard light located on the top edge of the display even illuminates the keyboard to let you work in low-light conditions

[neutrino23]

There was a lot of speculation recently about a dual processor PB. I would prefer that to a G5, at least for the time being. It would give you a lot of power when you need it (and are plugged in to an outlet) and give you long battery life at other times.

A little better battery life would be nicer. Why is it that NewerTek can supply batteries with so much more capacity than Apple does?

A little higher screen resolution would be nice.

A better WiFi antenna would be nice. Maybe a provision for an external antenna.

[admactanium]

well, carbon fiber can easily be painted. i personally like cf but that's because i'm a cf whore on my motorcycles. there's also aluminum fiber, which is similar to carbon fiber obviously but with aluminum threads instead. it's made stronger and stiffer by the resin. so aluminum fiber would be pretty darned cool actually.

[Amorph]

I believe Apple has used carbon fiber before in PowerBooks. However, they used it for the cage around the hardware, not for the case. If they use carbon fiber again, I'd expect it to be for that reason.

Then again, carbon fiber is black, and Steve has a jones for black PowerBooks...

[Peter North]

Originally posted by admactanium
well, carbon fiber can easily be painted


and then chip

[iDave]

Yeah, like Apple wants to release another PowerBook with paint chipping problems. :no:

[farve]

Like the old titaniums, they fugly when the paint starts to chip

[TKN]

iBook- I think iPod mini colored aluminum enclosures for the iBooks along with thinning them out to make the current 12" Powerbook obsolete at 4 lbs. Release limited edition colors to generate revenue, or change the colors with generations.

Powerbook- subnotebook size fast G4? 12" challenging the Panasonic W2, keep the 15 and 17" at about the same size with G5s. The subnotebook is a huge gap Apple has for the Asia market...

[jaegermann]

Originally posted by Peter North
I hope they dont jam a crippled G5 chip into a 2.5 inch thick laptop that runs hot and gets 2 hours battery life.

Welcome to the world of Wintel notebooks:lol:

[Peter North]

Originally posted by jaegermann
Welcome to the world of Wintel notebooks:lol:


that is hilarious. you should look into getting a standup special on HBO

[Kassandra]

I would love to see an anodized aluminum iBook line lol, i'd get a pink one asap! But I would also want the current design to be an option aswell, as I think it's the best notebook design in the industry.

[Gavriel]

Originally posted by Amorph
Then again, carbon fiber is black, and Steve has a jones for black PowerBooks...

Pardon? What does that mean? From the context I gather it means something like "a sweat spot for" or something? If so, what makes you say that?

[nooon]

Originally posted by jaegermann
Welcome to the world of Wintel notebooks:lol:

So true.
I had a P4 2.0GHz Fujitsu-Siemens laptop before I made the switch. It basically had a prosessor designed for a desktop computer put in a laptop, with two fans that ran constantly and a 1,5h batterylife. After 4 months one of the fans just quit working, and the laptop started overheating and turning off everytime I did something slightly prosessor-demanding.

I would hate to get a Powerbook G5 that acted like this..

[PB]

Originally posted by nooon
So true.
I had a P4 2.0GHz Fujitsu-Siemens laptop before I made the switch. It basically had a prosessor designed for a desktop computer put in a laptop, with two fans that ran constantly and a 1,5h batterylife.

Those were the days with the Pentium 4 in notebooks. But not anymore. The Pentium-M based notebooks have much better battery life than any Powerbook. And are way more powerful. Apple has yet to reach this level of performance.

[earthtoandy]

yeah i remember taking a class and the professor had a 3ghz laptop (HP i think) and it took a solid 15 minutes for it to start up and be useful. pfff

[Splinemodel]

Well, I'm expecting nothing less than a 15cm diameter puck that holographically emits a monitor and any other interface device imaginable.

[Amorph]

Originally posted by Splinemodel
Well, I'm expecting nothing less than a 15cm diameter puck that holographically emits a monitor and any other interface device imaginable.

I'm not buying until at least 3 of them are unimaginable.

BTW, for the question upthread: "jones" is slang for "hunger" or "desire." It came out during the Titanium PowerBook phase that Steve wasn't happy that it wasn't black. Then, well, it went aluminum. Heh. I guess the combination of great sales and the difficulty of reliably painting or anodizing the metal overruled him. (I'm not sure about aluminum, but titanium only anodizes into iridescent gem tones).

[cory]

yea i would say no new update in the powerbook design anytime soon. As you can see the upper end (powerbooks, powermacs and the new displays) all have that alluminum look.imacs and ibook have the white and grey look. I think both are pretty sweet. No need for a design change unless one posses has a big problem.. But O how the G5 powerbook will be nice.. someday someday..

[farve]

I just found out that Fuitsu Siemens are about to inroduce the LifeBook :the design of the the laptop is extremly "inspired"
by the Mac laptops, In shape it looks exatly like the 15inch PowerBook, the bottom part is Aluminum but the top
is in white plastic.
Altough it's a blatant ripoff it will undermine Apples unike design. I think the current Apple designs are fantastic
and don't need an update but they need to respond to state that there one step ahead.
Apple has for a long time now been in the for front of experimenting with materials for there laptops and I think
they should continue to do this since that is the only way to diffretiate a laptop.
Cabon fiber could look great when you do that woven kind of thing, although i would prefer a powerbook in gold (24k) :)

Viktor

[jouster]

Originally posted by iDave
I think a lot could be done to make them scratch and dent resistant.

Well, dents and cracks, though esthetically displeasing, are good ways of absorbing energy from a fall, no?

I always thought that making a laptop case extremely rigid would be counter productive. Don't you risk having all the energy (which has to go *somewhere*) end up at a much more sensitive part, like the MB?

[iDave]

Originally posted by jouster
Well, dents and cracks, though esthetically displeasing, are good ways of absorbing energy from a fall, no?

I always thought that making a laptop case extremely rigid would be counter productive. Don't you risk having all the energy (which has to go *somewhere*) end up at a much more sensitive part, like the MB?
Um, ok, point taken. I haven't yet dropped my PowerBook, so I guess I should have just said "scratch resistant." I'm not sure what could be done. All I know is that the slightest scuff to an iBook or PowerBook makes a pretty ugly scar.

[cubist]

I'd like them to be like the original IceBook with an outer clear case, and make that case easily (and inexpensively) replaceable. Go ahead and gouge it all to heck, you can replace it next week.

[rottenspam]

I think too many people here have a processer fetish. I mean yeah processors are important but they are certianly not the only componet that can be improved. In fact people do buy macs for the CPU, lets get realistic here. IF it was the CPU that sold all computer people would try to buy the best most advanced processor for the price. But its not speed that sells its what you can do with it.

My predicitions for new powerbooks...

1. Apple goes to widescreen format on all powerbooks including the 12.1" As this seems to be the market trend. Also might see higher resolutions, though doubtful
2. Firewire 800 on all machines, as well as airport
3. New videocards, lets face it the 5200 is a weak card, we'll probably see 9800's at the top end, if it dosen't suck a lot of battery life, but the 9800 is marginally faster then a 9700. The 9800 is a joke for portabilty.
4. Better built in sound lets face it my ibook is pretty weak in that department.
5. Faster CPU's probably with larger L2 cache and a faster FSB, maybe a bump to DDR400

I think all changes will be minor an incremental. We might see dual core CPU's apple seems to be going that direction with all their computers. I would suspect that apple would like a dual core G4 so they can claim to be first with a dual core notebook.

[johnq]

7200 RPM hard drives and 1GB of RAM does wonders for Mac OS X performance.

[Xool]

I expect minor bumps with perhaps a few more options. Prices lowered overall. If G5 PowerBooks are delayed even longer, these models could still be bumped slightly for one more revision.

[IonYz]

Originally posted by rottenspam
1. Apple goes to widescreen format on all powerbooks including the 12.1"

Widescreen would greatly help the 12" differentiate itself physically from the iBook. Metal, color, whatever they do; with that 4:3 screen it still screams iBook to me.

[dexter]

Carbon fibre has electrical transmission issues, too. Hence the windows in the later Titanium 'Books for WiFi.

Maybe they could reverse the design - aluminum frame, carbon shell pieces, WiFi in plastic display bezel like AlBooks.

I'd definitely like to see a stronger Powerbook structure, though. When you pick up a TiBook, it always feels like it's flexing so much in the bottom center (hence logic board issues???), so I've become accustomed to picking mine up by the sides. Real gently.

Shouldn't have to be so delicate with something called a "Power" anything.

[Xool]

Originally posted by IonYz
Widescreen would greatly help the 12" differentiate itself physically from the iBook. Metal, color, whatever they do; with that 4:3 screen it still screams iBook to me.

I agree. I'd only consider the 12" PowerBook if it featured widescreen, but I'd also want the backlit keyboard and other features too. Otherwise, its 15" for me.

I've used a rev A Titanium for over 3 years and couldn't see not keeping widescreen.

[iDave]

No offense, but the backlit keyboard is the most over-sold useless feature I've ever seen. I've got one on my PowerBook and haven't had need for it once, since the screen lights up the silver keys just fine. I think a wide screen (13"?) on the small PowerBook is a good idea and would help differentiate it from the iBook, but skip the lighted keyboard and keep it $100 cheaper than it might be otherwise, thanks.

[earthtoandy]

yuo dont use it... i would. so i would like it.

BTO is fine

[Spytap]

Originally posted by iDave
No offense, but the backlit keyboard is the most over-sold useless feature I've ever seen. I've got one on my PowerBook and haven't had need for it once, since the screen lights up the silver keys just fine. I think a wide screen (13"?) on the small PowerBook is a good idea and would help differentiate it from the iBook, but skip the lighted keyboard and keep it $100 cheaper than it might be otherwise, thanks.
Hell, I use it all the time. Edit in a dark room, to make sure the colors are right, it comes in handy and it doesn't kill your night-vision like those USB led lights do. I would BTO it if it didn't come standard, it's more than worth it to me.

[PB]

Originally posted by iDave
No offense, but the backlit keyboard is the most over-sold useless feature I've ever seen. I've got one on my PowerBook and haven't had need for it once, since the screen lights up the silver keys just fine.

Am I the only one to find the screen light inadequate to illuminate the keyboard? In my 12", I have to try to find the keys in the dark, since the light levels of the screen and of the keyboard under the screen light are significantly different and the eye has to adapt. I wish it had the backlit keyboard.

[versu]

It's been mentioned already, but the one thing that Apple has not yet offered is a better resolution on the PBs. WXGA does not cut it on a professional notebook - way too blocky pixels.

I have a 1.5GHz 15.2" PB with 1280x800. I also have a Compaq 1.6GHz P-M 15.4" with 1680x1050. Features and build quality are otherwise pretty much the same. However, the screen on my Compaq is noticeably nicer than on the more expensive PB; razor-sharp fonts and much larger screen real-estate which translates to much less scrolling around in Excel, web-browsers etc. And no; 1680x1050 is not too small, unless you have impaired vision.

If you can't bump up the processor or the GPU what else is left but the battery or the screen?

[PB]

Originally posted by versu

I have a 1.5GHz 15.2" PB with 1280x800. I also have a Compaq 1.6GHz P-M 15.4" with 1680x1050. Features and build quality are otherwise pretty much the same. However, the screen on my Compaq is noticeably nicer than on the more expensive PB; razor-sharp fonts and much larger screen real-estate which translates to much less scrolling around in Excel, web-browsers etc. And no; 1680x1050 is not too small, unless you have impaired vision.

Or you do want to work comfortably. My wife's Dell has a 15" screen at 1920 x 1200. While I agree that such displays are much more sharp, there is no way to use it at such resolution without binoculars. Me at least. And I have not impaired vision. Just a personal preference.

[Gavriel]

Originally posted by PB
Or you do want to work comfortably. My wife's Dell has a 15" screen at 1920 x 1200. While I agree that such displays are much more sharp, there is no way to use it at such resolution without binoculars. Me at least. And I have not impaired vision. Just a personal preference.

So 1920x1200 is the new 1680x1050? ;-) Personally I'd love a slightly higher resolution display on the Powerbooks. Couple that with better color quality and higher brightness.

[Amorph]

Originally posted by Gavriel
So 1920x1200 is the new 1680x1050? ;-) Personally I'd love a slightly higher resolution display on the Powerbooks. Couple that with better color quality and higher brightness.

You do realize that higher resolution correlates to lower brightness and narrower viewing angles in LCDs, right?

To the poster who said that high resolutions are only a problem to people whose vision is impaired: The majority of the adult population has impaired vision, not least from years of staring at monitors.

We have a bunch of Dells with 1600x1200 screens. Every last one of them runs at 1024x768. This is the worst of all possible worlds: The screens are darker, blurrier than if we'd just ordered native 1024x768 screens, and more expensive on top of that. High resolution screens are not necessarily a feature. Not yet.

[Spytap]

A lot of these problems with size and readability will disappear once we get to tiger and resolution independant size for the OS. Then I think a higher screen res will be necessary to showcase sharper and clearer icons and text. In the meantime, simply having the ability to go higher res if we so choose is always a plus, especially when it comes to people who use it gor graphics, effects, and editing.

[PB]

Originally posted by Gavriel
So 1920x1200 is the new 1680x1050? ;-)

All I am saying is that high resolutions, like 1680 x 1050 (for the case of versu) or higher (1920 x 1200 in my wife's case) in a 15" display, are not really needed. And perhaps should be avoided as a potential risk for the vision in the long term.

[G2G]

The only prob with mixing carbon fiber and aluminum is it creates electrolysis. I have seen this in bicycles...after a little time goes by they start to come apart...I would like to see a longer battery life and faster hd...the res is fine the cpu is fine they look great cant wait to buy my first MAC......

[RolandG]

High-screen relative resolutions maybe great for the sharpness of text and graphics, but how precise is editing? I guess you would need a pretty quiet hand.

Furthermore, in an office environment, the most frequently used applications are Web-based. The web unfortunately is not resolution independent yet, and overriding the font sizes specified in most cases blows the layout because the graphics won't scale.

To bad, all attempts to make the web resolution independant seem to never have taken off (especially SVG, a W3C-endorsed (http://www.w3c.org/Graphics/SVG/) mark-up language standard for vector based graphics) because the Browser manufacturers never really implemented it. Microsoft announced (http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/dnlong/html/avalongraphics.asp) to "embrace and enhance" it and base Longhorn's UI (Avalon) on it. Maybe Apple is on the same track with Tiger: an integral part of its UI already using WebKit (Spotlight anyone) - why not go all the way?

For the near term, I would really love to see the aforementioned 13"-widescreen on the PowerBooks and DVI video out on the iBooks as well as a longer battery life, a faster USB, digital audio out and a slight price drop across the whole line.

[mattyj]

As a Package the Powerbooks work great, I recently bought a 15" 1.33Ghz and it's fantastic.

Screen resolution: As long as it's significantly above 1024 it's fine, 1280x864 pixels are by far enough for photoshop and office work, as well as playing games and video editing.

The mobility radeon 9700 is a great choice (although I would have ordered the 128MB version in a split second had if been available on the 1.33Ghz). The new G4 processors are good too, whilst not massive in clock speed, it does all I want it to do - but then I don't use it for 3d, yet.

For improvements I'd definitely like to see a longer battery life, at the moment it is a bit short and PPC is supposed to be energy efficient no? Perhaps Apple aren't using the right batteries, which I'm sure someone has said on these forums. Also getting that FSB up in speed would be a good idea, to take full advantage of the DDR RAM. DDR400 would be a good addition as apparently it has a lower voltage use than DDR 333 (and below) and PC133 and therefore uses less power. Getting faster RPM drives would also be a bonus

To improve the Powerbook wouldn't be a simple task, IMO it would mean bumping up every aspect of it rather than dumping a behemoth G5 in it. It needs fine tuning rather than reinventing.

[iDave]

Originally posted by RolandG
For the near term, I would really love to see the aforementioned 13"-widescreen on the PowerBooks and DVI video out on the iBooks...
If iBooks had DVI out, I'd quit whining about wanting a cheaper headless Mac and buy one of those. Unfortunately, it's not likely to happen. :\

[Spytap]

For improvements I'd definitely like to see a longer battery life, at the moment it is a bit short and PPC is supposed to be energy efficient no? Perhaps Apple aren't using the right batteries, which I'm sure someone has said on these forums. Also getting that FSB up in speed would be a good idea, to take full advantage of the DDR RAM. DDR400 would be a good addition as apparently it has a lower voltage use than DDR 333 (and below) and PC133 and therefore uses less power. Getting faster RPM drives would also be a bonus

To improve the Powerbook wouldn't be a simple task, IMO it would mean bumping up every aspect of it rather than dumping a behemoth G5 in it. It needs fine tuning rather than reinventing.
agreed, i'm waiting for the next revision because I want A) better screens, B) SATA drives, C) 7200RPM BTO option, and D) a higher FSB. These are all things that are most important to me because of video editing and effects rendering (along with other processor, HD, and video card taxing work). I know I'm not the majority, but honestly every little bit helps as it's going to be working on set as a mobile editing and small effects workstation.

[TofuTodd]

really? i thought for electrolysis to occur at least both had to be conductors, but actually, I suppose I assumed that because I'd never seen the contrary (which is of course the wrong way to assume something). But metal and fiberglass are fine, carbon fiber should be similar to fiberglass... eh?

[Gavriel]

Originally posted by Amorph
You do realize that higher resolution correlates to lower brightness and narrower viewing angles in LCDs, right?

I did not know that. :embarrass Thanks for pointing it out! :)

[versu]

You do realize that higher resolution correlates to lower brightness and narrower viewing angles in LCDs, right?

If the quality of the screen is half decent, this becomes a theoretical rather than a practical issue. I have no problems in that respect with my PC laptop; in fact I turn the brightness down.

All I am saying is that high resolutions, like 1680 x 1050 (for the case of versu) or higher (1920 x 1200 in my wife's case) in a 15" display, are not really needed. And perhaps should be avoided as a potential risk for the vision in the long term.

Well, yes. Perhaps. And perhaps we should refrain from driving in our cars at over 50mpg lest the G-forces damage our innards. In the long term. Potentially.

Screen resolution: As long as it's significantly above 1024 it's fine, 1280x864 pixels are by far enough for photoshop and office work, as well as playing games and video editing.

I don't think that 1280x864 IS significantly above XGA. This is my point. Too blocky, too much wasted real estate. By all means keep the current resolutions for those who want them. However, these are POWERBOOKS, and as far as I'm concerned, 1280x864 is not good enough. Take a look at the PC side of things. XGA is what you will typically get in budget laptops. Go up a notch and 1450x1050 is getting quite common on the 15" 4x3 format laptops. PBs should at least offer this option as a BTO.

[G2G]

Originally posted by TofuTodd
really? i thought for electrolysis to occur at least both had to be conductors, but actually, I suppose I assumed that because I'd never seen the contrary (which is of course the wrong way to assume something). But metal and fiberglass are fine, carbon fiber should be similar to fiberglass... eh? I worked in a bike shop for about seven years {pedal power}Trek had ben using aluminum lugs and carbonfiber...and after some time maybe a year you could see that it the {aluminum lug and the carbon were peeling apart...maybe they have some new technolgy that prevents this ? no big deal it would be cool !!!

[Amorph]

Originally posted by versu
If the quality of the screen is half decent, this becomes a theoretical rather than a practical issue. I have no problems in that respect with my PC laptop; in fact I turn the brightness down.

In other words, your PC laptop compensates with a bright backlight. How's the battery life?

That leaves the two other problems: Narrow viewing angle, and the fact that the way most people use those screens in practice, they get a blurry, aliased interface instead of a clear, sharp interface.

[tak1108]

What's next for Apple notebooks?

Nothing.


Maybe. Maybe an update, but that's pushing it.

[mattyj]

Originally posted by Amorph
That leaves the two other problems: Narrow viewing angle, and the fact that the way most people use those screens in practice, they get a blurry, aliased interface instead of a clear, sharp interface.

Amorph raises a good point, I know many people in the Windows world that have LCDs, but never use them at the highest resolution apart from when playing games. Most people that I know tend not to use high desktop resolutions, and I reckon this is also true for the majority of people.

[Chagi]

Originally posted by mattyj
Amorph raises a good point, I know many people in the Windows world that have LCDs, but never use them at the highest resolution apart from when playing games. Most people that I know tend not to use high desktop resolutions, and I reckon this is also true for the majority of people.

That's whacky, particularly considering that most LCDs look like ass when they aren't running in their native resolution...

[versu]

Originally posted by Amorph
In other words, your PC laptop compensates with a bright backlight. How's the battery life?

That leaves the two other problems: Narrow viewing angle, and the fact that the way most people use those screens in practice, they get a blurry, aliased interface instead of a clear, sharp interface.


Battery life is better than my PB. Minimum 4.5 hours, where I get just shy of 3.5 hours on my AluPB.

Viewing angle is no narrower than on my PB.

Your last point is hard to follow. Most people pay extra (you do not get extra resolution for free, more pixels = higher manufacturing+QC costs) for a higher resolution screen just so that they can run it at a lower resolution? Give me a break. These anecdotal stories can be countered by the fact that I DON'T know anyone who does this. Therefore I reckon that most people don't do this, either.

[dexter]

Originally posted by versu
Most people pay extra (you do not get extra resolution for free, more pixels = higher manufacturing+QC costs) for a higher resolution screen just so that they can run it at a lower resolution? Give me a break. These anecdotal stories can be countered by the fact that I DON'T know anyone who does this. Therefore I reckon that most people don't do this, either.

I have seen plenty of people who do this, but they are usually basic end users. I tried to show them the error of their ways; how much more crisp it is at a higher resolution. They like the 'big screens/big type' better. It was frustrating to me, because they were making it harder to see with the blurry screen. They really only needed to change the settings that change the type size in the Control Panel and keep a clearer picture. PC people, mind you...

Back on topic, I agree with anybody who wants higher resolution. Although not the best platform, I do use my PB for Photoshop, Illustrator, etc., and sometimes could use more real estate. Hope the option is there in the next PB release.

[mattyj]

Do most people know the difference between an LCD and a CRT apart from the immediately perceivable differences? Probably not as they probably don't care, perhaps you just know people who are clued up and know what they're doing. It's easy to forget being on these forums you are not the 'average joe'. Most don't know about cpus, ram, or screens.

[iDave]

Just shows you how bad some eyes are. Not good enough to notice that everything is blurry at non-native resolution. Bigger text is more important, in those cases. I even work with a graphic designer who preferred to keep her nice Dell 1600x1200 LCD display set non-native until I practically begged her to try it native for awhile. I think she's finally convinced.

(Sorry for continuing off-topic.)

[Amorph]

Originally posted by versu
Your last point is hard to follow. Most people pay extra (you do not get extra resolution for free, more pixels = higher manufacturing+QC costs) for a higher resolution screen just so that they can run it at a lower resolution? Give me a break. These anecdotal stories can be countered by the fact that I DON'T know anyone who does this. Therefore I reckon that most people don't do this, either.

People assume that bigger is better, and people like you reinforce that belief. So after consulting their local geek with 20/10 vision they pay extra to get the "better" screen with more resolution.

Then they find out that everything looks really tiny, and they do what they've done for years (on CRTs): drop the resolution to make everything bigger. It's familiar and it works.

I'm surrounded by these people. They're mostly older professionals or academics whose vision has been adversely affected by years of reading books in dark rooms, but they hardly constitute a minority. I can remember having 20/16 vision myself, not quite two decades ago...

[Ompus]

The problem with going wide-screen on a 12" notebook is that you lose too much vertical space. That's not as big a deal when you're dealing with a 15" or 17" notebook where you've got lots of pixels to play with. For surfing the net and editing documents, vertical space on a 12" notebook is too precious to sacrifice.

On the other hand, for the ultimate tight squeeze, it's easier and more useful to make a screen wider. So...for my time in the air, I suggest a 13.5" widescreen powerbook. This would entail a model about 12.5 inches wide; an inch narrower than the 15" model and about and about 1.5 inches wider than the 12" model. Depth, which is always at a premium, will be 8.5 inches- shallower even than the 12" model. Screen resolution would be approximately 1280 x 768.
My final suggestions are to accept increases in thickness and weight- compared to the 12" notebook- for the sake of battery life. The current 12" powerbook is 1.18" thick. With that in mind, I'd accept a tradeoff to 1.3"-1.4" thick if it ensured world-class run time.

I wouldn't ditch the current 12". But IF I added another powerbook model, I think a 13.5 inch extra-widescreen would have interesting possibilities.

[ua2006]

Originally posted by PB
Am I the only one to find the screen light inadequate to illuminate the keyboard? In my 12", I have to try to find the keys in the dark, since the light levels of the screen and of the keyboard under the screen light are significantly different and the eye has to adapt. I wish it had the backlit keyboard.

I would like this feature a lot on the 12" model. I have a hard time seeing the keys with only the display. I hope Apple includes it in the next models.

[Chagi]

Originally posted by s_sarinana
I would like this feature a lot on the 12" model. I have a hard time seeing the keys with only the display. I hope Apple includes it in the next models.

I think there's a good chance of this. Apple tends to migrate features downwards over time, as well as turning options into standard features. For example, at one point Bluetooth and Airport Extreme were both options on the Powerbooks, now both are standard. The lighted keyboard was only available at first on the 17", now it's an option on 15" model. I think that the next round of models will all feature it.

[Spytap]

I'm telling you, larger bus, better screens, and more battery life and I'm happy. I could care less about the faster CPU, GPU or anything else (well, Serial ata hard drives and 7200 RPM drives would be nice, but not as much so as the previous stated desires)but as someone who's a target market for their POWERbook line (film person) these are what I need to keep it competitive.

[marksmall50]

Would it be possible to make the screen section detachable? Throw in a touch sensitive surface and you have a pretty nice tablet.

[emig647]

That would be cool... but most people don't need that... would it be worth it?

[ua2006]

I have a feeling that would add a huge amount to the cost of a notebook and most people would probably not use it as much.

[emig647]

Agreed

[dexter]

Now that the G5 iMac is out with a ton of "user-servicability," maybe the next-gen PB's will bring that user-friendly thinking regarding upgrades forward.

I was disappointed that my CPU wasn't upgradable like the G3 PB; it would be nice if they'd bring that feature back (though it's unlikely, as it's better to sell someone an entirely new notebook when they want to upgrade).

[Chris Cuilla]

Originally posted by dexter
Now that the G5 iMac is out with a ton of "user-servicability," maybe the next-gen PB's will bring that user-friendly thinking regarding upgrades forward.

I was disappointed that my CPU wasn't upgradable like the G3 PB; it would be nice if they'd bring that feature back (though it's unlikely, as it's better to sell someone an entirely new notebook when they want to upgrade).

Well, that...and..it's a bit more complicated that just popping in a new CPU.

[emig647]

Let us dream ;)
...
On a side note... I don't see apple going the "upgrading cpu" route any more... especially with using liquid cooling now. :(