Does Kerry have a Chance?

[Beige_G3]

America is buying into the Bush regime more each day. It is sad for the US and sad for the World, but I think that Kerry is going on a downhill slide from here on out. Like it or not, a whole lot of people are impressed by the "stay the course" ignorant tuff guy talk. I am loosing faith in my fellow citizens' ability to think.

Couldn't we have found someone better than Kerry? Did the Democrats ever expect to win this one?


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3658490.stm

[kozchris]

No. Democrats should give up now and save money for the next election.

http://www.strangecosmos.com/images/content/15744.JPG

[Gilsch]

Someone better than Kerry. Compared to Bush....tons. I'm sure there's quite a few, but either way, both are a joke....much more so Bush. But the whole world knows that.

Very hard to go against such a well oiled machine who will go to any lengths to destroy anyone anywhere.....during a "time of war".....when your "patriotism" is questioned simply by having different ideas. With us or against us.

Don't give up hope. Plenty of time left. If you believe in polls, take into account that there may be a nice influx of new voters this election who don't participate in polls. Not to mention quite a few undecideds up for grabs in battleground states.

[Gilsch]

hey Kozchris....better vote Republican or the Democrats will ban the Bible if they win!!!

[kozchris]

Originally posted by Gilsch
hey Kozchris....better vote Republican or the Democrats will ban the Bible if they win!!!

pro-abortion.
could care less about other peoples sexual preference.
Have read parts of the Bible but not the whole thing.
Do not own a gun.

You don't have to agree with all of the President Bush's ideals to be a Republican. Come join the party.

[hardeeharhar]

Originally posted by kozchris
pro-abortion.
could care less about other peoples sexual preference.
Have read parts of the Bible but not the whole thing.
Do not own a gun.

You don't have to agree with all of the President Bush's ideals to be a Republican. Come join the party.

Yeah you live in the south and it is just assumed that you are one...

[midwinter]

Originally posted by kozchris
You don't have to agree with all of the President Bush's ideals to be a Republican.

Considering he doesn't strike me in the least as having anything in common with Republicans, that doesn't surprise me.

I just wish the Republicans would pick a new candidate.

[jimmac]

If Bush is reelected the people who bought into his rhetoric deserve what they get. More war, more lies, serial recession, etc. Unfortunately we'll all be a part of it.

Don't believe me? Just watch.




OUT THE DOOR IN 2004!

[Existence]

Originally posted by jimmac
If Bush is reelected... [/B]

He was not elected the first time. If he is this time, which is very likely, America will become the most hated country in the world and terrorist attacks will rise. If he is elected, his presidency finally gains an aura of legitimacy.

[Aquatic]

If he is elected the environment and Social Security/Medicare are fucked. And because they are fucked more EPA money will be drained. America will be ruined. Every single Bush supporter on this board has demonstrated an utter, hideous, misunderstanding of the environment.

I did a random off the cuff poll Boston South Station bus station of all places, and my results were surprising. I went up to random people and here is what happened.

1 - undecided (old lady)
2 Bush (old couple)
2 Kerry - young, NOT from America
1 Libertarian girl going to BU
1 Leaning toward Bush - the bus driver (middle-aged white guy)

Surprising for Boston. A few more people I talked to on the Bus supported Bush.

The average American is STUPID. I am sorry there is no excuse. They blindly recite Fox News sound bites. "Kerry will say one thing and do another" an old Vet said to me in Sears one day this summer. Guy, how fucking stupid are you? Guess who is cutting your VA benefits, your Social Security, your healthcare, your environment, and increasing your taxes, gas price, etc, gramps? I want to move to Canada if Bush wins. I can't take it anymore. :(

I never understood why liberals have to preface everything with such nationalism. I will admit: I hate most of what America does and stands for today. I think the country started out great but needs some sort of social/political/economic reset. Republicans have fucked this country up badly. Europe's government on the other hand is a Representative one and is doing nicely I might add, considering they have a big population density and thus lots of environmental and other problems. I want to live in Montreal. It's clean and people are so nice there.

Even New England has succumbed. NH, VT, NY, RI, CT, even Mass have GOP Governors! And they are infiltrating the Senate and House up here. They are pushing out true compassionate conservatives like Jeffords. The rich and the Jesus freaks have finally achieved a stranglehold on America. But to acknowledge this is UNAMERICAN AND COMMUNIST! Well. Maybe I am a socialist. Or at least very liberal Democrat. I don't like the direction America is moving for certain. I do know that Canada, while a hell of a lot poorer than us, is doing just fine. It seems like they are better. And I like being cold. I think I might just defect. :( It's sad. There are a ton of things I like about America that are unique. Majoring in environmental science, I probably won't have a good career here for decades since that's how long it will take for ecological disasters to start becoming unignorable and people will start getting employed to fix things. At present Canada is very serious about the environment and Montreal is very green and has a good gov't and private sector environmental engineering opportunity.

[tonton]

Originally posted by Aquatic
I want to move to Canada if Bush wins. I can't take it anymore. :(

I hear every word you say. The only thing that makes me not leave America at this point is that I've already left. It's truly sickening the ignorant disregard for the WORLD's best interest that exists in today's America.

No nation is an island!

You're welcome to come here. Seriously. What do you do?

[Beige_G3]

the truth is there are more than enough Americans who like this guy to elect him. The simple-minded black and white approach to life appeals to alot of people.

black or white
good or evil

no need to think aout the grey reality

then there are the stupid catchy little names for the evil ones! I just read an article about the woman in prison in Iraq. We call them "Dr. Germ" and "Chemical Sally" Nice and simple so we all no they are on the bad side.

[faust9]

Yes Kerry has a chance.

I offer exhibit 'A': The National Review Online has an editorial (all their stories are editorials) proclaiming Wes Clarks virtues over Kerry's failings. When a conservative republican publication pines for a different candidate then you know you have a good chance of winning.

http://www.nationalreview.com/goldberg/goldberg200409220845.asp

Enjoy.

[BuonRotto]

Originally posted by Beige_G3
the truth is there are more than enough Americans who like this guy to elect him. The simple-minded black and white approach to life appeals to alot of people.

black or white
good or evil

no need to think aout the grey reality

then there are the stupid catchy little names for the evil ones! I just read an article about the woman in prison in Iraq. We call them "Dr. Germ" and "Chemical Sally" Nice and simple so we all no they are on the bad side.

Sounds like, despite the words of protest, someone is just as guilty of binary thinking. ;) :p

[Beige_G3]

Perhaps I am guilty of binary thinking BuonRotto. I am definitely a bit pessimistic at this point. I think that the Kerry campaign is on the verge of a melt down. Wisconsin, Minnesota and Oregon leaning Bush? That's not good. The worse part of it is that the votes to elect Kerry exist, if the people holding them would only get up and VOTE!

[Northgate]

It's all about the electoral college. Kerry will take New Hampshire, Arkansas, Ohio, Nevada and possibly squeek out a win in Florida.

The polls cannot predict new voters. I believe the Democrats have been more successful at not only rallying their base, but also incorporating far more brand new voters. It will be the new voter count that will turn the election in Kerry's favor.

Just my opinion.

[midwinter]

Originally posted by Northgate
It's all about the electoral college. Kerry will take New Hampshire, Arkansas, Ohio, Nevada and possibly squeek out a win in Florida.

The polls cannot predict new voters. I believe the Democrats have been more successful at not only rallying their base, but also incorporating far more brand new voters. It will be the new voter count that will turn the election in Kerry's favor.

Just my opinion.

Unless Rove is able to woo more Christian voters. That's been his strategy for this one.

[Beige_G3]

I hope ur right. We must keep the pressure on the "new voters" to actally do it.

BTW My point about WI, MN and OR was not a ref to their electotal power, but to the fact that thetg were onve liberal, Dem states which continue to slide to the right.

[faust9]

Originally posted by Beige_G3
I hope ur right. We must keep the pressure on the "new voters" to actally do it.

BTW My point about WI, MN and OR was not a ref to their electotal power, but to the fact that thetg were onve liberal, Dem states which continue to slide to the right.

Here's a big clue about the "new voter" counts: http://www.mtv.com/chooseorlose/headlines/news.jhtml?id=1491234

Granted, MTV isn't a noted polling agency; however, they do keep thier finger on the pulse of the yough(those who pay the bills if yoy will).

[Northgate]

Originally posted by midwinter
Unless Rove is able to woo more Christian voters. That's been his strategy for this one.

I can only speak for the Catholics in my family, but they're all voting for Kerry. My brother, a staunch Republican, will not. However, I know of far too many church going christians who are upset that Republicans have co-opted their religion. The idea that christians are only Republicans is absurd to them.

I also know of three reservists who spent a year in Iraq who are furious with this current administration and will be voting Kerry.

Now this is only my own microcosm. But it looks good for Kerry in my world. It's the "good 'ol boy" vote that I'm worried about.

However, the question is whether Rove is mobilizing more christians than Democrats are voting regular, every-day Americans. I believe the later.

We'll see a few short weeks.

[Wrong Robot]

Not too belittle your microcosm northgate but you *are* in SoCal, of course you're going to see a noticeable kerry bias through most people you know.

[midwinter]

Originally posted by Northgate
I can only speak for the Catholics in my family, but they're all voting for Kerry. My brother, a staunch Republican, will not. However, I know of far too many church going christians who are upset that Republicans have co-opted their religion. The idea that christians are only Republicans is absurd to them.

I also know of three reservists who spent a year in Iraq who are furious with this current administration and will be voting Kerry.

Now this is only my own microcosm. But it looks good for Kerry in my world. It's the "good 'ol boy" vote that I'm worried about.

However, the question is whether Rove is mobilizing more christians than Democrats are voting regular, every-day Americans. I believe the later.

We'll see a few short weeks.

In modern politics, "Christian" means "evangelical."

[Northgate]

Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Not too belittle your microcosm northgate but you *are* in SoCal, of course you're going to see a noticeable kerry bias through most people you know.

I recognize that. I also live in Studio City. It doesn't get much more liberal than Hollywood's back yard out here.

[faust9]

DP--wireless network is being flakey.

[Gilsch]

Well, Beige. With all due respect. Are you doing anything to help defeat Bush?

Democrats, Independents, Undecideds....we need all the help we can get.

Go here:

http://actforvictory.org/

[Not Unlike Myself]

I agree with a post above saying I am losing in faith in the ability of my fellow citizens to think.

I don't trust my commander in chief. The guy *I* voted for last election. I don't feel the US is better off today. I don't feel any safer, my tax burden is unchanged, all my personal beliefs have been squashed by him. I really don't know what I ever saw in Bush.

You know, I'm not bitter, I'm not angry, I'm just not happy with him. I will vote on the issues and I'll vote on concious and on both counts, Kerry gets my vote.

I really can't say if Kerry has a chance or not. But my wife and I will do the best we can to make sure he does. We are in a thick Republican state and I catch flack for having his sticker on my car. But the bottom line is, how can anybody give anyone else crap about what they believe? I feel like a sticking hippie saying "why can't we all just get along?".

My political views put my in paradox. I am a pro-life, pro-gay marriage, anti-gun, anti-good old boy system, pro-death penalty, pro-trade, anti-faithbased initiative person. So this sits me in between two camps, and the devil I don't know is better then the devil I do know.

In November, without hesitation I will vote to put a new leader in the white house.

The things I want to see is a respected america, equality among all of our people, irregardless of sexual preference or race, a tax code which is based of ability to pay, a governement who respects privacy as much as they respect security, an international community which can trade with us without manipulation, a dynamic change in health care and and overall change of direction.

[shetline]

Originally posted by midwinter
In modern politics, "Christian" means "evangelical."
Sort of like the way "PC" has come to mean only Windows PCs. Macs are obviously "personal computers", but the meaning of "PC" has been taken over by the Windows world.

Q: Do you have a PC?
A: No, I have a Mac.

The takeover of "Christian" isn't quite so complete as the takeover of "PC", however, because I think you'd normally hear "Yes" instead of "No" in the answer to a parallel religious question, but you'd still see that need to qualify oneself expressed.

Q: Are you a Christian?
A: Yes, I'm a Catholic.

I don't think you'll hear too many Catholics or Episcopalians or Methodists, etc., identify themselves first and foremost as Christians -- for them, the word has come to carry a bit of a stigma, a taint of fanaticism with which they do not wish to associate themselves.

(Sorry for going off on so much of a tangent!)

[faust9]

Originally posted by Gilsch
Well, Beige. With all due respect. Are you doing anything to help defeat Bush?

Democrats, Independents, Undecideds....we need all the help we can get.

Go here:

http://actforvictory.org/

EXACTLY!!!! Trumpt attacked my supposed lack of life and questioned if I though position on PO would change anything to wit I told him no but the other things I do to sway voters will. You have to get off your duff. Don't simply complain that Kerry might not win. Argue in public with pro-Bush supporters (make sure you can do this well enough to refute most if not all claims made by them). I just did this last week. A pro-Bush get out the vote canvaser handed me a registration form which meant I had to discuss why he was wrong loudly enough for all in the immediate vicinity to hear.

Stupid shit like that. If my actions turn one person from Bush to Kerry then I'll be happy. I feel I've convinced a few that Bush is "wrong" for America though and I know I've inspired a few to vote no matter which box they check come Nov... If you feel Kerry is in the dog house then get out and support him. Don't let Novak or any other shill convince you Kerry is a lost cause. Don't let Gallup weigh you down because if you look at an aggregate poll you'll see Bush has almost no lead--bad for an incumbent.

My 2 cents.

[Beige_G3]

I'm trying Gilsch. My state is lost, but I am trying my best anyway.

[faust9]

Originally posted by Beige_G3
I'm trying Gilsch. My state is lost, but I am trying my best anyway.

Quick, move to a swing state until Nov 3rd.

[BuonRotto]

Personally, I have this natural instinct to shut down when someone tries to yell, bully or preach me into changing my opinion. It's why I hate efforts to do that, from preachy bumper stickers to fire-and-brimstone zealot preachers. Persuasion doesn't mean beating people into submitting to your opinions, and there's no better way to keep people away than to stand on your soap box and swing your billy club at anyone who passes by.

[Beige_G3]

True BuonRotto. My efforts are in trying to get people to vote. I hear alot of whining from people around me (in the real world, not here) and I know those people did not vote last time. I have been and will continue to pressure people to show up and cast their votes. The conservatives will vote . We need to as well.

[pfflam]

Originally posted by faust9
Quick, move to a swing state until Nov 3rd. The nieghbors across the street just moved here from Texas . . . their GWB signs went up just the other day .. . .

hmmm?!?!

Will the house hit the market in December?