2008 canidates [Archive]

iPoster

11-06-2004, 10:21 AM

Three words:

Jesse Ventura, Independent :D

It doesn’t matter who is in charge, Democrats or Republicans. The end justifies the means. Want to break the iron grip these two parties have on our politics? Good luck. Last week, the Presidential Debates Commission announced the schedule for next year’s debates. What a joke. This commission hijacked from the League of Women Voters by Republican and Democratic hacks is about as fair as the Globetrotters against the Washington generals. Their goal-keep any viable third party candidate out of the debates. All this in a country where polls indicate there are more independents than Democrats or Republicans. Why, I ask, do we let the minority rule?"

"We’re getting to the campaign season, which is a time of year when I tend to get upset with Democrats and Republicans. I often refer to campaign years as open season for bribery. Al, you know, the definition in the paper of bribery, or in the dictionary, is giving something of value to someone in power in hopes of influencing their decision. We have an entire Democratic/Republican political system based upon bribery. If you did it in the private sector, you would be arrested and put in jail, but in the public sector, it’s the status quo. How do we stop this?"

During an interview with the Associated Press, former Minnesota Gov. Jesse Ventura hinted that he's toying with the idea of running as an Independent for the presidency in 2008.

"No party, no nothing," he told the AP, adding that his campaign message would be, "Elect someone who truly is not controlled by special-interest money. With me, you would get a true check and balance."

hardeeharhar

11-06-2004, 10:26 AM

Clearly Hillary is not going to run.

Anders

11-06-2004, 10:27 AM

Anyone who would ensure the rights of the individual over religion and other forms of opression.

McCain
Schwartzenegger(sp?)
Clinton
Hell even Cheney (if he promise not to invade any countries)

hardeeharhar

11-06-2004, 10:42 AM

Arny cannot run.

Depending on which way the Republicans go, McCain probably wouldn't win.

Scott

11-06-2004, 10:44 AM

At work we thought it would be funny to have a Schwartzenegger vs Granholm in 2008:D

applenut

11-06-2004, 03:34 PM

McCain/Guilianni 2008

hardeeharhar

11-06-2004, 03:35 PM

Originally posted by applenut
McCain/Guilianni 2008

That is like saying Big Bird/Barney...

slughead

11-06-2004, 03:49 PM

what about the libertarians?

we've got nowhere to go but up!

Placebo

11-06-2004, 04:03 PM

Originally posted by hardeeharhar
Arny cannot run.

Even as the Founding Fathers did not know that they were preventing this doofus from running, I thank them anyways.

Towel

11-06-2004, 06:35 PM

McCain will be 72 in 2008. I love the guy, but even Reagan was only 69 when he was sworn in.

Guiliani is clearly gearing up for a run at something. He and Pataki may challenge Hillary in '06, and if either/both doesn't win they might go for Pres in '08. I really suspect Jeb will run - he can't stay Gov forever, right? Probably several Rep Senators, too - I've heard rumors about Santorum and Frist, and I could see guys like Hagel or Lugar making Graham-esque runs at it. Maybe Ashcroft, unless he goes to the SC first.

On the Dem side, I think it all depends on how the next four years go. I could easily see Dean making a re-run in 2008, if Dems get to feeling the same way about him that Reps did about Reagan in '76. It'll probably be too soon for Obama, and I just can't imagine Hillary seriously believing she could be elected (nor, I hope, Edwards). Otherwise, I think people will spring up to match the times and the mood of the party - the way Dean and Clark did this time around. There's a whole stable of Govs, including a bunch in the South, to draw on. And a bunch of ambitious Senators - like Corzine or Schumer, if they don't get bogged down as Govs.

rok

11-06-2004, 06:51 PM

i think, despite his age, mccain would want one last go of it. but i don't think the party wants him to. i think he'd win in the biggest landslide ever.
obama will still be way too green in 2008, but i think he's got a great message about him.
hilary needs to stay right where she is for a while.
guiliani's a joke.
i would not be surprised to see an effort to amend the rules to allow arnold to run, perhaps by 2012 (after a few more congressional and senate seats go in the republican camp).
edwards is like the cheshire cat... all smile, then just kinda disappears after a while.
dean still has that "you blew it" cloud hanging over him.
would, god help me, delay ever run for the big chair? something tells me he can enact way more of his agenda in his current seat, but he has incredibly strong beliefs, and feels its his duty to protect america from the liberal wing.
i really liked clark as a person, but he just did not know how to be a politician.
and please stop putting the bush family in office. i swear, we look more like an aristocracy with each passing generation...
and be on the lookout for new senator from louisiana, david vitter, in 2012 or 16. he destroyed six other candidates to take the senate seat as a republican for the first time since reconstruction here.

midwinter

11-06-2004, 07:02 PM

Mark Warner, maybe?

Scott

11-06-2004, 07:36 PM

Originally posted by midwinter
Mark Warner, maybe?

Yea maybe.

midwinter

11-06-2004, 08:20 PM

Originally posted by Scott
Yea maybe.

I don't know much about him, but he seems to fit the bill for another stab at the Clinton strategy (southern moderate governor), and the elections for the last 30 years have made it clear that the electorate wants governors.

Scott

11-06-2004, 08:26 PM

He's from a good state to run from.

Gene Clean

11-06-2004, 08:31 PM

I'd like to see Bill O'Reilly/Sean Hannity ticket. That would be the funniest ticket ever.

ast3r3x

11-06-2004, 08:40 PM

Originally posted by SDW2001
Rendell is horrible. I know...I voted for him.

Well, he has engery, and is loved by most of PA. Not to mentio he did pretty good for Philadlephia.

midwinter

11-06-2004, 08:41 PM

Originally posted by Gene Clean
I'd like to see Bill O'Reilly/Sean Hannity ticket. That would be the funniest ticket ever.

You mean a sex offender and a guy with a private jet on the same ticket?

midwinter

11-06-2004, 08:43 PM

Originally posted by Scott
He's from a good state to run from.

Do you mean for the presidency, or just in general?

groverat

11-06-2004, 09:44 PM

Maybe Ashcroft, unless he goes to the SC first.

Good job, you just made me kill myself.

Gene Clean

11-06-2004, 09:47 PM

Originally posted by midwinter
You mean a sex offender and a guy with a private jet on the same ticket?

Yes I do. I watch them instead of Comedy Central, and I gotta say, the word funny doesn't do justice to these guys. Just freakin' hillarious..

Gene Clean

11-06-2004, 09:48 PM

If Ashcroft is a candidate, then I think that democrats should put a dead guy to run against him. He lost the last time to a dead guy he ran for office, so there's no reason to think he won't lose again.

Gene Clean

11-06-2004, 10:51 PM

Originally posted by ShawnJ
Foolproof strategy. Get this guy a job at the DNC! ;)

Hey, if you're unable to defeat a DEAD guy when running for office, giving you an ALIVE candidate might lead you to unconditional surrender. And the Democrats don't want that; they want to beat the puck out of them jesusboys. Besides I heard he was sick wanting to resign. Soon now, Rumsfeld will get sick and pass the disease to Powell as well. The disease is spreading in the jesusboy camp...

midwinter

11-06-2004, 10:55 PM

Originally posted by Gene Clean
Hey, if you're unable to defeat a DEAD guy when running for office, giving you an ALIVE candidate might lead you to unconditional surrender. And the Democrats don't want that; they want to beat the puck out of them jesusboys. Besides I heard he was sick wanting to resign. Soon now, Rumsfeld will get sick and pass the disease to Powell as well. The disease is spreading in the jesusboy camp...

You do get the joke that Ashcroft lost an election to a dead man a few years ago, right?

Gene Clean

11-06-2004, 11:00 PM

Originally posted by midwinter
You do get the joke that Ashcroft lost an election to a dead man a few years ago, right?

Seeing as it was I who actually told the joke in this thread, I would certainly think so.

midwinter

11-06-2004, 11:19 PM

Originally posted by Gene Clean
Seeing as it was I who actually told the joke in this thread, I would certainly think so.

Doh! I thought someone else had made that joke! Mea culpa mea culpa mea culpa!

Existence

11-07-2004, 12:29 AM

Howard Dean. There is no substitute.

Gene Clean

11-07-2004, 02:19 AM

Originally posted by ShawnJ
Right. Except John Ashcroft beat plenty of living candidates in the past. According to his bio (http://www.usdoj.gov/ag/ashcroftbio.html) at the US DOJ, Ashcroft was elected Governor of Missouri from 1985-1993 and won a term as Senator from 1994-2000.

Once you lose to a dead guy, you're dead (figuratively) as freakin' fried chicken.

Scott

11-07-2004, 09:20 AM

Rumor is that Ashcroft is going step down from his post. That should make some people happy.

midwinter I mean for the presidency. Virginia is a southern state. I'm going to guess that he's a little more moderate than most democrats.

And people please please if you have any hope of winning in 2008 forget about Dean. He wasn't even a very good governor and only trick is sticking it to Bush who wont be running in 2008.

rok

11-07-2004, 11:01 AM

Originally posted by Scott
... and only trick is sticking it to Bush who wont be running in 2008.

unless they manage to relieve that two-term limit thing before 2008.

nothing would surprise me anymore.

Outsider

11-07-2004, 11:30 AM

Here's an article about Dean:

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/president/articles/2004/11/07/dean_takes_on_his_image_in_ad_for_search_engine/

I found this interesting:
There is ample precedent for politicians as pitchmen: Bob Dole, Republican presidential nominee in 1996, for Viagra; the late US House Speaker Thomas P. O'Neill, for American Express; the 1984 vice presidential nominee, Geraldine Ferraro, for Pepsi; and the former Texas governor, Ann Richards, who teamed with former New York governor Mario M. Cuomo for Doritos, to name a few.

None have won political positions afterward.

Hopefully Dean rethinks this and shores up his base for a 2008 run. Maybe Obama as a running mate?

Outsider

11-07-2004, 11:32 AM

Also interesting: Go red, not right! (http://www.boston.com/news/politics/president/articles/2004/11/07/wheres_the_party/)

midwinter

11-07-2004, 01:52 PM

Did you have your sense of humor surgically removed?

You: "Virginia is a pretty good state to run from."
Me: "Do you mean for the presidency, or just in general."

And now this:

Originally posted by Scott
midwinter I mean for the presidency. Virginia is a southern state. I'm going to guess that he's a little more moderate than most democrats.

Scott

11-07-2004, 02:13 PM

Originally posted by midwinter
Did you have your sense of humor surgically removed?

You: "Virginia is a pretty good state to run from."
Me: "Do you mean for the presidency, or just in general."

And now this:

I missed your joke the first time around. Virginia is a nice state to live in. NoVa has turned into a sprawling nightmare. The people are nice and the universities are great. I'm sure it's hard for a bigot like you to understand?

midwinter

11-07-2004, 02:37 PM

Originally posted by Scott
I missed your joke the first time around. Virginia is a nice state to live in. NoVa has turned into a sprawling nightmare. The people are nice and the universities are great. I'm sure it's hard for a bigot like you to understand?

What the fuck is that supposed to mean? Are you suggesting I don't like the South or Southerners? Please tell me you're not trying to say that.

quagmire

11-07-2004, 03:29 PM

Gore/Clinton. But, not Hiliary Clinton, Bill Clinton. There is no law or amendment that a former president can't be a vice president. It will keep those dirty republican congress from impeaching Gore because they do not want Clinton back in.

midwinter

11-07-2004, 03:31 PM

Originally posted by quagmire
Gore/Clinton. But, not Hiliary Clinton, Bill Clinton. There is no law or amendment that a former president can't be a vice president. It will keep those dirty republican congress from impeaching Gore because they do not want Clinton back in.

Clinton has spoken pretty clearly on this, and it's his belief that the spirit of the law prevents him from running as a VP.

Scott

11-07-2004, 03:54 PM

Outsider

11-07-2004, 03:58 PM

Originally posted by Scott
Now that's clever. So then we could do Cheney/Bush? Been there, done that. ;)

SDW2001

11-07-2004, 05:47 PM

Originally posted by ast3r3x
Well, he has engery, and is loved by most of PA. Not to mentio he did pretty good for Philadlephia.

He's not loved. You know they call him the Governor of Philadelphia?
He's broken a lot of promises. The teacher's are furious with him.

SDW2001

11-07-2004, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by midwinter
Clinton has spoken pretty clearly on this, and it's his belief that the spirit of the law prevents him from running as a VP.

I agree that it does.

hardeeharhar

11-07-2004, 06:12 PM

Originally posted by SDW2001
He's not loved. You know they call him the Governor of Philadelphia?
He's broken a lot of promises. The teacher's are furious with him.

Seeing that Philadelphia isn't a state and its government is set up with a mayor and not a governor, the people who say this are idiots. That and Philly isn't the only urban area in Pennsylvania, contrary to popular belief in the suburbs of Philly...

SDW2001

11-07-2004, 08:23 PM

Originally posted by hardeeharhar
Seeing that Philadelphia isn't a state and its government is set up with a mayor and not a governor, the people who say this are idiots. That and Philly isn't the only urban area in Pennsylvania, contrary to popular belief in the suburbs of Philly...

Umm...it's because it's another...wait for it....JOKE. It's because he hasn't done a damn thing except eating hundreds of Buffalo wings while speeding on the turnpike.

As far as PA, do you live here? Rendell is slime, and many here have figured that out.

hardeeharhar

11-07-2004, 11:21 PM

Originally posted by SDW2001
Umm...it's because it's another...wait for it....JOKE. It's because he hasn't done a damn thing except eating hundreds of Buffalo wings while speeding on the turnpike.

As far as PA, do you live here? Rendell is slime, and many here have figured that out.

Yes.

Kirkland

11-08-2004, 12:36 PM

Originally posted by midwinter
Mark Warner, maybe?

DING DING DING DING DING DING DING.

We have a winner.

Kirkland

11-08-2004, 12:38 PM

Originally posted by quagmire
Gore/Clinton. But, not Hiliary Clinton, Bill Clinton. There is no law or amendment that a former president can't be a vice president. It will keep those dirty republican congress from impeaching Gore because they do not want Clinton back in.

The law implicitly DOES prevent Clinton from running. The law requires that the candidate for vice president be legally eligible to run for president. Bill Clinton is not legally eligible to run for president, ergo he is not eligible to run for vice president.

midwinter

11-08-2004, 01:15 PM

Originally posted by Kirkland
The law implicitly DOES prevent Clinton from running. The law requires that the candidate for vice president be legally eligible to run for president. Bill Clinton is not legally eligible to run for president, ergo he is not eligible to run for vice president.

Actually, when I heard Clinton speak about this, he pointed out that "legally eligible" means the standard stuff: 35 years old, born in the US, etc. He did point out, though, that the spirit of the law was that you get two terms and that's that and you're supposed to bow out.

Kirkland

11-08-2004, 01:54 PM

Someone who has served two complete terms for president is not legally eligible to be president again. That's not symbolic or the "spirit" of the law -- it's just flat out the law.

midwinter

11-08-2004, 02:02 PM

Originally posted by Kirkland
Someone who has served two complete terms for president is not legally eligible to be president again. That's not symbolic or the "spirit" of the law -- it's just flat out the law.

Well, this is neither here nor there. But here's what the owner's manual says about eligibility:

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

It's pretty straightforward. You have to meet all of these requirements to be eligible for the office.

Now here's the salient bits of the 22nd amendment to the owner's manual:

No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of the President more than once.

In other words, technically, Clinton could serve as VP and then, if tragedy struck, assume the office of the Presidency, since he would not have been elected more than twice.

Do you see what I'm getting at with all of this? The owner's manual doesn't clearly prohibit a former president from serving as a VP, nor does it clearly prohibit a former President becoming president under the order of succession. It just prohibits him/her from being elected more than twice.

Anyway. I'm doing some digging around on Mark Warner. Seems ok at first glance.

Cheers

Scott

11-08-2004, 02:28 PM

Although to may be fun to dream up hypertechnical ways in which Clinton or Bush or Reagan if he were still alive could be president again, the 22nd clearly intends to keep someone out off office that has been there for two terms.

Towel

11-08-2004, 02:34 PM

Just to complete the "proof", here's the bit pertaining to who can be VP, from the 12th Ammendment:But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.The legal argument for a former Pres as VP is based on the 22nd amendment using clearly different language - "shall be elected" rather than "shall be eligible". I'd love to hear from the authors of that amendment (are any still alive?) to know what they were thinking when they used that language. In the absence of their testimony, it seems if they had meant to make this sort of thing impossible, they would have just said "eligible".

Edit: Thinking about it, they must have used that language intentionally, because otherwise you could argue that no former President could hold any position in the line of succession (including in Congress).

burningwheel

11-08-2004, 03:27 PM

Obama said he won't run. he said he hasn't even stepped foot in the senate yet

why are you people obsessed with him running

the question is will Cheny run?

Scott

11-08-2004, 04:43 PM

Cheney can't run. The heart attack would kill him.

11-08-2004, 05:05 PM

Cheney has said this is his last term in public office.

BuonRotto

11-08-2004, 05:16 PM

yay. :p

Splinemodel

11-08-2004, 05:23 PM

Originally posted by slughead
what about the libertarians?

we've got nowhere to go but up!

I think most libertarians would look at the list above and agree that Arnold is the most preferable of them. Of course, unless the constitution is ammended, then he can't run. If Bush and a republican congress somehow manage to ammend the consitution in the next four years, I would consider voting for Arnold, even though I usually vote strictly along party lines. . . . Libertarian party lines, that is. ;)

rok

11-08-2004, 09:50 PM

Originally posted by Splinemodel
I think most libertarians would look at the list above and agree that Arnold is the most preferable of them. Of course, unless the constitution is ammended, then he can't run. If Bush and a republican congress somehow manage to ammend the consitution in the next four years, I would consider voting for Arnold, even though I usually vote strictly along party lines. . . . Libertarian party lines, that is. ;)

i thought ventura was, ostensibly, a libertarian. say what you will about the big goof, but he can sometimes be very well-spoken, and has miltary background. and heck, it's not like he's trying to hide his wrestling history. it was his job, it's why people know him, he can't go back and not wrestle, so be it.

however, if you had told me a decade ago we might be looking at a jesse ventura vs. arnold schwarzeneggar presidential election in my lifetime, i would have likely imploded.