Blu-Ray forces Sony PlayStation 3 delay

[AppleInsider]

Sony will put off the release of its much anticipated PlayStation 3 console until November from its planned spring debut because of delays in finalizing the next-generation Blu-ray optical disc technology to be used in the gaming system, the company said on Wednesday.

PlayStation 3 delays

According to the Associated Press, Ken Kutaragi, the head Sony's video games division, made the announcement at a hastily called news conference after reports of the delay surfaced in the business daily Nihon Keizai Shimbun and other papers.

The new timeline means that the PlayStation 3 will still hit store shelves simultaneously in Japan, North America and Europe, just in time for Christmas, the report said.

During the news conference, Kutaragi said Sony is still trying to finalize the copyright protection technology and other standards for the Blu-ray DVD disc, the format for PlayStation 3, and next-generation video for the company's electronics gadgets in the works.

"I'd like to apologize for the delay," Kutaragi said. "I have been cautious because many people in various areas are banking on the potential of the next-generation DVD."

Blu-ray preparations were initially to have been completed by last September, but now won't be finalized until next month, he said.

Blu-ray in Macs

The news is relevant to Mac users as Apple has also endorsed the Blu-ray as its next-generation optical disc format for Macintosh computers.

It was about year ago this time that the company announced it had joined the Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA), which pits itself against the rival HD DVD format, whose supporters include industry heavyweights such as Microsoft and Intel.

According to AppleInsider's proprietary checks, which took place in February, one of Apple's two primary optical drive suppliers were estimating delivery of half height Blu-ray drives -- designed for desktop systems -- for the second calendar quarter of the year. However, delivery of slim slot-loading Blu-ray drives -- designed for notebooks -- was estimated anywhere between the beginning of the third quarter to the end of the year.

News of ongoing Blu-ray delays may mean that Mac users will also have to wait for the next-generation drives to show up in Apple's computer systems. Prior to this news, it was expected that the company's first-generation Intel-based PowerMac systems would be the first Macs to support Blu-ray in the form of the half height drives.[ View this article at AppleInsider.com ] (http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1595)

[nagromme]

All that delay just for the © protection?

BD is the superior technology and holds MORE DATA. But if they simply can't get it done, then luckily Apple can easily support either or both in future.

I was hoping for a BD drive in a new Intel PowerMac in late summer. Hopes are dwindling. I may have to go external later.

[vinney57]

Copy protection? Hmm... sounds like a little spin on the situation.

Let the squabbling begin!

[Catman4d2]

half height? cool! does that mean slimmer notebooks?

[hmurchison]

It was about year ago this time that the company announced it had joined the Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA), pitting itself against supporters of the rival HD DVD format, which later grew to include industry heavyweights such as Microsoft and Intel.

Apple's not necessarily pitting themselves against anyone.

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2005/apr/17fcstudio.html

DVD Studio Pro 4, Final Cut Studio’s professional DVD authoring program, is the first commercially available DVD authoring software that lets users burn their HD projects to high definition DVDs based on the latest HD DVD specification. DVD Studio Pro 4 will be demonstrated at NAB with a prototype consumer HD DVD player from Toshiba set to debut later this year

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2005/apr/17hd.html

Apple is committed to both emerging high definition DVD standards—Blu-ray Disc and HD DVD. Apple is an active member of the DVD Forum which developed the HD DVD standard, and last month joined the Board of Directors of the Blu-ray Disc Association.



http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/press/release/detail/0,,2076_4313_291704979,00.html

http://www.cdfreaks.com/news/12307

Current Blu Ray Recorders lack the ability to burn CD.


Franky I'm not all that interested in either Blu Ray or HD DVD Player/Recorder. Many people are thinking that they'll just slot their drive in an start watching movies. Bzzzzzzzz unless you have a HDCP DVI/HDMI output and a HDCP monitor it ain't happening for Pre-recorded media.

I doubt that we'll see "affordable" Blu Ray or HD DVD drives until 2007. The Pioneer drive listed above is roughly $995

The PS3 is going to take a lion's share of the blue diodes so I don't expect that computer drives will be plentiful as well. These drives are different than any other drive we've had. They both have DRM as a vital component and the surrounding hardware must be on the same page.

[sCreeD]

Actually, Sony (and a few other studios) have gone on record (http://www.engadget.com/2006/03/14/sony-wont-downsample-blu-ray-flicks/) saying that their content will not down-sample HD content piped to analog sets.

Makes sense, they need their format to succeed.

[Xool]

Originally posted by nagromme
All that delay just for the © protection?

BD is the superior technology and holds MORE DATA. But if they simply can't get it done, then luckily Apple can easily support either or both in future.

I was hoping for a BD drive in a new Intel PowerMac in late summer. Hopes are dwindling. I may have to go external later.

I agree. Hopes for BD in the MacBook Pro I plan to purchase later this year have all but vanished. Same goes for the first round of intel towers, although I doubt I'll be replacing my G5 tower until sometime in 2007.

I prefer Blu-Ray so I'm somewhat glad that HD-DVD is being delayed too, although at the end of the day I just want HD content and it can't come too soon!

[fuyutsuki]

"Half height" = standard 5.25" drive size. It's a throwback to when drives were monsters and computers were powered by their users terror ... the original IBM PC most likely.

I for one am looking out for a blue laser laptop drive so I can upgarde my old PowerBook's combo drive (2003 ... need I say more) to something which can read the monster 25, 50, 100gb discs I'll be burning with my new Mac once they get those out! I don't need HD video on my 12" screen. I'm just looking for the data capacity! It will make my anime far more portable. ;)

[1984]

Here is what the Half Height, Slim Tray and Slim Slot BD recorders will look like...

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20051005/pana02.jpg

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20051005/pana01.jpg

... and they all will record DVD and CD just fine thank you very much.

[1984]

The delay in releasing the PS3 was expected. I realize that Sony wanted to use it to further push the Blu-Ray format as soon as possible but they have virtaully every other manufacturer in existance to take care of that. It simply doesn't make sense to release it until the holiday buying season. Better to release it when it's ready along with a decent number of games and movies. I just wish they would nail down the specs already.

[Kolchak]

Originally posted by 1984
Here is what the Half Height, Slim Tray and Slim Slot BD recorders will look like...
... and they all will record DVD and CD just fine thank you very much.

Yes, that's why they have the "Compact Disc Re-Writeable" logo on them. You have to love these people who write "current recorders can't do this" or that. Current recorders aren't sold in the US. Chew on this: as far as I can tell, the Toshiba HD-A1 won't support DVD+R. Not that I care, since I use DVD-R, but that does cut out a substantial amount of the market, especially since some seem to feel +R was victorious over -R. And that's not a current recorder, it's a future recorder.

[Elixir]

Originally posted by 1984
The delay in releasing the PS3 was expected. I realize that Sony wanted to use it to further push the Blu-Ray format as soon as possible but they have virtaully every other manufacturer in existance to take care of that. It simply doesn't make sense to release it until the holiday buying season. Better to release it when it's ready along with a decent number of games and movies. I just wish they would nail down the specs already.


84- your time is coming.

[hmurchison]

I assume you guys are talking about me.

The Pioneer unit is the first Blu Ray that's shipping. What you've captured here are mockups that aren't shipping. I've never stated that all Blu Ray recorders will not record CDRW as well. Some of you have a unecessary chip on your shoulder. I tend to carry my own sometimes as well though.

Looking forward to seeing both formats in the marketplace. I'm highly impressed with the quality of HD DVD and Blu Ray just may be superior. If HD DVD is as bad as it gets then we all benefit greatly.

[GregAlexander]

Interesting, glad to see Apple supporting both.

What I want to see is iMovie HD burning HD straight to regular DVDs. Apparently one of the standards for BlueRay allows for the BlueRay MPEG4-AVC/WMV/MPEG2 (plus menus) to be written to one of today's DVD's. That should mean 4 or 5 hours of standard quality video on today's DVD - but only playing in new BluRay players.

For me, right now - burning slideshows in SD and HD would be great (let your player play standard unless you have a bluray). The photos obviously have high resolution so why not be ready for the new players.

Greg

[hmurchison]

Greg

Good news. Burning HD Red Laser discs should be a feature of both players. Sure you'll only get like 45 minutes of space but for short HD productions and longer for SD and that's fine for the cost.

Even better news is

Amtel Corp (http://www.atmel.com/dyn/corporate/view_detail.asp?FileName=Cebit_3_8.html)

announced today its AT78C4050 “All-Format DVD" System-on-Chip (AFDVD™ SoC), the industry's highest level, integrated optical system based on 0.13 micron technology. The AT78C4050 is capable of supporting both blue and red laser technologies including all DVD-ROM, DVD-R/RW, DVD+R/RW, CD-ROM, CD-R/RW and the next-generation HD-DVD and Blue-ray Disc® DVD formats.

This new SoC for an “All-Format DVD" is designed for consumer electronics as well as the PC market and is the first DVD front end device that integrates PRML data channel, DVD ECC, CD CIRC C3, buffer management, DVD CD 1.7PP, EFM+, EFM Endec, and ATAPI interface logic on a single chip. The AT78C4050 integrates all necessary components for a DVD and CD re-writable drive as well as a DVD recorder.

Atmel's AT78C4050 AFDVD SoC is backward compatible with every format that uses a red laser and can achieve DVD read and write speeds of up to 16x and CD-ROM disc read and write speeds of up to 54x. The AT78C4050 for blue laser DVDs can implement speeds of up to 8x making it an ideal system-on-chip for use in the next generation of DVD products including both HD-DVD and Blu-ray formats which use the blue laser-based technology.

Atmel offers complete development platforms for blue and red laser OPUs (Optical Pick-Up Units), enabling customers to start system development with their own preferred OPU hardware. Development platforms include the Atmel AT78C4050 and AT78C3007 Motor Driver, Flash memory, Laser Diode Driver Integrated Circuit (LDDIC) and Photo Detector Integrated Circuit (PDIC). Complete reference design platforms, including firmware and board support packages, provide a complete tool for accelerated customer development.

"Our complete development solution enables Atmel to reduce risk, accelerate time-to-market, and produce cost-effective solutions for all companies involved in the development of both competing formats of HD-DVD and Blu-Ray Discs," said Max Bathaee, Atmel's Director of Marketing for Network Storage Products. “With the new Atmel AFDVD SoC we are able to provide VLSI solutions in technologies such as portable recorders and digital DVD camcorders in addition to consumer electronics and the PC market."

Atmel's optical storage design team shared its design information at ISSCC last month to enable engineers and designers around the world to take advantage of Atmel's breakthrough design for the next generation of the blue laser DVD products. Atmel's AFDVD SoC is an advanced architecture taking advantage of a Partial Response, Maximum Likelihood (PRML) read channel which uses advanced mixed-signal and digital signal processing (DSP), optical disc controller, servo logic and two 32-bit embedded microprocessors offering superior performance, scalability, integration and power efficiency for DVD-recorder applications. And, this SoC was recently nominated as one of the finalists for the EDN innovation product of the year.

The AT78C4050 is now available at a unit cost of $8.00 in quantities of 100. A hardware and firmware reference design is also available.



$8 bucks is all. I now see why LG is scrapping plans for two seperate players and moving to Universal Players from the jump. Look for more options to spring up soon as common sense hits many of the CE vendors and they begin to offer UPs.

[Xool]

I'm also looking forward to using current DVD media for short HD projects or for longer SD projects using the HD codecs. I'm glad the Blu-Ray standard is thinking of this. Hopefully iDVD, DVD Studio Pro, and Toast will support it too!

[McDave]

Originally posted by nagromme
All that delay just for the © protection?

BD is the superior technology and holds MORE DATA. But if they simply can't get it done, then luckily Apple can easily support either or both in future.

I was hoping for a BD drive in a new Intel PowerMac in late summer. Hopes are dwindling. I may have to go external later.


If copyright protection's the problem the answer is simple, just release them in France! ;)

I take it this is why the Apple Media Centre hasn't made an appearance. Without HD playback as the killer app it's difficult to justify a $1000-1500 price tag. Still, it gives them time for downloaded TV shows/movies (maybe HD!) to replace DVR as the preferred way of de-scheduling TV, which should make the Media Centre concept more viable (less configuration) for the masses.

Do we even know if the Intel Mac Mini has the horsepower to playback HD movies?

McD

[mania]

you guys seem all warm and fuzzy for bludeathray but I get bad feelings about it - meaning think about how much harder it is to rip and burn a dvd than it is an audio cd, and how many more coasters you get. now extrapolate to the hd flavors. you get my drift. kinda like how people think they want bluetooth but no one trusts it cause its so flaky.

[GregAlexander]

Originally posted by McDave
Do we even know if the Intel Mac Mini has the horsepower to playback HD movies? I don't think we know. I've read a review saying it didn't work, and a review saying it worked great. I'd let time pass (or wait for a solid review) before saying either way.

[Elixir]

i'm not for blu ray at all.

all these security measures have me worried.

[hmurchison]

Originally posted by Xool
I'm also looking forward to using current DVD media for short HD projects or for longer SD projects using the HD codecs. I'm glad the Blu-Ray standard is thinking of this. Hopefully iDVD, DVD Studio Pro, and Toast will support it too!

You can thank Warner. Rumor has it BD-9 support was the clincher for Warner agreeing to bring content to BD-ROM.

[1984]

Originally posted by Elixir
i'm not for blu ray at all.

all these security measures have me worried.

How is HD-DVD any different? :lol:

[1984]

Originally posted by hmurchison

The Pioneer unit is the first Blu Ray that's shipping. What you've captured here are mockups that aren't shipping.

May is not that far off though. Here are the model numbers and specs...

Panasonic UJ-215 and Panasonic SW-5582 (http://www.dfwdepot.com/dvd-ram/index.php?main_page=products_general_info&products_id=54&zenid=92babc71015db08d7cd88b799a35d1fa)

[aplnub]

Originally posted by GregAlexander
I don't think we know. I've read a review saying it didn't work, and a review saying it worked great. I'd let time pass (or wait for a solid review) before saying either way.

if by HD you mean 1080p, my new intel mini Core Duo does great playing the movie trailers off Apple's website. It makes me cry at night when I am on my iMac G5 20" 1.8 GHz.

[1984]

I have yet to see anyone run one at the full 1920x1080 resolution. No one has a 23" Cinema Display hooked up to their Mac mini.

[hmurchison]

Originally posted by 1984
How is HD-DVD any different? :lol:

While both Blu Ray and HD DVD utilize AACS 128-bit encryption Blu Ray adds ROM Mark and BD+ ontop. This is likely what is causing some delays as they try to get BD+ and AACS working in tandem.

[drakethegreat]

I could care less about both of the new formats. They are being pushed as highly restrictive when they could just be higher capacity disks for us to use. Instead Sony and Toshiba have to take the time to perfect how they can screw us out of our fair-use and break 1 law by using another (DMCA).

I for one plan to boycott both stick to DVDs for the time being. Honestly if this stuff isn't cheap enough until 2007 or later then I would also expect the new groundwork for better download services to be developed. Hell in a year and a half we may have a higher speed internet because both google and a specialized organization are rumored to be working on high speed backbones capable of supported the transfer of large video streams and files. This would solve the bandwidth considerations for high resolution HD films and in the end you just have to worry about hard disk capacity. Once again if this is 2007 or later then we should have 500 GB HDs (as big as the HD manufacturers want to make them without major defects) at a reasonable price of below 200 a piece. Easily enough to store 20 GB movies even uncompressed (which they won't be).

Reliability considered you save up 400 dollars, which is still nothing compared to the costs for me to buy a player and a computer with a drive for these new formats. Let us also not forget about the thousand dollar HDTV. With this 400 dollars you could buy two 500 GB HDs to backup everything and you will be set. You will be capable of saving 25 uncompressed films on those HDs but most likely they will be compressed to about 5-7 GBs and still be HD in which case you will have room for 2 copies of 71 films for 400.

A lot of guess work here but so is the dates of all this bluray and apple integration of it.

[aplnub]

Originally posted by 1984
I have yet to see anyone run one at the full 1920x1080 resolution. No one has a 23" Cinema Display hooked up to their Mac mini.

My wife has a 23", but she has a G4 Mini. :(

[Darth_Apple]

Check this out:

The SCE president also told the crowd that the PS3 would use a 60GB 2.5-inch hard disc drive (HDD). A slide show during the presentation said the HDD would be loaded with the Linux operating system instead of Microsoft's Windows OS. The show also said it could be used as a "home server," could be directly connected to the Internet, and would be fully "upgradable."

It would have been cool to see the OSX in the PS3 but we'll reach mars [people] before that happens :D

Here's the link to the news: http://www.gamespot.com/news/6145972.html