Apple introduces $899 education iMac

[AppleInsider]

Apple on Wednesday introduced a new $899 configuration of the 17-inch iMac designed specifically for education customers.

The computer features a 1.83 GHz Intel Core Duo processor, a built-in iSight video camera and iLife '06, the next generation of Apple's award-winning suite of digital lifestyle applications.

Apple said the 17-inch iMac for education is available immediately and will replace the eMac, its last CRT based computer, providing students and teachers everything they need to learn and create in today's digital classroom, all in the ultra-efficient iMac design.

"The iMac is ideal for the space saving needs of both the classroom and the dorm room with the entire computer built right into a two-inch thin display," Apple said. "The iMac design has continuously improved generation after generation, resulting in increased material efficiency, decreased packaging mass and volume, and decreased energy consumption -- all of which lead to a smaller environmental footprint."

Featuring a 17-inch widescreen LCD display, the iMac for education includes a Combo drive for burning CDs and reading DVDs, 512MB of 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM memory expandable up to 2GB and hard drive storage capacity up to 160GB.

Every iMac also includes a built-in iSight video camera for video conferencing out-of-the-box using Apple's iChat AV, or recording a video podcast or iMovie using iLife '06.

Providing the latest in high-performance connectivity options, the 17-inch iMac for education includes built-in 10/100/1000 BASE-T Gigabit Ethernet for high-speed networking, built-in AirPort Extreme 802.11g WiFi for up to 54 Mbps fast wireless networking, a total of five USB ports (three USB 2.0) and two FireWire 400 ports.

Designed with today's digital classroom in mind, every iMac comes with iLife '06, the next generation of Apple's award-winning suite of digital lifestyle applications featuring iPhoto, iMovie HD, iDVD, GarageBand and iWeb, a new iLife application that makes it super-easy to create amazing websites with photos, blogs and Podcasts and publish them on .Mac for viewing by anyone on the Internet with just a single click. Every iMac also comes with the latest release of the world's most advanced operating system, Mac OS X version 10.4.6 "Tiger" including Safari, Mail, iCal, iChat AV, Front Row and Photo Booth, running natively on the Intel-based desktop.

Pricing & Availability

The 17-inch iMac for education is available immediately for education customers through the Apple Store for Education or by calling an Apple education sales representative at 800-800-APPL.

The eMac will no longer be in production and is available for purchase while supplies last through the Apple Store for Education or by calling an Apple education sales representative at 800-800-APPL.

Apple will showcase the 17-inch iMac and its complete line of products and solutions for education at the National Educational Computing Conference in San Diego, California from July 5-7, 2006.

The 17-inch 1.83 GHz iMac, for a suggested education price of $899 (US), includes:
17-inch widescreen LCD display;
1.83 GHz Intel Core Duo processor;
512MB of 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM expandable to 2GB;
24x Combo drive;
Intel GMA 950 graphics;
built-in iSight video camera;
built-in AirPort Extreme wireless networking;
80GB Serial ATA hard drive running at 7200 rpm;
mini-DVI out (adapters for DVI, VGA and Composite/S-Video sold separately);
built-in stereo speakers and microphone; and
Mighty Mouse and Apple Keyboard.
Build-to-order options and accessories include up to 2GB DDR2 SDRAM, 160GB Serial ATA hard drive, iWork '06 (pre-installed), Apple Remote and Apple USB Modem.[ View this article at AppleInsider.com ] (http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1861)

[zedrac]

Oh God, the entire article is an email link!

But that iMac looks pretty bang for your buck. I like.

Edit: Didn't see the intergrated graphics...Not for me then.

[jaydfwtx]

This makes the price of the mac mini look horribly overpriced! Hopefully this system will eventually be available to everyone, as it is a great value.

[abrooks]

Good to see you can copy and paste, effective journalism.

Apple Press Release (http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2006/jul/05imac.html)

[Johnny Mozzarella]

Originally posted by jaydfwtx
This makes the price of the mac mini look horribly overpriced! Hopefully this system will eventually be available to everyone, as it is a great value.

It is available to almost anyone.
If you have kids in school or college then you can purchase from the education store.
If you take 1 class at your local community college, you can purchase from the education store.

This is a great value and making a similar configuration available to the general public would be a great move.
I agree, I think we are going to see the mini drop in price.

[Denmaru]

Indeed - that's a lot of bang for buck. I wonder why there no Superdrive BTO, though.

[your_ad_here]

Important to remember that if they sold this to the general public, it would probably be priced at $999 - the $899 is the edu price, and the existing imac models are $100 cheaper for edu buyers.

Still, even at $999 it seems like it would get a few sales. They would definitely need to bump the specs/decrease the price on the mini though.

[kim kap sol]

If this isn't an indication that the Mac Pros will be quad across the line (or at the very least the mid and top config), I don't know what is.

I mean, who the heck would pay 2000 for a 2.3 or 2.6 Conroe without a monitor when you can get a very respectable 1.8 Yonah for 900 *with* monitor. Sure...integrated graphics, no expandability, etc. but still...there's a limit to the bullcrap Apple can feed pros.

[Ireland]

Not on Europe yet. :(

[umijin]

Why would anyone (with edu access) buy a freaking mini with prices like this for the much better outfitted eMac?

Will they actually lower the mini price too?

[halo1982]

Top of the line Mini is $779...or you can get this very similarly equipped eMac for $899...hrm....
Thats a little over the price you'd pay for a keyboard and mouse, and all you lose is the Superdrive...

[kim kap sol]

Originally posted by halo1982
Top of the line Mini is $779...or you can get this very similarly equipped eMac for $899...hrm....
Thats a little over the price you'd pay for a keyboard and mouse, and all you lose is the Superdrive...

And you gain a monitor.

Mini price has got to come down.

[meelash]

WOW.:wow: This is a really, really nice deal. I've been waiting for a new config to come out at WWDC to buy for my mum that's not too expensive but now I think I might buy this instead. The only thing that's holding me back is the possibility of a new Nano before the free nano education deal expires in September.

I think that it's more likely the mini specs will go up than that the price will come down. IMO the mini was overpriced even compared to the regular iMac when you factor in the cost of monitor, keyboard, mouse, etc.

[onlooker]

The edu mini price is irrelevant IMO #1 it's a much newer product, and design than this iMac. It is also a discounted price for an actual product. This product is specifically designed for education, and is priced within the parameters of Apple's entire scholastic plan. Which would include mass sales into the pricing equation. The Mini was not intended for this nor was it priced in such a manner. Also, this iMac design is almost EOL IMO :) and the parts, manufacturing costs, etc. etc. etc.... have probably become far less expensive than they were when it was originally introduced. Now take out the graphics card, integrate it, and viola. The new eMac. Priced accordingly.

[sandau]

Originally posted by umijin
Why would anyone (with edu access) buy a freaking mini with prices like this for the much better outfitted eMac?

Will they actually lower the mini price too?

mini for the living room, mini for the car, mini for a server that hides away without a head (monitor). lots of uses.

[palegolas]

So what's the big difference from a normal iMac here..?
Is it the Intel GMA 950 graphics that makes it cheap and somewhat dull?
I guess it's good enough for schools, and that's great.

[backtomac]

I think that unless a school was doing a lot of video editing this would be an excellent machine. I'm sure there are some teachers who visit the forum who can comment on typical usage of computers in class.

[hmurchison]

You newbies need to show a wee bit more respect. Add a bit more "content" yourselves before chiding AI. 8)

Nice unit but I'm thinking that next years iMac Edu is going to be nice if it has Conroe and a 20" version for $1299. I'll accept GMA X3000 integrated graphics but me personally I'm not buying another GMA 950 based unit. Nice price though and ready for the BtS buying frenzy

[macbear01]

Originally posted by palegolas
So what's the big difference from a normal iMac here..?
Is it the Intel GMA 950 graphics that makes it cheap and somewhat dull?
I guess it's good enough for schools, and that's great.
Just looking at the simple specs under the pricing at the store...

17" 1.83 GHz Duo and 17" 1.83 GHz Duo (same)
$899 edu vs. $1199 edu/$1299 standard
80 GB HDD vs. 160 GB HDD
Combo Drive vs. Dual-Layer Super Drive
Intel GMA Graphics (64 MB shared) vs. ATI x1600 (128 MB dedicated)
No Bluetooth vs. Bluetooth
No Remote vs. Apple Remote

Does that account for $300?

[ApplePi]

Looks nice. May actually pick one up with my student loan. But I don't start school till the end of September. Hopefully the free nano deal is still going by then. But I doubt it.

[artse]

Originally posted by macbear01
Does that account for $300?
Yes it does!

[NOFEER]

i'm surprised that to put more distance between the other products that it didn't have a 15" screen.

[ApplePi]

Originally posted by NOFEER
i'm surprised that to put more distance between the other products that it didn't have a 15" screen.

Probably cheaper to stick with a 17" for manufacturing purposes. This is one of those machines that's not supposed to fit into their tidy consumer lineup. It's entirely for education purposes alone.

[xebeche]

Originally posted by macbear01
Just looking at the simple specs under the pricing at the store...

17" 1.83 GHz Duo and 17" 1.83 GHz Duo (same)
$899 edu vs. $1199 edu/$1299 standard
80 GB HDD vs. 160 GB HDD
Combo Drive vs. Dual-Layer Super Drive
Intel GMA Graphics (64 MB shared) vs. ATI x1600 (128 MB dedicated)
No Bluetooth vs. Bluetooth
No Remote vs. Apple Remote

Does that account for $300?

No, it accounts for $400 to most people and then $300 educationally.

I think many of you are missing the point here. Apple is really cutting their margin out on THIS MACHINE alone to provide the education market a very inexpensive alternative. They may reduce the price of the Mac Minis, who knows, but I highly doubt this will be available to the public like the eMac was. We'll all just have to suck it up and move on with our lives.

[GordonComstock]

Originally posted by palegolas
So what's the big difference from a normal iMac here..?
Is it the Intel GMA 950 graphics that makes it cheap and somewhat dull?
I guess it's good enough for schools, and that's great.

It's not just good for schools. It's great for Mac based small businesses with a few low level admins whose work is primarily email, Word, and the web. I've got three eMacs that are perfectly fine for light duty work. These will make a nice replacement, taking up much less desk real estate, getting current with hardware and preparing for the more distant future's inevitable Intel only OS features.

I like it.

gc

[Mr. H]

Originally posted by backtomac
I think that unless a school was doing a lot of video editing this would be an excellent machine.

There's nothing wrong with these machines for video-editing. You don't need a dedicated graphics chip for video editing.

Whilst this machine is a great deal, I hope that it isn't "it" for Apple's educational offerings. I hope they are working on an education-specific design and that this is a stop-gap. Where's the protective glass to prevent poking fingers from damaging the LCD? Where is the option for no camera (which is an issue for many schools, apparently)?

[aegisdesign]

Originally posted by Mr. H
There's nothing wrong with these machines for video-editing. You don't need a dedicated graphics chip for video editing.

There's nothing wrong with these machines for most things. I think people forget on here that many Pros have absolutely no need for 3D graphics or even a fast CPU.

I spend most of my time editing PHP/XHTML, ObjC code and 2D work in Photoshop/Illustrator or my personal stuff in iLife. To be frank, even the educational iMac is overkill.

[Placebo]

Do you all think this release precludes the possibility of a new eMac?

[Chucker]

Originally posted by Placebo
Do you all think this release precludes the possibility of a new eMac? [/B]

At the very least, it makes it unlikely. Notice also that apple.com/emac used to redirect to apple.com/education/emac (once they had removed general-public eMac sales), which now redirects, in turn, to apple.com/education. So for now, eMac is no more. I see no reason for Apple to reintroduce it; they have the mini at the lower end and the non-education-specific iMacs at the higher end. Seems to me this segment is quite saturated now. Don't forget the MacBook, too.

[xsmi]

Yes,

I too agree that this machine will be fine for most classrooms. The computers in the classrooms wher I work are mainly for Word Processing, PowerPoint presentaions, Indesign and I do my work in Finale. I think these machines are adequate for the uses stated above. I don't know what the per unit cost of the Dells we purchased were last year, but I don't think it was much less and they came with smaller HD's (everything saved on central server), no CDR, and NO STYLE!! ;)

[CharlesS]

I wonder why there's not even an option to add Bluetooth via BTO. Yeah, I know you can do it with a USB dongle, but why isn't it an option? The old first-generation G5 iMacs that didn't have Bluetooth standard at least let you add it as an option...

[BenRoethig]

Originally posted by ApplePi
Probably cheaper to stick with a 17" for manufacturing purposes. This is one of those machines that's not supposed to fit into their tidy consumer lineup. It's entirely for education purposes alone.

And they said that about the eMac until they learned there was a market. It still exists.

[JeffDM]

Originally posted by aegisdesign
There's nothing wrong with these machines for most things. I think people forget on here that many Pros have absolutely no need for 3D graphics or even a fast CPU.


I've heard of a test that showed that the "unsupported" configurations for Final Cut Studio still work fine, at a negligible speed difference, the MB did about as well as a MBP. Any operation that uses the GPU will work fine because the Intel video chip is programmable, and as such, supports Core Image / Core Video.

I have not sought out this test though.

[melgross]

Originally posted by palegolas
So what's the big difference from a normal iMac here..?
Is it the Intel GMA 950 graphics that makes it cheap and somewhat dull?
I guess it's good enough for schools, and that's great.

The 950 is fine for video editing. The only area it falls down on is 3D games and CAD. Not likely a major user base for this machine.

We have been doing video editing over the years with video cards far less powerful than the 950 IG. All we need is a 24 bit output with high enough video rez for the monitor. The 17" monitor built-in here will be well served by the 950.

[melgross]

Originally posted by GordonComstock
It's not just good for schools. It's great for Mac based small businesses with a few low level admins whose work is primarily email, Word, and the web. I've got three eMacs that are perfectly fine for light duty work. These will make a nice replacement, taking up much less desk real estate, getting current with hardware and preparing for the more distant future's inevitable Intel only OS features.

I like it.

gc

That's right!

A machine that sits on the desk of most secretary's doesn't need fancy graphics, a huge HD, Blutooth, WiFi, or major RAM installs. As most business machines go on desks like that, it could be of interest to companies, as Apple will likely sell this machine to the general public as well, if the outcry is loud enough (if they aren't already!).

[melgross]

Originally posted by Placebo
Do you all think this release precludes the possibility of a new eMac?

Once Apple started selling it to the general public it became a misnomer anyway. This might just be an acknowledgment of that. Why call something the "Educational" machine if anyone can buy it?

[initiator]

"The eMac will no longer be in production and is available for purchase while supplies last through the Apple Store for Education or by calling an Apple education sales representative at 800-800-APPL."

FYI

There are NO supplies of eMacs available anywhere. When I called Apple Education, they only had refurbs, and those were only available to educational buyers (not individual education sales).

I was hoping to nab one of the last eMacs with a Superdrive, but there are NONE to be found. Every website I visit (even those that say they have stock) have no stock. Talk about scarce. I know I shouldn't have waited, but I was still hoping. Anyone know where I can find a new one?

BTW: I don't like LCD. I'm old school...prefer CRTs.

[melgross]

Originally posted by CharlesS
I wonder why there's not even an option to add Bluetooth via BTO. Yeah, I know you can do it with a USB dongle, but why isn't it an option? The old first-generation G5 iMacs that didn't have Bluetooth standard at least let you add it as an option...

Schools don't want the capability for wireless Bluetooth on many machines. The idea is to lock the machines down, operationally. Bluetooth would be a nucience. By Apple removing the upgradability, they lose nothing, and save some in component, assembly, and testing costs.

[JeffDM]

Originally posted by xebeche
No, it accounts for $400 to most people and then $300 educationally.

I think many of you are missing the point here. Apple is really cutting their margin out on THIS MACHINE alone to provide the education market a very inexpensive alternative. They may reduce the price of the Mac Minis, who knows, but I highly doubt this will be available to the public like the eMac was. We'll all just have to suck it up and move on with our lives.

The educational price of one product shouldn't be compared to the retail price of a different model. The price difference would still be $300 if it had a retail presence. The educational price of the next model up is $1199.

[melgross]

Oh, by the way, we might take notice of the fact that it's WEDNESDAY!!!

So much for Tuesday only intro's, that some keep insisting upon. Remember this for future arguments.

[JeffDM]

Originally posted by initiator
There are NO supplies of eMacs available anywhere. When I called Apple Education, they only had refurbs, and those were only available to educational buyers (not individual education sales).

I was hoping to nab one of the last eMacs with a Superdrive, but there are NONE to be found. Every website I visit (even those that say they have stock) have no stock. Talk about scarce. I know I shouldn't have waited, but I was still hoping. Anyone know where I can find a new one?

They are probably holding onto their refurbished units to make sure schools can get replacements of the same machine for the service life of the computers, especially for labs where they might want to keep all the computers identical.

Originally posted by melgross
Oh, by the way, we might take notice of the fact that it's WEDNESDAY!!!

So much for Tuesday only intro's, that some keep insisting upon. Remember this for future arguments.

For the record, it doesn't matter to me what day it's announced. I would call it an exception because of the holiday. It doesn't make sense to announce on a holiday.

[GordonComstock]

Originally posted by initiator
"The eMac will no longer be in production and is available for purchase while supplies last through the Apple Store for Education or by calling an Apple education sales representative at 800-800-APPL."

FYI

There are NO supplies of eMacs available anywhere. When I called Apple Education, they only had refurbs, and those were only available to educational buyers (not individual education sales).

I was hoping to nab one of the last eMacs with a Superdrive, but there are NONE to be found. Every website I visit (even those that say they have stock) have no stock. Talk about scarce. I know I shouldn't have waited, but I was still hoping. Anyone know where I can find a new one?

Sooo.....

Will there be a temporarily increased desire for these machines created that will float the price for a small amount of time? IOW, is the time to put a few on eBay NOW? ASAP methinks? (they ain't worth that much used, ANYWAY).

gc

[onlooker]

Originally posted by melgross
Oh, by the way, we might take notice of the fact that it's WEDNESDAY!!!

So much for Tuesday only intro's, that some keep insisting upon. Remember this for future arguments.

Apple didn't announce it on fourth of July because it's a National Holiday.

Remember that in your future arguments.;)

[pmjoe]

Originally posted by macbear01
Just looking at the simple specs under the pricing at the store...

17" 1.83 GHz Duo and 17" 1.83 GHz Duo (same)
$899 edu vs. $1199 edu/$1299 standard
80 GB HDD vs. 160 GB HDD
Combo Drive vs. Dual-Layer Super Drive
Intel GMA Graphics (64 MB shared) vs. ATI x1600 (128 MB dedicated)
No Bluetooth vs. Bluetooth
No Remote vs. Apple Remote

Does that account for $300?
Also, 2x256MB RAM vs. 1x512MB (which I assume leaves a slot open for expansion).

[Bruce Young]

Originally posted by ApplePi
Looks nice. May actually pick one up with my student loan. But I don't start school till the end of September. Hopefully the free nano deal is still going by then. But I doubt it.

FYI, from Apple Education site:
http://www.apple.com/backtoschool/?cid=WWW-NAUS-BTS20060530-8EBFY
Free iPod with purchase is valid through September 16

(unless they extend it...)

[Bruce Young]

Originally posted by xsmi
I too agree that this machine will be fine for most classrooms...

Re. the specs and price on this new Edu model, I concur that this should be fine for the classroom. It really looks like an excellent value.

FYI, I have been in classrooms equipped with the older 15" iMacs (iLamps) g4s, and they worked adequately (though a tad slow) for WP, GoLive even PhotoShop CS.
So there should be no problems with using this new iMac with larger 17", and with faster processor (even noting you will be in Rosetta emulation mode for Adobe for now).

Originally posted by Placebo
Do you all think this release precludes the possibility of a new eMac?

Re. any more Education channel models, I remember reading some news analysis a month or so ago indicating that Apple's primary Education model was rather late/behind its introduction schedule and might not make it to market till late fall, early winter -- which would have meant they missed the entire back-to-school buying market. Not good.

So my guess is they grabbed a basic iMac 17 and tweaked it to conform to Academic needs criteria so that they'd be sure to have a decent and available model in stock for Back To School season.

Definitely the right move to have a decent machine ready to buy.
And my guess is there will be more education offerings down the road a bit.

[jbaker78]

I doubt that this is actually a special iMac, its screams Mac Mini in an iMac case. Hence the integrated graphics.

I would bet that this practically the same MB as the mini with slight component changes for the built in screen and SATA connection.

What do you think?

[Chucker]

Originally posted by jbaker78
I doubt that this is actually a special iMac, its screams Mac Mini in an iMac case. Hence the integrated graphics.

I would bet that this practically the same MB as the mini with slight component changes for the built in screen and SATA connection.

What do you think?

It's an iMac without a dedicated graphics card. The other iMacs already come with integrated graphics on the chipset; it's just unused.

The Mac mini is far more different from this iMac than the other iMacs are from it.

[jbaker78]

Ah yeah, the iMac does have integrated graphics already... damn, thought I was onto something there.

[ecking]

Originally posted by melgross
Apple will likely sell this machine to the general public as well, if the outcry is loud enough (if they aren't already!).

But how does one outcry? I have no idea how to go about complaining to apple to release it to the public.

[ecking]

Originally posted by melgross
Oh, by the way, we might take notice of the fact that it's WEDNESDAY!!!

So much for Tuesday only intro's, that some keep insisting upon. Remember this for future arguments.

Like others said yesterday was the 4th.

But it's funny because AL had something about a possible 4th of july intro of something and...here we are. Once again this site is on the ball.

[ecking]

Arg! Once again my old predictions were close but not perfect:

Originally posted by ecking
17"
anywhere from 80-120 3.5" 7200rpm hd
intel gma 950 graphics
1.66 core duo
2gb ram max (512 2x 256 standard)
no isight
no bluetooth
no wireless?

799-899

[Zenga]

Perhaps the iMac will become the eMac and a new iMac is on the works..!
:smokey:

[onlooker]

Originally posted by Zenga
Perhaps the iMac will become the eMac and a new iMac is on the works..!
:smokey:

That is pretty much what happened last time. But as I have been saying for a while I think Apple has all new designs for all their products now that they are on intel. I think keeping the same cases for the beginning of the transition was so Mac users would feel like these were all familiar Mac products. I think it worked, and they can now move on.

[Neruda]

Originally posted by backtomac
I think that unless a school was doing a lot of video editing this would be an excellent machine. I'm sure there are some teachers who visit the forum who can comment on typical usage of computers in class.

This is actually great news for my school.

I work for the techonology department of a high school, and we upgraded one of our two computer labs with about 40 new eMacs (1.42Ghz) about a month and a half ago. Both labs had iMacs (circa 1999-2000) running Tiger. The school wanted to squeeze every bit of use out of these machines, but this was a Total nightmare. The computers were so slow running anything that it actually antagonized many of the faculty/kids (mostly Windows XP users at home). I had to explain that yes, these computers suck, but that's because they're so old! Even the eMacs are a considerable improvement, but we waited to update the other lab in order to see if Apple would release an educational intel based iMac/eMac, so at least one of the labs will get these machines.

As a sidenote, our library has about 30 Dells running Windows XP (the catalogue system is XP only). All of these PCs are being replaced with iMacs, but my boss hasn't decided wether to install XP via Bootcamp or have the catalog run on XP through parallels. So we will probably not have any PC hardware to support this September. Good times :) Sucks having to still pay for all those Windows licenses, though.

[lundy]

Has to be an "iMac with SuperDrive" to qualify for the free iPod nano. :(

Originally posted by Bruce Young
FYI, from Apple Education site:
http://www.apple.com/backtoschool/?cid=WWW-NAUS-BTS20060530-8EBFY
Free iPod with purchase is valid through September 16

(unless they extend it...)

[@homenow]

For those counting pennies figuring how much the iMac could come down in price let's not forget that since Apple went to the LCD monitors for the iMac the price of those monitors have come down considerably in price, and should drop more by the end of the year. 17" LCD panels are now going for under $200 with incentives when the 17" Cinima was going for $699 when it was discontinued, I think that was about the time that the FP G4 iMac was released (17" LCD's were running about $400-500 at the time as I recall). Sure Apple has added a lot to the iMac since then, but most of it is not really needed for a low end model. Apple could probably release a $999 iMac today if they wanted to. I don't see this happening but Apple has gone on record that they wanted to get the price of the iMac back down below $1000. Of course that was a few years ago and before the Mini was released.

[furious_]

comparing iMac models (http://www.apple.com/au/education/imac/specs.html)

interesting that they kept the remote function.


Front Row and the Apple Remote — Your World at Your Fingertips

Or across the room. In a lab or classroom, why should a desktop computer strap you to the desk? iMac includes Apple’s new Front Row software, a simple and intuitive way to get to photos, videos, music and DVDs — even Keynote presentations. The Apple Remote is as easy to use as an iPod, and it can control one iMac or a whole room full of them, with one simple click


from here (http://www.apple.com/au/education/imac/)

[melgross]

Originally posted by JeffDM
For the record, it doesn't matter to me what day it's announced. I would call it an exception because of the holiday. It doesn't make sense to announce on a holiday.

I don't care either, but quite a few people here were insisting that the next intro would be Next Tuesday because of the holiday.

[melgross]

Originally posted by onlooker
Apple didn't announce it on fourth of July because it's a National Holiday.

Remember that in your future arguments.;)

Yeah, yeah. Read all the posts that predicted that because of the holidy, the next intro would be next Tuesday. Remember that?:lol: :lol:

[melgross]

Originally posted by jbaker78
Ah yeah, the iMac does have integrated graphics already... damn, thought I was onto something there.

That's ok, keep trying.

[melgross]

Originally posted by ecking
But how does one outcry? I have no idea how to go about complaining to apple to release it to the public.

Well, that might not have been the best word to use, but I like it.:)

Basically, by going into an Apple store and asking for it. The word gets back. It happened with the eMac. I suppose that's the way. After enough people ask, Apple will respond (hopefully).

[furious_]

would you not think that after the success of the eMac with consumers that apple would be smart enough to release it

[gar]

Originally posted by furious_
would you not think that after the success of the eMac with consumers that apple would be smart enough to release it Stupid enough, you mean.

The iMac G4 was overpriced and performance crippled.
That way iMac sales where well below exceptations so Apple needed a way to boost Mac sales.

That's not the case anymore. The iMac sells very well, these days.
And a $300-$400 premium is not something Apple will give up for some whinning cheapskates.

We'll see faster iMacs soon.
So Apple can justify the ultra steep price difference between the 17" iMac consumer edition and its educational counterpart.

[furious_]

why can it not replace the Mac Mini?

it has poor sales, crippled performance, and is over priced.

and the contempt you show for people who would rather save money and get a machine that better suits their need is amusing.

the mini misses its target market buy about 200$ and the iMac about the same. i use dells becasue they offer me price and performance that is second to none. i also do not pay for them :p

i would buy a edu iMac as it offers me everything i need:

- fast
- reliable
- no Grahics card: i fit into the 90% of computer uses that would not need now or ever a grahics card(as i only use accounting software)
- good price

but i do not pay for computers and am not a student/ education buyer so i miss out.

P.S. all prices are in AU dollars

edit: dells are reliable; the dell i am on now is 4 years old and never had a problem.

[CharlesS]

Originally posted by melgross
Schools don't want the capability for wireless Bluetooth on many machines. The idea is to lock the machines down, operationally. Bluetooth would be a nucience. By Apple removing the upgradability, they lose nothing, and save some in component, assembly, and testing costs.
Yeah, but it's available to students as well as administration. Students are actually very likely to want Bluetooth capability in their machines. This is why I wonder why Bluetooth isn't an option. I'm not asking for it to be standard.

Plus, schools don't necessarily need 802.11g wireless networking in a desktop machine either. They usually have Ethernet ports running into the lab. But this machine seems to have that.

[Chucker]

Yeah, the lack of BTO options for Bluetooth and a SuperDrive is unfortunate.

[backtomac]

Originally posted by gar


We'll see faster iMacs soon.
So Apple can justify the ultra steep price difference between the 17" iMac consumer edition and its educational counterpart.

I agree. Hopefully Conroe iMacs before the end of the month.:smokey:

[TenoBell]

The iMac G4 was overpriced and performance crippled.

why can it not replace the Mac Mini?
it has poor sales, crippled performance, and is over priced.

You guys throw the word crippled around a lot, can we describe what crippled means for context.

In context of its intended market how was the iMac G4 crippled? The iMac line has been Apple's most successful computers.

You can certainly make an argument for the Mac mini not including a keyboard or mouse as being crippled, but you know that when you buy it. Apple does not want the mini to sell as well as the iMac.

[hmurchison]

Teno it's "obvious" to me that my Honda is crippled because they didn't put the Acura NSX engine in it :smokey:

seriously though I believe a product is "crippled" when it has the ability to do more and is purposely diminished. Such as if I have an ethernet nic that could do gigabit but was limited to fast ethernet for no apparent reason.

[jbh0001]

Originally posted by initiator
BTW: I don't like LCD. I'm old school...prefer CRTs.

Then you'd better hope that SED (http://www.hdtvsolutions.com/sed_tvs.htm) technology pans out in a few years, and that they decide to make panels small enough to use for desktop & laptop computers.

[melgross]

Originally posted by CharlesS
Yeah, but it's available to students as well as administration. Students are actually very likely to want Bluetooth capability in their machines. This is why I wonder why Bluetooth isn't an option. I'm not asking for it to be standard.

Plus, schools don't necessarily need 802.11g wireless networking in a desktop machine either. They usually have Ethernet ports running into the lab. But this machine seems to have that.

If students want Bluetooth in their own machines, then they will just have to buy the regular model. Apple doesn't have to supply that ability. This is a price constrained model. Once they start adding the missing features back, or even the capability to add them, the price will start creeping up again.

[JeffDM]

Originally posted by hmurchison
Teno it's "obvious" to me that my Honda is crippled because they didn't put the Acura NSX engine in it :smokey:

seriously though I believe a product is "crippled" when it has the ability to do more and is purposely diminished. Such as if I have an ethernet nic that could do gigabit but was limited to fast ethernet for no apparent reason.

By that definition, Apple has crippled products, but the mini doesn't seem to count by the same definition. The old iMac, G4 and first few revisions of G5, were technically capable of dual head operation, but was set to only provide mirroring, only corrected as of the G5 /w iSight and later. Many iPods have the capability in the hardware to record audio, but it requires either a hack, such as Linux for iPod, or an add-on device, to turn it on.

[melgross]

Originally posted by JeffDM
By that definition, Apple has crippled products, but the mini doesn't seem to count by the same definition. The old iMac, G4 and first few revisions of G5, were technically capable of dual head operation, but was set to only provide mirroring, only corrected as of the G5 /w iSight and later. Many iPods have the capability in the hardware to record audio, but it requires either a hack, such as Linux for iPod, or an add-on device, to turn it on.

This discussion about "crippled" products will go nowhere. All products are crippled, except the very top of the line, by these definitions.

All companies have to have several lines of products. Often, it is cheaper to use some of the same components, but they then have to disable certain features. This is quite normal.

As long as the product doesn't subject the user to a small subset of programs, or hardware add-ons, as the old Pc jr. did, then it's fine.

[JeffDM]

Originally posted by melgross
This discussion about "crippled" products will go nowhere. All products are crippled, except the very top of the line, by these definitions.

All companies have to have several lines of products. Often, it is cheaper to use some of the same components, but they then have to disable certain features. This is quite normal.

As long as the product doesn't subject the user to a small subset of programs, or hardware add-ons, as the old Pc jr. did, then it's fine.

I don't know, the top of the line iPod can't record audio, so there's no more expensive product to protect.

Frankly, their old habit of disabling second head feature on iMac was truly ludicrous given that it's not going to canibalize the market for higher end products, and that it's an awfully expensive computer to be mirror-only.

[aegisdesign]

Originally posted by JeffDM
Frankly, their old habit of disabling second head feature on iMac was truly ludicrous given that it's not going to canibalize the market for higher end products, and that it's an awfully expensive computer to be mirror-only.

How many iMac users are there that would want to run an ugly second monitor next to their beautiful iMac though?

Not many I'd guess. You buy an iMac because you don't want the bulk.

Sure, deliberately disabling the feature is stupid but I can't imagine it's a feature that gets used a lot.

[ecs]

I don't like what Apple is doing. They release yet another machine with bad graphics before they fixed the hardware problems in MacBooks. Believe me, I hate to say this, but I don't see any quality advantage of Apple products over PCs anymore. I'd say current products are of worse quality than PCs. Apple is trying to save the last penny in the production pipeline. I don't like this. Moving from PPC to Intel is not an excuse for also lowering the quality.

I'm impatient to see what they do with the Mac Mini now. Perhaps they'll will even drop the Intel graphics in it, and release a Mini without any graphics at all, just to save a few dollars. A shame.

[JeffDM]

Originally posted by aegisdesign
How many iMac users are there that would want to run an ugly second monitor next to their beautiful iMac though?

Not many I'd guess. You buy an iMac because you don't want the bulk.

Sure, deliberately disabling the feature is stupid but I can't imagine it's a feature that gets used a lot.

Why do you say it has to be an ugly monitor? Sounds like a red herring argument to me. Not everyone is so vain. Besides, I've heard that one can connect an LCD monitor up to one of these things, even this Apple company sells some if you must have brand matching.

[hmurchison]

Originally posted by ecs
I don't like what Apple is doing. They release yet another machine with bad graphics before they fixed the hardware problems in MacBooks. Believe me, I hate to say this, but I don't see any quality advantage of Apple products over PCs anymore. I'd say current products are of worse quality than PCs. Apple is trying to save the last penny in the production pipeline. I don't like this. Moving from PPC to Intel is not an excuse for also lowering the quality.

I'm impatient to see what they do with the Mac Mini now. Perhaps they'll will even drop the Intel graphics in it, and release a Mini without any graphics at all, just to save a few dollars. A shame.

Based on what relevant data? Do you have access to thousand of sales of both platforms and their return rate percentages? If not then what you say is tantamount to a Wild Ass Guess.

Before the MBP and MB you had a G4 processor with a 167Ghz bus. I'm struggling...and I mean strugglinng to see how quality has diminished in anyway. The MB employs a more solid feel than any other laptop I've seen at the same pricepoint. Sony Vaio's are nice but they don't necessarily "feel" all that durable.

[aegisdesign]

Originally posted by JeffDM
Why do you say it has to be an ugly monitor? Sounds like a red herring argument to me. Not everyone is so vain. Besides, I've heard that one can connect an LCD monitor up to one of these things, even this Apple company sells some if you must have brand matching.

They're silver though. Clashes horribly. :D

[ulyssespdx]

Downgrading an existing machine and calling it "Educational" so it can be sold for ~$300 cheaper is silly.

Apple wanted to capture the school purchasing cycle, but didn't have a new, separate design to offer.

Analyze it more than that and you're wasting your time. boooring.

[hmurchison]

Originally posted by ulyssespdx
Downgrading an existing machine and calling it "Educational" so it can be sold for ~$300 cheaper is silly.

Apple wanted to capture the school purchasing cycle, but didn't have a new, separate design to offer.

Analyze it more than that and you're wasting your time. boooring.

Why would it be silly? Students have books and tuition to pay for the $300 savings is key. Most of the items that were stripped can have the functionality added later. There was no reason to develop an entirely different computer for education use.

[gar]

Originally posted by TenoBell
You guys throw the word crippled around a lot, can we describe what crippled means for context.

In context of its intended market how was the iMac G4 crippled? The iMac line has been Apple's most successful computers. The iMac line yes, the iBook sold better than the the iMac G4, iirc.

It sold much worse than it should.
- 15" TFT prices did go up instead of down, like Apple had anticipated. So Apple had to add $100 to the list price.
- The iMac also didn't have a processor upgrade for 13 months!!!
Looks pretty crippled to me.

It had also to do with the Motorola's G4 successor that didn't work as hoped (it had some thermal and exploding issues) and the project eventually got cancelled in the spring of 2002.
(These are 4.5 years old rumours, etc. so don't ask for facts or links because I can't provide those.)
So Apple had to rely on the G4 for more than 18 months before they could introduce the ppc970.
(And 31 months before they could introduce the iMacG5)
You can certainly make an argument for the Mac mini not including a keyboard or mouse as being crippled, but you know that when you buy it. Indeed. But not because of the keyboard and mouse.Apple does not want the mini to sell as well as the iMac. Indeed.

[gar]

Originally posted by ulyssespdx
Downgrading an existing machine and calling it "Educational" so it can be sold for ~$300 cheaper is silly.

Apple wanted to capture the school purchasing cycle, but didn't have a new, separate design to offer.

Analyze it more than that and you're wasting your time. boooring. Why should they introduce a new design if they have a good one on the shelf.
This is way cheaper than designing and building an entier new computer case for a couple of tens of thousand computers.

Apple did exactly the thing we expected:
iMac design sans dedicated GPU.

[steve666]

Originally posted by jaydfwtx
This makes the price of the mac mini look horribly overpriced! Hopefully this system will eventually be available to everyone, as it is a great value.

The $599 Mac Mini should be made dual core ASAP. As is, its an obvious rip-off. The Solo should not appear in any Mac.

[Mr. H]

Originally posted by steve666
The Solo should not appear in any Mac.

Why's that then?

Why not give the $599 a Duo and make the current Solo version $499?

[steve666]

Originally posted by Mr. H
Why's that then?

Why not give the $599 a Duo and make the current Solo version $499?

Because its performance may lead folks new to macs to think that all macs suck.
Would you buy a Mini Solo for only $100 less than a Mini Duo?

[Mr. H]

Originally posted by steve666
Because its performance may lead folks new to macs to think that all macs suck.
Would you buy a Mini Solo for only $100 less than a Mini Duo?

I think you should give buyers more credit. There are plenty of people who will happily choose lower performance to save money. The Solo is not a poor performing processor; it is by no means at the bottom of Intel's range and is still significantly faster than the preceding G4 processor.

For some people, that extra $100 can be a deal-breaker.

[NOFEER]

Originally posted by Mr. H
I think you should give buyers more credit. There are plenty of people who will happily choose lower performance to save money. The Solo is not a poor performing processor; it is by no means at the bottom of Intel's range and is still significantly faster than the preceding G4 processor.

For some people, that extra $100 can be a deal-breaker.

that's what the retail market is all about, SJ knows his market and his target, for those that internet, email, etc hey the .9 g4 works great, that's what my wife has, and you need an entry level unit for this purpose, soooo what's the most intense thing would this level of consumer do??? it certainly is an upgrade for my wife's needs. most present pc's are way too much for 90% of consumer level buyers that mini probably does a better job with ebay than my wifes ibook, and can run some windows programs...get me two:lol: ;)

[melgross]

Originally posted by aegisdesign
They're silver though. Clashes horribly. :D

Ugh!:lol:

[a_greer]

Originally posted by Mr. H
Why's that then?

Why not give the $599 a Duo and make the current Solo version $499? why not $300, Dell can ship a unit like that with a 17 inch display at that rate!

[JLL]

Originally posted by a_greer
why not $300, Dell can ship a unit like that with a 17 inch display at that rate!

Not in a 'mini' size.

[ecking]

Originally posted by ecs
I don't like what Apple is doing. They release yet another machine with bad graphics before they fixed the hardware problems in MacBooks.

What does one what to with the other? Macbook isn't an imac and the same people don't work on both.

Steve Jobs: Who are you what do you do here? What are you doing?

Employee: I'm a desktop computer hardware designer I'm designing an educational imac like I was hired to do.

Steve Jobs: What? Fuck that, get your ass over to the macbooks and fix their problems.

Employee: Sir, that's not really my...

Steve Jobs: I remember telling not asking.

[ecking]

Originally posted by ulyssespdx
Downgrading an existing machine and calling it "Educational" so it can be sold for ~$300 cheaper is silly.

Apple wanted to capture the school purchasing cycle, but didn't have a new, separate design to offer.

Analyze it more than that and you're wasting your time. boooring.

Hey, why don't you go look at the old emac. And then go look at the old imac. Oh hell I'll do if for you:

http://www.apple-history.com/images/models/imac.gif

http://www.apple-history.com/images/models/emac.jpg

Shit your right apple DID have a nice, new separate design to offer last time, and this time are just lazy bastards. Assholes with their boring product releases.