Hussein Executed

[Bergermeister]

http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/12/29/hussein/index.html


It is now fact, so a new thread to deal with the fall-out.

Bush got what he wanted, but what does his death really mean for the world?

[BR]

I will never cheer another man's death.

[AsLan^]

It is interesting though, when was the last time a head of state was executed?

Is this just business as usual in the world?

[Mac on a Mac]

I have no sympathy for him, but this will accomplish nothing. I'm waiting for Bush to start flapping his gums about this great step in the building of the new Iraqi democracy.

[jimmac]

I think the real questions here are :

What has this got to do with us?

For what possible reason should we feel positive in any way about this? Yes he was a mass murderer and probably derserved death. However how many are there in the world just like him? How did we pick this particular one? Stick a pin in a map?

Why is this much like a bad stunt double on a TV program? I mean he really doesn't look anything like the guy we would want to see in this role and find justice.

And by the way where is Osama Bin Laden anyway?

[segovius]

I have no sympathy for him, but this will accomplish nothing. I'm waiting for Bush to start flapping his gums about this great step in the building of the new Iraqi democracy.

Bush is inextricably linked to Hussein - it is something in the nature of a fixation.

In psychological terms, now that Saddam has gone then a large part of Bush's raison d'etre will also vanish.

I do not expect any gum-flapping - quite the contrary. It is very possible - likely even - that Bush will now start to implode psychologically as he struggles to equilibrate the vacuum that Saddam's absence will leave after being so obsessed and fixated on him for so long.

The warning flags to look for will be tell-tale signs of imbalance.....nervous tics or twitches possibly co-joined with wild rants and erratic behaviour.

There is a very real and grave danger that he may even return to the bottle or, worse - if immediate treatment is not forthcoming and he remains in denial as to the root causes of his inner torment - he may in an extreme case seek solace in proscribed narcotics or pharmaceuticals.

The only hope I can see for Mr Bush's condition is to quickly elevate another 'substitute' to Saddam's now vacant throne and to invest him with all the relevant 'evil' qualities in an attempt to restore some sort of balance.

At first glance it seems that Ahmedinejad is the most suitable candidate for this role - certainly the majority of sheep have been pre-softened and the few that haven't yet will find the transition to the new bogeyman quite painless and requiring a minimum of their limited thinking capacity but this could raise problems in the long run.

For a start it will not be so easy to conduct 'under the table alliances' with the Iranian President nor sell him any WMD for use against his own people. In fact, Ahmadinejad seems very loathe to kill his own people for the west like Saddam did.

This is not a problem as such as lies can easily be manufactured and the sheep will uncritically accept them anyway - indeed it is even fashionable for them to create their own these days but the major psychological barrier here would be that Mr Bush's subconscious mind would be aware that the psychological balance of the id is based on a precarious and spurious falsity and should a conflict arise between the superego and his public persona then - shudder - it is even possible we could see the President run amok in the corridors of power in a Strangelovian ongoing episode of psychotic trauma played out on the world stage.

Let's all pray to whatever Gods protect us that medical science can intervene before this all too likely scenario become a horrendous reality.

[Flounder]

Off the top of my head, the last well known one that I recall was the dude from Romania. I'm sure there have been others since then though.

[Mac on a Mac]

The warning flags to look for will be tell-tale signs of imbalance.....nervous tics or twitches possibly co-joined with wild rants and erratic behaviour.


He's been showing those sign for years.

[trailmaster308]

They should have put it on PPV and sold some ad space to the beer companies.

"taste great, less filling"

At least then we could have gotten some money to pay for this damn war.

[jamac]

He really got the easy way out.

[AsLan^]

Off the top of my head, the last well known one that I recall was the dude from Romania. I'm sure there have been others since then though.

I actually looked it up and it was Mohammad Najibullah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Najibullah) the former president of Afghanistan. He was lynched by the Taliban in 1996.

[segovius]

Whatever spin you buy into to however you fell about whatever one thing is for sure: he went to his death like a man.

I tip my hat to that. It commands respect to stand on a gallows and go to your death standing tall.

Who here will be able to say that when the time comes? Most of us will perish like a dog or senile and processed in some hospital bed drugged to oblivion and weeping like a scared baby.....

[@_@ Artman]

"When you kill a king, you don't stab him in the dark. You kill him where the entire court can watch him die."

- Amsterdam Vallon

[Northgate]

When I saw the photos of Hussein's photos, my first thought was "are those the same hooded guys from the Berg beheading video?"

But my real thought was, "Wow. Too bad that wasn't BinLaden instead of Hussein."

[SDW2001]

Seg:

At first glance it seems that Ahmedinejad is the most suitable candidate for this role - certainly the majority of sheep have been pre-softened and the few that haven't yet will find the transition to the new bogeyman quite painless and requiring a minimum of their limited thinking capacity but this could raise problems in the long run.


Here we go. Apologist Alert.

[sunilraman]

When I saw the photos of Hussein's photos, my first thought was "are those the same hooded guys from the Berg beheading video?"
But my real thought was, "Wow. Too bad that wasn't BinLaden instead of Hussein."

Actually, if that was BinLaden, that would be not so good, what with making a martyr -- you know, man becomes myth becomes legend, etc... Like a certain someone two millennia ago (terrible comparison, I know).

[sunilraman]

When I saw the photos of Hussein's photos, my first thought was "are those the same hooded guys from the Berg beheading video?"...

How does one get a job being "hooded guy for Saddam execution"? Is it like, "We are looking for suitably qualified individuals for hanging a war criminal. Affinity for black hoods, ski masks, and other facial coverings of dark colour is a plus. Please apply by calling this number. If chosen, we will secretly enter your home and whisk you away to assist in the execution as privacy and security is of utmost importance.." :err: :lol: :(

[sunilraman]

...what does his death really mean for the world?

What's up with "death" as a verdict for a war criminal? Either it's lifetime of jail or being killed for every war crime death they were responsible for... too bad you can't kill a man more than once... :rolleyes:

Hanging? What is this, the 16th Century? Eye for an eye? The gallows looked decidedly primitive in the videos. Why not lethal injection at least? I hear it's more humane (though some reports do suggest otherwise).

And aren't these war criminals supposed to go to the Hague or something?

[sunilraman]

Whatever spin you buy into to however you fell about whatever one thing is for sure: he went to his death like a man... I tip my hat to that. It commands respect to stand on a gallows and go to your death standing tall......

Huh. Yeah. He was kinda like, OK, what, I stand here now? OK, whatever the fuck ever... Hood, nah, screw that. When the main executioner was talking to him he was strangely calm, kinda like, Okay, so the trapdoors open, I die? Yeah, okay, I get that, yeah... Is that the body bag where you'll put me once it's done? Now how long will this take? I've usually get my goons to do mass killings and stuff, and we use guns in assasinations, if I remember... Not sure how this hanging thing works... Unbearable pain for several minutes while I suffocate to death you say? Uh huh... :err:

[MarcUK]

Actually, if that was BinLaden, that would be not so good, what with making a martyr -- you know, man becomes myth becomes legend, etc... Like a certain someone two millennia ago (terrible comparison, I know).

well you must be crazy, insane infact, because I was thinking the same thing myself, and we all know my insanity.

All it would take is if Saddams sunni stronghold managed to covertly attain power, im sure a couple of Saddams soundbites would make great religious doctrine, and you could begin to formulate a mythology about how a great leader was killed by the forces of Satan and rose again to save the world.

[MarcUK]

There's video footage of his execution if anyone's interested.

Try Break.com.

well that didn't take long, i wasn't expecting this to surface for about a week.

[Hassan i Sabbah]

I've seen the footage now. It's the first time I've seen one of these snuff things, and it's a pretty amazing piece of film, actually. You don't see the moment he falls through the trap, thankfully, just the aftermath.

Is it just me (and I really hate to say it, because he was a narcissistic scumbag, etc., whom any right thinking human people despised) or does Saddam die with... dignity? Like... 'a man'?

[MarcUK]

really depends on wether he he could be considered a man to start with.

A coward would know how men should act, and perhaps the last act of cowardice was to give the impression of being a human in his last stand.?

[mydo]

... if I remember... Not sure how this hanging thing works... Unbearable pain for several minutes while I suffocate to death you say? Uh huh... [/I] :err:

If done right it's supposed to snap the neck and death is as instant as it can be in that situation.

[sunilraman]

well you must be crazy, insane infact, because I was thinking the same thing myself, and we all know my insanity.

All it would take is if Saddams sunni stronghold managed to covertly attain power, im sure a couple of Saddams soundbites would make great religious doctrine, and you could begin to formulate a mythology about how a great leader was killed by the forces of Satan and rose again to save the world.

Hey, I call it like I see it. Thanks for being insane with me... :err: :smokey: ... Yeah the missing piece is if he is seen walking around and talking to some people for a few days before then disappearing completely. Since it is the 3rd millennium, a bit of blurry mp4 mobile phone footage of him walking around would suffice.

The thing is, Sunni Islam is 90% of Muslims around the world. When I was growing up in Malaysia, we never even heard of Sunni vs. Shia... Malaysia is pretty much Sunni Muslim [Malay Ethnicity] (80-90% of population, rest are minority Chinese, Indians, Eurasians, European, Hindu, Buddhism ("pure" and confucianist/taoist/etc.), Protestant, Catholic)

Shia is only 10% of Muslims and apparently highly limited to majorities in Iran, Iraq, Yemen, all other Muslim countries are very predominantly Sunni.

From this website:
http://www.religionfacts.com/islam/comparison_charts/islamic_sects.htm
http://www.religionfacts.com/islam/places/by_country.htm

It seems kinda bizarre that Saddam was so obsessed with fighting off the Shia and killing Kurds and what not when most of the other Muslim countries in the Middle East around him are Sunni. But, a madman dictator, well, that's what you get.

Maybe the US needs to pour another 100,000 troops into Iraq and divide up the country by religious sect/ subsects. It "worked" (???!) for India and Pakistan -- The British before they pulled out divided up things so that Indian-predominantly-Hindu would be in India, and the Indian-predominantly-Muslim would be Pakistan. :???: :???: :???: WTF. I be confused. Too early and too intense to start the New Year with.

[FormerLurker]

How does one get a job being "hooded guy for Saddam execution"? http://www.spiegel.de/international/0,1518,456652,00.html

[MarcUK]

Hey, I call it like I see it. Thanks for being insane with me... :err: :smokey: ...

no probs! Be careful of people who are claiming to be sane...that where the real madness lies.

[SpcMs]

Any comments on the fact that Saddam's executors where scanting the name of Muqtada al Sadr?

http://www.indymedia.ie/attachments/aug2006/122484466.jpg

[MarcUK]

well it would seem that this has all been staged managed to keep iraq in a state of near civil war. Divide and conqueor.

I expect, that person was paid by some US flunkey to make Moggie the prime target for revenge attacks by Saddams followers.

[SpamSandwich]

I will never cheer another man's death.

Heh, heh...

"YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO LIFE (AND TO END IT WHEN YOU PLEASE)!
JOIN THE PRO-DEATH MOVEMENT!"

Oh, the sweet irony. :lol:

(Just as an aside, I'm not trying to pick a fight)

[addabox]

Dumbfounding.

A grotesquely mishandled execution that actually managed to move Saddam towards martyr status. Wouldn't have thought it possible.

So that's what it all came down to? A man rushed to the gallows via extra-legal contortions and hung by thugs indistinguishable from the death squads that are killing American troops? While the name of arguably the biggest "terrorist" in Iraq is chanted?

The insanity of the Bush invasion is laid bare for all to see: America makes common cause with with the America hating, Iran loving, radical, tiny minority in the Muslim world Shia to whack their enemy in precisely the debased, lawless manner of the "terrorists" we claim to be fighting.

And the rest of the Muslim world takes note. America and the Shia, working for a better Iraq.

[BR]

Heh, heh...

"YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO LIFE (AND TO END IT WHEN YOU PLEASE)!
JOIN THE PRO-DEATH MOVEMENT!"

Oh, the sweet irony. :lol:

(Just as an aside, I'm not trying to pick a fight)

You have a right to end it yourself. It is yours and yours alone. No irony whatsoever.

[sunilraman]

....The insanity of the Bush invasion is laid bare for all to see: America makes common cause with with the America hating, Iran loving, radical, tiny minority in the Muslim world Shia to whack their enemy in precisely the debased, lawless manner of the "terrorists" we claim to be fighting.

And the rest of the Muslim world takes note. America and the Shia, working for a better Iraq.

Bingo. I knew something was "wrong" with the Iraq war (and marched in the big Peace Protest in Sydney in March or April 2006).

Now that I know 90% and almost ALL muslim countries are Sunni, bloody hell. What a frack up on the part of the US. If they wanted WMD or scapegoats or retribution or oil or whatever maybe they should have invaded Shia Iran :rolleyes:

[talksense101]

Not everything is as it seems. They had their fun making mockery of the man before hanging him.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6221751.stm

[mydo]

Honestly what to people expect? Saddam was a brutal butcher and torturer of people. When given the chance to execute this man who wouldn't tell him to go to hell and calibrate?

[Northgate]

I mean. I would've thought it would be handled like a state affair. Above board. A press tour of the execution chamber. CNN, FOX, MSNBC camped out in front of chain link fence with a nondescript military compound in the background while journos yammer on and on about Saddam's last meal etc.

But what we got was a weird, contorted, underground video of a man haphazardly being hung in some dark basement.

I mean there were people with black masks on hollaring Al Sadr's name.

[100mph]

We made the guy, then we removed him ... just like many others.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article16014.htm

[Mac on a Mac]

We helped him. We didn't make him.

[MarcUK]

a 'hutton' inquiry into the leaker of the video

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6229097.stm

[rageous]

Whatever spin you buy into to however you fell about whatever one thing is for sure: he went to his death like a man.

I tip my hat to that. It commands respect to stand on a gallows and go to your death standing tall.

Who here will be able to say that when the time comes? Most of us will perish like a dog or senile and processed in some hospital bed drugged to oblivion and weeping like a scared baby.....
He gets no respect from me. Accepting your death and facing it isn't a sign of nobility. Standing in the face of death for a noble reason is a sign of nobility.

I'm not all gung-ho about his having been hung, but not trying to avoid an inevitable execution in no way shows any redeeming quality in a man who was as terrible as him. Should we give mad props to wife beaters who don't resist the cops when they come to arrest them after a marathon session of beatdowns on the Mrs.? Drug abusers who stand tall as the state removes their neglected children from their home? Jeffrey Dahmer remained stoic when his verdict was read, but who gives a shit?

[mydo]

He gets no respect from me either. This is a man that to the end of his day held his head high. What was he so proud of? Had he no shame for the killing torture and rape of thousands?

Is that what you respect Segovius? An unrepentant torture, murderer, rapist taking like a man at the end? You're sick.

I would have had respect for him had he admitted the horrible acts he had committed and in the end urged Iraqis to put it all aside and act in the best interest of peace and democracy. That's what I would respect. If I could even muster some for him.