Some things the iPhone NEEDS, imo

[Padilla79]

I'm in love with this thing, but I'm forcing myself NOT to buy it until a 2G iPhone is released. Here's a few things I'm looking for:

1. More storage -- I'd like to see more storage, along the lines of 16-32GB, or even that wonderful 60GB mini-HDD that Samsung is releasing
2. Utilization of WiFi -- Why not beat Zune at it's own game? Sync wirelessly with WiFi and/or Bluetooth with other phones and computers. Download something from the iTunes Store onto the iPhone and then sync it with the PC, and vice versa. Or how about iPhone-to-iPhone communication, much like what the Nintendo DS does.
3. 3G Network -- EDGE sucks. I use it on my Razr and it's HORRIBLE. 3G is the way to go, and I'm waiting for it.
4. More software -- I'd like to see AIM on my iPhone, even though I can just route my IMs to my phone and talk via SMS. Having an iPhone-tailored AIM would be perfect, I think.
5. Video camera -- I'm not sure if it has it or not, but I think the iPhone only has a 2mp camera. I'd like to see video functionality so that that wonderfully amazing widescreen could be put to even better use.

Don't get me wrong, like I said before, I'm in love with this thing, but I'd like to see a few of those aforesaid 5 things before I spend $600.

[dacloo]

the iPhone doesn't have a photocamera at all, or???

I'd rather buy a very cheap photocamera which performs 10 times better than the latest photo-phone.

[Hiro]

the iPhone doesn't have a photocamera at all, or???

I'd rather buy a very cheap photocamera which performs 10 times better than the latest photo-phone.

Yes, it does. A 2Mpix, lens is on the back. That probably outperforms your cheapo camera right there.

[Thelonius]

1. Absolutely, yes, I can't agree more. I still can't help but thinking that 4 or 8gb is some cruel practical joke Steve Jobs played on me.

2. Well I will give you the downloading wirelessly from stores and the like, and device to device communication. I somehow think the phone to phone communication is something they wanted but when proposed the heads of several people at the record labels heads exploded. See what MS went through with the Zune for an example. Syncing wirelessly seems completely pointless however. Why wouldn't I want to dock it while I sync and get a bit of a battery recharge. Given the projected battery life of this device I will have to charge it 3 times a day anyhow.

3. I believe Jobs has already stated this was coming. I heard that yesterday stated on CNBC (not directly from Jobs mouth however). The justification I have heard (not from CNBC) was edge is more widespread than 3g, so while 3g is clearly better, it won't help out some guy in Idaho buying an iPhone who doesn't have access to a 3g network. And gen 1 is all about trying to give something to everyone.

4. Yes I see what you mean, and I think widgets are the means to accomplish this.

5. meh. I understand the desire here, but on the other hand i think cameras on phones are a scurge invented by evil french Canadians to waste valuable space that could have been used to put in a better antena to improve cell phone reception. The last thing I want is more space taken up for a video camera I also won't use as it absolutely stinks vs the performance and features of my camcorder.

[Padilla79]

Well, see, I like having a video camera on my phone for whenever I feel like taking a quick video. I'm not asking for some amazing HD recorder or anything, just a video camera which would take advantage of the widescreen and stuff like that.

And about the Widgets. See, I'm a PC user, and I'm completely unfamiliar with Mac software, so I didn't know you could make an AIM widget or whatever. That's pretty awesome. Oh, and btw, when I get this phone, I'll probably be switching to Mac w/ Boot Camp for my Windows apps.

[Chucker]

I'm in love with this thing, but I'm forcing myself NOT to buy it until a 2G iPhone is released. Here's a few things I'm looking for:

1. More storage -- I'd like to see more storage, along the lines of 16-32GB, or even that wonderful 60GB mini-HDD that Samsung is releasing

16 GB is doable now. However, the iPhone doesn't have an HDD, so 60 is completely out of question at this point.

2. Utilization of WiFi -- Why not beat Zune at it's own game? Sync wirelessly with WiFi and/or Bluetooth with other phones and computers.

I don't see the point of this as opposed to using Bluetooth for it, which already provides suitable profiles.

Download something from the iTunes Store onto the iPhone and then sync it with the PC, and vice versa. Or how about iPhone-to-iPhone communication, much like what the Nintendo DS does.

iPhone-to-iPhone communication is essentially already there. It switches seamlessly between cellular and WiFi.

3. 3G Network -- EDGE sucks. I use it on my Razr and it's HORRIBLE. 3G is the way to go, and I'm waiting for it.

Steve said 3G is coming somewhere down the road.

4. More software -- I'd like to see AIM on my iPhone, even though I can just route my IMs to my phone and talk via SMS. Having an iPhone-tailored AIM would be perfect, I think.

Agreed, but there is no indication so far regarding third-party apps. Might be possible from day 1.

5. Video camera -- I'm not sure if it has it or not, but I think the iPhone only has a 2mp camera. I'd like to see video functionality so that that wonderfully amazing widescreen could be put to even better use.

Video chat is pointless without 3G, though.

[Thelonius]

I think I may need to take back what I said about widgets. I read comments about it being a closed system. The implication seems to be there are widgets, yes, but it is closed to 3rd party development like the full blown OSX or yahoo widgets have.

[Padilla79]

Video chat is pointless without 3G, though.

Well, I'm not talking about video chat, I'm just talking about recording a movie and storing it, possibly sending it to someone via MMS. Video chat would be friggin awesome, but I doubt we'll see that anytime soon.

[icfireball]

Well, I'm not talking about video chat, I'm just talking about recording a movie and storing it, possibly sending it to someone via MMS. Video chat would be friggin awesome, but I doubt we'll see that anytime soon.

They almost for sure have that.

Hehe... I wonder if the iPhone has photobooth effects?

[addabox]

I don't get the demands for more memory. Compared to what? The iPhone has far more memory than any other smart phone on the market.

HDD is out for the time being for battery life reasons. Everybody's griping about the price, another 8 GB of flash memory isn't really going to help that out, is it? Memory will grow as flash prices come down and Apple can maintain its price point. Unless battery tech gets a lot better, don't look for HDD anytime soon. This isn't an iPod, which only has to do one thing and do it fairly simply.

As has been noted, not allowing wireless downloads is pretty clearly a recording industry thing, on account of there endless stupidity. I'm sure Apple has everything in place, if the record execs ever get their heads out of their asses.

I'm not very experienced with EDGE speeds, but I've read in several places that the real bottle-neck is the Blazer browser that typically is used. The consensus seems to be that while slower, it's not deal breaker slower and the trade-off in ubiquity and battery life makes sense.

The jury is out on how much access to developers and third party apps Apple will allow. Of course at this point they are keeping things in-house, it only makes sense. It seems pretty likely that things will open up as the platform matures.

[TenoBell]

I don't get the demands for more memory. Compared to what? The iPhone has far more memory than any other smart phone on the market.

They are comparing it to the iPod. Even if Steve announced it with 16GB I'm sure people would still complain.

3G Network -- EDGE sucks. I use it on my Razr and it's HORRIBLE. 3G is the way to go, and I'm waiting for it

I'm hearing a lot of negative reviews about EDGE. Hopefully 3G will be available right away.

The jury is out on how much access to developers and third party apps Apple will allow. Of course at this point they are keeping things in-house, it only makes sense. It seems pretty likely that things will open up as the platform matures.

Its difficult to tell with this one. Apple has been known to misdirect information and all out lie to enhance the oohh ahh factor when they officially announce products.

The fact that it uses widgets alone says it should be open to third party apps. It would be pretty frustrating to have favorite widgets or create useful widgets in Leopard but not be able to use them on the iPhone.

What do you do when you receive a word or excel document in your e-mail? They should allow the MacBU to provide word and excel for the iPhone. Closing the iPhone only hurts the platform as a whole.

[Slewis]

They are comparing it to the iPod. Even if Steve announced it with 16GB I'm sure people would still complain.



I'm hearing a lot of negative reviews about EDGE. Hopefully 3G will be available right away.



Its difficult to tell with this one. Apple has been known to misdirect information and all out lie to enhance the oohh ahh factor when they officially announce products.

The fact that it uses widgets alone says it should be open to third party apps. It would be pretty frustrating to have favorite widgets or create useful widgets in Leopard but not be able to use them on the iPhone.

What do you do when you receive a word or excel document in your e-mail? They should allow the MacBU to provide word and excel for the iPhone. Closing the iPhone only hurts the platform as a whole.

Well one of the reasons they chose Mac OS X for the iPhone was Cocoa so I doubt you'll be limited to Widgets.

Sebastian

[addabox]

Whatever form of OS X this is, embedded, slimmed down or radically modified, it seems pretty likely that for Apple it represents a platform. iPhone for now, a family of computing appliances in the future.

Given that, it seems almost impossible that Apple won't allow third party apps and development for the platform, even if the iPhone is somewhat locked down in the near term.

[GregAlexander]

Here's a few things I'm looking for:
1. More storageI think 8GB will do the job (for now), and we'll see more shortly. I am surprised that an 8GB Nano is $50 more than a 4GB Nano - but an 8GB iPhone is $100 more than a 4GB. What's up?

2. Utilization of WiFi - Sync wirelessly with WiFi and/or Bluetooth with other phones and computers. Download something from the iTunes Store onto the iPhone and then sync it with the PC, and vice versa. Or how about iPhone-to-iPhone communication.Interesting. phone-phone communication could allow network games. Being free communication though, we might use it too much and wipe out the battery.

I like the idea of downloading something from iTS onto the phone - then "sync purchases" back to iTunes. Could it equalise the information divide (so to speak) for people who can't get ADSL or cable? Imagine purchasing a season of a favourite show at home (on ISDN or dialup), having the iPhone be "on the lookout", and when you go near an Apple store or Cingular store, it connects via Wifi and downloads as much as it can.

Wifi voip calls would be good. Why fill the GSM network when you can use wifi?

3. 3G Network.Agreed. 3G is a requirement. It's being so heavily pushed here in Australia.

4. More software -- I'd like to see AIM on my iPhoneI hope they'll allow 3rd party software. Integrating SMS-chat with iChat would be good. I can see some problems with letting anyone write anything - the ease of use might suffer!

5. Video camera -- I'm not sure if it has it or not, but I think the iPhone only has a 2mp camera. I'd like to see video functionality so that that wonderfully amazing widescreen could be put to even better use.2mp cameras in phones are typically crap. The lense is simply not good enough.

[Aries 1B]

I'd rather write with a stylus than tap on a keyboard (even a virtual, beyond the state of the art keyboard).

Moreover, I'd really want to be able to sketch on it (directions, ideas, etc.) and then email the sketches. Furthermore, I'd rather be able to quickly write down new information in the same way that I would with a small pad of paper. To me, THAT'S intuitive.

So close, and yet so far...

Damn!:mad:
Damn!:mad:
Damn!:mad:

The Treos have styli and that's one of the best things about them.

V/R,
Aries 1B

[Padilla79]

Well, about the memory. I know that a HDD is out of the question, I just think that a 60GB miniHDD is amazing. But, hey, Sandisk just announced a 32GB SSD (solid state disk...flash memory) for $600, heh.

But seriously, I think more memory is required. My music collection does not touch most other people's (I have about 1500 songs), but it takes up far more than 4GB of memory, around 6, I think. Then that leaves me room for pictures I'd be taking with the phone and such. If they're touting the ability to play movies so much, why not make it so that one could take a sizable amount of movies with them?

I don't know, I think the iPhone is cool, but I'm gonna wait before I spend $600. Apple is notorious for releasing pretty good upgrades down the line, so I'll be waiting happily. That, and switching to a Mac laptop (whatever they're called) when I go to college this fall.

[Thelonius]

I am one of those pleading for more memory. The reason why is simple, I am looking at the device as a media player first with phone functionality thrown in. While some will look at that view in horror, it is a valid position. Sure as a smart phone it has terrific memory and the price is right in there with new smart phones hitting the market, it's terrific. But before I am sold on it as my next phone I need some more details that will surely come out in the next several months about it's corporate email abilities.

[TenoBell]

I'd rather write with a stylus than tap on a keyboard (even a virtual, beyond the state of the art keyboard).

That's certainly a personal choice. Look at the market. No one else out side of Palm is adopting the stylus, QWERTY keyboards are far more popular.

2mp cameras in phones are typically crap. The lense is simply not good enough.

The lens quality is not determined by the megapixels.
Megapixels in some ways mean nothing. The quality of the sensor is more important.

A 2MP sensor with higher quantization and better color sampling can easily beat a crappy 5MP sensor

[addabox]

I am one of those pleading for more memory. The reason why is simple, I am looking at the device as a media player first with phone functionality thrown in. While some will look at that view in horror, it is a valid position. Sure as a smart phone it has terrific memory and the price is right in there with new smart phones hitting the market, it's terrific. But before I am sold on it as my next phone I need some more details that will surely come out in the next several months about it's corporate email abilities.

Clearly the iPhone is not for you. It's a mobile communicator/web appliance with a Nano expressed in software.

I think we all agree the touch screen interface will migrate to the iPod line, from the top down. Might see the "true video" 60/80GB model sooner than later. As far as a mainly iPod model with phone ability "thrown in", I dunno. The phone/conectivity stuff is too elaborately worked out for Apple to settle for "iPod that can make a call", it looks like to me.

Like I say, it looks to be a platform, and just as Apple wouldn't be likely to sell laptops that dropped a bunch of functionality to keep the price and size down, I don't think they're keen to start chopping this thing up. The iPod is a special case because of its importance the overall Apple ecosystem.

[GregAlexander]

I'd rather write with a stylus than tap on a keyboard (even a virtual, beyond the state of the art keyboard).Yeah that is surprising. Maybe it's too slow, or something?

I wouldn't mind making voice recordings. Click on a date in my calendar, talk into the phone, and fix it up manually when I get home. Same for replying to emails... how about record a voice-reply and email that?

[ebaydan777]

1. Absolutely, yes, I can't agree more. I still can't help but thinking that 4 or 8gb is some cruel practical joke Steve Jobs played on me.

2. Well I will give you the downloading wirelessly from stores and the like, and device to device communication. I somehow think the phone to phone communication is something they wanted but when proposed the heads of several people at the record labels heads exploded. See what MS went through with the Zune for an example. Syncing wirelessly seems completely pointless however. Why wouldn't I want to dock it while I sync and get a bit of a battery recharge. Given the projected battery life of this device I will have to charge it 3 times a day anyhow.

3. I believe Jobs has already stated this was coming. I heard that yesterday stated on CNBC (not directly from Jobs mouth however). The justification I have heard (not from CNBC) was edge is more widespread than 3g, so while 3g is clearly better, it won't help out some guy in Idaho buying an iPhone who doesn't have access to a 3g network. And gen 1 is all about trying to give something to everyone.

4. Yes I see what you mean, and I think widgets are the means to accomplish this.

5. meh. I understand the desire here, but on the other hand i think cameras on phones are a scurge invented by evil french Canadians to waste valuable space that could have been used to put in a better antena to improve cell phone reception. The last thing I want is more space taken up for a video camera I also won't use as it absolutely stinks vs the performance and features of my camcorder.

agreed
1. space is ok would be nice it was at least 20gb tho..

2. i think this will actually end up being on the final product before launch date in june

3. ya i beleive you right, 3G is a waiste of time, ive only see it in NYC and NJ etc...its not even in Los Angeles, which is i beleive the 2nd biggest city of cell phone users, EDGE is widespread and more useful...

4. ya i dont care about the camera..i have a canon rebel for that...cameras on phones are good for quick shots to send to friends easily to show them something funny or familiar..like an inside joke, not to use for your science project or art show..

[GregAlexander]

I am one of those pleading for more memory. The reason why is simple, I am looking at the device as a media player first with phone functionality thrown in.Remember how small the first iPods HDD was, and where it's gone.

Are you saying you want everything an iPhone has, plus an internal HDD?

I think we all agree the touch screen interface will migrate to the iPod line, from the top down. Might see the "true video" 60/80GB model sooner than later.

I wonder how you'd make a "true video" 80GB model. The iPhone looks thicker than an iPod already. Do we want an iPod without phone/wifi/bluetooth? (thus also no internal speaker, microphone, or antennas) to which we add a hard disk and cache (for battery life). I assume it'd still be pretty expensive! (no phone contract to drop $500 from the cost). Do we still want OSX on the device for iTunes, calendar etc? Applets wouldn't work, nor web, email etc... but I guess if we want the rest we need the same chip set.

I don't think we'll see a "true video" model anymore. A longshot might be an iPhone with everything except the phone. It could use bluetooth to get net access via your existing phone or computer (or wifi otherwise?). You could even make calls via bluetooth (can bluetooth headsets make their phone dial a certain number?) Without an internal phone/antenna, there might be room for a HDD. I have my doubts though.

--- stop the press :)
I'm wrong. maybe.

Apple got patents for having a touch pad around the sides of a screen right? Is it possible they could have a full screen ipod that uses those touch pads? Most of steve's finger gestures would have worked if done on the edge of the screen too - eg scrolling down songs would use the touchpad down the right hand side (just slide on the touchpad). Play, stop, forward, back could be at the bottom of the screen...

I need to watch the demo again, could every finger movement (for the iPod functions) could be replicated with a touch pad on the outside. If so a cheaper/simpler device might be quite possible.

[Kendoka]

Request:
Make the QUERTY-keyboard scale (grow) when the iPhone is flipped into landscape.
It would definitely make it easier to type text...

[Padilla79]

I think we all have to keep in mind that the iPhone is nonetheless amazing. Look at where we are with the iPod. Back when it first came out, it was 5GB with a black and white screen. Now it's 80GB with a color screen that plays full movies. The iPhone is a fantastic first entry into the field, and it will only get better. However, I'm going to wait a little bit so technologies catch up so that I can justify myself spending $600 on a phone/mobile computer/smartphone/God's gift. Plus, I don't feel like starting a new contract with Cingular just yet, I need to be able to fund myself and see what kind of plans they'll be offering.

It's only a matter of time, so it's not like I'll be waiting forever. Apple's going to keep this thing rolling along.

[Denton]

... evil french Canadians ...

wtf? I think there is enough enmity between Quebec and the rest of Canada without idiots like you peddling more hate. Why don't you go live in Montreal and spend some time getting to know some "evil French-Canadians." Perhaps you'll even come to appreciate their perspective on separation.

[Denton]

I think 8GB will do the job (for now), and we'll see more shortly. I am surprised that an 8GB Nano is $50 more than a 4GB Nano - but an 8GB iPhone is $100 more than a 4GB. What's up?

This is just the way mark-up works. Apple's mark-up is a certain percentage of the cost of the device. Suppose that the mark-up is 25%. The Apple would sell a $160 device for $200, and a $320 device for $400; thus if you add a $40 component to each of these devices, the selling prices will be $250 and $500, respectively. This is how the price of the iPhone goes from $500 to $600 with the addition of the 4GB, when the price of the Nano only goes from $200 to $250 for the same increase in memory.

[Woody56292]

yeah out here in the southeast, 3g isn't very prevalent. Go to a cingular store and look at their 3g chart. I did when looking at getting a helio, but couldn't because I didn't have 3g in my area. ( south carolina )
3g would be nice, but they can't physically get enough towers up in time for launch of the iphone. although I am sure the iphone will spure cingular/at&t to adapt 3g much faster.

[ebaydan777]

agreed, 3G is not even in los angeles where i live, thats rediculous, i think maybe version 2 of iphone, for now i think EDGE is a better idea so people dont get pist when they figure out they dont have 3G in their area and possibly waisted their money

[sc_markt]

Request:
Make the QUERTY-keyboard scale (grow) when the iPhone is flipped into landscape.
It would definitely make it easier to type text...

I thought about this too. Its a good idea.
How about a USB port so you could connect a keyboard and mouse to it??

I wonder if it would be sensible to add in handwriting recognition software so you could use a stylus pen to write stuff into documents or whatever???

I'm also wondering if this thing will come with a pda type app?


- Mark

[arindlaub]

iChat mobile not present? WTF, even the most basic phones do im now

windows mobile has office, iwork mobile necessary.

3G also needed, video chat would be awesome

Also, no mention of iPod game's compatibility. Imagine 3rd party modern games. playing GTA on your iphone! PSP watch out!

They should go with the Zune on the streaming

Bluetooth data transfer, at least contacts and cal, videos and music hopefully

Also, they need to figure out how to do a Wireless itunes store, even 2G phones allow some kind of music or video downloading

Love the iPhone, but the info wasn't detail enough to answer some questions.

[sc_markt]

3G also needed, video chat would be awesome



Somebody said on Macdailynews that appleinsiders told him that 3G can be done via software. If true, great.

I like your idea on video chat. For the life of me, I don't understand why cell phones don't have this feature...

[ebaydan777]

iChat mobile not present? WTF, even the most basic phones do im now

windows mobile has office, iwork mobile necessary.

3G also needed, video chat would be awesome

Also, no mention of iPod game's compatibility. Imagine 3rd party modern games. playing GTA on your iphone! PSP watch out!

They should go with the Zune on the streaming

Bluetooth data transfer, at least contacts and cal, videos and music hopefully

Also, they need to figure out how to do a Wireless itunes store, even 2G phones allow some kind of music or video downloading

Love the iPhone, but the info wasn't detail enough to answer some questions.


iChat is on the phone no worries

and i agree i think he didnt mention more into detail about all this stuff because theres still a lot of time and work to do before release date..i think hes taking everyones feed back in and putting his people to place all this on the phone..who knows maybe 3G will be on the final release and it wil be open app..

[TenoBell]

iChat mobile not present? WTF, even the most basic phones do im now.

iChat is being updated in Leopard. Its likely they are not ready to show it yet.

[ebaydan777]

Somebody said on Macdailynews that appleinsiders told him that 3G can be done via software. If true, great.

I like your idea on video chat. For the life of me, I don't understand why cell phones don't have this feature...

wow if it is done on software..which it probably will be because everything is pretty much software based on the cell network, then WOOHOO haha, but we still wont have the camera on the front of the phone for video conference, but then again who knows it may have it on the final release if people bug Jobs enough about 3G, if he realizes he is losing money because without 3G his 1% mark wont happen, he may very well implement it..

[TenoBell]

I like your idea on video chat. For the life of me, I don't understand why cell phones don't have this feature...

Because its likely a battery killer. What would be the point of video communication if you can only talk for a few minutes.

[addabox]

iChat mobile not present? WTF, even the most basic phones do im now

windows mobile has office, iwork mobile necessary.

3G also needed, video chat would be awesome

Also, no mention of iPod game's compatibility. Imagine 3rd party modern games. playing GTA on your iphone! PSP watch out!

They should go with the Zune on the streaming

Bluetooth data transfer, at least contacts and cal, videos and music hopefully

Also, they need to figure out how to do a Wireless itunes store, even 2G phones allow some kind of music or video downloading

Love the iPhone, but the info wasn't detail enough to answer some questions.

Of course it does IM. Nobody has called it "iChat Mobile" yet, but iChat bubble style IM was demoed.

The ability to open Office docs or a mobile iWork is a given, if not right off the bat.

See the remarks about 3G deployment in the posts above. Having the latest and greatest just to have it when most people in the US can't take advantage of it and it significantly impacts battery life is not smart, it's just spec whorage.

Games, also , just a matter of time.

A wireless iTunes store is almost certainly blocked by the record companies. The cell carriers can sell music from their stores because of truly draconian DRM. Wireless iTunes means syncing with your computer, moving things around, etc. Ditto wireless phone to phone transfer, which is why MS's implementation is so limited.

Bluetooth transfer of contacts is a must, however.

[Slewis]

1.iChat mobile not present? WTF, even the most basic phones do im now

2.windows mobile has office, iwork mobile necessary.

3.3G also needed, video chat would be awesome

4.Also, no mention of iPod game's compatibility. Imagine 3rd party modern games. playing GTA on your iphone! PSP watch out!

5.They should go with the Zune on the streaming

6.Bluetooth data transfer, at least contacts and cal, videos and music hopefully

7.Also, they need to figure out how to do a Wireless itunes store, even 2G phones allow some kind of music or video downloading

Love the iPhone, but the info wasn't detail enough to answer some questions.
I numbered your points to make them easier to respond to

1. While it obviously didn't show up in our faces, I think SMS Chat was iChat. Obviously not iChat in the context of Audio/Video/Text through your AIM account, but more like iChat may see SMS features in Leopard, and SMS will act as a Text Chat.

2. Who actually uses Mobile versions of Word, Excel, and Powerpoint? May I ask why? I just can't see any use for them, and even then, the iPhone isn't exactly suited to any of these. Neither is any other phone out there. Oh, and iWork doesn't compete with Office, well Keynote could compete with Powerpoint, but my point is they don't compete, Apple isn't very competitive in Business world.

3. When 3G is actually more widespread, Steve will add 3G. So far it's Reach is not very far in the US, which is where it is launching first, and where Apple is located.

4. Hmm, no mention but we could still see them. Don't hold your breath for GTA though, the iPhone doesn't exactly appear to be well suited for any type of gaming beyond simple games in it's current form and design.

5. Nah, it's not needed.

6. Haha, this is probably going to see the light of day. If you have a Bluetooth enabled phone now you can sync it with your Mac in iSync.

7. Not needed.

Sebastian

[Slewis]

wow if it is done on software..which it probably will be because everything is pretty much software based on the cell network, then WOOHOO haha, but we still wont have the camera on the front of the phone for video conference, but then again who knows it may have it on the final release if people bug Jobs enough about 3G, if he realizes he is losing money because without 3G his 1% mark wont happen, he may very well implement it..
The Phone would have to have the Hardware already built into it to handle 3G via a simple Software Update.

His 1% market won't happen if he goes exclusively with 3G.

That is the final model, it was shown early not because it was unfinished, but because it has to be FCC approved.

Sebastian

[ebaydan777]

ya i agree on the the wireless transfer or itunes, it will most likely happen with calender/contacts/etc with bluetooth wireless sync, but the itunes, records companies have got to have stopped this, means you could just walk to anyone with itunes sync it and take music that costs $ for a single user, not 2....this was probably wanted by Jobs and denied by the record companies...but thats kind of good because most wireless things can be hacked i dont want people stealing music off my computer or even my phone which would probably be possible with wireless sync abilities

[ebaydan777]

The Phone would have to have the Hardware already built into it to handle 3G via a simple Software Update.

His 1% market won't happen if he goes exclusively with 3G.

That is the final model, it was shown early not because it was unfinished, but because it has to be FCC approved.

Sebastian

well i think 3G is just a bad idea..but im gonna go 50/50 on him placing hardware on the device for later 3G usages, he did say it was to come, maybe he is already implenting the hardware for it, hopefuly...

and i dont think it is the final device, he still has a while for FCC to approve it i think small things such as apps and gps on google maps as well as other cool feature may be included in the final design, especially the back of the phone, doesnt look finished at all to me

[TenoBell]

Who actually uses Mobile versions of Word, Excel, and Powerpoint? May I ask why?

There does need to be a word and excel reader so you can view the documents, those two formats dominate e-mail. I agree power point is useless.

I think GPS would add expense for a function that is not widely used.

[ebaydan777]

iwork and ilife should include the document readers for sure

i beleive GPS triangulation will be available..which is good enough

[Slewis]

There does need to be a word and excel reader so you can view the documents, those two formats dominate e-mail. I agree power point is useless.

I think GPS would add expense for a function that is not widely used.
So why suggest a version of iWork?
Preview with the ability to view Presentations and other Spreadsheet/Powerpoint/Text formats should work well enough.

Sebastian

[Slewis]

well i think 3G is just a bad idea..but im gonna go 50/50 on him placing hardware on the device for later 3G usages, he did say it was to come, maybe he is already implenting the hardware for it, hopefuly...

and i dont think it is the final device, he still has a while for FCC to approve it i think small things such as apps and gps on google maps as well as other cool feature may be included in the final design, especially the back of the phone, doesnt look finished at all to me
As far as Hardware goes, it's pretty much the Final Design.

I don't think he can rework it while the FCC is certifying it or they'd have to certify it again because technically it would be a different phone.

Sebastian

[arindlaub]

Happy that they have iChat. They really should open up to 3rd parties apps, but Apple could keep a lock on what they allow. Some hacker will crack the restriction most likely anyway.

[arindlaub]

I agree about not needing office or iwork, it's completely pointless, but Windows Mobile switchers might want it, plus that's just my dream on what it'll have in June. Obviously we still don't know much about the phone's specs or capabilities in detail.

[ebaydan777]

ya and i agree with Sebastian, im gonna have to say that maybe 3rd party programs are not such a good idea...dealing with smartphones for a couple years now, and now owning a tmobile Dash, i have lots of apps on here yet they really bug my phone up, i can hardly restart it when i need to it just crashes...i think having developers go through apple first is a good idea, im sure these will become widgets too

[arindlaub]

Apple advertises about how iSync works with so many different phones, I highly doubt that they wouldn't allow Contacts/To Do Lists/Calendar bluetooth syncing.

[Slewis]

ya and i agree with Sebastian, im gonna have to say that maybe 3rd party programs are not such a good idea...dealing with smartphones for a couple years now, and now owning a tmobile Dash, i have lots of apps on here yet they really bug my phone up, i can hardly restart it when i need to it just crashes...i think having developers go through apple first is a good idea, im sure these will become widgets too
First someone disagreed with me by agreeing with me in another thread and now someone is agreeing with me by disagreeing with me :err:

If you mean my FCC comments, Apple may already have plans for Software, it wouldn't exactly change the phone either.

Sebastian

[ebaydan777]

ya thats what i mean, apple will develope their own im sure

[Slewis]

ya thats what i mean, apple will develope their own im sure
Sadly the iPhone development platform won't be a game breaker for me, but I was really looking forward to developing for it. I'm not much of a programmer now but I'm studying Python and Objective-C and the iPhone would tie in so perfectly with my first planned project. :(

Sebastian

[ebaydan777]

maybe u should still work on it and later down the road you could release it and be the new steve jobs....never know lol

[Slewis]

maybe u should still work on it and later down the road you could release it and be the new steve jobs....never know lol
Haha, it would be more like a Tie In Project. But I'm not going to work on something I can't release or even use.

Sebastian

[Padilla79]

One thing that concerns the hell out of me is what Cingular (to be just AT&T by the time iPhone releases) is going to do with minute and data plans for this thing. My dad uses a an HP Pocket PC and his unlimited data plan is something like $20 a month, not including his minute rate. That's simply amazing. If iPhone has anything different, I'm going to flip a lid and let AT&T hear it.

However, on that same note, I think a special data plan should be made to promote all of iPhone's features, particularly the fact that you can surf the Internet on a true browser. Personally, I'd like to see an unlimited data/message plan for a very reasonable price. Minutes, they should stay the same, but I think data/message plan prices should be lowered to promote the many features that are offered.

[ebaydan777]

well, looks like it will be $20, and i think job's said theyre makking a data plan just for the iphone as well..but the phone is considered under the smartphone connect for $20, but im going to the the MEdia Max 3000 for $39.99, mms, 3000 sms and unlimited data

[Padilla79]

My Cingular plan right now uses MEdia Net Basic: 1MB data transfer, 200 SMS (text), and 40 MMS (multimedia) per month. I'd obviously want to up that to unlimited everything, but that'd probably be rather costly. I don't use my MMS a lot, but I would if I got the iPhone (especially if it had video, COUGH). But, see, that's why I'm waiting to see what's up, I think that's best.

[Aquatic]

I don't get it.

This thing SUCKS.

Battery life is shit, and without tactile input, it can't be used in a car or other situations where you want to just hit a key and speed dial without looking. As a phone, it's shit. This is going to TANK unless they fix it FAST.

Sorry...this thing is a piece. Oh yeah, and just Cingular? What a joke.

And the PRICE!? Yeah. Right. Nice. Try. Game. Over. After the fanboise get it, this thing's sales will fall to 0 unless they change it.

I really wanted to like it. I mean, you guys are talking about widgets. It's a PHONE. That's 50% of its function. And as a phone, it sucks.

I bet 2.0 will be good though. I'm banking on it. I hope they will have Verizon. If so, I'll buy it. It just needs to cost half as much, work with all networks, increase the battery several-fold, and have at LEAST a call button that calls the last dialed number (as in, a REAL BUTTON.) AND perhaps another button that is assignable (to say a number, song, function, etc.)

[addabox]

I could be wrong, but I'm guessing that one of the things Apple extracted out of Cingular/ATT for the exclusive deal is some kind of reasonable flat rate for unlimited data, for iPhone customers.

It just strikes my as the kind of thing Apple would do, if they possibly could-- make simplifying the ownership experience part of the iPhone mystique. We all ready know that Cingular agreed to change some of their back-end stuff to make random access vm possible, so who knows what else Steve got out of them?

I mean, if he knows smart phone interfaces are broken, Steve must be aware that the whole cell carrier contract process is broken as well.

It would be ironic if the fruits of the apparent capitulation to evil cell carriers-- 2 year lock in-- were to be the beginning of taking the customer experience out of their hands and putting it with the phone manufacturers, where it properly resides.

Just provide us with ubiquitous, high-speed connectivity, charge a flat rate, then get the hell out of the way and let companies like Apple innovate the hell out the devices that use that connectivity.

The cell carriers vainglorious dreams of being in charge of how and where and what we move around on ubiquitous digital nets must end. Cingular is not a content provider, and I hope that the iPhone deal means they are starting to become willing to accept that, and that other will follow suit.

[icfireball]

I don't get it.

This thing SUCKS.

Battery life is shit, and without tactile input, it can't be used in a car or other situations where you want to just hit a key and speed dial without looking. As a phone, it's shit. This is going to TANK unless they fix it FAST.

Sorry...this thing is a piece. Oh yeah, and just Cingular? What a joke.

And the PRICE!? Yeah. Right. Nice. Try. Game. Over. After the fanboise get it, this thing's sales will fall to 0 unless they change it.

I really wanted to like it. I mean, you guys are talking about widgets. It's a PHONE. That's 50% of its function. And as a phone, it sucks.

I bet 2.0 will be good though. I'm banking on it. I hope they will have Verizon. If so, I'll buy it. It just needs to cost half as much, work with all networks, increase the battery several-fold, and have at LEAST a call button that calls the last dialed number (as in, a REAL BUTTON.) AND perhaps another button that is assignable (to say a number, song, function, etc.)

1) Multi-year contract with Cingular - Don't expect a Verizon version soon. Verizon is no better than Cingular, and no worse as well.
2) Apple will not add buttons.
3) You never mentioned storage - thats my big problem with it.
4) 1.5 is likely to come in October with increased memory and more software.
5) The current video iPod will likely be upgraded to similar Multi-Touch interface or there will be an in betwteen product without the phone.
6) I agree Price is high but it is good to consider that it is a full iPod and a full phone + more.
7) It is a good phone with virtually all function and more from the looks of it. What does your phone do that you would like this to do? If you claim iPhone dosn't do that for sure, you can't say that because software isn't done.
8 ) I don't recommend ANYBODY use ANY cell phone in their car. It's a bad idea and studys have shown that it is much likely to cause more accidents. The touch screen if mounted in the right location seems like it would be EASIER to operate in the car.

[ebaydan777]

I don't get it.

This thing SUCKS.

Battery life is shit, and without tactile input, it can't be used in a car or other situations where you want to just hit a key and speed dial without looking. As a phone, it's shit. This is going to TANK unless they fix it FAST.

Sorry...this thing is a piece. Oh yeah, and just Cingular? What a joke.

And the PRICE!? Yeah. Right. Nice. Try. Game. Over. After the fanboise get it, this thing's sales will fall to 0 unless they change it.

I really wanted to like it. I mean, you guys are talking about widgets. It's a PHONE. That's 50% of its function. And as a phone, it sucks.

I bet 2.0 will be good though. I'm banking on it. I hope they will have Verizon. If so, I'll buy it. It just needs to cost half as much, work with all networks, increase the battery several-fold, and have at LEAST a call button that calls the last dialed number (as in, a REAL BUTTON.) AND perhaps another button that is assignable (to say a number, song, function, etc.)

hmmm...ok well

battery life is actually very good..go do some research first (phonescoop.com) compared to other smartphones

should have speed dial, but most important i think it will be voice recognition,so you dont really have to push anything but ur bluetooth headset...genious

price....well if you remember correctly the RAZR was just another phone, but was also very thin thats all...and that started at about the same price, most smartphones are also tagged between 250-400 depending on options, my tmobile dash was $320 and isnt that great

its not just a phone its 3 things together, internet communicator, phone, and IPOD....it all functions equally alike none is more important than the other to most people buying the iphone, ya sure it has a phone but thats not all its for, widgets(apps) is a huge part of it just like 3rd party apps are huge on smartphones

this phone will never have verizon at launch, maybe in 3 years but then 2.0 will be out and once again be cingular (gsm) exclusive, by then we should expect 3G, actually im going to say that the 1st iphone will have 3G now that Job's has made it official to a software update only

and having a call button erases the whole purpose of the phone, how bout you read a thing or two before you start trashing one of the most revolutionary ideas to the cell phone

and stop trolling your making yourself look like an ass

[Padilla79]

If you don't think the iPhone is revolutionary, you need to rethink your life. Seriously. I'm not being a fanboy (and I'm not, I'm pro-Windows, pro-Microsoft, pro-Gates, yet pro-iPod [and now pro-iPhone]), but the iPhone is just amazing. While $600 is a WHOLE LOTTA money to be paying out for a phone, remember that you're getting a mobile computer and an iPod all-in-one.

I'm just saying, I'm willing to wait a year or so to get a newer version and my own contract (family plans suck, btw). I cant' wait to see what Apple does with this device. There's still room for so much more (software wise), the widgets leave the device open-ended.

And about that, widgets should not be 100% 3rd party. Apple should have to inspect all software and approve it before allowing it (via coding and such) to run on iPhone. Too many 3rd party widgets would ruin the iPhone and exploit it and cause a bunch of problems.

[addabox]

I don't get it.

This thing SUCKS.

Battery life is shit, and without tactile input, it can't be used in a car or other situations where you want to just hit a key and speed dial without looking. As a phone, it's shit. This is going to TANK unless they fix it FAST.

Sorry...this thing is a piece. Oh yeah, and just Cingular? What a joke.

And the PRICE!? Yeah. Right. Nice. Try. Game. Over. After the fanboise get it, this thing's sales will fall to 0 unless they change it.

I really wanted to like it. I mean, you guys are talking about widgets. It's a PHONE. That's 50% of its function. And as a phone, it sucks.

I bet 2.0 will be good though. I'm banking on it. I hope they will have Verizon. If so, I'll buy it. It just needs to cost half as much, work with all networks, increase the battery several-fold, and have at LEAST a call button that calls the last dialed number (as in, a REAL BUTTON.) AND perhaps another button that is assignable (to say a number, song, function, etc.)

I think this post should be mounted in the public square so we can all point and laugh at Aquatic when the iPhone proves to be a pivotal development in the history of the personal technology, which it most certainly is.

[icfireball]

When the RAZR came out, it original was sold at full price, no discounts. Period. End of story. But shortly thereafter the price started to fall... not because Motorola changed it's price but because carriers picked up the tab to reel in customers

I honestly don't think cingular will do this (or to be more precise, I don't think Apple will let them because that will kill Apple's method of distribution), but isn't it possible cingular will take off $100 of the cost after a few months just because that will get them a two year contact where $100 is likely barely two months worth of bills.

At any rate, expect an iPhone 1.5 in October(ish). This iPhone will likely just contain a memory boost and/or price cut (more likely the first), and new software.

[teufel]

Edge is 3 to 4 times faster than GPRS, and gives pretty useable speeds, in real life. Of course, not for downloads, but for web browsing, even on a Macbook, very tolerable.
However, for Europe, there is no way this phone will seel through any serious network (T mobile in Germany, Vodafone in UK or any network in Italy) without 3G.

This may in fact explain the six months gap between market dates in the US and Europe, because i am pretty sure that the European version will also include 3G.

Finally, i would like to point out that, in countries where Wi-Fi is ubiquitous and cheap enough, the 3G issue becomes moot.

Pierre

PS: i want one as soon as it's available in Europe !

[b3ns0n]

However, for Europe, there is no way this phone will sell through any serious network (T mobile in Germany, Vodafone in UK or any network in Italy) without 3G.

This may in fact explain the six months gap between market dates in the US and Europe, because i am pretty sure that the European version will also include 3G.

I agree 100%.

I'm in London and there's no cheap/free municipal wireless here. I think that sort of thing might be more common in the USA. I can get it at my university, but nowhere else. That's why 3G is so important to the European launch, and I'm sure Jobs knows this. I however read quite a discouraging article in the Times the other day about the bid for iPhone in Europe - apparently Telefonica SA are leading the bidding (they own O2 in the UK) - the article pointed out that since the iPhone isn't 3G compatible, the UK network "3" is ruled out, and that they aren't very happy about this. But surely if 3G was coming in time for launch, this wouldn't matter, which makes me doubt whether this is the case. Make what you will of that, anyway.

[NOFEER]

lets talk memory
in order to plan what is a typical itunes video file size, he demoed pirates so how many movies could you keep. i'd like the idea of using this in my car connected to a screen.

if say you could keep 4-6 movies AND a few hundred pictures to show granny and 250+songs like the shuffle.

as far as other apps, i would think to move into enterprise it must be able to at least display word docs, spreadsheets +/- it would be cool to carry your keynote presentation with you....is SJ looking to make enterprise expansion. would a corp hand these out instead of blackberry????

if it had an expansion slot so you could add memory

is 2.5 g software upgradable to 3g??? if it can be used abroad then don't they have more 3g then us and thus 3g now???. i don't understand this gsm thing would it require a new chip???

I DON'T LIKE that the battery isn't consumer changeable, that means if you need a new one (always the case) that you have to send it in and lose your phone for a week or so.....maybe they give out loaner go phones ha ha

edge is dialup, webpages are more rich, flash is needed, and internet access needs the speed

is wifi wimax compatible

and what about using that screen if it has a protective case.....there is no way i am buying this big dollar gizmo without a good case....like my bodyglove, wont that mess up the screen use???

why june???? are they waiting for more 3g?? and how much of each call and data package is apple getting. with this wow phone it would be a snap for mvno, but cingular and all telco don't want the telco monopoly to be eroded by apple. i bet an apple mvno option scared cingular into submission. so does apple get a play from the phone use revenue side??? here was there oportunity to make the dollars

lots of questions

[b3ns0n]

I don't see them providing user-expandable memory, that's not Apple's style at all. It'd be nice if they'd finally concede and make the battery user replaceable, though. If you noticed, they were quite quiet on battery life, not providing a standby figure, for example, Maybe this is something they're still finalising, and hopefully at some stage that Digg guy's dual-battery hypothesis will come true.

[kfdan]

I think a video link via skype or some such communication system is a killer application that would come natural to iPhone. One camera to shoot video (talk face to face perhaps even conference call) and another to shoot stills. The video camera could swivel from front to back! Love that idea and it certainly would further distinguish Apple's iPhone from the rest of the pack!:)

[Padilla79]

kfdan, while it's a good idea, it's not happening anytime soon. Video conferencing is unnecessary at this time, but I still think that the ability to record movies via the camera is.

[octane]

However, for Europe, there is no way this phone will seel through any serious network (T mobile in Germany, Vodafone in UK or any network in Italy) without 3G.

This may in fact explain the six months gap between market dates in the US and Europe, because i am pretty sure that the European version will also include 3G.

Finally, i would like to point out that, in countries where Wi-Fi is ubiquitous and cheap enough, the 3G issue becomes moot.

You hit the nail on the head. I'd bet the price of the phone that the European version will have 3G. The reason the U.S. version won't have 3G, according to a Cingular rep friend of mine (from a couple of months ago), the 3G network is "broken" (his exact words). I didn't have time to dig into it with him but aside from that it doesn't seem like 3G (at least Cingular's) penetration is high enough. WiFi is my friend. 8) :D

[ebaydan777]

ya no 3G at this moment is a good way to go in the U.S. curently. I went to cingular this morning to see what the whole deal was, and they said that its good 3G wasnt involved yet, i told them Job's was considering a simple software update is this possible? he said sure the antennae and radios should be in the phone by shipment then all it is is a small update on the firmware, but dont count on Job's giving 3G for a while at least till 2008 because 3G is truely a "broken" solution currently until they get some more land usage from it

[arindlaub]

Pogue, a reporter for the NY Times, has a list of FAQs about the iPhone. He claims it won't sync with Outlook. Unless they make iCal/Address Book etc. for Windows, how will it sync? He also says no games! Apple shouldn't develop games for the iPod and not use them for the iPhone. He also claims it won't connect to iChat. He also claims no videocamera, but it might by June.

I dunno, I think the iPhone packs in a lot, but for a high end mid 2007 phone, it should have 3G, IM, and a videocam.

[arindlaub]

sorry, forgot link to Pogues, FAQS
[URL="http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/01/11/the-ultimate-iphone-frequently-asked-questions/"]

[ebaydan777]

uhh well i know theyre not sure about the video, but it might include games but they needed to be downloaded from itunes, this is not for sure its speculation from jobs, but iChat is a YES, it will include ichat thats for sure, AIM is a huge part of the phone and AIM being exclusive for ichat is a huge thing, almost every phone has it this wil too, this is also coming from the nytimes John Markoff

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/11/technology/11cnd-apple.html?_r=1&hp&ex=1168578000&en=f1aed4fed98b8686&ei=5094&partner=homepage&oref=slogin

not only that but ichat is featured as a demo on Apple own website....

[ebaydan777]

wow i just read all this and it is a load of crap..a lot of the features he told us about is actually on the phone already...

[octane]

Not to say the actually AIM iChat client won't be on the phone, but isn't a version of it already on the phone in SMS? Maybe they're thinking so many more people use SMS, why not just make that look like iChat? :???:

[ebaydan777]

screw SMS i like to have AIM to see who is available online and speak with them through an instam messenger client, now i am really pist if the phone doesnt have this they just lost my business, and a lot of people who use it to speak with people a majority of the time

[Slewis]

I'll try to answer everyone of them that I can
lets talk memory
in order to plan what is a typical itunes video file size, he demoed pirates so how many movies could you keep. i'd like the idea of using this in my car connected to a screen.

if say you could keep 4-6 movies AND a few hundred pictures to show granny and 250+songs like the shuffle.
I have 3 Movies from iTunes, and now the Keynote is downloading.
Pirates of the Caribbean is 1.64 GB
Pirates of the Caribbean 2 is 1.74 GB
Casanova is 1.26 GB
The Macworld 2007 Keynote is 1.21 GB
That averages out to be about 1.4625 GB per movie, if you factor in that you'll only have around 7 GB to work with on the 8 GB model, you can fit about 4 or 5 Movies on there depending on how large they are. That leaves room for probably a little more then 2 GB of Pictures and Music, unless the system really does eat a full GB.

as far as other apps, i would think to move into enterprise it must be able to at least display word docs, spreadsheets +/- it would be cool to carry your keynote presentation with you....is SJ looking to make enterprise expansion. would a corp hand these out instead of blackberry????

I highly doubt even Apple could pass up the chance for Software expansion, but it's a bit grim at the moment.

if it had an expansion slot so you could add memory
It doesn't have one, the only expansion "slot" is the Dock Connector and the Headphone jack.

is 2.5 g software upgradable to 3g??? if it can be used abroad then don't they have more 3g then us and thus 3g now???. i don't understand this gsm thing would it require a new chip???
I did some light reading (very light reading) on this and 3G requires the Hardware to be in place before you can even think of a Software update. If the iPhone doesn't have the required hardware it won't work with a sotware update.

I DON'T LIKE that the battery isn't consumer changeable, that means if you need a new one (always the case) that you have to send it in and lose your phone for a week or so.....maybe they give out loaner go phones ha ha
Good point, then again maybe they can just open it up and change the Battery right there at the Genius Bar for you.

edge is dialup, webpages are more rich, flash is needed, and internet access needs the speed
EDGE is about 4-5x faster then that, but it's close enough, Flash is needed and I hope it is in Safari

is wifi wimax compatible
No, different standards. WiFi is 802.11 and WiMax is 802.16, but you can stick both in one device, the iPhone won't have WiMax though.

and what about using that screen if it has a protective case.....there is no way i am buying this big dollar gizmo without a good case....like my bodyglove, wont that mess up the screen use???
I highly doubt Apple overlooked this and with 200+ Patents in the iPhone hopefully one of them takes care of this problem

why june???? are they waiting for more 3g?? and how much of each call and data package is apple getting. with this wow phone it would be a snap for mvno, but cingular and all telco don't want the telco monopoly to be eroded by apple. i bet an apple mvno option scared cingular into submission. so does apple get a play from the phone use revenue side??? here was there oportunity to make the dollars
Apple has to wait till June for the FCC to certify the iPhone. They introduced the iPhone so the FCC wouldn't do it for them by releasing a document or something. It wouldn't be a snap to do MVNO, it would be very costly, and Apple chose Cingular because they had a great experience working together on the ROKR, which they chose then because they are the Nation's largest Wireless provider.

lots of questions
Lots of Answers

Sebastian

[Aquatic]

Yeah does this thing have AIM? I mean if not..that's a fucking joke. SMS? LOL. Yeah. Right.

Does it even have Vibrate????

Piece of crap.

As per GPS, it's simpe. It should be a more expensive option. It would be killer.

But the most important thing about the iPhone, is, well, the PHONE. Which currently...sucks.

[octane]

Yeah does this thing have AIM? I mean if not..that's a fucking joke. SMS? LOL. Yeah. Right.

Does it even have Vibrate????

Piece of crap.

As per GPS, it's simpe. It should be a more expensive option. It would be killer.

But the most important thing about the iPhone, is, well, the PHONE. Which currently...sucks.

You sure make a lot of snap judgements without even using the phone :no:

[Aquatic]

Not having vibrate is a BIG DEAL. Also can it do video? I'd assume it can but if not that would be awful too.

And no I didn't finish watching the video on it, it was too painful. But I'm sure they'll get it right. Or give up. One or the other. Hopefully they'll keep going. They should have never stopped the Newton and QuickTake. They invented entire industries and then left them.

[TenoBell]

They didn't explicitly say it will have iChat, they didn't explicitly say it won't. We'll know in June.

Not having vibrate is a BIG DEAL

Perhaps vibrate and the motion sensors don't get along too well.
But again they did not specifically say it had vibrate nor did they specifically say it won't.

[Neruda]

Roughly Drafted has an article dealing with iPhone myths, which incidentally, directly addresses a lot of the pro-con points being made in this thread. For those of you that don't bother to read these links, here are some of the topics.

Myth 1: the iPhone is missing EVDO (or some other high end feature) which will stifle adoption.
Myth Two: The iPhone is priced too high. It needs a 2 GB version for $299 lacking phone features.
Myth Three: The iPhone should be sold unlocked, not tied to Cingular service.

Myth Four: The iPhone software is a closed model, therefore the sky is falling.

This is what Steve-o had to say about this:
These are devices that need to work, and you can’t do that if you load any software on them,” he said. “That doesn’t mean there’s not going to be software to buy that you can load on them coming from us. It doesn’t mean we have to write it all, but it means it has to be more of a controlled environment.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/11/technology/11cnd-apple.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin


Myth Five: The iPhone is just a phone with features lots of other phones already have.
This seems to be the most prevalent one with the Windows fanboys at work.

Myth Eight: An integrated battery is a significant problem for users.

Myth Nine: OMG Scratches

Aquatic: if you think this phone sucks so much, then there is a simple solution: don't buy it.

Personally, I would not buy this phone, but the prospects of the implementation of some of this technology in an iPod is very exciting, and I will be buying one of those if the features/price is right.

[Macvault]

A couple things iPhone needs:

1) no lockdown to cell carrier and no contract
2) Microvision Projector (http://www.microvision.com)
3) GPS
4) Skype/Voip over WiFi
5) Voice recording
6) Ability to record conversations to memory and upload to computer/iTunes, etc.
7) Video-out for connecting to TV / video goggles

Or, maybe all this needs to be the new iPod, and the iPhone can stay the way it is and fester in the hellish exclusiveness of Planet Cingular.

Sooo close, yet sooo far.

[TenoBell]

Microvision Projector

What the HELL?

Why does the iPhone NEED a projector?

[Macvault]

What the HELL?

Why does the iPhone NEED a projector?

Don't get me wrong - the lack of the Microvision Projector does not detract from how awsome the iPhone is (the Cingular+contract deal does), but it would be cool if you could project video, photos, etc onto a big screen/wall from such a small device.

[icfireball]

A couple things iPhone needs:

1) no lockdown to cell carrier and no contract
2) Microvision Projector (http://www.microvision.com)
3) GPS
4) Skype/Voip over WiFi
5) Voice recording
6) Ability to record conversations to memory and upload to computer/iTunes, etc.
7) Video-out for connecting to TV / video goggles

Or, maybe all this needs to be the new iPod, and the iPhone can stay the way it is and fester in the hellish exclusiveness of Planet Cingular.

Sooo close, yet sooo far.

1) No lockdown to cell phone carier is ultimately good, but bad for now. Apple would have to coordinate ALL of their new technologies based on ALL of their providers. Cingular seems to be the most open to making network changes, so this gives Apple a lot of freedom. ALL PHONES COME WITH A CONTRACT IN THE SENSE THAT ALL PLANS COME WITH A CONTACT EXCEPT PAY-AS-YOU GO, AND PAY-AS-YOU-GO PHONES SUCK!
2) This technology is EXPENSIVE and currently sucks quite a bit.
3) Cell phones can be located by the carrier and this information sent back to the phone, so with Google Maps, thats good enough. GPS is just ANOTHER expense.
5) No. Too complicated and Skype/VOip quality over wireless is not the best.
6) You don't know it doesn't have this, and this would be nice.
7) This can be done through the dock.

[Macvault]

1) No lockdown to cell phone carier is ultimately good, but bad for now. Apple would have to coordinate ALL of their new technologies based on ALL of their providers. Cingular seems to be the most open to making network changes, so this gives Apple a lot of freedom. ALL PHONES COME WITH A CONTRACT IN THE SENSE THAT ALL PLANS COME WITH A CONTACT EXCEPT PAY-AS-YOU GO, AND PAY-AS-YOU-GO PHONES SUCK!
2) This technology is EXPENSIVE and currently sucks quite a bit.
3) Cell phones can be located by the carrier and this information sent back to the phone, so with Google Maps, thats good enough. GPS is just ANOTHER expense.
5) No. Too complicated and Skype/VOip quality over wireless is not the best.
6) You don't know it doesn't have this, and this would be nice.
7) This can be done through the dock.

3) Can the carrier pinpoint your exact location within a couple feet and give fly-through map directions - anywhere on the planet? Only GPS will do this.
5) WTF?! Skype quality has always been AWSOME for me - whether wireless or wired. Better than my landline phone!

[ebaydan777]

ok first i think the end product will have iChat built in, it must...

second i think that the 3G hardware will be in the phone, most definitly must have it, but i think they are going to keep it closed because there is no use for it thus drains battery, once it opens up i think they will speak to cingular and find some solutions

third, a projector? wtf is wrong with people seriously this isnt a housemade or your bitch, thats just rediculous

fourth, im pretty sure this phone will have GPS with all the buddy buddying apple has with google now, im sure it will at least have GPS triangulation

fifth, skype was also in that NYTIMES link ^ there, job's said he is trying to deal with cingular on this but they dont know if they will shoot for it because it makes cingular lose minutes, its all money u know

sixth, we dont know about voice recording, but i dont see a use for it personally neither do a lot of people, probably xnay on that

and last, about the damn software, its closed ended, but who cares, honestly id rather pay apple for their products no joke, i have my tmobile dash, only had it for 2 motnhs and its a peice of crap, why because of all these dumb 3rd party apps on there, they suck and they ruin the phones..im glad apple is creating everything, i just hope they make the things everyone needs, which they will..look at how cool and useful some of the widgets are for macs

so people stop bitching either buy it or dont, i went to t-mobile today and my buddy that works there already has the phone on pre-order..i asked HOW...he just simply said "its nice working for phone companies"....and then he showed me a reciept from cingular...dont ask me how but it came out to like $640 something...lol and i asked, but u work for tmobile how will u work this, its not unlockable...and he said..oh but i already sent the specs to our unlocking department and theyre already working on it, theyll have a key out by June....i was pretty impressed especially with that receipt...lol i want him to order me one but he said next month, he can only do 1 a month so i will update u all in february haha

[icfireball]

3) Can the carrier pinpoint your exact location within a couple feet and give fly-through map directions - anywhere on the planet? Only GPS will do this.
5) WTF?! Skype quality has always been AWSOME for me - whether wireless or wired. Better than my landline phone!

Cell phone location by carrier is much more accurate than most would think. This is how E911 knows exactly where you are. At any rate, even if GPS is good in the long term, it is not right now. It would just be another added expense.

I've used skype a few times and the quality was about the same as my cell phone. At anyrate, its really just not needed for most. Afterall, your paying for your cell phone bill wether you use the minutes or not.

[Slewis]

Cell phone location by carrier is much more accurate than most would think. This is how E911 knows exactly where you are. At any rate, even if GPS is good in the long term, it is not right now. It would just be another added expense.

I've used skype a few times and the quality was about the same as my cell phone. At anyrate, its really just not needed for most. Afterall, your paying for your cell phone bill wether you use the minutes or not.
Some use Skype for it's Free Skype to Skype calls, then again, almost every IM (except most Jabber Based IMs) have this feature, and then for people without Skype, they just use their Minutes.

I'm in agreement with you though, you're paying the bill anyways so why not use it?

Sebastian

[TenoBell]

I've used skype a few times and the quality was about the same as my cell phone. At anyrate, its really just not needed for most. Afterall, your paying for your cell phone bill wether you use the minutes or not.

Agreed some people are making too big a deal over VOIP. But Apple should allow it to be used.
One good reason is people would feel like they have some choice. It would defeat the point of a mobile phone to depend on WiFI. So they would still end up using Cingular anyway.

[Slewis]

Agreed some people are making too big a deal over VOIP. But Apple should allow it to be used.
One good reason is people would feel like they have some choice. It would defeat the point of a mobile phone to depend on WiFI. So they would still end up using Cingular anyway.
Here in San Francisco, Mobile Phone providers will learn to... how to put it... UTTERLY UTTERLY HATE ANY MOBILE DEVICE THAT CAN INSTALL SKYPE!!

I'm sure Apple may have considered it, but I doubt Cingular liked the idea very much with efforts like Google and Earthlink turning San Francisco into a gigantic Wifi Network, and a few other Efforts around the country, I think one in Portland, and I think Paris has something similar (not sure)

Sebastian

[Aquatic]

Yes I agree AIM and iChat are needed and thus by extension being able to place calls for free in WiFi zones via Voice chat in iChat would be sweet. Not to mention videochat. But Apple follows The Man these days (like DRM for iTMS) and carriers like Slewis said absolutely HATE that idea. Sigh.

[TenoBell]

But Apple follows The Man these days (like DRM for iTMS) and carriers like Slewis said absolutely HATE that idea. Sigh.

Come on Aquatic you have to be reasonable.

Apple is not in total control of these situations. Everyone is in this for their own best interests and Apple has to negotiate everything. DRM on iTMS is not Apple bending to the will of the man. iTMS would not exist at all without DRM, period. Its a compromise.

The same between Apple and Cingular. Apple is not able to walk into the situation and fully control what Cingular will do. Apple has to compromise and Cingular has to compromise. Of course Cingular would not want the iPhone to use VOIP. In negotiating Apple may have had to give up that option in order to get something more valuable. If Apple does not compromise with Cingular the iPhone does not exist, period.

Once Apple has grown the iPhone market and the two year contract with Cingular expires they are in a better position to do what they want.

[ebaydan777]

honestly...im sure apple would like to do everything but they are in a tie down with cingular..and they have to give them something, doing VOIP and all that just simply excludes cingular's money at all, then whats the point

[Slewis]

honestly...im sure apple would like to do everything but they are in a tie down with cingular..and they have to give them something, doing VOIP and all that just simply excludes cingular's money at all, then whats the point
Haha, how? Phone companies will hate any WiFi phone with Skype or similar. But the iPhone requires a contract to buy it, you're still going to end up paying the phone bill. :lol: At any rate, if you're paying the bill anyways, why not just use the phone plan you have?

Sebastian

[THT]

I'm in love with this thing, but I'm forcing myself NOT to buy it until a 2G iPhone is released.

Not a bad thing. This thing is a brand new platform and will require quite a bit of software refinement. I think the icons could stand a bit more refinement in their looks myself.

Here's a few things I'm looking for:
1. More storage -- I'd like to see more storage, along the lines of 16-32GB, or even that wonderful 60GB mini-HDD that Samsung is releasing
2. Utilization of WiFi -- Why not beat Zune at it's own game? Sync wirelessly with WiFi and/or Bluetooth with other phones and computers. Download something from the iTunes Store onto the iPhone and then sync it with the PC, and vice versa. Or how about iPhone-to-iPhone communication, much like what the Nintendo DS does.
3. 3G Network -- EDGE sucks. I use it on my Razr and it's HORRIBLE. 3G is the way to go, and I'm waiting for it.
4. More software -- I'd like to see AIM on my iPhone, even though I can just route my IMs to my phone and talk via SMS. Having an iPhone-tailored AIM would be perfect, I think.
5. Video camera -- I'm not sure if it has it or not, but I think the iPhone only has a 2mp camera. I'd like to see video functionality so that that wonderfully amazing widescreen could be put to even better use.

1. Yeah. Jobs is in love with thinness, or perhaps that's a requirement of the smartphone market. If this thing is an iPod, a phone and internet communicator, it should have memory to handle the potential uses.

They could have very easily gone with 8 GB flash at the $499 price point and an 80 GB 1.8" drive at the $599 price point. An 80 GB version would be 0.6" thick and that messes with the aesthetics. A 30 GB hard drive could probably be under 0.5" thick though, and they'd be able to keep one thickness. I guess the big tradeoff was flash probably uses less power, and these machines need to save as much power as possible.

2. That's just a software update.

3. I don't think there will be a situation where using the wireless carrier's network for internet usage will be anything more than horrible. 3G will come by Q4 07 for Europe, and hopefully Apple refreshes for the USA at the same time.

4. They just need to write software.

5. The hardware is there, they just need to write the software.

One of the big complaints everyone has is that Apple decided to work with the USA wireless carriers instead of competing against them or doing something better than them since they are universally hated in the USA.

The thing that most everyone recognizes is that the iPhone as a platform has nearly unlimited potential with the multi-touch interface and how a lot of things could be added by bit of software.

[Macvault]

Come on Aquatic you have to be reasonable.

Apple is not in total control of these situations. Everyone is in this for their own best interests and Apple has to negotiate everything. DRM on iTMS is not Apple bending to the will of the man. iTMS would not exist at all without DRM, period. Its a compromise.

The same between Apple and Cingular. Apple is not able to walk into the situation and fully control what Cingular will do. Apple has to compromise and Cingular has to compromise. Of course Cingular would not want the iPhone to use VOIP. In negotiating Apple may have had to give up that option in order to get something more valuable. If Apple does not compromise with Cingular the iPhone does not exist, period.

Once Apple has grown the iPhone market and the two year contract with Cingular expires they are in a better position to do what they want.

Compromise is UNACCEPTABLE! That's why I canceled my own wedding a year ago! Steve/Apple should NOT give into the demands of the music lables, cellphone companies, etc! Apple once upon a time was different from Microsoft in that they offered their users CHOICE, FREEDOM, etc! Now, Steve is working for Cingular and for Disney! It's just plain UNACCEPTABLE! :mad: :mad: :mad:

[ebaydan777]

well creating a whole new infrastructure, i doubt they would do their own cell phone network, imagine all the towers and satellites they have to send up to be their own, and with the music...wtf is wrong with you, what do you want apple to write its own tunes as well, if apple didnt compromise with record companies etc...they wouldnt have shit and you know it, that was a stupid comment grow up and realize REAL LIFE situations that are actually acceptable

[Woody56292]

I have some good questions.

1. will iphone support custom ringtones. ( create your own ringtones ala sony ercisson phones )
2. will you be able to use mp3s as ringtones. ( the obvious answer is yes, but they never said anything about it during the podcast.
3. will you be able to assign a picture( can you even assign one? ) and ringtone to each contact you have?
4.voice recorder?
5. voice-dialing?
etc.

[Hiro]

Compromise is UNACCEPTABLE! That's why I canceled my own wedding a year ago!

Hmmmph, see in black and white only the Sith do...

Life is compromise, from the moment you began exercising free will.

I won't judge your reasons for cnx'ing your wedding, they may be very good. But it probably wasn't about compromise, that's just the easy way to explain it. Getting engaged in the first place was a compromise, you gave up the right to drop trou with any other women, for what your fiance brought to the table. You have a job? Thats a compromise, time vs money. Need I go on?

[ebaydan777]

I have some good questions.

1. will iphone support custom ringtones. ( create your own ringtones ala sony ercisson phones )
2. will you be able to use mp3s as ringtones. ( the obvious answer is yes, but they never said anything about it during the podcast.
3. will you be able to assign a picture( can you even assign one? ) and ringtone to each contact you have?
4.voice recorder?
5. voice-dialing?
etc.

no one knows about 1 and 2, at least not yet it has been confirmed as "No Comment" for now..

and for three, again not known for the ringtone, but im going to say yes to 1-2 and the ringtone part of 3, the picture is a for sure yes it even had their picture on the contact when steve was using the phone for keynote
voice-dialing, with the bluetooth headset they dropped im gonna assume it has voice recognition, it must

[ebaydan777]

Hmmmph, see in black and white only the Sith do...

Life is compromise, from the moment you began exercising free will.

I won't judge your reasons for cnx'ing your wedding, they may be very good. But it probably wasn't about compromise, that's just the easy way to explain it. Getting engaged in the first place was a compromise, you gave up the right to drop trou with any other women, for what your fiance brought to the table. You have a job? Thats a compromise, time vs money. Need I go on?


oooo owned...you sound like a person with tunnel vision whoever said no compromise...thats just stupid you cant just have everything in life your way it doesnt work out, if it was true why are there starving people in africa..have to compromise with their resources, or homeless people on the street, a bad choice due to compromising

[Padilla79]

Can a 3G antenna connect to a 2G network? Think about it. Apple themselves has stated that they plan 3G in the future, and I'm wondering if they intend to stick 3G hardware in iPhone and just have it work with 2G for now. If that's possible, and IF they do that, then, man, they sure are doing everything right. However, I'm not sure, and this is purely speculation on my part.

Also, I wonder if they have more goodies up their sleeves that will be announced when the FCC approves it (since the FCC gives rundowns of every [hardware] feature of every device it reviews).

As for now, though, I don't care what it has, because I'm waiting a little bit to get it.

[Macvault]

...Getting engaged in the first place was a compromise, you gave up the right to drop trou with any other women, for what your fiance brought to the table. You have a job? Thats a compromise, time vs money. Need I go on?

I never was "engaged". Why would you AssUme so?? And, no, I don't have a job :D Need I go on?

[Hassan i Sabbah]

I never was "engaged". Why would you AssUme so?? And, no, I don't have a job :D Need I go on?

off topic... but how did you have a marriage to call off if you never got engaged?

Intriguing...

[Not Unlike Myself]

Perhaps there are some convergent ideas nobody has mentioned yet: (or if you have, I might not have read)

1) Phone has same dock connector. I forsee car kits which let you dial your phone from the dashboard or via voice. (utilizing the cell feature in the glovebox)

2) Phone has wifi. See a future iChat enabling VOIP calls when in WiFi coverage for free. (or Skype)

3) Phone has wifi / bluetooth. See sharing your iPhone library with other iPhone users when within range.

4) Phone has accelerometers and bluetooth. See two iphone users meet and want to exchange contact cards. See each of them take out there iPhone and 'shake' it at each other (like the jesture of greeting). Then see their contact cards swap via bluetooth with ZERO touch.

5) Phone has wifi. See phone able to talk wirelessly with Apple TV for some unknown reason.

6) Phone has touch screen. Bring on the games. Every time Apple does a new launch they pilot stuff. (like the video clips from pixar before TV shows etc). Well I see the iPod games available in the iTunes music store as a pilot for a HUGE opportunity to download games/content from iTunes to your iPhone.

[Hiro]

off topic... but how did you have a marriage to call off if you never got engaged?

Intriguing...

I never was "engaged". Why would you AssUme so?? And, no, I don't have a job :D Need I go on?

I am just as curious as Hassan! I'm also a little perplexed by your ass fixation. Could that have been the hang-up that would have required a compromise? :p

Good luck with the no job thing! You must be far more cuddly than I. :) But do people just feel naturally compelled to feed/house you, or do you compromise and do something in exchange for food/shelter? We can go down that road all day, but if you have ever shat in a toilet you have made a compromise of holding your bowels rather than letting fly whenever the mood hits you, all to garner social acceptance and a less smelly environment.

[Imergingenious]

I am just as curious as Hassan! I'm also a little perplexed by your ass fixation. Could that have been the hang-up that would have required a compromise? :p

Good luck with the no job thing! You must be far more cuddly than I. :) But do people just feel naturally compelled to feed/house you, or do you compromise and do something in exchange for food/shelter? We can go down that road all day, but if you have ever shat in a toilet you have made a compromise of holding your bowels rather than letting fly whenever the mood hits you, all to garner social acceptance and a less smelly environment.

Too much information. MacVault probably said that due to issues with admitting fault. Most people are stubborn like that. I know I am.

That said, I think the iPhone is targeted at people who HAVE jobs. Good paying ones.

[black.horizons]

to all those who mention Zune:

I'm not a mac user. Certainly a mac fan - but as a lowly student I can't even afford an iPod. Hopefully come next semester I'll be on work placement earning enough to buy a macbook, an iPod (or even an iPhone / Mac Book Pro mixup)...

I can't see why Apple should take on Microsoft taking on Apple. Why should Apple include the features Zune has (wifi). Thats why Apple has managed to be such a success story. The iPod came as a result of innovation within the company, looking at things other than software. It was a break through in how the music industry operated. Microsoft were worried and decided to take Apple on at its game.

Apple now have released an iPhone (not iPod[with a phone attached]). My own view is that iPhone is just that. A phone that like 99% of new mobiles bought in the UK can play music. The fact that it has 8Gb of memory is amazing. It's a phone, with 8Gb of memory. Its not an 8Gb iPod Nano that can make phone calls and send text messages.

Its like the Apple site says. "Apple reinvents the phone". Not "Apple rereleases Nano to make phone calls"...though that might be a handy firmware upgrade.... :lol: [and i do hasten to add that i'm joking nanos don't have the attena required...or do they?!?!]

rant end!

p.s. anybody know who the UK carrier will be??

[Slewis]

to all those who mention Zune:

I'm not a mac user. Certainly a mac fan - but as a lowly student I can't even afford an iPod. Hopefully come next semester I'll be on work placement earning enough to buy a macbook, an iPod (or even an iPhone / Mac Book Pro mixup)...

I can't see why Apple should take on Microsoft taking on Apple. Why should Apple include the features Zune has (wifi). Thats why Apple has managed to be such a success story. The iPod came as a result of innovation within the company, looking at things other than software. It was a break through in how the music industry operated. Microsoft were worried and decided to take Apple on at its game.

Apple now have released an iPhone (not iPod[with a phone attached]). My own view is that iPhone is just that. A phone that like 99% of new mobiles bought in the UK can play music. The fact that it has 8Gb of memory is amazing. It's a phone, with 8Gb of memory. Its not an 8Gb iPod Nano that can make phone calls and send text messages.

Its like the Apple site says. "Apple reinvents the phone". Not "Apple rereleases Nano to make phone calls"...though that might be a handy firmware upgrade.... :lol: [and i do hasten to add that i'm joking nanos don't have the attena required...or do they?!?!]

rant end!

p.s. anybody know who the UK carrier will be??
Zune wasn't Mentioned
WiFi makes sense in a Phone, except to the Carriers
It's a 3in1 Phone/iPod/Internet Communicator :p

Sebastian

[Woody56292]

no one knows about 1 and 2, at least not yet it has been confirmed as "No Comment" for now..

and for three, again not known for the ringtone, but im going to say yes to 1-2 and the ringtone part of 3, the picture is a for sure yes it even had their picture on the contact when steve was using the phone for keynote
voice-dialing, with the bluetooth headset they dropped im gonna assume it has voice recognition, it must

omg... gizmodo (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphones/iphone-roundup-true-cost-3d-and-ringtones-229094.php) just confirmed that you can't use your mp3s as ringtones. what a bunch of garbage! I hope Apple convinces Cingular that nobody is going to buy their crappy ringtones for double the price of an mp3.


"Also, more importantly, users won't be able to use iTunes songs as ringtones. At least, not at launch. We're sure Apple's gotta work out stuff with Cingular and the music industry, since using songs you already bought as ringtones makes it pretty hard to justify buying the same song again just to use as a ringtone—something that's turning out to be a pretty big money source for both providers and the music industry."

[addabox]

omg... gizmodo (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphones/iphone-roundup-true-cost-3d-and-ringtones-229094.php) just confirmed that you can't use your mp3s as ringtones. what a bunch of garbage! I hope Apple convinces Cingular that nobody is going to buy their crappy ringtones for double the price of an mp3.


"Also, more importantly, users won't be able to use iTunes songs as ringtones. At least, not at launch. We're sure Apple's gotta work out stuff with Cingular and the music industry, since using songs you already bought as ringtones makes it pretty hard to justify buying the same song again just to use as a ringtone—something that's turning out to be a pretty big money source for both providers and the music industry."

Why would Apple be telling Gizmodo things they're not telling anyone else?

The David Pogue article specifically said that the iTunes as ringtones thing "hadn't been decided yet."

[NanoAkron]

Of course it does IM. Nobody has called it "iChat Mobile" yet, but iChat bubble style IM was demoed.

The ability to open Office docs or a mobile iWork is a given, if not right off the bat.

See the remarks about 3G deployment in the posts above. Having the latest and greatest just to have it when most people in the US can't take advantage of it and it significantly impacts battery life is not smart, it's just spec whorage.


You do know that there are more countries than just the US right?

And that is most of those 'other countries', 3G infrastructure is already well in place?

I think the bigger question should be "Why has apple deliberately crippled the phone to appeal to the smaller, US-based GSM market when the rest of the world stands ready for the taking."

US phone networks be damned. Release overseas first and let the domestic crowd cry to the networks to drag their sorry asses into the 21st century.

[Hiro]

You do know that there are more countries than just the US right?

And that is most of those 'other countries', 3G infrastructure is already well in place?

I think the bigger question should be "Why has apple deliberately crippled the phone to appeal to the smaller, US-based GSM market when the rest of the world stands ready for the taking."

US phone networks be damned. Release overseas first and let the domestic crowd cry to the networks to drag their sorry asses into the 21st century.

Has Apple released or even said it is going to release a crippled international version? No.

You are making assumptions that are unreasonable at the moment. You may have a valid concern that Apple has not announced anything specific about it's international versions, but that doesn't mean they won't provide the right phone for that market. Steve said outright that there are going to be multiple versions in the iPhone family. That should make you take a wait and see on whether iPhone is crippled from an international standpoint.

My guess is it won't be, especially since it won't be tied to Cingular's US contract terms.

[Aquatic]

Yeah ok adda. It is an iPod with a phone as an afterthought. I WANT to buy this thing! If it doesn't suck. I seem to be the only person here or even the mass media that sees the massive deficiencies that may ultimately lead to the complete cancellation of this product line. Maybe I'm exaggerating a little. But they need to see that it won't sell if it can't be used in a car (sorry, I don't care if it's not safe, everyone does it, sort of like smoking, driving faster than 65mph, eating butter, etc.) Also I wouldn't be surprised if it lacks things like vibrate. No VOIP of course because they have succumbed to The Man. No iLife/MS Office compatibility is another strike. Outlook is a big deal...don't know how they'd tackle that though, that's probably just hopeless but it nonetheless hurts. Voice dialing is needed. 3rd party apps (even if they need to be "approved" are need. We should be able to write out own widgets though. I'll probably write a letter but I assumed someone smarter than me would, and add things on I didn't think of. Basically, I could probably do phone things faster with my phone than the iPhone. That's the whole point. Without LOOKING too. Come on most of you place calls in your car. I guess Apple will just have to have great voice navigation.

But I digress. I bet they will add more/have stuff up their sleeve. And we really don't know anything about it yet. After all that time I still feel there is stuff we don't know about it.
Time will tell. And as for GPS that should come in a very high end edition but obviously not the standard one until maybe 5 years from now when it's affordable. That'd be SICK though. Team up with Trimble or Magellan like I've said.

[addabox]

You do know that there are more countries than just the US right?

And that is most of those 'other countries', 3G infrastructure is already well in place?

I think the bigger question should be "Why has apple deliberately crippled the phone to appeal to the smaller, US-based GSM market when the rest of the world stands ready for the taking."

US phone networks be damned. Release overseas first and let the domestic crowd cry to the networks to drag their sorry asses into the 21st century.

:err: Yes, I know that. Do you know that Apple is releasing the iPhone in the US first, so anything we have to say about its roll out is necessarily specifically about that?

Apple has been quite clear why it chose the set-up it did for the American roll out, and it is because of the relatively poor coverage of 3G service. They have also said they will go 3G in America as soon as the coverage makes that sensible.

To claim that means Apple has simply forsworn 3G worldwide, or Apple's choices in America reveal some kind of US provincialism, is pointlessly contentious.

[Hiro]

Yeah ok adda. It is an iPod with a phone as an afterthought. I WANT to buy this thing! If it doesn't suck. I seem to be the only person here or even the mass media that sees the massive deficiencies that may ultimately lead to the complete cancellation of this product line. Maybe I'm exaggerating a little. But they need to see that it won't sell if it can't be used in a car (sorry, I don't care if it's not safe, everyone does it, sort of like smoking, driving faster than 65mph, eating butter, etc.)
It has bluetooth, why wouldn't you be able to use it in a car?

Also I wouldn't be surprised if it lacks things like vibrate. No VOIP of course because they have succumbed to The Man. Possibly, possibly not. Nobody outside the product team really knows for sure.

No iLife/MS Office compatibility is another strike.
Getting awfully sure here in the negative column. These are pretty big, but you are forgetting that Leopard & iWork07(probably) are due out before the phone is. I would stake my left nut that a version of iWork or at least it's Office document readers will be available for iPhone. Maybe for sale, not free, but definitely available.

Outlook is a big deal...don't know how they'd tackle that though, that's probably just hopeless but it nonetheless hurts.
Outlook email isn't such a big deal, any decent mail client can do what Outlook phone clients do. Syncing Outlook address books and schedules would be huge for businesses though, gotta agree with that. Joe Schmuckatelli not using it for work couldn't care though.

Voice dialing is needed.
Nice, not needed. Think future upgrade.

3rd party apps (even if they need to be "approved" are need. We should be able to write out own widgets though. I'll probably write a letter but I assumed someone smarter than me would, and add things on I didn't think of.
They will come, just not out of every morons dev house.

Basically, I could probably do phone things faster with my phone than the iPhone. That's the whole point. Without LOOKING too. Come on most of you place calls in your car. I guess Apple will just have to have great voice navigation.
That's all muscle memory for the specific phone you have. Get a new phone, relearn it until you are fast. No different here, voice nav doesn't change this. Again, get a new phone and you need to look at it until you know it cold, that takes quite a bit of use. So, same problems in a car no matter what new phone you buy.

But I digress. I bet they will add more/have stuff up their sleeve. And we really don't know anything about it yet. After all that time I still feel there is stuff we don't know about it.
Time will tell. And as for GPS that should come in a very high end edition but obviously not the standard one until maybe 5 years from now when it's affordable. That'd be SICK though. Team up with Trimble or Magellan like I've said.
Especially if you could plug in a SICK laser too! (Yes SICK is a brand/type of laser!) Let your robotics mind go wild!

[addabox]

Yeah ok adda. It is an iPod with a phone as an afterthought. I WANT to buy this thing! If it doesn't suck. I seem to be the only person here or even the mass media that sees the massive deficiencies that may ultimately lead to the complete cancellation of this product line. Maybe I'm exaggerating a little. But they need to see that it won't sell if it can't be used in a car (sorry, I don't care if it's not safe, everyone does it, sort of like smoking, driving faster than 65mph, eating butter, etc.) Also I wouldn't be surprised if it lacks things like vibrate. No VOIP of course because they have succumbed to The Man. No iLife/MS Office compatibility is another strike. Outlook is a big deal...don't know how they'd tackle that though, that's probably just hopeless but it nonetheless hurts. Voice dialing is needed. 3rd party apps (even if they need to be "approved" are need. We should be able to write out own widgets though. I'll probably write a letter but I assumed someone smarter than me would, and add things on I didn't think of. Basically, I could probably do phone things faster with my phone than the iPhone. That's the whole point. Without LOOKING too. Come on most of you place calls in your car. I guess Apple will just have to have great voice navigation.

But I digress. I bet they will add more/have stuff up their sleeve. And we really don't know anything about it yet. After all that time I still feel there is stuff we don't know about it.
Time will tell. And as for GPS that should come in a very high end edition but obviously not the standard one until maybe 5 years from now when it's affordable. That'd be SICK though. Team up with Trimble or Magellan like I've said.

Well, some of that is not clear (vibrate, voice navigation), some of it is not Apple's fault (VOIP), some of it seems inevitable (iLife, Office and Outlook compatibility), and I honestly believe that none of it is a fatal blow compared to what it does do and how it does it.

EDIT: what Hiro said.

[Padilla79]

Well, it was just reported on Engadget that iPhone's widescreen isn't legit widescreen, 16:9 ratio. That's quite depressing. I hope they fix that, I really do.

[GregAlexander]

Well, it was just reported on Engadget that iPhone's widescreen isn't legit widescreen, 16:9 ratio. That's quite depressing. I hope they fix that, I really do.
I thought that was obvious from the picture. It's not 16:9.

I agree, especially for a phone, that a little longer, and a little thinner, might be nice.

[addabox]

Well, it was just reported on Engadget that iPhone's widescreen isn't legit widescreen, 16:9 ratio. That's quite depressing. I hope they fix that, I really do.

"Depressing"? Huh. So when you watch your movie on the the 3.5" screen and notice the quarter inch black bar at the top you'll get "depressed"? Like you do when you watch the not-really-wide screen PSP?

Because that 1/4" is what's standing between a miserable, crippled movie experience and full 3.5" wide-screen cinema like experience?

[Imergingenious]

Plus having a wider screen allows them to fit the keyboard in portrait view. Any skinnier and it would have been impossible

[THT]

The iPhone backlash articles are too amazing for words. This aspect ratio complaint is beyond ridiculous.

There are a lot of tradeoffs involved here, and they settled on something reasonable. If it is 1.78 (16/9) aspect ratio, imagine the black bars when watching 4:3 TV shows. If it was 2.35 (or whatever the super panoramic aspect ratio) like Pirates, there will be black bars on 1.78 HD aspect ratio screens. Argh...

[GregAlexander]

Plus having a wider screen allows them to fit the keyboard in portrait view. Any skinnier and it would have been impossibleGood point.

[Hiro]

Well, it was just reported on Engadget that iPhone's widescreen isn't legit widescreen, 16:9 ratio. That's quite depressing. I hope they fix that, I really do.

I like how the term widescreen gets suddenly updated. When Apple first shipped the TiPB it was the ONLY laptop with a widescreen display on the planet. It has a 3:2 ratio! Everyone jumped on the 3:2 ratio as widescreen bandwagon for a good 7 years! HD resolutions have extended what widescreen is, but not to the point of excluding an ratio that is significantly wider than it is tall -- duh! -- wide screen!

Now suddenly Engadget thinks they get to redefine what an entire industry has used in marketing materials for 7 years! Uhhh, no. :grumble:

[Padilla79]

"Depressing"? Huh. So when you watch your movie on the the 3.5" screen and notice the quarter inch black bar at the top you'll get "depressed"? Like you do when you watch the not-really-wide screen PSP?

Because that 1/4" is what's standing between a miserable, crippled movie experience and full 3.5" wide-screen cinema like experience?

Bro, chill, don't be hostile. It's just a phrase, an exaggeration of my disappointment, that's all.

[addabox]

Bro, chill, don't be hostile. It's just a phrase, an exaggeration of my disappointment, that's all.

Not hostile at all, just amazed that the aspect ratio of the iPhone's screen got so much negative press, and engendered such dismay around the web.

Honestly, I can't imagine being even disappointed, for pretty much the reason I said: the difference in watching a very slightly letterboxed 16:9 video on the iPhone and a "true" 16:9 screen, at 3.5", is a fraction of an inch. Moreover, as has been pointed out, it's a fraction of an inch you get back the other way when watching 4:3 material.

And given that this very slight compromise is in service to all the other things the iPhone does, well, I just don't get the downside.

[PeaceTrain67]

:smokey: I have some disputes about the iPhone.
I have a Motorola SYNC right now (The phone cingular spends all day and night trying to advertise for: Rock the kashba commercial for instance). It's music is a jip, it's got 512 MB. This is the 'Music Phone', keep in mind.
I get about 60 songs on it, but here's the hassle, if you don't have Napster, you have to create an account and pay $15 a month to keep using your phone for music. At this point, that's not happening. That is part of the reason I flew right on board for the iPhone immediately. Also, I have a 80GB iPod. I got about 20GB remaining.
On top of that I have a MacBook Pro. ($1999 Model). My phone is in on 24 hours a day, and here's practically the breakdown on an average day:
8 Hours Charge
15 Hours In My Pocket
1 Hour In Use.
that's pretty average. You might say if you got an iPod why do you want this phone, I mean, that is the only major thing that seperates the iPhone from PDA's and such. You don't have to keep