Douse the Torch!

[mydo]

I'm very much enjoying the chaos and antics of the Olympic Torch relay. Empty symbolism replaced with something substantial. Here's hoping San Francisco comes through with something significant.


China Turns Patriotic Wrath on Olympics Demonstrators (http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/sports/sports-china-tibet.html)

As far as I can tell the NYT doesn't want to cover this.:rolleyes:

[Bergermeister]

This is turning into a nightmare for China; the torch relay may be changed because it failed on their watch. People will remember these events for a lot longer than they will the games themselves.

I'm waiting for the response to come to the statement about vile acts... the protesters will claim that China's acts are even more vile to which CHina will respond, causing a ...

Where are the sat photos from Tibet? Has anybody seen any posts anywhere? Somebody is bound to have paid for sat imagery of Tibet to show what the media is unable to.

[vinea]

Have the chinese killed protesters and rioters? Yes, that's beyond dispute. Are they cracking down on seperatists? Surely.

Is it worth a boycott of Beijing Olympics? No. To a certain extent the Chinese are right. They might politicize the games from the perspective of PR but all host countries do that. But the tit-for-tat 1980 and 1984 boycotts by the US then Russia were rather pointless and didn't serve to change anything but sully the games themselves and hurt atheletes.

The Chinese aren't going to modify their behavior because of an Olympic boycott. They WILL be pissed enough to retaliate for decades and in some ways their position is far stronger than the Soviets.

If you are upset, don't go to the olympics and don't watch. Send money to the Tibetans. Heck, go protest in front fo the Chinese embassy.

This is my comment on the olympics. I am against Chinese incursion of Bhutan but that's largely an Indian problem and not ours. Tibet is fait accompli. I don't believe that the Tibetans will be able to gain independence again. I do think the Chinese position there is idiotic and the hardline approach stupid. Given the Dali Lama willingness to support Tibet as part of China for a little more autonomy that's the smoothest course for integration.

Oh...as far as satellite images they won't show anything but I'm sure the French would be happy to sell any incriminating images if they existed.

[Bergermeister]

Sat images would very easily show a change in troop presence over time as well as major changes to daily life. Military formations where there were none, no traffic on a bridge when there used to be lots, etc. Sat photos can tell a lot.

Take a peek at your hometown on Google Earth. You'll be pretty surprised by what you can see even with these relatively low res images.

They just recently updated the images of where I live and it is amazing. With a little research, I will be able to tell the exact date the image was taken. One single photo can relate quite a bit of info. A series over time can relate volumes.

[mydo]

Will the satellite images show a fundamental shift in the Chinese government toward individual rights and an open political system?

[Bergermeister]

It will show the pizza I ordered for dinner...

Of course it won't show everything, but it will show certain changes that could be very valuable.

[vinea]

Take a peek at your hometown on Google Earth. You'll be pretty surprised by what you can see even with these relatively low res images.

They just recently updated the images of where I live and it is amazing. With a little research, I will be able to tell the exact date the image was taken. One single photo can relate quite a bit of info. A series over time can relate volumes.

Most of those detailed images are from aircraft. I think the PRC will object to air recon missions over Tibet...even if it's Google doing it.

[Bergermeister]

Most of those detailed images are from aircraft. I think the PRC will object to air recon missions over Tibet...even if it's Google doing it.

If that is the case, you have a point. I was under the impression the the images were sat shots. (Just checked and the images I am looking at are from sats... they are pretty clear...)
The photos are for highly populated areas... certainly not where I live.

That being said, it is interesting to see the colors of the cars on the streets of Beijing!

However, someone out there has access to some nice sats and it could be interesting to see what they come up with.

[vinea]

If that is the case, you have a point. I was under the impression the the images were sat shots.

That being said, it is interesting to see the colors of the cars on the streets of Beijing!

However, someone out there has access to some nice sats and it could be interesting to see what they come up with.

Commercial imagery are in the 2-3m range...meaning each pixel is 2-3m across. Some are now at the 1-m resolution range. Still somewhat coarse if you're looking for individual people or bodies. Most of the easily available detailed aerial imagery is in the .25m range and you can clearly see cars and sometimes people or shadows of people.

Folks can buy sat time from quickbird, spot, russia, etc. An interesting counter to this is the purchase of commercial satellite time/data during a period of interest. Something the US managed to do once but is a tad more expensive and unlikely today.

You can probably see troop movement since they tend to be largish blocks of folks with trucks and tents. Same with burned out buildings and the like. You would be able to gauge crowd size during an event with 1-3m resolution pics.

But for the information of greatest interest, reporters on the ground are needed.

[柳鲲鹏]

Diego Maradona refuses to carry Olympic torch - Times Online (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/olympics/article3731815.ece)
http://static.scribd.com/profiles/images/2knlvq9y4n456-full.jpg

[Jubelum]

Wow. How do you follow that?
8-)