Apple quietly refreshes iMac line, now up to 3.06GHz

[tdhockeyfan424]

today I ordered my new iMac 24" 2.4ghz with 2gb of ram and got the wireless keyboard and mouse.

I am wondering if apple updates the iMacs can I send mine in becuase I probably won't get mine for 3-5 days and the updates would come on Tuesday.

If I can send it I'm what do I have to do and how can I do it.

Also if they changes the ram to 2gb standard do I get 100 back because I updated it

Please help

apple udated ti to the new imacs at no aditional cost,
i now got this:

24" imac 2.8ghz, 2gb ram, 320gb hdd, 256mb ati graphics card and wireless keyboard and mouse.

**also from amazon for 200 dollars less than what apple charges i got the logitech z-5500 digital 5.1 surround sound speakers. they look very nice

[audiopollution]

today I ordered my new iMac 24" 2.4ghz with 2gb of ram and got the wireless keyboard and mouse.

I am wondering if apple updates the iMacs can I send mine in becuase I probably won't get mine for 3-5 days and the updates would come on Tuesday.

If I can send it I'm what do I have to do and how can I do it.

Also if they changes the ram to 2gb standard do I get 100 back because I updated it

Please help

Why did you order a new iMac today, considering the large number of reports that an upgraded version will be released in a mere two days?

Cancel the order. Wait until Tuesday.

[PB]

As audiopollution already said, if you still can cancel your order just do it. New iMacs are coming very soon. At least this is what the rumor says. And it was quiet for a long time. So... :D

EDIT: oh, and if you have ordered directly from Apple you may receive one of the updated models. But better be sure and cancel the order while you can. Good luck.

[Flounder]

Yeah, it's out. Call apple up and find out exactly what computer they're sending you. It might be the updated one, so there may be no need to cancel your order.

[aplnub]

Nice bump to bring everything up to speed but I don't see anything ground breaking.

It did get a new video card 8800GS which looks good compared to my ATI in my 24" aluminum.

[backtomac]

Nice bump to bring everything up to speed but I don't see anything ground breaking.

It did get a new video card 8800GS which looks good compared to my ATI in my 24" aluminum.

I think its a very nice update. I would agree its not ground breaking but the speed bumps are nice. The option of a better gpu is excellent(now the iMac can be used for gaming). And the 2 gbs of standard RAM is long overdue IMO.

[AppleInsider]

Apple on Monday updated its iMac family with the latest Intel Core 2 Duo Penryn mobile processors and the most powerful graphics ever available in the all-in-one desktop line.

With prices starting at just $1,199, the new iMacs also include 6MB L2 cache, a faster 1066 MHz front-side bus, and 2GB of memory standard in most models (expandable to 4GB).

Meanwhile, the new 24-inch Extreme configuration offers a 3.06 GHz Intel processor and a NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GS graphics card with 512MB of video memory, which Apple claims will deliver up to two times the standard performance for graphic intensive applications.

“The iMac’s gorgeous aluminum and glass all-in-one design has been an incredible hit with our customers and is just one of the reasons Mac sales are growing three and a half times faster than PC sales,” said Philip Schiller, Apple’s senior vice president of Worldwide Product Marketing. “With the latest Intel processors, a faster new graphics option and more memory, customers now have even more reasons to love the iMac.”

New Configurations

The new iMac line is available immediately through the Apple Store, Apple’s retail stores and Apple Authorized Resellers.

The new 20-inch 2.4 GHz iMac, for a suggested retail price of $1,199 (US), includes:
20-inch widescreen LCD display2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor with a 1066 MHz front-side bus1GB of 800 MHz DDR2 SDRAM expandable to 4GB250GB Serial ATA hard drive running at 7200 rpma slot-load 8x SuperDrive® with double-layer support (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)ATI Radeon HD 2400 XT with 128MB GDDR3 memorybuilt-in iSight video camerabuilt-in AirPort Extreme 802.11n wireless networking & Bluetooth 2.1+EDRmini-DVI out (adapters for DVI, VGA and Composite/S-Video sold separately)built-in stereo speakers and microphone; andthe Apple Keyboard, Mighty Mouse and infrared Apple Remote.
The new 20-inch 2.66 GHz iMac, for a suggested retail price of $1,499 (US), includes:
20-inch widescreen LCD display2.66 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor with a 1066 MHz front-side bus2GB of 800 MHz DDR2 SDRAM expandable to 4GB320GB Serial ATA hard drive running at 7200 rpma slot-load 8x SuperDrive with double-layer support (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)ATI Radeon HD 2600 PRO with 256MB GDDR3 memorybuilt-in iSight video camerabuilt-in AirPort Extreme 802.11n wireless networking & Bluetooth 2.1+EDRmini-DVI out (adapters for DVI, VGA and Composite/S-Video sold separately)built-in stereo speakers and microphone; andthe Apple Keyboard, Mighty Mouse and infrared Apple Remote.
The new 24-inch 2.8 GHz iMac, for a suggested retail price of $1,799 (US), includes:
24-inch widescreen LCD display2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor with a 1066 MHz front-side bus2GB of 800 MHz DDR2 SDRAM expandable to 4GB320GB Serial ATA hard drive running at 7200 rpma slot-load 8x SuperDrive with double-layer support (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)ATI Radeon HD 2600 PRO with 256MB GDDR3 memorybuilt-in iSight video camerabuilt-in AirPort Extreme 802.11n wireless networking & Bluetooth 2.1+EDRmini-DVI out (adapters for DVI, VGA and Composite/S-Video sold separately)built-in stereo speakers and microphone; andthe Apple Keyboard, Mighty Mouse and infrared Apple Remote.
The new 24-inch 3.06 GHz iMac, for a suggested retail price of $2,199 (US), includes:
24-inch widescreen LCD display3.06 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor with a 1066 MHz front-side bus2GB of 800 MHz DDR2 SDRAM expandable to 4GB500GB Serial ATA hard drive running at 7200 rpma slot-load 8x SuperDrive with double-layer support (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GS with 512MB GDDR3 memorybuilt-in iSight video camerabuilt-in AirPort Extreme 802.11n wireless networking & Bluetooth 2.1+EDRmini-DVI out (adapters for DVI, VGA and Composite/S-Video sold separately)built-in stereo speakers and microphone; andthe Apple Keyboard, Mighty Mouse and infrared Apple Remote.



The new iMacs further Apple’s commitment to environmental progress with highly recyclable and durable materials including scratch-resistant glass and professional grade aluminum. Each new model is rated EPEAT Silver, the company said, adding that the power-efficient systems also meet the stringent Energy Star 4.0 requirements for power consumption.

Apple is also now offering more reasonable pricing for iMac memory upgrades, with an upgrade from 1GB to 2GB costing $100, and an upgrade from 2GB to 4GB fetching just $300.

Each iMac ships with Mac OS X 10.5 Leopard and iLife '08.

Those readers looking to purchase a new iMac may want to check out MacMall, which is offering up to $100 in rebates (plus a free Epson Printer and copy of Parallels Desktop 3.0) with each purchase.[ View this article at AppleInsider.com ] (http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=4002)

[Abster2core]

today I ordered my new iMac 24" 2.4ghz with 2gb of ram and got the wireless keyboard and mouse.

I am wondering if apple updates the iMacs can I send mine in becuase I probably won't get mine for 3-5 days and the updates would come on Tuesday.

If I can send it I'm what do I have to do and how can I do it.

Also if they changes the ram to 2gb standard do I get 100 back because I updated it

Please help

Most likely if you don't do anything you will receive the new iteration at the published price.

For your own comfort, just call customer support.

[danieldelaney]

today I ordered my new iMac 24" 2.4ghz with 2gb of ram and got the wireless keyboard and mouse.

I am wondering if apple updates the iMacs can I send mine in becuase I probably won't get mine for 3-5 days and the updates would come on Tuesday.

If I can send it I'm what do I have to do and how can I do it.

Also if they changes the ram to 2gb standard do I get 100 back because I updated it

Please help

You're totally fine. They have a 14 day return policy. Just call them, I doubt it shipped. Regardless, in the past similar orders have simply been upgraded to the bumped technology at the same price point.

But so ya'll know: Any APPL tech you buy can be upgraded, returned, or swapped within 14 days of purchase with a receipt. If you open it, you may have to pay a restocking fee.

[json]

These look like nice updates. And the Swedish prices have also been adjusted in the right direction.
It's interesting to see that the new 3.06 with wireless keyboard/mouse and 750GB HD is about 20% cheaper than my 24" white iMac with 2.33 GHz, 2 GB memory, wireless keyboard/mouse and the better graphics card was when I bought it two years ago. I guess the value of the dollar also "works in our favour".....

Maybe it's time to upgrade from the white iMac..... but on the other hand I'm still hoping they will introduce a 30" model....

[amac4me]

Overall, a nice refresh to the iMac line.

[Train_Glunkr]

According to the Apple Store, both the "Good" and "Best" have an ATI Radeon 2600 HD PRO 256MB.

[Lorre]

RAM upgrade prices qot a lot friendlier too.

800MHz RAM, does that mean these get desktop processors?

[Franck]

These look like nice updates. And the Swedish prices have also been adjusted in the right direction.



Yeah ! Euro-prices are down accordingly (200-300€ across the line). That's good news.;)

[NOFEER]

how hard is it to upgrade ram in the new imacs??
what are the criteria for edu discount
i plan on getting 2 for my kids for school (elementary school)
this might be a tougher question
what's the predicted life of these, namely will they be good enough for say 4-6 years--elementary school level? and wouldn't the base 2.4ghz be adequate or should i spend the extra for more processor??
do you think there will be a speed bump for the fall school session??
thanks

[Lorre]

how hard is it to upgrade ram in the new imacs??
what are the criteria for edu discount
i plan on getting 2 for my kids for school (elementary school)
this might be a tougher question
what's the predicted life of these, namely will they be good enough for say 4-6 years--elementary school level? and wouldn't the base 2.4ghz be adequate or should i spend the extra for more processor??
do you think there will be a speed bump for the fall school session??
thanks

For elementary school, this is more than fast enough to last you about 5 years I'd say, that is if your kids don't want to play a lot of games on these. No need to get the more expensive models. You should get 2GB of RAM though. To replace this ram, you need to loosen 1(one) screw.
Speed bump before fall is possible, I'd say 60% chance they upgrade it once more before September, if you can hold out till November or so, I'd wait.

[ascii]

No glossy/matte screen choice. Customer feedback not reaching engineers.

[posner]

how hard is it to upgrade ram in the new imacs??
what are the criteria for edu discount
i plan on getting 2 for my kids for school (elementary school)
this might be a tougher question
what's the predicted life of these, namely will they be good enough for say 4-6 years--elementary school level? and wouldn't the base 2.4ghz be adequate or should i spend the extra for more processor??
do you think there will be a speed bump for the fall school session??
thanks

I think you'll be fine for 5+ years even with the base model. Our first iMac (2000; 400mhz g3) lasted 6 years with our two kids (through elementary school), with updates to RAM and external HD along the way. Our current iMac (Sep06 update) should be fine for all required schoolwork through high school (another 3-5yrs from now).

The tasks most likely to tax an aging iMac are heavy photo and video editing and storage. Fortunately those tasks are not common in elementary school. The three systems most relevant to these tasks are video RAM, system memory, and hard drive space. Video RAM is tough to update later, so that is the one place where I'd encourage you to max out upon purchase from Apple to increase longevity. Otherwise, prices for both system memory and hard drive storage will continue to drop dramatically in the next few years, so consider going with the base levels of those now and upgrading when you actually need the higher capacity (when prices will be lower). For example, we opted for the 250GB HD in 2006 instead of paying an extra $100+ for 500GB. Next year, when we'll finally start filling that 250GB HD, I should be able to buy an external 750GB HD for about $100 (tripling the storage we get for that $100). Same basic story for system RAM, which is very easy to install on your own and available cheaply through 3rd parties. Of course if you have the cash you won't regret buying a maxed-out system right now, but it'd likely be overkill for now and may delay a future update. Have fun!

edit: I agree with Lorre that upgrading to 2GB RAM right away is probably a good move. Apple charges $100, but you can do better with 3rd party suppliers.

[wtbard]

No glossy/matte screen choice. Customer feedback not reaching engineers.

Are all of the new ones just glossy? Weren't some of the previous version matte? (I may be confusing the iMac with the MacBook Pro) My big complaint with the glossy is I see things behind me which is distracting.

[wizard69]

how hard is it to upgrade ram in the new imacs??
what are the criteria for edu discount

Last I knew registration in a college

i plan on getting 2 for my kids for school (elementary school)

That is nice all I ever got was hand me down socks!

this might be a tougher question
what's the predicted life of these, namely will they be good enough for say 4-6 years--elementary school level?

Well that depends on where your kids are grade wise. 4 years shouldn't be to bad 6 is another matter especially if they are older.

and wouldn't the base 2.4ghz be adequate or should i spend the extra for more processor??
[quote]
If you are buying for long term get the fastest processor you can afford.
[quote]
do you think there will be a speed bump for the fall school session??
thanks

I doubt it as this release really is for the school buying season. Plus there is the question of just what is in this hardware release processor wise. It sounds like Apple maxed out Intels laptop offerings.

Dave

[Ireland]

Putting a huge sign on their homepage is hardly quietly refreshing the iMac. It's saying; "look at our new stuff!"

Aside from Steve doing an event this is the next biggest thing they could do. Using my iPhone now while I wait for a week for my iMac to come back with a new display. Damn burn-in.

[BenRoethig]

Well, at least I know what's replacing by rev. A aluminum iMac either this fall or next spring.

[Zenga]

These look like nice updates. And the Swedish prices have also been adjusted in the right direction.
It's interesting to see that the new 3.06 with wireless keyboard/mouse and 750GB HD is about 20% cheaper than my 24" white iMac with 2.33 GHz, 2 GB memory, wireless keyboard/mouse and the better graphics card was when I bought it two years ago. I guess the value of the dollar also "works in our favour".....

Maybe it's time to upgrade from the white iMac..... but on the other hand I'm still hoping they will introduce a 30" model....

buy a 50" bravia and attach a mac mini to it!

:lol:

[Zenga]

No glossy/matte screen choice. Customer feedback not reaching engineers.

aye!
:smokey:

[ascii]

Are all of the new ones just glossy? Weren't some of the previous version matte? (I may be confusing the iMac with the MacBook Pro) My big complaint with the glossy is I see things behind me which is distracting.

Yes, you are thinking of the MacBook Pro. There is a choice of screen on that but not the iMac.

[Obi-Wan Kubrick]

Hi all this is my first post here. I have been checking this site almost daily for around a year so I figure I should post here. This refresh looks pretty good. But I still wont be repalcing my iMac G5 with isight.

[roehlstation]

No glossy/matte screen choice. Customer feedback not reaching engineers.

Just take the glass off the front. and you have matte finish.

[Akanbe]

No glossy/matte screen choice. Customer feedback not reaching engineers.

Yeppers. I wonder if the 20" is still the same screen with the uneven brightness and other problems?

[posner]

Last I knew registration in a college

[quote]
and wouldn't the base 2.4ghz be adequate or should i spend the extra for more processor??
[quote]
If you are buying for long term get the fastest processor you can afford.

Dave

Processor speed definitely helps, but here is where you can quickly get routed up the price chart because Apple bundles faster processors with slightly upgraded features across the line -- so in the 20" line, $300 gets you an extra .266GHz speed (~11% increase), but also 1GB RAM, 70GB HD and a slightly better video card. To get any faster, you pay $300 to buy another .134GHz speed (~6% increase) but must move up to 24" monitor. So yes, more speed is great, but you quickly start paying for lots of other stuff that you might not want or that will certainly be cheaper to buy separately later (RAM, HD). Even the base model should be fine for elementary school work for 5+ years. If one of them gets really into processor-intensive multimedia, then you'll be in better shape to spring for whatever Apple is selling 5yrs from now.

[wizard69]

The tasks most likely to tax an aging iMac are heavy photo and video editing and storage. Fortunately those tasks are not common in elementary school.

Well you hope not do realize that the usage of computers in schools has changed and will continue to change. While I don't know the age group we are talking about here it is not to difficult to imagine a kid taking a photography class or having a video project to deal with. Even with these though you will not tax the iMac that much.


I liked your arguments about RAM and memory, but in my mind your suggestion to go low end with Apple hardware is a bit off base. You go up a model or two not for the RAM and disk space offered, which as you point out gets cheaper every year, but for the processor speed. Like video RAM not easy to update so it pays to get the faster machine if you expect to have it around for the long haul.

The question of course for this specific issue is just how fast will software and the users outgrow the processor speed of a base unit. The problem is you can't predict when or how that will happen, but you can give your self as much breathing room as possible. As an example some time ago I built up a Linux machine which I thought was a pretty good value even if the processor was modest. That Linux box worked pretty good through (1) one upgrade of the OS after which it was noticeably under powered.

Now I'm not trying to say that Apple will evolve it OS in a way that will outstrip the ability of todays processors to deliver good performance in 4 years. Just that you don't really know what will happen and the difference between the slowest and fastest processor 4 to 6 years down the road could be significant. Considering you can't normally upgrade an iMacs processor it is something to think about.

Dave

[wizard69]

Guys I think this is one of the best updates Apple has produced in a long long time. If it wasn't for just buying a Mac Book Pro I think I'd be in line for one right now.

There is already some speculation that this might be Montevina, due to the bus speeds and clock rates. Not sure if that is the case or not but either way this is more than just a modest update. Appel should really be able to drive a lot of sales with this revision for the next 6 months or so.

Dave

[Obi-Wan Kubrick]

today I ordered my new iMac 24" 2.4ghz with 2gb of ram and got the wireless keyboard and mouse.

I am wondering if apple updates the iMacs can I send mine in becuase I probably won't get mine for 3-5 days and the updates would come on Tuesday.

If I can send it I'm what do I have to do and how can I do it.

Also if they changes the ram to 2gb standard do I get 100 back because I updated it

Please help
I am assuming you come to this site often. So why would you order an iMac if you knew a refresh was coming?

[shanmugam]

where we can find all these CPUs in intel site?

all of them seems to be special order from Apple to intel...

these are desktop cpus or next generation notebook cpus.

good upgrades!

[backtomac]

Is it me or are the chips in this refresh from the Montevina platform?

If so looks like Apple got them a bit early.

[json]

buy a 50" bravia and attach a mac mini to it!

:lol:

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Bring on the 3.06 GHz, 750GB HD, nVidia 8800 Mini and I will remodel the bedroom to make room for the Bravia!
And oh yeah, a better yen exchange rate too please.

[ros3ntan]

today I ordered my new iMac 24" 2.4ghz with 2gb of ram and got the wireless keyboard and mouse.

I am wondering if apple updates the iMacs can I send mine in becuase I probably won't get mine for 3-5 days and the updates would come on Tuesday.

If I can send it I'm what do I have to do and how can I do it.

Also if they changes the ram to 2gb standard do I get 100 back because I updated it

Please help

call them and tell them your problem. Customer is always right

[jragosta]

Just take the glass off the front. and you have matte finish.

Or use steel wool.

[RoamingGnome]

Is it me or are the chips in this refresh from the Montevina platform?

If so looks like Apple got them a bit early.

Yeah, I highly doubt Apple is shipping desktop processors - that would be too good in terms of cost/performance. I bet this is PC6400 200-PIN RAM don't get your hopes up for desktop RAM, we'd be at a 1.33GHz BUS for both the processor and the RAM.

[cutigerinva]

So are these Montevina chips?

[solipsism]

What are the model numbers of these chips. A cursory looks suggests Penryn's lower power consumption—and thus subsequent heat output—allowed Apple to use desktop-grade C2Ds in the iMac. This would allow for a better bump in speed and slightly lower price of the chip.

[posner]

Well you hope not do realize that the usage of computers in schools has changed and will continue to change. While I don't know the age group we are talking about here it is not to difficult to imagine a kid taking a photography class or having a video project to deal with. Even with these though you will not tax the iMac that much.


I liked your arguments about RAM and memory, but in my mind your suggestion to go low end with Apple hardware is a bit off base. You go up a model or two not for the RAM and disk space offered, which as you point out gets cheaper every year, but for the processor speed. Like video RAM not easy to update so it pays to get the faster machine if you expect to have it around for the long haul.

The question of course for this specific issue is just how fast will software and the users outgrow the processor speed of a base unit. The problem is you can't predict when or how that will happen, but you can give your self as much breathing room as possible. As an example some time ago I built up a Linux machine which I thought was a pretty good value even if the processor was modest. That Linux box worked pretty good through (1) one upgrade of the OS after which it was noticeably under powered.

Now I'm not trying to say that Apple will evolve it OS in a way that will outstrip the ability of todays processors to deliver good performance in 4 years. Just that you don't really know what will happen and the difference between the slowest and fastest processor 4 to 6 years down the road could be significant. Considering you can't normally upgrade an iMacs processor it is something to think about.

Dave

The original poster's question was about kids who will be in elementary school over the next 5 years. My 6th grader is currently having a great time playing with Final Cut Express on our 2yr old iMac -- far beyond anything required by his school. I realize schools are going more multimedia, but I'm confident today's base iMac will handle anything required of elementary kids over the next 5yrs. So here's my bottom line: if money is no object, by all means get the fastest possible beast ($2199 for the 3.06GHz with all the extras). But the base model ($1199) will likely be MORE than enough for young kids for several years. In 4 years, you can then take that $1000 you saved (perhaps doubled or tripled if invested in AAPL!) and buy something that will be far more powerful than the maxed-out system you could buy right now.

(I realize I'm not talking about gaming issues, but the poster was asking about schoolwork. If you want to run the hottest games at the highest speeds, then you'll absolutely benefit from the maxed-out system.)

[markroder]

Any idea why Apple did not bump the Mini? Do you think it will come in the next few weeks, or will they slip it into WMDC? (surely they have better announcements to make?) .....

Any news or speculation welcomed!

[gastroboy]

Shame about there being no non-glossy option, that rules it out for me as a designer.

Australian/US prices (Both ex tax US$ @ A$ = conservative US $0.93.5. The A$ has reached US $0.95.6 last week which should make Australian prices 2.2% cheaper again)

Model / Aus Price / USA Price / Markup

20" 2.4Ghz / US$ 1,554.69 / US$ 1,199.00 / 29.7%

20" 2.4Ghz / US$ 1,943.61 / US$ 1,499.00 / 29.7%

24" 2.8Ghz / US$ 2,332.53 / US$ 1,799.00 / 29.7%*

24" 3.0Ghz / US$ 2,915.90 / US$ 1,999.00 / 45.9%

4 Gb RAM / US$ 291.68 / US$ 200.00 / 45.8%

750 Gb HD / US$ 145.84 / US$100.00 / 45.8%

1 Tb HD / US$ 359.75 / US$150.00 / 139.8% * Street price Ext HD US$ 289.75

W/L Mouse / US$ 29.17 / US$20.00 / 45.8%

W/l Keybd / US$ 38.89 / US$30.00 / 29.7%

Applecare / US$ 260.57 / US$169.00 / 54.2%

Interesting is the 2 tier pricing and the "Super Luxury Tax" Apple charges on certain extras such as the top speed, largest HD & Applecare. Are they trying to discourage Australian users from these models? I just got a 1.5 Tb WD My Book Pro II with FW 400, FW 800 & USB 2 & Raid for US$ 387.95 ex tax, a shade more than their "Upgrade" to a 1 Tb standard HD.

Long Live the Australian/USA Free Trade Agreement.

* The refurbished white non glossy 24" iMac 2.Ghz is looking a steal at US $1,199. A shame they are no longer available in Australia.

[solipsism]

It does look like Apple has gotten the Montevina chips ahead of schedule and before everyone else. I was waiting for this to get an older iMac but I think I'll go with a new one since it's Montevina.


• X9100 (3.06 GHz, 6MB L2 1066MHz FSB, 44W TDP) — $851 [May 2008 Release Date]
• 9600 (2.8 GHz, 6MB, 1066 FSB, 35W TDP) — $530 [May 2008 Release Date]
• ?????? (2.6 GHz, 6MB, 1066 FSB 25W TDP) — $???
• SP9400 (2.4 GHz, 6MB, 1066 FSB, 25W TDP) — $316 [May 2008 Release Date]

PS: Any help with confirmation and of the 2.66 GHz chip used would be great.

[JeffDM]

Just take the glass off the front. and you have matte finish.

I think that kind of makes it silly to put the glass on in the first place, worst of both worlds. You get the reflection of the glass and the diffused light too on the angles you don't have glare.

[Lemon Bon Bon.]

This, short of the uber Nehalem release of early '09 is the one for me.

I'm buying this. 8+ years. I've had enough wit the waiting.

It's got the psychological 3 gig.

And.

It's got the 512 meg card. Just shy of the GT's performance. I'll take that bet...

I guess 'heat' or 'cheapo' reasons came to the fore...re not the GT. But hey, the GS is offering twice + the bench of the Pro. So. No arguments there.

But...having looked at the benches...it's not a bad card at all. Well, in a 1 and a half inch closure. That aint too bad.

And a 24 inch screen. Take that away. - £400 and you've got a £900 PC. Dual core 3 gig. 512 megs gpu card. 2 gigs of ram and a 1/2 terra byte HD. That'll do. How much porn can you store on yer HD anyhow? :I

You'd be hard pressed to find a better deal at PC World...

Yep. As long as I can do my pre-vis and play a game of City of Heroes in Boot Camp...

Yeah.

I'm off to Gordy's...

Lemon Bon Bon.

[Lemon Bon Bon.]

It's a good deal.

Lemon Bon Bon. :)

[Lemon Bon Bon.]

Well. For Apple. ;)

Lemon Bon Bon.

[Abster2core]

The original poster's question was about kids who will be in elementary school over the next 5 years. My 6th grader is currently having a great time playing with Final Cut Express on our 2yr old iMac -- far beyond anything required by his school. I realize schools are going more multimedia, but I'm confident today's base iMac will handle anything required of elementary kids over the next 5yrs. So here's my bottom line: if money is no object, by all means get the fastest possible beast ($2199 for the 3.06GHz with all the extras). But the base model ($1199) will likely be MORE than enough for young kids for several years. In 4 years, you can then take that $1000 you saved (perhaps doubled or tripled if invested in AAPL!) and buy something that will be far more powerful than the maxed-out system you could buy right now.

(I realize I'm not talking about gaming issues, but the poster was asking about schoolwork. If you want to run the hottest games at the highest speeds, then you'll absolutely benefit from the maxed-out system.)

Agree in part.

One child is only 4 and the other 6. Going for two or even one high end for the oldest seems overkill. Doubt that they would appreciate the difference right now.

Even going for extra RAM is questionable. Remember this (as asked by NOFEER) was for school use, i.e., grades pre-school/1 to 3/5, not for gaming.

I would suggest getting one of the Britannica Encyclopedia Suites for the difference. It will have more value for a heck of a lot longer than will the two Macs together, and they will have something to read when the power fails.

[elroth]

The new memory upgrade is actually $200 to go from 2GB to 4GB. And it's 800 GHz memory instead of the previous generation's 667. That's not bad at all.

I like this upgrade a lot, and I'm glad I waited. It's going to be like a rocket compared to my 1.8GHz original iMac G5.

[Stormchild]

Yeah wow, I never would have noticed the new iMac announcement, what with Apple being so "quiet" about it. No mention of it anywhere on the Apple website.

http://www.stormchild.net/misc/screens/imac_lineup_quietly_refreshed.jpg

[solipsism]

So are these Montevina chips?


YES THEY ARE. Intel is once again giving Apple special preference and giving them the chip not just before everyone else, but also before the official release date scheduled for next month. It's a good time to be a Mac user.

PS: Any assistance on the model number for the 2.66 GHz chip would be great.
PPS: Anyone still think Apple is going to dump Intel for P.A. Semi made PPCs?

[RoamingGnome]

YES THEY ARE. Intel is once again giving Apple special preference and giving them the chip not just before everyone else, but also before the official release date scheduled for next month. It's a good time to be a Mac user.

PS: Any assistance on the model number for the 2.66 GHz chip would be great.
PPS: Anyone still think Apple is going to dump Intel for P.A. Semi made PPCs?

lol, Intel is trying to court apple by giving them preferential treatment

[Stormchild]

The new memory upgrade is actually $200 to go from 2GB to 4GB. And it's 800 GHz memory instead of the previous generation's 667. That's not bad at all.

Actually, that's still way overpriced. You can get a full 4 GB of the exact same memory for under $100 elsewhere (and by the way it's 800 MHz, not GHz). Try checking the prices for 4 GB of 800 MHz DDR2 memory at Dealram (http://dealnews.com/memory/prices/PC2-6400-DDR2-800-MHz/64/2GBx2.html). Never buy RAM or HD upgrades from Apple.

[Johnny Mozzarella]

Shame about there being no non-glossy option, that rules it out for me as a designer.

Griffin or some other third party company should create a matching hood and anti-glare film for the iMac to reduce glare from lights and make it more usable by graphics professionals.

It looks like they aren't using the cheaper display anymore. They are claiming "Millions of colors at all resolutions" for both models.

[gastroboy]

lol, Intel is trying to court apple by giving them preferential treatment

Maybe they are giving Apple pre-release chips so that Mac users can help them debug the chips? :wow:

[JeffDM]

Actually, that's still way overpriced. You can get a full 4 GB of the exact same memory for under $100 elsewhere (and by the way it's 800 MHz, not GHz). Try checking the prices for 4 GB of 800 MHz DDR2 memory at Dealram (http://dealnews.com/memory/prices/PC2-6400-DDR2-800-MHz/64/2GBx2.html). Never buy RAM or HD upgrades from Apple.

That doesn't give you the price for the SODIMMS though.

I too thought the line at the bottom of the story was a bit silly:

Apple is also now offering more reasonable pricing for iMac memory upgrades, with an upgrade from 1GB to 2GB costing $100, and an upgrade from 2GB to 4GB fetching just $300.

More reasonable being in terms of previous pricing and not in comparison to what you might be able to buy the same kind of memory from what might be the same supplier. As it is, the Apple upgrade price is still 3x that of buying the memory upgrade outright.

[acepernich@dlm.com]

... is finally gone.

[solipsism]

lol, Intel is trying to court apple by giving them preferential treatment

Symbiotic relationship. Apple gets to feel special and Intel gets the free press associated with Apple's elite machines showcasing their new chips.

[gastroboy]

More reasonable being in terms of previous pricing and not in comparison to what you might be able to buy the same kind of memory from what might be the same supplier. As it is, the Apple upgrade price is still 3x that of buying the memory outright.

Fair enough but Apple is not just selling you the RAM they are installing and presumably testing it as well.

Not a big deal, especially if it is being done in the assembly line.

I have never, ever had Apple install either a Hard Drive, optical Drive or RAM. I try to picture the lazy/slow witted/gullible/fearful/overpaid users who think it is a good idea for Apple to install simple upgrades for them.

[JeffDM]

Yeah wow, I never would have noticed the new iMac announcement, what with Apple being so "quiet" about it. No mention of it anywhere on the Apple website.

That wasn't there when the new iMacs were posted to the web store. I think the delay was several hours.

[JeffDM]

Fair enough but Apple is not just selling you the RAM they are installing and presumably testing it as well.

Not a big deal, especially if it is being done in the assembly line.

I doubt it's anywhere nearly that expensive to test or upgrade memory, especially give that the cost difference is enough for more than an entire ipod nano.

I don't doubt that there are those that will pay it, but I really don't think they are getting their money's worth on the upgrade.

[solipsism]

I try to picture the lazy/slow witted/gullible/fearful/overpaid users who think it is a good idea for Apple to install simple upgrades for them.
I think it's a great idea for a large majority of the Mac community. Not for me or people on this forum, but for the time poor/non-technical users who would rather have the encompassing warranty of the Apple factory install than having to save a $100 buying looking on online for a cheap electronics seller, then either reading countless reviews or just making a purchase without knowing the quality or legitimacy of the online store when they give their CC info over, and then figuring out how to install it correctly. What may be the right for you and me isn't necessarily the right choice for everyone.

[solipsism]

I don't doubt that there are those that will pay it, but I really don't think they are getting their money's worth on the upgrade.

Peace of mind is a powerful selling point. So is simplicity.

[gastroboy]

I doubt it's anywhere nearly that expensive to test or upgrade memory, especially give that the cost difference is enough for more than an entire ipod nano.

I don't doubt that there are those that will pay it, but I really don't think they are getting their money's worth on the upgrade.

Anyone care to do a cross comparison to what Dell charges for their "upgrades?

I always have trouble getting onto their US website, it redirects to the local one.

This is one point PC users do win. Apple does gouge on extras. In Australia it goes well beyond just gouging, it eviscerates.

[markoh]

That doesn't give you the price for the SODIMMS though.

I too thought the line at the bottom of the story was a bit silly:

More reasonable being in terms of previous pricing and not in comparison to what you might be able to buy the same kind of memory from what might be the same supplier. As it is, the Apple upgrade price is still 3x that of buying the memory upgrade outright.

More like 7x. I just bought a 2GB module for an iMac for $33 from Newegg. Shipping was a couple of dollars.

[solipsism]

I think it was a mistake to not add a Blu ray reader. In a year's time, not having a Blu ray reader will be like not having a DVD reader today. i.e. a major problem.
I don't think so. Blu-ray is still a footnote to DVD and the cost os still too high. There are still some technological changes that have to happen on the Mac platform before Blu-ray can be added across the line.

I guess Apple does keep it's employees in the dark...
Every now and then you'll meet an Apple Store sales clerk who reads these forums, but not often. They, like most people, are not technical and have lives that don't revolve around the latest tech releases. They certainly wouldn't be the fist place I'd look for rumours.

[JeffDM]

Peace of mind is a powerful selling point. So is simplicity.

If someone thinks that $800/hr is a good rate to pay for that, then so be it. I know some people are really bad and might ruin more than that in an hour, but it's not that hard. I think the instructions are even in the manual.

[Abster2core]

Australian/US prices (Both ex tax US$ @ A$ = conservative US $0.93.5. The A$ has reached US $0.95.6 last week which should make Australian prices 2.2% cheaper again)

Model / Aus Price / USA Price / Markup
24" 3.0Ghz / US$ 2,915.90 / US$ 1,999.00 / 45.9%

Am I missing something here?

The base price for a 24" 3Ghz in the US is $2199. The listed price in Australia is $2726 ($2554 US)

Is there not a 5% (Australian) custom tariff on goods over $1000 plus shipping and insurance included in the list price? If so, the difference drops from $255 US to $30 ($110 customs plus shipping and insurance $110) The GST is extra.

[melgross]

No glossy/matte screen choice. Customer feedback not reaching engineers.This has nothing to do with the engineers. It's a decision made at the top management level— Jobs and Ives.

[solipsism]

So.... what does Montevina have over Santa Rosa?• WiMAX?(which won't be enabled on the iMac)
• Hardware H.2.64 decoding
• Lower power usage (not a big selling point in a desktop)
• Smaller chip and subsequent MoBo
• Blu-ray HDCP support on chip
• Can use Integrated GPU for Blu-ray playback
• Robson 2.0 (2nd version of Turbo memory)
• DDR3 Ram
• Intel GMA X4500 (3 versions)
Is that correct?


So, to all the people cursing Apple for not releasing the Santa Rosa/Penryn iMac. is this a welcome upgrade that Apple jumped to Montevina/Penryn before Intel even officially releases the chip? Or is there other things ot complain about?

[NasserAE]

I remember I've seen a clear cover that covert your glossy iMac and MacBook display to matte! I just can't find it now.

[solipsism]

Anyone care to do a cross comparison to what Dell charges for their "upgrades?
Dell currently charges $50 per additional GB of RAM.

If someone thinks that $800/hr is a good rate to pay for that, then so be it.
Where do you get $800/hr? It's $100 per GB which is a huge time saver, keeps the average person from getting screwed on price by the average online website, and gives then them the peace of mind of an encompassing warranty.

You don't seem to understand that the average person doesn't know the RAM from the HDD from the CPU. If I were to walk into any computer repair/upgrade shop I will be paying about the same and perhaps more money than Apple charges for the RAM upgrade.... and I'd have to physically bring the machine in, which is a chore.

I don't take my cars to auto repair shops because I can do the work myself. I also don't need warranties and thus don't waste money on new cars because I can do the work myself. That isn't a luxury most people have because most people know how to drive cars but haven't a clue about them past filling up the gas tank. And the technical people on this forum does not represent thea average Mac user, especially since it's popularity has increased.

[Flounder]

This, short of the uber Nehalem release of early '09 is the one for me.

I'm buying this. 8+ years. I've had enough wit the waiting.

It's got the psychological 3 gig.

And.

It's got the 512 meg card. Just shy of the GT's performance. I'll take that bet...

I guess 'heat' or 'cheapo' reasons came to the fore...re not the GT. But hey, the GS is offering twice + the bench of the Pro. So. No arguments there.

But...having looked at the benches...it's not a bad card at all. Well, in a 1 and a half inch closure. That aint too bad.

And a 24 inch screen. Take that away. - £400 and you've got a £900 PC. Dual core 3 gig. 512 megs gpu card. 2 gigs of ram and a 1/2 terra byte HD. That'll do. How much porn can you store on yer HD anyhow? :I

You'd be hard pressed to find a better deal at PC World...

Yep. As long as I can do my pre-vis and play a game of City of Heroes in Boot Camp...

Yeah.

I'm off to Gordy's...

Lemon Bon Bon.

You're really doing it LBB? I never thought I'd see the day! If so, congratulations :D

[melgross]

YES THEY ARE. Intel is once again giving Apple special preference and giving them the chip not just before everyone else, but also before the official release date scheduled for next month. It's a good time to be a Mac user.

PS: Any assistance on the model number for the 2.66 GHz chip would be great.
PPS: Anyone still think Apple is going to dump Intel for P.A. Semi made PPCs?

That's what it looks like. It's also why I keep saying that we may see Nehalem announced at the ADC for the Mac Pro. I do hope so!

I think that this would be the third time Intel has done this for Apple.

[Abster2core]

Griffin or some other third party company should create a matching hood and anti-glare film for the iMac to reduce glare from lights and make it more usable by graphics professionals.

Power Support and Photodon offer anti-glare films that can be quickly added or removed to suit the situation.

[zinfella]

You're preaching to the choir there.

But I'll let Mel come by and explain himself.

I didn't see anything to indicate that the display has been upgraded, and if not, we still get the uneven lighting and color across the screen. :\

Quick, somebody go buy a 24" model, and tell me that the problem is gone! ;)

[melgross]

Maybe they are giving Apple pre-release chips so that Mac users can help them debug the chips? :wow:

Very funny.

[gastroboy]

Am I missing something here?

Yes, for a start you have the conversion around the wrong way, you divide by 0.935.

The base price for a 24" 3Ghz in the US is $2199. The listed price in Australia is $2726 ($2554 US)

Is there not a 5% (Australian) custom tariff on goods over $1000 plus shipping and insurance included in the list price? If so, the difference drops from $255 US to $30 ($110 customs plus shipping and insurance $110) The GST is extra.

There is an Australian/USA Free trade agreement in place. To my knowledge there is no customs tariff.

As the goods are ex China and Australian ports are closer to Chinese ports than even the US west coast, I fail to see where there are extra costs involved.

There will be insurance on USA shipments as well so your calculation is double dipping.

The GST has been removed from the calculation to square up the comparison, as the US Apple site does not include USA taxes.

If there is a pro-rata extra cost in freight and insurance that does not explain the radically different price markups for the higher end products and extras. Freight actually wouldn't vary as in most cases the weight of different RAM or HD would not change and the box is the same size.

This is Apple charging whatever it feels it can get away with and shifting profits away from Australia and back to the USA head office. Our previous government was complicit in writing soft laws that prevent parallel or grey marketing of imports to prevent this sort of exploitation.

The so called FTA with the States has opened us up to the kind of abuse that Canada has suffered, where our competitive products are blocked in the US market, whilst the USA does whatever it wants in ours.

With friends like this...

[drjjones]

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Bring on the 3.06 GHz, 750GB HD, nVidia 8800 Mini and I will remodel the bedroom to make room for the Bravia!
And oh yeah, a better yen exchange rate too please.

OOO.. sounds so nice .. might do one myself ,, great idea :smokey:

[addicted44]

This has nothing to do with the engineers. It's a decision made at the top management level— Jobs and Ives.

For most consumers glossy is the best option. Consumers are more likely to watch movies, etc than anything else on their computers. Also, unlike laptops, you wont be lugging your imac out in the sun anytime soon, so there really is no incentive for the additional complexity of adding a matte screen option.

On the other hand, professional designers, or people in graphic related jobs cannot buy the imac. But that is what the mac PRO is for...

In sum, I think its a reasonable decision to offer the matte option on the macbook pro and allow people to attach a monitor of their choosing to the mac pro, and leave the consumer options all glossy.

[ascii]

I think it was a mistake to not add a Blu ray reader. In a year's time, not having a Blu ray reader will be like not having a DVD reader today. i.e. a major problem.

[KernalROM]

Well, i just got off the phone with the Fresno Apple Store and asked the guy when the new iMac's were going to be available to buy....

He said "New iMacs??? When did this happen"

He checked with his manager and was backfilled on the new iMacs..

He said they should be in the shipment today and they will be setting out display models tonight.

This actually lends credit to when I called them on Saturday asking if there was a refresh on Tuesday and the store employee said she had heard nothing..

I guess Apple does keep it's employees in the dark...

Bryan

[gastroboy]

For most consumers glossy is the best option. Consumers are more likely to watch movies, etc than anything else on their computers. Also, unlike laptops, you wont be lugging your imac out in the sun anytime soon, so there really is no incentive for the additional complexity of adding a matte screen option.

On the other hand, professional designers, or people in graphic related jobs cannot buy the imac. But that is what the mac PRO is for...

In sum, I think its a reasonable decision to offer the matte option on the macbook pro and allow people to attach a monitor of their choosing to the mac pro, and leave the consumer options all glossy.

1. Consumers also suffer from reflections, the fact they don't recognise what the problem is is irrelevant. As is the spurious suggestion that they are the ones who will be watching movies (video editors anyone?) not web browsing, or trying to read text documents and emails through the reflections.

2. How does NOT putting the glass on which is an extra, adds to the weight and complexity of fittings etc make for "additional complexity"?

3. How come it is possible to choose screens on the MacBook following your logic?

I gave a local costing on the iMacs, it might interest you to know that the already heavy pricing on Mac Pros is increased an additional 38.9% in Australia*. Not that that is relevant if it constitutes a hardware combination the customer does not want.

It is like saying if you don't like the obstructive sunshades in your VW Golf, which obscure your view, you can always buy a Rolls Royce.

* I corrected this after recalculating the latest figures on the Australian Apple website. Apple used to overcharge a whopping 67% on a fully configured Mac Pro. Now it is a uniform 38.9% right up the line. Still way too much.

[backtomac]

For most consumers glossy is the best option. Consumers are more likely to watch movies, etc than anything else on their computers. Also, unlike laptops, you wont be lugging your imac out in the sun anytime soon, so there really is no incentive for the additional complexity of adding a matte screen option.

On the other hand, professional designers, or people in graphic related jobs cannot buy the imac. But that is what the mac PRO is for...

In sum, I think its a reasonable decision to offer the matte option on the macbook pro and allow people to attach a monitor of their choosing to the mac pro, and leave the consumer options all glossy.

You're preaching to the choir there.

But I'll let Mel come by and explain himself.

[JeffDM]

Where do you get $800/hr? It's $100 per GB which is a huge time saver, keeps the average person from getting screwed on price by the average online website, and gives then them the peace of mind of an encompassing warranty.

I thought the price of the upgrade was $300, but still, it's a lot.

The cost of 4GB SO-DIMM outright from a reputable retail company is less than $100. Maybe the original 2GB is $50, so you have a $150 difference because the additional cost to Apple for the bigger memory can't be much more than $50. It doesn't take 15 minutes to install the memory and handle the paperwork too. So that's $600 an hour, assuming a fairly pedestrian installation time.

[JeffDM]

So.... what does Montevina have over Santa Rosa?


• WiMAX?(which won't be enabled on the iMac)
• Hardware H.2.64 decoding
• Lower power usage (not a big selling point in a desktop)
• Smaller chip and subsequent MoBo
• Blu-ray HDCP support on chip
• Can use Integrated GPU for Blu-ray playback
• Robson 2.0 (2nd version of Turbo memory)
• DDR3 Ram
• Intel GMA X4500 (3 versions)
Is that correct?


So, to all the people cursing Apple for not releasing the Santa Rosa/Penryn iMac. is this a welcome upgrade that Apple jumped to Montevina/Penryn before Intel even officially releases the chip? Or is there other things ot complain about?

I don't think the Penryn was much of an update anyway, its biggest benefit is power consumption (not much there either), the increased speed was negligible at best.

Robson's not much of a bullet point either.

[mgkwho]

Putting a huge sign on their homepage is hardly quietly refreshing the iMac. It's saying; "look at our new stuff!"

Aside from Steve doing an event this is the next biggest thing they could do. Using my iPhone now while I wait for a week for my iMac to come back with a new display. Damn burn-in.

Yeah wow, I never would have noticed the new iMac announcement, what with Apple being so "quiet" about it. No mention of it anywhere on the Apple website.

I totally agree. They have a press release and everything. The only thing they are missing is a press event, but it is simply a hardware refresh.

So the recent macbook updates must have been quiet too, right AI?

How about you change the title to be a little more accurate? kthx

-=|Mgkwho

[c64]

I'm not going to play games is it worth it or just get the referb 24" for $1399?

[JeffDM]

I'm not going to play games is it worth it or just get the referb 24" for $1399?

Yes. I was tempted. It's a good machine. But for my circumstances, I really need to put the money to other use, I don't really need a new computer.

[c64]

Yes. I was tempted. It's a good machine. But for my circumstances, I really need to put the money to other use, I don't really need a new computer.


I'm not going to play games or burn movies.I'll willuse for itunes,internet,photo's and maybe some home movie editing.I would like to know if I would benefit with 8800 gs other than gaming?

[zinfella]

I'm not going to play games is it worth it or just get the referb 24" for $1399?


That's a call only you can make. But, the new models will also be sold as refurbs eventually, although probably not at that price until another model upgrade approaches.

IMO, the new models are a better buy, faster processor, faster RAM, faster video card, faster optical drive, YMMV. ;)

[JeffDM]

How about you change the title to be a little more accurate?

They need to update the title, but that doesn't mean AI writers need to go back to elementary school over this little thing. The Apple front page was still giving top billing to the iPhone SDK for at least two hours after the iMac was updated in the Apple store. So it was correct at the time the story was posted.

[JeffDM]

I'm not going to play games or burn movies.I'll willuse for itunes,internet,photo's and maybe some home movie editing.I would like to know if I would benefit with 8800 gs other than gaming?

I don't think you need the 8800 at all for your use.

[zinfella]

I don't think you need the 8800 at all for your use.

IMO, it's a need vs want situation. The 8800 will out perform, but only the buyer can say if it's worth the extra bucks to HIM.

[JakeTheRock]

Kinda funny, my school just bought brand new 24" iMacs a week or two ago...

[JeffDM]

IMO, it's a need vs want situation. The 8800 will out perform, but only the buyer can say if it's worth the extra bucks to HIM.

True, but he already said he doesn't play games, which is about the only significant benefit, one that I don't see worth paying the extra $1000 for the stated uses. Even for core image / core video stuff, the 8800 isn't a very good performer compared to lesser chips.

[KamiNoYadoru]

If the conventions of the 2600 in the last generation hold, is the thinking that they've got an 8800M GT in there, downclocked? I'm really curious what the video card situation is going to be with this model, because there's not a mobile version of the 8800 GS that I'm aware of and I think we're all pretty certain that there's not a desktop GPU in there. If they put in an 8700M GT then they can fuck right off.

[JakeTheRock]

I'm not going to play games or burn movies.I'll willuse for itunes,internet,photo's and maybe some home movie editing.I would like to know if I would benefit with 8800 gs other than gaming?

For that, i would say buy the Mac Mini, put 2 gigs of RAM in it and a bigger hard drive, and buy an external monitor. On the tasks you mentioned, you won't notice a speed differeenc, especially for browins the web or internet. Home movie editing, in iMovie, runs very well on the Mac Mini, and i have done hours of video on it. Just make sure you get a big hard drive, weather internal or external.

[troberts]

Any idea why Apple did not bump the Mini? Do you think it will come in the next few weeks, or will they slip it into WMDC? (surely they have better announcements to make?) .....

Any news or speculation welcomed!
I think the Mac mini will get updated after the MacBook gets updated so the Mac mini isn't more powerful than the MacBook. With Intel pushing to discontinue "older" platforms sooner than they have been, I have a feeling the Mac mini will skip Santa Rosa and move straight to Montevina.

[Abster2core]

Yes, for a start you have the conversion around the wrong way, you divide by 0.935.

There is an Australian/USA Free trade agreement in place. To my knowledge there is no customs tariff.

As the goods are ex China and Australian ports are closer to Chinese ports than even the US west coast, I fail to see where there are extra costs involved.

There will be insurance on USA shipments as well so your calculation is double dipping.

The GST has been removed from the calculation to square up the comparison, as the US Apple site does not include USA taxes.

If there is a pro-rata extra cost in freight and insurance that does not explain the radically different price markups for the higher end products and extras. Freight actually wouldn't vary as in most cases the weight of different RAM or HD would not change and the box is the same size.

This is Apple charging whatever it feels it can get away with and shifting profits away from Australia and back to the USA head office. Our previous government was complicit in writing soft laws that prevent parallel or grey marketing of imports to prevent this sort of exploitation.

The so called FTA with the States has opened us up to the kind of abuse that Canada has suffered, where our competitive products are blocked in the US market, whilst the USA does whatever it wants in ours.

With friends like this...

Am I missing something?

Apple Store Australia lists the
24” iMac for 2,726.26 A$ or [2,554.32 $US]

Apple Store USA lists the
24” iMac for 2,199.00 $US or [2,347.10 A$]

for a difference of 355 $US. Obviously would include additional export/import custom declarations, shipping, distribution, marketing, overhead, etc.

According to the Australia Custom Tariff site, there is a tax of 5% still on goods coming in over $1000 A$, plus a shipping and insurance duty added?

[zinfella]

True, but he already said he doesn't play games, which is about the only significant benefit, one that I don't see worth paying the extra $1000 for the stated uses. Even for core image / core video stuff, the 8800 isn't a very good performer compared to lesser chips.

What $1000? The 8800 choice over the Radeon 2600 is an additional $150. :???:

He did say he was going to do video editing. ;)

[solipsism]

I thought the price of the upgrade was $300, but still, it's a lot.

The cost of 4GB SO-DIMM outright from a reputable retail company is less than $100. Maybe the original 2GB is $50, so you have a $150 difference because the additional cost to Apple for the bigger memory can't be much more than $50. It doesn't take 15 minutes to install the memory and handle the paperwork too. So that's $600 an hour, assuming a fairly pedestrian installation time.

It is $300 from 1B to 4GB. That is $100 per additonal GB.

The time it takes a repair shop or factory to upgrade RAM is irrelevant. You aren't looking at it from the average comsumer's POV.

Think about 65yo widow buying a Mac. Is she going to pay an extra $100 for 2GB and have it delivered as is or is she going to spend hour upon hour reading forums to find the best places to find quality, cheap memory? Is she then going to want to get out a tiny screwdriver and install the memory herself just to save $70 that will drawn out over the entire use of the computer? Is she going to print out the instructions for replacing/adding memory and hope she oes it right the first time? This is not what the average person wants to do. EVER! The average person doesn't want to overclock their processor, change out GPU when a new one comes out or add neon lights to their case to "pimp it out". They just want a simple system that is reliable and will allow them to do the tasks they need it do.

BTW: that is an actual case above of a recent switcher I know. I told her why 2GB of RAM would be better than 1GB and that she could always upgrade later. She opted out of 4GB at the time and went for 2GB.

[sequitur]

It does look like Apple has gotten the Montevina chips ahead of schedule and before everyone else. I was waiting for this to get an older iMac but I think I'll go with a new one since it's Montevina.

Where did you read that the new iMacs have the Montevina chips?

[JeffDM]

What $1000? The 8800 choice over the Radeon 2600 is an additional $150. :???:

I thought only the top end had it.

But it's more than $150 difference, it's $1399 vs $1949 because he's considering the reconditioned model, vs a new iMac with the 8800.

He did say he was going to do video editing. ;)

Barefeats showed that 8800 is not much benefit for video editing, it's a detriment. For its capabilities that relate to pro apps, It's actually slower than some older, "lesser" cards.

http://www.barefeats.com/harper10.html

[teckstud]

Griffin or some other third party company should create a matching hood and anti-glare film for the iMac to reduce glare from lights and make it more usable by graphics professional.

Like in the old days of the original G3 iMac when an aniti glare attachment was made
by 3M.
Is the glossy screen needed in order for Apple to get a higher environmental rating? Because it really sucks big time if you have any light source behind you. That must also be the reason for the black racoon border - to help your eyes stay focussed due to the glare factor distraction.

[solipsism]

Where did you read that the new iMacs have the Montevina chips?

I deduced it from the stated 1066MHz FSB, 6MB L2 cache and clockspeed. There is no Santa Rosa platform chips that match those criteria. Though, I still can't find a model number for the 2.66GHz chip.

[teckstud]

For most consumers glossy is the best option. Consumers are more likely to watch movies, etc than anything else on their computers. Also, unlike laptops, you wont be lugging your imac out in the sun anytime soon, so there really is no incentive for the additional complexity of adding a matte screen option.


?? Apple went from glare to glossy with G3, G4 iMacs for that very reason. Who wants to watch movies when you have to constanly draw the shades, turn off the lights??
I think glossy all about getting a better environmental rating only.

[teckstud]

I think it was a mistake to not add a Blu ray reader. In a year's time, not having a Blu ray reader will be like not having a DVD reader today. i.e. a major problem.

I agree- it should have been at least an option, no matter the price. The iMac is advertised as made for HD- it's overdue already especially now that the format war is over.

[melgross]

You're preaching to the choir there.

But I'll let Mel come by and explain himself.

I was going to let it lapse at this time, but, hopefully, just ONE more point.:)

The industry today has fewer choices in this regard. As I've mentioned before, the smaller manufacturers of pro level monitors have mostly disappeared. Even Barco, whose monitors I employed at my own company no longer makes graphics models. They now specialize in hi end medical, and other industries.

Because of that, we have less variation in what we can get for this purpose.

The other reason has to do with marketshare. I know some people don't understand marketshare, so they consider it to be unimportant, but it is all important.

What I mean is that when I was doing my work, starting in the latter '80's, there was no consumer market as such. Because of that, most monitors were expensive, and sold in fairly small numbers.

A small company could ask for a specialized tube, and get it, because their share of expensive monitors was fairly high. Their demands were important.

But, starting in the mid '90's, when consumer computer sales really took off, cheaper monitors became much more important than hi end versions. This disparity in pricing became much more pronounced, with top models costing over twenty times what the average monitor cost.

But, with tubes still being the primary source, it was just a matter of getting a different tube, which was easier to do.

But, after tubes began to disappear, even companies like Barco, which had no problem charging about $15,000 for their top models, found getting their spec'd tubes to be too expensive, and dropped them.

The problem with LCD's is like the problem with CD's vs Lp's. The technology to manufacturer Lp's is one in which you could buy a couple of machines, and you were in business. CD's require a vast, extremely expensive plant, though it has come down in price over the decades.

LCD manufacture requires vast numbers of screens to be made exactly the same way. It's really tough to have a small manufacturer get a specialized screen in a number that's too small a percentage of marketshare, even if the number would dwarf the old crt model's sales. The factories cost billions. The glass used is very expensive, and a small company simply can't get in the ground floor.

What this all means is that even the high end graphics user these days has their choices constrained by the manufacturing process, and that has been for matte screens, mostly because the older LCD's weren't that bright, and reflections were a really big problem. Anti-glare coatings were too expensive, and so matte was much cheaper to produce. Most of these screens go for consumer use.

That's beginning to change (matte vs gloss). But, of course, what people are used to is what they prefer.

If it's glossy, or if it's matte. It can be hard to dissuade someone otherwise, I suppose, including myself.

But, in going back to the '70's, when I started out in doing some IQ work for a large professional lab, the color correction system they had purchased used a very expensive 20" 640 x 480 monitor ($6,000!) with a glossy screen that was used in a dark room. There was a choice for a very expensive matte upgrade, but the images were not presented well with it.

Dark rooms and glossy screens were standard for many years for the highest end work, and anyone who does not know that, simply doesn't have the background to comment on anything other than the newer situation, which is not considered to be ideal. But, even for the newer monitors, dim, or dark rooms are still preferred, though most people these days would rebel at the notion. You still need a 5000% corrected viewer to look at prints properly, and a grey wall infront of you, with the lights not impinging on the monitor screen, and of the right color.

I'm not suggesting, that for home use, one must go through all of these gyrations. But, as even matte monitors suffer from bad seating, lighting, and overall placement, glossy ones don't require that much more of a shift.

Now, some people are very sensitive to reflections, and some like to THINK they are. Your milage will vary.

I see the rainbow from DLP chips, but I don't let it bother me. I consider my Tv to be superior in every way that matters, and I'm not about to go to an inferior design to eliminate the occasional eye blink long effect. I feel the same way about glossy screens.

[Nicnac]

"Starting at only $1,199"

Get real, people. The US economy is hosed. People can't afford $1200 for a computer. Apple is bucking trends so far by selling more machines then God, but the bubble will burst. I hope Apple realizes this soon (perhaps with a new Mini) before HP, Dell, Acer, and everyone else learns from the recent 'clone' news and releases sub $1000 mini towers that are OSX ready. And don't tell me about the current Mini. If I want a weak machine, I'll look for a P4 in the garbage. We need a sub-$1k mac that can push 1080p, 7.1, bluray, and have a remote control, and Apple will finally be the company to make HTPC mainstream.

[KamiNoYadoru]

What?

[JeffDM]

"Starting at only $1,199"

Get real, people. The US economy is hosed. People can't afford $1200 for a computer. Apple is bucking trends so far by selling more machines then God, but the bubble will burst.

Bah, even Dell grew 20% in the last quarter. If there's a huge problem, they'd be hurting. People write this stuff as if Great Depression II is imminent, it's a bit much.

The stuff about "OS X ready" hardware is nonsense too. No one would be able to support it well enough for consumers. All Apple has to do is tweak stuff and it'll break on the next update.

[zinfella]

"Starting at only $1,199"

Get real, people. The US economy is hosed. People can't afford $1200 for a computer. Apple is bucking trends so far by selling more machines then God, but the bubble will burst. I hope Apple realizes this soon (perhaps with a new Mini) before HP, Dell, Acer, and everyone else learns from the recent 'clone' news and releases sub $1000 mini towers that are OSX ready. And don't tell me about the current Mini. If I want a weak machine, I'll look for a P4 in the garbage. We need a sub-$1k mac that can push 1080p, 7.1, bluray, and have a remote control, and Apple will finally be the company to make HTPC mainstream.


This is your brain on drugs! :lol::lol:

[TenoBell]

Get real, people. The US economy is hosed. People can't afford $1200 for a computer. Apple is bucking trends so far by selling more machines then God, but the bubble will burst. I hope Apple realizes this soon (perhaps with a new Mini) before HP, Dell, Acer, and everyone else learns from the recent 'clone' news and releases sub $1000 mini towers that are OSX ready. And don't tell me about the current Mini. If I want a weak machine, I'll look for a P4 in the garbage. We need a sub-$1k mac that can push 1080p, 7.1, bluray, and have a remote control, and Apple will finally be the company to make HTPC mainstream.

This past quarters results refute your claims. In the last quarter Apple has grown faster than the computer industry at large. Posting record profits while selling premium priced computers.

Analysts predict we have weathered the worst of the economic slowdown and the situation is beginning to show signs of recovery. Many companies that were expected to have a slow down have actually shown a growth in revenues and profits. One important and very good sign is the value of the dollar is beginning to bounce back.

[zinfella]

I was going to let it lapse at this time, but, hopefully, just ONE more point.:)

The industry today has fewer choices in this regard. As I've mentioned before, the smaller manufacturers of pro level monitors have mostly disappeared. Even Barco, whose monitors I employed at my own company no longer makes graphics models. They now specialize in hi end medical, and other industries.

Because of that, we have less variation in what we can get for this purpose.

The other reason has to do with marketshare. I know some people don't understand marketshare, so they consider it to be unimportant, but it is all important.

What I mean is that when I was doing my work, starting in the latter '80's, there was no consumer market as such. Because of that, most monitors were expensive, and sold in fairly small numbers.

A small company could ask for a specialized tube, and get it, because their share of expensive monitors was fairly high. Their demands were important.

But, starting in the mid '90's, when consumer computer sales really took off, cheaper monitors became much more important than hi end versions. This disparity in pricing became much more pronounced, with top models costing over twenty times what the average monitor cost.

But, with tubes still being the primary source, it was just a matter of getting a different tube, which was easier to do.

But, after tubes began to disappear, even companies like Barco, which had no problem charging about $15,000 for their top models, found getting their spec'd tubes to be too expensive, and dropped them.

The problem with LCD's is like the problem with CD's vs Lp's. The technology to manufacturer Lp's is one in which you could buy a couple of machines, and you were in business. CD's require a vast, extremely expensive plant, though it has come down in price over the decades.

LCD manufacture requires vast numbers of screens to be made exactly the same way. It's really tough to have a small manufacturer get a specialized screen in a number that's too small a percentage of marketshare, even if the number would dwarf the old crt model's sales. The factories cost billions. The glass used is very expensive, and a small company simply can't get in the ground floor.

What this all means is that even the high end graphics user these days has their choices constrained by the manufacturing process, and that has been for matte screens, mostly because the older LCD's weren't that bright, and reflections were a really big problem. Anti-glare coatings were too expensive, and so matte was much cheaper to produce. Most of these screens go for consumer use.

That's beginning to change (matte vs gloss). But, of course, what people are used to is what they prefer.

If it's glossy, or if it's matte. It can be hard to dissuade someone otherwise, I suppose, including myself.

But, in going back to the '70's, when I started out in doing some IQ work for a large professional lab, the color correction system they had purchased used a very expensive 20" 640 x 480 monitor ($6,000!) with a glossy screen that was used in a dark room. There was a choice for a very expensive matte upgrade, but the images were not presented well with it.

Dark rooms and glossy screens were standard for many years for the highest end work, and anyone who does not know that, simply doesn't have the background to comment on anything other than the newer situation, which is not considered to be ideal. But, even for the newer monitors, dim, or dark rooms are still preferred, though most people these days would rebel at the notion. You still need a 5000% corrected viewer to look at prints properly, and a grey wall infront of you, with the lights not impinging on the monitor screen, and of the right color.

I'm not suggesting, that for home use, one must go through all of these gyrations. But, as even matte monitors suffer from bad seating, lighting, and overall placement, glossy ones don't require that much more of a shift.

Now, some people are very sensitive to reflections, and some like to THINK they are. Your milage will vary.

I see the rainbow from DLP chips, but I don't let it bother me. I consider my Tv to be superior in every way that matters, and I'm not about to go to an inferior design to eliminate the occasional eye blink long effect. I feel the same way about glossy screens.

I'll settle for even lighting and color, and I like the glossy screen. :)

[c64]

If the conventions of the 2600 in the last generation hold, is the thinking that they've got an 8800M GT in there, downclocked? I'm really curious what the video card situation is going to be with this model, because there's not a mobile version of the 8800 GS that I'm aware of and I think we're all pretty certain that there's not a desktop GPU in there. If they put in an 8700M GT then they can fuck right off.


Your right,I couldn't find any performance reviews on the 8800gs to do a comparison with the 2600 pro.Do they even have a 8800 gs model?

If this was going to be my main computer I would put out the extra money.I'm just tired of the usual issues with Microsoft.So i figured I'll use my pc for gaming and burning movies(14min to burn a movie with pc) and use the mac for the rest.

[solipsism]

"Starting at only $1,199"

Get real, people. The US economy is hosed. People can't afford $1200 for a computer. Apple is bucking trends so far by selling more machines then God, but the bubble will burst. I hope Apple realizes this soon (perhaps with a new Mini) before HP, Dell, Acer, and everyone else learns from the recent 'clone' news and releases sub $1000 mini towers that are OSX ready. And don't tell me about the current Mini. If I want a weak machine, I'll look for a P4 in the garbage. We need a sub-$1k mac that can push 1080p, 7.1, bluray, and have a remote control, and Apple will finally be the company to make HTPC mainstream.

Not an issue for most. A $1,200 necessity that will last several years, be used my multiple family members in many cases and still have a resale value when you go to upgrade isn't a tough decision for most.

Consider that computers are more used than ever by the public and that prices have fallen even though inflation has brought that average price of good up. I recall when a computer was not a common household appliance, cost $10K easy and the the mortgage was 15%.

[tdhockeyfan424]

Most likely if you don't do anything you will receive the new iteration at the published price.

For your own comfort, just call customer support.

i checked it out today and since it didnt shipp yet they fixed
the order and updated it

im probaly gonna get it so soon

i cant wait

[melgross]

Analysts predict we have weathered the worst of the economic slowdown and the situation is beginning to show signs of recovery. Many companies that were expected to have a slow down have actually shown a growth in revenues and profits. One important and very good sign is the value of the dollar is beginning to bounce back.

Er, no!

We're just beginning to enter the worst of the recession. It wasn't even agreed upon that we were IN a recession until last month.

The estimate is that this recession will last longer than the average 8 months for recessions that has been true since WWII. Perhaps a year. Hopefully, we will be coming out of it shortly after the election.

[MissKitty]

... is finally gone.

Except in the mini and and MacBook...

[melgross]

Your right,I couldn't find any performance reviews on the 8800gs to do a comparison with the 2600 pro.Do they even have a 8800 gs model?

If this was going to be my main computer I would put out the extra money.I'm just tired of the usual issues with Microsoft.So i figured I'll use my pc for gaming and burning movies(14min to burn a movie with pc) and use the mac for the rest.

Some interesting stuff relating exactly to that:

http://news.softpedia.com/news/NVIDIA-Drops-8800GS-Adds-G98-52731.shtml

http://news.softpedia.com/news/NVIDIA-8800GS-Information-Leaked-in-Driver-Details-52629.shtml

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130332

http://r800.blogspot.com/2007/12/nvidia-8800gs-brief-test.html

[teckstud]

Er, no!

We're just beginning to enter the worst of the recession. It wasn't even agreed upon that we were IN a recession until last month.


By who- George W. Bush? Since when does he agree with anything that's factual? We've been in a recession at lot longer than a month- don't fool yourself.

[mdriftmeyer]

I'm sure the gloss/matte finish requests are reaching the engineers and that they are actually in the minority.

[gastroboy]

Am I missing something?

Apple Store Australia lists the
24” iMac for 2,726.26 A$ or [2,554.32 $US]

Apple Store USA lists the
24” iMac for 2,199.00 $US or [2,347.10 A$]

for a difference of 355 $US. Obviously would include additional export/import custom declarations, shipping, distribution, marketing, overhead, etc.

According to the Australia Custom Tariff site, there is a tax of 5% still on goods coming in over $1000 A$, plus a shipping and insurance duty added?

No, mea culpa. This comes from me doing this in the wee small hours, the brain has gone all fuzzy.

I am so used to doing the conversions the other way around, when I did it for your benefit in US $ I got it arse backwards. Yes you should multiply, which gives a much more reasonable 16.14% markup which is not bad for Apple, unless they are working on a different exchange rate.

As for duties there are none and the charges you looked up were for small individual imports from non FTA countries. Apple I would presume would not be paying individual import fees on each and every item anyway.

You missed the Preferential Rates section which covers the USA as a FTA partner.

The one thing we have both not investigated is; what import fees is the USA charging? After all you need to compare like with like. No point pretending it is only Australia that has handling costs.

The same goes for marketing, etc. If the paperwork and marketing were not done in Australia then it would have to be done in the USA.

[melgross]

By who- George W. Bush? Since when does he agree with anything that's factual? We've been in a recession at lot longer than a month- don't fool yourself.

I'm not talking about Bush. I'm taking about economists. We had a slowdown, which is not technically a recession. Now, we're in the beginning of a recession.

Bush would like to ignore that. You think he's going to say that this recession will last longer than most? Don't you think hes thinking about the elections and what that will do to Republicans? No, he's been trying to minimize it.

[zinfella]

I'm not talking about Bush. I'm taking about economists. We had a slowdown, which is not technically a recession. Now, we're in the beginning of a recession.

Bush would like to ignore that. You think he's going to say that this recession will last longer than most? Don't you think hes thinking about the elections and what that will do to Republicans? No, he's been trying to minimize it.

And who controls the money, why since Jan 07, the Democratic controlled Congress. :(

[jowie74]

Yeppers. I wonder if the 20" is still the same screen with the uneven brightness and other problems?
according to the specs, the screen has not changed. And they are still stating all screens are "millions"... ;)

[gastroboy]

I'm sure the gloss/matte finish requests are reaching the engineers and that they are actually in the minority.

It is not the engineers who are determining this, it is marketing.

How do gloss/matte finish requests go past the retail sales person who simply tells the customer "That's the way they come"?

From my encounters with Apple sales staff and the sales staff in major retail stores, this seems to be the biggest objection they field. Just as in PC shops it is can I have the PC with XP installed?

The answer to both is no, you'll just have to lump it if you want a new computer.

[zinfella]

It is not the engineers who are determining this, it is marketing.

How do gloss/matte finish requests go past the retail sales person who simply tells the customer "That's the way they come"?

From my encounters with Apple sales staff and the sales staff in major retail stores, this seems to be the biggest objection they field. Just as in PC shops it is can I have the PC with XP installed?

The answer to both is no, you'll just have to lump it if you want a new computer.

That's silly, marketing will market whatever the designers design. Just like they do with MacBook Pro models.

[melgross]

And who controls the money, why since Jan 07, the Democratic controlled Congress. :(

Not really. Congress can't do anything the President won't sign. That's been their problem. He has the last word.

[JeffDM]

It is not the engineers who are determining this, it is marketing.

How do gloss/matte finish requests go past the retail sales person who simply tells the customer "That's the way they come"?

From my encounters with Apple sales staff and the sales staff in major retail stores, this seems to be the biggest objection they field. Just as in PC shops it is can I have the PC with XP installed?

The answer to both is no, you'll just have to lump it if you want a new computer.

Actually, the supposed cutoff for XP is still a few months away, and it could still get extended again. Maybe those in sales might lie because they don't have any XP machines and thus don't want you to buy from somewhere else, or they just might not know any better.

A lot of monitors are available in matte as well.

[melgross]

according to the specs, the screen has not changed. And they are still stating all screens are "millions"... ;)

I don't even know why people are concerned about this. The likelihood that anyone will notice the difference is very small. Even for color correction, mostly, it works well.

I'm waiting to see if Apple will upgrade their pro displays. Meanwhile I bought a Samsung 245BW monitor as a placeholder since my Sony 900BW died recently.

This monitor doesn't have millions of colors either. But, when I make prints on my Canon IPF5100, and view them under my GTI Graphiclite D50 viewer, the prints match the (calibrated) screen almost exactly (accounting for the difference between emissive screens and reflective prints).

Really, too much is being made of this. The 20" models aren't going to be used for critical color work. The 24" screen does have a true 24 bit panel.

[edwin2213]

Not really. Congress can't do anything the President won't sign. That's been their problem. He has the last word.

The President doesn't have the last word. A presidential veto can be overridden by a two thirds majority vote of both the house and the senate.

[mstone]

I'm not talking about Bush. I'm taking about economists. We had a slowdown, which is not technically a recession. Now, we're in the beginning of a recession.

Bush would like to ignore that. You think he's going to say that this recession will last longer than most? Don't you think hes thinking about the elections and what that will do to Republicans? No, he's been trying to minimize it.


Elections don't change anything. If you are waiting for politicians to bail you out, you're going to have a long, long wait.

In my situation my original core duo 20" is just fine for surfing the web and playing videos/music so I don't need a new iMac on my kitchen table. At work, though, I do need more power for FCP, but 8 cores is a lot of money, recession or not.

[zinfella]

I don't even know why people are concerned about this. The likelihood that anyone will notice the difference is very small. Even for color correction, mostly, it works well.

I'm waiting to see if Apple will upgrade their pro displays. Meanwhile I bought a Samsung 245BW monitor as a placeholder since my Sony 900BW died recently.

This monitor doesn't have millions of colors either. But, when I make prints on my Canon IPF5100, and view them under my GTI Graphiclite D50 viewer, the prints match the (calibrated) screen almost exactly (accounting for the difference between emissive screens and reflective prints).

Really, too much is being made of this. The 20" models aren't going to be used for critical color work. The 24" screen does have a true 24 bit panel.

The photography blogs are full of dissatisfied 24" iMac owners specifically because of the screen gradient problem. Apple refuses to admit the problem, but, they do exchange models that have it. Some people have done as many as 3 exchanges, and still had the problem.

Don't misunderstand, folks not into high end graphics or heavily into photography, aren't going to have an issue, but, that sure isn't everyone. We already know that Apple is looking at going to all LED displays, what we don't know is when. Maybe the next iMac upgrade, who knows?

Some of the unhappy photographers are pros and some are serious amateurs, but all demand high quality images. Screen gradient issues showing uneven light and color are an impediment to that. They think it's a VERY big issue, and it's their money . :)

[solipsism]

According to TG Daily, the 3.06GHz is not the X9100 or even Montevina, it's still Santa Rosa. They state it's a one-off chip for Apple. Though the other chips they list Montevina part numbers, with the 2.66GHz model numbers still oddly absent. Perhaps that is a one-off chip too to balance out the range.• http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/37152/135/

[JeffDM]

The President doesn't have the last word. A presidential veto can be overridden by a two thirds majority vote of both the house and the senate.

That's true, but it hasn't happened often recently because that means convincing those aligned with the President to "defect". Even if they're the minority, that minority is still quite strong enough to make the President's veto pen effectively the last word until he's replaced.

[JeffDM]

Elections don't change anything. If you are waiting for politicians to bail you out, you're going to have a long, long wait.

He's not saying that though, I think you're pulling things out of the discussion that's not there.

[mstone]

He's not saying that though, I think you're pulling things out of the discussion that's not there.

Perhaps I should have used this quote instead.
Er, no!

We're just beginning to enter the worst of the recession. It wasn't even agreed upon that we were IN a recession until last month.

The estimate is that this recession will last longer than the average 8 months for recessions that has been true since WWII. Perhaps a year. Hopefully, we will be coming out of it shortly after the election.

[melgross]

The President doesn't have the last word. A presidential veto can be overridden by a two thirds majority vote of both the house and the senate.

Sure. I know that. But it almost never happens. We have almost never had a two thirds majority that would agree on anything. It's so rare an event that it can be ignored, for most usual purposes.

[melgross]

Elections don't change anything. If you are waiting for politicians to bail you out, you're going to have a long, long wait.

Bailing me out?

You live here too, from what I see from your location.

Anyway, that's not the point.


In my situation my original core duo 20" is just fine for surfing the web and playing videos/music so I don't need a new iMac on my kitchen table. At work, though, I do need more power for FCP, but 8 cores is a lot of money, recession or not.

Yes, 8 cores is a lot of money even if we were not in a recession.

But there is an advantage to 8 cores. This is the first time that computers are more powerful than needed for most programs, even professional ones.

As these programs are revised over the next few years, they will use more the the present 8 core machine. This will actually allow them to work more quickly on the (then) old machine than they did when the machine and software was new.

This will enable that machine to add years to its life that otherwise, a weaker machine with fewer cores wouldn't have.

This means that the machine will have a much better ROI than a 2 or 4 core machine.

Besides. This is a capital investment for a company. There are tax advantages to buying it. In the end, the cost will be much less than you think.

[melgross]

The photography blogs are full of dissatisfied 24" iMac owners specifically because of the screen gradient problem. Apple refuses to admit the problem, but, they do exchange models that have it. Some people have done as many as 3 exchanges, and still had the problem.

We bought 20 24" machines for the two photography labs in my daughters school. I've been helping the teachers with their classes. I've not noticed this problem, and I wonder where it comes from.

What blogs are you talking about, because the pro sites I'm a member of, where more than a few pro's use these machines, have had not a word of it.


Don't misunderstand, folks not into high end graphics or heavily into photography, aren't going to have an issue, but, that sure isn't everyone. We already know that Apple is looking at going to all LED displays, what we don't know is when. Maybe the next iMac upgrade, who knows?

You mean backlit displays, right?


Some of the unhappy photographers are pros and some are serious amateurs, but all demand high quality images. Screen gradient issues showing uneven light and color are an impediment to that. They think it's a VERY big issue, and it's their money . :)

As I've just said, I've not seen this issue, nor have I read about it. Please give me a link or two to check out. I would be very interested.

[JeffDM]

Perhaps I should have used this quote instead.

I think you read too much into that one too. Even if there's a power shift, it takes several months for it to mean anything more than just be a feel good effect.

[melgross]

Perhaps I should have used this quote instead.

He's right. you're reading something into it that I didn't say, or mean.

I'm not relating the end of the recession to the elections. It's just that economists think that the recession will end shortly after the elections, perhaps around January.

It's coincidence. Though some better economic policies would help.

[elroth]

The President doesn't have the last word. A presidential veto can be overridden by a two thirds majority vote of both the house and the senate.

After a presidential veto, it takes 67 senators to override. So unless there are 67 democrats in the senate, the president and the republicans have all the power they need to stop any meaningful change.

[WelshDog]

Er, no!

We're just beginning to enter the worst of the recession. It wasn't even agreed upon that we were IN a recession until last month.

The estimate is that this recession will last longer than the average 8 months for recessions that has been true since WWII. Perhaps a year. Hopefully, we will be coming out of it shortly after the election.The future is not so bright and we won't need shades. Peak oil, Google it.

[elroth]

According to a story on MacNN, Intel has confirmed that the chips are 45nm Penryn chips with Santa Rosa chipset.

"The 3.06GHz processor and fellow chips in Apple's new iMacs are part of a special run of Intel's existing technology... Although the processors match the same core clock rates and 1,066MHz system bus speeds as those for the upcoming platform, the processors are now known to be unlisted speed grades that include special support for the faster bus speeds (up from 800MHz)...The mainboard remains based on the same "Santa Rosa" chipset as for earlier iMacs and MacBooks."

I still like what I know so far.

[Abster2core]

The one thing we have both not investigated is; what import fees is the USA charging? After all you need to compare like with like. No point pretending it is only Australia that has handling costs.

The same goes for marketing, etc. If the paperwork and marketing were not done in Australia then it would have to be done in the USA.

There is no import fee that the USA is charging. Cost of transportation from whereever, including all the paperwork and legal stuff is in the cost of goods.

Even though there is no country import tax, there still is freight forwarding costs and landing tax that is born by the receiver.

Marketing, although most is done in the US, there is still regional issues that have to be addressed, i.e., country specific legal issues such as warrantees and the like. Just the cost of another language, phone numbers, translations, etc., are added costs. In addition, accounting, patent and copyright filings, monitoring, support and tracking is costs that have to reflect the regional concerns as well. Just can't dump American Made and not expect to pay the piper.

[elroth]

Barefeats showed that 8800 is not much benefit for video editing, it's a detriment. For its capabilities that relate to pro apps, It's actually slower than some older, "lesser" cards.

http://www.barefeats.com/harper10.html

They tested the 8800 GT against the 2600 XT (it doesn't say how much memory). Do you think the same results hold for the 8800 GS (512MB) against the 2600 Pro (256 MB)? (I'm interested in the apps, not the gaming). The way the cards are named is pretty confusing.

[zinfella]

We bought 20 24" machines for the two photography labs in my daughters school. I've been helping the teachers with their classes. I've not noticed this problem, and I wonder where it comes from.

What blogs are you talking about, because the pro sites I'm a member of, where more than a few pro's use these machines, have had not a word of it.



You mean backlit displays, right?



As I've just said, I've not seen this issue, nor have I read about it. Please give me a link or two to check out. I would be very interested.

Here are several pages worth.

<http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=iMac+24%22+screen+gradient+issue&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8>

Another from Photo.net.

<http://photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00OED9>

They're not hard to find.

[ncpcguy]

Well I just placed my order for the 24" 3.06ghz box with the NVIDIA GPU. I'm moving from a 7 year old Dell PIII box (that's slow as hell) and never used a Mac in my life. What's the best way to learn the new OSX environment? Just dive in? Pay the Apple store for "lessons"? Wish me luck!

[zinfella]

Well I just placed my order for the 24" 3.06ghz box with the NVIDIA GPU. I'm moving from a 7 year old Dell PIII box (that's slow as hell) and never used a Mac in my life. What's the best way to learn the new OSX environment? Just dive in? Pay the Apple store for "lessons"? Wish me luck!

IMO, join a MUG, you can't beat all of the info at your fingertips. For example, here's an excellent one, and yes I'm a member, <http://www.amug.org/>. For $39 a year you will get unlimited online support, plus member discounts on merchandise, and we have monthly meetings if you live close enough.

I've gotten many times more than $39 worth of help every year that I've been a member.

[elroth]

Well I just placed my order for the 24" 3.06ghz box with the NVIDIA GPU. I'm moving from a 7 year old Dell PIII box (that's slow as hell) and never used a Mac in my life. What's the best way to learn the new OSX environment? Just dive in? Pay the Apple store for "lessons"? Wish me luck!

One option is the book "Mac OS X Leopard: The Missing Manual." Also, the Apple Stores have beginning classes/workshops for free (or you can pay for one-on-one time). There's a "Switchers" page on the Apple website.

[gastroboy]

Well I just placed my order for the 24" 3.06ghz box with the NVIDIA GPU. I'm moving from a 7 year old Dell PIII box (that's slow as hell) and never used a Mac in my life. What's the best way to learn the new OSX environment? Just dive in? Pay the Apple stor