Inside the multitouch FingerWorks tech in Apple's tablet

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  • gazoobeegazoobee Posts: 3,754member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    Wasn't there a reference recently to a multi-touch gesture that recognizes "forefinger and thumb pinched together" as text input? In the manner of holding a pen or pencil.



    Casually trying that out on a flat surface feels much more natural than trying to "write" with just your forefinger, as in the case of signing on a POS device. If the surface I was doing that on gave me "ink" feedback to see what I was doing, I don't think it would be too bad. Of course, the real problem would be accurate handwriting recognition, but that would be just as true for a stylus.



    Actually, playing around with that gesture, I'm suddenly convinced that Apple's tablet won't have a stylus, and will rely on the thumb/finger pinch thing to do stylus-like duties. It really doesn't feel less accurate and you could adjust line width in software (and possibly in mid-stroke with some adjacent gesture). The only downside that I can see is that a stylus tip lets you see the point of contact whereas your fingers obscure it, but I'm not sure how big a problem that really is.



    It's not a multi-touch gesture, but Apple has had a patent for several years now that uses infra-red detection to recognise the orientation and shape of the users hands as they hover *near* the surface, before they touch it.



    It's a bit sci-fi-ish, but in theory it's possible to tell if someone's hand is "making the pen gesture" and switch to virtual ink as a result, switching back when they change and poke it with their fingertips instead.



    This could be an explanation for those comments about how you will have to "learn" stuff to make the thing work, as in you will have to learn what hand signals to make to let the thing know if you want to type or write/draw. It's pretty "out there" as an idea though and might not be possible yet. I'd like to see them try it, but it's easy to see how something like that could fail spectacularly also and then the tablet would *really* be Newton 2.0.
  • anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 16,776member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    He has that reputation for a reason, because it's true.



    Yeah, and I've heard that it takes one to know one.
  • irelandireland Posts: 15,290member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    Yeah, and I've heard that it takes one to know one.



    You're a jerk.
  • steviet02steviet02 Posts: 592member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    Yeah, he probably qualifies too (I say 'probably' because I've never personally interacted with him. Have you?).



    You mean, he would never interact with you....
  • solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post


    Since typing, even on a virtual keyboard is always faster than writing, I have the feeling that Apple will leave the stylus out and just claim it's not necessary. The only people disappointed will be people who need to draw or sketch which is a small enough group that they might get away with it.



    There are so many fields where that is not only wanted but required when using a tablet-like device. I don?t expect it to be included with the tablet but I can?t imagine it not being part of the OS and possibly even sold as an accessory from Apple from the start.
  • irelandireland Posts: 15,290member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ajay View Post


    how long have you guys at AI have been toying around with the Apple Tablet (by whatever name it's known by)?



    I started this thread on the 2nd July 2007.
  • a-mazea-maze Posts: 65member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hill60 View Post


    Smartphone GPS has turned into a replay of the browser wars.



    Antitrust issues?



    Don't Garmin and TomTom use Navteq maps, owned by Nokia?



    No, TomTom uses maps from TeleAtlas, a company they bought a couple of years ago.



    http://www.businessweek.com/technolo...723_084676.htm
  • anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 16,776member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    You're a jerk.



    And, paradoxically, sometimes, you're distressingly obvious!
  • anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 16,776member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a-maze View Post


    No, TomTom uses maps from TeleAtlas, a company they bought a couple of years ago.



    http://www.businessweek.com/technolo...723_084676.htm



    I wonder if there might be an 'anti-dumping' issue that Garmin/TomTom could bring up here with Nokia/Google giving it away for free. After all, it cannot cost zero to produce.
  • anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 16,776member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    I started this thread on the 2nd July 2007.



    And you are to be congratulated for that. Seriously. Prescient.
  • irelandireland Posts: 15,290member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    And you are to be congratulated for that. Seriously. Prescient.



    Thanks.
  • richlrichl Posts: 2,213member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by a-maze View Post


    No, TomTom uses maps from TeleAtlas, a company they bought a couple of years ago.



    Google also use TeleAtlas maps outside of the US. Unsurprisingly, TeleAtlas (aka TomTom) refused to let Google offer free turn-by-turn navigation using their maps.
  • solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    And you are to be congratulated for that. Seriously. Prescient.



    I would not agree since that was done 6 months after the iPhone was announced and a tablet is somewhere between a MB and an iPhone. We know that Apple had the Newton and the iPhone started out as a tablet device that never materialized.



    I can?t imagine that it would have anything resembling Mac OS X in the UI as depicted in the mockups and the survey eludes to Ireland thinking it would happen more than years ago, before the end of 2008. Plus, a lot of the design seems to be just a giant iPod (then iPhone) with Mac OS X shoehorned in it.



    I do give him credit for his unwavering focus and desire for this tablet to emerge though it seems obvious that it would be happen at some point. I do think he?s going to be very, very, very disappointed since most of his ideas have not evolved since those first mockups in 2007. Usually i?d wish someone luck on their ideal product, but with this I cannot as I think it would be a failed device in every single way.



    (I hope that didn?t come across too harshly, Ireland)
  • addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,667member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    I would not agree since that was done 6 months after the iPhone was announced and a tablet is somewhere between a MB and an iPhone. We know that Apple had the Newton and the iPhone started out as a tablet device that never materialized.



    I can?t imagine that it would have anything resembling Mac OS X in the UI as depicted in the mockups and the survey eludes to Ireland thinking it would happen more than years ago, before the end of 2008. Plus, a lot of the design seems to be just a giant iPod (then iPhone) with Mac OS X shoehorned in it.



    I do give him credit for his unwavering focus and desire for this tablet to emerge though it seems obvious that it would be happen at some point. I do think he?s going to be very, very, very disappointed since most of his ideas have not evolved since those first mockups in 2007. Usually i?d wish someone luck on their ideal product, but with this I cannot as I think it would be a failed device in every single way.



    (I hope that didn?t come across too harshly, Ireland)



    I was going to say something like that, with the additional caveat that, looking back at that thread, I was arguing strenuously for the inclusion of a hardware keyboard and I was obviously and completely wrong.



    So on that: Ireland had me dead to rights, and his arguments that a "pure tablet" would be more Apple like have been borne out.



    But, as Solipsism says, Ireland has also been singlemindedly focused on this device being a "Mac" running "OS X Touch" since day one, and that doesn't look to be happening (although of course it remains to be seen). Back then we couldn't have known the gravitational pull of the App Store, and how the opportunity to do media distribution might pull any Apple tablet device towards the iPhone ecosystem.



    Also, I'm deducting points for the ongoing no-show of an Apple branded television or a DVD slot in the Apple TV.
  • anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 16,776member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    Thanks.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    I would not agree......

    I do give him credit for his unwavering focus and desire for this tablet to emerge though it seems obvious that it would be happen at some point. I do think he?s going to be very, very, very disappointed since most of his ideas have not evolved since those first mockups in 2007.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    I was going to say something like that, with the additional caveat that, ......



    Ah, it will all be revealed in a few days, won't it. Can't wait.
  • ltmpltmp Posts: 204member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    Yeah, he probably qualifies too (I say 'probably' because I've never personally interacted with him. Have you?).



    I met Jobs and Gates at a show once. Shook both of their hands.

    They were both incredibly pleasant people especially considering the fact that hundreds of us were crowding them.



    Sadly, I eventually had to wash my hand.
  • quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,546member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    And you are to be congratulated for that. Seriously. Prescient.



    Yup. Credit where it's due.



    Now about that Magic Mouse . . .
  • hill60hill60 Posts: 6,959member
    Not to mention Verizon, AT&T et al with their subscription based services.



    Google has opened a whole can of worms with free voice guidance on the Droid, to compete it has to be free.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    I wonder if there might be an 'anti-dumping' issue that Garmin/TomTom could bring up here with Nokia/Google giving it away for free. After all, it cannot cost zero to produce.



  • quinneyquinney Posts: 2,416member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BC Kelly View Post


    Interesting concept about a "vibrate/feeling" feedback from the Touch Screen, so can know where the fingers are without having to look - is what we typist do with the 'dots' on the F and J Keys so we can always find the "Home Row" - and since keyboards are of similar size/shape we're able to know where all the other keys are without having to look - again, same as the Piano



    But that darn Touch Screen - all flat and glass, no 'dots' - how will that problem be solved ?



    BC



    The device may be able to detect the positions of all your fingers, wherever you place them on the touch surface. The device could then correctly interpret touches as corresponding key presses. It would not be required to always place your fingers in the same starting positions, as you would when using a typewriter or playing a piano. Tactile feedback would be unnecessary. Like Gazoobee posted:



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post


    Apple has had a patent for several years now that uses infra-red detection to recognise the orientation and shape of the users hands as they hover *near* the surface, before they touch it.



  • tazinlwfltazinlwfl Posts: 117member
    I want one of those rear-projection Drafting multi-touch tables... :-(
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