Religious fundamentalism, is it everywhere?
After our recent discussions on Islam, I'm left with the feeling that some of you guys blame this religion and it's holy scriptures for about all the bad things going on in the world.
While we where able to give the Mormons a break, and see people as people, instead of labeling a whole group. We where well on the way on letting our prejudices get the upper hand. But a good effort from groverat and some others turned the whole thread into a class in mormon ways, and not judging people by their religion/ religious group.
If you dig a bit you'll find sects and holy text in every religion that are "disturbing" to say the least. The old testament is filled with "barbaric" punishments and prophicies. The Talmud has quite a few "unsympatetic" decriptions on how to deal with "none jews".
Right wing Christians are in the western world reponsible for several "religious murdes" each year, attacks on abortion-supportes etc. I recently read about an incident where an ultra-ortodox jew refused to lend out his phone to call for an ambulance for a non-jew. The burning of a train filled with muslim families by hindu-nationalist in India two weeks ago is another sad example.
These are the sad realities of all practice of religion in its most extreem forms.
All this should probably go into the "big bloke in black..." thread, but I have given up following it.
While we where able to give the Mormons a break, and see people as people, instead of labeling a whole group. We where well on the way on letting our prejudices get the upper hand. But a good effort from groverat and some others turned the whole thread into a class in mormon ways, and not judging people by their religion/ religious group.
If you dig a bit you'll find sects and holy text in every religion that are "disturbing" to say the least. The old testament is filled with "barbaric" punishments and prophicies. The Talmud has quite a few "unsympatetic" decriptions on how to deal with "none jews".
Right wing Christians are in the western world reponsible for several "religious murdes" each year, attacks on abortion-supportes etc. I recently read about an incident where an ultra-ortodox jew refused to lend out his phone to call for an ambulance for a non-jew. The burning of a train filled with muslim families by hindu-nationalist in India two weeks ago is another sad example.
These are the sad realities of all practice of religion in its most extreem forms.
All this should probably go into the "big bloke in black..." thread, but I have given up following it.
Comments
Most of the terrorist problems in the world nowadays are the result of Islamic terrorists.
I hope Israel kills every single Palestinean over there.
Next question.
<strong>Well, when you put it that way, you have bomb attacks in North Ireland all the time...</strong><hr></blockquote>
My wife and I were just talking about this very subject not 4 hours ago. Neither us can understand why this happens in Ireland and not in the US... We in the US have Catholics and Protestants everywhere, and NO KILLINGS! I don't understand it.
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I hope Israel kills every single Palestinean over there.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Its really strange to me that anyone can want an Endlösung to the situation. Despite what you think about the Israel/Palestine situation how can you wish the death of millions of innocent people? Children that can´t even comprehend the situation yet. Your statement is no better than that of OBL and I don´t even think he wishes every american dead.
Every person should be hold accountable for his or hers action. Its not "every population should be hold accountable for the action of its members" or there would be no people left on the earth.
And I don't think I've heard people blame Islam the religion as much as Islam the culture. But it's hard to separate the two, because they have theocracies and don't typically value religious pluralism in their countries.
But, I do have a question: Doesn't the Koran promote war (jihad) with infidels? And if so, wouldn't a literal interpretation combined with a willingness to define 'infidel' loosely encourage violence? And does anything similar appear in other religions?
<strong>My wife and I were just talking about this very subject not 4 hours ago. Neither us can understand why this happens in Ireland and not in the US... We in the US have Catholics and Protestants everywhere, and NO KILLINGS! I don't understand it.</strong><hr></blockquote>Because there is no land at stake.
And the children over in Palestine understand exactly the situation over there. I've seen the videos of the young kids hooping and hollerin over the WTC attacks... I've seen the video of the 16 year old girl who was the terrorist bomber who killed three people at the market in Jerusalem... Trust me, they know exactly the situation over there.
On the other hand, my step kids who are teens aren't killing Catholics and Jews. They are going to school, playing video games and watching tv.
<strong>Because there is no land at stake.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So what? That's a petty excuse to kill other people. So if I want "the Catholics" off my street, the way to do it is to kill them???
<strong>The children over in Palestine understand exactly the situation over there.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Also those who can´t talk yet?
[quote]<strong>I've seen the videos of the young kids hooping and hollerin over the WTC attacks...</strong><hr></blockquote>
I have seen that here in Denmark too (VERY few). Should they be killed as well? Could you convict people to death in US if they had cheered 911?
[quote]<strong>I've seen the video of the 16 year old girl who was the terrorist bomber who killed three people at the market in Jerusalem... Trust me, they know exactly the situation over there.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Does her actions make the whole Palestinian population guilty?.
[quote]<strong>On the other hand, my step kids who are teens aren't killing Catholics and Jews. They are going to school, playing video games and watching tv.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Hooray for them.
Even when in war civilian casualties are considered regrettable "side effects" but you want to slaughter an entire population because of the actions of a few of them (rememeber there are millions palestinians) What makes you better than Hitler?
A muslim friend of mine who studies this subject has told me that the whole concept of Jihad is very misused and misunderstood. It is supposedly more about defence than holy war. The term Jihad has to with the exertion of a holy task for the benefit of Islam. So building a bridge could be a Jihad, if the aim is holy enough...
Jihad has also been used in wars between muslim tribes, but, according to my friend, this is a grave misuse of the term.
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Hooray for them.
Even when in war civilian casualties are considered regrettable "side effects" but you want to slaughter an entire population because of the actions of a few of them (rememeber there are millions palestinians) What makes you better than Hitler?</strong><hr></blockquote>
reaaaaaaaaach......... You know what I mean, dude.
hmm... you pretty much hit the nail on the head I think... This is certainly a big part of it. But while land-disputes are usually settled, conflicts with a religious aspect seem to carry on forever...
[ 03-29-2002: Message edited by: New ]</p>
<strong>So what? That's a petty excuse to kill other people. So if I want "the Catholics" off my street, the way to do it is to kill them???
You were apparently trying to make some deep point about why Catholics and Protestants don't kill each other in the US.
In fact, it's really very straightforward. It's not just a religious conflict - it's a religious conflict tied up in the politics of a particular region.
It's still not clear what your point was about comparing Irish Protestants and Catholics to American ones. Perhaps you could explain.
I look forward to your response, Mr. "Kill Every Single Palestinian."
It was muslimns who set fire to a train filled with Hindus.
As for whether there is religious extremism everywhere-in different times and places it has existed within every major religion.
A century ago Christianity was the source of much of the violence attributed to religion. Right now it is Islam. Islam is the scourge of the world right now and the cause of much evil. The biggest problem is that the Imams and religious figures of Islam are not vocalizing any disgust with terrorism and violence and are actually in many ways instigating it. Right now Islam is the enemy of the world.
As for why this kind of violence is rarely seen in the US its because we're all working too hard to let our base fears and fanaticisms take over. Its also because we are smarter than those uneducated assholes.......................................... .....
[quote]Riots were sparked off across Gujarat early this month after a Muslim mob attacked and killed a group of Hindu activists travelling by train in the town of Godhra.
Several days of revenge attacks followed in which at least 700 people, mostly members of the minority Muslim community, were killed.<hr></blockquote>
As you can see from the story, the number of casualities where highest among the muslims here as well. It is also worth mentioning that the hindu activists where trying to raise a hindu temple on the ruins of a mosque... Land again...
[quote]Its also because we are smarter than those uneducated assholes.<hr></blockquote>
OMG... yes, you must be smarter... <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
Funtamentalism may be about the "fundamentals" but it really means " dawgonnit I know what's right . . .its just common sayance . . Its what I think",
or, to be fair: it usually means that it is about reading a text as if one's own understanding of it is the fundamental truth and that whatever that text (whichever 'scripture' of choice or upbringing) says according to a simple (read simplistic)and literal understanding means is the only truth.
<strong>Dudeguy, No, i for one don't know what you mean. You come off like an ignoranti. Not knoing the very basics of why Ireland is different than the United States. When there has been a history of bloody subjugation of the Irish by the English for hundreds years and now they practice it upon themselves.
Funtamentalism may be about the "fundamentals" but it really means " dawgonnit I know what's right . . .its just common sayance . . Its what I think",
or, to be fair: it usually means that it is about reading a text as if one's own understanding of it is the fundamental truth and that whatever that text (whichever 'scripture' of choice or upbringing) says according to a simple (read simplistic)and literal understanding means is the only truth.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Ignoranti!! <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
Now about the Palestinean thing... they are nothing more than terrorists, and you kill terrorists. You don't negotiate with them. You don't give them air-time on Al Jazeera or CNN. You kill them. This is what Israel is doing now. They should have started this long ago.
Now about the Palestinean thing... they are nothing more than terrorists, and you kill terrorists. You don't negotiate with them. You don't give them air-time on Al Jazeera or CNN. You kill them. This is what Israel is doing now. They should have started this long ago.
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Amen, brother..........................................