With 14 months of R&D, apple could probably do something more than provide average data speeds.
LG Revolution dropping browse time from 7+ hours for iPhone to less than 4 confirms my point. Even the best "4G" rates 1 1/2 fewer hours of battery life than the iPhone 4.
Quote:
In this one story, a fox sees some high-hanging grapes and wishes to eat them. When the fox is unable to think of a way to reach them, he surmises that the grapes are probably not worth eating, as they must not be ripe or that they are sour. This example follows a pattern: one desires something, finds it unattainable, and reduces one's dissonance by criticizing it.
[wiki - cognitive dissonance]
just accept Apple's mistake of not including LTE or even 21mbps HSPA+
How about dropping the lame fable and give a use for the speed. I suspect the reason you chose to tell a story is because you don't have one. It's not worth dropping hours of battery life now for an assumed and unrealized future use for the extra speed.
The battery could have been improved upon to compensate for the additional power draw. The extra battery draw would only come from downloading files, not things like talking on your phone/texting.
As far the use for that speed, tethering would be an obvious advantage. Upload speeds of videos you capture on the go, app download speeds, faster syncing, streaming video etc.
Just a few circumstances where I could see it being useful personally.
The battery could have been improved upon to compensate for the additional power draw. The extra battery draw would only come from downloading files, not things like talking on your phone/texting.
As far the use for that speed, tethering would be an obvious advantage. Upload speeds of videos you capture on the go, app download speeds, faster syncing, streaming video etc.
Just a few circumstances where I could see it being useful personally.
There's only so much a battery can be improved without just making it larger or giving the technology time to be ready for commercialization.
An active radio, even when not transmitting and receiving a data payload, will consume power just for being on, and they generally scan the spectrum for towers on a regular basis, which consumes power, and if the signal is weak, it can really drain power quickly. That's why the lists on how to conserve power suggest even turning off WiFi and Bluetooth if you're not using them - they do make a noticeable difference in battery life. On heavy-use days, I sometimes even turn off 3G when I don't need the speed.
This article is a complete travesty of misquote, misunderstanding, misspelling, and misleading.
AT&T has about as much 14.4 Mbps HSDPA as they did 7.2 HSDPA 2 years ago when the 3GS launched...almost none. By now, real world data rates are 3-5 Mbps.
You'll see at least that speed on the 4S immediately, and probably upwards of 7-10 Mbps over the next 2 years.
What's there not to get? As you have noticed, AT&T provides considerably lower than 7 Mbps now, and there's nothing to suggest it will get much higher than that anytime soon. iPhone 4 can already go up to 7.2, so the point is that there's not much the faster potential of iPhone 4S' 14.4 can offer Americans.
Even if AT&T dramatically boosts its mobile network throughput, it will likely not saturate the iPhone 4, let alone take any special advantage of the iPhone 4S' "4G" like speeds. So the potential is there, but not the actual mobile network capacity, at least in the US.
iPhone 4S will benefit users like those in Canada and Europe, where 14.4 service is more common. The only possible good news is that AT&T is talking about building out HSDPA along with LTE, which means at some point iPhone 4S users could have blazing fast data access. But its not here now, and there's no firm commitment to delivering anything close to +7 Mbps speeds currently being promised by AT&T.
On Verizon and Sprint it's even worse, because there's zero potential for the iPhone 4S to ever work any faster on their networks than the iPhone 4, which currently feels dog slow compared to AT&T's <7Mpbs service.
I get up to 5 MBit download and 2 upload on AT&T now. While I often like daniel's posts this one just sounds incorrect. AT&T has been rolling out new android phones using the faster huspa speeds and tests have been conducted showing them faster, at time approaching 10 mbits and more. Apple benchmarks in the presentation to those. How can Daniel say the actual speeds will be slower than what we are getting now? Give me a freakin' break...
And yet people were clamoring for LTE. How foolish they all are.
The telecoms need shut down. Have the BBB do it, I don't care. If we ever want this country to be competitive again, we need to have higher standards and an iron fist on forced carrier hardware upgrades.
Are you suggesting that the Better Business Bureau "shut down" the carriers? That ridiculous suggestion aside, Apple chose to release a phone that does not support LTE? The carriers are supporting high-speed data, but Apple chose to adopt a protocol that nobody in the US uses.
Apple notwithstanding, any carrier promising 3G beyond 5mbps is outright lying and should be taken to task for their blatant deception. Like I said, show me in volume around the world where you can get 5mbps sustained on 3G. HS-whatever-PA is all nice on paper but in practice you're pushing the limits of what is possible with 3G networks as they currently stand around the world.
You mean 3G only, not 3.5G/HSPA+, right? Because there are plenty of carriers who deliver a lot better than 5 Mbps, even on straight 3G phones.
Apple notwithstanding, any carrier promising 3G beyond 5mbps is outright lying and should be taken to task for their blatant deception. Like I said, show me in volume around the world where you can get 5mbps sustained on 3G. HS-whatever-PA is all nice on paper but in practice you're pushing the limits of what is possible with 3G networks as they currently stand around the world.
Would you ellaborate as to why not? 15 codes, 16QAM + MIMO or Dual Cell will get you real speeds beyond 5Mbps quite easily. Just as with LTE it can be done, it can be done with HSPA+ (or soonish HSPA+Adv). It's mainly a matter of dimensioning the radio network and transmission to fit your needs. The first google search I did came up with: http://www.signalsresearch.com/Docs/MWC-%20SRG.pdf. How many of such research papers would you need to satisfy your "in volume around the world" hypotheses?
A while back many networks fell in the 2-3Mbps practical range (achieved with 5-10 codes and 16QAM), but the higher speeds (5-10Mbps) have been on the increase for a while now and should be reality in quite a few locations already since 10-15 codes and dual-cell has become more prevalent and the reception will improve with advanced receivers (FDE, Interference cancellation, CPC and FDPCH) coming to commercial devices withouth changing network HW (SW upgrade required).
Are you suggesting that the Better Business Bureau "shut down" the carriers? That ridiculous suggestion aside, Apple chose to release a phone that does not support LTE? The carriers are supporting high-speed data, but Apple chose to adopt a protocol that nobody in the US uses.
Your angst is misdirected.
You realize that? the world is larger than the U.S., right? Also, this is likely Apple's way of telling these morons to shape up.
So please forgive my ignorance, but I thought the Apple presentation said that the 4S supports HSDPA, not HSPA+?!? Are they the same thing?? Thanks!
They are not the same thing and 4S does not do HSPA+. 4S does HSPA.
- 3GPP Release 5 introduced HSDPA (High Speed Downlink Packet Access) with speeds up to 14.4Mbps in the downlink and this tech was deployed to networks roughly around 2007-2009.
- 3GPP Release 6 introduced HSUPA (High Speed Uplink Packet Access) up to 5.8Mbps in the uplink direction. Deployed roughly 2008-2010
These two together are collectively known as HSPA
- 3GPP Release 7 brought HSPA+, which increased speeds in both directions (DL 21Mbps-84Mbps) and brought many other improvements. This is what has been deployed in networks globally during the last few years or so.
- 3GPP Release 8 brought LTE and is being deployed as we speak
- Release 9 will bring improvements to LTE. Next 1-3 years for deployment
- Release 10 will bring HSPA+ to 168Mbps
- Release 11 will bring HSPA+ Advanced (speeds up to 678Mbps). 3-5 years from now in real life.
In a publicly issued document to mobile developers dated just last month, AT&T stated, "HSDPA?an ehhanced [sic] protocol in the HSPA family?is the highest-performance cellular-data technology ever deployed. Its peak theoretical rate is 14.4 megabits per second (Mbps).
I don't understand this quote from the article, my current VZW Thunderbolt 4G LTE is showing speed tests around 30 Mbps down and 12Mbps up currently. Can someone explain what they mean by highest performance cellular data technology with a theoretical rate of 14.4 Mbps?
I don't understand this quote from the article, my current VZW Thunderbolt 4G LTE is showing speed tests around 30 Mbps down and 12Mbps up currently. Can someone explain what they mean by highest performance cellular data technology with a theoretical rate of 14.4 Mbps?
I's called an error or a lie depending on your viewpoint. Highest performing cellular data at the moment is LTE with HSPA+ a very close second.
Frankly it doesn't matter. Wherever I go the AT&T signal is so unreliable that what their theoretical capacity is of NO relevance.
I can't tell you how many times I have full signal strength, yet no internet connectivity on my 3gs. Or how often it takes FOREVER to do things using the AT&T network.
I will take a slower consistent connection over anything AT&T.
I'm pretty sure that AT&T's network, in most large cities, can pull down 21mbps and T-Mobile's network is lightyears beyond 14mbps with their 42mbps network that is about to be utilized by the Galaxy S II. Some of the information in this article is misleading as the iPhone 4s will more than be able to use the technology in AT&T's network because it is almost double the speed of the phone.
The real story is the disparity of speed options available to Sprint and Verizon customers because of a lack of 4G on the iPhone 4s (ironic that the entire iPhone 4 line lacks any 4G at all, and no, 14mbps really doesn't count). The most notable omission will be Sprint's WiMax, as it's been around for years, and every competitive phone to the iPhone will be WiMax-enabled on their network.
Comments
Why do you insist on being an Apple apologist in every single post? Are you trying to be the unofficial Apple customer service representative of AI?
Hij is wethouder Hekking...
Hij is wethouder Hekking...
? Dutch? But why? And what?
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4450/lg-revolution/5
With 14 months of R&D, apple could probably do something more than provide average data speeds.
LG Revolution dropping browse time from 7+ hours for iPhone to less than 4 confirms my point. Even the best "4G" rates 1 1/2 fewer hours of battery life than the iPhone 4.
In this one story, a fox sees some high-hanging grapes and wishes to eat them. When the fox is unable to think of a way to reach them, he surmises that the grapes are probably not worth eating, as they must not be ripe or that they are sour. This example follows a pattern: one desires something, finds it unattainable, and reduces one's dissonance by criticizing it.
[wiki - cognitive dissonance]
just accept Apple's mistake of not including LTE or even 21mbps HSPA+
How about dropping the lame fable and give a use for the speed. I suspect the reason you chose to tell a story is because you don't have one. It's not worth dropping hours of battery life now for an assumed and unrealized future use for the extra speed.
Doesn't it confirm my comments?
How about dropping the lame fable and give a use.
The battery could have been improved upon to compensate for the additional power draw. The extra battery draw would only come from downloading files, not things like talking on your phone/texting.
As far the use for that speed, tethering would be an obvious advantage. Upload speeds of videos you capture on the go, app download speeds, faster syncing, streaming video etc.
Just a few circumstances where I could see it being useful personally.
The battery could have been improved upon to compensate for the additional power draw. The extra battery draw would only come from downloading files, not things like talking on your phone/texting.
As far the use for that speed, tethering would be an obvious advantage. Upload speeds of videos you capture on the go, app download speeds, faster syncing, streaming video etc.
Just a few circumstances where I could see it being useful personally.
There's only so much a battery can be improved without just making it larger or giving the technology time to be ready for commercialization.
An active radio, even when not transmitting and receiving a data payload, will consume power just for being on, and they generally scan the spectrum for towers on a regular basis, which consumes power, and if the signal is weak, it can really drain power quickly. That's why the lists on how to conserve power suggest even turning off WiFi and Bluetooth if you're not using them - they do make a noticeable difference in battery life. On heavy-use days, I sometimes even turn off 3G when I don't need the speed.
It won't matter because the battery life would still suck, given the state of current LTE chips. You'd need to turn off LTE anyway.
Assuming this is real, how do you plan to use a 15+ Mbps connection on a pocket-able device?
Ask Sol what he could do with that.
AT&T has about as much 14.4 Mbps HSDPA as they did 7.2 HSDPA 2 years ago when the 3GS launched...almost none. By now, real world data rates are 3-5 Mbps.
You'll see at least that speed on the 4S immediately, and probably upwards of 7-10 Mbps over the next 2 years.
What's there not to get? As you have noticed, AT&T provides considerably lower than 7 Mbps now, and there's nothing to suggest it will get much higher than that anytime soon. iPhone 4 can already go up to 7.2, so the point is that there's not much the faster potential of iPhone 4S' 14.4 can offer Americans.
Even if AT&T dramatically boosts its mobile network throughput, it will likely not saturate the iPhone 4, let alone take any special advantage of the iPhone 4S' "4G" like speeds. So the potential is there, but not the actual mobile network capacity, at least in the US.
iPhone 4S will benefit users like those in Canada and Europe, where 14.4 service is more common. The only possible good news is that AT&T is talking about building out HSDPA along with LTE, which means at some point iPhone 4S users could have blazing fast data access. But its not here now, and there's no firm commitment to delivering anything close to +7 Mbps speeds currently being promised by AT&T.
On Verizon and Sprint it's even worse, because there's zero potential for the iPhone 4S to ever work any faster on their networks than the iPhone 4, which currently feels dog slow compared to AT&T's <7Mpbs service.
I get up to 5 MBit download and 2 upload on AT&T now. While I often like daniel's posts this one just sounds incorrect. AT&T has been rolling out new android phones using the faster huspa speeds and tests have been conducted showing them faster, at time approaching 10 mbits and more. Apple benchmarks in the presentation to those. How can Daniel say the actual speeds will be slower than what we are getting now? Give me a freakin' break...
And yet people were clamoring for LTE. How foolish they all are.
The telecoms need shut down. Have the BBB do it, I don't care. If we ever want this country to be competitive again, we need to have higher standards and an iron fist on forced carrier hardware upgrades.
Are you suggesting that the Better Business Bureau "shut down" the carriers? That ridiculous suggestion aside, Apple chose to release a phone that does not support LTE? The carriers are supporting high-speed data, but Apple chose to adopt a protocol that nobody in the US uses.
Your angst is misdirected.
Apple notwithstanding, any carrier promising 3G beyond 5mbps is outright lying and should be taken to task for their blatant deception. Like I said, show me in volume around the world where you can get 5mbps sustained on 3G. HS-whatever-PA is all nice on paper but in practice you're pushing the limits of what is possible with 3G networks as they currently stand around the world.
You mean 3G only, not 3.5G/HSPA+, right? Because there are plenty of carriers who deliver a lot better than 5 Mbps, even on straight 3G phones.
Apple notwithstanding, any carrier promising 3G beyond 5mbps is outright lying and should be taken to task for their blatant deception. Like I said, show me in volume around the world where you can get 5mbps sustained on 3G. HS-whatever-PA is all nice on paper but in practice you're pushing the limits of what is possible with 3G networks as they currently stand around the world.
Would you ellaborate as to why not? 15 codes, 16QAM + MIMO or Dual Cell will get you real speeds beyond 5Mbps quite easily. Just as with LTE it can be done, it can be done with HSPA+ (or soonish HSPA+Adv). It's mainly a matter of dimensioning the radio network and transmission to fit your needs. The first google search I did came up with: http://www.signalsresearch.com/Docs/MWC-%20SRG.pdf. How many of such research papers would you need to satisfy your "in volume around the world" hypotheses?
A while back many networks fell in the 2-3Mbps practical range (achieved with 5-10 codes and 16QAM), but the higher speeds (5-10Mbps) have been on the increase for a while now and should be reality in quite a few locations already since 10-15 codes and dual-cell has become more prevalent and the reception will improve with advanced receivers (FDE, Interference cancellation, CPC and FDPCH) coming to commercial devices withouth changing network HW (SW upgrade required).
Regs, Jarkko
Are you suggesting that the Better Business Bureau "shut down" the carriers? That ridiculous suggestion aside, Apple chose to release a phone that does not support LTE? The carriers are supporting high-speed data, but Apple chose to adopt a protocol that nobody in the US uses.
Your angst is misdirected.
You realize that? the world is larger than the U.S., right? Also, this is likely Apple's way of telling these morons to shape up.
So please forgive my ignorance, but I thought the Apple presentation said that the 4S supports HSDPA, not HSPA+?!? Are they the same thing?? Thanks!
They are not the same thing and 4S does not do HSPA+. 4S does HSPA.
- 3GPP Release 5 introduced HSDPA (High Speed Downlink Packet Access) with speeds up to 14.4Mbps in the downlink and this tech was deployed to networks roughly around 2007-2009.
- 3GPP Release 6 introduced HSUPA (High Speed Uplink Packet Access) up to 5.8Mbps in the uplink direction. Deployed roughly 2008-2010
These two together are collectively known as HSPA
- 3GPP Release 7 brought HSPA+, which increased speeds in both directions (DL 21Mbps-84Mbps) and brought many other improvements. This is what has been deployed in networks globally during the last few years or so.
- 3GPP Release 8 brought LTE and is being deployed as we speak
- Release 9 will bring improvements to LTE. Next 1-3 years for deployment
- Release 10 will bring HSPA+ to 168Mbps
- Release 11 will bring HSPA+ Advanced (speeds up to 678Mbps). 3-5 years from now in real life.
Regs, Jarkko
In a publicly issued document to mobile developers dated just last month, AT&T stated, "HSDPA?an ehhanced [sic] protocol in the HSPA family?is the highest-performance cellular-data technology ever deployed. Its peak theoretical rate is 14.4 megabits per second (Mbps).
I don't understand this quote from the article, my current VZW Thunderbolt 4G LTE is showing speed tests around 30 Mbps down and 12Mbps up currently. Can someone explain what they mean by highest performance cellular data technology with a theoretical rate of 14.4 Mbps?
I don't understand this quote from the article, my current VZW Thunderbolt 4G LTE is showing speed tests around 30 Mbps down and 12Mbps up currently. Can someone explain what they mean by highest performance cellular data technology with a theoretical rate of 14.4 Mbps?
I's called an error or a lie depending on your viewpoint. Highest performing cellular data at the moment is LTE with HSPA+ a very close second.
Regs, Jarkko
- Release 11 will bring HSPA+ Advanced (speeds up to 678Mbps). 3-5 years from now in real life.
So 23 seconds at peak speed to hit the data cap. Great.
I can't tell you how many times I have full signal strength, yet no internet connectivity on my 3gs. Or how often it takes FOREVER to do things using the AT&T network.
I will take a slower consistent connection over anything AT&T.
The real story is the disparity of speed options available to Sprint and Verizon customers because of a lack of 4G on the iPhone 4s (ironic that the entire iPhone 4 line lacks any 4G at all, and no, 14mbps really doesn't count). The most notable omission will be Sprint's WiMax, as it's been around for years, and every competitive phone to the iPhone will be WiMax-enabled on their network.