Everything has to be "versus Apple" to make it on this site
No, it just has to be of interest to Apple users. If it were titled "Versus Android" I would still read it. There are many an example of Appleinsider articles which are 'of interest to' Apple users rather than directly affecting or competing with them (or the products they use).
To take on Android, would be more appropriate. Android is eating your lunch Microsoft, not iPhone.
Damn straight. The Lumia 800 is targeting the low/mid budget and the Lumia 710 is very much low budget.
If you look at German pricing for the Lumia's and iPhones...
Nokia Lumia 800 420 ? ($584 USD)
Nokia Lumia 710 270 ? ($375 USD)
iPhone 3GS 8GB 369 ? ($513 USD)
iPhone 4 8GB 519 ? ($722 USD)
iPhone 4S 16GB 629 ? ($874 USD)
The Lumia 800 is actually priced closer to an iPhone 8GB 3GS than it is to an iPhone 4 8GB and the Lumia 710 is in another budget price bracket all of its own.
These phones are definitely built to compete with the crappier BoGo or "free" (on contract) Android devices.
Nokia didn't actually announce anything to compete directly in the "top of the market" range. There were substantial rumors of another device (the Lumia 900 "Ace") with a 4.3" screen and bumped up specs but nothing was confirmed.
It's going to be interesting to see where Nokia position Windows Phone.
What's obvious is you don't know your ass from a hole in the wall.
Microsoft was slow out of the gate watching and waiting like a predator. They "were" the only game in the smartphone market for years. Then iOS happened which took the smartphone market in a completely new direction. A direction Microsoft wasn't prepared for. 5 years later they have deployed Windows Phone 7.5 Mango (a great but young mobile OS)and have essentially purchased a phone manufacturer (Nokia). Over the next 12 months we're going to see a "sleeping giant" enter the mobile phone arena.
iOS and Android have a lot to fear.
No, please remove your head from your posterior. There is nothing to like about this OS as proven by its abject failure in the marketplace. Also, Windows was never the only smartphone game as you seem to think. NEVER! There was symbian and other proprietary OS's such as Palm and BB at the same time. In fact, MSFT's past efforts were the antithesis of "smart". The reality is that MOST people don't really like MSFT products but have been forced to use them, and now they are irrelevant in the mobile space as there are far superior choices out there. People are tired of being screwed by this company with buggy, bloated over-priced software and are very happy to have other options.
I know that this is the Internet and making informed opinions is frowned upon but why don't you try one before bashing it?
Most non-techies who use WP7 prefer it to Android. The problem for Microsoft is that the WP7 devices so far have been lacklustre and haven't been marketed with any real conviction. There's also a huge gap in their app portfolio.
LOL - "Most non-techies who use WP7 prefer it to Android." - what, all 12 of them? And they work for MSFT?
I still do not understand how the Nokia cloner Windows Phone is different from any of the other cloner Windows Phones. Same fugly, unusable OS with text scrolling off to the right all over the place. Same crappy Zune services. Locked to the proprietary Microsoft Windows platform. Locked to the crappy BING services.
How is the Nokia cloner Windows Phone going to all of a sudden get people to look past all the failings of Windows Phone and start buying? Makes no sense. People already rejected Windows Phone from all the other cloners.
I think this is spot on. This is the "other shoe" that is waiting to drop in regards Windows Phone hardware.
Microsoft bought Nokia because Nokia had the reputation for hardware. They were considered one of the best and everyone has been waiting for these Nokia phones.
The fact is though, that Nokia was king of hardware when hardware was all that counted and most phones were crappy flip phones. Hardware still matters, but software and eco-system matters much much more. Nowadays we have dozens of Android smart phones with absolutely excellent hardware and specs as well as a variety of tablets.
Once these Nokia phones start coming out and getting reviewed, and everyone realises that the hardware is no great shakes or at least no better nor worse than anything else, the differentiator (and most of Nokia's brand value) will just evaporate. Nokia is really just another phone manufacturer and the Windows Phone platform will live or die by what Microsoft does, not Nokia.
Nokia (at least in terms of the company that it was) is already dead. They could go away tomorrow and nothing would change about the phone market.
No, please remove your head from your posterior. There is nothing to like about this OS as proven by its abject failure in the marketplace. Also, Windows was never the only smartphone game as you seem to think. NEVER! There was symbian and other proprietary OS's such as Palm and BB at the same time. In fact, MSFT's past efforts were the antithesis of "smart". The reality is that MOST people don't really like MSFT products but have been forced to use them, and now they are irrelevant in the mobile space as there are far superior choices out there. People are tired of being screwed by this company with buggy, bloated over-priced software and are very happy to have other options.
Six months?? I think it's quite obvious right now that it's a total fackin' failure.
Never count out MS...they are known for their third iteration being a hit -- windows 3.1 for example...
Windows CE on checkbook size PCs that connected to external modems in the mid 90s was attempt 1,
Windows Pocket PC/Mobile on palm like devices and phones like the Palm Treo was take 2,
Win Phone is try three. the one where they get it right usually...and they have xbox and Zune, which gives them a leg up in gaming, and subscribtion music on every phone, apple cant do the latter,
Ok I will buy that, however I have a question. How many times has MS got it correct o the first try?
I'm going to say never.
It's interesting that you mention that though as Microsoft's first smartphone was released over a decade ago.
It was very open (as in open to customize, not source). Microsoft allowed almost total customization and had little control over the hardware.
This openness didn't start off so bad, but over time the number of different phones and capabilities led to a totally fragmented platform. It became increasingly difficult to write software to target all possible devices and software versions.
Some OEM's even started to "add value" by totally replacing the UI with their own.
After almost a decade of this OS being on the market it reached a breaking point. Microsoft basically had to throw the old OS out and start with a clean slate.
So forget about the "7" in the version number, Windows Phone is Microsoft's second attempt at smartphones.
... Most non-techies who use WP7 prefer it to Android. The problem for Microsoft is that the WP7 devices so far have been lacklustre and haven't been marketed with any real conviction. ....
I don't think this is true at all and it seems to me that you are just making it up given the figures on OS adoption that we are all aware of. You talk of proper debate but then throw out a completely unsupported statement like that?
Personally, I find Windows Phone a very confusing interface although I only have limited experience with actually using it. The only friend of mine that actually has one however, is exactly the "non-techie" you speak of.
She is a mid-level manager at a local corporation and got one as a gift so she is trying to use it as her main phone. She finds it absolutely impenetrable and has no idea how to work it at all. She hasn't figured out how to use it even after two weeks of having it, with the exception of the camera and the phone part. Every time she phones someone, it adds a giant red tile to the home screen with that person's phone number and name on it and after two weeks of use, the home screen scrolled for yards and yards with all these name-tiles. She uses it by endlessly scrolling up and down this long list of tiles on the main screen and touching one to make a call. That's all she knows.
Now that's a true "Windows Phone 7 Ultimate Edition" story.
I think the picture of the 800 looks really cool. That looks like something Apple would build.
Like and iPod Nano phone? I can see that with the color and aluminium casing but I think it's an original design is more than enough ways to keep people from thinking it's an Apple product.
I like it and wish MS and Nokia well. I wonder if their app store is big enough to be viable at this point. For their sake, I hope so.
Ugliest UI ever :roll eyes: Though its minimalistic and clean there is no sense of symmetry and "lacks taste" These guys can't find a good designer to copy Apple after all these years with all their $ ???
I agree that the Start screen is pretty ugly. Those big monochrome tiles don't do much for me. But everything else is pretty interesting. I'm especially interested in the hubs - people, music, etc. The biggest problem with Windows Phone for me is that it tries to be too people centric. I'm not a social animal. I don't use FaceBook or Twitter. So the social integration aspects are lost on me.
Comments
The 710, though, looks nice aesthetically.
Everything has to be "versus Apple" to make it on this site
No, it just has to be of interest to Apple users. If it were titled "Versus Android" I would still read it. There are many an example of Appleinsider articles which are 'of interest to' Apple users rather than directly affecting or competing with them (or the products they use).
to take on Apple's iPhone 4S
To take on Android, would be more appropriate. Android is eating your lunch Microsoft, not iPhone.
Damn straight. The Lumia 800 is targeting the low/mid budget and the Lumia 710 is very much low budget.
If you look at German pricing for the Lumia's and iPhones...
- Nokia Lumia 800 420 ? ($584 USD)
- Nokia Lumia 710 270 ? ($375 USD)
- iPhone 3GS 8GB 369 ? ($513 USD)
- iPhone 4 8GB 519 ? ($722 USD)
- iPhone 4S 16GB 629 ? ($874 USD)
The Lumia 800 is actually priced closer to an iPhone 8GB 3GS than it is to an iPhone 4 8GB and the Lumia 710 is in another budget price bracket all of its own.These phones are definitely built to compete with the crappier BoGo or "free" (on contract) Android devices.
Nokia didn't actually announce anything to compete directly in the "top of the market" range. There were substantial rumors of another device (the Lumia 900 "Ace") with a 4.3" screen and bumped up specs but nothing was confirmed.
It's going to be interesting to see where Nokia position Windows Phone.
The? case? Do you really not see it?
There is nothing to sue for apple.These are no iPhone clones!
With this machines they do NOT steal design or IP from Apple!
Microsoft and Nokia are going the right way!
They try to be a fair competitor in this market.
Respect for that!
enough said!
What's obvious is you don't know your ass from a hole in the wall.
Microsoft was slow out of the gate watching and waiting like a predator. They "were" the only game in the smartphone market for years. Then iOS happened which took the smartphone market in a completely new direction. A direction Microsoft wasn't prepared for. 5 years later they have deployed Windows Phone 7.5 Mango (a great but young mobile OS)and have essentially purchased a phone manufacturer (Nokia). Over the next 12 months we're going to see a "sleeping giant" enter the mobile phone arena.
iOS and Android have a lot to fear.
No, please remove your head from your posterior. There is nothing to like about this OS as proven by its abject failure in the marketplace. Also, Windows was never the only smartphone game as you seem to think. NEVER! There was symbian and other proprietary OS's such as Palm and BB at the same time. In fact, MSFT's past efforts were the antithesis of "smart". The reality is that MOST people don't really like MSFT products but have been forced to use them, and now they are irrelevant in the mobile space as there are far superior choices out there. People are tired of being screwed by this company with buggy, bloated over-priced software and are very happy to have other options.
Ok I will buy that, however I have a question. How many times has MS got it correct o the first try ?
Are you talking about the operating system or the phone?
The phones are first try... the OS is already second gen.
I know that this is the Internet and making informed opinions is frowned upon but why don't you try one before bashing it?
Most non-techies who use WP7 prefer it to Android. The problem for Microsoft is that the WP7 devices so far have been lacklustre and haven't been marketed with any real conviction. There's also a huge gap in their app portfolio.
LOL - "Most non-techies who use WP7 prefer it to Android." - what, all 12 of them? And they work for MSFT?
I still do not understand how the Nokia cloner Windows Phone is different from any of the other cloner Windows Phones. Same fugly, unusable OS with text scrolling off to the right all over the place. Same crappy Zune services. Locked to the proprietary Microsoft Windows platform. Locked to the crappy BING services.
How is the Nokia cloner Windows Phone going to all of a sudden get people to look past all the failings of Windows Phone and start buying? Makes no sense. People already rejected Windows Phone from all the other cloners.
I think this is spot on. This is the "other shoe" that is waiting to drop in regards Windows Phone hardware.
Microsoft bought Nokia because Nokia had the reputation for hardware. They were considered one of the best and everyone has been waiting for these Nokia phones.
The fact is though, that Nokia was king of hardware when hardware was all that counted and most phones were crappy flip phones. Hardware still matters, but software and eco-system matters much much more. Nowadays we have dozens of Android smart phones with absolutely excellent hardware and specs as well as a variety of tablets.
Once these Nokia phones start coming out and getting reviewed, and everyone realises that the hardware is no great shakes or at least no better nor worse than anything else, the differentiator (and most of Nokia's brand value) will just evaporate. Nokia is really just another phone manufacturer and the Windows Phone platform will live or die by what Microsoft does, not Nokia.
Nokia (at least in terms of the company that it was) is already dead. They could go away tomorrow and nothing would change about the phone market.
No, please remove your head from your posterior. There is nothing to like about this OS as proven by its abject failure in the marketplace. Also, Windows was never the only smartphone game as you seem to think. NEVER! There was symbian and other proprietary OS's such as Palm and BB at the same time. In fact, MSFT's past efforts were the antithesis of "smart". The reality is that MOST people don't really like MSFT products but have been forced to use them, and now they are irrelevant in the mobile space as there are far superior choices out there. People are tired of being screwed by this company with buggy, bloated over-priced software and are very happy to have other options.
We'll see. Keep this bookmarked for 12 months.
Six months?? I think it's quite obvious right now that it's a total fackin' failure.
Never count out MS...they are known for their third iteration being a hit -- windows 3.1 for example...
Windows CE on checkbook size PCs that connected to external modems in the mid 90s was attempt 1,
Windows Pocket PC/Mobile on palm like devices and phones like the Palm Treo was take 2,
Win Phone is try three. the one where they get it right usually...and they have xbox and Zune, which gives them a leg up in gaming, and subscribtion music on every phone, apple cant do the latter,
It's not going to take Apple six months to sue the pants off of Nokia for this design.
Well, don't these phones look ugly!
I would think that they instruct trolls to not contradict each other in troll school, but what do I know...
Anyway, I don't see how these phones are going to justify the move to Windows Phone; If I'd buy anything from Nokia now, it would only be the N9...
Ok I will buy that, however I have a question. How many times has MS got it correct o the first try?
I'm going to say never.
It's interesting that you mention that though as Microsoft's first smartphone was released over a decade ago.
It was very open (as in open to customize, not source). Microsoft allowed almost total customization and had little control over the hardware.
This openness didn't start off so bad, but over time the number of different phones and capabilities led to a totally fragmented platform. It became increasingly difficult to write software to target all possible devices and software versions.
Some OEM's even started to "add value" by totally replacing the UI with their own.
After almost a decade of this OS being on the market it reached a breaking point. Microsoft basically had to throw the old OS out and start with a clean slate.
So forget about the "7" in the version number, Windows Phone is Microsoft's second attempt at smartphones.
... Most non-techies who use WP7 prefer it to Android. The problem for Microsoft is that the WP7 devices so far have been lacklustre and haven't been marketed with any real conviction. ....
I don't think this is true at all and it seems to me that you are just making it up given the figures on OS adoption that we are all aware of. You talk of proper debate but then throw out a completely unsupported statement like that?
Personally, I find Windows Phone a very confusing interface although I only have limited experience with actually using it. The only friend of mine that actually has one however, is exactly the "non-techie" you speak of.
She is a mid-level manager at a local corporation and got one as a gift so she is trying to use it as her main phone. She finds it absolutely impenetrable and has no idea how to work it at all. She hasn't figured out how to use it even after two weeks of having it, with the exception of the camera and the phone part. Every time she phones someone, it adds a giant red tile to the home screen with that person's phone number and name on it and after two weeks of use, the home screen scrolled for yards and yards with all these name-tiles. She uses it by endlessly scrolling up and down this long list of tiles on the main screen and touching one to make a call. That's all she knows.
Now that's a true "Windows Phone 7 Ultimate Edition" story.
I think the picture of the 800 looks really cool. That looks like something Apple would build.
Like and iPod Nano phone? I can see that with the color and aluminium casing but I think it's an original design is more than enough ways to keep people from thinking it's an Apple product.
I like it and wish MS and Nokia well. I wonder if their app store is big enough to be viable at this point. For their sake, I hope so.
To take on Android, would be more appropriate.
Android is eating your lunch Microsoft, not iPhone.
Microsoft don't want to compete with Android, do you realise just how much money Android makes for Microsoft in licensing. Fooking miiiiiiilions.
So it begins. We will all know in 6 months whether MIcrosoft Mobile is a contender or epic fail
Microsoft does not get another shot after this...it's the last bullet in the gun
Oh yeah? That's what they also said about the Zune and... oh wait
The? case? Do you really not see it?
The case doesn't look anything like an iPhone/iPod/iPod Touch. Why would they sue?
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphon...7/default.aspx
Ugliest UI ever :roll eyes: Though its minimalistic and clean there is no sense of symmetry and "lacks taste" These guys can't find a good designer to copy Apple after all these years with all their $ ???
I agree that the Start screen is pretty ugly. Those big monochrome tiles don't do much for me. But everything else is pretty interesting. I'm especially interested in the hubs - people, music, etc. The biggest problem with Windows Phone for me is that it tries to be too people centric. I'm not a social animal. I don't use FaceBook or Twitter. So the social integration aspects are lost on me.