This is quite irresponsible. Apple will be growing server capacity inline with the number of 4S sold. If this hack becomes widespread it could ruin the experience for genuine, paying customers.
EXACTLY. If you don't like it, then there's always Android. Where you can get gingerbread on your nice G1.....oh, wait.
And the Siri servers already starte buckle under the strain of 4 million iPhone 4S users in 3 days. These asshat trolls never think what would happen if Apple rolled out Siri to 120 million iDevices at once.
As for Cash907's comment on Mango it's been for how long now and I still haven't had the update pushed to me. Apparently it's ok for MS to do a systematic and controlled release, but not Apple.
You were the one defending it to the DEATH saying that there was just no way the iphone 4 could handle Siri...
Anything you say in this thread I won't be able to take seriously.
People don't have G1s though. They're 3 years old now.
This means that you have an option to get a free Android phone running the newest release of Android.
What are you evne talking about. You're not making any sense AT ALL. What does that have to do with anything? Yeah, G1 was the first Android phone....what the hell is the free thing?
So? First, do you know that it's the same version? Maybe Apple added new capabilities. Second, perhaps it didn't run well enough to meet Apple's standards, particularly when other things are active.
You are not making sense. Perhaps this, perhaps that. It was a free app so they are under no obligation to keep it running but it would have been nice to treat it like the iDisk policy and let it run until the two year contract expiration. Instead it makes it look like they killed it to twist your arm into buying a new phone and pay an early termination fee.
This is quite irresponsible. Apple will be growing server capacity inline with the number of 4S sold. If this hack becomes widespread it could ruin the experience for genuine, paying customers.
Exactly my first thought and I agree totally. This is asinine.
Given it is mostly done server side I have to assume Apple can sort out what is an iPhone 4s and block the rest if they wish though. I have little doubt more devices will gain Siri as the server capacity grows.
Given it is mostly done server side I have to assume Apple can sort out what is an iPhone 4s and block the rest if they wish though. I have little doubt more devices will gain Siri as the server capacity grows.
Can't wait to see those overage fees for all the data.
You were the one defending it to the DEATH saying that there was just no way the iphone 4 could handle Siri...
Anything you say in this thread I won't be able to take seriously.
1) I seem to recall you saying Siri required no processing whatsoever. I said it clearly does. I was right.
2) Siri was already available as an app for previous iPhones so saying that it wasn't technically possible to work at some level is not something I've ever said or would ever say. I said ? and still say ? there are clear logistical, marketing, and potential technical reasons Apple did it nor will include Siri for previous iDevices. With two years of Apple-owned Siri development and a completely different requirement for minimal service requirements should be considered by anyone with half a brain.
1) I seem to recall you saying Siri required no processing whatsoever. I said it clearly does. I was right.
Siri uses very little processing power - the majority of the work goes into UI and dictation. Dictation is not as processing intensive as you would think (it understands or it doesn't, it doesn't "think" about what you said to try and understand what it doesn't initially). The majority of the work goes into understanding what your text means, and this is handled by Apple.
Quote:
Given it is mostly done server side I have to assume Apple can sort out what is an iPhone 4s and block the rest if they wish though. I have little doubt more devices will gain Siri as the server capacity grows.
This is what Apple does now. When an iPhone 4S is activated it gains a special authorization token that allows Siri's servers to respond, which is saved to the device. The examples shown use a valid auth token which makes the servers think the commands are coming from a 4S - this is why this method is not something to be mass distributed.
Siri uses very little processing power - the majority of the work goes into UI and dictation. Dictation is not as processing intensive as you would think (it understands or it doesn't, it doesn't "think" about what you said to try and understand what it doesn't initially). The majority of the work goes into understanding what your text means, and this is handled by Apple.
This is what Apple does now. When an iPhone 4S is activated it gains a special authorization token that allows Siri's servers to respond, which is saved to the device. The examples shown use a valid auth token which makes the servers think the commands are coming from a 4S - this is why this method is not something to be mass distributed.
When you ask or command Siri to answer a question or do some task does the recording of your voice get sent to Apple for analysis or does Siri figure out if the request can be understood locally on the device and then send a text based request to the server. I'm curious because it would greatly affect the amount of data sent over the network. I thought that it sent the audio to the server.
So? First, do you know that it's the same version? Maybe Apple added new capabilities. Second, perhaps it didn't run well enough to meet Apple's standards, particularly when other things are active.
Furthermore, even if it DID run just fine on the iPhone 4, that's Apple's choice. If you don't like it, you're free to develop your own phone and software.
I can make a case for and against Siri eventually coming to all devices running iOS 5.0. The tipping point all depends on how important is the data mining it produces.
There are several things I have yet to read about Siri:
How does it compare to the old standalone app in reliability.
How does it compare to the old standalone app in speed.
How does it compare to the old standalone app in versatility.
Since it's systmewide, how does it compare to the old standalone app in data used per user.
Since it's systmewide, how does it compare to the old standalone app in processing per user.
Is any of Siri processed locally like in the previous Voice Control for iPhone for making a call or playing music, or is all processing now sent server-side for processing.
What exactly is that new A5 feature Phil Schiller talked about during the Siri demo?
Clearly there are good technical and logistical reasons for Siri not being pushed to 120 million iDevices at once as we've during the first weekend, but there are clearly marketing reasons why you'd put it on the flagship product first. Anyone who crys foul because Apple didn't roll of the Beta to only new iPod Touches or new sales of 3GS's are just asshats who either don't understand the simplest fundamentals of business and/or just angry little trolls that hate anything successful. Let them had their inferior Speaktoit on the Android Market while claiming it's better because it's not owned by the evil Apple empire.
Siri uses very little processing power - the majority of the work goes into UI and dictation. Dictation is not as processing intensive as you would think (it understands or it doesn't, it doesn't "think" about what you said to try and understand what it doesn't initially). The majority of the work goes into understanding what your text means, and this is handled by Apple.
How do you think "Apple" figures out all these audio bytes?! THAT ALL HAS TO BE PROCESSED!! There is a huge amount of processing involved with Siri. Just because it's not's not local doesn't mean it's not being processed. It's not being sent to Hogwarts so Dumbledorf can put a translation spell on it. No actual magic is involved with breakthrough technology.
Edit: When you and others refer to Siri as requiring no processing are you thinking about Siri as just the nifty little icon on your iPhone when you long-press the Home Button? I certainly don't, and neither should anyone else. It's an ecosystem technology and should be considered as such.
I find it funny when this crap comes out, people 'defend' Apple and say it's their company. Anyways, why don't people get mad because My Wii discs break when I put it into my NES slot?
How do you think "Apple" figures out all these audio bytes?! THAT ALL HAS TO BE PROCESSED!! There is a huge amount of processing involved with Siri. Just because it's not's not local doesn't mean it's not being processed. It's not being sent to Hogwarts so Dumbledorf can put a translation spell on it. No actual magic is involved with breakthrough technology.
Edit: When you and others refer to Siri as requiring no processing are you thinking about Siri as just the nifty little icon on your iPhone when you long-press the Home Button? I certainly don't, and neither should anyone else. It's an ecosystem technology and should be considered as such.
Where are you getting this idea that Siri uses huge amounts of processing power? Do you understand how Siri works at all? Or even do you have any experience with speech-to-text programming, text analyzers, or programming at all? Or are you just blinding guessing it does because it just seems like it would?
Sure, it's processing power, which takes machines and effort to handle - especially from millions of iPhone users, but do not forget that Apple is sitting on over $75 billion in cash reserves and processing information is very very cheap. One investment in a server, which is also cheap, and you have an *infinite ability to process with that machine. (* excluding maintaining and care, which are extremely cheap as well).
To be honest, I'm more wow'ed by Apple's ability to handle the iCloud services over Siri's load. Apple was having problems with Siri's servers, but that was because they underestimated the usage that would come in. With preparation and access to an inane they can be ready for anything.
Where are you getting this idea that Siri uses huge amounts of processing power? Do you understand how Siri works at all? Or even do you have any experience with speech-to-text programming, text analyzers, or programming at all? Or are you just blinding guessing it does because it just seems like it would?
Sure, it's processing power, which takes machines and effort to handle - especially from millions of iPhone users, but do not forget that Apple is sitting on over $75 billion in cash reserves and processing information is very very cheap. One investment in a server, which is also cheap, and you have an *infinite ability to process with that machine. (* excluding maintaining and care, which are extremely cheap as well).
To be honest, I'm more wow'ed by Apple's ability to handle the iCloud services over Siri's load. Apple was having problems with Siri's servers, but that was because they underestimated the usage that would come in. With preparation and access to an inane they can be ready for anything.
1) Yes, understanding human language is process intensive.
2) No, there is no infinite abili to process... as seen by the server issues with the weekend launch of the 4S.
3) you acknowdlge the problems with Siri's servers and "underestimated" usage but you say that processing is infinite and Apple has (rephrasing) an excessive amount of money... Yet you don't think this was an issue with processing all the Siri requests. Too many requests in RAM? (silly) Too much bandwidth for Siri requests? (possible but far from the most likely reason)
Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe Apple ever stated that the 4S hardware spec upgrade was needed for Siri to function or perform optimally. On the other hand, I don't believe they said it was being limited to the 4S due to Apple server limitations or other non-hardware issues. They could have precluded or mitigated the inevitable porting to other devices by stating why Siri was being limited to the 4S.
I fully expect that the limitation to the 4s was solely for marketing purposes to push sales of the new phone. If they make it sound cool enough, it won't just be off-contract people switching, but also people buying a new unlocked one and selling their old 4.
I also fully expect that once that initial push dies down, that Apple will coincidentally "finalize" Siri 1.0 and "discover" that it will work on other iOS devices afterall, and make it available to them, for a price.
Yes, Apple owes the world a complete explanation of all their strategic planning for software and hardware. And if we shoot ourselves in the foot doing work arounds, it's their fault.
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1
I hope this post was sarcastic......
Sorry, forgot my sarcastic emoticon. Thought it was outrageous on the face to avoid such confusion. But considering the posts of the 'droid trolls that infest this place, I can understand your problem.
Comments
Only Apple can increase the price of an app to $199 and call it magical.
Why do ridiculous insane crackpots always choose names like "reality check?"
Don't you see the irony of picking a name like that and then posting all the looney garbage that you do?
You should change your name to "crack-smoking-lunatic100."
This is quite irresponsible. Apple will be growing server capacity inline with the number of 4S sold. If this hack becomes widespread it could ruin the experience for genuine, paying customers.
EXACTLY. If you don't like it, then there's always Android. Where you can get gingerbread on your nice G1.....oh, wait.
And the Siri servers already starte buckle under the strain of 4 million iPhone 4S users in 3 days. These asshat trolls never think what would happen if Apple rolled out Siri to 120 million iDevices at once.
As for Cash907's comment on Mango it's been for how long now and I still haven't had the update pushed to me. Apparently it's ok for MS to do a systematic and controlled release, but not Apple.
You were the one defending it to the DEATH saying that there was just no way the iphone 4 could handle Siri...
Anything you say in this thread I won't be able to take seriously.
EXACTLY. If you don't like it, then there's always Android. Where you can get gingerbread on your nice G1.....oh, wait.
People don't have G1s though. They're 3 years old now.
This means that you have an option to get a free Android phone running the newest release of Android.
People don't have G1s though. They're 3 years old now.
This means that you have an option to get a free Android phone running the newest release of Android.
What are you evne talking about. You're not making any sense AT ALL. What does that have to do with anything? Yeah, G1 was the first Android phone....what the hell is the free thing?
So? First, do you know that it's the same version? Maybe Apple added new capabilities. Second, perhaps it didn't run well enough to meet Apple's standards, particularly when other things are active.
You are not making sense. Perhaps this, perhaps that. It was a free app so they are under no obligation to keep it running but it would have been nice to treat it like the iDisk policy and let it run until the two year contract expiration. Instead it makes it look like they killed it to twist your arm into buying a new phone and pay an early termination fee.
This is quite irresponsible. Apple will be growing server capacity inline with the number of 4S sold. If this hack becomes widespread it could ruin the experience for genuine, paying customers.
Exactly my first thought and I agree totally. This is asinine.
Given it is mostly done server side I have to assume Apple can sort out what is an iPhone 4s and block the rest if they wish though. I have little doubt more devices will gain Siri as the server capacity grows.
Given it is mostly done server side I have to assume Apple can sort out what is an iPhone 4s and block the rest if they wish though. I have little doubt more devices will gain Siri as the server capacity grows.
Can't wait to see those overage fees for all the data.
You were the one defending it to the DEATH saying that there was just no way the iphone 4 could handle Siri...
Anything you say in this thread I won't be able to take seriously.
1) I seem to recall you saying Siri required no processing whatsoever. I said it clearly does. I was right.
2) Siri was already available as an app for previous iPhones so saying that it wasn't technically possible to work at some level is not something I've ever said or would ever say. I said ? and still say ? there are clear logistical, marketing, and potential technical reasons Apple did it nor will include Siri for previous iDevices. With two years of Apple-owned Siri development and a completely different requirement for minimal service requirements should be considered by anyone with half a brain.
1) I seem to recall you saying Siri required no processing whatsoever. I said it clearly does. I was right.
Siri uses very little processing power - the majority of the work goes into UI and dictation. Dictation is not as processing intensive as you would think (it understands or it doesn't, it doesn't "think" about what you said to try and understand what it doesn't initially). The majority of the work goes into understanding what your text means, and this is handled by Apple.
Given it is mostly done server side I have to assume Apple can sort out what is an iPhone 4s and block the rest if they wish though. I have little doubt more devices will gain Siri as the server capacity grows.
This is what Apple does now. When an iPhone 4S is activated it gains a special authorization token that allows Siri's servers to respond, which is saved to the device. The examples shown use a valid auth token which makes the servers think the commands are coming from a 4S - this is why this method is not something to be mass distributed.
Siri uses very little processing power - the majority of the work goes into UI and dictation. Dictation is not as processing intensive as you would think (it understands or it doesn't, it doesn't "think" about what you said to try and understand what it doesn't initially). The majority of the work goes into understanding what your text means, and this is handled by Apple.
This is what Apple does now. When an iPhone 4S is activated it gains a special authorization token that allows Siri's servers to respond, which is saved to the device. The examples shown use a valid auth token which makes the servers think the commands are coming from a 4S - this is why this method is not something to be mass distributed.
When you ask or command Siri to answer a question or do some task does the recording of your voice get sent to Apple for analysis or does Siri figure out if the request can be understood locally on the device and then send a text based request to the server. I'm curious because it would greatly affect the amount of data sent over the network. I thought that it sent the audio to the server.
So? First, do you know that it's the same version? Maybe Apple added new capabilities. Second, perhaps it didn't run well enough to meet Apple's standards, particularly when other things are active.
Furthermore, even if it DID run just fine on the iPhone 4, that's Apple's choice. If you don't like it, you're free to develop your own phone and software.
I can make a case for and against Siri eventually coming to all devices running iOS 5.0. The tipping point all depends on how important is the data mining it produces.
There are several things I have yet to read about Siri:
- How does it compare to the old standalone app in reliability.
- How does it compare to the old standalone app in speed.
- How does it compare to the old standalone app in versatility.
- Since it's systmewide, how does it compare to the old standalone app in data used per user.
- Since it's systmewide, how does it compare to the old standalone app in processing per user.
- Is any of Siri processed locally like in the previous Voice Control for iPhone for making a call or playing music, or is all processing now sent server-side for processing.
- What exactly is that new A5 feature Phil Schiller talked about during the Siri demo?
Clearly there are good technical and logistical reasons for Siri not being pushed to 120 million iDevices at once as we've during the first weekend, but there are clearly marketing reasons why you'd put it on the flagship product first. Anyone who crys foul because Apple didn't roll of the Beta to only new iPod Touches or new sales of 3GS's are just asshats who either don't understand the simplest fundamentals of business and/or just angry little trolls that hate anything successful. Let them had their inferior Speaktoit on the Android Market while claiming it's better because it's not owned by the evil Apple empire.Siri uses very little processing power - the majority of the work goes into UI and dictation. Dictation is not as processing intensive as you would think (it understands or it doesn't, it doesn't "think" about what you said to try and understand what it doesn't initially). The majority of the work goes into understanding what your text means, and this is handled by Apple.
How do you think "Apple" figures out all these audio bytes?!
Edit: When you and others refer to Siri as requiring no processing are you thinking about Siri as just the nifty little icon on your iPhone when you long-press the Home Button? I certainly don't, and neither should anyone else. It's an ecosystem technology and should be considered as such.
How do you think "Apple" figures out all these audio bytes?!
Edit: When you and others refer to Siri as requiring no processing are you thinking about Siri as just the nifty little icon on your iPhone when you long-press the Home Button? I certainly don't, and neither should anyone else. It's an ecosystem technology and should be considered as such.
Where are you getting this idea that Siri uses huge amounts of processing power? Do you understand how Siri works at all? Or even do you have any experience with speech-to-text programming, text analyzers, or programming at all? Or are you just blinding guessing it does because it just seems like it would?
Sure, it's processing power, which takes machines and effort to handle - especially from millions of iPhone users, but do not forget that Apple is sitting on over $75 billion in cash reserves and processing information is very very cheap. One investment in a server, which is also cheap, and you have an *infinite ability to process with that machine. (* excluding maintaining and care, which are extremely cheap as well).
To be honest, I'm more wow'ed by Apple's ability to handle the iCloud services over Siri's load. Apple was having problems with Siri's servers, but that was because they underestimated the usage that would come in. With preparation and access to an inane they can be ready for anything.
Where are you getting this idea that Siri uses huge amounts of processing power? Do you understand how Siri works at all? Or even do you have any experience with speech-to-text programming, text analyzers, or programming at all? Or are you just blinding guessing it does because it just seems like it would?
Sure, it's processing power, which takes machines and effort to handle - especially from millions of iPhone users, but do not forget that Apple is sitting on over $75 billion in cash reserves and processing information is very very cheap. One investment in a server, which is also cheap, and you have an *infinite ability to process with that machine. (* excluding maintaining and care, which are extremely cheap as well).
To be honest, I'm more wow'ed by Apple's ability to handle the iCloud services over Siri's load. Apple was having problems with Siri's servers, but that was because they underestimated the usage that would come in. With preparation and access to an inane they can be ready for anything.
1) Yes, understanding human language is process intensive.
2) No, there is no infinite abili to process... as seen by the server issues with the weekend launch of the 4S.
3) you acknowdlge the problems with Siri's servers and "underestimated" usage but you say that processing is infinite and Apple has (rephrasing) an excessive amount of money... Yet you don't think this was an issue with processing all the Siri requests. Too many requests in RAM? (silly) Too much bandwidth for Siri requests? (possible but far from the most likely reason)
I also fully expect that once that initial push dies down, that Apple will coincidentally "finalize" Siri 1.0 and "discover" that it will work on other iOS devices afterall, and make it available to them, for a price.
Yes, Apple owes the world a complete explanation of all their strategic planning for software and hardware. And if we shoot ourselves in the foot doing work arounds, it's their fault.
I hope this post was sarcastic......
Sorry, forgot my sarcastic emoticon. Thought it was outrageous on the face to avoid such confusion. But considering the posts of the 'droid trolls that infest this place, I can understand your problem.