Learned my lesson re SIM cards. The iPhone 4 uses a smaller sim than my old phone. When I upgraded, the geek yanked my old sim and, for no good reason, folded it in half and tossed it. If you are ever in this position and want to turn an old iPhone into an iTouch, restore it to factory settings, borrow a sim from a friend, pop it in the old iPhone, plug it in and launch iTunes. Follow the prompt and within a few seconds it is ready to go. Remove the borrowed sim and you are done.
They probably trashed the sim card so that 611 couldn't be called with it. Even without the sim card you can still call 911, though it's not obvious. 611 can be called as long as the sim card works (eg not reported stolen.) The last thing you want your kids to do is call 611 and tell the CSR to enable Data. Calling 611 will call the carrier the SIM card or underlying switch is connected to, it's not guaranteed.
Gave 3GS to my teenage daughter and put her on AT&T prepaid plan for $25 per month (unlimited text but no web). My iPhone-4 will end up in the same hands once Apple releases LTE/4"+ device.
Thats pretty brilliant. Because they can still use it just like a touch (web on wifi) with iphone features and no data plan. I rarely use 3G ever. If my company didn't pay for it and I wanted to save a grand a year, that's a great option. (do kids really need a data plan?)
Gave 3GS to my teenage daughter and put her on AT&T prepaid plan for $25 per month (unlimited text but no web).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bregalad
The carriers ... charge the same amount for a voice/data plan on an old phone as they do for one that contains a huge subsidy.
Unless you're going to demote your smart phone to a pre-paid "dumb" phone there's just no point activating an old phone when you could get a brand new one for almost the same total cost.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol
Thats pretty brilliant. Because they can still use it just like a touch (web on wifi) with iphone features and no data plan. I rarely use 3G ever.
This article is very timely for me - despite all my years of dealing with tech and phone companies, all these options are very confusing.
My old dumb phone (Verizon) is dying. I have a minutes and TXT plan with a (grandfathered) 20% union discount. I also have an accumulated $100 credit towards a new phone with 2 year re-up (they no longer offer this for new accounts, but I'm pretty sure those who were promised them still get them).
I'd like to keep the grandfathered discount (also no longer available) and keep that credit to use when Apple brings out a 4G model.
(Note: I hold onto things as long as they work well - so I plan to keep a new iPhone for several years, which is why I'm holding out for 4G. I mean, my 2004 iBook is still going strong in my house as my accounting, podcast playing and facebook in bed machine except for a seldom used dead key (which I use the virtual keyboard for), reduced Wi-Fi speeds on the net and a dead battery that would cost more than the whole resale value of the machine to replace.)
And I can live without 3G net on my phone. I'm going to buy a new iPad when they're released for my mobile computing needs and use the data plan on an ad hoc basis when traveling.
So these are my questions, if anyone can help :
............... 1. If I buy a used Verizon aftermarket iPhone and walk into Verizon, can I activate it as a phone and TXTing device without adding a data plan?
................... (And so keep my present plan, my discount, my credit, my old phone #, etc.)
................... Or will I be forced to either get a data plan anyway?
Update: I happened to pass a Verizon store and got the skinny: One can keep their plan, and there's no contract, but unless you bring in a dumb phone you have to add a data plan. Ridic!
................... Or have to change to a prepaid plan and so lose my discount and credit?
Update: Don't have to change my plan, but this is "cool": Verizon apparently has the right to deprecate the terms of a contract after the fact. My last 2 year agreement had a $100 credit for "new every two." Big Red just informed me that it's now worth $50. Info highway robbery!
............... 2. If I can just keep my present package with the used iPhone, will the phone still access the net on WiFi? (I.e., for use until I get my iPad and also for when
................... I don't have the pad with me after I get it)?
Update: N/A [see above]
In sum, can I employ a used iPhone as both a dumb phone AND a Wi-Fi capable iPod touch substitute?
Update: Nupe!!
Any replies much appreciated....
Update: Or teeth gnashings or lamentations.
Bonus Update: the worst problem on my current old dumb phone was the battery - well, it has a cracked front screen, but the inner one's just as good, so can live with that. Turns out Verizon doesn't stock it any more, but the store had one in the back room they gave me for $10 (instead of $39.95), so I may make it the next iPhone's release after all without an interim used phone.
iMessage comes to mind. But I agree, kids under the age of xxx, whatever, can be okay with WiFi. Maybe Tallest Skill can comment on where he uses his iPhone, since he doesn't have a data plan.
iMessage comes to mind. But I agree, kids under the age of xxx, whatever, can be okay with WiFi. Maybe Tallest Skill can comment on where he uses his iPhone, since he doesn't have a data plan.
I also don't have a phone plan, remember.
I have my actual phone, this thing, and I carry my iPhone in my other pocket.
Every year since 2008 on the day of release of the new iPhone model, I have gone to a branch of each telecom in turn and asked them if I can have an iPhone without a data plan (basically just use my current plan). They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay full price for said iPhone and continue to use my current plan. They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay for the unlocked model, bring it to them, and continue to use my current plan. They always say no.
I then respectfully end the conversation and walk out of the store. I have done this since the launch of the iPhone 3G.
They force us to have data plans. And then they act like infants when we actually use said data. AND they refuse to allow us to alleviate the pressure on their network by not having a data plan.
I'd be fine without a data plan. I'm fine without one now. Not just kids.
Why do you have an iPhone and not just an iPod touch?
I won it back on Day One 2007. I had no plan to get an iPhone at that time because there was absolutely no AT&T service where I live, I certainly couldn't swing $70 a month, and I didn't see much need for cellular dial-up back then, particularly when I had Wi-Fi in so many places.
I've just used it as an everything-but-a-phone ever since.
I eventually did get a 1st-gen iPod touch, but as a freebie from the education discount of a friend of the family. She didn't want it. What a shame.
I have my actual phone, this thing, and I carry my iPhone in my other pocket.
Every year since 2008 on the day of release of the new iPhone model, I have gone to a branch of each telecom in turn and asked them if I can have an iPhone without a data plan (basically just use my current plan). They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay full price for said iPhone and continue to use my current plan. They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay for the unlocked model, bring it to them, and continue to use my current plan. They always say no.
I then respectfully end the conversation and walk out of the store. I have done this since the launch of the iPhone 3G.
They force us to have data plans. And then they act like infants when we actually use said data. AND they refuse to allow us to alleviate the pressure on their network by not having a data plan.
I'd be fine without a data plan. I'm fine without one now. Not just kids.
It looks like the common element in your given requests is you tell them it's an iPhone. They don't need to know the type of phone, the SIM doesn't know any better. Have you asked them to sell you a SIM and plan for an existing feature phone?
It looks like the common element in your given requests is you tell them it's an iPhone. They don't need to know the type of phone, the SIM doesn't know any better. Have you asked them to sell you a SIM and plan for an existing feature phone?
We have Verizon right now (and have since aught one), so SIMs are out of the question. And AT&T automatically adds data plans to your phone if you try to game them like that, so they're out of the question, even though they do have at least phone service where I live now. T-Mobile's out, sadly, and Sprint says the same thing as everyone else; not without a data plan.
I have my actual phone, this thing, and I carry my iPhone in my other pocket.
They force us to have data plans. And then they act like infants when we actually use said data. AND they refuse to allow us to alleviate the pressure on their network by not having a data plan.
Wow. Crazy telco's. Over here in The Netherlands we got a € 10 data plan, unlimited, when the iPhone2G, sorry¡, iPhone3G, came out in 2008. Stayed that way for, I believe, 2.5 years. Now it's around € 12,50 with a 500MB cap, some cap at 1GB.
---
That LG clamshell is a brick! No way to get it kaput!
Sorry to hear you don't have reception in your area. For your sake you better have a fast DSL.
We have Verizon right now (and have since aught one), so SIMs are out of the question. And AT&T automatically adds data plans to your phone if you try to game them like that, so they're out of the question, even though they do have at least phone service where I live now. T-Mobile's out, sadly, and Sprint says the same thing as everyone else; not without a data plan.
How does AT&T know? Do they check the IMEI and find it's an Apple phone?
How does AT&T know? Do they check the IMEI and find it's an Apple phone?
They figured out I was breaking my contractual obligations when tethering even though the tethering setup I used was native to the iPhone via a service from jailbreaking that said AT&T couldn't detect it. After they warned me I still used it and months later (though after doing this for 4 years) they finally removed my Unlimited plan. I took a risk and got caught. I full except that I was violating my contract. But anyway, it seems they have ways of figuring out what's going through their network in ways I hadn't imaged.
They figured out I was breaking my contractual obligations when tethering even though the tethering setup I used was native to the iPhone via a service from jailbreaking that said AT&T couldn't detect it. After they warned me I still used it and months later (though after doing this for 4 years) they finally removed my Unlimited plan. I took a risk and got caught. I full except that I was violating my contract. But anyway, it seems they have ways of figuring out what's going through their network in ways I hadn't imaged.
Huh, interesting. Never knew that. Jeff asked TS, why are you replying?
I have my actual phone, this thing, and I carry my iPhone in my other pocket.
Every year since 2008 on the day of release of the new iPhone model, I have gone to a branch of each telecom in turn and asked them if I can have an iPhone without a data plan (basically just use my current plan). They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay full price for said iPhone and continue to use my current plan. They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay for the unlocked model, bring it to them, and continue to use my current plan. They always say no.
I then respectfully end the conversation and walk out of the store. I have done this since the launch of the iPhone 3G.
They force us to have data plans. And then they act like infants when we actually use said data. AND they refuse to allow us to alleviate the pressure on their network by not having a data plan.
I'd be fine without a data plan. I'm fine without one now. Not just kids.
We have Verizon right now (and have since aught one), so SIMs are out of the question. And AT&T automatically adds data plans to your phone if you try to game them like that, so they're out of the question, even though they do have at least phone service where I live now. T-Mobile's out, sadly, and Sprint says the same thing as everyone else; not without a data plan.
If Verizon is the best option in your area, then you should investigate a used CDMA iPhone and putting it on PagePlus Cellular. They sub-lease Verizon's network. They have some great deals including $12 a month for 250 min/250 texts and 10 megs. $80 for 2000 minutes that do not expire for a year ($.04 a minute). The deal that is really sizzling in my opinion is their $30 a month 1200 minute talk/3000 text and 100 megs of data plan.
I have my entire family on prepaid plans. The wife and I both have iPhones (though as I mentioned in another thread I'm playing around with the Atrix as well.) If you aren't on contract or subsidizing a phone you could literally take the same phone in your hand and use it on Page Plus tomorrow.
You, me, Jeff or any one might quote another poster but in an open forum all can and should answer if they feel they have something relevant to add to the discussion. I wasn't able to directly answer Jeff's query but I hope my experience read by him and others could help us all get more information than we would have collected separately.
How does AT&T know? Do they check the IMEI and find it's an Apple phone?
As far as I've read from everyone who has tried it, that's exactly it. They WILL find you and they WILL add the data.
Of course, that's actually moot for me. AT&T actually lets first-gen iPhone users have plans without data legitimately.
So why do I still not have a plan on it? Well, my family has had Verizon for the last decade and their service, both cellular and customer, has been unparalleled. When I wrote a message directly to their (heavens, I forget who it was now. And they seem to have removed their executive contact page since I sent that message? hmm?), I didn't receive a stock e-mail back, I received an e-mail asking when would be a good time to call me. I replied and received a call from (not the actual guy, unfortunately) a member of his office (at least he said that) who thanked me for my concern and talked to me further about my situation (I can repost the original message I sent here, if people would like).
So that was nice. The only other time I've had that happen from a company was when I got an e-mail from Steve Jobs back when I asked him about the MacBook Pro's 8600M problem (his answer wasn't in line with what Apple eventually did, but he DID reply ).
And hey, we all know how terrible AT&T is. I just haven't had the gumption to switch, and really, who wants to use a five year old phone, even with a simulacrum of iOS 5.1? If this keeps up many years more, I think that I CAN see myself buying two more 1st-gen iPhones for the other two members of my family who want them and moving us all to AT&T, but right now I'm still holding on to a single piece of hope that eventually we'll be able to have the same rights granted to us as even CANADA allows and get iPhones without data.
You, me, Jeff or any one might quote another poster but in an open forum all can and should answer if they feel they have something relevant to add to the discussion. I wasn't able to directly answer Jeff's query but I hope my experience read by him and others could help us all get more information than we would have collected separately.
Ah ok, thanks. You too Jeff. I agree with what you're saying, just came across as awkward as your reply started with "They figured out I... "
Comments
Learned my lesson re SIM cards. The iPhone 4 uses a smaller sim than my old phone. When I upgraded, the geek yanked my old sim and, for no good reason, folded it in half and tossed it. If you are ever in this position and want to turn an old iPhone into an iTouch, restore it to factory settings, borrow a sim from a friend, pop it in the old iPhone, plug it in and launch iTunes. Follow the prompt and within a few seconds it is ready to go. Remove the borrowed sim and you are done.
They probably trashed the sim card so that 611 couldn't be called with it. Even without the sim card you can still call 911, though it's not obvious. 611 can be called as long as the sim card works (eg not reported stolen.) The last thing you want your kids to do is call 611 and tell the CSR to enable Data. Calling 611 will call the carrier the SIM card or underlying switch is connected to, it's not guaranteed.
Gave 3GS to my teenage daughter and put her on AT&T prepaid plan for $25 per month (unlimited text but no web). My iPhone-4 will end up in the same hands once Apple releases LTE/4"+ device.
Thats pretty brilliant. Because they can still use it just like a touch (web on wifi) with iphone features and no data plan. I rarely use 3G ever. If my company didn't pay for it and I wanted to save a grand a year, that's a great option. (do kids really need a data plan?)
Gave 3GS to my teenage daughter and put her on AT&T prepaid plan for $25 per month (unlimited text but no web).
The carriers ... charge the same amount for a voice/data plan on an old phone as they do for one that contains a huge subsidy.
Unless you're going to demote your smart phone to a pre-paid "dumb" phone there's just no point activating an old phone when you could get a brand new one for almost the same total cost.
Thats pretty brilliant. Because they can still use it just like a touch (web on wifi) with iphone features and no data plan. I rarely use 3G ever.
This article is very timely for me - despite all my years of dealing with tech and phone companies, all these options are very confusing.
My old dumb phone (Verizon) is dying. I have a minutes and TXT plan with a (grandfathered) 20% union discount. I also have an accumulated $100 credit towards a new phone with 2 year re-up (they no longer offer this for new accounts, but I'm pretty sure those who were promised them still get them).
I'd like to keep the grandfathered discount (also no longer available) and keep that credit to use when Apple brings out a 4G model. And I can live without 3G net on my phone. I'm going to buy a new iPad when they're released for my mobile computing needs and use the data plan on an ad hoc basis when traveling.
So these are my questions, if anyone can help :
............... 1. If I buy a used Verizon aftermarket iPhone and walk into Verizon, can I activate it as a phone and TXTing device without adding a data plan?
................... (And so keep my present plan, my discount, my credit, my old phone #, etc.)
................... Or will I be forced to either get a data plan anyway?
Update: I happened to pass a Verizon store and got the skinny: One can keep their plan, and there's no contract, but unless you bring in a dumb phone you have to add a data plan. Ridic!
................... Or have to change to a prepaid plan and so lose my discount and credit?
Update: Don't have to change my plan, but this is "cool": Verizon apparently has the right to deprecate the terms of a contract after the fact. My last 2 year agreement had a $100 credit for "new every two." Big Red just informed me that it's now worth $50. Info highway robbery!
............... 2. If I can just keep my present package with the used iPhone, will the phone still access the net on WiFi? (I.e., for use until I get my iPad and also for when
................... I don't have the pad with me after I get it)?
Update: N/A [see above]
In sum, can I employ a used iPhone as both a dumb phone AND a Wi-Fi capable iPod touch substitute?
Update: Nupe!!
Any replies much appreciated....
Update: Or teeth gnashings or lamentations.
Bonus Update: the worst problem on my current old dumb phone was the battery - well, it has a cracked front screen, but the inner one's just as good, so can live with that. Turns out Verizon doesn't stock it any more, but the store had one in the back room they gave me for $10 (instead of $39.95), so I may make it the next iPhone's release after all without an interim used phone.
Winning! (Life's little victories are sweet.)
do kids really need a data plan?
iMessage comes to mind. But I agree, kids under the age of xxx, whatever, can be okay with WiFi. Maybe Tallest Skill can comment on where he uses his iPhone, since he doesn't have a data plan.
iMessage comes to mind. But I agree, kids under the age of xxx, whatever, can be okay with WiFi. Maybe Tallest Skill can comment on where he uses his iPhone, since he doesn't have a data plan.
I also don't have a phone plan, remember.
I have my actual phone, this thing, and I carry my iPhone in my other pocket.
Every year since 2008 on the day of release of the new iPhone model, I have gone to a branch of each telecom in turn and asked them if I can have an iPhone without a data plan (basically just use my current plan). They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay full price for said iPhone and continue to use my current plan. They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay for the unlocked model, bring it to them, and continue to use my current plan. They always say no.
I then respectfully end the conversation and walk out of the store. I have done this since the launch of the iPhone 3G.
They force us to have data plans. And then they act like infants when we actually use said data. AND they refuse to allow us to alleviate the pressure on their network by not having a data plan.
I'd be fine without a data plan. I'm fine without one now. Not just kids.
I'd be fine without a data plan. I'm fine without one now. Not just kids.
Ok.... But how can you surf the web and drive?
Why do you have an iPhone and not just an iPod touch?
Why do you have an iPhone and not just an iPod touch?
I won it back on Day One 2007. I had no plan to get an iPhone at that time because there was absolutely no AT&T service where I live, I certainly couldn't swing $70 a month, and I didn't see much need for cellular dial-up back then, particularly when I had Wi-Fi in so many places.
I've just used it as an everything-but-a-phone ever since.
I eventually did get a 1st-gen iPod touch, but as a freebie from the education discount of a friend of the family. She didn't want it. What a shame.
I also don't have a phone plan, remember.
I have my actual phone, this thing, and I carry my iPhone in my other pocket.
Every year since 2008 on the day of release of the new iPhone model, I have gone to a branch of each telecom in turn and asked them if I can have an iPhone without a data plan (basically just use my current plan). They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay full price for said iPhone and continue to use my current plan. They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay for the unlocked model, bring it to them, and continue to use my current plan. They always say no.
I then respectfully end the conversation and walk out of the store. I have done this since the launch of the iPhone 3G.
They force us to have data plans. And then they act like infants when we actually use said data. AND they refuse to allow us to alleviate the pressure on their network by not having a data plan.
I'd be fine without a data plan. I'm fine without one now. Not just kids.
It looks like the common element in your given requests is you tell them it's an iPhone. They don't need to know the type of phone, the SIM doesn't know any better. Have you asked them to sell you a SIM and plan for an existing feature phone?
It looks like the common element in your given requests is you tell them it's an iPhone. They don't need to know the type of phone, the SIM doesn't know any better. Have you asked them to sell you a SIM and plan for an existing feature phone?
We have Verizon right now (and have since aught one), so SIMs are out of the question. And AT&T automatically adds data plans to your phone if you try to game them like that, so they're out of the question, even though they do have at least phone service where I live now. T-Mobile's out, sadly, and Sprint says the same thing as everyone else; not without a data plan.
I also don't have a phone plan, remember.
I have my actual phone, this thing, and I carry my iPhone in my other pocket.
They force us to have data plans. And then they act like infants when we actually use said data. AND they refuse to allow us to alleviate the pressure on their network by not having a data plan.
Wow. Crazy telco's. Over here in The Netherlands we got a € 10 data plan, unlimited, when the iPhone2G, sorry¡, iPhone3G, came out in 2008. Stayed that way for, I believe, 2.5 years. Now it's around € 12,50 with a 500MB cap, some cap at 1GB.
---
That LG clamshell is a brick! No way to get it kaput!
Sorry to hear you don't have reception in your area. For your sake you better have a fast DSL.
We have Verizon right now (and have since aught one), so SIMs are out of the question. And AT&T automatically adds data plans to your phone if you try to game them like that, so they're out of the question, even though they do have at least phone service where I live now. T-Mobile's out, sadly, and Sprint says the same thing as everyone else; not without a data plan.
How does AT&T know? Do they check the IMEI and find it's an Apple phone?
How does AT&T know? Do they check the IMEI and find it's an Apple phone?
They figured out I was breaking my contractual obligations when tethering even though the tethering setup I used was native to the iPhone via a service from jailbreaking that said AT&T couldn't detect it. After they warned me I still used it and months later (though after doing this for 4 years) they finally removed my Unlimited plan. I took a risk and got caught. I full except that I was violating my contract. But anyway, it seems they have ways of figuring out what's going through their network in ways I hadn't imaged.
They figured out I was breaking my contractual obligations when tethering even though the tethering setup I used was native to the iPhone via a service from jailbreaking that said AT&T couldn't detect it. After they warned me I still used it and months later (though after doing this for 4 years) they finally removed my Unlimited plan. I took a risk and got caught. I full except that I was violating my contract. But anyway, it seems they have ways of figuring out what's going through their network in ways I hadn't imaged.
Huh, interesting. Never knew that. Jeff asked TS, why are you replying?
Huh, interesting. Never knew that. Jeff asked TS, why are you replying?
I don't see the problem, it was useful and interesting information, and it wasn't a question that could only be answered by Tallest Skil.
I also don't have a phone plan, remember.
I have my actual phone, this thing, and I carry my iPhone in my other pocket.
Every year since 2008 on the day of release of the new iPhone model, I have gone to a branch of each telecom in turn and asked them if I can have an iPhone without a data plan (basically just use my current plan). They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay full price for said iPhone and continue to use my current plan. They always say no. I then ask them if I can pay for the unlocked model, bring it to them, and continue to use my current plan. They always say no.
I then respectfully end the conversation and walk out of the store. I have done this since the launch of the iPhone 3G.
They force us to have data plans. And then they act like infants when we actually use said data. AND they refuse to allow us to alleviate the pressure on their network by not having a data plan.
I'd be fine without a data plan. I'm fine without one now. Not just kids.
You can take your iPhone and get an H2O sim for it. They will let you buy minutes and texts with no data. They sub-lease AT&T's network and your iPhone will see the SIM as an AT&T sim.
We have Verizon right now (and have since aught one), so SIMs are out of the question. And AT&T automatically adds data plans to your phone if you try to game them like that, so they're out of the question, even though they do have at least phone service where I live now. T-Mobile's out, sadly, and Sprint says the same thing as everyone else; not without a data plan.
If Verizon is the best option in your area, then you should investigate a used CDMA iPhone and putting it on PagePlus Cellular. They sub-lease Verizon's network. They have some great deals including $12 a month for 250 min/250 texts and 10 megs. $80 for 2000 minutes that do not expire for a year ($.04 a minute). The deal that is really sizzling in my opinion is their $30 a month 1200 minute talk/3000 text and 100 megs of data plan.
I have my entire family on prepaid plans. The wife and I both have iPhones (though as I mentioned in another thread I'm playing around with the Atrix as well.) If you aren't on contract or subsidizing a phone you could literally take the same phone in your hand and use it on Page Plus tomorrow.
Jeff asked TS, why are you replying?
You, me, Jeff or any one might quote another poster but in an open forum all can and should answer if they feel they have something relevant to add to the discussion. I wasn't able to directly answer Jeff's query but I hope my experience read by him and others could help us all get more information than we would have collected separately.
How does AT&T know? Do they check the IMEI and find it's an Apple phone?
As far as I've read from everyone who has tried it, that's exactly it. They WILL find you and they WILL add the data.
Of course, that's actually moot for me. AT&T actually lets first-gen iPhone users have plans without data legitimately.
So why do I still not have a plan on it? Well, my family has had Verizon for the last decade and their service, both cellular and customer, has been unparalleled. When I wrote a message directly to their (heavens, I forget who it was now. And they seem to have removed their executive contact page since I sent that message? hmm?), I didn't receive a stock e-mail back, I received an e-mail asking when would be a good time to call me. I replied and received a call from (not the actual guy, unfortunately) a member of his office (at least he said that) who thanked me for my concern and talked to me further about my situation (I can repost the original message I sent here, if people would like).
So that was nice. The only other time I've had that happen from a company was when I got an e-mail from Steve Jobs back when I asked him about the MacBook Pro's 8600M problem (his answer wasn't in line with what Apple eventually did, but he DID reply
And hey, we all know how terrible AT&T is. I just haven't had the gumption to switch, and really, who wants to use a five year old phone, even with a simulacrum of iOS 5.1? If this keeps up many years more, I think that I CAN see myself buying two more 1st-gen iPhones for the other two members of my family who want them and moving us all to AT&T, but right now I'm still holding on to a single piece of hope that eventually we'll be able to have the same rights granted to us as even CANADA allows and get iPhones without data.
You, me, Jeff or any one might quote another poster but in an open forum all can and should answer if they feel they have something relevant to add to the discussion. I wasn't able to directly answer Jeff's query but I hope my experience read by him and others could help us all get more information than we would have collected separately.
Ah ok, thanks. You too Jeff. I agree with what you're saying, just came across as awkward as your reply started with "They figured out I... "