People used to go on about how laptops were taking over from desktops, but I think that victory will be short lived - the tablet can replace the laptop for 80% of applications.
Personally I no longer have a laptop, I sold my MBP. I have a tablet (iPad) and a desktop (iMac) and iCloud means that when I get home my tablet is already synced with my computer, ready to go. The perfect combination.
The tablet form factor can evolve to become a working device, but it needs lots of work still.
To Quote Tim Cook
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
"Cook said other offerings "will sell a fair number of units, but I don't think that people that want an iPad will settle for limited function."
I believe he meant that the other tablets out there have limited functionality over the iPad, not the iPad having limited functionality over a regular PC.
The funniest line in that story to me is Ballmer saying: "We do not, say, like Apple, believe in low volume, very high prices, very -- Apple is a great company, does a fine job. But their model says high margin, high quality, high price," he said. "That's kind of how they come to market. We say we want big market share. But with big market share, you take a lower price."
Wait, Apple = high margin, high quality, high price. Microsoft = big market share, lower price. Apparently he didn't want to mention the third opposite - lower quality?
Ah, what would we do without Ballmer?
In business 101, it is profit that pays the bills, enables R & D, and provides jobs. When cost exceeds revenue, the company goes out of business.
The funniest line in that story to me is Ballmer saying: "We do not, say, like Apple, believe in low volume, very high prices, very -- Apple is a great company, does a fine job. But their model says high margin, high quality, high price," he said. "That's kind of how they come to market. We say we want big market share. But with big market share, you take a lower price."
Wait, Apple = high margin, high quality, high price. Microsoft = big market share, lower price. Apparently he didn't want to mention the third opposite - lower quality?
Ah, what would we do without Ballmer?
Isn't that a classic one from July 31, 2009?! And the closing one, nicely ignoring facts:
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
"And are the ads working?" he asked rhetorically. "In an independent survey, we asked 18- to 24-year-olds?or they were asked, "Who offers the best value, Apple or Microsoft?" You can kind of see Apple was comfortably ahead despite the fact they ? well, despite whatever the facts are. Our ads started in April of '09. You can see kind of what the perception changes have been so far."
Apple themselves say that iPad is post pc device. Why then is it counted as a PC? PCs are open to an extemt that allows flexibility not in the iPad...
Also As a matter of fact, I think apples days with no tablet competitor are limited(I don't consider android tablets anything more than paper weights) this won't be popular here but I'm telling you, ive used windows8 and on a tablet, it's everything I wish the iPad could be. The new ui will kick ass on a tablet device.
Personally, I see the Tablet and the PC as two completely different products. However, I also think the market relevance of the two product categories is inverting.
The device which we have traditionally called a "PC" will no longer be deserving of that name - it will rightfully revert to the more generic phrase "desktop computer" - and it will increasingly become the "niche" device for highly specialized needs.
The device which we have come to know as the "Tablet" will increasingly become the mainstream device for everyday computing needs, taking up the title of "Personal Computer" which will eventually need to be stripped away from the older class of desktop devices.
Personally, I see the Tablet and the PC as two completely different products. However, I also think the market relevance of the two product categories is inverting.
The device which we have traditionally called a "PC" will no longer be deserving of that name - it will rightfully revert to the more generic phrase "desktop computer" - and it will increasingly become the "niche" device for highly specialized needs.
The device which we have come to know as the "Tablet" will increasingly become the mainstream device for everyday computing needs, taking up the title of "Personal Computer" which will eventually need to be stripped away from the older class of desktop devices.
Agreed. Some posters here desperately want the two types of products to be called the same so they can claim Apple is beating Dell and Microsoft and finally winning the PC wars by combining all MAC and iPad sales (why not throw iPhones in there too?). The iPad is a different product, the goal is for it to replace desktop/laptop PCs not be categorized the same.
"I think people really want to do multiple things with their tablets. We don't really see these limited function tablets and ereaders being in same category."
Actually, I find that a dedicated eInk reader such as the classic Kindle (not the Fire) or Nook, with their 6" non-backlit screens is worth having alongside an iPad. The iPad is a tablet computer, the eInk Kindles are pure readers. The readers are lighter and easier on the eyes, and you can pretty much ignore the battery for weeks.
Definitely limited function tablets such as eInk readers are not in the same category. But precisely for that reason there is plenty of room for them. The Kindle Fire, on the other hand, does not make sense for an iPad owner.
Apple themselves say that iPad is post pc device. Why then is it counted as a PC? PCs are open to an extemt that allows flexibility not in the iPad...
Well, at home my wife is experimenting with using an iPad as a notebook replacement. We got an iPad, bluetooth keyboard, and a case that allows for a wide range of angles when placed on a desk. The keyboard stays at home.
She still needs a desktop machine for some things, but can go for days without it. I'd say it's 70% there. In some ways, the iPad is better than any notebook she has ever owned or could get, such as the all-day battery life and extreme portability.
Things that would help seal the deal include double resolution, but with a slightly larger screen, say 11.2" (but always 3:4, not the 16:9 garbage), and an optional case similar to the Zagg keyboard cover with a full-size keyboard. This would make it more like a notebook for some tasks, but it would be more flexible since the iPad could be used by itself also, as a tablet.
Apple themselves say that iPad is post pc device. Why then is it counted as a PC? PCs are open to an extemt that allows flexibility not in the iPad...
Because "post-traditional definition of PC" doesn't roll off the tongue. People are buying iPads to do the tasks that they used to buy a PC for, and they're buying them instead of traditional PCs. So, if you want to pick nits at what a PC is and should be, go for it. Your view of what a PC is or should be doesn't really matter.
Quote:
Also As a matter of fact, I think apples days with no tablet competitor are limited(I don't consider android tablets anything more than paper weights) this won't be popular here but I'm telling you, ive used windows8 and on a tablet, it's everything I wish the iPad could be. The new ui will kick ass on a tablet device.
I agree competition will get better, but the new UI from MS is being heralded as kick ass by people because it's the first time anyone can remember MS actually creating something new that wasn't a poor copy of something else. It's more of a "you made this yourself? Good boy! Hey everyone, look what my four year old made" type of kick ass.
The fact is beyond a few tiles on the lock screen (which you don't see when you're actually working), Windows 8 doesn't let you do anything groundbreaking or new. Until anyone can articulate something a Win8 tablet will be able to do that an iPad can't, what is there to get excited about.
Here's a great example of why the iPads are doing very well: at the recent NAMM (Natl Assoc of Music Merchants) show in L.A., THE trade show for dealers of anything to do with pro audio and music hardware and software, iPads were everywhere. Not as notepads for the attendees, as parts of products on display. Mackie, MOTU, Akai, Moog, etc., in fact it seemed practically NOBODY didn't have an iPad centric product. These aren't like the silly iPod docks you see in Target. These are part of serious tools. Most weren't trying to compete with any laptops but were front ends for other hardware processors. You couldn't use a desktop for most of these uses and these are better than using a laptop for their purposes. Just Google it and read up on all of them. People who use iPads in recording studios and for live audio purposes are over the moon in love with how they fit in. This has nothing to do with how something else isn't selling or is saturated. It has to do with what's good about an iPad.
They work. No one is going to build a system around hardware they don't have faith in, and if this year's NAMM is any indication there is no lack of faith in iPads as something all audio people will be wanting to spend $500 on even if they never use it for anything else, never enter into Apple's ecosystem for apps or media, download a show or even boot up iTunes.
Oh, and in case anyone is wondering what the percentage of other tablets on display for the same uses and products? Other tablets were close to invisible, I was told. Anything running Android was some little little page turning app or DJ something or other. If any were doing any better my friend couldn't find them. But you couldn't turn around without an iPad running a $30,000 tour mixer or fine tuning Broadway caliber monitor packages.
It's over. Apple will make millions just based on this market and there are no other players.
I'm buying a new iMac or MBP this spring and setting myself up to record at home. I'm grabbing an iPad 3, an Alesis I/O Dock and the new Arturia Mini Brute (did you get to play w/that one at NAMM?). The Mini Brute will function as a controller for my Korg iMS-20 and Moog Animoog (both of which I already have on my wife's iPad and the Animoog is already bought on my iTunes account long before I have one so I could get the intro pricing) and I'll either use the amps and effects in Garageband or buy the Peavey Ampkit upgrades for the free app for my guitar and bass. The Mini Brute will also be plain awesome plugged in by itself of course.
No one makes serious music apps on Android b/c of the high latency involved in the OS compared w/OS X and iOS (they both use Core Audio which has very low latency) and who wants to watch people sideload your $30 Moog synth for free instead of actually paying for it? Android has to at least solve the latency issue before anyone will try anything serious w/music production on that OS.
Because "post-traditional definition of PC" doesn't roll off the tongue. People are buying iPads to do the tasks that they used to buy a PC for, and they're buying them instead of traditional PCs. So, if you want to pick nits at what a PC is and should be, go for it. Your view of what a PC is or should be doesn't really matter.
I agree competition will get better, but the new UI from MS is being heralded as kick ass by people because it's the first time anyone can remember MS actually creating something new that wasn't a poor copy of something else. It's more of a "you made this yourself? Good boy! Hey everyone, look what my four year old made" type of kick ass.
The fact is beyond a few tiles on the lock screen (which you don't see when you're actually working), Windows 8 doesn't let you do anything groundbreaking or new. Until anyone can articulate something a Win8 tablet will be able to do that an iPad can't, what is there to get excited about.
Metro was derived from the OS used on the MS Zune, where its intro on the Zune2 absolutely destroyed the iPod touch market. Obviously this rampant success will be repeated against the iPad, with greater splendour implicit with the arrival of Windows 8.
Comments
Personally I no longer have a laptop, I sold my MBP. I have a tablet (iPad) and a desktop (iMac) and iCloud means that when I get home my tablet is already synced with my computer, ready to go. The perfect combination.
The tablet form factor can evolve to become a working device, but it needs lots of work still.
To Quote Tim Cook
"Cook said other offerings "will sell a fair number of units, but I don't think that people that want an iPad will settle for limited function."
I believe he meant that the other tablets out there have limited functionality over the iPad, not the iPad having limited functionality over a regular PC.
The funniest line in that story to me is Ballmer saying: "We do not, say, like Apple, believe in low volume, very high prices, very -- Apple is a great company, does a fine job. But their model says high margin, high quality, high price," he said. "That's kind of how they come to market. We say we want big market share. But with big market share, you take a lower price."
Wait, Apple = high margin, high quality, high price. Microsoft = big market share, lower price. Apparently he didn't want to mention the third opposite - lower quality?
Ah, what would we do without Ballmer?
In business 101, it is profit that pays the bills, enables R & D, and provides jobs. When cost exceeds revenue, the company goes out of business.
The funniest line in that story to me is Ballmer saying: "We do not, say, like Apple, believe in low volume, very high prices, very -- Apple is a great company, does a fine job. But their model says high margin, high quality, high price," he said. "That's kind of how they come to market. We say we want big market share. But with big market share, you take a lower price."
Wait, Apple = high margin, high quality, high price. Microsoft = big market share, lower price. Apparently he didn't want to mention the third opposite - lower quality?
Ah, what would we do without Ballmer?
Isn't that a classic one from July 31, 2009?! And the closing one, nicely ignoring facts:
"And are the ads working?" he asked rhetorically. "In an independent survey, we asked 18- to 24-year-olds?or they were asked, "Who offers the best value, Apple or Microsoft?" You can kind of see Apple was comfortably ahead despite the fact they ? well, despite whatever the facts are. Our ads started in April of '09. You can see kind of what the perception changes have been so far."
[ View this article at AppleInsider.com ]
Yes. I can't believe IT guys defend this legacy of fail:
From: http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/new...uccesfully.ars
Thanks Mr. Newton! I'll put that on my colleagues Wintels desktop!
Also As a matter of fact, I think apples days with no tablet competitor are limited(I don't consider android tablets anything more than paper weights) this won't be popular here but I'm telling you, ive used windows8 and on a tablet, it's everything I wish the iPad could be. The new ui will kick ass on a tablet device.
The device which we have traditionally called a "PC" will no longer be deserving of that name - it will rightfully revert to the more generic phrase "desktop computer" - and it will increasingly become the "niche" device for highly specialized needs.
The device which we have come to know as the "Tablet" will increasingly become the mainstream device for everyday computing needs, taking up the title of "Personal Computer" which will eventually need to be stripped away from the older class of desktop devices.
Personally, I see the Tablet and the PC as two completely different products. However, I also think the market relevance of the two product categories is inverting.
The device which we have traditionally called a "PC" will no longer be deserving of that name - it will rightfully revert to the more generic phrase "desktop computer" - and it will increasingly become the "niche" device for highly specialized needs.
The device which we have come to know as the "Tablet" will increasingly become the mainstream device for everyday computing needs, taking up the title of "Personal Computer" which will eventually need to be stripped away from the older class of desktop devices.
Agreed. Some posters here desperately want the two types of products to be called the same so they can claim Apple is beating Dell and Microsoft and finally winning the PC wars by combining all MAC and iPad sales (why not throw iPhones in there too?). The iPad is a different product, the goal is for it to replace desktop/laptop PCs not be categorized the same.
"I think people really want to do multiple things with their tablets. We don't really see these limited function tablets and ereaders being in same category."
Actually, I find that a dedicated eInk reader such as the classic Kindle (not the Fire) or Nook, with their 6" non-backlit screens is worth having alongside an iPad. The iPad is a tablet computer, the eInk Kindles are pure readers. The readers are lighter and easier on the eyes, and you can pretty much ignore the battery for weeks.
Definitely limited function tablets such as eInk readers are not in the same category. But precisely for that reason there is plenty of room for them. The Kindle Fire, on the other hand, does not make sense for an iPad owner.
Apple themselves say that iPad is post pc device. Why then is it counted as a PC? PCs are open to an extemt that allows flexibility not in the iPad...
Well, at home my wife is experimenting with using an iPad as a notebook replacement. We got an iPad, bluetooth keyboard, and a case that allows for a wide range of angles when placed on a desk. The keyboard stays at home.
She still needs a desktop machine for some things, but can go for days without it. I'd say it's 70% there. In some ways, the iPad is better than any notebook she has ever owned or could get, such as the all-day battery life and extreme portability.
Things that would help seal the deal include double resolution, but with a slightly larger screen, say 11.2" (but always 3:4, not the 16:9 garbage), and an optional case similar to the Zagg keyboard cover with a full-size keyboard. This would make it more like a notebook for some tasks, but it would be more flexible since the iPad could be used by itself also, as a tablet.
Apple themselves say that iPad is post pc device. Why then is it counted as a PC? PCs are open to an extemt that allows flexibility not in the iPad...
Because "post-traditional definition of PC" doesn't roll off the tongue. People are buying iPads to do the tasks that they used to buy a PC for, and they're buying them instead of traditional PCs. So, if you want to pick nits at what a PC is and should be, go for it. Your view of what a PC is or should be doesn't really matter.
Also As a matter of fact, I think apples days with no tablet competitor are limited(I don't consider android tablets anything more than paper weights) this won't be popular here but I'm telling you, ive used windows8 and on a tablet, it's everything I wish the iPad could be. The new ui will kick ass on a tablet device.
I agree competition will get better, but the new UI from MS is being heralded as kick ass by people because it's the first time anyone can remember MS actually creating something new that wasn't a poor copy of something else. It's more of a "you made this yourself? Good boy! Hey everyone, look what my four year old made" type of kick ass.
The fact is beyond a few tiles on the lock screen (which you don't see when you're actually working), Windows 8 doesn't let you do anything groundbreaking or new. Until anyone can articulate something a Win8 tablet will be able to do that an iPad can't, what is there to get excited about.
No.
Here's a great example of why the iPads are doing very well: at the recent NAMM (Natl Assoc of Music Merchants) show in L.A., THE trade show for dealers of anything to do with pro audio and music hardware and software, iPads were everywhere. Not as notepads for the attendees, as parts of products on display. Mackie, MOTU, Akai, Moog, etc., in fact it seemed practically NOBODY didn't have an iPad centric product. These aren't like the silly iPod docks you see in Target. These are part of serious tools. Most weren't trying to compete with any laptops but were front ends for other hardware processors. You couldn't use a desktop for most of these uses and these are better than using a laptop for their purposes. Just Google it and read up on all of them. People who use iPads in recording studios and for live audio purposes are over the moon in love with how they fit in. This has nothing to do with how something else isn't selling or is saturated. It has to do with what's good about an iPad.
They work. No one is going to build a system around hardware they don't have faith in, and if this year's NAMM is any indication there is no lack of faith in iPads as something all audio people will be wanting to spend $500 on even if they never use it for anything else, never enter into Apple's ecosystem for apps or media, download a show or even boot up iTunes.
Oh, and in case anyone is wondering what the percentage of other tablets on display for the same uses and products? Other tablets were close to invisible, I was told. Anything running Android was some little little page turning app or DJ something or other. If any were doing any better my friend couldn't find them. But you couldn't turn around without an iPad running a $30,000 tour mixer or fine tuning Broadway caliber monitor packages.
It's over. Apple will make millions just based on this market and there are no other players.
I'm buying a new iMac or MBP this spring and setting myself up to record at home. I'm grabbing an iPad 3, an Alesis I/O Dock and the new Arturia Mini Brute (did you get to play w/that one at NAMM?). The Mini Brute will function as a controller for my Korg iMS-20 and Moog Animoog (both of which I already have on my wife's iPad and the Animoog is already bought on my iTunes account long before I have one so I could get the intro pricing) and I'll either use the amps and effects in Garageband or buy the Peavey Ampkit upgrades for the free app for my guitar and bass. The Mini Brute will also be plain awesome plugged in by itself of course.
No one makes serious music apps on Android b/c of the high latency involved in the OS compared w/OS X and iOS (they both use Core Audio which has very low latency) and who wants to watch people sideload your $30 Moog synth for free instead of actually paying for it? Android has to at least solve the latency issue before anyone will try anything serious w/music production on that OS.
Because "post-traditional definition of PC" doesn't roll off the tongue. People are buying iPads to do the tasks that they used to buy a PC for, and they're buying them instead of traditional PCs. So, if you want to pick nits at what a PC is and should be, go for it. Your view of what a PC is or should be doesn't really matter.
I agree competition will get better, but the new UI from MS is being heralded as kick ass by people because it's the first time anyone can remember MS actually creating something new that wasn't a poor copy of something else. It's more of a "you made this yourself? Good boy! Hey everyone, look what my four year old made" type of kick ass.
The fact is beyond a few tiles on the lock screen (which you don't see when you're actually working), Windows 8 doesn't let you do anything groundbreaking or new. Until anyone can articulate something a Win8 tablet will be able to do that an iPad can't, what is there to get excited about.
Metro was derived from the OS used on the MS Zune, where its intro on the Zune2 absolutely destroyed the iPod touch market. Obviously this rampant success will be repeated against the iPad, with greater splendour implicit with the arrival of Windows 8.
Cheers