Not considering the iPhone, if a maker came to VZW with a phone $100 more than a other models vzw would charge $100 more, but since ATT made the deal to sell the iPhone at $199 it would've been nor good business sense to follow suit. Get it?
I have a theory about why Apple is suing Android. Correct me if I'm wrong, didn't at one time Apple sucked back in the 90's? Nobody wanted Apple. Steve Jobs came into the picture and turn the company around by releasing the ipod 10 or so years ago? Then the ipod touch, the iphone, and now the ipad? They may be the first to take someone else idea and made it so much better. It all doesn't mean they are the best. There is always someone better out there. Just like the car analogy. You buy a 2012 Challenger R/T and pour $10k into performance. You think you are the fastest. Then you someone pulls up next to you with a brand new Challenger SRT8 and pour $10k into it. The SRT8 wins. Apple thinks they are the best because they started the smartphone race. Now realizing someone out there is faster (android) and Apple doesn't like it and they don't want to loose. Instead of using all the money they have to make there products better and faster, they sue. That's kinda like the same thing when you face the school bully and he is stronger than you. Instead of standing up with something of equal power like a stick or something, you run to tell his parents. Apple is a very rich spoil brat that doesn't like to fight on their own.
Good lord this thread is grotesque. Can't we just lock it and be done? Is AI now truly just click whoring with no regard at all for the quality of the discussion?
I have a theory about why Apple is suing Android. Correct me if I'm wrong, didn't at one time Apple sucked back in the 90's? Nobody wanted Apple. Steve Jobs came into the picture and turn the company around by releasing the ipod 10 or so years ago? Then the ipod touch, the iphone, and now the ipad? They may be the first to take someone else idea and made it so much better. It all doesn't mean they are the best. There is always someone better out there. Just like the car analogy. You buy a 2012 Challenger R/T and pour $10k into performance. You think you are the fastest. Then you someone pulls up next to you with a brand new Challenger SRT8 and pour $10k into it. The SRT8 wins. Apple thinks they are the best because they started the smartphone race. Now realizing someone out there is faster (android) and Apple doesn't like it and they don't want to loose. Instead of using all the money they have to make there products better and faster, they sue. That's kinda like the same thing when you face the school bully and he is stronger than you. Instead of standing up with something of equal power like a stick or something, you run to tell his parents. Apple is a very rich spoil brat that doesn't like to fight on their own.
Welcome to AI and I hope your future posts are better than this one.
Not considering the iPhone, if a maker came to VZW with a phone $100 more than a other models vzw would charge $100 more, but since ATT made the deal to sell the iPhone at $199 it would've been nor good business sense to follow suit. Get it?
Now I get your point, but I don't think that's how it played out. I think Apple told the carriers what they will pay Apple and what the maximum per phone they can charge per their contract. I think Apple dictated the terms by pointing out that there phone will bring in subscribers, maintain subscribers, and create smartphone users from dumb phone users, and (perhaps most importantly) create family plans from hand-me-down iPhones that they will not have to pay Apple anything for. At least that's how I would have approached it.
Good lord this thread is grotesque. Can't we just lock it and be done? Is AI now truly just click whoring with no regard at all for the quality of the discussion?
There ought to be a reading comprehension test before one is allowed to post.
Now I get your point, but I don't think that's how it played out. I think Apple told the carriers what they will pay Apple and what the maximum per phone they can charge per their contract. I think Apple dictated the terms by pointing out that there phone will bring in subscribers, maintain subscribers, and create smartphone users from dumb phone users, and (perhaps most importantly) create family plans from hand-me-down iPhones that they will not have to pay Apple anything for. At least that's how I would have approached it.
That's how it played out with ATT, but I'm certain VZW wasn't going to say "We now sell the iPhone for $100 more than ATT, for your extra $100 you get slower 3G in many places, no talk and surf, harder to sell, etc.."
Android is not one specific make and model. GM sells the most cars but they do not have the best selling car.
I understand your attempts to backpedal and suddenly break your car analogy into categories to try and reduce Android's market share.
I also understand that you're embarrassed that you've made an analogy in an area where you're obviously not familiar with either cars or the phone industry.
Unfortunately, the fact remains that you stated "Comparing an iPhone to a Ferrari is asinine, its the best selling phone right? So what's the best selling car? a Toyota Corolla? Why? Because they just work. Low repair rate, and long lasting. That makes more sense."
By your own analogy, Android, the best selling phone on the market, with a current market share of 47%, is now that 'Toyota Corolla'.
And I guess that makes iPhone the Ferrari, as previously stated by meh 2.
Good lord this thread is grotesque. Can't we just lock it and be done? Is AI now truly just click whoring with no regard at all for the quality of the discussion?
I utterly agree.
Good thing we're open-minded when it comes to trolls on an Apple-related forum.
Asinine... or just a joke that's past its use by date.
You are right though. If Android is a Dodge Dart the iPhone is a Toyota Corolla (and Windows Phone is a Ford Focus and BB is a Mazda 2).
Car fanboys will swear black and blue that their preferred manufacturer is the best, and they'll even list the reasons why.
To normal people they are all just cars.
If you wanted a phone analogous to a Ferrari it most certainly wouldn't be an iPhone, it would be a Vertu... stupidly impractical and overpriced to boot.
Current figures as of Feb 2012 indicate that Android has 47% of the market, compared to iOS's 29%:
asinine... Or just a joke that's past its use by date.
You are right though. If android is a dodge dart the iphone is a toyota corolla (and windows phone is a ford focus and bb is a mazda 2).
Car fanboys will swear black and blue that their preferred manufacturer is the best, and they'll even list the reasons why.
To normal people they are all just cars.
If you wanted a phone analogous to a ferrari it most certainly wouldn't be an iphone, it would be a vertu... Stupidly impractical and overpriced to boot.
current figures as of feb 2012 indicate that android has 47% of the market, compared to ios's 29%:
who's got the toyota corolla now, mr "i obviously can't afford a ferrari"?
how is that relevant to what i wrote?
if you are unable to follow your own posts in a thread i will most definitely not be explaining them for you.
How is that relevant to what I wrote?
If you want to comment on what other people have written then you reply to their posts. If you want to reply to my post you need to explain to me how your comment is relevant to what I wrote?
It seems you were not even commenting on what I wrote but on the person I quoted.
Well, in the sense that Apple disrupted a practically ossified handset industry by entering it with the iPhone, then you would be right.
By revolutionizing the upper-end market (where the profits were), and carving out a huge part of it for themselves, Apple threw establishment into panic mode. Jpbs estimated that it would take five years for the industry to catch up, and that's what it has taken MS and Nokia, and RIM if they don't die first.
Only Android, by using Apple's patents illegally, was able to jump in quickly. You will notice that only Android phone makers have suffered under Apple's suits, so where it may look like a forest fire to you, it is a very selective burn.
And it's a very controlled burn too. Apple is burning back the Android competition about as fast as Apple is building up its own production.
If I were to guess, I would expect 2013 to see one huge market share for Apple and the rest of the market served by Nokia with WM8, Samsung's Bada, and maybe one more small player. MotoMo and RIM most likely gone from the Phone business, and Google will be shoveling money out the back door to Apple and Oracle.
The smoke will clear and the fires will no longer be set.
First of all google did not copy iOS it is really sad some people are to ignorant to understand that. First of all the way the two OSs operate is totally different. Google uses a virtual machine called Dalvic very similar to java in order to interact with the soft ware and the hardware. iOS does not use a virtual machine to interact with software and hardware it is more direct on soft ware communicates with the machine language.
The next thing that is completely different about the OSs is the user interface. iOS goes the way of have no home screen and having the user doing everything directly from the app drawer. Android however does it a differently. Android does it similar to how Blackberry OS and Windows mobile have done it for years. Android has an App drawer that all the apps are placed in. Then it has a seperate homescreen that the user interacts with. this home screen contains the shortcut to applications and widgets this is similar to those previous OSs.
What happened was Android was being developed to compete with the then current heavy weights of the industry and was taking the best things from those OSs and makign android with it. At that time smartphones where keyboard based. Then the iPhone was Released and the demand for smartphones shifted. People did not want the keyboard based any more so as demand shifted so did did the androids offerings. Instead of offering an OS that would not even be desirable to consumers android was made touch orientated and DID COPY MULTITOUCH AND PINCH TO ZOOM however most of the things in the Os where virtually the same. Android being touch based does not make it an iOS copy. Having the grid of Icons is not because that was around far before iOS. If you use them both you will see the differences are vast.
I know i am in the minority hear, but when is Apple going to get past Steve's ego? These legal moves are only productive at stifling competition. I love Apple products but really starting to hate the anti-competitive and monopolistic world view
Probably when the competing product don't look exactly like an iPhone or an iPad. In samsungs case it will take a long time in court to dunk it into their heads.... Galaxy s = iPhone 3g(s), galaxy s2 = iPhone 4(s) and so on...
And it really doesn't look like a bright future on the legal side for the android os...
I know i am in the minority hear, but when is Apple going to get past Steve's ego? These legal moves are only productive at stifling competition. I love Apple products but really starting to hate the anti-competitive and monopolistic world view
Probably when the competing product don't look exactly like an iPhone or an iPad or copy ip from the iphone yes pinch to zoom, lockscreen etc. In samsungs case it will take a long time in court to dunk it into their heads.... Galaxy s = iPhone 3g(s), galaxy s2 = iPhone 4(s) and so on...
And it really doesn't look like a bright future on the legal side for the android os...
I know i am in the minority hear, but when is Apple going to get past Steve's ego? These legal moves are only productive at stifling competition. I love Apple products but really starting to hate the anti-competitive and monopolistic world view
Probably when the competing product don't look exactly like an iPhone or an iPad or copy ip from the iphone yes pinch to zoom, lockscreen etc. In samsungs case it will take a long time in court to dunk it into their heads.... Galaxy s = iPhone 3g(s), galaxy s2 = iPhone 4(s) and so on... And no I don't think slapping a logo on the frontside is enough of an fysical difference to not confuse buyers to think it is anything else than an iphone.
On a side note The iPhone really changed the material of the screen used and created a totally new market for Corning which had not found any use for its product fron the 60s. If it werent for the iPhone we would still use scratching plastic screens today...
And it really doesn't look like a bright future on the legal side for the android os...
Probably when the competing product don't look exactly like an iPhone or an iPad. In samsungs case it will take a long time in court to dunk it into their heads.... Galaxy s = iPhone 3g(s), galaxy s2 = iPhone 4(s) and so on...
And it really doesn't look like a bright future on the legal side for the android os...
He's absolutely right. It stifles competition when Apple's natural success is so overwhelming that Google and Samsung feel they have no choice but to steal from Apple instead of investing in actual innovation.
I believe that he was eluding to what I was bringing up: People like that aren't reported because they're using personal attacks on Android users. So even if the posts are horribly out of line, most people won't notice because his opinion lies with theirs. I don't know if this is true or not (and I definitely report both sides), but I have noticed a surprising number of Android fans being banned or having their posts edited recently. I'll make sure I take better note of both cases in the future to help combat my biases however.
Me, I am not a software socialist like the Groklaw team and believe programmers have the F***KING right to profit from their work.
I don't have a problem with software socialists/communists as such, it's where that model becomes corrupted like the Soviet Communist states and what we have with Google is a classic mirror of that.
Schmidt and his merry band sit up in the Politburo getting rich.
Comments
I don't understand that sentence.
Not considering the iPhone, if a maker came to VZW with a phone $100 more than a other models vzw would charge $100 more, but since ATT made the deal to sell the iPhone at $199 it would've been nor good business sense to follow suit. Get it?
I have a theory about why Apple is suing Android. Correct me if I'm wrong, didn't at one time Apple sucked back in the 90's? Nobody wanted Apple. Steve Jobs came into the picture and turn the company around by releasing the ipod 10 or so years ago? Then the ipod touch, the iphone, and now the ipad? They may be the first to take someone else idea and made it so much better. It all doesn't mean they are the best. There is always someone better out there. Just like the car analogy. You buy a 2012 Challenger R/T and pour $10k into performance. You think you are the fastest. Then you someone pulls up next to you with a brand new Challenger SRT8 and pour $10k into it. The SRT8 wins. Apple thinks they are the best because they started the smartphone race. Now realizing someone out there is faster (android) and Apple doesn't like it and they don't want to loose. Instead of using all the money they have to make there products better and faster, they sue. That's kinda like the same thing when you face the school bully and he is stronger than you. Instead of standing up with something of equal power like a stick or something, you run to tell his parents. Apple is a very rich spoil brat that doesn't like to fight on their own.
Welcome to AI and I hope your future posts are better than this one.
Not considering the iPhone, if a maker came to VZW with a phone $100 more than a other models vzw would charge $100 more, but since ATT made the deal to sell the iPhone at $199 it would've been nor good business sense to follow suit. Get it?
Now I get your point, but I don't think that's how it played out. I think Apple told the carriers what they will pay Apple and what the maximum per phone they can charge per their contract. I think Apple dictated the terms by pointing out that there phone will bring in subscribers, maintain subscribers, and create smartphone users from dumb phone users, and (perhaps most importantly) create family plans from hand-me-down iPhones that they will not have to pay Apple anything for. At least that's how I would have approached it.
Good lord this thread is grotesque. Can't we just lock it and be done? Is AI now truly just click whoring with no regard at all for the quality of the discussion?
There ought to be a reading comprehension test before one is allowed to post.
Now I get your point, but I don't think that's how it played out. I think Apple told the carriers what they will pay Apple and what the maximum per phone they can charge per their contract. I think Apple dictated the terms by pointing out that there phone will bring in subscribers, maintain subscribers, and create smartphone users from dumb phone users, and (perhaps most importantly) create family plans from hand-me-down iPhones that they will not have to pay Apple anything for. At least that's how I would have approached it.
That's how it played out with ATT, but I'm certain VZW wasn't going to say "We now sell the iPhone for $100 more than ATT, for your extra $100 you get slower 3G in many places, no talk and surf, harder to sell, etc.."
Android is not one specific make and model. GM sells the most cars but they do not have the best selling car.
I understand your attempts to backpedal and suddenly break your car analogy into categories to try and reduce Android's market share.
I also understand that you're embarrassed that you've made an analogy in an area where you're obviously not familiar with either cars or the phone industry.
Unfortunately, the fact remains that you stated "Comparing an iPhone to a Ferrari is asinine, its the best selling phone right? So what's the best selling car? a Toyota Corolla? Why? Because they just work. Low repair rate, and long lasting. That makes more sense."
By your own analogy, Android, the best selling phone on the market, with a current market share of 47%, is now that 'Toyota Corolla'.
And I guess that makes iPhone the Ferrari, as previously stated by meh 2.
Thanks for proving his point.
Good lord this thread is grotesque. Can't we just lock it and be done? Is AI now truly just click whoring with no regard at all for the quality of the discussion?
I utterly agree.
Good thing we're open-minded when it comes to trolls on an Apple-related forum.
Asinine... or just a joke that's past its use by date.
You are right though. If Android is a Dodge Dart the iPhone is a Toyota Corolla (and Windows Phone is a Ford Focus and BB is a Mazda 2).
Car fanboys will swear black and blue that their preferred manufacturer is the best, and they'll even list the reasons why.
To normal people they are all just cars.
If you wanted a phone analogous to a Ferrari it most certainly wouldn't be an iPhone, it would be a Vertu... stupidly impractical and overpriced to boot.
Current figures as of Feb 2012 indicate that Android has 47% of the market, compared to iOS's 29%:
http://marketingland.com/us-smartpho...s-decline-5249
Who's got the Toyota Corolla now, Mr "I obviously can't afford a Ferrari"?
How is that relevant to what I wrote?
How is that relevant to what I wrote?
If you are unable to follow your own posts in a thread I will most definitely not be explaining them for you.
asinine... Or just a joke that's past its use by date.
You are right though. If android is a dodge dart the iphone is a toyota corolla (and windows phone is a ford focus and bb is a mazda 2).
Car fanboys will swear black and blue that their preferred manufacturer is the best, and they'll even list the reasons why.
To normal people they are all just cars.
If you wanted a phone analogous to a ferrari it most certainly wouldn't be an iphone, it would be a vertu... Stupidly impractical and overpriced to boot.
current figures as of feb 2012 indicate that android has 47% of the market, compared to ios's 29%:
http://marketingland.com/us-smartpho...s-decline-5249
who's got the toyota corolla now, mr "i obviously can't afford a ferrari"?
how is that relevant to what i wrote?
if you are unable to follow your own posts in a thread i will most definitely not be explaining them for you.
How is that relevant to what I wrote?
If you want to comment on what other people have written then you reply to their posts. If you want to reply to my post you need to explain to me how your comment is relevant to what I wrote?
It seems you were not even commenting on what I wrote but on the person I quoted.
Well, in the sense that Apple disrupted a practically ossified handset industry by entering it with the iPhone, then you would be right.
By revolutionizing the upper-end market (where the profits were), and carving out a huge part of it for themselves, Apple threw establishment into panic mode. Jpbs estimated that it would take five years for the industry to catch up, and that's what it has taken MS and Nokia, and RIM if they don't die first.
Only Android, by using Apple's patents illegally, was able to jump in quickly. You will notice that only Android phone makers have suffered under Apple's suits, so where it may look like a forest fire to you, it is a very selective burn.
And it's a very controlled burn too. Apple is burning back the Android competition about as fast as Apple is building up its own production.
If I were to guess, I would expect 2013 to see one huge market share for Apple and the rest of the market served by Nokia with WM8, Samsung's Bada, and maybe one more small player. MotoMo and RIM most likely gone from the Phone business, and Google will be shoveling money out the back door to Apple and Oracle.
The smoke will clear and the fires will no longer be set.
First of all google did not copy iOS it is really sad some people are to ignorant to understand that. First of all the way the two OSs operate is totally different. Google uses a virtual machine called Dalvic very similar to java in order to interact with the soft ware and the hardware. iOS does not use a virtual machine to interact with software and hardware it is more direct on soft ware communicates with the machine language.
The next thing that is completely different about the OSs is the user interface. iOS goes the way of have no home screen and having the user doing everything directly from the app drawer. Android however does it a differently. Android does it similar to how Blackberry OS and Windows mobile have done it for years. Android has an App drawer that all the apps are placed in. Then it has a seperate homescreen that the user interacts with. this home screen contains the shortcut to applications and widgets this is similar to those previous OSs.
What happened was Android was being developed to compete with the then current heavy weights of the industry and was taking the best things from those OSs and makign android with it. At that time smartphones where keyboard based. Then the iPhone was Released and the demand for smartphones shifted. People did not want the keyboard based any more so as demand shifted so did did the androids offerings. Instead of offering an OS that would not even be desirable to consumers android was made touch orientated and DID COPY MULTITOUCH AND PINCH TO ZOOM however most of the things in the Os where virtually the same. Android being touch based does not make it an iOS copy. Having the grid of Icons is not because that was around far before iOS. If you use them both you will see the differences are vast.
I know i am in the minority hear, but when is Apple going to get past Steve's ego? These legal moves are only productive at stifling competition. I love Apple products but really starting to hate the anti-competitive and monopolistic world view
Probably when the competing product don't look exactly like an iPhone or an iPad. In samsungs case it will take a long time in court to dunk it into their heads.... Galaxy s = iPhone 3g(s), galaxy s2 = iPhone 4(s) and so on...
And it really doesn't look like a bright future on the legal side for the android os...
I know i am in the minority hear, but when is Apple going to get past Steve's ego? These legal moves are only productive at stifling competition. I love Apple products but really starting to hate the anti-competitive and monopolistic world view
Probably when the competing product don't look exactly like an iPhone or an iPad or copy ip from the iphone yes pinch to zoom, lockscreen etc. In samsungs case it will take a long time in court to dunk it into their heads.... Galaxy s = iPhone 3g(s), galaxy s2 = iPhone 4(s) and so on...
And it really doesn't look like a bright future on the legal side for the android os...
I know i am in the minority hear, but when is Apple going to get past Steve's ego? These legal moves are only productive at stifling competition. I love Apple products but really starting to hate the anti-competitive and monopolistic world view
Probably when the competing product don't look exactly like an iPhone or an iPad or copy ip from the iphone yes pinch to zoom, lockscreen etc. In samsungs case it will take a long time in court to dunk it into their heads.... Galaxy s = iPhone 3g(s), galaxy s2 = iPhone 4(s) and so on... And no I don't think slapping a logo on the frontside is enough of an fysical difference to not confuse buyers to think it is anything else than an iphone.
On a side note The iPhone really changed the material of the screen used and created a totally new market for Corning which had not found any use for its product fron the 60s. If it werent for the iPhone we would still use scratching plastic screens today...
And it really doesn't look like a bright future on the legal side for the android os...
Probably when the competing product don't look exactly like an iPhone or an iPad. In samsungs case it will take a long time in court to dunk it into their heads.... Galaxy s = iPhone 3g(s), galaxy s2 = iPhone 4(s) and so on...
And it really doesn't look like a bright future on the legal side for the android os...
He's absolutely right. It stifles competition when Apple's natural success is so overwhelming that Google and Samsung feel they have no choice but to steal from Apple instead of investing in actual innovation.
None.
I believe that he was eluding to what I was bringing up: People like that aren't reported because they're using personal attacks on Android users. So even if the posts are horribly out of line, most people won't notice because his opinion lies with theirs. I don't know if this is true or not (and I definitely report both sides), but I have noticed a surprising number of Android fans being banned or having their posts edited recently. I'll make sure I take better note of both cases in the future to help combat my biases however.
To the mods: Thanks for doing what you do!
Me, I am not a software socialist like the Groklaw team and believe programmers have the F***KING right to profit from their work.
I don't have a problem with software socialists/communists as such, it's where that model becomes corrupted like the Soviet Communist states and what we have with Google is a classic mirror of that.
Schmidt and his merry band sit up in the Politburo getting rich.