Judge affirms vital Apple touchscreen patent in case against Motorola

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Comments

  • tbelltbell Posts: 3,146member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Blitz1 View Post


    Well, here are a couple of things.



    Touch was not invented by Apple

    The display of the app icons was not invented by Apple

    The swipe to unlock was not invented by Apple

    The tablet was not invented by Apple

    Apple did not invent the rounded rectangle

    ...



    True, but the specific implementation of how those things are used in Apple's devices was invented by Apple. There is more than one way to do something, and in most cases each way may be eligible for patent protection.



    Further, when you take a whole bunch of things and put them together to make a single item, the arrangement of those small things might be eligible for patent, trademark, and possibly copyright protection.



    Look no further than Coke's original bottle for an example of how that works. Other's created bottles to drink from before Coke. Yet, its bottle was protected by patent, copyright, and trademark law.
  • tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 40,400member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


    We're still at least a year away from a product that wasn't largely done under Jobs.



    Next year's iPad's processor will probably be the first major component that didn't have high-level approval from him (as it didn't exist beyond projections when he died). As for combinations of product specs before that, I think we'll see (though we'll never know it's the case) the 6th iPhone have a feature set that isn't exactly what he wanted.
  • gatorguygatorguy Posts: 14,912member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TBell View Post


    Maybe he will cover it with some of that Apple stock.



    BTW, it's nice to see occasional legal comments from an actual attorney rather than someone who plays one on the forum.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


    Thanks for trolling.



    How about learning a little about patent law and the requirement that companies defend their patents or lose them, then come back (tail between legs) with an informed comment for everyone.



    I'd like to learn about that. Can you give any cites for the proposition that you lose a patent if you do not defend it?
  • gatorguygatorguy Posts: 14,912member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post


    I'd like to learn about that. Can you give any cites for the proposition that you lose a patent if you do not defend it?



    I think he's probably well aware he misspoke. It happens to all of us on occasion, so no need to rub it in. What goes around comes around and all that.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by TBell View Post


    As an attorney I can promise you there is no such requirement under Patent law. Companies quietly allow other companies to use patented ideas all the time. Perhaps, you are thinking of Trademark law where indeed one does have to police one's patents.




    I don't believe that you are an attorney, due to the ignorant and sloppy writing displayed here.



    I find it unlikely that an attorney would use the wrong word in this context. Maybe it was just a brain fart? But as of now, I call bullshit.
  • dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,481member
    It should be aired on A&E, we already have Storage Wars and Shipping Wars, Patent Wars would make a good show.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by haar View Post


    well I HATE that in windows, when you use the scroll bar to get to the end of a list and overshoot the end of the scroll bar, it goes back to where is started from.

    really, can't window recognize that i am pulling down the scroll bar to the end, and when i get to the bottom of the bar, it(window contents) should stay at the bottom... i'm holding the mouse buttom down, shouldn't it know that I don't want to leave the scroll bar, but get to the end.?








    There are a zillion annoying aspects of Windows. In the 1990's I used to curse at Microsoft because of them.



    There are many fewer now, and most of them are no longer even noticed. Many of them can be worked around, so they never appear. Many of them are mere default settings, which can be easily changed.



    Windows is far from perfect, and I an very sceptical of their new UI for Windows 8. I suspect that many people will just opt for the "Classic" Win7 UI and will rarely if ever look at Metro on the desktop.
  • stelligentstelligent Posts: 2,680member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TBell View Post


    True, but the specific implementation of how those things are used in Apple's devices was invented by Apple. There is more than one way to do something, and in most cases each way may be eligible for patent protection.



    Further, when you take a whole bunch of things and put them together to make a single item, the arrangement of those small things might be eligible for patent, trademark, and possibly copyright protection.



    Look no further than Coke's original bottle for an example of how that works. Other's created bottles to drink from before Coke. Yet, its bottle was protected by patent, copyright, and trademark law.



    The Coke bottle is protected by a trademark? Really?
  • stelligentstelligent Posts: 2,680member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post


    It should be aired on A&E, we already have Storage Wars and Shipping Wars, Patent Wars would make a good show.



    You can count on a book or two covering this some time. It should be a good read.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post


    I think he's probably well aware he misspoke. It happens to all of us on occasion, so no need to rub it in. What goes around comes around and all that.



    If it is the case that he misspoke, then all is well. Yes, it happens to all of us.
  • solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by stelligent View Post


    The Coke bottle is protected by a trademark? Really?



    Pages 6, 7, 10 and 11 will be quite enlightening, though the whole thing is informative while being easy to digest.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by stelligent View Post


    The Coke bottle is protected by a trademark? Really?



    "Widely recognized as a pioneering example of package-driven branding, the contour bottle is one of the few packages to ever receive a trademark from the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office, helping to make Coca-Cola one of the most famous brands in the world today."



    http://www.junkfoodnews.net/Coke-Bottles-90-Years.htm







    I don't vouch for the accuracy of the information, but it exists independently as a statement of fact...
  • gatorguygatorguy Posts: 14,912member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


    Pages 6, 7, 10 and 11 will be quite enlightening, though the whole thing is informative while being easy to digest.



    That's a nice presentation and an easy read. Thanks for the find Solip.
  • quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,566member
    Moto's products are lousy and so is their service. Derivative, undifferentiated junk (unless "fugly" counts as differentiation.)

    There's a reason they needed a buyout. They were tanking.



    Those who fail to re-invent their business end up as buyout-bait with nothing left but an old trove of patents,

    most of which they try to wield around (or abuse) for FRAND licensing dollars. Like an old hooker way past her sell-by date.



    I kinda feel sorry for Moto. That like Nokia, they've become this sad and pathetic in their old age.

    There was a time when they made decent products and were able to respond to market forces (which to be fair, were moving along at a glacial pace anyway.)



    Apple in 2007 and later in 2010 destroyed a lot of comfortable (but hopelessly dated) business strategies in the mobile sector.
  • bushman4bushman4 Posts: 775member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RedGeminiPA View Post


    You have no idea what you're talking about. It's already been said that there is about 3-5 years worth of products on the roadmap that Steve Jobs was involved in.



    You complain about the iPhone 4S's design (not a redesign), but you completely ignored the iPhone 3GS. Did you miss that one? It was the same design as the iPhone 3G. Want to guess how that went over with the consumers? IT SOLD MORE THAN THE IPHONE 3G, A LOT MORE! And, it's STILL IN PRODUCTION.



    Considering there is well over a year in R&D for a new product, Steve was still around during the new iPad's development.



    Just in case you missed it, Apple has been partners with Samsung for a LONG time... just like they were partners with Google, well before Android became what it is.



    You really need to do some more research before you come here blabbering about stuff you obviously don't know anything about.



    I could go on dissecting your other stupid comments, but it isn't worth my time or effort.



    Even with a product refresh once a year, its not as easy to totally change or reinvent totally.

    Most people look for the physival hardware changes they can see to call it new and different. Unfortunately people forget its the new operating system and better inside components that are worth more.

    Lastly why do a total change when you have a winning product they just tweak it (even when Steve Jobs was alive) because you never know how well a reinvented product will be accepted......Even though its Apple and people will buy it there are many that buy for the technology not just because its Apple.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by BUSHMAN4 View Post


    Lastly why do a total change when you have a winning product they just tweak it (even when Steve Jobs was alive) because you never know how well a reinvented product will be accepted......Even though its Apple and people will buy it there are many that buy for the technology not just because its Apple.



    Apple is clever about doing that. It often releases products in parallel to the existing products.



    The MBA is an example. It came out in parallel to the MBP. Now there are rumors of a merger between the two, presumably taking the best aspects of each.



    Likely a similar case could be made in the iPod world as well.



    Finally, people talk about some sort of merger between the MBA and the iPad. I don't know what it would be like, but the general theme is similar WRT "reinvented products" in that they are parallel releases, which are later merged.
  • jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post


    Finally, people talk about some sort of merger between the MBA and the iPad.



    People also talk about Elvis living on Mars with Marilyn Monroe.
  • solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post


    Apple is clever about doing that. It often releases products in parallel to the existing products.



    The MBA is an example. It came out in parallel to the MBP. Now there are rumors of a merger between the two, presumably taking the best aspects of each.



    Likely a similar case could be made in the iPod world as well.



    Finally, people talk about some sort of merger between the MBA and the iPad. I don't know what it would be like, but the general theme is similar WRT "reinvented products" in that they are parallel releases, which are later merged.



    Apple has a long history of borrowing tech from its products. It's one area their competitors don't seem to understand. Apple has built iOS from Mac OS and since then have returned pieces back that make Mac OS better. They also did this with their iPhone HW with their iPod Hw expertise, which includes their knowledge of multi-touch trackpad drivers.



    The MBA was their first unibody design. It seemed expensive and "over engineered" at the time, if you want to take a pejorative look at it, but since then the MBP, then iPhone, then iPad, and Mac mini have adopted it. I think the Apple TV remote is also milled from a solid piece of aluminium.



    From their ASIC to their casings they are building upon their expertise with each new release. If you decide to keep your groups in isolation or switch horses because you've "innovated" your way into a corner you are limited in your scope and will have to start over way too often to be competitive.
  • drdoppiodrdoppio Posts: 1,132member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    That's a platitude. Of course they are.



    The question is whether they have to pay to stay.



    Well, in light of the claims that the recently upheld patent is "vital", Mr Job's apparent desire to destroy Android, and all the talk about thermonuclear war on Android, it is hardly a platitude to claim that Android will survive unaffected.



    Even the fact that patents may lead only to royalties and not product bans has been suggested to pose a threat on the survival of Android, since making the OS too expensive will drive down the profits of the manufacturers and they may opt for WP instead.



    In the end, I think it is non-trivial to suggest that the effect of this particular patent on end consumers will be as insignificant as those of the previous patents that caused features in Android to be reworked.
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