Apple CEO Tim Cook says globalization is 'great for the world' in China speech

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 68
    A very wide ranging thread. Please endure this long comment, there is a payoff, if just in a reason to deride this commenter.  Which is welcomed if deserved.

    As mentioned by others, Tim Cook is a man on the wire at all times. Even some Apple lovers here seem to not understand his dilemma. Haters include some among Apple users, Apple haters and anti liberal governments at home and abroad. No winners in his job, when even people whom enjoy the luxury of free speech, open tech, unlimited liberties comparatively to other countries still bad mouth a successful representative of that freedom, in Cook and Apple when they go into the opposing den.
    Clearly, he must defend the health and prosperity of his company, which means he speaks a different language to different audiences, remains flexible to the inflexible barriers to Apple. And throughout, at least to my eye and ear, he acts as a worthy role model on the world stage, and as a proper corporate representative and citizen of the United States. The people, business and entrepreneur types and authoritarian governments learn from the determination and patience of a liberal icon like Cook in their midst, even when it isn't immediately apparent.

    One other major factor not directly mentioned in this thread which has had a major impact and influence on low educational achievement in the US and the problems encompassed in globalization began several decades ago, mid 1970's.

    Once thought to to be a 'crazy conspiracy theory', the Concept of Trilateralism actually took hold and has in an almost monopolistic fashion, taken over important aspects of US lifestyle, education and economic globalization theory. This is also true to a lesser extent in other Trilateral nations and in the present lack of cohesion and stability in international relations as a whole.

    Lowering of educational standards in the US was one of the main goals of the Trilateralists, under the theory that a less educated electorate will be less able to understand and disagree/refuse the issues and consequences of transnational corporate domination and all factors of  globalization and importantly less able, prepared and motivated to vote for a truly representative leader. If you include gerrymandering and the disenfranchisement of many traditionally Democratic leaning members of the electorate, it is amazing, center right Democratic candidates like Clinton and Obama were able to win national elections, even though  the economic and social leanings in a majority of the voting age members of society favor the more generally identified democratic issues and planks. 

    Trilateralism is not a conspiracy theory it became a conspiracy reality. The greatest example of their success was the election of 1980. Three candidates were in contention Democratic candidates Carter/Mondale, Republicans Reagan/Bush and for one of the few times in modern Presidential Elections, an independent candidate considered a legitimate contender, John Anderson.

    As many know, all three contenders in 1980 were Trilateralists. In essence, in supposedly, the most open and democratic election system in modern times, people had no choice other than a candidate from the Trilateral Commission.

    How many Trilateralist existed at the time? Western Europe, Japan and US Canada was considered the Trilateral world. Approximately 600 millions people in those countries at the time, and only 360 people were hand picked as Trilateralist, as representatives for 600 millions people.
    In the US, the dominant member nation of the Trilateral world, we had 80 members on the Commission. So 80 members for 280 million folks. That's a hell of a conspiracy. In 1976, the first election that the Trilateralist came into ascendancy, President Carters Administration had 16 top members of his Administration as Trilateralists. President, V. president, Sec of State/Defense/Treasury/UN Ambassador and many other top officials. Between the Carter/Reagan/GHWBush period Trilateralism dominated American Foreign and Domestic Policy including the considerable dumbing down of the educational standards of American classrooms.

    So, to the present, these folks run the show, because the Trilateralists, the political theory they subscribe to and globalization as a whole was theorized and institutionalized by the think tank off shoots scholars and policies from those rightist institutions. Two that stand out are the Heritage Foundation and American Enterprise Institute.

    the important difference in our situation now is that this political/economic theory cum present reality is now in the hands of a completely unethical illiberal Presidential/Congressional leadership, and some would say, Russian influenced government. In any case our present government is not a benevolent government, so the current incarnation can be expected to be more Authoritarian with an even more militaristic and economically dominating bent here and abroad.

    So give Cook and Apple a break, we are witnessing the breakdown of the modern nation state system and economic status quo. Where it all lands, nobody knows!








    edited March 19 tallest skil
  • Reply 42 of 68
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 1,397member
    georgie01 said:
    I see the benefits of globalisation but can't support Cook on it. It creates greater potential for negative global consequences, things in our arrogance we assume won't happen. Even the shipping of bees around the US to pollinate crops makes me nervous—that seems like a disaster waiting to happen (why not develop a sustainable crop variety to encourage bee population year round?). Also, through globalisation there is a reduction in the uniqueness of different cultures, and I think it's arrogant to assume those losses are inconsequential.
    There are also consequences of non-globalization, as we see with the slowly sinking ship of the British economy.

    And there are even dangers in democracy, if the electorate is ignorant and uncommitted to the principles of that form of government, as we saw in Egypt and other Arab Spring disasters, and we may be seeing in the US right now.
    The US is NOT a Democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. But you are correct in that our electorate, on both sides, seem uncommitted to preserving the Constitution as it was written and try to interpret it in their own ways which is very bad. 
    O rly? As written....you mean banning women from voting? Defining slaves as worth 3/5s of a white man? 

    Sorry, but as should be perfectly clear the constitution is a framework designed to be modified and updated and cannot be taken as set in stone, considering some of its serious humanitarian flaws. 
  • Reply 43 of 68
    georgie01 said:
    I see the benefits of globalisation but can't support Cook on it. It creates greater potential for negative global consequences, things in our arrogance we assume won't happen. Even the shipping of bees around the US to pollinate crops makes me nervous—that seems like a disaster waiting to happen (why not develop a sustainable crop variety to encourage bee population year round?). Also, through globalisation there is a reduction in the uniqueness of different cultures, and I think it's arrogant to assume those losses are inconsequential.
    There are also consequences of non-globalization, as we see with the slowly sinking ship of the British economy.

    And there are even dangers in democracy, if the electorate is ignorant and uncommitted to the principles of that form of government, as we saw in Egypt and other Arab Spring disasters, and we may be seeing in the US right now.
    The US is NOT a Democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. But you are correct in that our electorate, on both sides, seem uncommitted to preserving the Constitution as it was written and try to interpret it in their own ways which is very bad. 
    A Republic is a type of Democracy (a representative Democracy). It's completely correct to refer to it as a Democracy.
    SoliSpamSandwich
  • Reply 44 of 68
    spice-boyspice-boy Posts: 315member
    A very wide ranging thread. Please endure this long comment, there is a payoff, if just in a reason to deride this commenter.  Which is welcomed if deserved.

    As mentioned by others, Tim Cook is a man on the wire at all times. Even some Apple lovers here seem to not understand his dilemma. Haters include some among Apple users, Apple haters and anti liberal governments at home and abroad. No winners in his job, when even people whom enjoy the luxury of free speech, open tech, unlimited liberties comparatively to other countries still bad mouth a successful representative of that freedom, in Cook and Apple when they go into the opposing den.
    Clearly, he must defend the health and prosperity of his company, which means he speaks a different language to different audiences, remains flexible to the inflexible barriers to Apple. And throughout, at least to my eye and ear, he acts as a worthy role model on the world stage, and as a proper corporate representative and citizen of the United States. The people, business and entrepreneur types and authoritarian governments learn from the determination and patience of a liberal icon like Cook in their midst, even when it isn't immediately apparent.

    One other major factor not directly mentioned in this thread which has had a major impact and influence on low educational achievement in the US and the problems encompassed in globalization began several decades ago, mid 1970's.

    Once thought to to be a 'crazy conspiracy theory', the Concept of Trilateralism actually took hold and has in an almost monopolistic fashion, taken over important aspects of US lifestyle, education and economic globalization theory. This is also true to a lesser extent in other Trilateral nations and in the present lack of cohesion and stability in international relations as a whole.

    Lowering of educational standards in the US was one of the main goals of the Trilateralists, under the theory that a less educated electorate will be less able to understand and disagree/refuse the issues and consequences of transnational corporate domination and all factors of  globalization and importantly less able, prepared and motivated to vote for a truly representative leader. If you include gerrymandering and the disenfranchisement of many traditionally Democratic leaning members of the electorate, it is amazing, center right Democratic candidates like Clinton and Obama were able to win national elections, even though  the economic and social leanings in a majority of the voting age members of society favor the more generally identified democratic issues and planks. 

    Trilateralism is not a conspiracy theory it became a conspiracy reality. The greatest example of their success was the election of 1980. Three candidates were in contention Democratic candidates Carter/Mondale, Republicans Reagan/Bush and for one of the few times in modern Presidential Elections, an independent candidate considered a legitimate contender, John Anderson.

    As many know, all three contenders in 1980 were Trilateralists. In essence, in supposedly, the most open and democratic election system in modern times, people had no choice other than a candidate from the Trilateral Commission.

    How many Trilateralist existed at the time? Western Europe, Japan and US Canada was considered the Trilateral world. Approximately 600 millions people in those countries at the time, and only 360 people were hand picked as Trilateralist, as representatives for 600 millions people.
    In the US, the dominant member nation of the Trilateral world, we had 80 members on the Commission. So 80 members for 280 million folks. That's a hell of a conspiracy. In 1976, the first election that the Trilateralist came into ascendancy, President Carters Administration had 16 top members of his Administration as Trilateralists. President, V. president, Sec of State/Defense/Treasury/UN Ambassador and many other top officials. Between the Carter/Reagan/GHWBush period Trilateralism dominated American Foreign and Domestic Policy including the considerable dumbing down of the educational standards of American classrooms.

    So, to the present, these folks run the show, because the Trilateralists, the political theory they subscribe to and globalization as a whole was theorized and institutionalized by the think tank off shoots scholars and policies from those rightist institutions. Two that stand out are the Heritage Foundation and American Enterprise Institute.

    the important difference in our situation now is that this political/economic theory cum present reality is now in the hands of a completely unethical illiberal Presidential/Congressional leadership, and some would say, Russian influenced government. In any case our present government is not a benevolent government, so the current incarnation can be expected to be more Authoritarian with an even more militaristic and economically dominating bent here and abroad.

    So give Cook and Apple a break, we are witnessing the breakdown of the modern nation state system and economic status quo. Where it all lands, nobody knows!








    Wow, so there was a concerted effort to make Americas dumb? People always get the government they deserve and unfortunately we will about to get a lesson of what a lack on critical thinking will bring forth. Any person with a library card, and internet connection and the desire to find out more about something can do so, what seems to prevent this is a lack in interest.

    We have become a society of consumers not creators. We consume news in small bites (or bytes) and are satisfied with a headline and deep no further. Most people spend any time when they are not working shopping. Homes get filled with useless junk and the solution is never to stop shopping just buy a bigger house to fit it all in until of course that house runs out of storage.

    Our society will soon be a 2 class one with the educated living primarily in cities and surrounding suburban towns which will be better educated with white collar jobs. The other class will consist of the miniamully educated, living in failed towns and small cities who turn to cooking meth to survive. What happened in the 1970's in cities like New York is now happening in the homeland. Now most "welfare" and public assistance goes to rural and small towns compared to what the Republican party falsely claim is mostly lavished on single (inner city) mothers. 

    I came from a dying manufacturing town, once the biggest textile producing city in the world by the time I was a teen I knew I had to go to college and never return if I wanted a better life. I was luckier than most to have that insight at that age and the strength to leave everything and everyone behind to pursue a better life in New York. There has always been poverty in America but now it has shifted to the middle and working class who we're not prepared and longing for the time of their parents. That time will never return. 
    ration al
  • Reply 45 of 68
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 41,355member
    we are witnessing the breakdown of the modern nation state system and economic status quo. Where it all lands, nobody knows!
    Don’t worry. It lands with the execution for treason of the people trying to do that.
    O rly? As written....you mean banning women from voting? Defining slaves as worth 3/5s of a... ...man?
    Oh, cute. A reducto ad absurdum. Anything else to add, or do you seriously believe in moral relativism?
    ...the constitution is a framework designed to be modified and updated...
    Which is why the concept of amendments exist, not the concept of activist judging, which is the same as treason.
    ...considering some of its serious humanitarian flaws.
    Rights are not given, they are innate. You’re just wrong.
    It's completely correct to refer to it as a Democracy.
    It’s not, as democracy in the modern sense has been taken to mean “direct democracy, universal franchise,” which has never been relevant to the United States’ governance.

    spice-boy said:
    Wow, so there was a concerted effort to make Americas dumb?
    Is.
    People always get the government they deserve and unfortunately we will about to get a lesson of what a lack on critical thinking will bring forth.
    About? As though the last century has been any good? Holy shit, cry some more and try again with a real argument.
    There has always been poverty in America but now it has shifted to the middle and working class who we're not prepared and longing for the time of their parents. That time will never return. 
    Thanks for the defeatism. It’s not relevant to reality in any way, but thanks for it. I’m sure the problems will be solved that way.
  • Reply 46 of 68
    SoliSoli Posts: 2,860member
    O rly? As written....you mean banning women from voting? Defining slaves as worth 3/5s of a... ...man?
    Oh, cute. A reducto ad absurdum. Anything else to add, or do you seriously believe in moral relativism?
    Holy shit! You're claiming those facts about US history are absurd? As in they never happened? Holy fuck, don't tell me you think the Earth is flat and the Holocaust is a Jewish conspiracy, too!
    edited March 19 singularity
  • Reply 47 of 68
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 41,355member
    Soli said:
    Holy shit! You're claiming those facts about US history are absurd?
    Nope.
  • Reply 48 of 68
    spice-boyspice-boy Posts: 315member
    Question who am I?
    "I can write a single sentence debunking anyone's comments because I am right without need to backup my dismissive proclamations".
     
  • Reply 49 of 68
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 41,355member
    spice-boy said:
    Question who am I?
    "I can write a single sentence debunking anyone's comments because I am right without need to backup my dismissive proclamations".
    Oh, I know! You!

    Still waiting for my questions to be answered, by the way. You won’t, though.
    SpamSandwich
  • Reply 50 of 68
    monstrositymonstrosity Posts: 2,136member
    Globalisation is cancer. I look forward to Tim Cook retiring.
    edited March 19 tallest skilSpamSandwich
  • Reply 51 of 68
    dewmedewme Posts: 765member
    The whole notion of "globalization" is very subjective. Whether it's viewed as a benefit or a curse depends on whether one takes an optimistic or a pessimistic perspective. In a narrow sense, I clearly recall when China started opening up to trade with the west in the early 1980s the company I worked for was giddy with the notion of selling more of our US made products into China. The naive and optimistic perspective at the time equated "globalization" with "more worldwide customers." Unfortunately the reality turned out to be more like "if you build your products in China with special considerations for the functional and financial needs of the Chinese customer base, then you will have Chinese customers. Damn. That's a lot more work!  In retrospect the regional companies already in the Asian market were able to react more quickly and accurately to the needs of the Chinese market and now they not only control that market but have backfilled into the US market and displaced most of the US players.

    I think Steve Jobs and Tim Cook saw similar things happening but at much greater velocity and scale. To sell widely in global markets you have to have global presence and localize your products to the particular needs of many localities. This of course is a very narrow and optimistic perspective to maximize the reach of companies desiring global presence and a global customer base. I've subsequently been involved in other products and companies that played this version of globalization successfully. But I'd be the first one to say that once a for-profit company has global scale capabilities and a flexible operational infrastructure that work on a global scale they will absolutely "optimize" their global capability to exploit the margins made available by the lack of globalization of social, financial, regulatory, currency, legal, currency, economic, etc., systems in the countries involved. Capitalism at some level is driven by the exploitation of inequities and margins and globalization in a worldwide environment that lacks global systems and global citizenship simply expands the playing field for companies that execute on it well, like Apple does.

    In my opinion "globalization" is way too overloaded a term to use as a catch-all for how some companies are currently playing the global market in very narrow product segments. The closest analogy I can think of is "automation" in the sense of machines replacing human workers. The optimistic versus pessimistic perspectives of the effects of automation go back at least as far as the Greeks and Romans and remain as divisive as ever today. I suspect globalization will follow a similar split between optimistic and pessimistic perspectives for at least as long a period of time going forward. There are no easy answers, unless we all become citizens of a single global society that spans the entire population of the Earth. 
    edited March 19
  • Reply 52 of 68
    SoliSoli Posts: 2,860member
    Globalisation is cancer. I look forward to Tim Cook retiring.
    So your ideal view of Apple is to source all materials in the US, build only in the US, and sell only in the US? I'm glad you're not working at Apple.
  • Reply 53 of 68
    I think a certain amount of globalization is needed and healthy.  I have seen many hammering trump for being anti globalization which he is not.  My understanding is he feels a strong need to take care of the US first.  Which I feel is a good thing.  Would be curious on other views to this.
  • Reply 54 of 68
    spice-boyspice-boy Posts: 315member
    spice-boy said:
    Question who am I?
    "I can write a single sentence debunking anyone's comments because I am right without need to backup my dismissive proclamations".
    Oh, I know! You!

    Still waiting for my questions to be answered, by the way. You won’t, though.
    you are so easy.
  • Reply 55 of 68
    Like how Julian Assange’s Wikileaks chooses to attack Western democracies and leave the totalitarian Chinese, Russian, DPRK governments alone. If he had released classified Russian documents he would have been dead ten years ago. Tim Cook is a big-time SJW in the U.S. but not in China, India, Russia where iPhone sales can be shut down if he opens his mouth. And of course there’s the Saudis and other Arab countries who publicly execute homosexuals. Such bravery! Same goes for Google and every other ‘American’ global company. 
    You got it backwards. Jullian Assange does not attack, but releases facts which meanistream media forgot to do for political reasons. Since mainstream mediia is on liberal side attacking conservatoves event without any factual grounds then this sounds like right thing to do to have reliable sources of facts and release them to public. His organization did release facts about conservatives as well, but apparently they were not as shocking as liberal affairs.
    edited March 20
  • Reply 56 of 68
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 41,355member
    spice-boy said:
    you are so easy.
    “It’s $25 for a bon mot, $100 for a full debate, sugar. No logical fallacies, no sources known for being paid to receive fake stories, and I get to say where you touch.” 

    Still not an argument, by the way.
  • Reply 57 of 68
    Globalization is great for Apple and other large multi-national corporations but there aren't as many benefits for the average worker.
    That is very true. However powerful people have to say and they do not give damn about average as person. 10-15 years ago I posted on ZDnet forums concerns about predictable outcomes of globalization, but I was "a fool". It was not even innovative what I posted that time because US manufacturing already died by that time and people lost all that. Then quality issues from Asia came and again when I said about that I was "not politically correct". Marked was swampt by some breaking scrap to perpetuate economy based on garbage products. Well aparently some powerful people want revenue from one place and invest elsewhere. Well that does not work for many and it is symptom of globalist idea. After all it should be controlled by individual governments that run for their countries, but buisness thinks otherwise and so rich get richer and average equilize to less wealthy. I also said that India and China can swamp other markets and drown them... especially US. People do not seem to understand human potential and US population being only small fraction in comparison to places like in India and China. In other words, if you do not start controlling trend then small population will lose wealth and turn into demise and poverty at some point1. It does not work that only management/administration must be be here - actually I and many were hoping for what started happening - offshore management. In fact you do not need anything here: all design, manufacturing, administration/management and ownership can be elswhere... and this is what started happening some time ago so, some fools need to start seeing this and oppose this trend before it is too late and have more idiots rioting not understanding basics.
    tallest skil
  • Reply 58 of 68
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 589member
    Our children's education will sink even further down the ladder of in comparison to other wester nations.
    Be very, VERY, VERY careful now. Otherwise I’ll have to respond to this with facts that will hurt your feelings.
    https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/best-education

    http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/15/u-s-students-internationally-math-science/



    looks like there is plenty of room for improvement.


    You don't really expect people to believe these rankings.

    They have Israel lower than the US.   Oh please.

    Like every other science Nobel prize winner is Jewish .

    Fake news.
  • Reply 59 of 68
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 41,355member
    k2kw said:
    You don't really expect people to believe these rankings.
    They’re legit; your argument’s hardly valid.
    singularity
  • Reply 60 of 68
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 4,518member
    k2kw said:
    Our children's education will sink even further down the ladder of in comparison to other wester nations.
    Be very, VERY, VERY careful now. Otherwise I’ll have to respond to this with facts that will hurt your feelings.
    https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/best-education

    http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/15/u-s-students-internationally-math-science/



    looks like there is plenty of room for improvement.


    You don't really expect people to believe these rankings.

    They have Israel lower than the US.   Oh please.

    Like every other science Nobel prize winner is Jewish .

    Fake news.
    These are independent tests across the world on the abilities of 15 year olds. 
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