Retina MacBook Pro minus Touch Bar, iPad Pro Cintiq capability rumored in development

Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited April 6
New claims about future Mac hardware have emerged after Tuesday's revelations from Apple's Phil Schiller and Craig Federighi, with the latest rumors suggesting that future high-end Retina MacBook Pros may not include a Touch Bar, and the iPad Pro could be used directly as a tablet input device for a connected Mac.




According to a report from OS News, and reinforced by notable developer Marco Arment, the new Mac Pro tentatively slated for a 2018 release only started development a few weeks ago. Apple was allegedly taken aback by poor "professional" response to the 2016 Retina MacBook Pro with Touch Bar, and amped up attention to the segment.

As a result of feedback garnered in the wake of the release, reportedly, Apple's updates to the 15-inch MacBook Pro may not include a Touch Bar. Additional synergistic features between macOS and iOS are also rumored to be in the works, such as "hooking an iPad Pro up to a Mac to use it as a Cintiq-like device" according to OS News.

Apple's examination of the "Cintiq-like" features mirrors that available in apps on the App Store, such as a annual subscription to Duet Display, or Astropad Studio.

In an uncharacteristic reveal of Apple's future moves, on Tuesday Senior Vice Presidents Phil Schiller and Craig Federighi spilled the beans on a new Mac Pro in development for 2018, the evolution of the iMac, and the continuation of the Mac mini.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 79
    rogifan_newrogifan_new Posts: 1,582member
    Apple's going to ditch the touchbar when it hasn't even been on the market for a year? Yeah no. The things pros complained about with the new MBP was RAM and ports, neither of which have anything to do with the touchbar. My guess is we're going to hear all sorts of bogus rumors from people allegedly in the know. Btw, Marco Arment doesn't have any inside information he just guessed that Apple's decision on the Mac Pro was recent (hence why no date on when we'll see a new one).

    I think the only thing truly legit with these rumors is Apple got an earful from some "pro" consumers and they have to course correct. Alex Lindsey, who is on Macbreak Weekly said he'd prefer it if Apple got out of the Mac hardware business and let someone else do it. I think that's nuts. 
    andrewj5790StrangeDaysTuuborDaekwanmacplusplusrandominternetpersonRayz2016
  • Reply 2 of 79
    emoelleremoeller Posts: 273member
    I agree, Apple would be foolish to ditch the touchbar.  I didn't buy one, only because I have a 2013 MBP that fits my needs, but I've tested one at the store for over an hour with multiple programs I use and I'm very impressed and will purchase one when the time comes.  As for using an iPad in conjunction with a MPB I'm doing that now the my Air2 and Duet.  It works perfectly (and is free except on the iPad Pro units) and they have even added a touch bar iPad when I use it as the second screen.   Duet works really well because it is hard wired (via USB) to the MBP, eliminating lags some of the other emulators have.  Not sure how Apple could improve on what Duet does now?
  • Reply 3 of 79
    Apple's going to ditch the touchbar when it hasn't even been on the market for a year? Yeah no. The things pros complained about with the new MBP was RAM and ports, neither of which have anything to do with the touchbar. My guess is we're going to hear all sorts of bogus rumors from people allegedly in the know. Btw, Marco Arment doesn't have any inside information he just guessed that Apple's decision on the Mac Pro was recent (hence why no date on when we'll see a new one).

    I think the only thing truly legit with these rumors is Apple got an earful from some "pro" consumers and they have to course correct. Alex Lindsey, who is on Macbreak Weekly said he'd prefer it if Apple got out of the Mac hardware business and let someone else do it. I think that's nuts. 
    I'd rather want to see a 17-inch with a Touch bar.  If this rumor is true, it shows that Apple are confused of what it was doing.
    SpamSandwichDaekwancalebbenbekke
  • Reply 4 of 79
    I suspect what they might do is include an entry level MacBook Pro that doesn't include touch bar (but still has a non-ULV processor, and can be upgraded to a full blown i7 with tons of RAM etc. I was almost certain I'd be buying a new MacBook Pro last fall, but I looked at the prices and realized that I'd be paying the cost of an Apple Watch in order to get what's essentially an Apple Watch built into my MacBook. And i said no. (I actually wrote to Tim about it, who knows if he read it.) I would actually love to see them move back to the design of the non-retina MacBook Pros, and include MORE. They could leave the optical drive out and instead create a space for modular upgrades (I know it's a very non-Apple thing to do, but it'd cater to the pro market very well.) If it's empty your laptop is lighter. If it's full you have additional battery, or an optical drive (for people like my sister who's a lawyer who HAS to deal with DVDs often on the go because that's how they get evidence given to them.) You could have other modules like a discrete GPU. There are probably also a number of other options that you might like to have built into your MacBook that I haven't thought of. Sadly I doubt this'll happen.
  • Reply 5 of 79
    19831983 Posts: 898member
    WTF! Oh right, something Apple has had in development for years and one of, if not the main selling point of the latest MBPr line is just going to be dropped right away on future hardware updates because some pros don't like it? What kind of nonsense is this! What the next step might be in the near future, is that the whole keyboard area gets replaced by a haptic feedback touchscreen of some sort, with the current Touch Bar as a stop gap. Other venders are known to be working on this.
    edited April 6 watto_cobra
  • Reply 6 of 79
    entropysentropys Posts: 644member
    Apple's going to ditch the touchbar when it hasn't even been on the market for a year? Yeah no. The things pros complained about with the new MBP was RAM and ports, neither of which have anything to do with the touchbar. My guess is we're going to hear all sorts of bogus rumors from people allegedly in the know. Btw, Marco Arment doesn't have any inside information he just guessed that Apple's decision on the Mac Pro was recent (hence why no date on when we'll see a new one).

    I think the only thing truly legit with these rumors is Apple got an earful from some "pro" consumers and they have to course correct. Alex Lindsey, who is on Macbreak Weekly said he'd prefer it if Apple got out of the Mac hardware business and let someone else do it. I think that's nuts. 
    I agree, the touchbar will be around for at least three years, and it wasn't the thing people complained that much about in comparison to ports and RAM.  But I would add price.  
    If Apple thought USBC only was the future, it should have used the strategy where it was the only ports on a consumer device first (like the original iMac did with USB), not a machine people have to make their living off. Perhaps a cheaper education oriented device. They could have called it a MacBook Air or something.
    RAM ditto. People should not be constrained by using a Macbook Pro to make their living off in comparison with Apple's competitors. 
    The only issue with the touchbar is it does not seem to be enough of a reason to buy an MBP over other solutions. Where is its killer use? Find that and it will be the bees' knees. And I guess, is the reason for the price rise.  Having a cheaper version without touchbar also slows its more widespread adoption, but to add the touchbar to the cheap one cuts Apple's margin.
    While using the iPad Pro as an input tablet to an iMac I guess is cool, I don't think too many people would use that solution, for reasons of cost (again) and let's be honest, it's a cludge, a "quick, we stuffed up, what can we do?" make up step to a final destination of more direct input. I also suspect it would come to regarded in the press as inferior to a more direct input method a la ms studio. Fair or not, that is what would happen.

    edited April 6
  • Reply 7 of 79
    wood1208wood1208 Posts: 999member
    I like it. Over and over I said Apple needs to have 13" and 15" low end Macbook Pro without touchbar but with decent(not high end) spec at some sweet price point. Such Macbook Pros are if you need laptop, just go buy without thinking like 32GB iPhone. Apple can not ignore student and casual users who overtime grows up into buying high end Macs/Macbooks. About ports, there is some cry why Apple removed ports but laptop industry is standardizing, consolidating ports for sometime. Most don't use ports on laptops other than USB. Apple could have gradually removed them like keep HDMI(workplace projector) but remove ethernet(because wireless everywhere), remove memory slot(because BT/Wifi transfer of file), remove thunderbolt (because moving to USB Type-C). And once in a while need to connect to peripherals with other ports, use dongle.
    edited April 6
  • Reply 8 of 79
    irelandireland Posts: 16,530member
    I recall recently commenting that it's obvious Apple is not getting out of the display business, as they were simply working on something. My feelings are similar re Wifi routers. Other innovators are trying to show Apple up here so Apple are rethinking Wifi routers and in the next year or three they'll release a new router product, probably as a three-pack.

    Now, regarding the Mac Pro and the Mac mini, as I have stated before. The most obvious inevitable evolution of both lines is to kill the Mac mini and produce a new Pro-type Mac mini in a different shape and make that the Mac Pro. Little computers you stack atop one another in whatever order you wish to create your own perfect Mac Pro. All these cubes would slot into one another and connect via a robust physical connection and a robust wired data connection within said physical connection. It would all work like magic. Want more hard drive space? Buy a RAID cube. What's more graphics power? Buy a graphics cube. What more ports? Buy an IO cube. Want more RAM? You get the idea. A starter set would give you all the pieces for a working computer and would look aesthetically pleasing when assembled. As new cubes are released yearly you simply add-on or swap out and sell your old cubes on the grey market.
    SpamSandwichStrangeDaysgetvoxoa
  • Reply 9 of 79
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 26,169member
    ireland said:
    I recall recently commenting that it's obvious Apple is not getting out of the display business, as they were simply working on something. My feelings are similar re Wifi routers. Other innovators are trying to show Apple up here so Apple are rethinking Wifi routers and in the next year or three they'll release a new router product, probably as a three-pack.

    Now, regarding the Mac Pro and the Mac mini, as I have stated before. The most obvious inevitable evolution of both lines is to kill the Mac mini and produce a new Pro-type Mac mini in a different shape and make that the Mac Pro. Little computers you stack atop one another in whatever order you wish to create your own perfect Mac Pro. All these cubes would slot into one another and connect via a robust physical connection and a robust wired data connection within said physical connection. It would all work like magic. Want more hard drive space? Buy a RAID cube. What's more graphics power? Buy a graphics cube. What more ports? Buy an IO cube. Want more RAM? You get the idea. A starter set would give you all the pieces for a working computer and would look aesthetically pleasing when assembled. As new cubes are released yearly you simply add-on or swap out and sell your old cubes on the grey market.
    I'm looking forward to a future of smart modular computing.
    ireland
  • Reply 10 of 79
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 1,358member
    I suspect what they might do is include an entry level MacBook Pro that doesn't include touch bar (but still has a non-ULV processor, and can be upgraded to a full blown i7 with tons of RAM etc. I was almost certain I'd be buying a new MacBook Pro last fall, but I looked at the prices and realized that I'd be paying the cost of an Apple Watch in order to get what's essentially an Apple Watch built into my MacBook. And i said no. (I actually wrote to Tim about it, who knows if he read it.) I would actually love to see them move back to the design of the non-retina MacBook Pros, and include MORE. They could leave the optical drive out and instead create a space for modular upgrades (I know it's a very non-Apple thing to do, but it'd cater to the pro market very well.) If it's empty your laptop is lighter. If it's full you have additional battery, or an optical drive (for people like my sister who's a lawyer who HAS to deal with DVDs often on the go because that's how they get evidence given to them.) You could have other modules like a discrete GPU. There are probably also a number of other options that you might like to have built into your MacBook that I haven't thought of. Sadly I doubt this'll happen.
    Because it's not a very good idea. Building a drive bay in order to let people plug in an optical drive incurs design compromises that are unnecessary for most people. People in that use case can simply plug a drive into a USBC port, which doesn't incur compromises on everybody else. 

    I'm a pro and I have no desire for what you've described. I want a thin, light, powerful machine. I have that. Battery life is good when on the go, and if stationary all day I can plug in. 
  • Reply 11 of 79
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 1,358member
    entropys said:
    Apple's going to ditch the touchbar when it hasn't even been on the market for a year? Yeah no. The things pros complained about with the new MBP was RAM and ports, neither of which have anything to do with the touchbar. My guess is we're going to hear all sorts of bogus rumors from people allegedly in the know. Btw, Marco Arment doesn't have any inside information he just guessed that Apple's decision on the Mac Pro was recent (hence why no date on when we'll see a new one).

    I think the only thing truly legit with these rumors is Apple got an earful from some "pro" consumers and they have to course correct. Alex Lindsey, who is on Macbreak Weekly said he'd prefer it if Apple got out of the Mac hardware business and let someone else do it. I think that's nuts. 
    I agree, the touchbar will be around for at least three years, and it wasn't the thing people complained that much about in comparison to ports and RAM.  But I would add price.  
    If Apple thought USBC only was the future, it should have used the strategy where it was the only ports on a consumer device first (like the original iMac did with USB), not a machine people have to make their living off. Perhaps a cheaper education oriented device. They could have called it a MacBook Air or something.
    RAM ditto. People should not be constrained by using a Macbook Pro to make their living off in comparison with Apple's competitors. 
    I'm confused by your position. Are you saying pros who make their living on the MBP won't plug in an adapter if they need it for some reason? 

    RAM "issue" is not a issue. Maybe somebody has an outlier use case, but for most mobile users this guy has it covered:

    https://www.zdziarski.com/blog/?p=6355

    ...if you need to run more than that at once, you need a desktop. 
    mrboba1
  • Reply 12 of 79
    blastdoorblastdoor Posts: 1,609member
    Apple was allegedly taken aback by poor "professional" response to the 2016 Retina MacBook Pro with Touch Bar, and amped up attention to the segment.

    Two thoughts here:

    1. I am genuinely thrilled that Apple seems to be listening to pro-users and understanding their importance

    2. As a corollary, I am also thrilled that the kinds of mindless fanboys who rabidly attack every criticism of Apple are not the kinds of people who appear to be calling the shots in Cupertino. You people know who you are. 
    edited April 6 dysamoriapscooter63
  • Reply 13 of 79
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 1,358member
    ireland said:
    I recall recently commenting that it's obvious Apple is not getting out of the display business, as they were simply working on something. My feelings are similar re Wifi routers. Other innovators are trying to show Apple up here so Apple are rethinking Wifi routers and in the next year or three they'll release a new router product, probably as a three-pack.

    Now, regarding the Mac Pro and the Mac mini, as I have stated before. The most obvious inevitable evolution of both lines is to kill the Mac mini and produce a new Pro-type Mac mini in a different shape and make that the Mac Pro. Little computers you stack atop one another in whatever order you wish to create your own perfect Mac Pro. All these cubes would slot into one another and connect via a robust physical connection and a robust wired data connection within said physical connection. It would all work like magic. Want more hard drive space? Buy a RAID cube. What's more graphics power? Buy a graphics cube. What more ports? Buy an IO cube. Want more RAM? You get the idea. A starter set would give you all the pieces for a working computer and would look aesthetically pleasing when assembled. As new cubes are released yearly you simply add-on or swap out and sell your old cubes on the grey market.
    Sounds cool but also sounds unlikely. I really believe Schiller was referring to separate CPU (case) and monitor. CPU likely having a slot or two, but that's it. 
    randominternetperson
  • Reply 14 of 79
    blastdoorblastdoor Posts: 1,609member
    Additional synergistic features between macOS and iOS are also rumored to be in the works, such as "hooking an iPad Pro up to a Mac to use it as a Cintiq-like device" according to OS News.

    I find this encouraging. 

    Apple's model of separate devices (instead of hybrid devices) makes a lot of sense from the "best tool for the job" perspective. But they need to work together very well. 



    polymnia
  • Reply 15 of 79
    appexappex Posts: 510member
    Apple should use an old physical architecture with a new set of guts for Mac Pro. It could be ready for WWDC 2017. Then design a brand new model for 2018, 2019 or year 3000.
    entropys
  • Reply 16 of 79
    kpomkpom Posts: 591member
    entropys said:

    If Apple thought USBC only was the future, it should have used the strategy where it was the only ports on a consumer device first (like the original iMac did with USB), not a machine people have to make their living off.
    You mean like the 2015 MacBook? 
    StrangeDaysrandominternetpersonEric_WVGGmrboba1
  • Reply 17 of 79
    DanielEranDanielEran Posts: 110editor
    Rumor with no data backing it up. On the other side, in the Q new MacBook Pros went on sale, Apple's Mac ASP (average selling price) jumped to $1,348, a year-over-year increase of $78 or 6.1%--the highest Macs have reached since the March quarter, 2013. Refurbs didn't push ASP up. Thom Holwerda is not a credible source, and Marco Arment observes anecdotes, not global data. All very hard to swallow. There was a severe blogger-based anti-Pro campaign complaining about no "32GB laptops," followed by a surge in Mac sales at higher ASPs (than when those 2015 MPBs were sold new!), and so as a result Apple is going to ditch TouchBar? Super Stupid. What will happen is that Intel will drop new chips this year, MPBs will get a speed bump and capacity to address more memory. Apple should also work on a Thunderbolt solution for GPUs, either in an external expansion chassis (supporting them, if not selling) or a GPU-backed TB3 display, like an iMac without the CPU, and a GPU you can upgrade.
    The_Martini_CatStrangeDaysEric_WVGGfastasleeppscooter63
  • Reply 18 of 79
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 29,087member
    entropys said:
    Apple's going to ditch the touchbar when it hasn't even been on the market for a year? Yeah no. The things pros complained about with the new MBP was RAM and ports, neither of which have anything to do with the touchbar. My guess is we're going to hear all sorts of bogus rumors from people allegedly in the know. Btw, Marco Arment doesn't have any inside information he just guessed that Apple's decision on the Mac Pro was recent (hence why no date on when we'll see a new one).

    I think the only thing truly legit with these rumors is Apple got an earful from some "pro" consumers and they have to course correct. Alex Lindsey, who is on Macbreak Weekly said he'd prefer it if Apple got out of the Mac hardware business and let someone else do it. I think that's nuts. 
    I agree, the touchbar will be around for at least three years, and it wasn't the thing people complained that much about in comparison to ports and RAM.  But I would add price.  
    If Apple thought USBC only was the future, it should have used the strategy where it was the only ports on a consumer device first (like the original iMac did with USB), not a machine people have to make their living off. Perhaps a cheaper education oriented device. They could have called it a MacBook Air or something.
    RAM ditto. People should not be constrained by using a Macbook Pro to make their living off in comparison with Apple's competitors. 
    I'm confused by your position. Are you saying pros who make their living on the MBP won't plug in an adapter if they need it for some reason? 

    RAM "issue" is not a issue. Maybe somebody has an outlier use case, but for most mobile users this guy has it covered:

    https://www.zdziarski.com/blog/?p=6355

    ...if you need to run more than that at once, you need a desktop. 
    The RAM question is an interesting one. In the past, for Photoshop, it was a major issue. Major! Even when I first bought my 2009 Mac Pro, it was an issue. I quickly went from 16GB, to 32GB and finally to 64GB.

    yes, it was indeed an issue. The way the software works, and the way most often, editing software works, if you have really big files, as I often do, and you're working on layers, and compositing other photo layers in, your file gets really big. I mean really big. PS likes to have three of those files. Ideally, they all reside in RAM. If they don't, you end up paging in and out - a lot.

    i found that even with just files that were 1GB in size, with 16GB of RAM, I was constantly paging, and slowing things down. It got a lot better with 32GB. But as we work, several apps are open at once, all with big files. Usually I've got PS, Illustrator and InDesign all open at once, along with other software needed. Oops! 32GB feels constrained. When opening Activity Monitor, and looking at RAM use, I can see that it's constrained. Software does odd things with RAM. Only when finally moving to 64GB did the problems stop. 

    Likely I'm an edge case, but I know a lot of others who are also edge cases. I'd like to see 32GB available for all Macs, at least. But, PCI SSD speeds have made some of that better. Paging in and out isn't nearly as bad. But it could be better.
    edited April 6 polymniabrucemc
  • Reply 19 of 79
    kkerstkkerst Posts: 330member
    I honestly think a vertical touch bar would have been more effective. I'm sure Apple has troves of people doing ergonomic research. However, a vertical touch bar could have been included near the trackpad. With it horizontal now, a user must reach over the keyboard. With it vertical, albeit smaller, you could have just used your finger and not reach across anything. I guess the problem with this is that it would favor left vs right handedness. Just a thought.
  • Reply 20 of 79
    Rumor with no data backing it up. On the other side, in the Q new MacBook Pros went on sale, Apple's Mac ASP (average selling price) jumped to $1,348, a year-over-year increase of $78 or 6.1%--the highest Macs have reached since the March quarter, 2013. Refurbs didn't push ASP up. Thom Holwerda is not a credible source, and Marco Arment observes anecdotes, not global data. All very hard to swallow. There was a severe blogger-based anti-Pro campaign complaining about no "32GB laptops," followed by a surge in Mac sales at higher ASPs (than when those 2015 MPBs were sold new!), and so as a result Apple is going to ditch TouchBar? Super Stupid. What will happen is that Intel will drop new chips this year, MPBs will get a speed bump and capacity to address more memory. Apple should also work on a Thunderbolt solution for GPUs, either in an external expansion chassis (supporting them, if not selling) or a GPU-backed TB3 display, like an iMac without the CPU, and a GPU you can upgrade.
    I don't disagree.
    brucemc
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