Microsoft Longhorn!
I am sorry, but I was on the newtek Lightwave 3D forum (www.newtek.com) and there's constant debate between the Wintel PC and Mac discussion boards. I posted a link to "Paul Thurrott's Windows SuperSite!" which details the new Microsoft Windows OS, "Windows Longhorn"!
I hadn't read it all, but I read some more this afternoon, because I remember someone saying it was based on UNIX. The part that got to me:
"Q: But Mac OS X already has a lot of these features. What's the big deal?
A: Apple has implemented some basic desktop composition features in Mac OS X "Panther," due this fall, and they appear to be quite impressive. But the basic problem with Mac OS X isn't going away: It's a classic desktop operating system that doesn't offer anything in the way of usability advancements over previous desktop operating systems. Today, Windows XP and its task-based interface are far superior to anything in Mac OS X."
Can anyone tell me what's supposedly so good about this new Windows OS, and why it's supposedly superior to OS X, 'cause I'm really at a loss.
Any thoughts ladies and gents?
Jimzip
P.S, oh, and my I also draw your attention to this screenshot of 'Longhorn':
http://www.winsupersite.com/images/showcase/aero-05.png
Gee. I wonder where the designer got the 'Album' and 'Genre' icon ideas...
I hadn't read it all, but I read some more this afternoon, because I remember someone saying it was based on UNIX. The part that got to me:
"Q: But Mac OS X already has a lot of these features. What's the big deal?
A: Apple has implemented some basic desktop composition features in Mac OS X "Panther," due this fall, and they appear to be quite impressive. But the basic problem with Mac OS X isn't going away: It's a classic desktop operating system that doesn't offer anything in the way of usability advancements over previous desktop operating systems. Today, Windows XP and its task-based interface are far superior to anything in Mac OS X."
Can anyone tell me what's supposedly so good about this new Windows OS, and why it's supposedly superior to OS X, 'cause I'm really at a loss.
Any thoughts ladies and gents?
Jimzip
P.S, oh, and my I also draw your attention to this screenshot of 'Longhorn':
http://www.winsupersite.com/images/showcase/aero-05.png
Gee. I wonder where the designer got the 'Album' and 'Genre' icon ideas...
Comments
Kinda funny the direction that Apple and MS have gone icon wise. Apple chose to go with more life like looking icons while MS has gone with a more cartoonish look. Not saying anything is better then the other just pointing it out.
A: Apple has implemented some basic desktop composition features in Mac OS X "Panther," due this fall,
They've been there since 10.0, and I don't know if they're basic.
Here's the kind of guy I was talking about over at Newtek, only this guy seems to be the slightly arrogant type that seems to demote Mac for no reason. (Seriously, is there much competition sales wise between Intel and Apple? Is Intel under that much of a threat? I highly doubt it, and I don't see why he has to go to the trouble of putting OS X down to glorify an operating system that's three years away..)
Sigh, back to LW Modeler..
Jimzip
Originally posted by Jimzip
Oh boy.. Get me this guy's e-mail address. Let's write him a small note telling him to come out from under his rock.
*sigh* And come off sounding like a raving Mac fanboy/zealot?
Please, let's not. You will be no better than the occasional Windows troll that pops into this forum (ala DVLN, SS Manic Devlin).
I'm sure this guy has gotten plenty of e-mails and hate-mails from Mac users in the past. His site has been around for a very long time and is welll respected in the Windows community. What he does is no different from the Mac sites that have posted "preview" information about Puma/Jaguar/Panther and have made the occasional superficial comparison to Windows. This is just coming from someone on the other side of the fence.
He's just doing what he likes doing in the end.
P.S, I'll get rid of that line from my original post, because me and hyped up don't go well when posting.
Jimzip
Originally posted by Brad
*sigh* And come off sounding like a raving Mac fanboy/zealot?
Please, let's not. You will be no better than the occasional Windows troll that pops into this forum (ala DVLN, SS Manic Devlin).
For once, I truly agree with you, Brad. This macos vs. windows thing is so boring & worn out. Blinded by principle. We should all just get along. I can still get my blood bubbling over the longhorn vs. panther little sketch, the one with the pictures, Jobs pulled at the WWDC. Hard to support something that inane. What are we, 8 years old?
Originally posted by JLL
A: Apple has implemented some basic desktop composition features in Mac OS X "Panther," due this fall,
They've been there since 10.0, and I don't know if they're basic.
Excuse me for a dumb question: what exactly is desktop composition? Is it Quartz in general or Quartz Compositor? Or is it Finder which composes the Desktop (draws a wallpaper with icons)? WTF? One just can't afford to be such an idiot as to critisize things he doesn't know even the name of.
See my sig.
Originally posted by costique
Excuse me for a dumb question: what exactly is desktop composition? Is it Quartz in general or Quartz Compositor? Or is it Finder which composes the Desktop (draws a wallpaper with icons)? WTF? One just can't afford to be such an idiot as to critisize things he doesn't know even the name of.
See my sig.
I think thats the little menu item that allows you to tile your desktop icons.
(Believe me, my posts usually attempt to stop flamewars and platform battles when they come up).
This was actually just a serious question on what people's thoughts were about the 'Longhorn' OS. I wanted to know what makes Paul think it's 'superior' to OS X. If it is, then why, and what is going to make the OS better that it's predecessors? Is it actually built on Unix?
I do not believe there is anything wrong with the current release of OS X (as in 10.2.6), and I don't think there's much point in a 'well respected' site like Thurrott's putting down a good OS.
(Also, yes, I agree it's superficial to do things like that, and the Mac community on the whole seems to be made up of generally good people that don't attack the PC side of things unless there's someone that's really yanking the chain. It doesn't happen often thankfully.)
Anyway, I'm going to get some sleep. I'm getting tired still waiting for those new PowerBooks.. 8)
Jimzip
(Oh, and I've toned down my original thread, because after reading it again, yeah I sound like a real fan-boy..
Or this.
Or this.
Or this.
If XP's task based interface is so good, how come I keep using the command line to get things done?
Yes, XP's UI is better than Win 2k. IMHO that is because Win2k was actually a step backward from NT 4.
Longhorn is a LONG way away. 2005 anyone? MS goes for monolithic massive updates with tons of functionality. The drawback is that the larger a software project is, the more likely it is to be late, and the more likely it is to be held up. Apple by contrast simply releases a new version of the OS every year, so if a feature is horribly behind schedule, it just slips a release date. Apple's strategy is much better (this is coming from a programmer, so I do have a clue). I think that OS X will be at 10.5 or so by the time Longhorn comes out.
The 3D interfaces are nice, but MS has consistently delivered garbage OS GUIs. Even XP Pro which is hands down their best OS has a junk GUI. I would pay some real money to be able to change the color of my start button. In the end, XP is going to cater to the office worker bean counters and so you know that whatever cool thing they do will be watered down so that it doesn't scare joe computer user. MS has the burden of having to keep its 90% marketshare, and it actually is a burden because they must program for the least common denominator.
I'll write more as time permits. (work is busy- in theory we go alpha on Monday)
Originally posted by murbot
Yes, you do not want to be going in there and looking like this.
Or this.
Or this.
Or this.
Murbot, you are a disgrace to desperation.
By locking my posts, you simply telling me that I am right.
Check out movies of longhorn Gui here.
Originally posted by der Kopf
For once, I truly agree with you, Brad. This macos vs. windows thing is so boring & worn out. Blinded by principle. We should all just get along. I can still get my blood bubbling over the longhorn vs. panther little sketch, the one with the pictures, Jobs pulled at the WWDC. Hard to support something that inane. What are we, 8 years old?
On the contrary, I hope that a juvenile "Whatever you can do I can do better" argument will spur development at both Apple and MS. It is called competition and it works wonders for innovation. It is the same war, just different battles. Who does better user switching in the OS? Right now, Apple (once Jaguar ships). Hopefully MS comes back with something equally good.
Back in my undergrad days, our AI professor broke the class into teams and then gave us all the same project. At my insistence, he agreed to award extra credit points on labs to the team that could make the software go fastest. Needless to say, lots of competition ensued, some challenging words were spoken, and in the end, my team consistently won (because my roommate and I took our projects a little bit too seriously and decided to just crush the competition on general principle). As a result of all the heated emotion and competition, the software that came out of the class was some of the best in years.
I wish that MS would remember how to innovate for web browsers. Maybe if SJ started complaining about how explorer sucked, BG would get a clue and add tabs and popup ad blocking to the windows version of explorer. Maybe if BG pointed out how slow the OS X journaling file system was, it would get a speed boost.
The other side improving is a good thing. Without it the Mac might not be as forward thinking as it is. Companies tend to rest on their laurels when there's nothing to compare it to.
I pray that neither side dies because without it there would be no competition and things would tend to stay the same for a lot longer than they do nowadays.
as far as longhorn's "gui," if they incorporate nonsense like that "flippy paper" effect every time you move a friggin' window (the calculator window with the spinning movies in front), i'll laugh my ass off. sure, the "genie effect" was pure "we did it because we could" eye-candy from apple, but it was only incurred when you minimized the window, and actually made a little bit of sense, since you saw where the window was going into the dock. admittedly, those on slower machines turned it off pretty quickly to save on overhead, but at least it served some sort of purpose. unlike that little window-move effect. what earthly purpose does that serve?
The future of operating systems is application-centric. In real life, you use real tools to get jobs done, and that is how computers should behave. If XP is so elegant in its task-based workflow, then why can't I tell where applications end and the OS begins? It's just one big glob. It's as if my tools are stapled to my hand.
Tell me what you think is more intuitive: this or this?
Originally posted by longhorn2004
Murbot, you are a disgrace to desperation.
By locking my posts, you simply telling me that I am right.
Check out movies of longhorn Gui here.
Er, no...
They lock your posts because we've all heard it all before. Many times. Until we're word perfect on our responses to every argument, but are dog tired of giving them.
Amorya
Win2K was their best effort in my opinion. It looked plain enough, and didn't crash too much. I mean, it crashed more than OS X 10.0, but not more than once or twice a day probably. But it was somewhat consistent. XP is just terrible, and I'm not even talking about the DRM.