Power Mac G4 or G5
Hi, I'm trying to decide what kind of Power Mac to buy. I'm trying to decide between the dual 1.25ghz G4 or the 1.6ghz G5. I used to have an iBook (dual usb) but I haven't used a Power Mac in a long time. I'm going to be doing the usual computer things: internet, itunes, idvd, maybe some soundtrack recording. I'm just not sure which Power Mac is better. There are pros and cons to both, so it just comes down to wether the G5 is all that much faster or if the G4 is fine. Thanks so much for any help!
Comments
So the G4 is faster and has a more convenient RAM setup (no need to install RAM in pairs). It also has more internal expansion - you can put up to four internal hard drives and two optical drives in it without any modification. The G5 can only have one optical drive and two hard drives. Also, the 1.6 GHz G5 is slightly crippled compared to the higher end ones - it has regular PCI instead of PCI-X, and it only has four RAM slots (which makes things hard when you have to install RAM in pairs).
- Xidius
Originally posted by Luca
Having dual processors helps a ton
Yeah, it might even make the G4 feel almost as fast as the 1.6G5 when using a DP supported application.
But otherwise, no. There are few applications, games, etc which make use of multiple processors, in which case you are set at a stern duel:
1.25 Ghz older processor with a 167mhz bus, 2gb ram max, etc etc.
vs
1.6 Ghz New processor with an 800mhz bus, up to 4gb ram, 8x agp, etc.
I still say you should go for the Dual 1.8Ghz, however.
- Xidius
Don't bother with the 1.6 GHz. And don't pay too much attention to all the people creaming themselves over the G5. As awesome as the G5 is, it's not nearly as good as some people make it out to be. It's just another Mac.
As far as having dual processors... it does help. Even if you run an application that doesn't take full advantage of both processors, it will still distribute the load among both processors. So, if you run a non-MP aware application (such as Bryce) on a dual G4 and a single G5, the G5 will win. However, if you were also doing other things in the background (encoding with iTunes, perhaps running a distributed.net client), I bet the dual would win hands down, because even though the primary task isn't optimized for dual processors, you're still seeing the benefit. Bryce will run on one processor and the other things will run on the other one.
Also, the G4 has 2 MB of L3 cache per processor. The G5 has no L3 cache at all. Although it's not a huge difference, it does help reconcile the slow bus speed on the G4.
Originally posted by Luca
Also, the G4 has 2 MB of L3 cache per processor. The G5 has no L3 cache at all. Although it's not a huge difference, it does help reconcile the slow bus speed on the G4.
Yes, but the G5 has twice as much L2 cache, which is what's really important. L3 cache was only in the G4 for bragging rights. It has been proven to make little or no difference. One of the reasons Apple has since removed it from all G4 laptops.
Just to clarify: 2 processors at most will improve work speed 20%.
Okay, so while using a dual processor-aware application (once again, these are few and far apart) your 1.25 Ghz G4 will work up to the speed of a 1.5Ghz G4. Fact still remains, that cannot hold it's own to a 1.6Ghz G5.
What biased do you have against the 1.6G5, Luca? Just don't want to admit justification for it's cost and worth? Or is it something more personal than that?
- Xidius
Go with the G4.
(And when you decide to buy another computer, next time you can ask in General Discussion, where purchasing advice belongs.
Yes, but the G5 has twice as much L2 cache, which is what's really important. L3 cache was only in the G4 for bragging rights. It has been proven to make little or no difference. One of the reasons Apple has since removed it from all G4 laptops.
L2 cache is very important, and yes the G5 has twice as much. No, it's not just there for bragging rights - it actually DOES improve performance. It helps make up for the slow bus speed. L3 cache is expensive, they wouldn't just throw it on the processor for shits and giggles. Intel, on the other hand, DOES just throw it on the processor (and charge hundreds upon hundreds of dollars for it). And the reason Apple has removed it from their laptops is because the new laptops use the 7447, which doesn't support L3 cache. That's why they're at 1.5 GHz in a little thin laptop - Apple made some sacrifices to do that.
Just to clarify: 2 processors at most will improve work speed 20%.
More like 50%. It's a good rule of thumb.
Okay, so while using a dual processor-aware application (once again, these are few and far apart) your 1.25 Ghz G4 will work up to the speed of a 1.5Ghz G4. Fact still remains, that cannot hold it's own to a 1.6Ghz G5.
Wrong again. What applicatiosn are dual processor aware? Hmm, let me just run down the dock here... Finder, Safari, iChat, Mail, iTunes, QuickTime, iMovie, iDVD... the list goes on. Yeah, I'm sure you won't really see a benefit since I suppose all the "cool" people use Internet Explorer, AOL Instant Messenger, Eudora, SoundJam MP in Classic Mode, Windows Media Player... oh wait.
What biased do you have against the 1.6G5, Luca? Just don't want to admit justification for it's cost and worth? Or is it something more personal than that?
It's a fine machine. But it costs too much. Face it, it's a single processor that is only marginally faster than a fast G4 processor. It only has four RAM slots and no PCI-X (which are two of the big advantages to having a G5). It stinks of the Yikes! thing way back in 1999. Yikes! machines were marginally cheaper when they came out, but nowadays they are worth nearly nothing compared to the AGP equipped Sawtooth. Amazing how one little slot could change their value so much. What happens three years from now when you want to add a high-bandwidth PCI-X card to your "future proof" G5? Sorry, no can do. You're stuck with PCI just like the G4.
Critical specs
1. Performance: Dual G4 is generally higher performing than 1.6 G5. But the two are so close, the you'll notice the difference in only certain apps.
2. Price: They are both $1599 (with ComboDrive)
3. The G5 has FW800, USB2, and Airport Extreme capability. The current G4 only has slower versions of each (Unless you can find a leftover G4 FW800).
Specs that matter to some
1. G5 is quieter
2. G4 will actually fit on your desk without taking up all the desk space.
3. G4 has more drive bays.
4. G4 runs VPC
5. G4 boots OS 9
You can always add FW800, USB2, and Airport Extreme to your G4 in the form of PCI cards. But I heard that you will sacrifice deep sleep, which is fairly important to me.
Both PowerMacs come with an ADC port and a DVI port. They MAY come with a DVI-VGA adapter as well, but I'm not sure. Anyway, you should have no problems connecting your display to the DVI port (quality is better than using VGA). If you want to add another display, ADC can be cheaply converted to DVI or VGA, so you have plenty of options.
Originally posted by mcstewart37
I currently have an LCD monitor with analog and DVI input, so I'm wondering which adapter I need to get. I'm thinking I'll ge the DVI to VGA adapter
Both the G4 and G5 towers come with an ADC-DVI converter for free. You'd be much better off with that than getting an analog converter.
Originally posted by Brad
Both the G4 and G5 towers come with an ADC-DVI converter for free. You'd be much better off with that than getting an analog converter.
Just a minor correction: The Powermacs do not come with ADC-DVI converters. You have to buy that separately. However, the installed graphics cards have both ADC and DVI built-in. A DVI to VGA adaptor is included if needed.
Basically, it doesn't change the fact that you are capable to connect through either of those out of the box but just wanted to set things straight.
http://www.apple.com/hardware/powermacg4/specs.html
http://www.apple.com/powermac/specs.html
BTW, what are you going to plug into the front ports? A videocamera? USB-powered devices? If so, you may want to get the G5. (or you can experiment with something like the Sweet Multiport from GeeThree, http://www.geethree.com/, but you will sacrifice a PCI slot, CD-Drive slot, and possibly deep sleep to make it happen)
If you simply need to connect a digital camera, the spare USB port on the keyboard usually does the job.
Originally posted by BeigeUser
Just a minor correction: The Powermacs do not come with ADC-DVI converters. You have to buy that separately. However, the installed graphics cards have both ADC and DVI built-in. A DVI to VGA adaptor is included if needed.
Gah! Curse my exam week induced dyslexia. It was right there in black and white and I just didn't read it right:
ADC and DVI connectors... and include a DVI to VGA adapter cable.
Okay, so, they come with a VGA adapter and include both DVI and ADC ports.
But what really clinched it for me was that it was a DP machine. As Luca pointed out, even if your applications are not DP-aware, the system most certainly is. Even though I could have gone with the 1.6 or even the 1.8 G5, I have to say that the Dual G4 will give you the best bang for the buck.
If you have the cash, go with the Dual-1.8...but until Apple releases a Dual-1.6 (and I don't think they ever will, given what happened with the Dual-867 MDD G4's), I'd say that you should go for the Dual-1.25 G4.