I guess the iBook800 can't really hang afterall...
I'd noticed a disturbing trend in here of people saying that the iBook 800 is very close to the PB12 and that the size weight of the 12 aren't worth the premium. But what about performance?
<a href="http://www.macworld.com/2003/04/reviews/12inchpowerbook/"; target="_blank">Take a look at this here review.</a>
The babybook hangs right in there with the L3 equipped 867 Ti in just about every task. Looking a photoshop, iTunes and iMovie, the babybook is fully 3X, 2.5X and 2X faster than the iBook, they didn't test it but I can only assume a similar advantage in iPhoto.
Those are some significant differences there. Based on those tests I'd say it's even a better deal than the Ti867, often staying within 5-10% of the Ti's numbers. Not bad at all for a subnote, eh?
Not to knock the iBook, I think it's the second best deal in the Mac line-up right now, but clearly the performance on certain core apps (mostly photoshop) is dramatically better on the PB12.
I can't wait to load it up with 640MB and see how it does.
[ 02-17-2003: Message edited by: Matsu ]</p>
<a href="http://www.macworld.com/2003/04/reviews/12inchpowerbook/"; target="_blank">Take a look at this here review.</a>
The babybook hangs right in there with the L3 equipped 867 Ti in just about every task. Looking a photoshop, iTunes and iMovie, the babybook is fully 3X, 2.5X and 2X faster than the iBook, they didn't test it but I can only assume a similar advantage in iPhoto.
Those are some significant differences there. Based on those tests I'd say it's even a better deal than the Ti867, often staying within 5-10% of the Ti's numbers. Not bad at all for a subnote, eh?
Not to knock the iBook, I think it's the second best deal in the Mac line-up right now, but clearly the performance on certain core apps (mostly photoshop) is dramatically better on the PB12.
I can't wait to load it up with 640MB and see how it does.
[ 02-17-2003: Message edited by: Matsu ]</p>
Comments
Then again, look at those 1 GHz TiBook scores. I'm glad I have one of those.
[quote]
originally posted by Fran411:
<strong>
Then again, look at those 1 GHz TiBook scores. I'm glad I have one of those.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Especially at the price for which you got it, though you might say you have a lot of sweat equity built into that Ti.
[ 02-17-2003: Message edited by: Matsu ]</p>
[ 02-17-2003: Message edited by: PooPooDoctor ]</p>
Matsu, why do you insist on calling the 12" PB a subnote? Apple does not make a subnote. They make small notebooks. There is a big difference. In another thread, people were comparing the values of Apple's notebook lines to the subnote offerings of other companies. It is not the same thing but I suppose it makes some people feel better about Apple products if they compare favorably to something. I am sure the 12 PB is a fine product. But don't make the mistake of miscategorizing it.
It's the rational subnote. Thinkaboutitferasec...
No subnote you can name will fit in a case that won't also take a PB12 or even iBook12. Unless they make a subnote that fits in your pocket, there's no point making all the savrifices that subnotes entail just to get down to 3lbs. Poor battery life, small screens, total crap keyboards, external drives.
It's as sub as a real computer can get right now. It's Apple's subnote.
[ 02-17-2003: Message edited by: Matsu ]</p>
<strong><a href="http://www.intel.com/technology/easeofuse/innovpc/mobile_sub.htm"; target="_blank">http://www.intel.com/technology/easeofuse/innovpc/mobile_sub.htm</a>;
Matsu, why do you insist on calling the 12" PB a subnote? Apple does not make a subnote. They make small notebooks. There is a big difference. In another thread, people were comparing the values of Apple's notebook lines to the subnote offerings of other companies. It is not the same thing but I suppose it makes some people feel better about Apple products if they compare favorably to something. I am sure the 12 PB is a fine product. But don't make the mistake of miscategorizing it.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Dude, you are quickly becoming my least favorite poster here. (Matsu had that honor for a while
As Matsu said, the mini is the smallest workable notebook available. Add to that the price and the coolness factor and there just is no competition out there. Plus, it's solid. The keyboard is the best I've used in a long long time. It doesn't feel cheap in any way whatsoever. There were no punches pulled when it came to this computer. I love it.
<strong>
(Matsu had that honor for a while
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I'm touched, how did I lose it? What did I do wrong? <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
<strong>Well, Duh! <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> I'm not being insultive there Matsu, just teasing ya a bit. Well, G3 vs G4... a no brainer. My 3 year old 350 MHz G4 tower blows away both my iBook 500 MHz G3 and my brother's 600 MHz G3 iMac... Not just a little, I mean noticeably. I'll never ever get another G3. <img src="graemlins/cancer.gif" border="0" alt="[cancer]" /> Kill the G3's already Apple!
[ 02-17-2003: Message edited by: PooPooDoctor ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
Ha ha! You have a G4 350 <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
Actually, a G3 500 should beat it unless it's an AltVec app.
To me, the PB is just that much more in terms of style and functionality. But it costs more. If it weren't for the very healthy edu discount I'm getting I'd have looked harder at the iBook, but I don't think I would have chosen it, ultimately. I plan to do some photoshopping and illustrator work, and probably will make heavy use out of iPhoto and certainly iTunes, I can't wait to dig into my 400 strong CD collection. Altivec kills in these tasks, anywhere from 2-3X faster.
Also, I need VPC for a couple of tasks (custom Access database for work and a few other little -- gov't -- library related apps). I won't get blazing speed from a G4, but the experience would be even worse on a G3.
<strong>
Ha ha! You have a G4 350 <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
Actually, a G3 500 should beat it unless it's an AltVec app.</strong><hr></blockquote>
<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> Actually it doesn't. <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
Could it be that a 3 year old G4 350 MHz tower still beats the pants off of a G3 600 MHz i(crap)Mac?!
No, really all humor aside, I was surprised myself. :eek: I thought for sure his iMac would be at least a bit faster than my tower, actually, it's because of this that I've come to dislike iMacs, even my 500 iBook for that matter.
Hey, back up a bit, you making fun of my 350 tower?!
Apple really needs to get rid of the G3 ASAP. Altivec is the one saving grace of this tumultuous PPC experiment. The sooner every single bit of software is recoded to take advantage of it as much as possible the better the mac will be. With iBooks being a huge seller, CRT iMacs still selling and a huge installed base of G3 macs, it's gonna be a while. Lets hope the PPC 970 gets here soon, and a .13u G4 or GOBI, or whatever, so that Apple can finally get ALL devs to use this tech as much as possible.
After that, SMALLER process parts so that we start to see multi CPU configs in all sorts of unexpected areas. The towers NEED to be all DP right now, but by no means should they remain the only DP machines in the long run. MP is the future.
If you're using it as your main computer, do you like the size or do you feel that it would be better to connect to a larger display when possible?
Just wondering......
<strong>How do you guys that have the 12" screens feel about the size of the display, either on the iBook or the Powerbook?
If you're using it as your main computer, do you like the size or do you feel that it would be better to connect to a larger display when possible?
Just wondering......
Works great for me (12" iBook). I only connect an external monitor if I work with several FileMaker-documents that I need to switch between very often.
I can't wait for the PBG4 12" I hear the screen is even better/brighter than the iBook's. However why would Apple use a different screen? Perhaps it just has a better backlight?
Mac Voyer I appreciate you sticking up for us telemarketers (survey taker! yes that was what I was) but you have to pick your battles. It's just semantics, I haven't seen ANY notebook as small as the PBG4 12" that you can actually USE. It IS a subnotebook.
<strong> It's just semantics, I haven't seen ANY notebook as small as the PBG4 12" that you can actually USE. It IS a subnotebook.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I'll take a chance and disagree. Before I got this 12" PowerBook, I owned a Toshiba Libretto, probably about the subbest of the subnotebooks. (It's roughly the size of a paperback book or VHS tape.)
I argue that my Libretto is 100% usable, but it makes significant sacrifices to achieve its small form factor. It's slow, has little memory, tiny keys, no ports (but two CardBus slots -- do you hear me, Apple?), a tiny 7-inch widescreen display, no optical drive ... but it's a subnotebook in every sense of the word. I took it everywhere with me for a year and a half without any complaints.
My PowerBook kicks the pants off of the Libretto in every way, even though it's larger. I believe that a subnotebook, by definition, sacrifices functionality for portability, but I don't see any such compromises on my machine. Let me give you another first-hand owner report, Matsu, to tide you over.
It's very fast (despite compaints about the lack of L3 cache). I haven't owned a Mac for a long time because of the expense, so my current workstation is a dual 1.2 GHz Athlon -- a fast machine for my graphics work. Coming from that, my PowerBook has completely taken over as my day-to-day machine. I've only turned on the PC to copy files, print to my parallel-port printer, and do some heavy lifting for work. The PowerBook isn't as fast with Photoshop or LightWave as I'd hoped, but I never expected it to completely replace my workstation for that.
Heat is almost a non-issue for me. Like I said, I take the PowerBook with my everywhere and use it both at home and at work without any problems. It does get warm, but the only time it got uncomfortably hot is when I was watching a DVD before I slept last night. It was sitting on top of my comforter, which probably compounded the heat from the machine.
The fan comes on every once in a while, usually if I try to push the machine a little hard. I remember it spinning up while I tried to render some video, or burn a DVD-R, but during normal use, it never comes on. It is a bit noisy, but I don't notice it with my headphones on.
Battery life is good, but it could be better. With the processor set for "reduced" performance (which also seems to produce less heat), I get about 3.5 hours on a charge, less if I listen to music the whole time. That's plenty of time, as I'm not roaming around for more than a couple hours at a time. I usually have my brightness set around 50-75% on the road.
Fit an finish are excellent, but leave room for improvement in the future. A few seams don't quite line up perfectly (we're talking less than a millimeter), and the trackpad button sticks occasionally if I push hard on the far left side. Typically, though, I use a mouse.
I don't know what else to say, so I'll just toss in a few more random thoughts. Audio fidelity is quite good [for a laptop]; I don't hear any significant noise through my studio monitors. The built-in speakers are tolerable, but I never liked laptop speakers anyway. The keyboard is fine, butt I don't like the fn-key in the lower left (although I'm not having as many problems with my muscle-memory as I thought I would). The SuperDrive works as advertised, burning 2 GB of data in about half an hour. The Nvidia GPU is certainly fast enough, driving an external 19" CRT without a twitch. I haven't encountered any problems with having "only" 640 MB RAM, although I would have liked to have 1 GB to match my desktop.
Phew. I don't have time to write any more, I've gotta run. Good luck getting your PowerBook -- it is by no means a subnotebook!
It has strayed alittle bit off topic . . .