New Mac Pro User

geonjay

Hello. First I ask for leniency before flaming. I haven't used a Mac full time since the mid 90's...I use mostly Linux and Solaris now. My company is providing a nice allowance for me to get a Mac Pro and I'm going to take advantage of it. I plan on getting the generic $2499 config (2.66, 1Gb, 250GB, etc) and I was going to add more RAM and get the ATI card. The mac guys I work with advised me to wait until after the WWDC, they doubted any major changes would be announced for the Pro, but advised me to wait just the same. So I shall. I still have questions about the hardware though.



1) Sound. I'm used to the linux/pc world of PCI sound cards that do copper digital out, or atleast rear and front stereo outputs. I see that the Pro has a digital out. Does this have to go to an external decoder? My current 5.1 speakers have a "built in" decoder but they don't do optical in. Do you guys have a recommended setup? Am I being too picky? The only time I used surround sound is when I'm watching TV or a DVD. What about USB sound cards? They suck on the PC market, does the same hold true for Mac?



2) Regarding viewing over-the-air HD, is there a recommended card, or USB/Firewire add-on? I see the USB 2.0 Elgato EyeTV..is that ok?



3) Are the only options those offered by Apple? I can't just go and pick up a newer nVidia or ATI card for the box?



4) Finally..memory. I see a few postings in this forum that mention OWC memory, or munchin, or even Micron. I don't know that I need ECC but I'd rather keep the option if I can..I just don't want to pay the price that Apple charges.



I think thats it. I really appreciate any constructive input.

seek3r

Let me see what I can do to answer this:



Ram: You don't *have* a choice with ECC FB dimms, xeons will not run with normal, run of the mill ddr2 667 ram. This isnt apple here, it's intel. These are sever chips and run with server ram (and new, expensive, slightly slower than equiv desktop server ram to boot). Also, because of the thermal design of the Mac Pro + the heat from the little proc in the ram, you *need* those enormous heatsinks or the ram overheats and errors, so you can't even use ordinary old FB dimms, you need ones rated to work in the MP. OWC has some great deals (for FB dimms at least), and I can at least verify that their ram runs perfectly fine, I have 2gbs of it in my MP.



Graphics cards: You're stuck. If you check around xclr8yourmac or various forums you may be able to find some PC card people have gotten to work, but it's usually a pain, and usually doesn't work 100%. Sucks don't it? :-p Hopefully there will be more compatible cards eventually, particularly as PCs move to EFI, but not yet.



Sound There's neither individual surround ports nor coax digital out on the Mac Pro. So yes, if you're using build in sound you're limited to stereo ouput or optical (in which case you need a decoder of some sort). As for USB options, there are certainly a few out there. A quick newegg search found me creative card which doesnt have component out and a gwc one that doesnt have 5.1 drivers for osx. That said I seem to remember there was an older creative usb card that *did* have component out for 5.1 and worked with osx, unfortunately I can't easily find it.



Over Air HD: This one I'm not as well versed in one the mac side, I've heard good things about El Gatos stuff, but I'm still primarily a linux guy and like hauppauge cards, I have no idea how or if they work on osx however.

shetline

Quote:

1) Sound. I'm used to the linux/pc world of PCI sound cards that do copper digital out, or atleast rear and front stereo outputs. I see that the Pro has a digital out. Does this have to go to an external decoder? My current 5.1 speakers have a "built in" decoder but they don't do optical in.

You should be able to find an optical/copper converter. That's something that should be damn cheap. I built a TosLink switch several years ago for something like $50 or less. The electrical output from a TosLink input module (which can be had for a few bucks) is pretty much just what you need to feed a coax input, with maybe a little impedance matching or voltage adjustment.



Chances are good, however, that because the demand is small and it's a "specialty audio product" it'll run you about $250 to buy that simple circuit packaged neatly into a small box with a power supply. Hopefully I'm wrong about that.

seek3r

Quote:

Originally Posted by shetline


You should be able to find an optical/copper converter. That's something that should be damn cheap. I built a TosLink switch several years ago for something like $50 or less. The electrical output from a TosLink input module (which can be had for a few bucks) is pretty much just what you need to feed a coax input, with maybe a little impedance matching or voltage adjustment.



Chances are good, however, that because the demand is small and it's a "specialty audio product" it'll run you about $250 to buy that simple circuit packaged neatly into a small box with a power supply. Hopefully I'm wrong about that.

::grins::

Good point, though I was shying away from the "you can build it yourself" considering how many people I know don't even know which end to hold a soldering gun with. I think you're right about a boxed version, and for the same price range you can pick up a decent 5.1 theater in a box (actually like the yamaha yht-270, which I've been thinking about getting :-p)

geonjay

Wow..thanks for all the input!!! I have found a TOS Optical -> SPDIF converter for <$30

http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/a..._adapters.html



I also appreciate the input on the RAM. Crucial memory is from Micron (the one time defacto standard-maker for memory) is that still a reliable manufacturer? They have a 2GB (2 x 1GB) package for $199, which ain't bad.





I've accepted my fate on the sound. Griffin has a firewire box for $99, and I can grab an old m-audio Sonica theater box for ~$99 as well...but for now I'll prolly just drop the $30 for the above-mentioned opt-coax converter and keep my existing speakers. Many folks have told me that the built-in sound is just fine...so I may just hold my horses and try it out.



So, again, thanks for the input. I have a feeling that I'll be frequenting this board often!

seek3r

Quote:

Originally Posted by geonjay


Wow..thanks for all the input!!! I have found a TOS Optical -> SPDIF converter for <$30

http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/a..._adapters.html

Cool, surprised to see it that cheap as a consumer item!

Quote:

I also appreciate the input on the RAM. Crucial memory is from Micron (the one time defacto standard-maker for memory) is that still a reliable manufacturer? They have a 2GB (2 x 1GB) package for $199, which ain't bad.

Damn, that is cheap, I'm impressed (though it shows to me on their site as 187, not 199, here). That ram should work, looks like it has the right heatsinks and crucial is a good brand. I swear it was more expensive when I bought the ram for my machine... :-p.

Quote:

I've accepted my fate on the sound. Griffin has a firewire box for $99, and I can grab an old m-audio Sonica theater box for ~$99 as well...but for now I'll prolly just drop the $30 for the above-mentioned opt-coax converter and keep my existing speakers. Many folks have told me that the built-in sound is just fine...so I may just hold my horses and try it out.

Built in sound is quite good, so yeah, try it out, if you don't like it you can always buy more later

Quote:

So, again, thanks for the input. I have a feeling that I'll be frequenting this board often!

That's why I'm here, AI is a good board :-)



EDIT: Just noticed owc still is cheaper, at 179 for 2gb here

shetline

Quote:

Originally Posted by geonjay


Wow..thanks for all the input!!! I have found a TOS Optical -> SPDIF converter for <$30

http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/a..._adapters.html

Good find. I don't have an immediate use for one of these, but I've bookmarked that in case the need comes up.