The Biggest Threat to Obama's Health Care "Reform" - Reality

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  • groveratgroverat Posts: 10,872member
    Quote:

    A pretty cartoon and a little mocking won't wipe away the reality that the top rate in the U.S. will be mid 50's% for all income taxes and that rate will be higher or on par with many socialist countries.



    Yes, finally.



    It should be even higher to pay for our absurd military spending.



    "Pay for what you spend? UNAMERICAN!"
  • hands sandonhands sandon Posts: 5,268member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


    Hands,



    I tried to dig deeper into these numbers, but cannot find the source. Can you help me out?







    A pretty cartoon and a little mocking won't wipe away the reality that the top rate in the U.S. will be mid 50's% for all income taxes and that rate will be higher or on par with many socialist countries.



    I believe that those figures originate from the Organisation of Economic Development, OECD. You have to pay for it, if you want to see the original data. You can get it from their website here- http://www.oecd.org/document/30/0,33..._1_1_1,00.html
  • mumbo jumbomumbo jumbo Posts: 1,633member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


    the top rate in the U.S. will be mid 50's% for all income taxes and that rate will be higher or on par with many socialist countries.



    A speculative claim dishonestly presented as fact.



    These figures are absolutely absurd. Where did you get them? How can you possibly know what the income tax figures will be?



    Please provide a link, to the US Treasury, for example, to back up this speculative claim that base income tax levels will be higher than those in Sweden and Denmark.
  • northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,459member
    Supporters of the GOP are too interested in continuing to allow their corporate overloads the ability to murder Americans by way of spreadsheet. And they will support their insurance brethren at all costs so that many more Americans can be murdered just so they can say the "ALL HAIL THE FREE MARKET! ALL HAIL THE FREE MARKET!"
  • floorjackfloorjack Posts: 2,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Northgate View Post


    Supporters of the GOP are too interested in continuing to allow their corporate overloads the ability to murder Americans by way of spreadsheet. And they will support their insurance brethren at all costs so that many more Americans can be murdered just so they can say the "ALL HAIL THE FREE MARKET! ALL HAIL THE FREE MARKET!"



    We've been found out! RUN!
  • northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,459member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post


    We've been found out! RUN!



    If it walks like a duck....
  • trumptmantrumptman Posts: 16,255member
    Oh crap... the DUCKs are coming, the DUCKS, are coming!
  • jazzgurujazzguru Posts: 6,435member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


    Oh crap... the DUCKs are coming, the DUCKS, are coming!



    Those stupid ducks. Always waddling and quacking. I know they're up to something. It's a conspiracy.
  • talon8472talon8472 Posts: 149member
    Northgate, you seem to think competition and choice by the people in the health care sector will yield more inefficiencies (poorer results) than having one monopoly (government) controlling the whole system. If you do in fact believe this, it is only because you lack the understanding of how/why capitalism works (and is the best) in the first place. That goes for anyone on the boards and elsewhere who are proponents of monopolistic systems.
  • hands sandonhands sandon Posts: 5,268member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post


    Those stupid ducks. Always waddling and quacking. I know they're up to something. It's a conspiracy.



    And that from a Denialist.....!!!!!!
  • taskisstaskiss Posts: 1,212member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Northgate View Post


    Supporters of the GOP are too interested in continuing to allow their corporate overloads the ability to murder Americans by way of spreadsheet. And they will support their insurance brethren at all costs so that many more Americans can be murdered just so they can say the "ALL HAIL THE FREE MARKET! ALL HAIL THE FREE MARKET!"



    Yet, the biggest threat to the administrations health care plan are Democrats.
  • jazzgurujazzguru Posts: 6,435member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Taskiss View Post


    Yet, the biggest threat to the administrations health care plan are Democrats.



    How ironic, eh? The Dems have TEH POWER, yet not all is rosy in the land of the jackass.



    Key House Panel Cancels Health Care Session as Moderate Democrats Voice Concerns



    Quote:

    A key House committee on Tuesday indefinitely postponed voting on health care reform legislation after Democratic leaders were unable to line up enough votes from moderate members of their own party.



    Obama Irks Some Democrats By Declaring He Can Ignore Legislation



    Quote:

    President Obama has irked close allies in Congress by declaring he has the right to ignore legislation on constitutional grounds after having criticized George W. Bush for doing the same.



    Four senior House Democrats on Tuesday said they were "surprised" and "chagrined" by Obama's declaration in June that he doesn't have to comply with provisions in a war spending bill that puts conditions on aid provided to the World Bank and International Monetary Fund.



  • northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,459member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Taskiss View Post


    Yet, the biggest threat to the administrations health care plan are Democrats.



    I agree. The Blue Dogs. And I'm sick to death of their shit and I want them primaried in a big way.



    It sucks not heaving a real progressive liberal political party to belong to. I'm stuck with these stupid idiot Democrats and their addiction to lobbyist money.
  • northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,459member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Talon8472 View Post


    Northgate, you seem to think competition and choice by the people in the health care sector will yield more inefficiencies (poorer results) than having one monopoly (government) controlling the whole system. If you do in fact believe this, it is only because you lack the understanding of how/why capitalism works (and is the best) in the first place. That goes for anyone on the boards and elsewhere who are proponents of monopolistic systems.



    I started reading what you said, but I had to stop at the "one monopoly (government)". That's certainly not being proposed. It's not in the current bill? Oh, that's right. That's your "theory" as to what will happen.



    The government providing health insurance to those who cannot get it the "free market" route does not constitute a monopoly.



    So I guess it's either DEATH BY SPREADSHEET or DEATH BY GOVERNMENT MONOPOLY eh? I'll take government monopoly any day. Death by spreadsheet always prevails.
  • jazzgurujazzguru Posts: 6,435member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Northgate View Post


    I started reading what you said, but I had to stop at the "one monopoly (government)". That's certainly not being proposed. It's not in the current bill? Oh, that's right. That's your "theory" as to what will happen.



    The government providing health insurance to those who cannot get it the "free market" route does not constitute a monopoly.



    So I guess it's either DEATH BY SPREADSHEET or DEATH BY GOVERNMENT MONOPOLY eh? I'll take government monopoly any day. Death by spreadsheet always prevails.



    If this bill passes, the "free market" as it pertains to health care will no longer exist.



    Millions Would Lose Private Insurance Under Health Reform Bill, Study Shows



    Quote:



    WASHINGTON, JULY 21, 2009-- More than 88 million Americans could lose their private, employer-based coverage, according toa new analysis of The American Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 released this week by The Heritage Foundation.



    Heritage commissioned The Lewin Group, a highly respected health care policy and management consulting firm, to examine the impact the House health reform bill would have on private insurance when a government-run health plan is introduced in the marketplace.



    The study found that 88.1 million Americans could be transitioned out of their current plan as employers opt out of continuing their existing coverage. These Americans would lose the employer coverage they now have. The study also found that nationwide 103.4 million Americans would end up on the new government-run public plan.



    "This flies in the face of the current promises that if you like your health insurance coverage, you will keep it," said Heritage Vice President Stuart Butler. "If the public plan is implemented as detailed in this House bill, people with private insurance will be moved on a public plan, regardless of what they want, because their employers will make that decision because of the financial incentives in the bill."



    Other key points from the Lewin study include:



    * Yearly premiums for Americans with private coverage could jump as much as $460 per person as a result of more cost-shifting, which would stem from the public plan.

    * Doctors stand to lose thousands of dollars of income under the legislation. Annual physician net income is estimated to drop by 6.3 percent or $13.4 billion (coming in at an average $18,900 per physician) when compared with current trends.



    You can read the entire study and find more health reform information at Heritage's new Web site www.fixhealthcarepolicy.com.



    Note the website at the end: http://fixhealthcarepolicy.com/



    All those who say that Conservatives are not offering any alternative solutions, GO THERE.
  • jazzgurujazzguru Posts: 6,435member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post


    Very interesting - "ObamaCare" is being endorsed by the AMA!





    Doctors Wage War Against Obama's Health Care Overhaul



    Excerpt:

    Quote:

    The American Medical Association -- the nation's largest physician organization with nearly 250,000 members -- initially opposed the president's plan, but backed the House Democrats' version of the bill last week. That has led to an internal dispute that has resulted in some physicians leaving the nation's largest doctors' association.



    Some doctors charge the bill will lead to inferior patient care as physician offices around the country triple their patient lists and become forced to ration care.



    "This is war," Dr. George Watson, a Kansas physician and president-elect of the American Association of Physicians and Surgeons, told FOXNews.com Thursday. "This is a bureaucratic boondoggle to grab control of health care. Everything that has been proposed in the 1,018 page bill will contribute to the ruination of medicine."



  • northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,459member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post


    Doctors Wage War Against Obama's Health Care Overhaul



    Excerpt:



    Of course doctors oppose health care reform. They don't want their big fat paychecks to suffer.
  • northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,459member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post


    If this bill passes, the "free market" as it pertains to health care will no longer exist.



    Millions Would Lose Private Insurance Under Health Reform Bill, Study Shows







    Note the website at the end: http://fixhealthcarepolicy.com/



    All those who say that Conservatives are not offering any alternative solutions, GO THERE.



    The American Heritage Foundation? A conservative think tank based on free enterprise and limited government? OF COURSE THEY DON'T LIKE IT!



    And The Lewin Group? A group funded by private insurers? Jesus!!!!!
  • jazzgurujazzguru Posts: 6,435member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Northgate View Post


    The American Heritage Foundation? A conservative think tank based on free enterprise and limited government? OF COURSE THEY DON'T LIKE IT!



    And The Lewin Group? A group funded by private insurers? Jesus!!!!!



    You're welcome to comment on the content of the article and that website, you know.
  • trumptmantrumptman Posts: 16,255member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Northgate View Post


    The American Heritage Foundation? A conservative think tank based on free enterprise and limited government? OF COURSE THEY DON'T LIKE IT!



    And The Lewin Group? A group funded by private insurers? Jesus!!!!!



    What complete jackasses! They support things like free enterprise and limited government. I'm pretty sure free enterprise is right up there terrorism.



    I never realized free enterprise ought to be uttered like a profanity.
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