Apple releases iPhone Software Version 1.1.4

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  • numetheusnumetheus Posts: 10member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sapporobaby View Post


    Survey says: not exactly true. I have Symbian programmer friends and they laugh at the way Apple passes down a decree and people simply swallow it hook line and sinker. They program in an environment where the ability to write malicious code exists but where is this code. Symbian come in two flavors and there is still no viable virus attacks that have crippled thousand or even tens of phones. Apple is no more secure than Symbian in this respect. Into the realm of opinion I think that Apple is simply using this as a way to control content distribution and in the end profits. However being that Apple has not invited me to any internal briefings, my opinions are no more valid than yours.



    As for the network crashing thing, sorry that it appeared I applied that to you. It was meant to those here in general that continue to believe this network crashing app lie that Apple and AT&T put forth. No offense to you there and my bad if it appeared this way.



    As a matter of fact, the Symbian OS model goes like this:



    5. UI Framework model

    4. Application Services Layer

    3. OS Services Layer

    2. Base Services Layer

    1. Kernel Services & Hardware Interface Layer



    A symbian developer does not have general access to get to or tinker with code in layer #1 and #2. In iPhone with Unix, we can .... and that knowledge is readily available if you know Unix. The PROBLEM is this ... code executed in Unix, without being executed in a root jail (or sandbox?) has access to the real root and everything underneath. This is potentially bad since the root password of all iPhones are exactly the same. HINT: ITS ALPINE.
  • sapporobabysapporobaby Posts: 1,079member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by numetheus View Post


    As a matter of fact, the Symbian OS model goes like this:



    5. UI Framework model

    4. Application Services Layer

    3. OS Services Layer

    2. Base Services Layer

    1. Kernel Services & Hardware Interface Layer



    A symbian developer does not have general access to get to or tinker with code in layer #1 and #2. In iPhone with Unix, we can .... and that knowledge is readily available if you know Unix. The PROBLEM is this ... code executed in Unix, without being executed in a root jail (or sandbox?) has access to the real root and everything underneath. This is potentially bad since the root password of all iPhones are exactly the same. HINT: ITS ALPINE.



    Alpine? As in the stereo or in yodeling country? That is pretty dumb though. I thought Apple took steps with 1.1.2 or 1.1.3 to change the way applications run. Not sure but I know that the current 3rd party applications had to all be re-written to take advantage of the new file structuring. Not a programmer so I do not know the terms, but I am sure you heard about this.
  • numetheusnumetheus Posts: 10member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sapporobaby View Post


    Alpine? As in the stereo or in yodeling country? That is pretty dumb though. I thought Apple took steps with 1.1.2 or 1.1.3 to change the way applications run. Not sure but I know that the current 3rd party applications had to all be re-written to take advantage of the new file structuring. Not a programmer so I do not know the terms, but I am sure you heard about this.



    Yeah. LOL I was surprised the first time I got into there. You can actually log in as root (Unix superuser) using the SAME password that every iPhone has (alpine). Anyway I was able to do work just like I would any other Unix server after installing the toolchain. Full C compiler and everything. The last mobile phone I was able to do this with was my Sharp Zaurus back in the day .... that one was Linux based. Anyway end result is you can work with the OS like you could any computer, and screw it up just as bad because the root account password is predictable. LOL



    And, in case people don't know the term jailbreak ill explain: The root file system is like the C\ in your Windows computer. In Unix, everything exists off of this root, and once you see the "real" one, you have access to absolutely everything including the kernel and all configuration files. Since Unix keeps all configuration in files rather than a registry, you can see how this is bad. When we create for example, an FTP server, in Unix, we don't like people to be able to see our real root to gain access to all of those system files, directories, and configuration ... so we create a sort of FAKE root. When people log in using FTP (or any service using this fake root), they think they are at the top of the tree, when in reality they are not. To equate this in Windows it is like you creating a folder and somehow telling the system that this new folder IS drive C\. I don't know how you would do this in Windows though ... im a Unix/Linux guy. Anyways, this fake root is called a root jail because it prevents access outside of this specified directory. So, jail breaking is kind of like expanding the confines of what users can access. This "confine" in the original implementation does not provide access to anything! Especially the launcher!



    Anyway, what apple will be doing is opening up a very limited portion of the file system and access to libraries within that limited portion. The SDK will make it easier for programmers to utilize these libraries more easily and prevent them from having to enter other parts of the file system.



    Im sorry if I am lecturing by the way ... I can't help it. I teach Linux courses at my college ... so lecturing is my life! LOL ;-)
  • sapporobabysapporobaby Posts: 1,079member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by numetheus View Post


    Yeah. LOL I was surprised the first time I got into there. You can actually log in as root (Unix superuser) using the SAME password that every iPhone has (alpine). Anyway I was able to do work just like I would any other Unix server after installing the toolchain. Full C compiler and everything. The last mobile phone I was able to do this with was my Sharp Zaurus back in the day .... that one was Linux based. Anyway end result is you can work with the OS like you could any computer, and screw it up just as bad because the root account password is predictable. LOL



    And, in case people don't know the term jailbreak ill explain: The root file system is like the C\ in your Windows computer. In Unix, everything exists off of this root, and once you see the "real" one, you have access to absolutely everything including the kernel and all configuration files. Since Unix keeps all configuration in files rather than a registry, you can see how this is bad. When we create for example, an FTP server, in Unix, we don't like people to be able to see our real root to gain access to all of those system files, directories, and configuration ... so we create a sort of FAKE root. When people log in using FTP (or any service using this fake root), they think they are at the top of the tree, when in reality they are not. To equate this in Windows it is like you creating a folder and somehow telling the system that this new folder IS drive C\. I don't know how you would do this in Windows though ... im a Unix/Linux guy. Anyways, this fake root is called a root jail because it prevents access outside of this specified directory. So, jail breaking is kind of like expanding the confines of what users can access. This "confine" in the original implementation does not provide access to anything! Especially the launcher!



    Anyway, what apple will be doing is opening up a very limited portion of the file system and access to libraries within that limited portion. The SDK will make it easier for programmers to utilize these libraries more easily and prevent them from having to enter other parts of the file system.



    Im sorry if I am lecturing by the way ... I can't help it. I teach Linux courses at my college ... so lecturing is my life! LOL ;-)



    Dude. You teach LINUX? You want to be my best friend? I can send you something from Finland as a down payment. I have decided to learn LINUX again. Which version would you recommend? Going on an old PC.
  • numetheusnumetheus Posts: 10member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sapporobaby View Post


    Dude. You teach LINUX? You want to be my best friend? I can send you something from Finland as a down payment. I have decided to learn LINUX again. Which version would you recommend? Going on an old PC.



    Yes. Ask me whatever and I'll find time to write up a lesson. I was going to put up an tutorial site with everything explained in laymans terms anyways. As far as which to use, it depends on how you want to learn it. Do you want to learn it to use it as a day to day operating system? Or do you want to learn Linux to learn it? That includes command line and everything that goes with it.



    For people starting to learn it as a day to day OS I recommend Ubuntu. If you want to get your hands dirty and really learn it I recommend Arch Linux. It installs as a pure command line, forcing you to learn program names because you have to build it up from xserver to window manager to other programs. And all the while its easy to use package manager gets you going quickly so you don't have to learn everything at once such as source compiling and other stuff. You can graduate from Arch to Gentoo. And if you get that, you can handle most Linux related things. Going the Ubuntu route gets you going instantly with a complete GUI environment, but my experience with students says that makes you lazy and unwilling to learn other more manual ways of doing things. I personally like to do things without the blinders a fully installed distro like Ubuntu provides.
  • greasemonkeygreasemonkey Posts: 2member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by numetheus View Post


    Yes. Ask me whatever and I'll find time to write up a lesson. I was going to put up an tutorial site with everything explained in laymans terms anyways. As far as which to use, it depends on how you want to learn it. Do you want to learn it to use it as a day to day operating system? Or do you want to learn Linux to learn it? That includes command line and everything that goes with it.



    For people starting to learn it as a day to day OS I recommend Ubuntu. If you want to get your hands dirty and really learn it I recommend Arch Linux. It installs as a pure command line, forcing you to learn program names because you have to build it up from xserver to window manager to other programs. And all the while its easy to use package manager gets you going quickly so you don't have to learn everything at once such as source compiling and other stuff. You can graduate from Arch to Gentoo. And if you get that, you can handle most Linux related things. Going the Ubuntu route gets you going instantly with a complete GUI environment, but my experience with students says that makes you lazy and unwilling to learn other more manual ways of doing things. I personally like to do things without the blinders a fully installed distro like Ubuntu provides.



    Think we are getting a bit off topic but...

    numetheus, I would love to see a tutorial starting from command line and working up... I would even be willing to test your tutorials through the rough drafts.
  • rhender777rhender777 Posts: 3member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FriendInMyPants View Post


    it doesnt add flash support does it? thats gonna open a new world to these devices



    Not sure if it really will, but I found this article which gives hope to flash support!



    http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...tware_2_0.html
  • numetheusnumetheus Posts: 10member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by GreaseMonkey View Post


    Think we are getting a bit off topic but...

    numetheus, I would love to see a tutorial starting from command line and working up... I would even be willing to test your tutorials through the rough drafts.



    I appologize to everyone for temporarily hijacking the thread. This will go no further than this last post.



    I was thinking of taking a different approach to writing my tutorial and use much the same format I use in my class by working toward an objective rather than the usual open spout of knowledge Linux surmon. In this case a fully working desktop install of Arch. Since it installs with mainly a base command line, along the way I will explain each process in depth including the kernel, command structure, directory and file management, package management, X servers, and system configuration by using a text editor. This will all be part of the journey to set up a fully working desktop from the ground up.



    If anyone is interested in getting previews and part of a list and member of my blog so we get feedback both ways, send me a private address with your email so I can build a list.
  • googleplexgoogleplex Posts: 41member
    Anyone else been getting two copies of every Yahoo email pushed to their iPhone since this update? I have, so I logged into Yahoo webmail to double check but there is only one of each...



    Update: seems to be fine now, removed my account and let the IMAP emails resync.
  • solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by googleplex View Post


    Anyone else been getting two copies of every Yahoo email pushed to their iPhone since this update? I have, so I logged into Yahoo webmail to double check but there is only one of each...



    Update: seems to be fine now, removed my account and let the IMAP emails resync.



    Is the push happening at decent intervals? When the iPhone first came out people were complaining it was showing up days later.
  • tyrnighttyrnight Posts: 24member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aclark19 View Post


    Hasn't anyone noticed??



    The problem of out-of-order text messages has been fixed!!







    didnt fix it on my iPhone



    now im getting doubles and double sound notifiers, not at the same time.. odd
  • solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tyrnight View Post


    didnt fix it on my iPhone



    now im getting doubles and double sound notifiers, not at the same time.. odd



    Have you tried restoring to factory and then reinstalling 1.1.4.
  • grommittgrommitt Posts: 1member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gmon750 View Post


    Like it or not, Apple continues updates/upgrades to iPhone software because the $$ it receives from the subscriber revenue - and not hardware sales - allows (motivates??) Apple to continue improving its product.



    So if their updates causes the freeloaders, hackers, slackers, and whiners more headaches and complaints as to why they can't partake in a support feature for free - and without problems - as opposed to only those that actually pay for the privilege... it sucks to be you.



    I dont' think the SDK bandwagon will make it any easier in certain aspects. If Apple opens it up more to development similar to how it was with Palm back when, more power to them and I would be first to sign up as I see nothing but a positive impact by that move.



    But the same mantra will still apply. Don't bitch about wanting something for free that everyone else has to pay for. Apple doesn't continue the R&D for the iPhone simply because it's cool. They are no different than any other company that needs to make money.



    I've been an Cingular->AT&T customer for 10+ years. Are they perfect?? Far from it. All the other providers are not perfect either. But I've been relatively happy with them. Is it right that AT&T is the exclusive provider? History will be the judge of that. Do I bitch about not having a Lamborghini as an everyday car? No. So if the iPhone is not available for whatever reason in your town/state/country/planet/whatever, that is just life. If you can hack it up enough to get it to work, kudos to you. But don't expect an easy ride from Apple. You own the hardware, but not the OS software. Get over it.



    Let the flamebaiting begin (again).



    Apart from living in the UK and having a different provider, what you said is essentially the way I feel - nicely done!
  • tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    Quote:

    A symbian developer does not have general access to get to or tinker with code in layer #1 and #2. In iPhone with Unix, we can .... and that knowledge is readily available if you know Unix. The PROBLEM is this ... code executed in Unix, without being executed in a root jail (or sandbox?) has access to the real root and everything underneath. This is potentially bad since the root password of all iPhones are exactly the same. HINT: ITS ALPINE.



    Good explanation.
  • gimlet-eyedkatgimlet-eyedkat Posts: 1member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mbene12 View Post


    prep for SDK release?



    Have a look at Settings/Safari and scroll down to the bottom of the page. There's now a link called "Developer" and when you go there, the option to turn on "debug console". Interesting things happen when you have this on and browse webpages.
  • sapporobabysapporobaby Posts: 1,079member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gimlet-eyedKat View Post


    Have a look at Settings/Safari and scroll down to the bottom of the page. There's now a link called "Developer" and when you go there, the option to turn on "debug console". Interesting things happen when you have this on and browse webpages.



    That was there in v.1.1.2 as far as I know.
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