Google 'Nexus One' pictured, rumored coming to T-Mobile

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  • caliminiuscaliminius Posts: 944member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rhetoric.assassin View Post


    And we will see the real numbers, more speculation about the 2.0 and 2.1 being the only two available, THE FACT remains all apple mobile devices are capable/use the latest apple mobile OS....until then with android, it is a lot of big talk...



    That still doesn't change the fact that the features and therefore potential applications are fragmented just like Android.



    Who cares if you can update a 3-year-old iPhone to the latest OS version? It WON'T have all of the latest features regardless. Nor will all applications on the App Store work on it because of that. Not to mention cell phones have a life cycle of about two years max. Unless you spent an exorbitant amount on your phone (ex., the first gen iPhone), you replace it in two years and move on and never care about updating the OS that's running it.
  • quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,563member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    I enjoyed the 3.5 hour making of on the BRD. It was undoubtedly more enjoyable than the film itself. Overall, I don?t care for Blade Runner. I absolutely love many, many aspects of it but the story was dull. Just watched The Road last night and had the same feeling of a well done movie that has a very dull storyline which a flat plot.



    I think it's the whole package that makes that film. Zero in on any one element and I think you'll find it lacking. It's just too bad that Hollwood's current idea of good Sci-Fi is laughable, IMHO. I'm not pleased with what they did to the Star Trek franchise. It's Star Wars Episode VII: Different Ships, Same Big Explosions. Ugh . . .



    Guess I'm old fashioned in that way.
  • quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,563member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by caliminius View Post


    That still doesn't change the fact that the features and therefore potential applications are fragmented just like Android.



    Who cares if you can update a 3-year-old iPhone to the latest OS version? It WON'T have all of the latest features regardless. Nor will all applications on the App Store work on it because of that. Not to mention cell phones have a life cycle of about two years max. Unless you spent an exorbitant amount on your phone (ex., the first gen iPhone), you replace it in two years and move on and never care about updating the OS that's running it.



    You've completely misunderstood the meaning of fragmentation as it applies to Android and developers' concerns. Go back and read the articles I posted. iPhone "fragmentation", the likes of which you're trying to describe, is completely different and poses no concern.



    What's happening with Android is serious enough that the industry is writing about it quite a bit.
  • solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by caliminius View Post


    That still doesn't change the fact that the features and therefore potential applications are fragmented just like Android.



    Who cares if you can update a 3-year-old iPhone to the latest OS version? It WON'T have all of the latest features regardless. Nor will all applications on the App Store work on it because of that. Not to mention cell phones have a life cycle of about two years max. Unless you spent an exorbitant amount on your phone (ex., the first gen iPhone), you replace it in two years and move on and never care about updating the OS that's running it.



    Your implied argument that Apple shouldn?t offer OS updates to previous year models or that they shouldn?t up the HW features is beyond silly. No one is stating that other vendors with homegrown OSes are facing this problem, just Android with many HW vendors, with many IO types and many Android builds with even more UI types is a problem. They aren?t growing FORWARD like most of the other players, but growing OUT and then FORWARD. This is not a good move for developers and will not make customers happy which means that unless a vendor can make a stable UPWARD moving OS with a standardized UI for their HW it?ll get harder and harder for vendors to push premium, profit making devices on consumers.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by caliminius View Post


    That still doesn't change the fact that the features and therefore potential applications are fragmented just like Android.



    Who cares if you can update a 3-year-old iPhone to the latest OS version? It WON'T have all of the latest features regardless. Nor will all applications on the App Store work on it because of that. Not to mention cell phones have a life cycle of about two years max. Unless you spent an exorbitant amount on your phone (ex., the first gen iPhone), you replace it in two years and move on and never care about updating the OS that's running it.



    is the G1 two years old? And I am sure there are plenty that care that if they buy a phone it still will stay contemporary in 6 months, 1 year and even 3 years.



    http://www.talkandroid.com/260-t-mobile-g1-details/



    try barely over a year old...and still waiting for an update...i guess they have already been forgotten by all those other google android pastry treats...eclair, donut, snacky cakes, cupcakes, what's next ho-hos, ding-dongs, cinna-twist, bear claws? I think they will run out of pastry names before they run out of iphone-killer contenders....
  • solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


    I think it's the whole package that makes that film. Zero in on any one element and I think you'll find it lacking. It's just too bad that Hollwood's current idea of good Sci-Fi is laughable, IMHO. I'm not pleased with what they did to the Star Trek franchise. It's Star Wars Episode VII: Different Ships, Same Big Explosions. Ugh . . .



    Guess I'm old fashioned in that way.



    I love the new Star Trek. I am a fan of J.J. Abrams and I?m really looking forward to Avatar. James Cameron is the director I?ve always wanted to be. Here is a great article about him in Wired. You can see that his concern really is about making a perfect film, not about just doing the least amount of work to get a fat pay check.
    I think that a story line and plot are important and certain movies that could have been great simply don?t have it. Here is a funny SouthPark clip that pretty much explains my feelings about some director/writers.
    PS: Anymore I?ll take to a private message since this is really off topic now.
  • quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,563member
    A little more detail in this article for those that still don't understand the meaning of fragmentation as it applies to mobile devices, including why developers are (and should) be concerned:



    http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/...fragmentation/
  • alphajack7alphajack7 Posts: 97member
    Apple gets copied again. Apple puts a handset on its phone icon. So does google.
  • surferfromuksurferfromuk Posts: 84member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    I love the new Star Trek. I am a fan of J.J. Abrams and I’m really looking forward to Avatar. James Cameron is the director I’ve always wanted to be. Here is a great article about him in Wired. You can see that his concern really is about making a perfect film, not about just doing the least amount of work to get a fat pay check.
    I think that a story line and plot are important and certain movies that could have been great simply don’t have it. Here is a funny SouthPark clip that pretty much explains my feelings about some director/writers.
    PS: Anymore I’ll take to a private message since this is really off topic now.



    So the second clip is what Cameron ripped to make Avatar? - Very funny, they're even blue! - like it.
  • cafcaf Posts: 4member
    I don't think any Android device could compare to the iPhone before the Droid. The Droid has hardware that matches the iPhone (better in some ways, but worse in others, but overall a pretty good match, especially for those that prefer physical keyboards). And when you consider that the Droid is on a better network, it makes for a good option for some people.



    I've been saying for some time though, that the pace of development in the Android world is way outpacing Apple. With new devices coming out every couple of weeks or so, there will soon be many Android devices that outperform the iPhone. The Nexus One, for instance, will have twice the resolution of an iPhone screen, and a significantly faster processor, the 1 GHz Snapdragon. It's thinner, offers better integration with the many free Google apps, and if I never have to use iTunes again, I'll be overjoyed (Never has such a crappy piece of software been suffered by so many, except maybe Windows Vista).



    What makes me most interested in the Nexus, though, is the business model. Will Google finally succeed in breaking the locked-in carrier model? Although others have tried, none have the marketing muscle or connections with buyers that Google has. It irritates me that if I buy an iPhone, or most other phones on major carriers, that I essentially have to buy them on credit. I get a cheap subsidized price up front, then have to pay for hugely overpriced service through the carrier for the next two years to pay back my "loan". It would be a huge step forward for consumers if we could buy the phone we want, then deal for the best data plan available. Even if only TMobile is on board with the Nexus initially, if they get enough new customers they could force the hand of others. It will be interesting to watch.
  • asianbobasianbob Posts: 797member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rhetoric.assassin View Post


    is the G1 two years old? And I am sure there are plenty that care that if they buy a phone it still will stay contemporary in 6 months, 1 year and even 3 years.



    http://www.talkandroid.com/260-t-mobile-g1-details/



    try barely over a year old...and still waiting for an update...i guess they have already been forgotten by all those other google android pastry treats...eclair, donut, snacky cakes, cupcakes, what's next ho-hos, ding-dongs, cinna-twist, bear claws? I think they will run out of pastry names before they run out of iphone-killer contenders....



    Wow... Someone woke up on the wrong side of the hatred bed this morning... You do know that you're the only one using the term "iPhone-killer", right? I get the feeling from your posts that you feel personally attacked that Google even dared to come out with something they see as an alternative to the iPhone.



    Android 2.0 has been ported over to the G1 by the Android community as a proof-of-concept demonstration that it can run the latest OS. While yes, it's not official, it shows that a bit of optimization is all that's needed for the OS.



    Since the G1 is made by HTC (Dream), I believe the delay in getting an official Eclair update to the G1 is because they're more focused on getting Sense to work with the latest upgrades in Android 2.0. Since all their future devices will use Sense, I find it understandable why they're putting more manpower into its upgrade. For all we know, they'll could put Sense on the G1 at the same time they update the Hero.
  • quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,563member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    Wow... Someone woke up on the wrong side of the hatred bed this morning... You do know that you're the only one using the term "iPhone-killer", right? I



    The entire industry is.
  • pismo500pismo500 Posts: 11member
    As much of an "Apple Guy" I consider myself to be... I am seriously considering the Google phone just because I would NOT have to get it on the AT&T network. Another plus is the rumored fact that it may be contract free...
  • wigginwiggin Posts: 2,068member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    The bezel for the camera is needlessly large. I had seen a reference to a story that said the camera was large, but the camera is a normal cell phone pinhole style camera with a big ring that fakes it out to looking larger than it really is, unless you know what you're looking at.



    It's hard to tell for sure from the photo, but I wonder how deep the camera lens is set below the surface of the bezel? They might have had to build up the "needlessly large" bezel in order to make that part of the phone thick enough for the the camera module. (Think of the camera that was pulled from the last iPod touch update, mostly likely because they couldn't get a good enough camera into a case that thin.) So they needed to make a bulge in the case for the camera and they put the big bezel around it to protect what would have otherwise been a protruding camera lens.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dlux View Post


    I really hope that Google helps to break up the practice of carrier subsidies and the public shifts to buying handsets independently of their phone company. In the long run that may become more widespread when/if we (in the US) see a unified 4G/LTE network standard, but until that happens the handset vendors will have to take some risks.



    If the public starts buying the high-end handsets on their own (shopping around as they would for any other CE device), the carriers might lose their exclusivity grip and have to start really competing for a change.



    That's a lovely vision of the future, but how much you want to bet the carriers still charge you the same monthly rate for service as they would if they subsidized your phone? That's why I think they should be required to spell out how much of each month's payment is going towards repaying your phone subsidy.
  • jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    You do know that you're the only one using the term "iPhone-killer", right?



    If so, he's been really busy. A Google search for "iphone killer" (with the quotes) gets 28 MILLION hits.



    The entire industry has been praising every new phone for the past 2 years as an iPhone killer. What planet have you been living on that made you miss this?



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MSF View Post


    One more thing, as you would expect, the Gmail / Google Apps integration is fantastic.



    This alone could draw users. I wish the iPhone had this tight Gmail integration.



    Not me. The tight integration with Google is one of the worst things about Android as far as I'm concerned. Google has enough ways to grab and control your personal information without giving it to them on a silver platter.
  • asianbobasianbob Posts: 797member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


    The entire industry is.



    More like the media industry. I think the term got popularized when Verizon released the Voyager and made the tall claim of it being the "iPhone killer". The phone wasn't horrible for being a dumbphone, but it was nowhere near what the iPhone was at that point.



    Since then, I don't think a single manufacturer in the industry has actually has used the term to describe their own products. Mostly for legal reasons. Actually, I can't remember a time where a single manufacturer in the industry ever used that phrase.



    Plenty of media still use the term as their own description of a device for their reviews. And plenty also hate that term too.



    [QUOTE=jragosta;1535049]If so, he's been really busy. A Google search for "iphone killer" (with the quotes) gets 28 MILLION hits.



    The entire industry has been praising every new phone for the past 2 years as an iPhone killer. What planet have you been living on that made you miss this?

    QUOTE]



    Ok, so I was broad on saying "you". Like I said above, the cell phone industry itself has never claimed any of their devices to be an "iPhone killer". I did that Google search (hehe, irony much?) and each and every hit that had "iPhone killer" in it was from a media outlet. While the media does help promote different items by reviewing them and showcasing it, they're not really directly part of the smartphone industry. At least to me. Opinions will differ.
  • solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    Wow... Someone woke up on the wrong side of the hatred bed this morning... You do know that you're the only one using the term "iPhone-killer", right? I get the feeling from your posts that you feel personally attacked that Google even dared to come out with something they see as an alternative to the iPhone.



    Android 2.0 has been ported over to the G1 by the Android community as a proof-of-concept demonstration that it can run the latest OS. While yes, it's not official, it shows that a bit of optimization is all that's needed for the OS.



    Since the G1 is made by HTC (Dream), I believe the delay in getting an official Eclair update to the G1 is because they're more focused on getting Sense to work with the latest upgrades in Android 2.0. Since all their future devices will use Sense, I find it understandable why they're putting more manpower into its upgrade. For all we know, they'll could put Sense on the G1 at the same time they update the Hero.



    It?s quite a common term. Google over 3.5M hits for ?iPhone Killer?. There is even a website titled iphonekiller.com that incorrectly uses the term killer: "We want to show that there are other iPhone Killers out there that are just as good if not better.? To compete with a product does imply killing it and to even refer to it as a killer of another likely means that it has no chance of doing so.



    The problem with v2.0 for the G1 is that it?s not official. Apple releases the iPhone OS updates for all iPhones at the same time. If the device doesn?t have the HW when you bought it then any app that requires that HW simply won?t be included. It?s pretty damn simply for the user it?s also nice that the user can not just hope but know that a year later your iPhone HW will get a rich OS update alongside the new iPhone, if not before it is released.



    Of course, at some point (I expect in 2010) the original iPhone won?t get the new update. I think 3 years is more than generous when you look at the history of smartphone OS update cycles. I know G1 users that weren?t happy when rumour that 1.6 (Donut) may not come to the G1 then the next rumour that v2.0 (Eclair) was even more unlikely, both do to the HTC?s short-sidedness with the flash capacity. The G1 got the Donut, but weeks after its launch and now it?s been about a 1.5 months since Eclair dropped and still no official support?. and for a phone that only landed less than 14 months ago.
  • Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    Wow... Someone woke up on the wrong side of the hatred bed this morning... You do know that you're the only one using the term "iPhone-killer", right? I get the feeling from your posts that you feel personally attacked that Google even dared to come out with something they see as an alternative to the iPhone.



    Android 2.0 has been ported over to the G1 by the Android community as a proof-of-concept demonstration that it can run the latest OS. While yes, it's not official, it shows that a bit of optimization is all that's needed for the OS.



    Since the G1 is made by HTC (Dream), I believe the delay in getting an official Eclair update to the G1 is because they're more focused on getting Sense to work with the latest upgrades in Android 2.0. Since all their future devices will use Sense, I find it understandable why they're putting more manpower into its upgrade. For all we know, they'll could put Sense on the G1 at the same time they update the Hero.



    I guess after hearing the term "iphone-killer" for so long from every new phone, I guess you guys are getting sick of hearing it...The once proud war cry from marketing these phones has left a bad taste in your mouth. It's become something of instant killshot if a new smart phone calls itself an iphone-killer, hmm, how many before have tried to claim the title and all have fallen...G1, Pre, Droid....



    I do not feel personally attacked, what a ludicrous thing to say. I am glad they rush their feeble attempts at trying to dethrone the phone with a superior network, a superior UI/OS experience, a superior app store, and all-around best purchase for your money smartphone.



    Hmm, what a surprise an open-source OS is not official...once again, not released, which means not READY! Welcome to the wonderful world of fragmented open-source development. So that is great the community has to take care of what google should. I can see the google support on their multitude of handsets will be NONE!



    People buy the iphone the same reason apple computers, little to no maintenance, runs what it says it does out of the box, security, productivity, ease of use, and proper implementation of hardware/software.



    It already appears that google can not live up to their end, its been over and they can not even update their first venture into android devices..
  • addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,667member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    Wow... Someone woke up on the wrong side of the hatred bed this morning... You do know that you're the only one using the term "iPhone-killer", right? I get the feeling from your posts that you feel personally attacked that Google even dared to come out with something they see as an alternative to the iPhone.



    Android 2.0 has been ported over to the G1 by the Android community as a proof-of-concept demonstration that it can run the latest OS. While yes, it's not official, it shows that a bit of optimization is all that's needed for the OS.



    Since the G1 is made by HTC (Dream), I believe the delay in getting an official Eclair update to the G1 is because they're more focused on getting Sense to work with the latest upgrades in Android 2.0. Since all their future devices will use Sense, I find it understandable why they're putting more manpower into its upgrade. For all we know, they'll could put Sense on the G1 at the same time they update the Hero.



    Look again at what you've written-- I think it makes the case that there are legitimate concerns regarding Android platform fragmentation and what it means for a broadly adopted consumer device.



    Your reasons why all is well sound exactly like the Linux apologists that have been assuring us the Linux is set to make real inroads on consumer desktops, any minute now. The problem being, of course, that what seems right and evident and good to tech heads and geeks isn't necessarily, and probably isn't, what seems right and evident and good to the average consumer.



    Remember, the whole point of the iPhone was to make smartphone functionality readily usable by the average consumer. And not just the phone itself, but the whole process, from software updates to getting apps. And remember that upon launch, tech heads and geeks were full of contempt because they already had phones that could "do all that."



    Now, Google has sort of explicitly positioned Android as the geek OS of choice, and I'm sure that a lot of early adopters are happy to dl "proof of concept" hacks that give their handsets various forms of functionality, and don't have trouble keeping track of various point releases and hardware capabilities. But that shit is never going to fly with the average consumer. Worse, the same community that relishes digging into the underpinnings of their phone are likely to have nothing but contempt for users that just want to buy a phone that works, with the apps they buy, out of the box. When such consumers come looking for help, are they going to get the IT guy treatment?



    The worst thing that could happen to Android would be to get a reputation as the geek phone of choice, with the geek community bristling at newbies who don't even know how to compile binaries or find OS tweeks generated by that community. Fragmentation isn't going to be a problem for a certain subset of users, as your post indicates. The problem is is that subset isn't big enough to drive truly mass market adoption. Android needs to have clarity, as a brand and as an experience, to remain a growing concern.
  • asianbobasianbob Posts: 797member
    Discussion success!
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