I know there are Office for Mac haters out there (a few might show up on this very thread). But I'm not one of them. For me, Office for Mac means that I don't have to run Windows at home (like I do at work). Just so you know where I stand, I'm a big, big fan.
That said, I do NOT love the ribbon on Office 2007. IMO it's a huge impediment vs. the menu interface for those of us who are not brand new to Office (or computers in general). I'm asking that you please NOT REPLACE THE MENU! If some users want the ribbon, fine, but make it possible to at least optionally run Office the old way with the standard menu; at least Word and Excel. That is important to me and probably to most of the Office for Mac users (again, ignoring the haters who don't count as they probably aren't actually customers in the first place).
Who knows, maybe the Office for Windows team could learn a thing or two from the MacBU team?
The only other things I need would be to have macro support added back in Excel, and some way to edit the current cell via a keyboard shortcut in Excel (like F2 in Mac for Windows).
Thanks for your consideration.
John.B
I totally agree about the ribbon. Our office just got "upgraded" to Office 2007, and most of us feel like that sick old Helen Keller joke: How did Helen Keller's parents punish her? By rearranging all of the furniture and covering the front door with extra door knobs that don't work...
for 15 bucks you can download a plugin that puts back in the strip that says, "File, Edit..
It feels like every iteration of MS office for Mac just gets worse. Each new version is slower to load than the last one, less responsible, and more complicated -- without being more capable.
Why Bother. Who wants to feed Steve Ballmer more wasted money. Use iWork and avoid the pack of thieves! And why would you buy a "downgrade" of Office, which every new version seems to be! I still have a ten year old version that works fine anyway. I always tell people to download Open products if they don't want to spend money for iWork.
No thanks. I appreciate some need it but TG I have moved on. I started with Visicalc so I have been around the block and earned my retirement to iWorks and its offspring.
It's about f**g time! I've been waiting for these features for years! Seriously Microsoft couldn't have just made the version for Windows and Mac the same since the beginning? It's as if they were purposely making an inferior product for Mac users so that less business users would adopt a Mac. One thing that the article didn't mention was whether it had the ability to compress pictures. For example, if you want to put a large picture into PowerPoint you have to resize it first using another program, otherwise you'll end up with a 20MB+ file that is impossible to email. In the Windows version you could compress and crop every picture within the file with a couple of clicks. I'm also not a big fan of Office 2007 ribbon UI, it needs the ability to customize and rearrange everything like the 2003 version. Anyway thanks for finally changing it. Now I can happily throw away my Windows machine completely
As someone who writes for a living, Word 2004 has proven a great tool. However, the whole Ribbon thing is a waste of precious screen space. Definitely not a step forward.
As for being over 45 and under 30....a floppy disc icon in the toolbar?
Might as well have a cassette tape icon.
Quote:
I think that says it all for Microsoft and their so-called willingness to throw away what needs throwing away in order to create the best possible usability.
Creating the BEST possible usability would mean throwing everything completely away and starting over. Unfortunately, as long as the money keeps rolling in the restart isn't going to happen.
I thought Microsoft did a decent job on Office 2008. I enjoy using Word more then Pages [although Pages has some nice templates]. However, Office needs to bring back macro support. We use Office for compatibility.
If the ribbon must be used, please make it an optional interface.
In Mac Office 2011 the ribbon replaces the format palette.
Schwieb also said this at Ars' Mac forum: "Outlook is a Cocoa app. The other apps are still predominately Carbon, but pretty much all new UI pieces are Cocoa within the Carbon apps."
You're just holding onto old mental patterns... you're probably over 45, I work with a few people around that age that hate the ribbon, while everybody under 30 likes it.
You should just stop thinking about features and think activity... it's pretty easy when you try. When you need to do anything that has to do with "putting stuff on the page" go to insert, when you're dealing with how the page looks, go to "page layout" and so on.. from there it's easy to visually scan the ribbon for what you need. USe it this way for 4 days, and your problems will be over.
Trust me, I do usability for a living!
I happen to be 45 my self. I have used everything from command line DOS in the 80s and Great GUIs in the 90s. Excel, Word, Borland Quatto, Lotus 123 and Ami, etc etc. This is the first time i seem a business program go backwards in evolution.
I can say our company of 650 will continue to use Office 2003 because Office 2007 has become unsuable. The same is true with our corporate auditors E&Y, nearly 144,000 employees worldwide, will not be using 2007. From what the EY Staff tell me seems their other clients will not be migrating to 2007 either. So they are pleased not migrate to 2007. Intel publicaly stated they will not be using Office 2007. I checked with my other beancounter friends and 2003 is their corporate choice of office suites. So pretty much every company in the Sillicon Valley and its global affilates are not using 2007. Our managment has not mandated it, they think it sucks as well, our IT isnt purchasing it.
Trust me I HAVE done it for a living! I am a Financial Controller who used spreadsheets, wordprocessors, etc etc for over 2 decades.
Yes we have a voice when it comes to corporate spending.. and its stinging MS in the A$$.
Though out the decades Apples philosophy regarding its products, ?no need for manuals?. Even today the Apple Retail store has that philosophy in practice that anyone can walk in and start using the products with little or now training. Its right in front of you.
The ribbon should not be an exception to the golden rule. IT MUST GO! PC OR MAC!
I'm just waiting for 64 bits iWork 10. Fortunately, I don't need all the fancy stuff like macros or virtual basic or complicated equations --I'm still using iWork 08 and happy with it. Most of the colleagues I work with --interchanging documents at a daily basis--, who use windows and office and pc's, don't even know I don't have Word neither Excel.
And look at all the vertical space you just lost, MacBook users.
This. MS seems to think that Widescreen monitors were never invented.
I use iWork because I can hide all the crap at the top and leave only the menu bar, leaving more of the actual document, which should be the MAIN focus of the interface, viewable with less scrolling. Office '08 pissed me off because you couldn't turn off the stupid gallery (never used it) completely. Valuable real estate, lost.
Just look at that screenshot--all that wasted grey space! Put the ribbon there! I'm all for making features more discoverable, but not if it makes the main focus of the program--your document--harder to navigate.
Aaaagrgrhrgrgrgrghhhghh!!! F*** the ribbon! It has reduced my productivity by at least 30%. I'm a keyboard-guy, and the ribbon forces you to click for some functions. I'd rather search through eight text-descriptive menus than hover over 80 nondescript buttons to find what I'm looking for. Damnit anyway!
VB is the only plus here.
I gotta be honest, though. I haven't used Office for Mac in probably 5 years. I'd rather just bring work home to my PC than to my Mac just so my "work spaces" are consistent.
Ever hear of things that are included in the Windows version of Office, like Publisher? Access? And they are *where?* in the Mac version?
OMG, I think I'm gonna vomit. Really? Someone's asking for Publisher on a Mac? Really? Why? Because PageMaker 1.03 won't install and run on a new iMac? Because Pages costs too much? Because Word is too hard to learn?
Next up after the break: We'll take calls from the 3 users demanding FrontPage and ImageComposer be released for Macintosh.
I know there are Office for Mac haters out there (a few might show up on this very thread). But I'm not one of them. For me, Office for Mac means that I don't have to run Windows at home (like I do at work). Just so you know where I stand, I'm a big, big fan.
That said, I do NOT love the ribbon on Office 2007. IMO it's a huge impediment vs. the menu interface for those of us who are not brand new to Office (or computers in general). I'm asking that you please NOT REPLACE THE MENU! If some users want the ribbon, fine, but make it possible to at least optionally run Office the old way with the standard menu; at least Word and Excel. That is important to me and probably to most of the Office for Mac users (again, ignoring the haters who don't count as they probably aren't actually customers in the first place).
Who knows, maybe the Office for Windows team could learn a thing or two from the MacBU team?
The only other things I need would be to have macro support added back in Excel, and some way to edit the current cell via a keyboard shortcut in Excel (like F2 in Mac for Windows).
Thanks for your consideration.
John.B
I've used Office for years. I love the ribbon. It's perhaps the one good idea M$ has had in the last 20 years. Of course they didn't use it for 2008, which means I refuse to buy it.
Save as is in that stupid Windows menu. Just wanted to say...I HATE THE RIBBON too! It's the worst for power-users. Everything is moved. So they have an Insert ribbon. But where is the insert row or column, you say? Why, of course it's not there! Took me 10 minutes to realize it was in another place. F'ing retarded. How exactly is it quicker than menus? I do NOT like crap to MOVE AROUND. Just like those f'ing retarded hopping tabs in dumbass Windows dialog boxes. How can MS engineers be so...stupid? I'm sure I'll get used to it. Although I've been using 2007 for a year and I'm still not as proficient as in 2003, which I also use every day. But why should we have to, if there's no benefit?
I just want Mac Office 2010 to be faster, more compatible, stable, and with VBA. And add MS Access and Outlook, and some Sharepoint abilities. Perhaps adding those last three will justify calling a version of it "premium" or "business" or "professional" whatever. Those are three good apps that are very powerful, and essential for business. Of course if they bring those over Macs might start selling more in business and that would be bad for Windows.
Comments
Dear MacBU:
I know there are Office for Mac haters out there (a few might show up on this very thread). But I'm not one of them. For me, Office for Mac means that I don't have to run Windows at home (like I do at work). Just so you know where I stand, I'm a big, big fan.
That said, I do NOT love the ribbon on Office 2007. IMO it's a huge impediment vs. the menu interface for those of us who are not brand new to Office (or computers in general). I'm asking that you please NOT REPLACE THE MENU! If some users want the ribbon, fine, but make it possible to at least optionally run Office the old way with the standard menu; at least Word and Excel. That is important to me and probably to most of the Office for Mac users (again, ignoring the haters who don't count as they probably aren't actually customers in the first place).
Who knows, maybe the Office for Windows team could learn a thing or two from the MacBU team?
The only other things I need would be to have macro support added back in Excel, and some way to edit the current cell via a keyboard shortcut in Excel (like F2 in Mac for Windows).
Thanks for your consideration.
John.B
I totally agree about the ribbon. Our office just got "upgraded" to Office 2007, and most of us feel like that sick old Helen Keller joke: How did Helen Keller's parents punish her? By rearranging all of the furniture and covering the front door with extra door knobs that don't work...
for 15 bucks you can download a plugin that puts back in the strip that says, "File, Edit..
http://www.ubit.ch/software/ubitmenu-languages/
out IT guy told me about it and then looked the other way...
It feels like every iteration of MS office for Mac just gets worse. Each new version is slower to load than the last one, less responsible, and more complicated -- without being more capable.
Why Bother. Who wants to feed Steve Ballmer more wasted money. Use iWork and avoid the pack of thieves! And why would you buy a "downgrade" of Office, which every new version seems to be! I still have a ten year old version that works fine anyway. I always tell people to download Open products if they don't want to spend money for iWork.
The ribbon on Office 2007 is ugly, buggy, and not user friendly.
As for being over 45 and under 30....a floppy disc icon in the toolbar?
I think that says it all for Microsoft and their so-called willingness to throw away what needs throwing away in order to create the best possible usability.
Creating the BEST possible usability would mean throwing everything completely away and starting over. Unfortunately, as long as the money keeps rolling in the restart isn't going to happen.
Keynote kicks butt though.
If the ribbon must be used, please make it an optional interface.
In Mac Office 2011 the ribbon replaces the format palette.
Schwieb also said this at Ars' Mac forum: "Outlook is a Cocoa app. The other apps are still predominately Carbon, but pretty much all new UI pieces are Cocoa within the Carbon apps."
You're just holding onto old mental patterns... you're probably over 45, I work with a few people around that age that hate the ribbon, while everybody under 30 likes it.
You should just stop thinking about features and think activity... it's pretty easy when you try. When you need to do anything that has to do with "putting stuff on the page" go to insert, when you're dealing with how the page looks, go to "page layout" and so on.. from there it's easy to visually scan the ribbon for what you need. USe it this way for 4 days, and your problems will be over.
Trust me, I do usability for a living!
I happen to be 45 my self. I have used everything from command line DOS in the 80s and Great GUIs in the 90s. Excel, Word, Borland Quatto, Lotus 123 and Ami, etc etc. This is the first time i seem a business program go backwards in evolution.
I can say our company of 650 will continue to use Office 2003 because Office 2007 has become unsuable. The same is true with our corporate auditors E&Y, nearly 144,000 employees worldwide, will not be using 2007. From what the EY Staff tell me seems their other clients will not be migrating to 2007 either. So they are pleased not migrate to 2007. Intel publicaly stated they will not be using Office 2007. I checked with my other beancounter friends and 2003 is their corporate choice of office suites. So pretty much every company in the Sillicon Valley and its global affilates are not using 2007. Our managment has not mandated it, they think it sucks as well, our IT isnt purchasing it.
Trust me I HAVE done it for a living! I am a Financial Controller who used spreadsheets, wordprocessors, etc etc for over 2 decades.
Yes we have a voice when it comes to corporate spending.. and its stinging MS in the A$$.
The ribbon should not be an exception to the golden rule. IT MUST GO! PC OR MAC!
And look at all the vertical space you just lost, MacBook users.
This. MS seems to think that Widescreen monitors were never invented.
I use iWork because I can hide all the crap at the top and leave only the menu bar, leaving more of the actual document, which should be the MAIN focus of the interface, viewable with less scrolling. Office '08 pissed me off because you couldn't turn off the stupid gallery (never used it) completely. Valuable real estate, lost.
Just look at that screenshot--all that wasted grey space! Put the ribbon there! I'm all for making features more discoverable, but not if it makes the main focus of the program--your document--harder to navigate.
But yes, ATM it is sometimes painful, and screen-consuming.
VB is the only plus here.
I gotta be honest, though. I haven't used Office for Mac in probably 5 years. I'd rather just bring work home to my PC than to my Mac just so my "work spaces" are consistent.
-Clive
Ever hear of things that are included in the Windows version of Office, like Publisher? Access? And they are *where?* in the Mac version?
Next up after the break: We'll take calls from the 3 users demanding FrontPage and ImageComposer be released for Macintosh.
Stay tuned...
Dear MacBU:
I know there are Office for Mac haters out there (a few might show up on this very thread). But I'm not one of them. For me, Office for Mac means that I don't have to run Windows at home (like I do at work). Just so you know where I stand, I'm a big, big fan.
That said, I do NOT love the ribbon on Office 2007. IMO it's a huge impediment vs. the menu interface for those of us who are not brand new to Office (or computers in general). I'm asking that you please NOT REPLACE THE MENU! If some users want the ribbon, fine, but make it possible to at least optionally run Office the old way with the standard menu; at least Word and Excel. That is important to me and probably to most of the Office for Mac users (again, ignoring the haters who don't count as they probably aren't actually customers in the first place).
Who knows, maybe the Office for Windows team could learn a thing or two from the MacBU team?
The only other things I need would be to have macro support added back in Excel, and some way to edit the current cell via a keyboard shortcut in Excel (like F2 in Mac for Windows).
Thanks for your consideration.
John.B
I've used Office for years. I love the ribbon. It's perhaps the one good idea M$ has had in the last 20 years. Of course they didn't use it for 2008, which means I refuse to buy it.
I just want Mac Office 2010 to be faster, more compatible, stable, and with VBA. And add MS Access and Outlook, and some Sharepoint abilities. Perhaps adding those last three will justify calling a version of it "premium" or "business" or "professional" whatever. Those are three good apps that are very powerful, and essential for business. Of course if they bring those over Macs might start selling more in business and that would be bad for Windows.