Nielson: Android flourished before iPhone 4, but Apple 'most desired'

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  • rationaltrollrationaltroll Posts: 510member
    Here's a story that's on 16,800 sites this morning, but absent from the Mac fan site AppleInsider.com:



    Android shipments grew 886% in Q2 2010

    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...%25+in+Q2+2010
  • screamingfistscreamingfist Posts: 971member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post


    By 2012, we'll see iPhone 6 (or whatever it's called) on Verizon, Sprint, and maybe a whole lot more US-based carriers. Android will be competing directly against iPhone on Verizon by then, because all carriers will be running the true all-IP packet-switched 4G protocol.



    And guess what will happen. We'll see mass defections from Android to iPhone. Guaranteed. Only the philosophically challenged "freetards" will stay on Android.



    Oh, and one more thing. There is no Android-based competitor to the iPod touch. And iPod touch sales are roughly the same as iPhone sales. So if you look at overall iOS device sales, even excluding iPad, iOS is still far ahead of Android.





    i have a nexus one with android 2.2

    i have absolutely no iphone 4 'lust'. everything i need to do i can do with my android based phone. if i had to choose between 'face time' and my android 2.2 built in access point/tethering i go with android. twice it has saved me when wireless access was down....

    most people i meet that are really into android are much more technical, and mentally brighter, than the people that rave on about iphone.
  • mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    They all might be like that but it could be an odd faulty battery. This will happen with all such devices and I wouldn’t hold a product responsible unless there is proof that they choose an inferior battery for the device to cut costs.



    Maybe, but she started seeing charging issues right after upgrading over the air, I think to 'cupcake'. I told her to Google about it and she said that several other posts were describing the exact same battery problem. I don't believe she was offered an upgrade or patch since that time. The battery issue which appeared immediately after the upgrade eventually manifested itself as a condition that caused it to be unable to fully recharge, takes forever to recharge and doesn't last very long as compared to the original configuration. But she is not the type to complain, she just adapts, in this case by keeping it plugged in as often as possible, but eventually she will get her new iPhone.
  • suddenly newtonsuddenly newton Posts: 13,093member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rorybalmer View Post


    Isn't Android an operating system where as iPhone is the actual phone? Can you really compare every device that has android to iPhone? I would assume you would compare android to iOS.. And motorola to apple.. Not Motorola, Nokia, HTC, etc. to Apple...



    That's like saying what's a more popular gum.. Juicy Fruit or any other gum that's mint flavored..



    Just seems like a pointless comparison.



    Just as pointless as Windows OS vs. Macs?
  • os2babaos2baba Posts: 261member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tt92618 View Post


    I don't know if anyone realizes it or not, but Google is attempting a replay of the OS war fought between Apple and Microsoft. Its the same strategy, only this time in the mobile space. But all of the factors are the same: Apple has a tight ecosystem that integrates hardware and software, and they control the entire pie. Google manufactures the operating system, and provides it to hardware vendors that design and manufacture their own hardware variants. Just like last time, Google is banking on volume and incremental improvement, while Apple is banking on supremacy in design, technology, and quality. The question is, are we seeing a replay, or is this going to turn out to be an entirely different movie.



    There is one big difference here. Google actually has an excellent product while DOS and Windows weren't.
  • groovetubegroovetube Posts: 557member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tt92618 View Post


    Apple has to confront two serious issues, and they must do so soon, if they are to effectively combat the onslaught of Android devices.



    1) They need to build out additional manufacturing capacity. Waits of 3 weeks will not work in a market where there are other devices running Android 2 (and soon 3) easily available from multiple carriers. It is too easy for consumers to simply walk away and purchase from another carrier, which brings up...



    2) Apple needs - NEEDS - to get out of the exclusivity deal with AT&T. This deal is going to kill market share for them in the US; it creates a competitive disadvantage for them that will only grow more severe as the market becomes crowded with higher-quality devices that erode the perceived gap between iPhone and Android handsets.



    I don't know if anyone realizes it or not, but Google is attempting a replay of the OS war fought between Apple and Microsoft. Its the same strategy, only this time in the mobile space. But all of the factors are the same: Apple has a tight ecosystem that integrates hardware and software, and they control the entire pie. Google manufactures the operating system, and provides it to hardware vendors that design and manufacture their own hardware variants. Just like last time, Google is banking on volume and incremental improvement, while Apple is banking on supremacy in design, technology, and quality. The question is, are we seeing a replay, or is this going to turn out to be an entirely different movie.



    that's what I've been thinking. I was around back in the day when us apple users all felt the superiority of our platform, was the advantage that would keep it dominant, I'm seeing and hearing the same bragging, deja vu But, it didn't.



    However, I think there are many many things being done differently this time round, having SJ at the top for one, and the success apple is seeing isn't going to slow anytime soon.



    But I do think the dismissal of the other platforms, is brainless.
  • dave k.dave k. Posts: 1,306member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Groovetube View Post


    that's what I've been thinking. I was around back in the day when us apple users all felt the superiority of our platform, was the advantage that would keep it dominant, I'm seeing and hearing the same bragging, deja vu But, it didn't.



    However, I think there are many many things being done differently this time round, having SJ at the top for one, and the success apple is seeing isn't going to slow anytime soon.



    But I do think the dismal of the other platforms, is brainless.



    Apple seems not to give a sh*t about marketshare. They seem to only occupied with owning/catering to the high-end crowd.
  • groovetubegroovetube Posts: 557member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    Apple seems not to give a sh*t about marketshare. They seem to only occupied with owning/catering to the high-end crowd.



    seems to be something that is currently working.
  • dave k.dave k. Posts: 1,306member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Groovetube View Post


    seems to be something that is currently working.



    No doubt. But long-term, I worry that Apple will be crushed by Google...
  • mjtomlinmjtomlin Posts: 1,556member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    No doubt. But long-term, I worry that Apple will be crushed by Google...



    Currently Android doesn't have a real OEM competitor in the US, which is why they are doing so well in market percentages... Most of the "sales" that went to WinMo are being handed to Android. OEMs and carriers can stick whatever OS they want on the hardware, when Microsoft releases WP7 later this year, those OEMs and carriers will have a choice. Consumers will then have a better choice as well. I'm pretty sure within a couple of years, there will just as many phones available with WP7 as there are Android and Android's share of the market will drop almost as fast as it rose.



    Secondly, in "open" phone markets where the iPhone is offered on multiple networks, Android is nothing but a blip on the radar, a small fraction of iPhone sales. In the US, subscribers of Verizon, Sprint and T-Mobile do not have the choice of buying an iPhone vs. Android, so you can't really compare how well one is doing over the other.
  • xian zhu xuandexian zhu xuande Posts: 801member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    Apple seems not to give a sh*t about marketshare. They seem to only occupied with owning/catering to the high-end crowd.



    Spot on. Apple only competes in the profitable/high-end markets. They never jump into the bulk/low-profit/high-risk markets. It has worked out for them, and I don't mind it one bit: I like their products because I prefer to pay the extra amount for a well-built product that lasts.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    No doubt. But long-term, I worry that Apple will be crushed by Google...



    They will not be. Android has appeal to the tech crowd, but there is a very large market it is disgusting to. Android will also never be even remotely as cool and desirable to the masses. My prediction is that Android will be very successful in the general smartphone market, but that those buying for aesthetics, trends, simplicity, and all the other common reasons (tech reasons why people prefer iPhone, word-of-mouth, family recommendations) will continue to buy the iPhone as long as Apple continues to innovate. There will be some head-to-head among tech users (based on type and preference), but Android will have a lot of trouble snatching up Apple's other users.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post


    Currently Android doesn't have a real OEM competitor in the US, which is why they are doing so well in market percentages... Most of the "sales" that went to WinMo are being handed to Android. OEMs and carriers can stick whatever OS they want on the hardware, when Microsoft releases WP7 later this year, those OEMs and carriers will have a choice. Consumers will then have a better choice as well. I'm pretty sure within a couple of years, there will just as many phones available with WP7 as there are Android and Android's share of the market will drop almost as fast as it rose.



    This assumes Microsoft can put together a mobile OS which can actually compete with Android and iOS. I believe they've got the potential: they've got mountains of talent and plenty of software experience. But they do need to sever any requirement for a stylus, it needs to be unique (not a Windows shell of any sort), fully integrated with Windows, Office, Exchange, and it needs to offer an attractive app market and touch screen experience. If they can hit on enough of these points (and I think they can hit on some of these points as long as Balmer keeps his head out of his arse), then they've definitely got the talent to compete in terms of getting the OS on phones. Blackberry probably has new cause to sweat in such a scenario.
  • davestalldavestall Posts: 45member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    Apple seems not to give a sh*t about marketshare. They seem to only occupied with owning/catering to the high-end crowd.



    Unfortunately; apple no longer produces a high end product. Its just a matter of time before the apple followers realize that; as they struggle to make phone calls.
  • davestalldavestall Posts: 45member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Xian Zhu Xuande View Post


    They will not be. Android has appeal to the tech crowd, but there is a very large market it is disgusting to. Android will also never be even remotely as cool and desirable to the masses. My prediction is that Android will be very successful in the general smartphone market, but that those buying for aesthetics, trends, simplicity, and all the other common reasons (tech reasons why people prefer iPhone, word-of-mouth, family recommendations) will continue to buy the iPhone as long as Apple continues to innovate. There will be some head-to-head among tech users (based on type and preference), but Android will have a lot of trouble snatching up Apple's other users.




    You must be living under a rock. It is the iphone that is struggling to catch up with features and UI. Iphone has the same archaic UI it had 3 years ago. If you consider adding folders innovative, you are living in the 1970s. Androids UI is competley customizable so the phone works how the customer wants; not how Steve Job's limited concept of how things should work. The high demand for iphone jailbreaking is to add features android has by default.



    A scrolling grid of squares = Apples idea of a useful UI. Sad.
  • xian zhu xuandexian zhu xuande Posts: 801member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davestall View Post


    Unfortunately; apple no longer produces a high end product. Its just a matter of time before the apple followers realize that; as they struggle to make phone calls.



    Ah, troll. Ignorant one at that.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davestall View Post


    You must be living under a rock. It is the iphone that is struggling to catch up with features and UI. Iphone has the same archaic UI it had 3 years ago. If you consider adding folders innovative, you are living in the 1970s. Androids UI is competley customizable so the phone works how the customer wants; not how Steve Job's limited concept of how things should work. The high demand for iphone jailbreaking is to add features android has by default.



    A scrolling grid of squares = Apples idea of a useful UI. Sad.



    You are the perfect example of the most braindead type of consumer out there: the sort who buys a product based on a feature list. Any trash Chinese knock-off company can throw out a product with a feature list that looks absolutely incredible—until you actually use the piece of junk. The same applies to Android, but on a much smaller scale. Google throws every feature they can find into the OS with very little time for preparation, by way of comparison, and it absolutely shows. Apple, by way of comparison, is content to let its users scream in agitation as it carefully mulls over a feature, finally implementing it in a way that few other devices could have ever hoped to do it (everything from FaceTime to Copy/Paste and the Camera). It leaves competitors with the choice to completely undo their previous method of doing things and copy Apple (or out-innovate them, which doesn't happen much), or with an obsolete feature. The end result is a product that works in marvelous ways from the top to the bottom, and that's one I can get behind. I want a device that works quickly, and when I need it to. I do not want to tinker with it. Android, by comparison, can do so many things, but precious few of those things as well as iOS. Now, this actually does appeal to some users, and for good reason, but not to me.



    In any case, you should probably be in school right now.



    Done chatting with you.



    Note to readers of intelligence: I actually do respect the Android platform and I am certainly not implying that Android buyers are braindead. Simply that product buyers who think their platform is best because of a feature list are. Buying Android because it is more open, tinker friendly, hackable, whatever—those are good reasons for some people to make a buying decision.
  • davestalldavestall Posts: 45member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Xian Zhu Xuande View Post


    Ah, troll. Ignorant one at that.





    You are the perfect example of the most braindead type of consumer out there: the sort who buys a product based on a feature list. Any trash Chinese knock-off company can throw out a product with a feature list that looks absolutely incredible?until you actually use the piece of junk. The same applies to Android, but on a much smaller scale. Google throws every feature they can find into the OS with very little time for preparation, by way of comparison, and it absolutely shows. Apple, by way of comparison, is content to let its users scream in agitation as it carefully mulls over a feature, finally implementing it in a way that few other devices could have ever hoped to do it (everything from FaceTime to Copy/Paste and the Camera). It leaves competitors with the choice to completely undo their previous method of doing things and copy Apple (or out-innovate them, which doesn't happen much), or with an obsolete feature. The end result is a product that works in marvelous ways from the top to the bottom, and that's one I can get behind. I want a device that works quickly, and when I need it to. I do not want to tinker with it. Android, by comparison, can do so many things, but precious few of those things as well as iOS. Now, this actually does appeal to some users, and for good reason, but not to me.



    In any case, you should probably be in school right now.



    Done chatting with you.



    Note to readers of intelligence: I actually do respect the Android platform and I am certainly not implying that Android buyers are braindead. Simply that product buyers who think their platform is best because of a feature list are. Buying Android because it is more open, tinker friendly, hackable, whatever?those are good reasons for some people to make a buying decision.



    I will ignore the childish name-calling. Iphone has the worst reputation for voice quality, dropped calls and reception. This is not an opinion; it is fact that even apple admits. And the latest iphone4 apple admits drops more calls that the previous version. If you consider this high end; so be it. I cant help those who ignore the obvious.



    But; it is the main reason Android is now outselling iphone and there are many more Android activations per day that IOS activations. Apple simply cant keep up. I know; apple doesnt care about market volume. Its a good thing.
  • groovetubegroovetube Posts: 557member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davestall View Post


    I will ignore the childish name-calling. Iphone has the worst reputation for voice quality, dropped calls and reception. This is not an opinion; it is fact that even apple admits. And the latest iphone4 apple admits drops more calls that the previous version. If you consider this high end; so be it. I cant help those who ignore the obvious.



    But; it is the main reason Android is now outselling iphone and there are many more Android activations per day that IOS activations. Apple simply cant keep up. I know; apple doesnt care about market volume. Its a good thing.



    is it even possible to have some kind of balanced viewpoints on the different platforms without this kind of horseshit? I mean really. If what you say is true, apple would not be seeing the astounding successes it is seeing.



    Granted I have plenty of criticisms of the iphone, but I don't think we need to resort to this kind of bull. It's as bad as the hardcore apple defence league that shrieks "apple hater!" the minute you "veer off message".



    As long as apple keeps innovating at the pace it is, and surprising the others with bold new products like the ipad, apple will continue to reign. Period. However, android is a very good platform, as is iOS, despite all the bickering back and forth as to who is worse.



    I have to say though, the last mobile development conference I was at, all the platforms that were there, the tables, the excitment, were all at every platform BUT microsoft. That poor guy sat there with one or two people dropping by. It'll be a while before M$ is going to be able to recover, if at all. I could be wrong, but M$ simply putting out a W7 phone isn't going to automatically trounce android.
  • shadashshadash Posts: 470member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davestall View Post


    Unfortunately; apple no longer produces a high end product. Its just a matter of time before the apple followers realize that; as they struggle to make phone calls.



    Not true. The iPhone has always been a pain in the ass to make a phone call on. The hardware itself - especially the iPhone 4 - is amazing and well ahead of the couple of Droids I have used.
  • shadashshadash Posts: 470member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    Apple seems not to give a sh*t about marketshare. They seem to only occupied with owning/catering to the high-end crowd.



    This is not how Apple operated in establishing dominance with the iPod. Otherwise we would not have the Shuffle, for example. Is the Mac the model for the iPhone or is the iPod?
  • xian zhu xuandexian zhu xuande Posts: 801member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davestall View Post


    I will ignore the childish name-calling. Iphone has the worst reputation for voice quality, dropped calls and reception. This is not an opinion; it is fact that even apple admits. And the latest iphone4 apple admits drops more calls that the previous version. If you consider this high end; so be it. I cant help those who ignore the obvious.



    That was more responsible, so I'll reply.



    In early days the iPhone had a poor reputation for voice quality. Voice quality on the iPhone 4 is phenomenal, however, and it has also gradually improved as the device has grown. Unfortunately right now, in the United States, voice quality is held back by AT&T's network, which does not offer voice quality on par with Verizon. Dropped calls and reception are not top notch as is often the case with media smartphones. If you're referring to the 'Antennagate' nonsense, though, I don't buy it. The iPhone 4 has been one of the very most reliable phones I have ever owned, outside a high-end phone-feature-based phone I used to have on Verizon, which also offers a superior network in areas I have spent most my time in terms of call reliability. Despite conducting business regularly on the iPhone 4 I have dropped few calls, and this includes Manhattan and San Francisco. Speculation beyond this is speculation by definition as AT&T has chosen not to release the real numbers.



    In any case, I was content to use the original iPhone as well, despite knowing clear well that, compared to say, a good BlackBerry, its phone feature was immature. The other features were great and the phone feature performed well enough. If someone wants phone first they should be looking to BlackBerry on Verizon (in the US).



    And as for your final sentence, weaseling a blanket statement stating that Apple releases low-quality products into a phone quality argument, when the iPhone 4 also happens to be an excellent phone, is horribly disingenuous.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davestall View Post


    But; it is the main reason Android is now outselling iphone and there are many more Android activations per day that IOS activations. Apple simply cant keep up. I know; apple doesnt care about market volume. Its a good thing.



    And you are completely wrong here. Unless Apple releases the iPhone to Verizon (and possibly other carriers) the Android platform will continue to grow at a pace faster than the iPhone. Note that you're comparing an OS to a device here, which is a little silly. Android is out-growing iPhone because it is the only high-quality multimedia smartphone OS available to OEM manufacturers (RIM and Microsoft may change this). It is available in phones ranging from high quality to bottom-feeding trash. It is also a fairly good product. Of course it is going to sell like hotcakes. It isn't so different from the Windows OS vs. Mac OS X circumstance.



    Incidentally, "Finally! The combined effort of every big phone producer in the phone market, making a range of low-end to high-end devices, has finally managed to activate more Android-based smartphones than a specific manufacturer's single device!" is, well, a little sad as a celebration. This is a naturally progression of the market under the current circumstances and reflects that Google has done a good job. Apple has as well. If Apple made the iOS platform available to OEM you would see a horribly different story, but that wouldn't be a good move for Apple, and its developers, at all.
  • davestalldavestall Posts: 45member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Xian Zhu Xuande View Post


    That was more responsible, so I'll reply.



    In early days the iPhone had a poor reputation for voice quality. Voice quality on the iPhone 4 is phenomenal, however, and it has also gradually improved as the device has grown. Unfortunately right now, in the United States, voice quality is held back by AT&T's network, which does not offer voice quality on par with Verizon. Dropped calls and reception are not top notch as is often the case with media smartphones. If you're referring to the 'Antennagate' nonsense, though, I don't buy it. The iPhone 4 has been one of the very most reliable phones I have ever owned, outside a high-end phone-feature-based phone I used to have on Verizon, which also offers a superior network in areas I have spent most my time in terms of call reliability. Despite conducting business regularly on the iPhone 4 I have dropped few calls, and this includes Manhattan and San Francisco. Speculation beyond this is speculation by definition as AT&T has chosen not to release the real numbers.



    In any case, I was content to use the original iPhone as well, despite knowing clear well that, compared to say, a good BlackBerry, its phone feature was immature. The other features were great and the phone feature performed well enough. If someone wants phone first they should be looking to BlackBerry on Verizon (in the US).



    And as for your final sentence, weaseling a blanket statement stating that Apple releases low-quality products into a phone quality argument, when the iPhone 4 also happens to be an excellent phone, is horribly disingenuous.





    And you are completely wrong here. Unless Apple releases the iPhone to Verizon (and possibly other carriers) the Android platform will continue to grow at a pace faster than the iPhone. Note that you're comparing an OS to a device here, which is a little silly. Android is out-growing iPhone because it is the only high-quality multimedia smartphone OS available to OEM manufacturers (RIM and Microsoft may change this). It is available in phones ranging from high quality to bottom-feeding trash. It is also a fairly good product. Of course it is going to sell like hotcakes. It isn't so different from the Windows OS vs. Mac OS X circumstance.



    Incidentally, "Finally! The combined effort of every big phone producer in the phone market, making a range of low-end to high-end devices, has finally managed to activate more Android-based smartphones than a specific manufacturer's single device!" is, well, a little sad as a celebration. This is a naturally progression of the market under the current circumstances and reflects that Google has done a good job. Apple has as well. If Apple made the iOS platform available to OEM you would see a horribly different story, but that wouldn't be a good move for Apple, and its developers, at all.



    You may also compare OS activations if you like which would include ipad, itouch and iphone for ois, and for android; well mostly phones. Android activations per day are significantly higher than ois activations. Apple is flat; android is in a steep growth curve. The end result is pretty obvious to me (and most analysis) unless apple makes a significant change to the "plan". Apples products are no longer better enough (or imho better at all) than the competition.
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