Mosque planned for ground zero.

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Comments

  • segoviussegovius Posts: 9,872member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cdgodin View Post


    If they treat EVERY new person like this I'm surprised people are still signing up.



    We could do with some new sign-ups it's true....preferably some non-Islamophobe right-wing fanatics.



    Unfortunately whatever new blood there is doesn't bring anything new to the table.



    Maybe people are just sheepish clones...or maybe they are the same posters under false names. Don't matter much...
  • cdgodincdgodin Posts: 12member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by segovius View Post


    Or perception and a frightening degree of almost quasi-psychic ability.



    The question is not whether the progressives label people in this way but rather whether they are right.... sad to say they have a pretty near 100% record so far....



    NEARLY, as in they're wrong about me.



    Back on-topic, I still think they shouldn't do that. Because as you guys said not all Muslims are terrorists but what about the people building this mosque? Are they terrorists or innocent Muslims?
  • segoviussegovius Posts: 9,872member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post


    Take two doses of reality and call me in the morning.



    I'm already on my third dose...



  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by segovius View Post


    Or perception and a frightening degree of almost quasi-psychic ability.



    The question is not whether the progressives label people in this way but rather whether they are right.... sad to say they have a pretty near 100% record so far....



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cdgodin View Post


    NEARLY, as in they're wrong about me.

    Back on-topic, I still think they shouldn't do that. Because as you guys said not all Muslims are terrorists but what about the people building this mosque? Are they terrorists or innocent Muslims?





    Well maybe some here have been quick to assume that you were someone else whom you claim not to be, but sometimes it's just too hard to tell.







    http://www.google.com/search?client=...UTF-8&oe=UTF-8



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cdgodin View Post


    [B]ut what about the people building this mosque? Are they terrorists or innocent Muslims?



    Been asked and answered?suggest that you do some research or read back on this thread. Also given your previous post cited below, you are either extremely intellectually challenged or bigoted or both.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cdgodin View Post


    I think that this would be a big slap in the face to the families of those who died on 9/11. Suppose, for example, that one of your loved ones was killed in 9/11. Would you want a Muslim mosque so close to where they died? I would presume NOT. And I also wonder why they have to build it so close to Ground Zero. Why not in the countryside or the like?



    Read the thread we had a discussion about the right under the 1st Amendment. Also support from other religious groups.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cdgodin View Post


    Eighty or so Muslims? I did not know that there were that much hijackers.



    Really dumb BIGOTED response to post that there were some 80 innocent Muslims who also died on 9/11. Some previous discussions:



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by segovius View Post


    Why does no-one ever mention the Muslims killed on 9/11 ? I think the numbers are unknown but there were certainly hundreds.



    If these Muslims were victims just like everyone else, and if they were not the kind of people who would fly planes into buildings then surely they are the same as anyone else? And surely that means there is no problem with the cultural centre UNLESS the organizers are the sort of people who fly planes into buildings themselves?



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post




    One of the Heros of 9/11

    Quote:

    Quote:

    Imagine being the family of Salman Hamdani. The 23-year-old New York City police cadet was a part-time ambulance driver, incoming medical student, and devout Muslim. When he disappeared on September 11, law enforcement officials came to his family, seeking him for questioning in relation to the terrorist attacks. They allegedly believed he was somehow involved. His whereabouts were undetermined for over six months, until his remains were finally identified. He was found near the North Tower, with his EMT medical bag beside him, presumably doing everything he could to help those in need. His family could finally rest, knowing that he died the hero they always knew him to b.



    http://islam.about.com/blvictims.htm






    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post


    It turns out that there used to be a prayer room in the South Tower of the WTC, on the 17th floor, used by Muslims on a regular basis. According to the article in the New York Times, some 60+ Muslims were killed in the attacks, people who were obviously not subscribers to the Odigo instant messaging service which received a tip off two hours before the attacks.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cdgodin View Post


    I am not racist. Try opening a Christain church in Mecca or one of the other Muslim holy cities. See what happens. And you still have not answered me why they can't open a Mosque somewhere else.



    Yeah maybe not a racist since Muslims can be from different races, you're just bigoted.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cdgodin View Post


    I am not this 'Camp David' person I am someone different. I have profiles on a lot of websites and all of them on this name. I have not registered here before and I am not a troll. And what is wrong with posting my own opinion? I seriously did not know that there were innocent Muslims who died on 9/11. And why because I am new do you AUTOMATICALLY assume I'm a troll?







    It's not because you're new that the assumption was made.
  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    By Henry Goldman - Sep 24, 2010 3:30 AM PT



    Quote:

    Four out of five voters in New York state agree Muslims have the right to build a mosque near the site of the Sept. 11 terrorist attack in Manhattan, yet 67 percent say they should voluntarily move it elsewhere, according to a Quinnipiac University poll.



    Attitudes toward the proposed Islamic center two blocks from Ground Zero split along party lines. Democrats said it would be appropriate, 50 percent to 34 percent; Republicans rejected it, 90 percent to 8 percent, and independents opposed it 63 percent to 30 percent.



    Quote:

    The proportion of voters who said the U.S. Constitution guarantees the Islamic group?s right to build near the World Trade Center site rose to 80 percent in the survey released today, from 54 percent in an Aug. 31 poll.



    Regardless of religious freedom, voters in the current survey preferred that the Islamic sponsors voluntarily relocate, 67 percent to 21 percent. Last month, voters said they wanted the Muslims to change their plans by 71 percent to 21 percent.



    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-0...poll-says.html



    The Quinnipiac University Survey



    http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1318.xml?ReleaseID=1506
  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    By ALEX ISENSTADT | 9/22/10 1:32 PM EDT



    Quote:

    North Carolina Republican Renee Ellmers is trying to jump-start her lagging congressional campaign with a fiery new ad slamming the proposed Islamic community center blocks from ground zero.



    The mosque debate has largely faded as a campaign issue since it burst onto the midterm landscape a little more than a month ago, but the spot marks a clear effort on Ellmers?s part to stoke the flames of an emotional issue and to bring attention to a campaign that has sputtered as of late. Ellmers won a brief wave of attention in June after YouTube video of Etheridge?s physical altercation with a questioner who stopped him on the sidewalk went viral.



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3R4yT...layer_embedded



    Posted by Brian Montopoli

    Quote:

    Renee Ellmers, who is trying to unseat Democratic Rep. Bob Etheridge in North Carolina, is out with an ad in which "the Muslims" and "the terrorists" seem to be used more or less interchangeably.



    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...07-503544.html



    Why more hate and hate mongering?
  • hands sandonhands sandon Posts: 5,270member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post


    By ALEX ISENSTADT | 9/22/10 1:32 PM EDT







    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3R4yT...layer_embedded



    Posted by Brian Montopoli

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...07-503544.html



    Why more hate and hate mongering?



    I bet she would happily carry a sign saying "Go Back To Africa Obama, I Want My Country Back".
  • segoviussegovius Posts: 9,872member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post


    I bet she would happily carry a sign saying "Go Back To Africa Obama, I Want My Country Back".



    I'm worried about the US right now...the mob is braying and advancing on the village with torches and pitchforks.



    I think we all know how the movie ends......
  • camp davidcamp david Posts: 692member
    Someone mention polls?



    Most New Yorkers still opposed to proposed 'Ground Zero' mosque: Poll

    http://news.oneindia.in/2010/09/25/m...d-zeromos.html

    New York, Sept 25 (ANI): About 57 percent of New Yorkers still believe that it is wrong to build the proposed Islamic community center and mosque two blocks away from the former World Trade Center site, while only 32 percent feel it's acceptable, according to a Quinnipiac University poll.



    And of course the loony Imam pushing the Ground Zero Mosque picks a convenient political target:



    Ground Zero mosque Imam blames Sarah Palin for 'growing Islamophobia'

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...amophobia.html

    The Muslim cleric behind plans to build a mosque close to the Ground Zero site has blamed politicians such as Sarah Palin for fuelling a "growing Islamophobia" that led to the burning of Korans on the ninth anniversary of the September 11 attacks.
  • segoviussegovius Posts: 9,872member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Camp David View Post


    And of course the loony Imam pushing the Ground Zero Mosque picks a convenient political target:



    Ground Zero mosque Imam blames Sarah Palin for 'growing Islamophobia'

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...amophobia.html

    The Muslim cleric behind plans to build a mosque close to the Ground Zero site has blamed politicians such as Sarah Palin for fuelling a "growing Islamophobia" that led to the burning of Korans on the ninth anniversary of the September 11 attacks.



    Stupid to blame her for Islamophobia - she is one of the racist/fascists on the extreme-right which is why the other fascists love her - she is tapping into their existing hatred.



    She does not cause Camp David's sickness for example. They are both just sufferers from the same disease.
  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Camp David View Post


    Someone mention polls?



    Most New Yorkers still opposed to proposed 'Ground Zero' mosque: Poll

    http://news.oneindia.in/2010/09/25/m...d-zeromos.html

    New York, Sept 25 (ANI): About 57 percent of New Yorkers still believe that it is wrong to build the proposed Islamic community center and mosque two blocks away from the former World Trade Center site, while only 32 percent feel it's acceptable, according to a Quinnipiac University poll.



    If you've been reading this thread---I posted this poll http://forums.appleinsider.com/showt...00#post1721700 and if you read what I posted you'd find:



    Quote:

    The proportion of voters who said the U.S. Constitution guarantees the Islamic group?s right to build near the World Trade Center site rose to 80 percent in the survey released today, from 54 percent in an Aug. 31 poll.



    Regardless of religious freedom, voters in the current survey preferred that the Islamic sponsors voluntarily relocate, 67 percent to 21 percent. Last month, voters said they wanted the Muslims to change their plans by 71 percent to 21 percent.



    Support for the right to build went up significantly over the period between the two surveys from 54% to 80%. As to whether the Park 51 complex should be built, there seems to be a drop in opposition, but with people like Palin, Ellmers, Jones and Newt stirring up hatred, it may take a long time for this to change.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Camp David View Post


    And of course the loony Imam pushing the Ground Zero Mosque picks a convenient political target:



    Ground Zero mosque Imam blames Sarah Palin for 'growing Islamophobia'

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...amophobia.html

    The Muslim cleric behind plans to build a mosque close to the Ground Zero site has blamed politicians such as Sarah Palin for fuelling a "growing Islamophobia" that led to the burning of Korans on the ninth anniversary of the September 11 attacks.



    Yeah, there's no reason to blame Palin.





    Sarah Palin's not-quite-a-word "refudiate" took Merriam-Webster's top searched "Word of the Summer."



    Quote:

    The political dispute over the mosque went national last Sunday, when Sarah Palin, the former Alaska governor and 2008 Republican vice presidential candidate, announced her opposition to it via Twitter.



    Quote:

    "Ground Zero Mosque supporters: doesn't it stab you in the heart, as it does ours throughout the heartland? Peaceful Muslims, pls refudiate,"



    Palin wrote, drawing ridicule for using the apparently invented word refudiate.



    She rewrote her post later, calling on
    Quote:

    "peace-seeking Muslims" to reject the mosque in the interest of national healing. "UNNECESSARY provocation,"



    she wrote of the mosque.



    Palin's comments drew a stern rebuke from Bloomberg, who has called efforts to derail the mosque un-American.



    Quote:

    "Sarah Palin has a right to her opinions, but I could not disagree more," Bloomberg said. "Everything the United States stands for, New York stands for, is tolerance and openness."





    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/nation/7118920.html
  • segoviussegovius Posts: 9,872member
    As an example of the sort of 'opposition' that some here are defending - calling a moderate Imam who works for peace 'loony' for example (btw, can you imagine how hard a task this guy must have? To fight extremism in his own religion and then after all that effort to be labelled ALONGSIDE them as insane? I have utmost respect for such people working for peace against hate on all sides...I could not do it) - here is a chilling video of a black man (not Muslim) who just happened to be at a demonstration against the CULTURAL CENTRE as a rabid crowd whipped themselves up into a frenzy and the mob spiralled out of control.



    Angry Crowd Lash Out at Black Man Because They Think He Is Muslim



    I am very much afraid that there will be more and more of this hate and bias. It seems the haters are now beyond all reason and just want blood.
  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    Scott Alexander:



    Quote:

    [I]n the controversy over the Park51 Project in lower Manhattan, the argument regarding the sensitivities of some of the families of 9/11 victims and first-responders, as well as other intensely hurt and angry U.S. Americans is dangerously misleading. However deep and real their grief, the narrative of those who express being outraged and deeply offended by the proposed Muslim community center is, I am sorry to say, deeply flawed. It has no moral validity unless one can prove that hardworking, deeply patriotic, and peace-loving U.S. American Muslims like Imam Faisal Rauf and his wife, Daisy Khan?leaders of the Park51 project?are no different than those who attacked the country they love on 9/11. Those who know them have testified that they embody the noblest aspirations of the vast majority of the U.S. and global Muslim community as they courageously and effectively struggle to stand up to a small but dangerous minority of extremists who would pervert their faith into a medium for hate.



    The narrative of the outraged has no moral validity unless one buys into the wildly paranoid and pathologically cynical fantasy that the broad swath of savvy, experienced, and upright interfaith and other community leaders in New York and across the country who actually know and interact daily with their Muslim fellow Americans are all unsuspecting dupes in an effort to advance the agenda of international terrorists. I speak of people like New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, Rabbi Burton Visotzky of the Jewish Theological Seminary, the members of Community Board 1 who overwhelmingly approved the project, Joan Brown Campbell of the Chautauqua Institution and former Secretary General of the National Council of Churches, and many others from around the country.



    In addition to muddying the waters of our civic discourse and making it appear to the rest of the Muslim world that U.S. Americans actually do despise Islam, the moral fallacy of the Park 51 controversy has had another sad consequence. It has silenced the voices of all those who have lost loved ones in the 9/11 attacks whose narrative departs from the narrative of fear and suspicion. What about the feelings and convictions of those mourners who believe that the building of Park51 will be a fitting tribute to their beloved dead?a monument to mutual understanding and U.S. American pluralist values which speaks a resounding ?no? to the violent, absolutist fanaticism of those who murdered their family members and friends?



    I am thinking about people like Donna Marsh O?Connor who lost her pregnant daughter Vanessa on 9/11 and who is a member of September Eleventh Families for Peaceful Tomorrows. In her support for the Park51 project, Ms. O?Connor has said publicly that
    Quote:

    ?the pain of individual people cannot, should not supersede our collective values and principles?the very things we argue our families died for. And if we embody the principles of what America is, then we will survive this, we will thrive, and we will be victors over the criminals who attacked our families on 9/11.?



    Are voices such as those of Ms. O?Connor and other like-minded 9/11 family members to be heard and weighed in the public discourse? Should not the narratives of these victims be juxtaposed to those that are dominating our collective consciousness, so that we can determine which seem to be more rooted in rationality, truth, and civic virtue? Or are we content to allow the media preoccupation with the darker side of human nature to inform our thinking? This issue is far too critical to the maintenance of a healthy civil society here at home for us to do the latter. It is also far too vital to our national security which is inexorably linked to the hope that Muslims around the world see us as credible partners in a struggle against global terror, rather than as a society at war with Islam.



    http://www.islamophobiatoday.com/201...1-controversy/



    Another fallacy that there were no Muslim Heros at Ground Zero:



    MOHAMMED SALMAN HAMDANI

    World Trade Center



    AN ALL-AMERICAN JEDI



    Quote:

    More than anything else, Mohammad Salman Hamdani wanted people to see him for who he truly was, not for who he seemed to be.



    He was an American citizen, and he hated it when his two younger brothers teased him by saying, "Why don't you go back to Pakistan," where he had been born. He could not say the same to them because they were born in the United States after his family immigrated when he was 13 months old.



    He wanted to be seen as an all-American kid. He wore No. 79 on the high school football team in Bayside, Queens, where he lived, and liked to be called Sal. When he graduated from Queens College in 2001 and did not get into an American medical school, he refused to apply to schools in any other country. He told his parents he intended to be an American doctor.



    He became a research assistant at Rockefeller University and drove an ambulance part time. One Christmas he sang in Handel's "Messiah" in Queens. He saw all the "Star Wars" movies, and it was well known that his new Honda was the one with "Yung Jedi" license plates.



    And yet, some people continued to see him as something he was not. After Mr. Hamdani, 23, disappeared on Sept. 11, ugly rumors circulated: he was a Muslim and worked in a lab; he might have been connected to a terrorist group. Months later the truth came out. Mr. Hamdani's remains had been found near the north tower, and he had gone there to help people he did not know.



    And then, at last, everyone could see Mr. Hamdani for what he truly was.



    Profile published in THE NEW YORK TIMES on March 8, 2003.



    http://islam.about.com/od/terrorism/...-11-Attack.htm
  • camp davidcamp david Posts: 692member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post


    Yeah, there's no reason to blame Palin...



    Pay close attention before you post; point I was making was the stupidity of the Ground Zero Imam attempting to blame Gov. Palin for a problem he caused! New Yorkers are against this mosque being built - blaming others for it just won't stand.
  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Camp David View Post




    And of course the loony Imam [FT comment: no hate to name calling] pushing the Ground Zero Mosque [FT comment: not at Ground Zero--near there but not there] picks a convenient political target [FT comment: can't refudiate that]:



    Ground Zero mosque Imam blames Sarah Palin for 'growing Islamophobia'

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...amophobia.html

    The Muslim cleric behind plans to build a mosque close to the Ground Zero site has blamed politicians such as Sarah Palin for fuelling a "growing Islamophobia" that led to the burning of Korans on the ninth anniversary of the September 11 attacks.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post




    Yeah, there's no reason to blame Palin.





    Sarah Palin's not-quite-a-word "refudiate" took Merriam-Webster's top searched "Word of the Summer."



    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/nation/7118920.html



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Camp David View Post


    Pay close attention before you post; point I was making was the stupidity of the Ground Zero Imam attempting to blame Gov. Palin for a problem he caused! New Yorkers are against this mosque being built - blaming others for it just won't stand.







    The point that I was making is THAT THE IMAM RAUF IS RIGHT. I dare you to "refudiate" that.



    From the Article you are refering:



    Quote:

    "What has happened is that..certain politicians decided that this project would be very useful for their political ambitions," Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf said, adding that this had prompted a "growing Islamophobia" in the US.



    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...amophobia.html



    IS HE INCORRECT in his statement? Please refer to the following--only a small sample:



    Quote:

    The political dispute over the mosque went national last Sunday, when Sarah Palin, the former Alaska governor and 2008 Republican vice presidential candidate, announced her opposition to it via Twitter.

    Quote:

    "Ground Zero Mosque supporters: doesn't it stab you in the heart, as it does ours throughout the heartland? Peaceful Muslims, pls refudiate,"



    Palin wrote, drawing ridicule for using the apparently invented word refudiate.



    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/nation/7118920.html



    Since you didn't emntion Newt in your comments I omitted the following from the same article:



    Gingrich latest among GOP to oppose NYC mosque

    By BETH FOUHY

    Associated Press

    July 21, 2010, 11:33PM



    Quote:

    NEW YORK ? Former U.S. House speaker Newt Gingrich on Wednesday announced his opposition to a planned mosque near ground zero, becoming the latest Republican leader to place the project on the national political stage.



    In a statement posted on his website, Gingrich, a potential 2012 presidential contender, said flatly, "No mosque." And he criticized Muslim leaders for suggesting the mosque's opponents are religiously intolerant.



    North Carolina voters send a message against hate and DO NOT VOTE FOR ELLMERS:



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QvKO...layer_embedded
  • camp davidcamp david Posts: 692member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post


    The point that I was making is THAT THE IMAM RAUF IS RIGHT. I dare you to "refudiate



    The Imam's claims from the very beginning was that the Ground Zero mosque would enhance and foster Muslim/Christian relations - he was wrong! The plans for this Mosque near Ground Zero have inflamed Americans against Islam - repudiating the Iman has already been done! It is extremely doubtful that this Al Qaeda New York base of ops centre will be built...
  • hands sandonhands sandon Posts: 5,270member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Camp David View Post


    The Imam's claims from the very beginning was that the Ground Zero mosque would enhance and foster Muslim/Christian relations - he was wrong! The plans for this Mosque near Ground Zero have inflamed Americans against Islam - repudiating the Iman has already been done! It is extremely doubtful that this Al Qaeda New York base of ops centre will be built...



    If it is built can we expect some Tearrorism from those who are upset about it?
  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Camp David View Post


    The Imam's claims from the very beginning was that the Ground Zero mosque would enhance and foster Muslim/Christian relations - he was wrong!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post


    The point that I was making is THAT THE IMAM RAUF IS RIGHT. I dare you to "refudiate" that.





    Again I must use a famous quote from Cool Hand Luke that I used is another post?might have been on this thread even:



    Quote:

    Captain, Road Prison 36: ?What we've got here is... failure to communicate.? from Cool Hand Luke (1967).....



    The point that I was making was the the Imam is correct in his assertion that Palin and others are the ones stirring up the furor. This is not to say that there weren't protest before, however it escalated when Palin and Newt threw their hats into the ring. Then you add in the Pastor from Florida who wanted to burn the Qur'an.



    I did not mean to imply that building the Park 51 Islamic Cultural Center was not controversial, however, I thought that we were a religiously tolerant Nation---but lately I seem to be proven wrong.



    Yes the Imam wanted to have the Park 51 Project as a show case of out reach and understanding---but he wasn't the one who caste the first stone. What should happen is wait until tempers cool down and then open a dialogue, but understand that the Park 51 Project should proceed at that location. A quote from a previous post above:



    Quote:

    [I]n the controversy over the Park51 Project in lower Manhattan, the argument regarding the sensitivities of some of the families of 9/11 victims and first-responders, as well as other intensely hurt and angry U.S. Americans is dangerously misleading. However deep and real their grief, the narrative of those who express being outraged and deeply offended by the proposed Muslim community center is, I am sorry to say, deeply flawed. It has no moral validity unless one can prove that hardworking, deeply patriotic, and peace-loving U.S. American Muslims like Imam Faisal Rauf and his wife, Daisy Khan?leaders of the Park51 project?are no different than those who attacked the country they love on 9/11. Those who know them have testified that they embody the noblest aspirations of the vast majority of the U.S. and global Muslim community as they courageously and effectively struggle to stand up to a small but dangerous minority of extremists who would pervert their faith into a medium for hate.



    The narrative of the outraged has no moral validity unless one buys into the wildly paranoid and pathologically cynical fantasy that the broad swath of savvy, experienced, and upright interfaith and other community leaders in New York and across the country who actually know and interact daily with their Muslim fellow Americans are all unsuspecting dupes in an effort to advance the agenda of international terrorists. I speak of people like New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, Rabbi Burton Visotzky of the Jewish Theological Seminary, the members of Community Board 1 who overwhelmingly approved the project, Joan Brown Campbell of the Chautauqua Institution and former Secretary General of the National Council of Churches, and many others from around the country.



    Quote:

    [T[he moral fallacy of the Park 51 controversy has had another sad consequence. It has silenced the voices of all those who have lost loved ones in the 9/11 attacks whose narrative departs from the narrative of fear and suspicion. What about the feelings and convictions of those mourners who believe that the building of Park51 will be a fitting tribute to their beloved dead?a monument to mutual understanding and U.S. American pluralist values which speaks a resounding ?no? to the violent, absolutist fanaticism of those who murdered their family members and friends?



    I am thinking about people like Donna Marsh O?Connor who lost her pregnant daughter Vanessa on 9/11 and who is a member of September Eleventh Families for Peaceful Tomorrows. In her support for the Park51 project, Ms. O?Connor has said publicly that



    Quote:

    ?the pain of individual people cannot, should not supersede our collective values and principles?the very things we argue our families died for. And if we embody the principles of what America is, then we will survive this, we will thrive, and we will be victors over the criminals who attacked our families on 9/11.?





    http://www.islamophobiatoday.com/201...1-controversy/





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Camp David View Post


    The plans for this Mosque near Ground Zero have inflamed Americans against Islam - repudiating the Iman has already been done! It is extremely doubtful that this Al Qaeda New York base of ops centre will be built...



    Just for the sake of argument, You're right the Imam is wrong in hoping from the ?very beginning was that the Ground Zero mosque would enhance and foster Muslim/Christian relations.? Is it wrong for him to have hoped? Do you deel better now that you have won an argument---think about what was won and what was lost. As a Nation we have failed. Then think about who are the ones doing this:















    NO HATE HERE--JUST ENVIRONMENTALIST TRYING TO SAVE THE TENNESSEE BOOBIE
  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    Sorry for the multiple post but AI/PO link was acting slow and couldn't tell if it posted the first time.
  • finetunesfinetunes Posts: 2,065member
    Sorry for the multiple post but AI/PO link was acting slow and couldn't tell if it posted the first time.
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