But I agree, specs-wise this phone is a dog. And apparently the OS doesn't help either -- no dual-core support in Q4 2011 - wtf?
I read somewhere they aren't going to be bringing multi-core in until Q4 2012.
Here is a question though... do you think they actually need dual cores? The OS runs on current gen hardware, so it doesn't need multi-core. There is no screen-mirroring like iOS and no "true multi-tasking" like Android.
Apple makes the ecosystem and OS fresh... confusing the clientele with too many multiple size phones aint in its game.
Apple makes the macbook pro in 3 sizes and the macbook air in two sizes, and has just recently discontinued the macbook plastic. not to mention the iPod: Touch, Nano, Shuffle, and Classic.
Apple is a great company that makes what sells, and there is definitely a market for huge 4.5"+ screen phones as well as super small phones.
There is nothing to sue for apple.These are no iPhone clones!
With this machines they do NOT steal design or IP from Apple!
Microsoft and Nokia are going the right way!
They try to be a fair competitor in this market.
Respect for that!
enough said!
iTommy don't let Tallest Skil get you going....he is trolling with no specifics...just blanket general statements. Then if you disagree......he turns the tables around on the person questioning his nonsense statement.
I recently played with my friend's phone with Windows Mobile Mango installed, and it was surprisingly very very good! I've had all iterations of the iPhone, and really do not like the jerky and being lost feel of Android phones, but this Windows Mobile Mango OS has got what it takes to make a lot of people believers.
I mean, it needs to get its App store shored up, but other than that, it is very responsive, very fluid, has some great ideas for the main screen where you can pin ANY item to it. As well, your contacts has all sources integrated with them (i.e. Phone number, email, facebook, linkedin, photostreams, etc, etc).
The items you pin on the main screen are active, for example, the weather widget shows current weather, your photostream updates or goes through different pictures, time ticks by, contacts will show updated info whether it is from text messages, emails, facebook updates, etc.
But overall, the feeling is smooth as butter, fresh, and new.
I really hope Apple starts looking at this phone before continuing iOS6 development.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtapps
I have not had the chance to play with w WinPhone yet. However I think after looking at the screens besides the clunky start screen it might be kind of neat.
I honestly hope that this does end up being a good phone. If Microsoft creates an excellent mobile to home environment interface like Apple has, we might actually have a real competitor to keep things interesting instead of just Droids empty flash with a few basic good ideas.The only reason droid has made it's mark is the number of phones that have been churned out and rushed, only maybe a hand full of these are worth note the rest are worthy of being the free phones you get when you open up a new account with a service provider.
With the windows phone that certainly looks like it's it's own best and not a clone, and with Nokia who did design some good phones back in the day. We might see real creativity enter back into the market instead of just improving what is already there, or just Apple creating and Droid cloning.
I say I welcome smart competition. lets hope this keeps things interesting.
I read somewhere they aren't going to be bringing multi-core in until Q4 2012.
Here is a question though... do you think they actually need dual cores? The OS runs on current gen hardware, so it doesn't need multi-core. There is no screen-mirroring like iOS and no "true multi-tasking" like Android.
Maybe for gaming?
My take on raw power is the following: Let's assume that your OS is very resource-efficient and doesn't need the extra power. Let's also assume that the interface is responsive enough. None of this will matter however, when we consider specific usage scenarios or use of third party applications. Games, as you point out, is one thing that will get affected. Multitasking is another. Heavier applications such as constant-on video messengers as Skype, or personal assistant software like Siri, will also not fly on weaker processors.
When you compare devices, you will want to consider running comparable applications on them, all the while maintaining your habits. Soon you will realize that no matter how efficient the OS is, a low-resolution screen will never give you good readability, lack of a front facing camera will make video telephony impossible, or lack of efficient multitasking will make your phone unresponsive when an incoming call coincides with an auto-scheduled app update while you're also playing an arcade game.
Yes, as anyone I also prefer the OS to be lightweight and not get in the way, but that does not relieve from the expectations for powerful hardware, because I know I am going to use it all anyway with third-party applications.
Apple makes the macbook pro in 3 sizes and the macbook air in two sizes, and has just recently discontinued the macbook plastic. not to mention the iPod: Touch, Nano, Shuffle, and Classic.
Apple is a great company that makes what sells, and there is definitely a market for huge 4.5"+ screen phones as well as super small phones.
... and right now we have three phones... 3GS, 4 and 4S. Now add to that mix another 3 phones which is what you are suggesting. Even if the 3GS was removed you are still talking 5 phones. Not Apple's style.
Add to that the outlook from the developer's view... working with different resolutions in iOS is a totally different thing than having 3 different sized notebooks.
... and, in my opinion, the market for a huge 4.5" iPhone is very limited. Around 4" will work perfectly to fill the need for a larger screen.
What's obvious is you don't know your ass from a hole in the wall.
Microsoft was slow out of the gate watching and waiting like a predator. They "were" the only game in the smartphone market for years. Then iOS happened which took the smartphone market in a completely new direction. A direction Microsoft wasn't prepared for. 5 years later they have deployed Windows Phone 7.5 Mango (a great but young mobile OS)and have essentially purchased a phone manufacturer (Nokia). Over the next 12 months we're going to see a "sleeping giant" enter the mobile phone arena.
iOS and Android have a lot to fear.
Where have I seen this post before..oh yeah, before every single product Microsoft (or anyone else non-Apple for that matter) has released over the past 10 years. Absolutely hilarious. Yes, things can change and noone knows what the future holds. But these 'sleeping giant' posts are idiotic, especially after all these years. I can't see these being threats to iPhones in any way, shape, or form. What, the Nokia hardware is going to turn the tide? Nokia doesn't have a shadow of the brand power it once did. And Win 7 phones have been a market failure so far. I don't see whats changed.
Where have I seen this post before..oh yeah, before every single product Microsoft (or anyone else non-Apple for that matter) has released over the past 10 years. Absolutely hilarious. Yes, things can change and noone knows what the future holds. But these 'sleeping giant' posts are idiotic, especially after all these years. I can't see these being threats to iPhones in any way, shape, or form. What, the Nokia hardware is going to turn the tide? Nokia doesn't have a shadow of the brand power it once did. And Win 7 phones have been a market failure so far. I don't see whats changed.
Because WP is not a rip off of iOS. About the only thing it has similar to an iPhone is a touch screen. As long as they don't use the same UI, pinch-to-zoom, slide-to-unlock, or other elements that have Apple patents, there isn't anything for Apple to sue them over.
Sure Windows Phone is another "me too" product because they're unable to dream up new concepts on their own, but for what might be the 1st time in their history, they've designed their own UI instead of ripping off someone else's.
Inferior to what? For the price range this phone is competing in (~iP 3GS), it is quite decent.
But I agree, specs-wise this phone is a dog. And apparently the OS doesn't help either -- no dual-core support in Q4 2011 - wtf?
Is "dual-core" simply a check-box on your shopping list? Or do you believe there's some function that can't be performed properly on a single core system? Note that I'm not trying to pick a fight. I've just heard a bunch of folks hankering for a dual-core CPU, but without stating why they think it's necessary. I do honestly want to know.
Where have I seen this post before..oh yeah, before every single product Microsoft (or anyone else non-Apple for that matter) has released over the past 10 years. Absolutely hilarious. Yes, things can change and noone knows what the future holds. But these 'sleeping giant' posts are idiotic, especially after all these years. I can't see these being threats to iPhones in any way, shape, or form. What, the Nokia hardware is going to turn the tide? Nokia doesn't have a shadow of the brand power it once did. And Win 7 phones have been a market failure so far. I don't see whats changed.
I agree...I have played around with a couple Win 7 phones. They are nice and the OS is actually not bad. BUT it does not come close to IOS or Android. For MS and Nokia to turn the mobile space on its ear and change the current market order they would have to release something very new and combine hardware and software that would capture the publics attention. I just don't see this happening....it could...but not probable.
No way it's the last bullet. They still have Windows 8/9 which can be put in phones in 2013/2014. Everything about MS boils down to Windows and Office. That's the center of MS' universe. I think they will put Windows 8 or its successor on phones, including a version of Office. Not the crap WM Office. Actual MS Office, only with the UI dumbed down for the smaller screen.
What's the point of putting desktop OS / app suite on mobile phone ? MS already tried this, with Windows Mobile 5-6, and proved this is non option. Their developer base is of little use there, as they are used to develop desktop software. Mobile software is not dumbed down version of desktop software. What you want to do with MS Office on mobile phone to make it that important ? If you want to overview document and make a simple edit, you can already do it now. You won't be creating your next Office document on 2013 mobile phone.
iTommy don't let Tallest Skil get you going....he is trolling with no specifics...just blanket general statements. Then if you disagree......he turns the tables around on the person questioning his nonsense statement.
Again, putting your post into context for those who've just tuned in, this is a comment from a guy who refuses to believe that anyone on the planet could own an iPhone without having paid a telecom to get one.
And that's why he's all whiny and defensive around me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mytdave
Because WP is not a rip off of iOS.
I said absolutely nothing about the software. It would be a hardware lawsuit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iTommy
There is nothing to sue for apple.These are no iPhone clones!
Never said they were. Never implied they were. Don't make crap up.
Quote:
With this machines they do NOT steal design or IP from Apple!
+=
Quote:
Microsoft and Nokia are going the right way!
Microsoft is. Absolutely.
Quote:
They try to be a fair competitor in this market.
And Microsoft is doing a VERY good job of it; you're absolutely right.
My take on raw power is the following: Let's assume that your OS is very resource-efficient and doesn't need the extra power. Let's also assume that the interface is responsive enough. None of this will matter however, when we consider specific usage scenarios or use of third party applications. Games, as you point out, is one thing that will get affected. Multitasking is another. Heavier applications such as constant-on video messengers as Skype, or personal assistant software like Siri, will also not fly on weaker processors.
When you compare devices, you will want to consider running comparable applications on them, all the while maintaining your habits. Soon you will realize that no matter how efficient the OS is, a low-resolution screen will never give you good readability, lack of a front facing camera will make video telephony impossible, or lack of efficient multitasking will make your phone unresponsive when an incoming call coincides with an auto-scheduled app update while you're also playing an arcade game.
Yes, as anyone I also prefer the OS to be lightweight and not get in the way, but that does not relieve from the expectations for powerful hardware, because I know I am going to use it all anyway with third-party applications.
So much in your post. Let me ramble for a bit...
All of the scenarios you describe are also great users of battery capacity. This is a mobile device with limited capabilities. Everything is a compromise to battery life.
Certainly games would be better satisfied with a separate GPU, rather than a multi-core CPU. Siri would probably work on an iPhone 4 just fine. Certainly the original app ran well on the single core iPhone 4. I think Apple is restricting it to the iPhone 4S as an incentive to upgrade and nothing else. Video teleconferencing? Really? I've not heard of anybody actually using Apple's FaceTime. A front-facing camera just seems like another checklist item rather than a real usable feature. As to the low-resolution screen, it's a resolution specified by Microsoft. I don't think it's particularly low-res. And having a single resolution size makes programming much easier. Android programmers have to contend with dozens of different screen sizes. What a pain. I like having the screen size controlled by Microsoft. Finally, your concerns about multitasking. First thing to note is that Microsoft will never allow complete, true multitasking - that is allowing background apps to do whatever they dang well please. There will always be a limited subset of functions allowed. And they will be prioritized. There's no way an incoming phone call would be dropped because the phone was too busy playing music in the background. The music app would simply be suspended.
They're nice looking phones, but they're not going to be a match for the iPhones (3GS, 4, 4S), (or Android) because at this point Windows Phone is a new platform, hasn't sold well at all and doesn't have an ecosystem grown around them - MS will pour billions and billions at it and eventually like they did with the Xbox and 360 they'll eventually buy their way in to an extent but it'll take alot of time and money.
Amazing the higher end 800 doesn't have a forward facing camera, kind of blows the mind considering the target audience, its the younger, hipper audience that uses it (and the N9 has one).
No announcements for US deliveries, which is really weird - they purposely kept the N9 out of the US so they could immediately sell their new Windows phones supposedly - but that isn't happening.
In the end Nokia is just a WP OEM (misguided strategy in my opinion) where their main competition is actually the other WP vendors HTC, Motorola and Samsung and that is not a good margin future.
I agree...I have played around with a couple Win 7 phones. They are nice and the OS is actually not bad. BUT it does not come close to IOS or Android. For MS and Nokia to turn the mobile space on its ear and change the current market order they would have to release something very new and combine hardware and software that would capture the publics attention. I just don't see this happening....it could...but not probable.
Could you please elaborate on "BUT it does not come close to iOS or Android"?
Comments
But I agree, specs-wise this phone is a dog. And apparently the OS doesn't help either -- no dual-core support in Q4 2011 - wtf?
I read somewhere they aren't going to be bringing multi-core in until Q4 2012.
Here is a question though... do you think they actually need dual cores? The OS runs on current gen hardware, so it doesn't need multi-core. There is no screen-mirroring like iOS and no "true multi-tasking" like Android.
Maybe for gaming?
The 800 will survive. The 710 will disappear by the weekend.
If it cost more I would agree, but it's approaching feature-phone pricing.
What other $375 phone would you buy instead of the 710?
Apple makes the ecosystem and OS fresh... confusing the clientele with too many multiple size phones aint in its game.
Apple makes the macbook pro in 3 sizes and the macbook air in two sizes, and has just recently discontinued the macbook plastic. not to mention the iPod: Touch, Nano, Shuffle, and Classic.
Apple is a great company that makes what sells, and there is definitely a market for huge 4.5"+ screen phones as well as super small phones.
It's not going to take Apple six months to sue the pants off of Nokia for this design.
Why? What will be the points of contention?
There is nothing to sue for apple.These are no iPhone clones!
With this machines they do NOT steal design or IP from Apple!
Microsoft and Nokia are going the right way!
They try to be a fair competitor in this market.
Respect for that!
enough said!
iTommy don't let Tallest Skil get you going....he is trolling with no specifics...just blanket general statements. Then if you disagree......he turns the tables around on the person questioning his nonsense statement.
I mean, it needs to get its App store shored up, but other than that, it is very responsive, very fluid, has some great ideas for the main screen where you can pin ANY item to it. As well, your contacts has all sources integrated with them (i.e. Phone number, email, facebook, linkedin, photostreams, etc, etc).
The items you pin on the main screen are active, for example, the weather widget shows current weather, your photostream updates or goes through different pictures, time ticks by, contacts will show updated info whether it is from text messages, emails, facebook updates, etc.
But overall, the feeling is smooth as butter, fresh, and new.
I really hope Apple starts looking at this phone before continuing iOS6 development.
I have not had the chance to play with w WinPhone yet. However I think after looking at the screens besides the clunky start screen it might be kind of neat.
I honestly hope that this does end up being a good phone. If Microsoft creates an excellent mobile to home environment interface like Apple has, we might actually have a real competitor to keep things interesting instead of just Droids empty flash with a few basic good ideas.The only reason droid has made it's mark is the number of phones that have been churned out and rushed, only maybe a hand full of these are worth note the rest are worthy of being the free phones you get when you open up a new account with a service provider.
With the windows phone that certainly looks like it's it's own best and not a clone, and with Nokia who did design some good phones back in the day. We might see real creativity enter back into the market instead of just improving what is already there, or just Apple creating and Droid cloning.
I say I welcome smart competition. lets hope this keeps things interesting.
I read somewhere they aren't going to be bringing multi-core in until Q4 2012.
Here is a question though... do you think they actually need dual cores? The OS runs on current gen hardware, so it doesn't need multi-core. There is no screen-mirroring like iOS and no "true multi-tasking" like Android.
Maybe for gaming?
My take on raw power is the following: Let's assume that your OS is very resource-efficient and doesn't need the extra power. Let's also assume that the interface is responsive enough. None of this will matter however, when we consider specific usage scenarios or use of third party applications. Games, as you point out, is one thing that will get affected. Multitasking is another. Heavier applications such as constant-on video messengers as Skype, or personal assistant software like Siri, will also not fly on weaker processors.
When you compare devices, you will want to consider running comparable applications on them, all the while maintaining your habits. Soon you will realize that no matter how efficient the OS is, a low-resolution screen will never give you good readability, lack of a front facing camera will make video telephony impossible, or lack of efficient multitasking will make your phone unresponsive when an incoming call coincides with an auto-scheduled app update while you're also playing an arcade game.
Yes, as anyone I also prefer the OS to be lightweight and not get in the way, but that does not relieve from the expectations for powerful hardware, because I know I am going to use it all anyway with third-party applications.
Apple makes the macbook pro in 3 sizes and the macbook air in two sizes, and has just recently discontinued the macbook plastic. not to mention the iPod: Touch, Nano, Shuffle, and Classic.
Apple is a great company that makes what sells, and there is definitely a market for huge 4.5"+ screen phones as well as super small phones.
... and right now we have three phones... 3GS, 4 and 4S. Now add to that mix another 3 phones which is what you are suggesting. Even if the 3GS was removed you are still talking 5 phones. Not Apple's style.
Add to that the outlook from the developer's view... working with different resolutions in iOS is a totally different thing than having 3 different sized notebooks.
... and, in my opinion, the market for a huge 4.5" iPhone is very limited. Around 4" will work perfectly to fill the need for a larger screen.
Now... back to regular programming.
What's obvious is you don't know your ass from a hole in the wall.
Microsoft was slow out of the gate watching and waiting like a predator. They "were" the only game in the smartphone market for years. Then iOS happened which took the smartphone market in a completely new direction. A direction Microsoft wasn't prepared for. 5 years later they have deployed Windows Phone 7.5 Mango (a great but young mobile OS)and have essentially purchased a phone manufacturer (Nokia). Over the next 12 months we're going to see a "sleeping giant" enter the mobile phone arena.
iOS and Android have a lot to fear.
Where have I seen this post before..oh yeah, before every single product Microsoft (or anyone else non-Apple for that matter) has released over the past 10 years. Absolutely hilarious. Yes, things can change and noone knows what the future holds. But these 'sleeping giant' posts are idiotic, especially after all these years. I can't see these being threats to iPhones in any way, shape, or form. What, the Nokia hardware is going to turn the tide? Nokia doesn't have a shadow of the brand power it once did. And Win 7 phones have been a market failure so far. I don't see whats changed.
Where have I seen this post before..oh yeah, before every single product Microsoft (or anyone else non-Apple for that matter) has released over the past 10 years. Absolutely hilarious. Yes, things can change and noone knows what the future holds. But these 'sleeping giant' posts are idiotic, especially after all these years. I can't see these being threats to iPhones in any way, shape, or form. What, the Nokia hardware is going to turn the tide? Nokia doesn't have a shadow of the brand power it once did. And Win 7 phones have been a market failure so far. I don't see whats changed.
Ballmer has stopped laughing?
Why?
:filler:
Because WP is not a rip off of iOS. About the only thing it has similar to an iPhone is a touch screen. As long as they don't use the same UI, pinch-to-zoom, slide-to-unlock, or other elements that have Apple patents, there isn't anything for Apple to sue them over.
Sure Windows Phone is another "me too" product because they're unable to dream up new concepts on their own, but for what might be the 1st time in their history, they've designed their own UI instead of ripping off someone else's.
Inferior to what? For the price range this phone is competing in (~iP 3GS), it is quite decent.
But I agree, specs-wise this phone is a dog. And apparently the OS doesn't help either -- no dual-core support in Q4 2011 - wtf?
Is "dual-core" simply a check-box on your shopping list? Or do you believe there's some function that can't be performed properly on a single core system? Note that I'm not trying to pick a fight. I've just heard a bunch of folks hankering for a dual-core CPU, but without stating why they think it's necessary. I do honestly want to know.
Where have I seen this post before..oh yeah, before every single product Microsoft (or anyone else non-Apple for that matter) has released over the past 10 years. Absolutely hilarious. Yes, things can change and noone knows what the future holds. But these 'sleeping giant' posts are idiotic, especially after all these years. I can't see these being threats to iPhones in any way, shape, or form. What, the Nokia hardware is going to turn the tide? Nokia doesn't have a shadow of the brand power it once did. And Win 7 phones have been a market failure so far. I don't see whats changed.
I agree...I have played around with a couple Win 7 phones. They are nice and the OS is actually not bad. BUT it does not come close to IOS or Android. For MS and Nokia to turn the mobile space on its ear and change the current market order they would have to release something very new and combine hardware and software that would capture the publics attention. I just don't see this happening....it could...but not probable.
No way it's the last bullet. They still have Windows 8/9 which can be put in phones in 2013/2014. Everything about MS boils down to Windows and Office. That's the center of MS' universe. I think they will put Windows 8 or its successor on phones, including a version of Office. Not the crap WM Office. Actual MS Office, only with the UI dumbed down for the smaller screen.
What's the point of putting desktop OS / app suite on mobile phone ? MS already tried this, with Windows Mobile 5-6, and proved this is non option. Their developer base is of little use there, as they are used to develop desktop software. Mobile software is not dumbed down version of desktop software. What you want to do with MS Office on mobile phone to make it that important ? If you want to overview document and make a simple edit, you can already do it now. You won't be creating your next Office document on 2013 mobile phone.
iTommy don't let Tallest Skil get you going....he is trolling with no specifics...just blanket general statements. Then if you disagree......he turns the tables around on the person questioning his nonsense statement.
Again, putting your post into context for those who've just tuned in, this is a comment from a guy who refuses to believe that anyone on the planet could own an iPhone without having paid a telecom to get one.
And that's why he's all whiny and defensive around me.
Because WP is not a rip off of iOS.
I said absolutely nothing about the software. It would be a hardware lawsuit.
There is nothing to sue for apple.These are no iPhone clones!
Never said they were. Never implied they were. Don't make crap up.
With this machines they do NOT steal design or IP from Apple!
Microsoft and Nokia are going the right way!
Microsoft is. Absolutely.
They try to be a fair competitor in this market.
And Microsoft is doing a VERY good job of it; you're absolutely right.
My take on raw power is the following: Let's assume that your OS is very resource-efficient and doesn't need the extra power. Let's also assume that the interface is responsive enough. None of this will matter however, when we consider specific usage scenarios or use of third party applications. Games, as you point out, is one thing that will get affected. Multitasking is another. Heavier applications such as constant-on video messengers as Skype, or personal assistant software like Siri, will also not fly on weaker processors.
When you compare devices, you will want to consider running comparable applications on them, all the while maintaining your habits. Soon you will realize that no matter how efficient the OS is, a low-resolution screen will never give you good readability, lack of a front facing camera will make video telephony impossible, or lack of efficient multitasking will make your phone unresponsive when an incoming call coincides with an auto-scheduled app update while you're also playing an arcade game.
Yes, as anyone I also prefer the OS to be lightweight and not get in the way, but that does not relieve from the expectations for powerful hardware, because I know I am going to use it all anyway with third-party applications.
So much in your post. Let me ramble for a bit...
All of the scenarios you describe are also great users of battery capacity. This is a mobile device with limited capabilities. Everything is a compromise to battery life.
Certainly games would be better satisfied with a separate GPU, rather than a multi-core CPU. Siri would probably work on an iPhone 4 just fine. Certainly the original app ran well on the single core iPhone 4. I think Apple is restricting it to the iPhone 4S as an incentive to upgrade and nothing else. Video teleconferencing? Really? I've not heard of anybody actually using Apple's FaceTime. A front-facing camera just seems like another checklist item rather than a real usable feature. As to the low-resolution screen, it's a resolution specified by Microsoft. I don't think it's particularly low-res. And having a single resolution size makes programming much easier. Android programmers have to contend with dozens of different screen sizes. What a pain. I like having the screen size controlled by Microsoft. Finally, your concerns about multitasking. First thing to note is that Microsoft will never allow complete, true multitasking - that is allowing background apps to do whatever they dang well please. There will always be a limited subset of functions allowed. And they will be prioritized. There's no way an incoming phone call would be dropped because the phone was too busy playing music in the background. The music app would simply be suspended.
Amazing the higher end 800 doesn't have a forward facing camera, kind of blows the mind considering the target audience, its the younger, hipper audience that uses it (and the N9 has one).
No announcements for US deliveries, which is really weird - they purposely kept the N9 out of the US so they could immediately sell their new Windows phones supposedly - but that isn't happening.
In the end Nokia is just a WP OEM (misguided strategy in my opinion) where their main competition is actually the other WP vendors HTC, Motorola and Samsung and that is not a good margin future.
Inferior to what? For the price range this phone is competing in (~iP 3GS), it is quite decent.
It's 420? which is $584. That's below, but in the range of the iPhone 4S, not the iPhone 3GS.
I agree...I have played around with a couple Win 7 phones. They are nice and the OS is actually not bad. BUT it does not come close to IOS or Android. For MS and Nokia to turn the mobile space on its ear and change the current market order they would have to release something very new and combine hardware and software that would capture the publics attention. I just don't see this happening....it could...but not probable.
Could you please elaborate on "BUT it does not come close to iOS or Android"?