Apple stalls Apple TV shipments ahead of iPad 3-compatible refresh

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  • applezillaapplezilla Posts: 941member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by archer75 View Post


    Personally i'd like to see 1080p and support for Dolby TrueHD and DTS-MA HD.



    I have no interest in streaming apples content, but I have gobs of my own bluray rips that i'd like to play on it.



    I want all that too, but if they meet those specs, they should build it into their own content. I bought a Blu-Ray player a couple of years ago and a couple of dozen titles, but we rarely handle our little silver discs.



    I ripped our Blu-Rays and many of our DVDs. Now they gather dust.
  • soundvisionsoundvision Posts: 148member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Cory Bauer View Post


    Really hope the new Apple TV hardware doesn't pack one new killer feature that Apple won't provide to previous generations, like they did with Airplay and TV rentals with the last hardware refresh. I had an original Apple TV, and had to buy the new one to get those features; then they killed TV rentals.



    Of course Apple is going to come out with a killer feature that leaves behind the old AppleTV. If not, then why would they make it.



    You know how the game is played, be prepared to pony up another $99.
  • mr. hmr. h Posts: 4,652member, moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Atashi View Post


    it's annoying to have to leave my computer turned on, logged on, and with iTunes running. Particularily as they made a big deal about the ATV2 being such a low-energy device



    A netbook makes a very good low-power iTunes server. Mine running Windows 7, actively streaming content from its internal HDD using iTunes consumes just under 5 watts (including mains power adaptor, screen and WiFi off; netbook is connected to wireless router via an ethernet cable); that's less than the wireless router!



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by paxman View Post


    I'd like to see either the ability to attach an external HD to the ATV or else the ability to access content stored on an AirDisk or AirCapsule on the network.



    I find it frustrating that Apple has been missing this trick for so long. AirCapsules should come with iTunes server capabilities built-in.



    I've been looking forward to Apple TV 3 for a while. I'm going to be pissed if it still resamples all audio to 48 kHz
  • cory bauercory bauer Posts: 1,286member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 11thIndian View Post


    As I've mentioned in other threads, Apple has already been working on this in the pro video world with ProRes422. ProRes is a widely accepted mastering format that has replaced, in a lot of cases, the need for delivering uncompressed video files to broadcasters. ProRes422 is only 1/4 the size of a similar uncompressed file- but delivers a picture indistinguishable to the naked eye.



    I'm VERY interested to see how in depth Apple goes into explaining this on Wednesday.



    Pro-Res has definitely eliminated the need for absurdly large uncompressed video files; a 30 second 8-bit uncompressed SD file would be like 900MB, while a 30 second 1080p Pro-Res LT file is closer to 250MB. But Pro-Res is still huge by streaming standards. A 90-minute movie saved as Pro-Res LT would be almost 60GB. Pro-Res Proxy cuts that number in half, but compression artifacts and loss of quality with Proxy is very obvious.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Soundvision View Post


    Of course Apple is going to come out with a killer feature that leaves behind the old AppleTV. If not, then why would they make it.



    You know how the game is played, be prepared to pony up another $99.



    What I meant was it'd be nice if the new Apple TV had a half-dozen or more killer new features, instead of only one. Replacing old hardware with significantly better new hardware is easy; it's when the new stuff is almost identical apart from a feature or two that it becomes irritating.
  • solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Atashi View Post


    I'm probably not the typical customer Apple's targeting with the ATV2 or rumoured ATV3, but I would love to see an ATV3 that had some onboard storage again. I primarily use my ATV for viewing my own content, and it's annoying to have to leave my computer turned on, logged on, and with iTunes running. Particularily as they made a big deal about the ATV2 being such a low-energy device, yet for me at least it's useless without an iMac chugging away in the background.!



    I think Apple is moving away from the complexity of having AppleTV content stored on and off the device. From my particular PoV this is annoying but from theirs this makes sense for many reasons.



    As for getting more storage I can see the AppleTV being 16 or 32GB if it's 1080p and/or if it will be designed with an App Store in mind, but I think 16GB is most likely.



    Also, if you don't want to keep you rMac and want to sync content from iTunes just put it on your iPhone, Touch or iPad and then use AirPlay. This is really the best way to control content going through the AppleTV.
  • haarhaar Posts: 509member
    apple tend to be "safe" in thier ads.. i wonder why they messed up by not having the people in the ad wearing lifejackets?... in Canada, not having an emergency kit on your boat or sea- doo is a 250 federal ticket for each missing item. so i would assume that it is at least 250 dollars a person that isn't wearing a lifejacket. (i wear a lifejacket on a sea-doo at all times, and I have the required operators licence).



    or to sum up (perhaps off topic), BTW for a powered boat ( not sure of self-powered vessels)..



    A. Transport Canada reports the following:

    Not having enough approved life jackets on board will result in a $200 fine;

    Careless operation will result in a $200 fine;

    Speeding will result in a $100 fine;

    Allowing someone under age to operate a boat will result in a $250 fine;

    Operating a boat if you are under age will result in a $100 fine;

    Operating a boat without a working muffle in good condition will result in a $100 fine;

    Towing someone without a spotter will result in a $100 fine.
  • jlanddjlandd Posts: 831member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by robogobo View Post


    Everytime the hype about the Apple TV television/ iTV dies down, I realize how silly the idea is, and doubt that Apple is actually going to ship it. It doesn't make sense to integrate into a television when everyone already has dirt cheap tvs. The current Apple TV black box config is perfect: plug and play. All that's needed is better content. The hardware doesn't matter in this case.



    I agree, although this doesn't mean that developments aren't going on behind the curtain in the content dept. But I'm with you insofar as I have a box (well, a Roku, but the point is the same), attached via HDMI to a TV, which gets wifi from my router. The TV, two years old, is big enough and has more more ins and outs than I use (actually I don't use any). I'm set. At this stage content is the only upgrade or downgrade I would do. And not because there's nothing conceivable in a new hardware box that would be an improvement, just that I'm done, finished, not clogging my brain with it, I'm all set. The only change would involve content.
  • mr. hmr. h Posts: 4,652member, moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 11thIndian View Post


    Apple has to compromise on data-rate for the purposes of delivery.



    The question is, with better processors than you find in a blu-ray player, can Apple delivery nearly indistinguishable picture quality at 1/4 the file size.



    As I've mentioned in other threads, Apple has already been working on this in the pro video world with ProRes422.



    From wikipedia, concerning ProRes422:
    • Normal 147 Mbit/s and High-Quality 220 Mbit/s for HD resolution at 60i

    • Normal 42 Mbit/s and High-Quality 63 Mbit/s for SD resolution at 29.97

    ProRes can't help, and neither can the thoery behind ProRes. ProRes was engineered from the ground up to have low CPU demands for decode/playback without sacrificing compression ratio.



    When it comes to low bit-rates, high-profile H.264 is still where it's at. As such, if a 1080p video file has a lower bitrate than the same video on Blu-Ray, the lower bitrate one will inevitably have lower picture quality, assuming both came from the same master original.
  • mex4ericmex4eric Posts: 48member
    Attach your cable box to the inputs of one ATV3 and receive the video on any other ATV3s wirelessly. Eliminate the ugly cables. Apple is all about streaming, not storage, so in home streaming to supplement iTunes streaming. 1080p in home and still 720p from iTunes due to internet limits. Also becomes an HDMI switch. Plus a few more non-Apple internet sources of video.



    Sonos already does this for audio.
  • solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 11thIndian View Post


    A typical SD movie on iTunes is about 1.2GB, and HD movie is about 4.5 (4x the pixels). I was postulating that using the same codec, a 1080 movie would be 4x again or about 12GB.



    I don't see that happening. When Apple moves to 1080p I expect either hovering near but higher than the current Mbps but offering them at no additional charge or going about double the Mbps (9-10GB for typical movie) and charging an extra dollar. Yes, both my scenarios unfortunately include less data per pixel than with 720p. from iTS.
  • 11thindian11thindian Posts: 181member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Cory Bauer View Post


    Pro-Res has definitely eliminated the need for absurdly large uncompressed video files; a 30 second 8-bit uncompressed SD file would be like 900MB, while a 30 second 1080p Pro-Res LT file is closer to 250MB. But Pro-Res is still huge by streaming standards. A 90-minute movie saved as Pro-Res LT would be almost 60GB. Pro-Res Proxy cuts that number in half, but compression artifacts and loss of quality with Proxy is very obvious.







    What I meant was it'd be nice if the new Apple TV had a half-dozen or more killer new features, instead of only one. Replacing old hardware with significantly better new hardware is easy; it's when the new stuff is almost identical apart from a feature or two that it becomes irritating.



    I'm not suggesting they're actually going to use ProRes. I seem to remember an article from a couple years ago about Apple toying with a consumer oriented version of the same idea.



    But essentially what it comes down to is that in order to deliver a high quality file, you either need to send a large amount of data



    OR a smaller file with a much more processor intensive codec like ProRes, which I'm figuring is why Apple has waited so long to deliver 1080p. The processors needed to be fast enough to decode the files in near real time.
  • hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 11,885member, moderator
    I'm preparing to buy an ATV 3 at launch. Probably buying a nice low end 40 or 42" this week or early next week.



    All I'm looking for is



    16GB of NAND storage

    Bluetooth 4.0

    A5 processing

    NAS support
  • irelandireland Posts: 15,572member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Atashi View Post


    I'm probably not the typical customer Apple's targeting with the ATV2 or rumoured ATV3, but I would love to see an ATV3 that had some onboard storage again.



    I'm personally glad it has no storage. I like not having to think about that.
  • irelandireland Posts: 15,572member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Cory Bauer View Post


    Really hope the new Apple TV hardware doesn't pack one new killer feature that Apple won't provide to previous generations, like they did with Airplay and TV rentals with the last hardware refresh. I had an original Apple TV, and had to buy the new one to get those features; then they killed TV rentals.



    To play devil's advocate Apple didn't kill the rentals. The idiotic studios did.
  • tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 40,379member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    I'm personally glad it has no storage. I like not having to think about that.



    No, you just have to think about wasting electricity and making sure you have your computer on and iTunes open for absolutely no reason.
  • irelandireland Posts: 15,572member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Aizmov View Post


    A5X for updated AppleTV

    A6 for iPad 3

    ???



    This is what I'm hoping for.
  • irelandireland Posts: 15,572member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by kent909 View Post


    I'd like to see an Apple TV App store.



    That's one thing Apple TV won't be getting. Expect that to be an iTV-exclusive feature.
  • hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 11,885member, moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 11thIndian View Post


    I'm not suggesting they're actually going to use ProRes. I seem to remember an article from a couple years ago about Apple toying with a consumer oriented version of the same idea.



    But essentially what it comes down to is that in order to deliver a high quality file, you either need to send a large amount of data



    OR a smaller file with a much more processor intensive codec like ProRes, which I'm figuring is why Apple has waited so long to deliver 1080p. The processors needed to be fast enough to decode the files in near real time.



    ProRes is really a feature for video pros that need to have a high quality format for view dailies and sending basically "proofs" around. It was never intended to be a codec for content delivery to consumers.



    The next big thing is HEVC the next generation of h.26x. It offers a further 50% reduction in data and supports 4k and 8k video. It should be on it's way to ratification early 2013. HEVC could bring HD downloadable movies to



    4GB for 1080

    1.5GB for 720

    < 1GB for SD



    I hope I get the option to download 720p and 1080p for a given movie as my iPad is just fine with 720.
  • tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 40,379member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    That's one thing Apple TV won't be getting. Expect that to be an iTV-exclusive feature.



    Wait, you actually think there will be both?
  • irelandireland Posts: 15,572member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    I'm preparing to buy an ATV 3 at launch. Probably buying a nice low end 40 or 42" this week or early next week.



    All I'm looking for is



    16GB of NAND storage

    Bluetooth 4.0

    A5 processing

    NAS support



    The most you'll get there will be an A5 or an A5X. Nothing more.
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