First look: Apple's new third-generation iPad with Retina display

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  • dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 11,220member


    WOT



    I was just thinking about those ppl who have been bitching about the storage capacity of the new iPad...



    Have a look at this:







    The IBM 2321 Data Cell Drive



    Quote:

    Early-to-mid 1960s. The Data Cell was IBM's first direct-access mass storage device. The design team was managed by IBM's Alan F. Shugart, who also was involved in the design of the first modern hard disk drive with air-bearing heads and later went on to found Shugart Associates in 1973 (which pioneered the floppy diskette) and Seagate Technology in 1979. (Contrary to the rumor that the Data Cell was designed as a thesis project by an MIT engineering student whose object was a storage system using every known technology... hydraulics, pneumatics, magnetics, springs, optics, ....) The 2321 housed up to ten removable and interchangeable data cells. Each data cell contained 200 magnetic strips, which were the basic recording media. The total storage capacity was 400 million bytes or 800 million decimal digits. Up to eight 2321s could be attached to the IBM 2841 control unit, allowing an overall capacity of over 3GB. Reportedly the Data Cell required 23 liters of motor oil.



    Average access times for selection of a strip range from 175 to 600 milliseconds; average rotational delay one a strip is on the drum is 25 milliseconds; access time to another cylinder averages 95 milliseconds.



    That's ~= 24 quarts of motor oil... to move 400 Megabytes of data... at .6 seconds access time



    I actually was supposed to install one of these little beauties at the Clark County NV (Las Vegas) Sheriff's office.



    We passed a very strict IBM Headquarters QA Usage Planning review... Our system was designed so that the data indexes contained robust basic data (on separate HDDs) so the system would would function if the DataCell was down for days (months).



    AIR, the DataCell device (not including the media) cost the customer about $7,000... per month.



    -- luckily, I got promoted (out of town) before delivery...



    I still have a sample DataCell strip, though...

  • tyler82tyler82 Posts: 508member
    I am quite impressed with the new iPhoto app. Here's an example of some before and after shots I took on my new iPad. The combination of iPhoto's image editing capabilities and the iPad improved built-in camera make this device a very desirable experience!



    Before







    After



  • solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    I have no idea when this changed but I hated the lack of thought put into the iPad 2's original camera app. Since it's typically held in two hands on the side having the shutter button bottom center was a poor decision. I'm glad to see they moved it at some point.


    iPad 2 camera app
  • dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 11,220member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tyler82 View Post


    I am quite impressed with the new iPhoto app. Here's an example of some before and after shots I took on my new iPad. The combination of iPhoto's image editing capabilities and the iPad improved built-in camera make this device a very desirable experience!







    Wow...



    Nice retouch work... Especially listening brush on the cat!



    Soon, most of that will be doable with automatic color correction.



  • tyler82tyler82 Posts: 508member
    [QUOTE=Dick Applebaum;2075181]
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tyler82 View Post


    I am quite impressed with the new iPhoto app. Here's an example of some before and after shots I took on my new iPad. The combination of iPhoto's image editing capabilities and the iPad improved built-in camera make this device a very desirable experience!





    Wow...



    Nice retouch work... Especially listening brush on the cat!



    Soon, most of that will be doable with automatic color correction.




    Have you used the new iPhoto app yet? It is so fun to use!
  • dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 11,220member
    [QUOTE=tyler82;2075186]
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post




    Have you used the new iPhoto app yet? It is so fun to use!



    Yeah... But I am a total dufas artistically...
  • daharderdaharder Posts: 1,580member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I have to tell you, you do need to polish up on those Photoshop skills. The image is doctored. If you sample the color values of the frames of the devices, not the actual screen region, the bezel, they both should be black however the iPad frame measures RGB (16 5 17) where the Tab measures RGB (1 0 2) making it much more black. This fact alone would lead one to suspect that the iPad image has been lightened artificially.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


    So besides using a doctored photo your argument is that ... blah...blah...blah



    You Know... All of the pathetic, rude, and hostile Apple apologists on this site you two two truly take the prize for the worst.



    FACT: In no way, shape or form were either of those photos 'doctored', and I challenge you to scientifically PROVE that they were.



    Anyway... The truth is, the new iPad(s) that I've now tried each have very obvious 'screen bleeding' issues, something I find completely unacceptable in an 'allegedly' state-of-the-art modern tablet device costing almost US 900.00.



    Pictured are the third new iPad that I've tried/purchased, along with my Samsung Galaxy Tab 7.7, just as they were taken by the camera, and the new iPad exhibits almost the exact same 'screen bleeding' as the previous two did.



  • timgriff84timgriff84 Posts: 904member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    The app you downloaded was a phone app, not a tablet app. Make sure you read about what you're downloading. The store makes it clear whether it's a phone app, a tablet app, or works properly with both.



    It's better the way Apple does it. What I hate about WP7 is when I try to scroll a screen I'm typing into, if I'm not careful, the keyboard goes away. Very annoying.



    Yeah, it woul be nice to have a trial version. But it's not that big a deal, really. It's nice to have a real free app that doesn't go away after some time as many of those trial apps do.



    Free is free. I don't know what you're talking about. You seem to have gotten it backwards. A trial app isn't really free, but a free app is. You don't have to buy the paid version. That an app with more features, which is why it's a paid app. With free apps, if the features are enough, you don't need to buy the paid version at all. If not, then you've got a pretty good idea as to how the paid version will work.



    Are you sure you really got an iPad? You don't have to double tap the home button. That was some time ago. You use four or five fingers and swipe up to pick any open app. Pretty easy.



    No it was an iPad app, listed in the iPad section. To be specific it's called mahjong!!! And has 2356 ratings. What was interesting was the touch points were in the right place on the screen but the image only filled the bottom left corner. Only app I've seen it on so far and it is down to the dev using pixels rather than what apple say to use.



    Free being free is also not true, if you search for need for speed there is need for speed hot pursuit and a lite version. The lite is essentially a trial for the paid version. I'd rather just have one app that if I want to keep I pay for. Alternatively if you search for some sudoku games there are some that are free but only have a few boards in them, after that it's an in app purchase, but you can't see how much there going to cost without going into each one. If an app ultimately charges you money then it's not free is it.



    Thanks for the tip on the switching app. I would never have found that! Apple should really include something to tell people what the gestures are. Everyone I meet that has one I ask if they know how to split the keyboard in 2 so that you can use just thumbs and out of 9 people so far 0 have known how to do it! And the only reasoning know was because my 4 month old daughter did it once.
  • timgriff84timgriff84 Posts: 904member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    There's a lot of problems with Metro. For example, after some time of buying apps, we found that we were having too many screens of them. We called for folders for organizational purposes. Because the OS is app centric, that wasn't a problem for Apple, and they complied with our requests (so much for them never listening!). But Metro isn't app centric, it's organized around functions. The problem with that is as you obtain more apps, you have to scroll. There is no way that it can accept folders without hiding those functions. That goes against the entire concept of what they're doing.



    So if they do that, they will have to change the OS so that it works more like Android and iOS. If they do that, then what's the point of buying it?



    Right now, there is no way to avoid scrolling down lists either. With iOS and Android, you can have those small letters on the right side you can tap. Nothing like that in WP7. We can also type a few letters, but often that's even more work. Depends on the length of the list.



    Also, when you have open apps in Metro, you have to swipe screen after screen to see which ones are open. There's no way to use a gesture as we can in iOs to pull up a list on the bottom.



    On WP7 you have jump lists to avoid scrolling down a list, there a lot easier and quicker than the small letters in ios. Also I don't see why you couldn't have the same folders functionality that iOS has in metro. For wp7 at least there just isn't the need as you have an app list with a jump list and a live tile screen which ultimately won't ever have to many tiles.



    Win 8 has the same open app list that iOS has except its a tap in the top left and they show the open app on the left hand side rather than bottom.
  • relicrelic Posts: 4,735member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post


    You Know... All of the pathetic, rude, and hostile Apple apologists on this site you two two truly take the prize for the worst.



    FACT: In no way, shape or form were either of those photos 'doctored', and I challenge you to scientifically PROVE that they were.



    Anyway... The truth is, the new iPad(s) that I've now tried each have very obvious 'screen bleeding' issues, something I find completely unacceptable in an 'allegedly' state-of-the-art modern tablet device costing almost US 900.00.



    Pictured are the third new iPad that I've tried/purchased, along with my Samsung Galaxy Tab 7.7, just as they were taken by the camera, and the new iPad exhibits almost the exact same 'screen bleeding' as the previous two did.







    I'll say it again I just love my Samsung 7.7 tablet. It's one of the only ones I would buy from them at the moment but I guess every company deserves one decent tablet in their line up. Man those colours, the brightness, big bucket of win.
  • gsilvergsilver Posts: 2member
    I went and bought the new ipad, since the screen update was the big thing that I've been wanting from the beginning, and I agree that the black levels need some work. While they're far better than my laptop, they're still a far cry from my Samsung TV. In terms of black levels, Samsung really knows what they're doing with their screens.



    Still, the resolution is very nice. A resolution fine enough to not see individual pixels normally (aside from things like rounded corners, that emphasize them) is a huge improvement to any screen. I'm quite happy with it so far.
  • hobbithobbit Posts: 532member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Relic View Post


    I'll say it again I just love my Samsung 7.7 tablet.



    Any AMOLED screen will by definition always have much better black levels than any LCD ever will have, IPS or not. That's part of the technological advance of OLEDs.



    I'd love the new iPad to have a 2048x1536 SuperAMOLED screen.

    Alas that is technically not possible yet.

    OLEDs with such a high pixel density have not yet been produced in 10" sizes from what I read. These densities exist only in tiny viewfinder sizes.



    Even if we go back to 1024x768, there is currently no manufacturer in the world, not even Samsung, who could produce an OLED screen in numbers needed for an iPad.

    Only because Samsung sells few tablets, comparatively, can they go with OLED screens. And those few probably already max out their yields.



    Also there is still very little experience data in regards to the fading of OLEDs. OLED elements grow dimmer over time, depending on the hours of usage. And unfortunately different RGB elements die at different rates, blue ones dying first, green last.

    Depending on use and environment temperature, could very well be that those 7.7 Samsung tablets will have noticeably dimmer images with slightly distorted colors in 2-3 years time. Although one could argue by that time one has replaced the unit...



    I hope we will get there soon, but for now Apple had not much choice with regards to the screen technology they could use.

    IPS was as good as it gets in the quantities they need.
  • sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Hi Guys and Gals, I am reposting here for those interested in SuperHD aka Retina iBooks and Keynote. Some of the newcomers to this thread may not have seen our previous predictions, which is now, fact.



    The reason is because the mockups I made work EXACTLY AS INTENDED on iPad Retina. It's pretty amazing. Keynote and iBooks on iPad Retina is "blow-away stuff".



    iBooks ~ As predicted by various people



    Load the following original images generated natively from iBooks Author on your iPad Retina vs iPad:

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/21386792/high_res_01.png

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/21386792/high_res_02.png



    iPad 2





    iPad Retina





    Keynote ~ As predicted by various people



    Load the following original images generated natively from Keynote '09 on your iPad Retina vs iPad:



    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/21386792/hig...ote_01.001.png

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/21386792/hig...ote_01.002.png

    Generated natively from Keynote '09 on Mac.



    Note that the first slide has super-crisp text and vector elements.

    In the second slide, we are able to display two 720p videos on one slide.

    Note Keynote '09 Mac and Keynote iPad formats are quite different.

    But you get the idea.
  • hobbithobbit Posts: 532member
    To add to sunilraman's post.





    While it's nice to have a higher resolution for crisper Latin character texts, I find that especiallly with non-Latin texts this is actually vital.





    Here's a mockup I had done for the iPad 2 and new iPad (it did look exactly like that in my real-world test). It uses 132 and 264 dpi with a zoom factor chosen so that the US Letter sized PDF fills the screen.





    While the iPad 2's English text is still somewhat readable, the Chinese characters are reduced to a pixel mush. Pretty much unreadable.



    On the new iPad the very same text, at the very same zoom level is completely readable, including the Chinese characters.

    What a change!





    Or in other words:

    On the iPad 2 I was forced constantly to zoom in / zoom out to read the text.

    On the new iPad zooming is no longer necessary at all.



  • solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hobBIT View Post


    To add to sunilraman's post.





    While it's nice to have a higher resolution for crisper Latin character texts, I find that especiallly with non-Latin texts this is actually vital.





    Here's a mockup I had done for the iPad 2 and new iPad (it did look exactly like that in my real-world test). It uses 132 and 264 dpi with a zoom factor chosen so that the US Letter sized PDF fills the screen.





    While the iPad 2's English text is still somewhat readable, the Chinese characters are reduced to a pixel mush. Pretty much unreadable.



    On the new iPad the very same text, at the very same zoom level is completely readable, including the Chinese characters. What a change!





    Or in other words:

    on the iPad 2 I was forced constantly to zoom in and zoom out to read the text. On the iPad 3 zooming is no longer necessary at all.



    image: http://homepage.mac.com/bauer/AppleInsider/Kanji.gif



    That makes me wonder if one of Apple's primary focus for the Retina Display ASAP was geared toward non-Western markets.
  • melgrossmelgross Posts: 28,568member, moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


    I have no idea when this changed but I hated the lack of thought put into the iPad 2's original camera app. Since it's typically held in two hands on the side having the shutter button bottom center was a poor decision. I'm glad to see they moved it at some point.


    iPad 2 camera app



    I used the camera on the 2 exactly once. Haven't tried it on this one yet. Still happy with the one on the 4S. If Apple can come up with a 3:1 optical zoom that fits, it will definitely kill everything up to $200 in the camera market.
  • justflybobjustflybob Posts: 1,337member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


    Was it 9.7" and black?



    Oh no you didn't!



  • melgrossmelgross Posts: 28,568member, moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by timgriff84 View Post


    No it was an iPad app, listed in the iPad section. To be specific it's called mahjong!!! And has 2356 ratings. What was interesting was the touch points were in the right place on the screen but the image only filled the bottom left corner. Only app I've seen it on so far and it is down to the dev using pixels rather than what apple say to use.



    Free being free is also not true, if you search for need for speed there is need for speed hot pursuit and a lite version. The lite is essentially a trial for the paid version. I'd rather just have one app that if I want to keep I pay for. Alternatively if you search for some sudoku games there are some that are free but only have a few boards in them, after that it's an in app purchase, but you can't see how much there going to cost without going into each one. If an app ultimately charges you money then it's not free is it.



    Thanks for the tip on the switching app. I would never have found that! Apple should really include something to tell people what the gestures are. Everyone I meet that has one I ask if they know how to split the keyboard in 2 so that you can use just thumbs and out of 9 people so far 0 have known how to do it! And the only reasoning know was because my 4 month old daughter did it once.



    Which Mahjong app it it exactly? I have four. I'll buy this to check it out myself. I've got over 350 apps, and I've never seen that happen.



    In app purchasing has proven to be VERY popular. VERY! So people like that. It's certainly not a negative.



    You can also switch between apps by swiping with four or five fingers sideways, and then you go to the next app directly. Forgot that one before.
  • melgrossmelgross Posts: 28,568member, moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by timgriff84 View Post


    On WP7 you have jump lists to avoid scrolling down a list, there a lot easier and quicker than the small letters in ios. Also I don't see why you couldn't have the same folders functionality that iOS has in metro. For wp7 at least there just isn't the need as you have an app list with a jump list and a live tile screen which ultimately won't ever have to many tiles.



    Win 8 has the same open app list that iOS has except its a tap in the top left and they show the open app on the left hand side rather than bottom.



    The jump list helps, but I don't find it to be as easy or nearly as useful if you have a lot of stuff. Of course, right now, there isn't a lot of stuff.
  • melgrossmelgross Posts: 28,568member, moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by gsilver View Post


    I went and bought the new ipad, since the screen update was the big thing that I've been wanting from the beginning, and I agree that the black levels need some work. While they're far better than my laptop, they're still a far cry from my Samsung TV. In terms of black levels, Samsung really knows what they're doing with their screens.



    Still, the resolution is very nice. A resolution fine enough to not see individual pixels normally (aside from things like rounded corners, that emphasize them) is a huge improvement to any screen. I'm quite happy with it so far.



    It's true that black levels on an AMOLED will be zero. They would have to be. But the colors are unrealistic. This is something that's been confirmed in every review as well as every scientific test. They are also much dimmer than a modern LED backlit LCD display, often only one third to one half as bright. They seem bright because of the black, but in reality, they are not.



    In addition, they use power like crazy, which is why MS, for example, uses so much black and single color areas in their UI, along with those thin stroke white fonts on dark, or black backgrounds, which gets so much criticism. AMOLED models also have lacked good battery life.



    So for a better black, you get more negatives. Not thrilled by any of that. The blacks on IPS screens is fine, as is the viewing angle. The truth is that you really don't notice the lack of true black unless you look directly at the black glass. On a white model, the blacks look total. Would I like it even blacker? Sure, but it's a more minor problem than the ones you get with current AMOLEDS.
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