Indians, by their nature, are cheap. They don't value quality. They buy as cheap as possible.
I am sure you know Indians well. You sound like someone who has done a lot of empirical research on Indians.
But the last sentence is puzzling: Who buys "as expensive as possible"?
Yes, I do because I am one & I have many years of doing business with them. Ever heard the saying, "penny wise, pound foolish"? When doing business with Indians, that describes them aptly. One of the big reasons, although not the only one, that Apple was successful in China is because Chinese love name brands & have no shame in flaunting their wealth / status. That value system (or lack thereof) hardly exists in Indians. Apple has a big cultural hurdle when doing business in India.
Do you know what the average selling price of Samsung products there is, compared to their other markets? If not, how can you make such a sweeping claim?
You now more about this than Tim Cook does!? Do you realize that it might just be making you look stupid, when you say something like that?
Indians, by their nature, are cheap. They don't value quality. They buy as cheap as possible.
Do you wear a $240 K gold shirt and probably another $150 K in accessories?
I am sure you know Indians well. You sound like someone who has done a lot of empirical research on Indians.
But the last sentence is puzzling: Who buys "as expensive as possible"?
Yes, I do because I am one & I have many years of doing business with them. Ever heard the saying, "penny wise, pound foolish"? When doing business with Indians, that describes them aptly. One of the big reasons, although not the only one, that Apple was successful in China is because Chinese love name brands & have no shame in flaunting their wealth / status. That value system (or lack thereof) hardly exists in Indians. Apple has a big cultural hurdle when doing business in India.
Ah, you're an India expert, a China expert and Apple expert. Because you've done business with them. Got it.
I still don't know anyone who buys "as expensive as possible", however. Perhaps Canadians do, I don't know...
Do you know what the average selling price of Samsung products there is, compared to their other markets? If not, how can you make such a sweeping claim?
You now more about this than Tim Cook does!? Do you realize that it might just be making you look stupid, when you say something like that?
Indians, by their nature, are cheap. They don't value quality. They buy as cheap as possible.
Do you wear a $240 K gold shirt and probably another $150 K in accessories?
Is he a typical Indian? I will worship Indians instead of Tim Cook.
There are some very wealthy Indians, sitting at the top in percentages that would equate to the iPhone's overall market saturation. Apple needs to figure out how to attract them, and Apple Stores just may be the way.
Wealthy Indians already bought iPhones just like China is doing now.
Why would someone buy a 5S vs. SE? SE is basically an updated 5S with (largely) 6S internals in the 5/5S form-factor.
Wait...is the 5S still selling but for less than the SE?
Ah, now I get it. So this is how Apple expands their sales market, by dropping their usual high margin standards going after the upper middle class and wealthy, and instead expanding to the lower income population. The SE certainly is a step in the right direction in terms of maintaining margins, but clearly the implication is that the 5s sells for less than the SE. Otherwise there's no reason people wouldn't buy the SE. I also have to think that performance aside, the 5s looks like the more expensive SE, so in a country which still values the caste system, that has to give the appearance of wealth one does not have. Unless the upper class are avoiding the SE for exactly that reason?
I am sure you know Indians well. You sound like someone who has done a lot of empirical research on Indians.
But the last sentence is puzzling: Who buys "as expensive as possible"?
Yes, I do because I am one & I have many years of doing business with them. Ever heard the saying, "penny wise, pound foolish"? When doing business with Indians, that describes them aptly. One of the big reasons, although not the only one, that Apple was successful in China is because Chinese love name brands & have no shame in flaunting their wealth / status. That value system (or lack thereof) hardly exists in Indians. Apple has a big cultural hurdle when doing business in India.
Ah, you're an India expert, a China expert and Apple expert. Because you've done business with them. Got it.
I still don't know anyone who buys "as expensive as possible", however. Perhaps Canadians do, I don't know...
where are you getting "as expensive as possible" from? he claimed they made purchases based on price, or as inexpensive as possible. that doesn't mean the only other alternative (non-Indian) would be the opposite, or as expensive as possible. I think the obvious statement he's making is most consumers weigh several factors, price being one, but that Indians only value price and go as inexpensive as possible.
not that I know this to be true or accurate. but that's obviously what he said and what you're driving at isn't.
I read a very interesting article about what is happening in India. Before I share it, I always said that Apple will not do well in India for lots of reason, the most important they are cheap they buy only on price and nothing else. Unless Apple wants to join the race to the bottom they will not sell much and if they join the race to the bottom they will end up the same place Nokia and Motorola are today, both of which got into the race to the bottom in India. It kill the company since so much resources were put in to make cheap phones which made no profits.
The article said many of the snack food and big name soda company are having a hard time in India their sales have continue to drop over the last few years. Guess what these companies and the experts are blame as the cause of decrease sales on drinks and snacks. You guess it cell phones, they said they the majority of the people in India can barely afford their cell phone especially smart phones, Most pay as they go on data, and pay when they have enough to buy a few megabits of data. These people are choosing not to buy snack foods and drinks so they can use their cell phones. As long as people are making these kinds of purchase decision they are not going to buy Apple products. The majority of the people who by Apple have lots of disposable income, and do not worry about whether to pay for data or buy a drink.
Imaging if Snack and Drink companies in the US saw declining sales over someone cell phone bill. They are dropping in the US because of cellphone but because people are choosing to eat healthier, which Apple has product for that and will make money off people wanting to be healthier. But Apple will not win in India because they are giving up snack and sugary drinks and other consumer products. They can not afford both. You do not see this elsewhere in the world, even in China.
I am sure you know Indians well. You sound like someone who has done a lot of empirical research on Indians.
But the last sentence is puzzling: Who buys "as expensive as possible"?
Yes, I do because I am one & I have many years of doing business with them. Ever heard the saying, "penny wise, pound foolish"? When doing business with Indians, that describes them aptly. One of the big reasons, although not the only one, that Apple was successful in China is because Chinese love name brands & have no shame in flaunting their wealth / status. That value system (or lack thereof) hardly exists in Indians. Apple has a big cultural hurdle when doing business in India.
Ah, you're an India expert, a China expert and Apple expert. Because you've done business with them. Got it.
I still don't know anyone who buys "as expensive as possible", however. Perhaps Canadians do, I don't know...
Actually, I buy at the highest value as possible, which could be more expensive. As the saying goes you only get what you pay for usually holds.
Simple example and something my dad taught me along time ago, Shoes, I buy the highest value shoe I want to afford. I am not talking tennis shoes or such. I am talking good leather walking or dress shoes. You can go to Payless and get a so called leather shoe for $50 or buy one get the second half off. Or you can go buy a well made leather shoe from a number of different companies. Pay anywhere from $150 to $500. In a years time the $50 one is shot and needs to be replaced, can not be repaired, trust me on this, I come from a family of shoe makers. Now the $150 to $500 ones can have the soles, heels insoles replaced many times over. I personally have a pair of $150 shoes I bought 20 years ago which I still wear and they look great. In stead of buying 20 $50/years I bought one $150 pair and pay $10 to $20 every so often to get them repaired. My total invents is less those who buy cheap shoes and I have a better product over a period of time. I apply this principle to most of may purchases, I will save my money to buy a better product verse buying cheap and replacing it many times over. This is a mind set, not because someone has or does not have money. My dad never had much money and only spent the money he had in his pocket but he always saved him money and bought what had the most value.
BTW that $150 shoe from 20 years ago it more like a $300 shoe today. The $150 shoes today are not all that good, if you do not know what to look for.
I am not saying everyone does this. But on average, the cheaper the item the shorter its lifespan. A guy I know bought only cheaper phones $100-$400 (max) and often claimed that he did not need more expensive phones. Within two years, he had bought 4 phones from Nokia to Samsung. If an average price he paid was $250, that's $1000 he had spent only on the phones alone. My old 5S cost a little bit more than half of that and lasted for 3 years.
Ah, you're an India expert, a China expert and Apple expert. Because you've done business with them. Got it.
I still don't know anyone who buys "as expensive as possible", however. Perhaps Canadians do, I don't know...
where are you getting "as expensive as possible" from? he claimed they made purchases based on price, or as inexpensive as possible. that doesn't mean the only other alternative (non-Indian) would be the opposite, or as expensive as possible. I think the obvious statement he's making is most consumers weigh several factors, price being one, but that Indians only value price and go as inexpensive as possible.
not that I know this to be true or accurate. but that's obviously what he said and what you're driving at isn't.
That's exactly what I'm driving at. As I mentioned, in my experience doing business with Indians, vast majority of the time it's about buying what's cheap rather than buying based on value, brand, user experience, etc..
Ah, you're an India expert, a China expert and Apple expert. Because you've done business with them. Got it.
I still don't know anyone who buys "as expensive as possible", however. Perhaps Canadians do, I don't know...
Actually, I buy at the highest value as possible, which could be more expensive. The saving you only get what you pay for usually holds.
Simple example and something my dad taught me along time ago, Shoes, I buy the highest value shoe I want to afford. I am not talking tennis shoes or such. I am talking good leather walking or dress shoes. You can go to Payless and get a so called leather shoe for $50 or buy one get the second half off. Or you can go buy a well made leather shoe from a number of different companies. Pay anywhere from $150 to $500. In a years time the $50 one is shot and needs to be replaced, can not be repaired, trust me on this, I come from a family of shoe makers. Now the $150 to $500 ones can have the soles, heels insoles replaced many times over. I personally have a pair of $150 shoes I bought 20 years ago which I still wear and they look great. In stead of buying 20 $50/years I bought one $150 pair and pay $10 to $20 every so often to get them repaired. My total invents is less those who buy cheap shoes and I have a better product over a period of time. I apply this principle to most of may purchases, I will save my money to buy a better product verse buying cheap and replacing it many times over. This is a mind set, not because someone has or does not have money. My dad never had much money and only spent the money he had in his pocket but he always saved him money and bought what had the most value.
BTW that $150 shoe from 20 years ago it more like a $300 shoe today. The $150 shoes today are not all that good, if you do not know what to look for.
Actually, I buy at the highest value as possible, which could be more expensive. As the saying goes you only get what you pay for usually holds.
Simple example and something my dad taught me along time ago, Shoes, I buy the highest value shoe I want to afford. I am not talking tennis shoes or such. I am talking good leather walking or dress shoes. You can go to Payless and get a so called leather shoe for $50 or buy one get the second half off. Or you can go buy a well made leather shoe from a number of different companies. Pay anywhere from $150 to $500. In a years time the $50 one is shot and needs to be replaced, can not be repaired, trust me on this, I come from a family of shoe makers. Now the $150 to $500 ones can have the soles, heels insoles replaced many times over. I personally have a pair of $150 shoes I bought 20 years ago which I still wear and they look great. In stead of buying 20 $50/years I bought one $150 pair and pay $10 to $20 every so often to get them repaired. My total invents is less those who buy cheap shoes and I have a better product over a period of time. I apply this principle to most of may purchases, I will save my money to buy a better product verse buying cheap and replacing it many times over. This is a mind set, not because someone has or does not have money. My dad never had much money and only spent the money he had in his pocket but he always saved him money and bought what had the most value.
BTW that $150 shoe from 20 years ago it more like a $300 shoe today. The $150 shoes today are not all that good, if you do not know what to look for.
I agree completely, but the problem in today's society is most things are disposable - not much is repairable. Cheaper to just go buy a new one.
Barring government manipulation/control of mobile vendors/access, as we're seeing in China, the pattern of Apple adoption will be the same as we've seen elsewhere. Apple is the premium experience. People will aspire to that experience. They'll drive a Yugo or two years, try a Buick, then finally leap to a Benz. Apple needs to be within financial reach of upper middle class customers in India, not trying to grab the bottom with old tech or crushed margins. The lobg game wins. Stores? Yes, yes, yes. Education is the best marketing.
Actually, I buy at the highest value as possible, which could be more expensive. As the saying goes you only get what you pay for usually holds.
Simple example and something my dad taught me along time ago, Shoes, I buy the highest value shoe I want to afford. I am not talking tennis shoes or such. I am talking good leather walking or dress shoes. You can go to Payless and get a so called leather shoe for $50 or buy one get the second half off. Or you can go buy a well made leather shoe from a number of different companies. Pay anywhere from $150 to $500. In a years time the $50 one is shot and needs to be replaced, can not be repaired, trust me on this, I come from a family of shoe makers. Now the $150 to $500 ones can have the soles, heels insoles replaced many times over. I personally have a pair of $150 shoes I bought 20 years ago which I still wear and they look great. In stead of buying 20 $50/years I bought one $150 pair and pay $10 to $20 every so often to get them repaired. My total invents is less those who buy cheap shoes and I have a better product over a period of time. I apply this principle to most of may purchases, I will save my money to buy a better product verse buying cheap and replacing it many times over. This is a mind set, not because someone has or does not have money. My dad never had much money and only spent the money he had in his pocket but he always saved him money and bought what had the most value.
BTW that $150 shoe from 20 years ago it more like a $300 shoe today. The $150 shoes today are not all that good, if you do not know what to look for.
I agree completely, but the problem in today's society is most things are disposable - not much is repairable. Cheaper to just go buy a new one.
This is not true, consumer product manufactures would like you to believe this. There are lots of high quality fixable products you can buy, but manufactures rather you toss verse repair, why they get to sell you another product a yr or two down the road. This is the android business model today, low quality, cheaper to replace than repair and plan obsolescence, Why do you think Google, Phone Manufactures, and services providers do not have a good software upgrade path, it drives more hardware sales. Just look at Apple and what is happening there, Apple sales are slowing down because what we have is high quality and Apple has easy software upgrade path, and the phone can be repair. The Iphone is very easily repairable, trust me I use to fix my kids' iphones all the time. They use to get our hand me downs and because they did not pay for them they did not take care of them, broken displays, and switches were the typical situation and I fixed them. Today they bought their own phones and guess what, have yet to brake a single one, interesting how that works.
It is definitely not cheaper to just replace, it does add up over time.
Actually, I buy at the highest value as possible, which could be more expensive. As the saying goes you only get what you pay for usually holds.
Simple example and something my dad taught me along time ago, Shoes, I buy the highest value shoe I want to afford. I am not talking tennis shoes or such. I am talking good leather walking or dress shoes. You can go to Payless and get a so called leather shoe for $50 or buy one get the second half off. Or you can go buy a well made leather shoe from a number of different companies. Pay anywhere from $150 to $500. In a years time the $50 one is shot and needs to be replaced, can not be repaired, trust me on this, I come from a family of shoe makers. Now the $150 to $500 ones can have the soles, heels insoles replaced many times over. I personally have a pair of $150 shoes I bought 20 years ago which I still wear and they look great. In stead of buying 20 $50/years I bought one $150 pair and pay $10 to $20 every so often to get them repaired. My total invents is less those who buy cheap shoes and I have a better product over a period of time. I apply this principle to most of may purchases, I will save my money to buy a better product verse buying cheap and replacing it many times over. This is a mind set, not because someone has or does not have money. My dad never had much money and only spent the money he had in his pocket but he always saved him money and bought what had the most value.
BTW that $150 shoe from 20 years ago it more like a $300 shoe today. The $150 shoes today are not all that good, if you do not know what to look for.
I agree completely, but the problem in today's society is most things are disposable - not much is repairable. Cheaper to just go buy a new one.
This is not true, consumer product manufactures would like you to believe this. There are lots of high quality fixable products you can buy, but manufactures rather you toss verse repair, why they get to sell you another product a yr or two down the road. This is the android business model today, low quality, cheaper to replace than repair and plan obsolescence, Why do you think Google, Phone Manufactures, and services providers do not have a good software upgrade path, it drives more hardware sales. Just look at Apple and what is happening there, Apple sales are slowing down because what we have is high quality and Apple has easy software upgrade path, and the phone can be repair. The Iphone is very easily repairable, trust me I use to fix my kids' iphones all the time. They use to get our hand me downs and because they did not pay for them they did not take care of them, broken displays, and switches were the typical situation and I fixed them. Today they bought their own phones and guess what, have yet to brake a single one, interesting how that works.
It is definitely not cheaper to just replace, it does add up over time.
Totally agree.
Recently I bought a 2010 model Macbook Pro 15 inch at about $450. It's a perfect laptop for my daily job without any issue. I think I can still keep and use it for another 5 years. So the very same laptop will be used for 11 years.
Think about how much money you will spend on multiple not-high-quality laptops in 11 years?
Comments
I still don't know anyone who buys "as expensive as possible", however. Perhaps Canadians do, I don't know...
(I was very saddened to learn that the man with flair, pictured, is no more, having been beaten to death,)
(I was very saddened to learn that the man with flair, pictured, is no more, having been beaten to death,)
Ah, now I get it. So this is how Apple expands their sales market, by dropping their usual high margin standards going after the upper middle class and wealthy, and instead expanding to the lower income population. The SE certainly is a step in the right direction in terms of maintaining margins, but clearly the implication is that the 5s sells for less than the SE. Otherwise there's no reason people wouldn't buy the SE. I also have to think that performance aside, the 5s looks like the more expensive SE, so in a country which still values the caste system, that has to give the appearance of wealth one does not have. Unless the upper class are avoiding the SE for exactly that reason?
not that I know this to be true or accurate. but that's obviously what he said and what you're driving at isn't.
I read a very interesting article about what is happening in India. Before I share it, I always said that Apple will not do well in India for lots of reason, the most important they are cheap they buy only on price and nothing else. Unless Apple wants to join the race to the bottom they will not sell much and if they join the race to the bottom they will end up the same place Nokia and Motorola are today, both of which got into the race to the bottom in India. It kill the company since so much resources were put in to make cheap phones which made no profits.
The article said many of the snack food and big name soda company are having a hard time in India their sales have continue to drop over the last few years. Guess what these companies and the experts are blame as the cause of decrease sales on drinks and snacks. You guess it cell phones, they said they the majority of the people in India can barely afford their cell phone especially smart phones, Most pay as they go on data, and pay when they have enough to buy a few megabits of data. These people are choosing not to buy snack foods and drinks so they can use their cell phones. As long as people are making these kinds of purchase decision they are not going to buy Apple products. The majority of the people who by Apple have lots of disposable income, and do not worry about whether to pay for data or buy a drink.
Imaging if Snack and Drink companies in the US saw declining sales over someone cell phone bill. They are dropping in the US because of cellphone but because people are choosing to eat healthier, which Apple has product for that and will make money off people wanting to be healthier. But Apple will not win in India because they are giving up snack and sugary drinks and other consumer products. They can not afford both. You do not see this elsewhere in the world, even in China.
http://businessmagz.com/business/indians-spurn-snacks-shampoo-to-load-their-smartphones-15662
Actually, I buy at the highest value as possible, which could be more expensive. As the saying goes you only get what you pay for usually holds.
Simple example and something my dad taught me along time ago, Shoes, I buy the highest value shoe I want to afford. I am not talking tennis shoes or such. I am talking good leather walking or dress shoes. You can go to Payless and get a so called leather shoe for $50 or buy one get the second half off. Or you can go buy a well made leather shoe from a number of different companies. Pay anywhere from $150 to $500. In a years time the $50 one is shot and needs to be replaced, can not be repaired, trust me on this, I come from a family of shoe makers. Now the $150 to $500 ones can have the soles, heels insoles replaced many times over. I personally have a pair of $150 shoes I bought 20 years ago which I still wear and they look great. In stead of buying 20 $50/years I bought one $150 pair and pay $10 to $20 every so often to get them repaired. My total invents is less those who buy cheap shoes and I have a better product over a period of time. I apply this principle to most of may purchases, I will save my money to buy a better product verse buying cheap and replacing it many times over. This is a mind set, not because someone has or does not have money. My dad never had much money and only spent the money he had in his pocket but he always saved him money and bought what had the most value.
BTW that $150 shoe from 20 years ago it more like a $300 shoe today. The $150 shoes today are not all that good, if you do not know what to look for.
This is not true, consumer product manufactures would like you to believe this. There are lots of high quality fixable products you can buy, but manufactures rather you toss verse repair, why they get to sell you another product a yr or two down the road. This is the android business model today, low quality, cheaper to replace than repair and plan obsolescence, Why do you think Google, Phone Manufactures, and services providers do not have a good software upgrade path, it drives more hardware sales. Just look at Apple and what is happening there, Apple sales are slowing down because what we have is high quality and Apple has easy software upgrade path, and the phone can be repair. The Iphone is very easily repairable, trust me I use to fix my kids' iphones all the time. They use to get our hand me downs and because they did not pay for them they did not take care of them, broken displays, and switches were the typical situation and I fixed them. Today they bought their own phones and guess what, have yet to brake a single one, interesting how that works.
It is definitely not cheaper to just replace, it does add up over time.
Recently I bought a 2010 model Macbook Pro 15 inch at about $450. It's a perfect laptop for my daily job without any issue. I think I can still keep and use it for another 5 years. So the very same laptop will be used for 11 years.
Think about how much money you will spend on multiple not-high-quality laptops in 11 years?