I'm actually really looking forward to this Expo ? I have a feeling that Apple is going to pull something "insanely great" out of the hat this time...
As am I. This is my first proper MW event, last year someone told me to watch it for iPod mini's, but this year I have a Mac and an iPod and all these silver aluminium and white plastic things lying around I can't wait to see what happens as nearly anything announced will affect my Dad's computer purchasing.
(BTW just spent 6 hours networking two windows computers to a router & then to a HP wireless printer. All that after walking in a printing from my PowerBook after 10secs of being in the room (love thy mac) I think my Dad now understands what I mean when I say Rendezvous )
Because if he was changing the entire Apple display lineup, he'd talk about them all at the same time. He'd talk about the current ones, show their prices, and then say they're adding one, and then show the price drops on the previous ones too. Think about it - it doesn't make sense at all to fiddle with the displays now and then do it again in a week. (Also, MacWorld is a week from today, not a couple of weeks.)
It's very clear that they did this before the keynote so they could avoid talking about displays altogether.
Like I said in my post above, it's been done before. They lowered iPod prices shortly before the iPod photo was announced. The 40gig iPod photo slipped into the $499 slot where the standard 40 gig iPod was just a few weeks before....
Plus, it doesn't make sense to introduce a sub $500 iMac without an affordable Apple branded display. Sure, a convert could use any old monitor with a headless iMac, but if they did want a new Apple display with their new Apple desktop (as most new computer buyers do,) they'd end up spending $1500 for a headless Mac and a 20" display. They'd be better off just buying the 17" iMac for $1299.
I definitely think that Apple will be introducing a low end 17" display designed specifically for this new low end box. It'd be a silly move if they didn't.
Plus, it doesn't make sense to introduce a sub $500 iMac without an affordable Apple branded display. Sure, a convert could use any old monitor with a headless iMac, but if they did want a new Apple display with their new Apple desktop (as most new computer buyers do,) they'd end up spending $1500 for a headless Mac and a 20" display. They'd be better off just buying the 17" iMac for $1299.
I definitely think that Apple will be introducing a low end 17" display designed specifically for this new low end box. It'd be a silly move if they didn't.
I think it would be a silly move if they DID.
Wouldn't a stand alone 17" display confuse buyers? They'd be in a quandry about whether to buy the headless Mac + Apple branded 17" display or just go for the 17" iMac.
I suspect the people with existing displays wouldn't be tempted by the new 17" display, and the people without existing displays would go for the 17" iMac.
Unless of course, Apple replaces the 17" iMac with this new headless machine and introduces a new 23" iMac at the top end. That would give them a mix and match 17" machine that would appeal to everyone, a 20" and a 23" prosumer machine.
Like I said in my post above, it's been done before. They lowered iPod prices shortly before the iPod photo was announced. The 40gig iPod photo slipped into the $499 slot where the standard 40 gig iPod was just a few weeks before...
I checked on that, and it was 3 months between the two releases. And it wasn't just a price drop, it was a new model with the click wheel.
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Plus, it doesn't make sense to introduce a sub $500 iMac without an affordable Apple branded display. Sure, a convert could use any old monitor with a headless iMac, but if they did want a new Apple display with their new Apple desktop (as most new computer buyers do,) they'd end up spending $1500 for a headless Mac and a 20" display. They'd be better off just buying the 17" iMac for $1299.
It is a strange state of affairs, but I think they've shown their hand already. I hope they do produce a smaller/cheaper display - it would make sense. But I'll bet you they don't.
Wouldn't a stand alone 17" display confuse buyers? They'd be in a quandry about whether to buy the headless Mac + Apple branded 17" display or just go for the 17" iMac.
Maybe for 30 seconds. Some speculate that the iMac-mini will have lower specs than the current iMacs (a G4 vs G5). So there is no confusion there. And provides a sell up for stores - Joe Switcher comes in to buy a mini and is convinced to part with a few more $$$ for the higher performance iMac.
Quote:
I suspect the people with existing displays wouldn't be tempted by the new 17" display, and the people without existing displays would go for the 17" iMac.
And I suspect there's a pretty good market segment that don't want their display integrated with their CPU like the iMac. (And if the Home Theater rumor is true, some people will use the mini without a "real" display.) Apple likes to provide the whole package. Releasing a new CPU without a matching display would be very un-Apple.
IMHO, the base iMac-mini & Apple display needs to come in at under $1000 - and probably pretty close to $1000. That puts it a little more than an eMac, and a little under an iMac. If the price rumors are to be believed ($500-$700), that puts the iMac-mini display at $300-500, significantly less than the current 19", but right in there with Sony and other premium LCD monitors - maybe too close for Apple's liking.
Quote:
Unless of course, Apple replaces the 17" iMac with this new headless machine and introduces a new 23" iMac at the top end. That would give them a mix and match 17" machine that would appeal to everyone, a 20" and a 23" prosumer machine.
Hmmm.... Push the 1.6GHz CPU into this iMac-mini and make the 1.8GHz the bottom of the line? What about the top? Can Apple put a 2.0GHz G5 in an iMac? Or keep the 1.8GHz and just add a bigger screen? They're going to have to beef up the GPU to push all those pixels around acceptably.
There's currently an $800 price jump between the 20" and 23" displays. That would put a 23" iMac at about $2700!
Wouldn't a stand alone 17" display confuse buyers? They'd be in a quandry about whether to buy the headless Mac + Apple branded 17" display or just go for the 17" iMac.
I don't think so....
The difference between the two will be the pricepoint, and a G5 vs. a G4 processor.
Even though the iMac G5 is not as expandable as a Powermac G5, it is still a pretty powerful machine. This new box is rumoured to have all low end components with a G4 processor. If Apple does release a matching 17" display for say $400 to $500, the whole set-up will be under $1000 which is still $300 less than the $1299 pricetag of the low end iMac G5.
This would be great had I not bought a 20" merely 3 months back They knocked almost one third off the price!! Just shows how much profit they really have in these, especially as its such a ratio. The 30" also had £300 knocked off but in comparison that is a 10th of the price.
Thanks Apple, nice to see you treating the early adopters well again.
This would be great had I not bought a 20" merely 3 months back They knocked almost one third off the price!! Just shows how much profit they really have in these, especially as its such a ratio. The 30" also had £300 knocked off but in comparison that is a 10th of the price.
Thanks Apple, nice to see you treating the early adopters well again.
What the heck do you want them to do, just not drop the price? I'm pretty sure no one forced you to buy it. Clearly you thought it was worth it at the time. Stop whining and enjoy your display!
What the heck do you want them to do, just not drop the price? I'm pretty sure no one forced you to buy it. Clearly you thought it was worth it at the time. Stop whining and enjoy your display!
No, I like the fact that they dropped the price.
Maybe you can stand to just drop £300 (almost $600) within 3 months and not be bothered by it. But believe it or not, losing that amount in a couple of months actually annoys me a little bit. Its not unreasonable.
I am in no doubt that other purchasers of the 20" will have similar feelings. What's next, are they going to drop the iPod Photo price £200 next week?
This is one of the reasons that Apples secrecy costs them in the wider market. People want value for money in the long run, especially smaller business', and if there is the constant threat of releasing something quickly after an initial launch, or changing prices, people will wait before purchasing. Most will wait, and wait, and wait.... then get bored and buy a PC. Apple need to be a little more open about their plans.
BTW I am all for the progress of technology at the expense of reducing the price of old technology or phasing it out. I just think that the drop for these displays is a clear signal that Apple got it wrong on the pricing when they brought these out. Hence the 33% reduction, practically unheard of in such a short space of time.
Only upside is it now provides me with the opportunity to get a second 20" to match 8)
I am not whining, how about you stop whining about my post and get on with your life.
This is one of the reasons that Apples secrecy costs them in the wider market. People want value for money in the long run, especially smaller business', and if there is the constant threat of releasing something quickly after an initial launch, or changing prices, people will wait before purchasing. Most will wait, and wait, and wait.... then get bored and buy a PC. Apple need to be a little more open about their plans.
call me crazy, but those displays have been out for quite a while. i bought mine when they came out, and i dont feel bad at all about the price drop. your unfortunate timing is just bad luck. it has nothing to do with apple appealing to the wrong people (etc). in the computer world, if i can buy a product and get 6+months of use before updates or price change, i feel good about it. apple cant help the fact that you ordered yours a couple months ago.
<snip>Hence the 33% reduction, practically unheard of in such a short space of time.
The reduction was less than 25%; still significant. I bought my 23" Cinema assuming that it would be cheaper later, but I wanted it then and had been waiting a long time for new models. When the 20" model was introduced at the same price as the one it replaced, I was amazed the price hadn't been reduced. That was part of the reason I went ahead and bought the 23" model.
What I wish is that Apple would more frequently reduce the price of their computers as well. Small reductions between upgrade cycles would be very nice, and would probably do wonders for sales.
Sorry, I wasn't thinking in your currency. In US$, it was less than 25%. Apparently, due to exchange rates, the reductions in Europe and Canada were more significant.
call me crazy, but those displays have been out for quite a while. i bought mine when they came out, and i dont feel bad at all about the price drop. your unfortunate timing is just bad luck.
Exactly. When the iBook 700 Mhz I bought got a speed bump, graphics card update, and $200 price drop three weeks later, sure, that kind of sucked, but that's life! I wasn't on these boards whining about it. I was enjoying my new laptop.
Jesus, you guys are touchy. I understand why they have done it and like I have said, its good that they are reducing prices. But I am just a little annoyed at dropping £300 as anyone would be.
If only I had waited a month, along with the $300 reduction in price of the 30" Cinema Display the new ATI X800 XT video card is $100 less than the Nvidia 6800 Ultra. Could have saved a cool $434 including tax, thats a pretty big hit to take so soon after the 30" display was released, Oh well, guess my crystal ball wasn't working correctly!
Comments
Originally posted by Messiah
I'm actually really looking forward to this Expo ? I have a feeling that Apple is going to pull something "insanely great" out of the hat this time...
As am I. This is my first proper MW event, last year someone told me to watch it for iPod mini's, but this year I have a Mac and an iPod and all these silver aluminium and white plastic things lying around
(BTW just spent 6 hours networking two windows computers to a router & then to a HP wireless printer. All that after walking in a printing from my PowerBook after 10secs of being in the room
Originally posted by BRussell
Because if he was changing the entire Apple display lineup, he'd talk about them all at the same time. He'd talk about the current ones, show their prices, and then say they're adding one, and then show the price drops on the previous ones too. Think about it - it doesn't make sense at all to fiddle with the displays now and then do it again in a week. (Also, MacWorld is a week from today, not a couple of weeks.)
It's very clear that they did this before the keynote so they could avoid talking about displays altogether.
Like I said in my post above, it's been done before. They lowered iPod prices shortly before the iPod photo was announced. The 40gig iPod photo slipped into the $499 slot where the standard 40 gig iPod was just a few weeks before....
Plus, it doesn't make sense to introduce a sub $500 iMac without an affordable Apple branded display. Sure, a convert could use any old monitor with a headless iMac, but if they did want a new Apple display with their new Apple desktop (as most new computer buyers do,) they'd end up spending $1500 for a headless Mac and a 20" display. They'd be better off just buying the 17" iMac for $1299.
I definitely think that Apple will be introducing a low end 17" display designed specifically for this new low end box. It'd be a silly move if they didn't.
Guess we'll see in a week!
Originally posted by solsun
Plus, it doesn't make sense to introduce a sub $500 iMac without an affordable Apple branded display. Sure, a convert could use any old monitor with a headless iMac, but if they did want a new Apple display with their new Apple desktop (as most new computer buyers do,) they'd end up spending $1500 for a headless Mac and a 20" display. They'd be better off just buying the 17" iMac for $1299.
I definitely think that Apple will be introducing a low end 17" display designed specifically for this new low end box. It'd be a silly move if they didn't.
I think it would be a silly move if they DID.
Wouldn't a stand alone 17" display confuse buyers? They'd be in a quandry about whether to buy the headless Mac + Apple branded 17" display or just go for the 17" iMac.
I suspect the people with existing displays wouldn't be tempted by the new 17" display, and the people without existing displays would go for the 17" iMac.
Unless of course, Apple replaces the 17" iMac with this new headless machine and introduces a new 23" iMac at the top end. That would give them a mix and match 17" machine that would appeal to everyone, a 20" and a 23" prosumer machine.
Originally posted by solsun
Like I said in my post above, it's been done before. They lowered iPod prices shortly before the iPod photo was announced. The 40gig iPod photo slipped into the $499 slot where the standard 40 gig iPod was just a few weeks before...
I checked on that, and it was 3 months between the two releases. And it wasn't just a price drop, it was a new model with the click wheel.
Plus, it doesn't make sense to introduce a sub $500 iMac without an affordable Apple branded display. Sure, a convert could use any old monitor with a headless iMac, but if they did want a new Apple display with their new Apple desktop (as most new computer buyers do,) they'd end up spending $1500 for a headless Mac and a 20" display. They'd be better off just buying the 17" iMac for $1299.
It is a strange state of affairs, but I think they've shown their hand already. I hope they do produce a smaller/cheaper display - it would make sense. But I'll bet you they don't.
Originally posted by Messiah
I think it would be a silly move if they DID.
Wouldn't a stand alone 17" display confuse buyers? They'd be in a quandry about whether to buy the headless Mac + Apple branded 17" display or just go for the 17" iMac.
Maybe for 30 seconds. Some speculate that the iMac-mini will have lower specs than the current iMacs (a G4 vs G5). So there is no confusion there. And provides a sell up for stores - Joe Switcher comes in to buy a mini and is convinced to part with a few more $$$ for the higher performance iMac.
I suspect the people with existing displays wouldn't be tempted by the new 17" display, and the people without existing displays would go for the 17" iMac.
And I suspect there's a pretty good market segment that don't want their display integrated with their CPU like the iMac. (And if the Home Theater rumor is true, some people will use the mini without a "real" display.) Apple likes to provide the whole package. Releasing a new CPU without a matching display would be very un-Apple.
IMHO, the base iMac-mini & Apple display needs to come in at under $1000 - and probably pretty close to $1000. That puts it a little more than an eMac, and a little under an iMac. If the price rumors are to be believed ($500-$700), that puts the iMac-mini display at $300-500, significantly less than the current 19", but right in there with Sony and other premium LCD monitors - maybe too close for Apple's liking.
Unless of course, Apple replaces the 17" iMac with this new headless machine and introduces a new 23" iMac at the top end. That would give them a mix and match 17" machine that would appeal to everyone, a 20" and a 23" prosumer machine.
Hmmm.... Push the 1.6GHz CPU into this iMac-mini and make the 1.8GHz the bottom of the line? What about the top? Can Apple put a 2.0GHz G5 in an iMac? Or keep the 1.8GHz and just add a bigger screen? They're going to have to beef up the GPU to push all those pixels around acceptably.
There's currently an $800 price jump between the 20" and 23" displays. That would put a 23" iMac at about $2700!
Speculation is fun!
- Jasen.
Originally posted by Messiah
I think it would be a silly move if they DID.
Wouldn't a stand alone 17" display confuse buyers? They'd be in a quandry about whether to buy the headless Mac + Apple branded 17" display or just go for the 17" iMac.
I don't think so....
The difference between the two will be the pricepoint, and a G5 vs. a G4 processor.
Even though the iMac G5 is not as expandable as a Powermac G5, it is still a pretty powerful machine. This new box is rumoured to have all low end components with a G4 processor. If Apple does release a matching 17" display for say $400 to $500, the whole set-up will be under $1000 which is still $300 less than the $1299 pricetag of the low end iMac G5.
Thanks Apple, nice to see you treating the early adopters well again.
Originally posted by the061
This would be great had I not bought a 20" merely 3 months back
Thanks Apple, nice to see you treating the early adopters well again.
What the heck do you want them to do, just not drop the price? I'm pretty sure no one forced you to buy it. Clearly you thought it was worth it at the time. Stop whining and enjoy your display!
Oh on a side note: The 30" totally kicks ass. I am still blown away by its performance - I doubt the novelty will ever wear off!
Originally posted by Flounder
What the heck do you want them to do, just not drop the price? I'm pretty sure no one forced you to buy it. Clearly you thought it was worth it at the time. Stop whining and enjoy your display!
No, I like the fact that they dropped the price.
Maybe you can stand to just drop £300 (almost $600) within 3 months and not be bothered by it. But believe it or not, losing that amount in a couple of months actually annoys me a little bit. Its not unreasonable.
I am in no doubt that other purchasers of the 20" will have similar feelings. What's next, are they going to drop the iPod Photo price £200 next week?
This is one of the reasons that Apples secrecy costs them in the wider market. People want value for money in the long run, especially smaller business', and if there is the constant threat of releasing something quickly after an initial launch, or changing prices, people will wait before purchasing. Most will wait, and wait, and wait.... then get bored and buy a PC. Apple need to be a little more open about their plans.
BTW I am all for the progress of technology at the expense of reducing the price of old technology or phasing it out. I just think that the drop for these displays is a clear signal that Apple got it wrong on the pricing when they brought these out. Hence the 33% reduction, practically unheard of in such a short space of time.
Only upside is it now provides me with the opportunity to get a second 20" to match 8)
I am not whining, how about you stop whining about my post and get on with your life.
Originally posted by the061
This is one of the reasons that Apples secrecy costs them in the wider market. People want value for money in the long run, especially smaller business', and if there is the constant threat of releasing something quickly after an initial launch, or changing prices, people will wait before purchasing. Most will wait, and wait, and wait.... then get bored and buy a PC. Apple need to be a little more open about their plans.
call me crazy, but those displays have been out for quite a while. i bought mine when they came out, and i dont feel bad at all about the price drop. your unfortunate timing is just bad luck. it has nothing to do with apple appealing to the wrong people (etc). in the computer world, if i can buy a product and get 6+months of use before updates or price change, i feel good about it. apple cant help the fact that you ordered yours a couple months ago.
Originally posted by the061
<snip>Hence the 33% reduction, practically unheard of in such a short space of time.
The reduction was less than 25%; still significant. I bought my 23" Cinema assuming that it would be cheaper later, but I wanted it then and had been waiting a long time for new models. When the 20" model was introduced at the same price as the one it replaced, I was amazed the price hadn't been reduced. That was part of the reason I went ahead and bought the 23" model.
What I wish is that Apple would more frequently reduce the price of their computers as well. Small reductions between upgrade cycles would be very nice, and would probably do wonders for sales.
Originally posted by the061
£1000 down to £700 is not less than 25%
Sorry, I wasn't thinking in your currency. In US$, it was less than 25%. Apparently, due to exchange rates, the reductions in Europe and Canada were more significant.
Originally posted by ipodandimac
call me crazy, but those displays have been out for quite a while. i bought mine when they came out, and i dont feel bad at all about the price drop. your unfortunate timing is just bad luck.
Exactly. When the iBook 700 Mhz I bought got a speed bump, graphics card update, and $200 price drop three weeks later, sure, that kind of sucked, but that's life! I wasn't on these boards whining about it. I was enjoying my new laptop.