Anti-DRM protest at Apple stores; Verizon on iPhone 3G's impact

[AppleInsider]

Open-source campaigners are planning a flood campaign against Apple retail they believe will pressure the iPhone maker to open up its devices. Verizon, meanwhile, only believes the iPhone 3G has had slight impact on its sales, and Doom's creator wants to create an exclusive iPhone game.

DRM opponents hope to overwhelm Apple retail

In a symbolic gesture, the Free Software Foundation plans a new campaign, nicknamed the Apple Challenge, that it thinks will pressure Apple into opening its software code.

The organization is asking supporters to book a Genius Bar appointment at an Apple retail store on Friday or Saturday and ask the technicians questions about the company's broader corporate policy regarding iPhone 3G and its software under the belief that any copy-protected hardware or software is "defective."

Among the questions several few technicians would be likely to answer, including those asking why Apple doesn't allow iPhone developers to publish source code, why Apple continues to sell protected iTunes music, and why the company doesn't support open media formats like FLAC, Ogg Theora, and Ogg Vorbis.

The questionnaire goes so far as to suggest that closed-source software for GPS would allow Apple to track customers' locations without their knowledge.

Although Apple currently uses and promotes some open-source software through Mac OS X, the company has more often refrained from a similar policy with its portable devices. Chief executive Steve Jobs, however, has endorsed cross-platform formats but has only mentioned AAC and MP3, which still require licensing and are patented in a way that makes open-source modification impossible.

Verizon downplays iPhone 3G's effects

iPhone 3G's rollout has had just a "minimally short-term impact" on Verizon's sales, if the company's statements during its quarterly results call prove true.

Though it stops short of handing out any statistics, the cellular service provider alludes to the Apple phone making a small dent in Verizon sales in the days following its launch but that it was "disproportionately less" than the company's market share, which is smaller than that of exclusive iPhone provider AT&T.

The company also fires a direct jab at AT&T, noting that its wireless strategy doesn't depend on "any one device" and claims the iPhone actually spurred a rush of smartphone sales at Verizon.

id Software's Carmack eager to develop iPhone exclusive

John Carmack, the co-founder of game development house id Software, says his company is planning to develop an iPhone-exclusive title that would show off the abilities of the platform, Forbes says.

While it's too early to reveal details, the game would be based on an existing storyline from the company such as Doom, Quake, or Wolfenstein but would be a "graphical tour de force" that shows off the visual prowess of the iPhone and iPod touch's PowerVR hardware.

"The iPhone, as a device, is in the same generation power-wise as the PS2 or Xbox," Carmack says. "The graphics are a little lower but the RAM is a lot higher."

Apple's handhelds also have considerably more storage than the cellphones id Software has developed for so far, with many games coming in over 10MB while a typical mobile game is often 300KB.

At present, his only immediate lament is not having time to create a launch game. "I really regret not having something at launch," he says.

[Enigmafan420]

I got my deep boots on and my Barbara Streisand detector is fired up...

Verizon's continuing downplay of the iPhone is a little short on credibility-I mean really-they claim that iPhone sales are pushing their own smart phone sales

I mean really d00d!!11!! Can I please have an LG DARE Phone?!?11!! (which incidentally costs as much as an iPhone but has kewl "angled" icons) that is so tightly locked-up I can't even add my own ring tones? And that runs some proprietary version of some software (not even Windows Mobile, which isn't very good in itself) WOW! I can run an HTML browser on my kewl gnu phone man

Verizon's problem is that they are the opposite of open source-you can't even sneeze around your phone without a charge. I don't think much of AT&T either-but there is no way I would trade my iPhone 3G for ANYTHING in Verizon's arsenal-especially with their $2.99 ring tones that only last 6 months and their legendarily bad customer service-it is at least as bad as AT&Ts, only without a phone worth owning.

[elroth]

"In a symbolic gesture, the Free Software Foundation plans a new campaign, nicknamed the Apple Challenge, that it thinks will pressure Apple into opening its software code."

Yeah, and I think the moon is made of green cheese.

[physguy]

Originally Posted by elroth

"In a symbolic gesture, the Free Software Foundation plans a new campaign, nicknamed the Apple Challenge, that it thinks will pressure Apple into opening its software code."

Yeah, and I think the moon is made of green cheese.

So, have they (FSF) ever done this to MS? I don't know, does anybody here know?

[Foo2]

Originally Posted by AppleInsider

In a symbolic gesture, the Free Software Foundation plans a new campaign, nicknamed the Apple Challenge, that it thinks will pressure Apple into opening its software code.

Excellent! The iPhone is apparently very popular amongst the members of the FSF. But if free and open software is the way to go, I don't understand why the FSF doesn't just develop an iPhone-like device of their own.

[robb1068]

Ha! This will be a total burn on Apple when those Genius Bar employees can't answer their questions on Apple's DRM policies.

[iVlad]

wow, people have nothing else to do. i am just so mad that there are all these protests against apple. what about other communist companies. =)

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by AppleInsider

DRM opponents hope to overwhelm Apple retail

I try not to use harsh languages on these boards but these guys are douche bags. Besides the well known fact that Jobs is being blackballed by the studios after being laughed at by one CEO for even conceiving of sure an idea just to latter jump in with Amazon with DRM-free music to usurp iTunes, this does nothing but inconvenience the people needing support with their Apple products and make it harder for the near-minimum wage employees at Apple trying to scrap out a living.

Originally Posted by Enigmafan420

Verizon's continuing downplay of the iPhone is a little short on credibility-I mean really-they claim that iPhone sales are pushing their own smart phone sales.

Verizon is saying all the typical things one expects from a company that is being financially hurt by the attention for one device. They have a point that it's only for the short term as the surge will die down and, as I've stated before, the iPhone have made smartphones mainstream, not jsut geek or business devices so the increase of smartphone sales by other manufacturers have increased too. It's a bit of sour grapes mixed in with the truth.

The real question will be what happens when OS X iPhone matures a little more and people (like me) find App Store apps for free that they just live without.

[VisualZone]

Originally Posted by robb1068

Ha! This will be a total burn on Apple when those Genius Bar employees can't answer their questions on Apple's DRM policies.

It would be very easy to answer the questions. Just two words, "no comment".

[VisualZone]

Originally Posted by physguy

So, have they (FSF) ever done this to MS? I don't know, does anybody here know?

I know they've done a few. Here's one for you...

http://badvista.fsf.org/

[paulgreen]

I think this action by FSF is going to primarily hurt Apple customers trying to get help at the Genius bar on Friday or Saturday. Could they not think of a better tactic?!

[nagromme]

The reason Mac, iPod and iPhone sales are still tanking is the lack of support for Ogg Theora.

The public demands Ogg Theora, and without that Apple will be gone in a year.

There is every chance that this protest will succeed. Other commercial companies have a lot less open source in the mix than Apple does. But even Apple will fail, hot on the heels of Microsoft, Adobe and other failures who have refused to adhere to the OSF's one-sided vision. "Some" open source is not enough. Darwin core? WebKit? Nice, but the world needs more. Everything should be open source. Apple will realize this I think, and the Ogg Theora support we love and need will arrive.

Be prepared for protests that dwarf anything the civil rights movement has ever seen. Developers who like to be paid for their time may see real opportunity in the Mac and iPhone platforms. It's an illusion that won't last. Paying for skilled creative work will never work out in the end.

There are two kinds of software, open source and not, and ONLY one of those models can ever work out well. Look at the history of the world's greatest, most useful, most user-friendly software. Notice how none of it costs anything? Case closed.

Also, what is Ogg Theora?

[Hoss]

Originally Posted by solipsism

I try not to use harsh languages on these boards but these guys are douche bags. Besides the well known fact that Jobs is being blackballed by the studios after being laughed at by one CEO for even conceiving of sure an idea just to latter jump in with Amazon with DRM-free music to usurp iTunes, this does nothing but inconvenience the people needing support with their Apple products and make it harder for the near-minimum wage employees at Apple trying to scrap out a living.




Verizon is saying all the typical things one expects from a company that is being financially hurt by the attention for one device. They have a point that it's only for the short term as the surge will die down and, as I've stated before, the iPhone have made smartphones mainstream, not jsut geek or business devices so the increase of smartphone sales by other manufacturers have increased too. It's a bit of sour grapes mixed in with the truth.

The real question will be what happens when OS X iPhone matures a little more and people (like me) find App Store apps for free that they just live without.

....Or Snow Leopard for iphone crankin' on an 8, 16, or 32 core chip......with phone and data provided by SiriusXM?

[vinea]

NOT Open Source but Freetards.

Jeez, lets do a DOS attack on Genius Bars and watch as Apple customers think that freetards are even greater morons.

But seriously...NOT Open Source but Free Software proponents (zealots). Please fix the article.

[johnl1479]

Thanks FSF for blocking out the Genius Bar to those of us that have problems with our Macs and need to get them fixed ASAP

[gobble gobble]

If they want to promote free software that's fine, but why do they need to be self-righteous dicks about it.

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by nagromme

The reason Mac, iPod and iPhone sales are still tanking is the lack of support for Ogg Theora.

The public demands Ogg Theora, and without that Apple will be gone in a year.

I can only assume that you are being sarcastic about Apple being gone in a year. As for Ogg, there are potential legal issues floating around regarding patent infringement. Maybeing it's just a bald-faced lie by closed source codec groups trying to keep Ogg down so they can make more money, but if true it could be a reason why this free-to-all container format is not being widely adopted in lieu of the fee-based Mp3 codec.

[Xian Zhu Xuande]

How can people educated about technology be so silly as to pull a stunt like that in the Apple Stores. The only possible benefit of things like this is in some message it may send to the music labels, who are the real people behind DRM. And I think the music labels have ignored people with much more sensical arguments than these guys...

The only improvement I can see them arguing for is the inclusion of music types like OGG.

I think Apple would convert the entire ITMS to iTunes Plus (or whatever they call it), if they could. Sales show clearly that people want DRM-free music, as evidenced in the Amazon music store and in the ITMS even now. Steve made it clear that he doesn't want DRM on that platform as well. I'm not sure it will have any affect on Apple's stance (if they release compatibility for OGG it won't be because of this), but they will succeed in inconveniencing a lot of people who are just trying to get their day's shopping over with.

- - - - - - - - -

Cool news about the Doom fellow! That sounds like a lot of fun. I don't really care for that sort of game myself, but it would be loads of fun to see what he can do with the platform! I'm actually really excited to see what develops out of this new App Store marketplace.

- - - - - - - - -

Verizon is a bunch of goobers.

- - - - - - - - -

Edit: Thanks for the laugh, nagromme!

Edit 2: Do these protesters have jobs? What is this? A bunch of people who quit life to play WoW?

[sibelius]

You know... I really find it funny how people 'demand' things. Things they didn't spend any time developing, no money in R&D... they didn't put their jobs at risk, or work years and years for peanuts until that big break. They didn't have the vision, drive, or desire. Yet they protest against corporations as if they have THE RIGHT!!!

To those who protest: You do have THE RIGHT... the right to buy software from someone else. If you don't like how a company operates go elsewhere. Or better yet -- MAKE YOUR OWN!!! But you wont do that, will you. Why? Because it's easier to b*tch to someone else than to actually put any effort or risk into creating a solution that's right for you.

Is DRM right? Who cares!?! Don't like it? There are a LOT of options out there... options that work with your iPod, or whatever else you might have.


You know what else I find funny about these people? Protestors always talk about how they're protesting for the good of the common man... but guess what? If I have an issue with my computer and/or software and I walk into an Apple Store and I can't get help from someone because of bunch of selfish self-centered 'tards are backlogging the counter I'm going to be pretty pissed off... and NOT at Apple.


If everyone spent their time focusing on their own personal problems and trying to make their lives better, instead of telling everyone else how they should live their lives, we'd all be better off.

No protestor has EVER done anything to help me, or anyone I know, out. But, I guess they like to do what they do because it's an escape (just like TV, booze, drugs, etc.) from the crappy reality which is their own personal life (which, as you can read from the first comments I've made, they're never going to fix because they're far too lazy to put effort into solving their own personal shortcomings).

[bloggerblog]

OMG! How can they be so un-informed?? "why Apple continues to sell protected iTunes music"??? Are they retarded? Steve Jobs is the biggest supporter of DRM free music. Everyone one and his mother knows that it's the music industry who demands it. Just take a look at the prices on the ATV, they're ridiculously high, is that Apple's plan? Of course not. It's the movie industry's demands that are biased towards Apple. RedBox is allowed to rent the latest releases for a dollar on the other-hand, ATV's latest releases are usually only for sale! at $14.00....

Genius Bar employees should be instructed to smack those morons across the face and pull the stool from underneath their asses! Then force them to write and produce music and publish their hard work for free. Yeah.. let's see how they'd like that!!

Whew! I feel better now...

[Wiggin]

Originally Posted by Foo2

Excellent! The iPhone is apparently very popular amongst the members of the FSF. But if free and open software is the way to go, I don't understand why the FSF doesn't just develop an iPhone-like device of their own.

I don't know much about it, but isn't that the point of Android, that it's open source? If they want an open source cell phone, why don't they just use that? Oh, right, they think they are "entitled" to Apple's hardware.

It must be miserable fighting hopeless causes all the time...

[technohermit]

Originally Posted by Enigmafan420

I got my deep boots on and my Barbara Streisand detector is fired up...

Verizon's continuing downplay of the iPhone is a little short on credibility-I mean really-they claim that iPhone sales are pushing their own smart phone sales

Actually, with the three people I had to speak with from Verizon trying to port my number over to AT&T, all three basically waived every charge under the sun for me to stay. "We have touch phones"; we can waive this and that for your other line (my wife--soon to be switching out as well); can you replace yourself with another person and we'll give them whatever you ask us to for free?
I'm sure someone fell for that crap and stayed. I was in the Apple store already with 3G iphone in hand, so I said no. Even if I was trapped under a car in the parking lot, bleeding from the eyes, I still would have gotten the iPhone at some point.
But I'm sure somewhere across the nation people used the I'm leaving for the iPhone thing to get a newer smartphone at a decent discount from Verizon.
Even my hatred for Verizon and their ridiculous fees cannot ignore the fact that in lower NY state, their cellular service is superior to AT&T. EVDO is thoroughly implanted wherever they have a signal. 3G is spotty at best, especially above NYC.

[ros3ntan]

looks like someone has found a loop hole in the justice system.. as apple, they the right to their own devices.. but demonstration in front of apple store is not illegal...

So who is going to affect? the people themselves.. the customer of Apple...and ultimately, the people demonstrating.. If Apple opens up, then iphone will be another generic device just like the sony mp3 player and any other mp3 player...

It is Apple's choice to open up something they owned.

[Slewis]

Null.

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by technohermit

Even my hatred for Verizon and their ridiculous fees cannot ignore the fact that in lower NY state, their cellular service is superior to AT&T. EVDO is thoroughly implanted wherever they have a signal. 3G is spotty at best, especially above NYC.

This is not the first we've heard of NY being very Verizon-friendly compared to AT&T in that regard. The odd thing is that a couple months ago AT&T released a a report of his superior 3G data speeds that I believe was from that area.

Luckily, I tend to travel in areas that are well covered by AT&T.

[bsenka]

Verizon's position may not be entirely defense. Didn't Verizon actually add more new subscribers during the first quarter after the initial iPhone launch than AT&T did?

If you don't travel overseas, but you do travel a lot in North America, CDMA can have advantages over GSM.

[emoney35]

Originally Posted by AppleInsider

The company also fires a direct jab at AT&T, noting that its wireless strategy doesn't depend on "any one device" and claims the iPhone actually spurred a rush of smartphone sales at Verizon.

Originally Posted by Enigmafan420

I mean really d00d!!11!! Can I please have an LG DARE Phone?!?11!! (which incidentally costs as much as an iPhone but has kewl "angled" icons) that is so tightly locked-up I can't even add my own ring tones? And that runs some proprietary version of some software (not even Windows Mobile, which isn't very good in itself) WOW! I can run an HTML browser on my kewl gnu phone man

Verizon's problem is that they are the opposite of open source-you can't even sneeze around your phone without a charge. I don't think much of AT&T either-but there is no way I would trade my iPhone 3G for ANYTHING in Verizon's arsenal-especially with their $2.99 ring tones that only last 6 months and their legendarily bad customer service-it is at least as bad as AT&Ts, only without a phone worth owning.

For the most part I completely agree. They might not be totally full of it by saying the iPhone has spurred more smart phone sales. The problem is Verizon's smart phones are awful compared to the iPhone, and it's only a matter of time before their customers figure this out. I actually took a serious look at getting one of their smart phones right after the iPhone originally came out, but their options were garbage, and they still are. My brother has one of the newer Blackberrys and even that is extremely cumbersome to use. The thing I really can't understand is how they charge so much?? The retail price of the LG Dare, Voyager, etc. are ridiculously high. Especially when you compare that price to the iPhone. Many times the iPhone is cheaper.

Fast forward one year...

I really started to need/want a smart phone, so I looked again at Verizon. To make a long story short, it was actually CHEAPER for me to cancel my contract with Verizon and buy the iPhone, rather than buying one of their smart phones at retail. (They claimed I wasn't close enough to the end of my contract to get any upgrade discount.) All I have to say to Verizon is Thanks! The iPhone is hands down the best phone on the market, and I have no regrets leaving Verizon's lagging technology behind.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by nagromme

...what is Ogg Theora?

I thought it was one of those hammer-wielding Nordic gods?

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by bsenka

Verizon's position may not be entirely defense. Didn't Verizon actually add more new subscribers during the first quarter after the initial iPhone launch than AT&T did?

If you don't travel overseas, but you do travel a lot in North America, CDMA can have advantages over GSM.

I think it was 1.5M new subscribers to 1.3M, in Verizon's favour. And that was when AT&T had the largest subscriber base (pre-the Altell acquisition by Verizon) so the percentage was even smaller for AT&T.

However, only half of the reported iPhone buyers for AT&T were new to the carrier (or like me returning after vowing to never to return to Cingular).

Another thing to consider is that we know that iPhone users had to pay at least $60/month to signup, a good $20 more than the a basic voice package so it's quite possible that AT&T's 200k less new subscribers actually generated more gross profit for the company than Verizon.

[irnchriz]

What a bunch of tree hugging pricks. They should all bugger off and play with their linux boxes.

Mind you, I don't imagine that more than three or four beardy weirdys will turn up anyway.

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by emoney35

To make a long story short, it was actually CHEAPER for me to cancel my contract with Verizon and buy the iPhone, rather than buying one of their smart phones at retail. (They claimed I wasn't close enough to the end of my contract to get any upgrade discount.) All I have to say to Verizon is Thanks! The iPhone is hands down the best phone on the market, and I have no regrets leaving Verizon's lagging technology behind.

If you told them what you were going to do I'm fairly certain they would have bent over and grabbed ankle to keep you as a customer.

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

I thought it was one of those hammer-wielding Nordic gods?

[vinea]

Originally Posted by nagromme

Also, what is Ogg Theora?

Dead video codec. Inferior to h.264.

[irnchriz]

"iPhone 3G's rollout has had just a "minimally short-term impact" on Verizon's sales, if the company's statements during its quarterly results call prove true."

They know that the iPhone was scarce as hell between May and July 11th?

Fuck, they would only have needed to sell a couple of handsets in June to sell more than AT&T sold iPhones.

Lets see what the figures are like after this quarter.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by irnchriz

..... beardy weirdys.......

That is funny.

[wilco]

Originally Posted by iVlad

wow, people have nothing else to do. i am just so mad that there are all these protests against apple. what about other communist companies. =)

Do you even know what you're trying to say?

[emoney35]

Originally Posted by solipsism

If you told them what you were going to do I'm fairly certain they would have bent over and grabbed ankle to keep you as a customer.

Yeah, you're probably right. I hinted at what I was planning to do, but honestly, unless they could offer me the iPhone, I wasn't staying! Obviously they couldn't, so I didn't want to deal with their rig-a-ma-roll. I just left it alone for the most part, and went to the Apple store to get the iPhone.

[huntercr]

Originally Posted by vinea

NOT Open Source but Freetards.

Jeez, lets do a DOS attack on Genius Bars and watch as Apple customers think that freetards are even greater morons.

But seriously...NOT Open Source but Free Software proponents (zealots). Please fix the article.

Yeah there's actually been a pretty big backlash against this "antiDRm at any cost" group. You should see the thread on slashdot... it's got antiApple people even rushing to Apple's defense.

What a stupid way to protest. The parallels to PETA are obvious and accurate. They're just interested in showboating themselves, not the cause.

Apple is a great Open Source enabler. Their source code contribs to FreeBSD go largely overlooked since it's all on the back end and in kernel land... Lets not Forget that the infamous Jordan Hubbard ( a cofounder of the FreeBSD project) has been employed by Apple since 2001 in their Unix/BSD division. What do you think he does all day?

[city]

I have been a loyal Verizon Wireless Customer since the early 90's when it was called Pacific Tel Cellular and later called Air Touch. (They should of kept the latter name.) My family is now enjoying their 3Gs. Verizon knows exactly how many numbers they are porting to AT&T. A lot!
Alot!

It was a smooth purchase at the Apple store using a Microsoft/Windows software based wireless ordering and credit card swiping device.

[voodooru]

no longer syncing to mobile me. they need to fix that joke. really.

today, for now apparent reason, all my contacts became only numbers, all the names have vanished. LOL!

glad i'm only using this free 2 month trial period.

[rmm221]

Well, Verizon lost me as a customer.. And about 3-4 other people in the line around me were calling on their Verizon BlackBerry's to get their account numbers so they could switch to AT&T.

I really have zero loyalty to a cellular network... They are all the same. My cell reception in my apartment, since I live in hollywood hills, is pretty weak with either network.

The key will be when IPHONE releases a VOIP wifi application.. like the upcoming ICALL.

Then I can switch to the 450 minute plan.. and use wifi at my home to make the majority of my phone calls and save myself loads of money.