Next-gen MacBook Air CPU; Apple's SoHo neighbors complain

[AppleInsider]

Intel's Developer Forum has revealed the processors likely to underpin the first refresh of the MacBook Air ultraportable. At the same time, residents near Apple's SoHo retail store in New York City allege that its frequent concerts are ruining the neighbourhood.

Slipping underneath the radar amidst talk of Nehalem and other next-generation technology, Intel at the San Francisco edition of its Developer Forum this week announced its first regularly available processor based on the same, very small chip packaging that made the MacBook Air possible.

Nicknamed the Core 2 Duo S, the 1.6GHz and 1.86GHz parts share the same basic architecture as chips released in July but consume about 60 percent less surface area through both a smaller main processor and smaller bridge chips used to interface with memory and peripherals.

Although they run at nearly the same clock speeds as the processors in Apple's 13.3-inch ultraportables, they should be faster through a 1.06GHz system bus (up from 800MHz) and a larger 6MB Level 2 onboard memory cache. They also consume less power at just 17W compared to the 20W of Apple's custom-ordered chip.

As the only processors that would fit into the extremely tight confines of the Air's chassis, the two Core 2 Duo S chips are a likely direct clue as to Apple's direction for its first update to the lightweight MacBook.

Apple's SoHo neighbors file complaints with NYC officials

As much as some tout Apple's flagship store in the SoHo district of Manhattan for its secondary role as a concert venue, local residents and offices are reporting a very different experience.

The neighborhood's SoHo Alliance organization has submitted a letter to the New York City borough's President, Scott Stringer, complaining that the frequent concerts are not only excessively loud and block the streets with fans but that they may violate local laws, including occupancy rules and mandates for public assembly. An August 12th performance by the Jonas Brothers is described as the event that pushed locals past the breaking point.

"This concert attracted thousands of young teenage girls who SCREAMED INCESSANTLY on the street for hours for their idols, blocking traffic, injuring one resident in the crush, and inconveniencing scores of other people and businesses," the SoHo Alliance writes. "This concert for the Jonas Brothers was like the Beatles at Shea Stadium. The screaming was that loud. However, residential Greene Street is not Shea Stadium."

Construction at inappropriate times of the night has also been one of Apple's more serious offenses, the group says. The Mac maker is further accused of lying to the Alliance and to the borough President about night work permits it didn't have.

City officials have yet to take action, and Apple hasn't commented on the matter.

[ View this article at AppleInsider.com ]

[LeeCambridge]

Anyone have any idea when the next refresh of the Macbook Air line is due? I've heard dates thrown around, Sept. 6th, 9th, 16th...need to know for grad school!

[Xian Zhu Xuande]

The Jonas Brothers!?

You're kidding me? A little kiddo Disney band has sparked some of the rowdiest crowds around? That's rich. It does suck to imagine what they have to deal with in having that sort of attraction near their homes or businesses, but it is no different anywhere else performances are made.

[teckstud]

I brought this up yesterday and it was reported Wednesday- old news.
If the iPhone farts it would have been reported instantaneously.
They forgot the part where the Soho Alliance states that the iPhone lines outside everyday are reminiscent of the "bread lines in communist Russia".

[nagromme]

Nobody but Apple knows a date for new Airs (or any upcoming products). "Soon" seems likely, but details are no more than rumors.

As for concerts, Apple certainly needs to follow local laws. If that means allowing only smaller events, then so be it.

[teckstud]

Originally Posted by LeeCambridge

Anyone have any idea when the next refresh of the Macbook Air line is due? I've heard dates thrown around, Sept. 6th, 9th, 16th...need to know for grad school!

You want something that slow for grad school?
Hopefuly they'll speed bump it up enough for high school.

[ambimac]

Steve Jobs will now announce that 2% of the residents of Greene Street were affected by the noise.
Also, the SoHo Alliance organization represents 8% of the population, and that 99.8% of the residents of Greene Street responded to the poll that was conducted to arrive at these statistics.

Kidding.

[mrjoec123]

I think Apple should consider sponsoring a major music venue. Put their name and logo on an amphitheater in a major city, and sponsor major music concerts there. Reinforce the connection between Apple and music. They could even still sell iPods and iPhones at booths at the events.

The concerts in the stores are a great idea, but they're going to keep running into trouble if they do it in neighborhoods like SoHo. Locals are always going to complain about noise violations, and rightfully so. When they allowed Apple to put a store there, I'm sure Apple didn't mention it would be having free concerts there on a regular basis.

[SpamSandwich]

Comparing the "Jonas Brothers" to the Beatles?.... ha, ha, ha. I don't think so!

[solipsism]

I think we're going to be hearing a lot of bellyaching when the new MBA arrives.The porcessor speeds are still in the 1.6 and 1.8GHz range and I doubt there will be much comfort for some that it's Montevina/Penryn and uses less power. Plus, I think the HDD will be upgraded to 120GB on the top end but I don't think there are any 1.8" SSDs that are more than 64GB right now.

Originally Posted by LeeCambridge

Anyone have any idea when the next refresh of the Macbook Air line is due? I've heard dates thrown around, Sept. 6th, 9th, 16th...need to know for grad school!

No one but Apple can say. There is a rumour of a special event in September. I suspect they will be releasing the new iPods and, at the very least, announcing the new Mac notebooks. Some say it won't be until after the Back To School ends on Monday the 15th. It's makes sense that the event will be on Tuesday the 16th, but I seem to recall Apple releasing new items right before the end of the Back To School promo and simply disallowing these new items.

I have doubts that the new notebooks will be ready for sale the same day as the event. Intel has had problems with these new chipsets. AnandTech was only able to find one company with a Centrino 2 notebook and that still had many issues. This was last month. So if Intel has sorted things out they may not have ramped up production for Apple's needs.

[gmon750]

Originally Posted by teckstud

You want something that slow for grad school?
Hopefuly they'll speed bump it up enough for high school.

Slow for what? Define your standards for "slow"? The performance of my Macbook Air is wonderful. It is my 9-to-5 laptop at work running VMWare/XP for the business apps and OSX for everything else not Microsoft related. As long as I'm not running any major graphics-intensive software, my MBA has performed beyond my expectations for an ultra-portable mobile laptop. Best laptop I've ever owned. I don't expect an ultra-portable laptop to compete on the same level as say their MacBook Pro. That is not its intent. Most buyers of the MBA know that.

Apple did not develop the MBA to your specifications. They developed it to my specs. There are other users out there where this machine fits their requirements perfectly as it did for me. No disrespect intended... just my 2 cents for a wonderful laptop.

[wobegon]

Originally Posted by LeeCambridge

Anyone have any idea when the next refresh of the Macbook Air line is due? I've heard dates thrown around, Sept. 6th, 9th, 16th...need to know for grad school!

The 16th seems most likely as many have observed it would be the day after Apple's Back to School deal ends that Monday. The Air is likely to get a processor refresh (and *crosses fingers* a storage increase, either with a 160GB HDD and/or an optional 128GB SSD) in addition to redesigned MacBook Pros (and maybe MacBooks too) and lower-priced, redesigned and/or enhanced iPods.

Originally Posted by teckstud

You want something that slow for grad school?
Hopefuly they'll speed bump it up enough for high school.

If all he's doing is listening to music, writing text documents, web browsing, emailing, and using an IM client, he'd see no major benefit in going with a faster Mac. I'm a college student with a 15" PowerBook G4: 1.67GHz processor, 1.5GB RAM, 80GB HDD, and it has more than enough horsepower for all those tasks and others.

His MacBook Air would be faster than my computer and of course, people considering an Air obviously value portability over serious processing power.

[K.C.]

If the first MBA used a custom chip why wouldn't the rev ?

In other words, it may be faster.

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by K.C.

If the first MBA used a custom chip why wouldn't the rev ?

In other words, it may be faster.

The reason the MBA was possible was because of the reduced chipset size. While I guess it could be called a custom chip Intel had already designed this chipset to work with the Merom processor before Apple asked for it. The only way that Apple could use the 2.26GHz or 2.4GHz chips in the MBA would be with at a lose to battery usage time as the TPD uses 25% more wattage more than the current chip or by using a new battery tech to account for the difference.

But now Intel is releasing many notebook chipsets using the 22mm^2 size so we ca hopefully get some smaller notebooks all around. I hope they remove the optical drive but I'm banking it won't happen until the next case revision in a few years. Networking and attached storage is so cheap and small that an optical drive is becoming a large waste of space, but I don't think enough people are ready for it.

PS: Interestingly, if Apple had used the 35mm^2 chipsets with the Merom chips the power usage would have actually been lower than the 20W it currently uses. It would have only been 17W that it will use on the new chips. Oh man, I foresee so many unhappy people complaining on their boards.

• http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=3356&p=4

[wobegon]

Originally Posted by solipsism

I hope they remove the optical drive but I'm banking it won't happen until the next case revision in a few years. Networking and attached storage is so cheap and small that an optical drive is becoming a large waste of space, but I don't think enough people are ready for it.

I've been ready for that for a while now. I'm hoping Apple will be a little more gutsy and just do it in September when they revise their MacBook Pro line, but that's wishful thinking.

Perhaps they're waiting for SSDs to get more affordable so from day one, they can offer a base MacBook Pro model with 256GB and lacking an internal SuperDrive right off the bat, then make a 128GB SSD standard on the Air. It's surprising how much solid-state storage can improve system and application start-up times as well as overall responsiveness compared to moving from a 1.6GHz to 1.8GHz processor.

I may wait awhile because I'd prefer as few moving parts as possible in my next Mac.

[mcarling]

I agree with solipsism and wobegon. It's time to drop the internal optical drive from the full notebook line. The MacBook Air has proven that internal optical disks are unneeded. I believe Steve has the vision and the guts to do it. Apple was the first computer company to drop the floppy drive. It was a good move.

[backtomac]

Originally Posted by mcarling

I agree with solipsism and wobegon. It's time to drop the internal optical drive from the full notebook line. The MacBook Air has proven that internal optical disks are unneeded. I believe Steve has the vision and the guts to do it. Apple was the first computer company to drop the floppy drive. It was a good move.

I disagree.

While I agree with Apple's decision to drop the optical in the MBA, it should be kept in the MB and MBP models. These machines are more 'general' purpose and potentially desktop replacements. As such they should continue to feature optical drives.

I think some people are being a little hasty to discard optical drives. I still find them quite useful for storing data and preferring ripping CDs to purchasing my audio content. While I don't use my optical drive daily I still use it enough to value it. The day will come when it'll be unnecessary, but that day isn't here yet IMO.

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by wobegon

Perhaps they're waiting for SSDs to get more affordable so from day one, they can offer a base MacBook Pro model with 256GB and lacking an internal SuperDrive right off the bat, then make a 128GB SSD standard on the Air.

I don't foresee the SSD replacing the HDD in notebooks for at least several years, but I don't see why Apple won't offer it as an option for the MBP as you can now get 128GB 2.5" SSDs for under $600 (Apple's price: $750). I wouldn't get it, but I can see it being a fairly popular option.

SSDs still have price and capacity working against them, but if Moore's Law working it shouldn't be long before the MBA's maximum storage option will only be had by getting the SSD. While the price will still be substantially higher than an HDD, the larger capacity—along with the other benefits of a solid state drive—will make it more appealing to many. Surprising to me, the MBA SSD option seems very popular; even when it was a $1000.

I use the MBA in my example, because the largest capacity Apple currently sells is a 80GB HDD and an 64GB SSD. Newegg currently has a 120GB HDDs (single platter only for the Air) available. When a 128GB SSD comes out (2009?) it would be the largest capacity drive available. If it isn't, it would surely jump past HDD when the 256GB version comes out a couple years later. By that time, I think Apple will completely forego HDDs in the MBA and use the now cheap 64 or 128GB SSDs for the low end models. (speculation)

How long before 2.5" SSD "out-capacity" 2.5" HDDs in notebooks? If we are at 128GB now and we get a doubling every two years that is only 4 years before notebooks will hold 512GB and 6 years before they hold 1TB. I don't think there is any new HDD tech on the horizon that can compete with that. Any insights?

[teckstud]

Originally Posted by gmon750

Slow for what? Define your standards for "slow"? The performance of my Macbook Air is wonderful. It is my 9-to-5 laptop at work running VMWare/XP for the business apps and OSX for everything else not Microsoft related. As long as I'm not running any major graphics-intensive software, my MBA has performed beyond my expectations for an ultra-portable mobile laptop. Best laptop I've ever owned. I don't expect an ultra-portable laptop to compete on the same level as say their MacBook Pro. That is not its intent. Most buyers of the MBA know that.

Apple did not develop the MBA to your specifications. They developed it to my specs. There are other users out there where this machine fits their requirements perfectly as it did for me. No disrespect intended... just my 2 cents for a wonderful laptop.

MacBook Pro? It doesn't even compete up to the level of the MacBook- did you not read the reviews? See MacWorld's please.
A friend of mine who has the Air and the Black MacBook confided to me Tuesday that the Air constantly freezes up when iChating.
I guess your specifications are for something ultralight be it slow and travel between classes- whatever.

[wizard69]

Originally Posted by mcarling

I agree with solipsism and wobegon. It's time to drop the internal optical drive from the full notebook line. The MacBook Air has proven that internal optical disks are unneeded. I believe Steve has the vision and the guts to do it. Apple was the first computer company to drop the floppy drive. It was a good move.

The last thing I want to see Apple do is get rid of the optical drive on all it's portables. Some yes but definitely not all the laptops.

The trouble is right at this moment an optical drive is the solution to several problems that currently don't have universally good and accepted solutions. So in one device you get the following.

1. A device for reading popularly distributed content here we are talking music and videos. Yes I'm fully aware that one can rip a CD an store your media locally. The point is you need a drive to do that and you need disposable disk space.

2. Like it or not many programs and data sets are distrbuted on CDs of some sort.

3. Like wise if you are in the field and need to distribute data to a customer a CD can be a mutually acceptable way to make the exchange. Many a rationalization that I won't go into here.

4. Field back ups. It is a simple shipable sane solution for saving serious data.

There are probably a couple of others. The point is there are certainly alternatives to many of the above either coming on line or about to. Except for one issue and that is the one where you give the customer what they request. Well that and the issue of alternative backups that are very shipable.

As to online storage that only works well when you have a public connection available. Even then my experiences with iDisk have been less than noteworthy. What it comes down to is this there are to many limitations in the alternatives to do away with optical drives right now.

Don't get me wrong though I know what the future will be like with respect to the PC world. That will certainly be one where connectivity replaces other distro methods. But it is not here yet. Further I don't ever expect that any form of connectivity will replace the expanding need for storage on a local portable machine.

Frankly I would look at an Apple portable with to storage bays instead of an optical disk with lustful eyes. As always the biggest limitation in making a laptop a primary machine is it's disk storage alotment. This should be very doable if one drive is a low power solid state solution. Even this dual bay approach wouldn't be enough for everybody but it would put smiles on a lot of faces. There would be even bigger smiles if those bays where user accessible.


Dave

[wizard69]

[\quote] Any insights?[/QUOTE]

There are a couple of things here that make the future very muddy.

1. It is not clear how much longer traditional flash memory cells can be shrunk. This beyond a couple of years it is hard to say if flash will be a factor.

2. This is especially an issue considering some of the tech in the labs right now that might make for a far better alternative to flash.

3. I don't forsee a users need for storage in portables shrinking any time soon. Thus I'm not sure flash will scale fast enough. On the other hand this could be addressed as a production problem. That is stack dies in chip packages and then stack the packages. In other words produce enough chips fast enough and cheap enough so that even with todays densities you meet storage requirements.

4. You seem to think that hard drive densities won't go up. There is still potential there. The drive makers could keep their lead for a bit longer.

5. The non public research! There has been some media attetion on recent break through that could lead to a more economical alternative to flash. What I ask is what about the stuff not public? There is obvious opportunity for some one to deliver an alternative to flash and magnetic tech. Maybe somebody is opperating under the radar here.

In a nut shell I would not want to wager on where flash will be in five or so years.


Dave

[wobegon]

Originally Posted by solipsism

I don't foresee the SSD replacing the HDD in notebooks for at least several years, but I don't see why Apple won't offer it as an option for the MBP as you can now get 128GB 2.5" SSDs for under $600 (Apple's price: $750). I wouldn't get it, but I can see it being a fairly popular option.

Yeah, realistically, I'm expecting an optional 128GB SSD for the redesigned MBPs coming in September. That would make it hard for their competitors as most 15" to 17" PC laptops don't have optional SSDs. I'll hold of judgement on whether they'll drop the internal disc drive.

Originally Posted by solipsism

I use the MBA in my example, because the largest capacity Apple currently sells is a 80GB HDD and an 64GB SSD. Newegg currently has a 120GB HDDs (single platter only for the Air) available. When a 128GB SSD comes out (2009?) it would be the largest capacity drive available. If it isn't, it would surely jump past HDD when the 256GB version comes out a couple years later. By that time, I think Apple will completely forego HDDs in the MBA and use the now cheap 64 or 128GB SSDs for the low end models. (speculation)

A couple years for an affordable 256GB SSD for the Air? Not according to THIS article, which details Samsung's plan to offer a multi-level SSD that promises to offer equivalent performance at a "considerably" lower cost in 2009.

If Apple can get a $1000 128GB 1.8" SSD as an option for the Air in the upcoming September revisions or at Macworld '09, maybe we'll see a similar halving of the price like the original 64GB option that recently dropped to $600 after only a few months on sale. By the end of the 2009, if the 256GB multi-level SSD is cost effective, they could make the 128GB SSD standard on the Air, with the 256GB drive optional. Also, with Snow Leopard, OS X's footprint (paw print ) will be reduced thanks to better localization and perhaps the use of resolution independent vector image files, rather than the larger raster files.

Originally Posted by solipsism

How long before 2.5" SSD "out-capacity" 2.5" HDDs in notebooks? If we are at 128GB now and we get a doubling every two years that is only 4 years before notebooks will hold 512GB and 6 years before they hold 1TB. I don't think there is any new HDD tech on the horizon that can compete with that. Any insights?

Agreed, and the truth is, SSD capacity doubling likely won't continue at a steady pace, but rather, expand progressively as prices drop and consumer demand increases at an accelerating rate.

[StuBeck]

Originally Posted by mcarling

I agree with solipsism and wobegon. It's time to drop the internal optical drive from the full notebook line. The MacBook Air has proven that internal optical disks are unneeded. I believe Steve has the vision and the guts to do it. Apple was the first computer company to drop the floppy drive. It was a good move.

I can assure you Steve does not have anything to do with it. He hires people who know much more about the area then him to make these decisions.

[irnchriz]

Won't be long before they start complaining about kids with long hair.

Down with the squares man!

[Messiah]

Originally Posted by Xian Zhu Xuande

The Jonas Brothers!?

You're kidding me? A little kiddo Disney band has sparked some of the rowdiest crowds around? That's rich. It does suck to imagine what they have to deal with in having that sort of attraction near their homes or businesses, but it is no different anywhere else performances are made.

I used to live next to Hampden Stadium in Glasgow. Hampden, the national stadium, is widely regarded as THE venue for artists to perform when they visit Scotland.

During my stay Eminem, Oasis, and U2 played there, as well as various American Football and soccer finals. There was never any trouble, and we were surprised that even although we only lived about 100 yards away, we could hardly hear the crowd.

The only trouble we had was when a pop concert aimed at teenage girls rolled in to town. The streets were packed with drunk teenage girls, fighting, screaming, passing out in the gutters. Literally tens of thousands of them. All screaming like they were being fried alive. Mass hysteria at the prospect of simply walking down the road.

We couldn't believe how much noise they were capable of generating. And the council couldn't believe how much litter and destruction they left in their wake.

And all for a glimpse of Darius Denesh's cock!

http://www.stars-masculines-nues.com/darius.jpg

[mcarling]

Originally Posted by StuBeck

I can assure you Steve does not have anything to do with it. He hires people who know much more about the area then him to make these decisions.

I've known Steve since before Apple Computer, Inc. Decisions like this are made by Steve and Steve alone. Steve listens to advice from those he hires, but he makes such decisions himself, sometimes to the consternation of employees.

As for the idea of leaving optical drives in some laptops, that is unlikely. Steve would conclude that those who need optical drives can either use an external drive or keep using an older laptop until they no longer need the optical drive. The transition will happen quickly when it happens. The MacBook Air may be the start of the transition or it may be an exception. I suspect the former.

[fpsanders]

The trouble is right at this moment an optical drive is the solution to several problems that currently don't have universally good and accepted solutions.

I have a MBA for about half a year now and although it felt weird to not have an optical drive, I'm not missing it any more.
- Nearly all software is downloadable from the internet
- I have 4Gb and 8Gb Usb sticks that take care of all my data distribution needs
- I don't want movies and lotsa music on my MBA cause the hard drive is too small (and that DOES annoy me a lot)
- and even if I am looking for something, I can buy/download it from the internet

I was also one of the early macintosh users. The feeling of not having a 5" floppy drive was kinda similar. But then I just thought it was cool, although, as an early adapter, it did not make my life easier. Now I just shrug. Hardly any inconvenience...

[pmjoe]

Originally Posted by mcarling

I agree with solipsism and wobegon. It's time to drop the internal optical drive from the full notebook line. The MacBook Air has proven that internal optical disks are unneeded.

ROTFLMAO! The only thing the MacBook Air has proven ... is that I don't want one. It's under-spec'd, overpriced, built for money is no object people/companies, where the person's daily use is probably more appropriate for the never released Palm Foleo. Most of these people would be better off with a $500 sub-notebook based on iPhone technology.

Stick a Blu-ray drive in my laptop please.

[wobegon]

Originally Posted by pmjoe

ROTFLMAO! The only thing the MacBook Air has proven ... is that I don't want one. It's under-spec'd, overpriced, built for money is no object people/companies, where the person's daily use is probably more appropriate for the never released Palm Foleo. Most of these people would be better off with a $500 sub-notebook based on iPhone technology.

Stick a Blu-ray drive in my laptop please.

You don't seem to understand the point of the MacBook Air. It's not trying to compete with the budget MacBook or the high-end MacBook Pro. It's in the emerging ultra-light category, where portability is more valuable than processing power to the customer. For what the Air is, it's not overpriced or underpowered compared to its ultra-light competition:



How the MacBook Air stacks up against other ultra-light notebooks

If someone wants something comparable to a sub-notebook, they're often better off going with an iPhone or iPod touch, mobile WiFi devices that do what they do well, rather than dealing with a sub-notebook's anemic performance, cramped keyboard, diminutive storage space, and claustrophobic screen. For "full size" tasks like typing text documents, organizing a digital photo album, managing a music collection, people can use a "full size" computer like the MacBook, MacBook Air, or MacBook Pro.

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by wobegon

You don't seem to understand the point of the MacBook Air. It's not trying to compete with the budget MacBook or the high-end MacBook Pro. It's in the emerging ultra-light category, where portability is more valuable than processing power to the customer. For what the Air is, it's not overpriced or underpowered compared to its ultra-light competition:

<chart>

How the MacBook Air stacks up against other ultra-light notebooks

If someone wants something comparable to a sub-notebook, they're often better off going with an iPhone or iPod touch, mobile WiFi devices that do what they do well, rather than dealing with a sub-notebook's anemic performance, cramped keyboard, diminutive storage space, and claustrophobic screen. For "full size" tasks like typing text documents, organizing a digital photo album, managing a music collection, people can use a "full size" computer like the MacBook, MacBook Air, or MacBook Pro.

I'd save your breath. If after 7 months and copycats appearing—which just get worse with the new Intel chips being 22mm^2—there isn't anything you can do now to convince people that the machine isn't a breath-through just because it doesn't suit their needs.

For comparison the first MB had a 1.83GHz CD "Yonah" which wold be slower than than the Santa Rosa/Merom architecture in the MBA. Before that the PowerBook and iBook even more underpowered than the MBA but people still complain.

That chart is old. Since the MBA arrived there have been two companies have released competing notebooks using these exact same 22mm^2 1.6 and 1.8GHz Merom C2D chips. Besides using the same chip they also made the machine very thin, used a 13" display, and was only to put in a single platter 1.8" HDD. They also cost a more than the MBA. These are the Lenovo X300 and VooDoo 133.

[ncee]

Originally Posted by SpamSandwich

Comparing the "Jonas Brothers" to the Beatles?.... ha, ha, ha. I don't think so!

The comparison was about the loud screaming little girls … not the music

Skip

[gmon750]

Originally Posted by teckstud

MacBook Pro? It doesn't even compete up to the level of the MacBook- did you not read the reviews? See MacWorld's please.
A friend of mine who has the Air and the Black MacBook confided to me Tuesday that the Air constantly freezes up when iChating.
I guess your specifications are for something ultralight be it slow and travel between classes- whatever.

I've read about the MBA having the freezing issues. I use mine constantly and at times, it does get quite warm on the lap but never has it locked up on me. I bought mine a couple months ago. Perhaps Apple made a production change to address it? I don't know.

And yes, I did read the MBA reviews. Just like I read movie-reviews, I take it with a grain of salt. I did a lot of research and examined many laptops (Windows/Apple) before I settled on the MBA. I don't believe my standards for an ultralight are low. The speed of my MBA is plenty-fast for what I use it for. I think with the technology and performance abilities available in modern laptops, people seemed to not understand that there is a price to be paid for high-performance machines such as heat and battery-consumption. Issues that the MBA I think address very well. If your needs don't go beyond Office apps, browsing, email, iTunes, minimal weight and high mobility, then the MBA is a perfect fit.

If your needs go beyond that such as video-editing, games, or a more permanent desktop replacement then go with the other models. In my case, I have my Mac Pro desktop to take care of business when I'm at home. I have no desire to use a laptop as a desktop replacement or to play videogames on it. However, I do understand that other people do look for those features in a laptop. That is what it MBP is for.

Just because it's not appropriate for you, it doesn't mean it's not appropriate for other users. We just have different requirements just as you do. Obviously it must be selling well and filling a niche since Apple is going to continuing it in its product lineup.

Go Apple!

[DavidW]

Originally Posted by mcarling

I agree with solipsism and wobegon. It's time to drop the internal optical drive from the full notebook line. The MacBook Air has proven that internal optical disks are unneeded. I believe Steve has the vision and the guts to do it. Apple was the first computer company to drop the floppy drive. It was a good move.

Why drop it? I'm still using an Apple G3 Pismo PowerBook (cirra 2000) that has a removable CD/DVD-rom drive. In it's place, I can place a second battery to extend battery run time for the time that I won't be needing a CD/DVD-rom drive. Or leave it empty to save on weight.

But I guess having a removable drive no longer fits into Apple sleek design form factor.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by fpsanders

I have a MBA for about half a year now and although it felt weird to not have an optical drive, I'm not missing it any more.
......

My wife has had an MBA since the day it came out. I insisted that she get the external optical drive. And, she has so far used it exactly zero times.

Could have used that $99 for something else.....

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by gmon750

Obviously it must be selling well and filling a niche since Apple is going to continuing it in its product lineup.

As well as others copying the design right down to the chipset, screen size, and 1.8" HDD.

Originally Posted by DavidW

Why drop it? I'm still using an Apple G3 Pismo PowerBook (cirra 2000) that has a removable CD/DVD-rom drive. In it's place, I can place a second battery to extend battery run time for the time that I won't be needing a CD/DVD-rom drive. Or leave it empty to save on weight.

But I guess having a removable drive no longer fits into Apple sleek design form factor.

It takes up a lot of room for how much it gets used. The size and fact that it has to be on an edge of the case constricts the engineering options available. If they do remove the optical drive I see four possible scenarios:

....• They offer a restore DVD and offer the Air's external optical drive as an option.
....• They offer a restore DVD and offer the Air's external optical drive included with purchase.
....• They do what Dell and HP do with their low-end system's restore software: they put it on a hidden HDD partition and give you a jewel case-sized leaflet that tells you should use the supplied software to burn it to a DVD. (This takes up too much space)
....• The replace the DVD with a specialised USB flash keychain drive. (Since it would require a 16GB drive this is cost prohibitive)


PS: When doing some minor research I found this 8GB flash keychain drive from less than 4 years being sold for $1800.

• http://www.engadget.com/2004/12/07/p...eychain-drive/

PPS: DavidW, how often do you use your optical drive?

[gmon750]

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

My wife has had an MBA since the day it came out. I insisted that she get the external optical drive. And, she has so far used it exactly zero times.

Could have used that $99 for something else.....

I've used my external CD for my MBA only a few times. It was to load VMware/XP and the one Windows-only development app from IBM that obviously is not available for download.

My previous laptop was a Sony Vaio S360P which I loved up until a burning aroma began escaping from the fan exhaust. I used the CD in that machine maybe 5 times in the three years I've owned it.

I don't miss an internal CD drive at all. It's a waste of space in today's Internet-downloading environment and USB memory-stick world. The less mechanical items in a laptop, the better.

Next on Jobs' hit-list: Mechanical hard drives. It's not "if" but "when".

[piot]

Originally Posted by mrjoec123

I think Apple should consider sponsoring a major music venue. Put their name and logo on an amphitheater in a major city, and sponsor major music concerts there.

http://www.ituneslive.co.uk/

[jfanning]

Originally Posted by gmon750

I don't miss an internal CD drive at all. It's a waste of space in today's Internet-downloading environment and USB memory-stick world. The less mechanical items in a laptop, the better.

There is still a large part of the world that doesn't have fast enough internet connections to warrant this

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by jfanning

There is still a large part of the world that doesn't have fast enough internet connections to warrant this

He the poster you replied to stated, there is a USB sticks, There is also external optical drives but I think, mpst importantly, Apple thinks about the high-end US market first. Its Bread and Butter in Mac sales.

[gmon750]

Originally Posted by jfanning

There is still a large part of the world that doesn't have fast enough internet connections to warrant this

That's why they still offer a CD option. It's just in an external format. I bought the MBA's external CD because certain business software only comes on CD. After I loaded them, the CD-drive went back in the original case and closed the cabinet door. I'll only use it again should I have to reload the OS or WinXP for whatever reason.