T-Mobile sets stage for Android, iPhone showdown next week

[AppleInsider]

An invitation sent out on Tuesday by T-Mobile asks the media to gather next week to see the first phone built on the Android mobile platform, but will also pit Apple and Google against each other -- if reluctantly.

The notice encourages the press to attend a New York City event on September 23rd that will mark the debut of both the phone and the software it depends on.

While little else is contained in the release itself, a string of leaks have essentially spoiled the carrier's plans in advance and imply a direct competitor to the iPhone and other full-touchscreen cellphones.

Once known as the HTC Dream, the device to eventually be called the G1 under T-Mobile has actually been in the public eye in Google demonstrations almost since Android's public unveiling last year. The device has garnered attention through photos and other leaks for the sheer number of features claimed to be under its wing: on top of its touchscreen, the display will slide out like Danger's Sidekick to expose a full keyboard and carry a BlackBerry-like trackball.

As is increasingly becoming the norm for user-friendly smartphones, the G1 is also reputedly packed with features. Some reports have the inaugural Android handset launching T-Mobile's 3G network on a national level, while numerous sources have also pegged GPS navigation, a tilt sensor and Wi-Fi to the device.

T-Mobile's invitation to journalists for the Android event. | Image credits: Gearlog.

Just hours before T-Mobile's invite hit the wires, the Wall Street Journal went so far as to claim sources that reported a late-October release for the HTC-made Android phone, tentatively removing one of the last pieces of the puzzle for the special announcement.

Whatever hardware is showcased at the high-profile occasion, it's likely to be the software that creates the most tension. The touchscreen version of Android has been been compared repeatedly to the iPhone despite significant alterations over its ten months of public appearances and even included the introduction of a close parallel to the iPhone's App Store known as Android Market.

Most differences in code have instead been a matter of policy. Where Apple has imposed a non-disclosure agreement on iPhone developers, limited their hardware access and pulled apps from the App Store for controversial reasons such as competition, Google has insisted on a primarily open-source approach that takes its hands off of much of the development process; developers can not only share code but are even allowed to access components that would normally be off-limits, such as the phone dialer.

And though Apple and Google are ostensibly close allies that share software technology, the tensions created by Android have also had a small impact in Apple's board room, with Google chief and Apple board member Eric Schmidt having to leave meetings as the company discusses iPhone plans that might conflict with Android's strategy.

Still, the Mountain View, Calif.-based search giant has been confident enough to demo a virtually complete Android on a G1 at a London developer meetup just a week before T-Mobile's event and argued that the quality and accessibility of Android apps would carry the day even if hardware is the same, particularly against legacy smartphone platforms such as Windows Mobile.

An excerpt of that demo is available to watch below.

[coolfactor]

The difference is that Apple is both the software and the hardware vender. Apple needs their handset approved by the cell networks. Google doesn't have that concern. They just build the sandbox and it's up to the hardware makers to pick and choose which features get implemented.

[g3pro]

Sweet stuff, hopefully I'll be able to get the G1 for use on the AT&T network.

[alansky]

The number one reason for the iPhone's tremendous popularity, imho, is the iPhone's incredibly easy-to-use interface. The iPhone made is supremely easy to use features like web browsing and email that were already offered on other smart phones but were rarely used because of poor implementation. This is how the iPhone changed everything. T-Mobile's Android phone cannot beat the iPhone by offering a longer list of features. If it is harder to use, it will fail.

[g3pro]

Originally Posted by alansky

The number one reason for the iPhone's tremendous popularity, imho, is the iPhone's incredibly easy-to-use interface. The iPhone made is supremely easy to use features like web browsing and email that were already offered on other smart phones but were rarely used because of poor implementation. This is how the iPhone changed everything. T-Mobile's Android phone cannot beat the iPhone by offering a longer list of features. If it is harder to use, it will fail.

RDF much?

How come the iPhone in Japan is barely taking off the ground? The people I talk with think the iPhone is passé at this point. It really is just another cellphone. Get used to it. Most other manufacturers have already caught up or are catching up and surpassing the iPhone.

Don't dismiss the features of the new phones. Apple could certainly learn a thing or two from them.

[NasserAE]

This is good. This will push Apple to improve the current and future iPhone by adding more features and better components.

[SpamSandwich]

Originally Posted by g3pro

RDF much?

How come the iPhone in Japan is barely taking off the ground? The people I talk with think the iPhone is passé at this point. It really is just another cellphone. Get used to it. Most other manufacturers have already caught up or are catching up and surpassing the iPhone.

Don't dismiss the features of the new phones. Apple could certainly learn a thing or two from them.

Clearly, app developers are not warming to the iPhone in Japan. It's such a great platform to develop for, perhaps the ramp up will just take longer there.

[iVlad]

How Sad. He was talking about nothing while page was loading and asking if people have hacked the wifi already. That's sooooooo ssssaaaadddd!!!

[g3pro]

Originally Posted by SpamSandwich

Clearly, app developers are not warming to the iPhone in Japan. It's such a great platform to develop for, perhaps the ramp up will just take longer there.

I'm hoping that once Apple (hopefully) opens up the platform to all comers without worrying about "competition" from independent developers, more people will start developing for the iPhone. I'm not optimistic however.

The issue that set me over the edge was the banning by Apple of the tethering application. I'm sure developers in Japan feel the same way.

[iPeon]

Originally Posted by g3pro

RDF much?

Clearly you do. But why bother pointing the obvious when the obvious isn't understood.

[digitalclips]

Dell phone surely on way ...

[Maxhomie]

Originally Posted by g3pro

The people I talk with think the iPhone is passé at this point. It really is just another cellphone. Get used to it. Most other manufacturers have already caught up or are catching up and surpassing the iPhone.

Don't dismiss the features of the new phones. Apple could certainly learn a thing or two from them.

Oh, give me a break...are the "people you're talking to" employees of T-Mobile, Google, Nokia and RIM? The iPhone has its issues, but it hasn't come close to being surpassed or caught up with by any competitor. We are talking about phone companies that still churn out phones with clumsy interfaces and loads of poorly implemented proprietary features. Suddenly, Android turns them into sleek, trendsetting market leaders?

I am looking forward to seeing what other phone manufacturers come out with based on Android, because competition is a good thing, but the phone companies are still going through their own baby steps with the new software platform. There are going to be a lot more lipstick-wearing pigs out there before a truly credible phone leverages Android to surpass the iPhone.

[VinitaBoy]

@MacOldTimer

You poor, pathetic, whining, whipped, defeated, sad senior citizen. So "Apple needs to get off its behind an [sic] offer some usable iPhone/Touch applications," eh? So nothing they've done this far matches up to . . . to . . . VAPORWARE? So, the fact that the App Store has generated more interest by a huge multiplicative factor than all of the "also-rans" COMBINED--COMBINED!--means nothing to you? So, the fact that the iPhone has SINGLE-HANDEDLY revolutionized the smartphone market is meaningless to you? By the end of this year (if not quarter) the iPhone will have surpassed WinMob's market share in only the second year of its existence, or are you unaware of that projection?

How truly easy it is to defeat you, sir or madam. IYHO, Version 2.1 is the complete and utter end of the iPhone development cycle, isn't it? Oh, woe is you, alas and alack!

For the love of Gawd, PLEASE, PLEASE defect to Android (again: VAPORWARE!) and spare the rest of us your breast-beating and hair-shirting machinations, OK? Jeez, how I do loathe you and your tribe.

[digitalclips]

Originally Posted by Maxhomie

Oh, give me a break...are the "people you're talking to" employees of T-Mobile, Google, Nokia and RIM? The iPhone has its issues, but it hasn't come close to being surpassed or caught up with by any competitor. We are talking about phone companies that still churn out phones with clumsy interfaces and loads of poorly implemented proprietary features. Suddenly, Android turns them into sleek, trendsetting market leaders?

I am looking forward to seeing what other phone manufacturers come out with based on Android, because competition is a good thing, but the phone companies are still going through their own baby steps with the new software platform. There are going to be a lot more lipstick-wearing pigs out there before a truly credible phone leverages Android to surpass the iPhone.

Totally correct.

[TenoBell]

Originally Posted by g3pro

How come the iPhone in Japan is barely taking off the ground? The people I talk with think the iPhone is passé at this point. It really is just another cellphone. Get used to it. Most other manufacturers have already caught up or are catching up and surpassing the iPhone.

People are getting this Japan story completely wrong. The iPhone is selling well in Japan just not in the same numbers as the US or Europe. According to estimates Apple has made nearly half a billion in revenue from Japan alone. That is not failure.

Exactly which phones have caught up to the iPhone? Exactly what way have they caught up?

[TenoBell]

Originally Posted by MacOldTimer

That said… There are many coming out with A LOT of potential to do it. Rim (Thunder), numerous offerings from many cell manufacturers with Android.

Those phones are still on paper at this point. We have to wait until they are actually in use.

Apple needs to get off its behind an offer some usable iPhone/Touch applications.

Their are over 3000 native apps and 2500 web apps available to the iPhone and iTouch. What do you feel is missing?

I bought the 3G with GPS and the only thing it offers me is a dot where I am in Google maps. That is not GPS.

What do you define as GPS?

Apple (IMHO) has sold out its end users and is looking out for #1.

In the long run every company is looking out for themselves first.

[stokessd]

The lack of pinch in maps, and pinch and tapping to zoom regions in the browser are going to make the user experience a lot more klunky feeling. I do like the freedom aspect of it, but it doesn't look nearly as polished from a scrolling and zooming perspective. And face it with such a tiny screen we do a lot of zooming and scrolling.

When an manufacturer gets that right, the phone feels right.

Sheldon

[Ireland]

+ and - to zoom in the browser.

Try not to think of the iPhone when he demos how stupid the zoom feature is on Android.

[beingnickb]

OMG it is not Apple so it sucks!!!

Jesus people open your minds. I love how everyone is so quick to criticize something they have no real experience in.

I love my iPhone. But I am always looking for the next best thing... even if it is not made by Apple.

By the way, this phone will not be called the G1, either...

[bsenka]

Originally Posted by g3pro

The people I talk with think the iPhone is passé at this point. It really is just another cellphone. Get used to it. Most other manufacturers have already caught up or are catching up and surpassing the iPhone.

Not even close. The buzz for the iPhone is still building. The only thing that will make the iPhone passe is if they don't expand to other carriers. They haven't reached the limit of their current partners yet, but eventually they will.

[satchmo]

Originally Posted by Maxhomie

We are talking about phone companies that still churn out phones with clumsy interfaces and loads of poorly implemented proprietary features. Suddenly, Android turns them into sleek, trendsetting market leaders?

Problem is, 90% of the population doesn't give a rat's ass about poorly implemented features. Look how successful Windows has been. So anything that remotely approaches Apple's iPhone in functionality could do well.

There's enough of a market for many to succeed. I suspect Android will certainly help the many cellphone manufacturers who have been saddled with really really bad interfaces.

[crees!]

Originally Posted by MacOldTimer

I'd hardly consider 42 the age of a Sad Senior Citizen.

It doesn't matter what Apple did yesterday. The market and business is what can you do today. Apple hasn't shown much in the Mobile OS market other than one blunder after another since the 3G came out. That is where Market Share is won.

It's a posting like yours that is going to lead to the demise (that would be "the end" for you OMG text fans) of Apple as a Phone OS.

Following every step Apple makes as the "Gospel".

I have said it many times on the boards. I'm a FAN of technology not a fan of a Vendor. Apple has just had the superior products.

The Video market is jumping Ship with Apple (as of today) because they fear Apple will create the same Monopoly (that would be the majority of the market OMG) they did with iTunes.

The market is tired of Apple being a closed loop and so am I.

And Yes I would jump ship if a better phone with an OS that is as user friendly and gave more freedom to it’s developers.

Remember. I’m old and can afford to jump ship when that day comes.

Edit.
I define GPS as a usable turn by turn voice navigation as every other phone manufacturer does.

A dot on a map does nothing when you're driving alone.

That is NOT GPS.

[tundraboy]

The basic problem with one software platform designed to run on multiple hardware manufacturers: Complexity run amuck.

There's this basic unresolved and unresolvable conflict between the software company (MS for Windows, Google for Android) and the hardware manufacturers (PCs, smartphones). The software provider wants the client hardware to be as undifferentiated as possible across manufacturers so that they only need to develop one universal version. OTOH no hardware manufacturer will agree to commoditize their product so they will push for as much differentiation as possible. The result of course is that the software platform becomes more and more complex as it seeks to accommodate each manufacturer's idiosyncratic features in that one universal platform --leading to a level of complexity that is so unmanageable that it bogs down the platform's whole ecosystem.

Android may work great early on but as the number of Android smartphone models rise, the Android platform will just keep getting more complex, more buggy, and more bloated until one day people will be complaining "Why can't Android be more like iPhone?"

Old story, same ending.

[Daniel0418]

Originally Posted by TenoBell

People are getting this Japan story completely wrong. The iPhone is selling well in Japan just not in the same numbers as the US or Europe. According to estimates Apple has made nearly half a billion in revenue from Japan alone. That is not failure.

Exactly which phones have caught up to the iPhone? Exactly what way have they caught up?

iPhone is doing bad in japan. Let'sgive apple the benefit of the doubt and say they have sold 300,000 which they haven't. On one single Japanese mobile carrier that has 19,000,000 customers that is all it has sold. That's not that good. A success would be a phone like the first razor or the blackberry. Phones that have sold millions. In japan sharp is one of the leading phones. Anyway... I hve the 3g but I am excited to see if the android is worth buying I hate the iPhone. I almost never have 3g... In LA it drops down to 0 bars in buildings so apples slogan should be... "iPhone 3g, twice has fast, half the time" it would be more true. The gps is very inaccurate. I get to a streeet 10-15 seconds before the blue dot. Sometimes it won't even find me. Anyway Woot go google I can't wait to see if your a good phone. Though I do like AT&T more than tmobile. T mobile had poor (non 3g) service when I had them but that was 5 years ago

[melgross]

Originally Posted by MacOldTimer

Edit.
I define GPS as a usable turn by turn voice navigation as every other phone manufacturer does.

A dot on a map does nothing when you're driving alone.

That's not a good definition for a GPS. Most GPS's on the market for handheld use don't do that either. Neither do most phones that include GPS.

If you want to say "automotive navigation device using GPS", then no, so far, it isn't that. You can get a couple of cheap programs that turn it into a handheld GPS unit with way points and such. That's also a GPS.

But we do know of at least two companies in that end of the software business that are working on applications for the iPhone that do that.

[TenoBell]

Originally Posted by MacOldTimer

It doesn't matter what Apple did yesterday. The market and business is what can you do today. Apple hasn't shown much in the Mobile OS market other than one blunder after another since the 3G came out. That is where Market Share is won.

I'm not sure what you are talking about. Over all the iPhone 3G has been well reviewed and received.

I'm not sure what your meaning of marketshare but the iPhone's is growing by leaps and bounds cutting into the marketshare of mobile phone leaders.

The Video market is jumping Ship with Apple (as of today) because they fear Apple will create the same Monopoly (that would be the majority of the market OMG) they did with iTunes.

That's not entirely true. iTunes is the largest vendor of video downloads. You are right in that movie studios don't want Apple to have the same control as they have in music. Largely because Apple will not give them the flexibility to raise prices.

The market is tired of Apple being a closed loop and so am I.

Anyone is free to compete and come up with a better service.

I define GPS as a usable turn by turn voice navigation as every other phone manufacturer does.

A dot on a map does nothing when you're driving alone.

The broad definition of GPS is a receiver that calculates its position through radio signals from a constellation of orbiting satellites. That is the blue dot. Turn by turn navigation is a specific feature that can be implemented supported by GPS.

From what we've heard Apple is still working on the API's that will support turn by turn directions.

[TenoBell]

Originally Posted by Daniel0418

iPhone is doing bad in japan. Let'sgive apple the benefit of the doubt and say they have sold 300,000 which they haven't. On one single Japanese mobile carrier that has 19,000,000 customers that is all it has sold. That's not that good. A success would be a phone like the first razor or the blackberry. Phones that have sold millions. In japan sharp is one of the leading phones.

The WSJ story estimates Softbank has sold 200,000 in its first two months with sales slowing since the introduction.

Who ever set the metric that a phone has to sell millions in its first quarter to be a success? What other phone in Japan costing $320 sold millions in its first couple of months? The first Razor nor first Blackberry did not sell millions in their first months of sales.

[melgross]

Originally Posted by TenoBell

The WSJ story estimates Softbank has sold 200,000 in its first two months with sales slowing since the introduction.

Who ever set the metric that a phone has to sell millions in its first quarter to be a success? What other phone in Japan costing $320 sold millions in its first couple of months? The first Razor nor first Blackberry did not sell millions in their first months of sales.

I have to agree with you on this one. The US has 2.35 times the population of Japan. So those 200,000 sales would translate out to over 470,000 sales here.

Thats pretty good!
Anyone expecting a runaway hit was off their rocker. I've been saying that it will sell well there, not that it would take over. That's just plain silly.

[TenoBell]

Originally Posted by melgross

I have to agree with you on this one. The US has 2.35 times the population of Japan. So those 200,000 sales would translate out to over 470,000 sales here.

Thats pretty good!
Anyone expecting a runaway hit was off their rocker. I've been saying that it will sell well there, not that it would take over. That's just plain silly.

I agree. The WSJ journal article puts it in perspective with Nokia. Nokia holds the largest market share of non-Japanese phones. With a 1% marketshare, 500,000 in sales. 200,000 is really good in comparison.

[bloggerblog]

Originally Posted by NasserAE

This is good. This will push Apple to improve the current and future iPhone by adding more features and better components.

Apple should focus more on reliability, robustness, and intensive testing. Same goes for OS X and especially OS X Server.

[SXT1]

Originally Posted by crees!

That is NOT GPS.

A-GPS maybe ?
I think turn-by-turn (assisted) GPS is sooooo basic these days that it should have been fully working on iPhone.
I only wan't to buy a 3G if the gps is fully working and not lagging (seconds) and not depends of any internet connection to get the google-maps ! Then I can throw away the tom-tom-thing away and live my life with only 1 device in my pocket, the iPhone (replacing 3 devices, being: ipod, phone and gps) with the added functionality that applications give me (almost giving my an extra gaming console in my pocket too)... just my idea :-)

[SXT1]

Originally Posted by TenoBell

I agree. The WSJ journal article puts it in perspective with Nokia. Nokia holds the largest market share of non-Japanese phones. With a 1% marketshare, 500,000 in sales. 200,000 is really good in comparison.

And Nokia is on that market for a decade .... don't forget that too !

[winterspan]

Originally Posted by g3pro

RDF much?

How come the iPhone in Japan is barely taking off the ground? The people I talk with think the iPhone is passé at this point. It really is just another cellphone. Get used to it. Most other manufacturers have already caught up or are catching up and surpassing the iPhone.

Don't dismiss the features of the new phones. Apple could certainly learn a thing or two from them.

Apple could learn a few things, but the OP is correct as to the importance of the iPhone's superior interface and ease of use than other smartphones. I've been in this game for ten years, and I certainly agree that the iPhone was a game changer. I've used every "smartphone" OS, and nothing right now comes even close. That is not to say the iPhone is perfect -- far from it. And Apple definitely needs to WAKE UP and start treating their developers better. They need to kill the NDA nonsense and let developers collaborate amongst each other. They also need to better organize the app store to separate great apps from the crapware and lay out an explicit and comprehensive guide for accepting their policies on accepting and rejecting applications to the App store. If they continue to treat developers poorly, many of them will move to other platforms, especially if Android takes off.

As much as I like Google, I love the iPhone and believe mobile OSX is the best platform from a technical and aesthetic standpoint -- Apple just needs to get the heck out of the way and let the developer community do what they do best. I certainly DON'T WANT to see good developers and software companies get discouraged with Apple and have Android leapfrog Apple in popularity and marketshare. We all know exactly what that would look like and the consequences of that. It would be another round of the 1980's-1990's crappy/knock-off but mass market and cheap "Windows PC" vs expensive closed-system Apple Macs.

[SXT1]

Originally Posted by bloggerblog

Apple should focus more on reliability, robustness, and intensive testing. Same goes for OS X and especially OS X Server.

Absolutly. The code they deliver contains more and more bugs that I get more the impression they pull out beta's (look at iPhone OS 2.0 and Leopard's initial release) and try to get it right with a quick update. Looks to my like they can't deliver on time any more. Maybe the actual code-base has swellen to large ? Hopefully they learn the lesson and get a new grip with Snow Leopard. Before they get in the same lane as Microsoft ! We're used to get good software, ad least they got a reputation for that. Bad software gets people complaining about the hardware eventualy... Look what happend with the iPhone 2.0 ! And Apple's still a hardware company, no ?

[hdasmith]

Originally Posted by SXT1

A-GPS maybe ?
I think turn-by-turn (assisted) GPS is sooooo basic these days that it should have been fully working on iPhone.
I only wan't to buy a 3G if the gps is fully working and not lagging (seconds) and not depends of any internet connection to get the google-maps ! Then I can throw away the tom-tom-thing away and live my life with only 1 device in my pocket, the iPhone (replacing 3 devices, being: ipod, phone and gps) with the added functionality that applications give me (almost giving my an extra gaming console in my pocket too)... just my idea :-)

No... A-GPS or assissted GPS uses cell towers to help the GPS to get a location faster. What you are all asking for is satellite navigation, or SatNav as the marketing people call it.

For those talking about apple adding the APIs for this, they don't need to. A clever programmer can calculate the velocity using a streamof GPS data. That's all the API will do. I think apple must be holding up satnav features on purpose, maybe because of battery or maybe because or data sizes. I don't know, but the functionality is there.

[JeffDM]

Originally Posted by hdasmith

No... A-GPS or assissted GPS uses cell towers to help the GPS to get a location faster. What you are all asking for is satellite navigation, or SatNav as the marketing people call it.

Isn't this kind of a diversion or unnecessary hair splitting from the perspective of this discussion? I ask this because all the GPS units I've seen lately have a turn-by-turn navigation feature anyway, it's assumed to be a feature that's expected of GPS devices now. From a technical perspective, you're right, but from a consumer perspective, it's missing a very basic feature, I don't think anyone sets out to buy a GPS only to get one that doesn't have dynamic turn-by-turn. These days, it's almost like getting raisin bran without the raisins and still calling it raisin bran.

For those talking about apple adding the APIs for this, they don't need to. A clever programmer can calculate the velocity using a streamof GPS data. That's all the API will do. I think apple must be holding up satnav features on purpose, maybe because of battery or maybe because or data sizes. I don't know, but the functionality is there.

The suggestion that it's a battery life issue doesn't work for me. If you're in a car, at least you have a good chance of getting power from the car. Of the other possible issues, I think there may be some negotiations going on with one of the established GPS companies, or the feature is not finished yet. Data size is not a problem. Even a 4GB iPhone should have plenty of room.

[Steve's son]

That guy talked like a dummy. If they ever expect to sell there product they will surly need to create a Apple similar speech environment. Things we're just to similar to the iPhone also. The customers will see that.

[irnchriz]

Shame Apple has the patents for multitouch. This is about as impressive as the latest WinMo offerings from Sony et al.

[irnchriz]

Originally Posted by SXT1

A-GPS maybe ?
I think turn-by-turn (assisted) GPS is sooooo basic these days that it should have been fully working on iPhone.
I only wan't to buy a 3G if the gps is fully working and not lagging (seconds) and not depends of any internet connection to get the google-maps ! Then I can throw away the tom-tom-thing away and live my life with only 1 device in my pocket, the iPhone (replacing 3 devices, being: ipod, phone and gps) with the added functionality that applications give me (almost giving my an extra gaming console in my pocket too)... just my idea :-)

On other handsets GPS navigation is supplied by third party software. And the software is generally shit.

Hopefully Tom Tom will release an iPhone app that will let you store your maps in memory like the winmo version does.

Why Tom Tom? I like sticking the Ozzy voice over on... 'at the r..r..r..oundabout take the f..f..f..irst f..f..f..fuckin exit' by the time he is finished you missed your exit. LOL

[hdasmith]

Originally Posted by JeffDM

Isn't this kind of a diversion or unnecessary hair splitting from the perspective of this discussion? I ask this because all the GPS units I've seen lately have a turn-by-turn navigation feature anyway, it's assumed to be a feature that's expected of GPS devices now. From a technical perspective, you're right, but from a consumer perspective, it's missing a very basic feature, I don't think anyone sets out to buy a GPS only to get one that doesn't have dynamic turn-by-turn. These days, it's almost like getting raisin bran without the raisins and still calling it raisin bran.

You're right, I am just being pedantic, but that's because I use GPS units that aren't meant for cars, and therefore see the majority of GPS units as not being SatNavs. I sail and walk and use GPS for both, neither of which that I use have maps, and only give a longitude and latitude. For me, that's the biggest missing feature of the GPS that comes with the iPhone. Thankfully, 3rd parties have fixed that one.

As for SatNavs, I'm going to keep my standalone Garmin. One, because Garmin are much more established than TomTom with better accuracy and often a faster location, and two, TomToms in Britain are pretty hopeless with post codes (our equivalent of zip codes, but they go litterally down to a few houses, or if you're in the sticks, one house, rather than the larger areas a zip code covers). Friends with TomToms have been left in the middle of a field up to 50 miles from their destination.