Update: 'home' activation no signal of unlocked US iPhone sales

[AppleInsider]

New information has clarified that the home activation option visible to Apple Store retail employees actually relates to sales made where the customer pre-qualifies at home, rather than the potential for new unlocked iPhone 3G sales offered without a subsidy.

During the iPhone 3G activation process, retail employees report, new iPhones originally ring up as $299 or $399, and are then discounted in the activation process using an instant rebate from AT&T that is tied to setting up a new contract.

AT&T customers who have already been credited with a recent phone unit subsidy aren't eligible for the discount. Some other customers have mobile contracts that are paid by their employer or involve other special circumstances that Apple retail employees aren't able to process as a regular sale.

In order to service these customers, a special home pre-qualification web site has been set up so that users can find if they are qualified by AT&T for a phone unit subsidy. Users can set up their account at home so that everything is ready to go when they make their iPhone 3G purchase at a retail store.

The new "Home" option that retail employees are seeing on their EasyPay terminals is designed to allow them to use this home pre-qualification step to accelerate the transaction of a new iPhone 3G. That also indicates there is no impending potential for unlocked iPhone 3G sales in the US, although this is expected at some point.

Also on the horizon is a reshuffling of iPhone 3G models, with the likely introduction of a 32GB model and the discontinuation of the 8GB unit. However, the 8GB version continues to enjoy widespread popularity and additional checks with other retail stores indicates that there does not appear to be any immediate plan to drop the model.

Based upon the historical timing of the introduction of last year's updates, a new 32GB iPhone 3G is not likely to be introduced until after the holiday season.

[teckstud]

Wow- now I can sleep tonight.

[Bageljoey]

Originally Posted by teckstud

Wow- now I can sleep tonight.

(or you can check AI again a few more times--just in case there is any new info...)

[ksec]

Originally Posted by Bageljoey

(or you can check AI again a few more times--just in case there is any new info...)

Haha, me too. i will be pretty pissed if they get out a iPhone 32G now. If it was after Xmas then it will be fine.

[BenRoethig]

As for the unlocked iPhone, how many other networks can it be used on? T-Mobile uses a slightly different 3G variant than AT&T and Europe and the vast majority of the rest of the U.S. market uses CDMA.

[nvidia2008]

Of course for USA and UK there will be no unlocked iPhone3Gs for at least until the end of the year. No way ATT and O2 are going to give up any of that lucrative holiday season sales.

The prepaid/ home activation/ whatever is just so that they can move (ie. sell) large, large amounts of iPhone 3Gs in November and December. Because the Apple Stores are mad enough during these peak times of the year, if they continue to have in store activation Apple Stores US and UK are f*ked.

[nvidia2008]

Singapore by end of the year will have different carriers selling it, most likely. But Singapore iPhone 3Gs are fullly unlocked anyway like Belgium and Italy.

[abrooks]

Originally Posted by nvidia2008

Of course for USA and UK there will be no unlocked iPhone3Gs for at least until the end of the year. No way ATT and O2 are going to give up any of that lucrative holiday season sales.

The iPhone 3G is available on pay as you go in the UK from O2.

[mrtotes]

Originally Posted by abrooks

The iPhone 3G is available on pay as you go in the UK from O2.

Entirely true, but also irrelevant in this case.

PAYG phones are still locked to their service provider. (Although CPW did (do?) have a good policy of selling unlocked phones with a PAYG SIM card)

[sapporobaby]

Right now, in Finland Sonera is facing a revolt of sorts. Hundreds of Sonera customers that purchased the iPhone have started canceling their contracts. While technically they can not cancel them before two years, they have signaled their intent to cancel. Sonera is trying to keep a lid on the problem but it should be public soon. As there are plenty of iPhones available in Finland, Sonera is looking to renegotiate their contract with Apple to allow unlocking sooner rather than later. Never before has a customer purchased a device at full price and still have it locked. These Finns are uber pissed.

[solipsism]

Originally Posted by abrooks

The iPhone 3G is available on pay as you go in the UK from O2.

But still not unlocked.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Right now, in Finland Sonera is facing a revolt of sorts. Hundreds of Sonera customers that purchased the iPhone have started canceling their contracts. While technically they can not cancel them before two years, they have signaled their intent to cancel. Sonera is trying to keep a lid on the problem but it should be public soon. As there are plenty of iPhones available in Finland, Sonera is looking to renegotiate their contract with Apple to allow unlocking sooner rather than later. Never before has a customer purchased a device at full price and still have it locked. These Finns are uber pissed.

I understand that the Finns might be annoyed, but sales volume in Finland will not make or break the iPhone.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

I understand that the Finns might be annoyed, but sales volume in Finland will not make or break the iPhone.

Who said anything about sales volume? I was commenting on the contracts that some operators (one that I know of in particular) sign that in the end will screw them and this is one of them. And regardless of volume sales, Apple is in the biz to make money, pure and simple. They didn't develop the iPhone as a gift to humanity. They developed it as a way to get your money, no matter where it comes from or how much.

[samab]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Who said anything about sales volume? I was commenting on the contracts that some operators (one that I know of in particular) sign that in the end will screw them and this is one of them. And regardless of volume sales, Apple is in the biz to make money, pure and simple. They didn't develop the iPhone as a gift to humanity. They developed it as a way to get your money, no matter where it comes from or how much.

Why is it Apple's fault? Why is renegotiation by Sonera necessary?

Sonera can sell iphones totally unlocked from the start --- they didn't do it because they decided to simlock the iphone. It has nothing to do with Apple.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Who said anything about sales volume?

Who said you said anything about sales volume?

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by samab

Why is it Apple's fault? Why is renegotiation by Sonera necessary?

Sonera can sell iphones totally unlocked from the start --- they didn't do it because they decided to simlock the iphone. It has nothing to do with Apple.

Exactly. Much better put.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

Who said you said anything about sales volume?

See post number 12, your post then get back to me. You mentioned sale volumes in your post and I commented on it. Pure and simple.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

Exactly. Much better put.

If you agree with him then you are equally as WRONG.

Have you not read what I posted? Did it go by you? Apple imposed these restrictions on Sonera, not the other way around. Apple required that Sonera locked the phones with a 2 year subscription. This subscription has now backfired and Sonera has the potential to lose customers because Apple has a monolithic US/North American business model.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

See post number 12, your post then get back to me. You mentioned sale volumes in your post and I commented on it. Pure and simple.

I did as you suggested, and am getting back to you: all I can say is, stop sounding so churlish. I (not you) simply responded to your post by making a point that whether Finns return the iPhone or not matters little to Apple in terms of their global sales volume.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

I did as you suggested, and am getting back to you: all I can say is, stop sounding so churlish.

Universal translation: Oh, I guess I was wrong but won't admit it.....

By the way, I don't take orders from you but keep trying.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Apple imposed these restrictions on Sonera, not the other way around.

That's just your claim at the moment.

Please advance the discussion by providing a credible link, cite, whatever: I am certainly wiling to be corrected on this (or any other point). Otherwise, move along.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

That's just your claim at the moment.

Please advance the discussion by providing a credible link, cite, whatever: I am certainly wiling to be corrected on this (or any other point). Otherwise, move along.

News flash, I do not care if you believe me. I really don't. I will take the word of several friends that work for Sonera over your "virtual" word any day. Your willingness to be corrected or not has no bearing on me one way or another. See it works like this. People need money to buy things, i.e. food. toilet paper, G.I. Joe with the Kung Fu Grip. They keep their jobs but giving me tidbits of information but without posting a link to the actual contract or giving any major details that can be linked back to them, thus cutting of their source of income. Did I explain it well enough for you? Trying to help you out as best I can. Otherwise..... you fill in the blank.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

News flash, I do not care if you believe me. I really don't. I will take the word of several friends that work for Sonera over your "virtual" word any day. Your willingness to be corrected or not has no bearing on me one way or another. Otherwise..... you fill in the blank.

Obviously, you can't provide a link or a cite. It's just a bald assertion.

[bpatton]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

News flash, I do not care if you believe me. I really don't. I will take the word of several friends that work for Sonera over your "virtual" word any day. Your willingness to be corrected or not has no bearing on me one way or another. See it works like this. People need money to buy things, i.e. food. toilet paper, G.I. Joe with the Kung Fu Grip. They keep their jobs but giving me tidbits of information but without posting a link to the actual contract or giving any major details that can be linked back to them, thus cutting of their source of income. Did I explain it well enough for you? Trying to help you out as best I can. Otherwise..... you fill in the blank.

Then you should not be complaining when others question the credibility of your statements.

[samab]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

News flash, I do not care if you believe me. I really don't. I will take the word of several friends that work for Sonera over your "virtual" word any day. Your willingness to be corrected or not has no bearing on me one way or another. See it works like this. People need money to buy things, i.e. food. toilet paper, G.I. Joe with the Kung Fu Grip. They keep their jobs but giving me tidbits of information but without posting a link to the actual contract or giving any major details that can be linked back to them, thus cutting of their source of income. Did I explain it well enough for you? Trying to help you out as best I can. Otherwise..... you fill in the blank.

You said your friend at Sonera said a lot of things --- and everything turned out to be wrong.

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=88272

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

Obviously, you can't provide a link or a cite. It's just a bald assertion.

I never said it was anything other than hearsay from some friends that work there. To date, I never had any reason to doubt their words. If they say that Apple put Sonera in a bind, then for me, Apple put Sonera in a bind. It can not be simpler than this.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by bpatton

Then you should not be complaining when others question the credibility of your statements.

People can question all they want, or believe all they want. As I will state again, and possibly again, the info I posted came from people who are friends that work for Sonera. Considering I trust them infinitely more than anyone on this site, for me their words are golden.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by samab

You said your friend at Sonera said a lot of things --- and everything turned out to be wrong.

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=88272

Glad you brought this up. Look at the date of that post. It was before Sonera (of Sweden, not Finland) made any public commitments regarding the pricing plans. Sonera (of Sweden again) looked around and saw that others were charging much more and they did the same, with Sonera (Finland this time having to follow what Sweden tells them to do). My friends work for Sonera here in Finland and not Sweden so info they have here is subject to change according to info released in Sweden.

Clear enough for you?

[samab]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Glad you brought this up. Look at the date of that post. It was before Sonera (of Sweden, not Finland) made any public commitments regarding the pricing plans. Sonera (of Sweden again) looked around and saw that others were charging much more and they did the same, with Sonera (Finland this time having to follow what Sweden tells them to do). My friends work for Sonera here in Finland and not Sweden so info they have here is subject to change according to info released in Sweden.

Clear enough for you?

So it has nothing to do with Apple then --- because Sonera HAD already signed the deal with Apple.

Clear enough for you?

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by samab

So it has nothing to do with Apple then --- because Sonera HAD already signed the deal with Apple.

Clear enough for you?

With you it is seldom clear but we can go round again if you want.

I will try to go slow.

Here goes.

My friends that work for Sonera Finland (FACT), said that Apple US had negotiated terms that Sonera had to offer the 3G iPhone locked and with a subscription (hearsay, conjecture, rumor based on friends that work for Sonera Finland).

Considering no one here has posted a copy of the contract between Apple and anyone else, my friends (guesses, conjecture, rumors) info is no less valid until anyone else here can post something otherwise.

Should be all clear by now. What do you think? Is there end game to this by the way? Until you, me, Steve Jobs, et al, posts a contract on the web we will be left with speculation.

[samab]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

With you it is seldom clear but we can go round again if you want.

I will try to go slow.

Here goes.

My friends that work for Sonera Finland (FACT), said that Apple US had negotiated terms that Sonera had to offer the 3G iPhone locked and with a subscription (hearsay, conjecture, rumor based on friends that work for Sonera Finland).

Considering no one here has posted a copy of the contract between Apple and anyone else, my friends (guesses, conjecture, rumors) info is no less valid until anyone else here can post something otherwise.

Should be all clear by now. What do you think?

It is the carriers' choice to whether sell the iphone simlock or not --- many carriers chose to sell unlocked iphones.

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1937

If Italian carriers can sell an unlocked iphone for 500-600 euro (prepay and unlock) and Sonera sells a simlocked iphone for the same price at 500-600 euro (2 year contract and simlock) and Hong Kong gets a unlocked iphone with full 2 years service for under $1000 US --- then for you to be correct, Sonera must be the dumbest negotiator on earth.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by samab

It is the carriers' choice to whether sell the iphone simlock or not --- many carriers chose to sell unlocked iphones.

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1937

If Italian carriers can sell an unlocked iphone for 500-600 euro (prepay and unlock) and Sonera sells a simlocked iphone for the same price at 500-600 euro (2 year contract and simlock) and Hong Kong gets a unlocked iphone with full 2 years service for under $1000 US --- then for you to be correct, Sonera must be the dumbest negotiator on earth.

We are not talking about intelligence here. At least I'm not. Do you think having locked contracts makes alot a of sense.

[anantksundaram]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

With you it is seldom clear but we can go round again if you want.

I will try to go slow.

Here goes.

My friends that work for Sonera Finland (FACT), said that Apple US had negotiated terms that Sonera had to offer the 3G iPhone locked and with a subscription (hearsay, conjecture, rumor based on friends that work for Sonera Finland).

Considering no one here has posted a copy of the contract between Apple and anyone else, my friends (guesses, conjecture, rumors) info is no less valid until anyone else here can post something otherwise.

Should be all clear by now. What do you think? Is there end game to this by the way? Until you, me, Steve Jobs, et al, posts a contract on the web we will be left with speculation.

I know that you dislike advice, but here it is anyway: stop digging!

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by anantksundaram

I know that you dislike advice, but here it is anyway: stop digging!

Maybe it's your advice......

Anyway, Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz.....

[samab]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

We are not talking about intelligence here. At least I'm not. Do you think having locked contracts makes alot a of sense.

I am not talking about intelligence per se.

I am talking about reasonableness --- do you think that Sonera is stupid enough to sign a contract that is a thousand times worse than the approx. 40 carriers who are selling unlocked iphones.

What I am talking about is that your so-called Sonera-Apple negotiated deal --- looks like native Indians selling Manhattan to the Dutch for a few goats.

I think you work for the State Department for too long --- somehow you convince yourself that Saddam really has WMD in Iraq. Your friend at Sonera was a thousand times wrong in the past already, yet somehow you continue to convince yourself that you are continued to be right.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by samab

I am not talking about intelligence per se.

I am talking about reasonableness --- do you think that Sonera is stupid enough to sign a contract that is a thousand times worse than the approx. 40 carriers who are selling unlocked iphones.

Yes, and no. They are not the first and will not be the last operator do something stupid. Maybe they actually thought they could get away with it. Who knows. It was the same here with branding. Some operators thought that branding phones and special phone OS's would word. It hasn't. People opted to pay full price over a subsidized phone. Here, the idea of total ownership is king.

What I am talking about is that your so-called Sonera-Apple negotiated deal --- looks like native Indians selling Manhattan to the Dutch for a few goats.

Not my deal. I am just saying what my friends told me. If you have first hand knowledge about any of the negotiated contracts then by all means share. Otherwise you can not say what is and is not true.

I think you work for the State Department for too long --- somehow you convince yourself that Saddam really has WMD in Iraq. Your friend at Sonera was a thousand times wrong in the past already, yet somehow you continue to convince yourself that you are continued to be right.

Very few in State actually believed it. We saw the data. It was all for show and a bunch of people bought it. Probably the same ones that drink the kool aid Apple peddles. By the way, Saddam was not captured in a spider hole. I do not convince myself that I am right, but you can not convince me that Sonera or my friends are wrong. Put up a copy of the contract and then we will both see.....

[samab]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Yes, and no. They are not the first and will not be the last operator do something stupid. Maybe they actually thought they could get away with it. Who knows.

I do not convince myself that I am right, but you can not convince me that Sonera or my friends are wrong. Put up a copy of the contract and then we will both see.....

It's not "just" doing something stupid --- it's doing something that is a thousand times more stupid than everybody else. And if Sonera is really that stupid, then Apple would have negotiated a iron-clad deal that leaves no renegotiation possible for Sonera.

Your friend was wrong a thousand times before. What's the old say --- fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice,... Your friend fooled you a thousand times already.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by samab

Your friend was wrong a thousand times before. What's the old say --- fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice,... Your friend fooled you a thousand times already.

We have now entered the "whatever" phase of the discussion. Considering you can't prove them wrong, I can say the same with you. Sooooo either prove them wrong or you are equally "fooled".

Oh and you live in a completely myopic existence.

[samab]

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

We have now entered the "whatever" phase of the discussion. Considering you can't prove them wrong, I can say the same with you. Sooooo either prove them wrong or you are equally "fooled".

Oh and you live in a completely myopic existence.

Myopic existence?

I was completely correct 3 months ago.

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...2&postcount=48

The only thing you "corrected" me was a couple of fast typing mistakes (like I said you are in Sweden instead of Finland).

Most people on this forum don't like a lot of what I say --- but they do respect my opinion.

[sapporobaby]

Originally Posted by samab

Myopic existence?

I was completely correct 3 months ago.

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...2&postcount=48

The only thing you "corrected" me was a couple of fast typing mistakes (like I said you are in Sweden instead of Finland).

Most people on this forum don't like a lot of what I say --- but they do respect my opinion.

For me it is not about liking or disliking what you or anyone else says. Very little in this forum can be proven. I take what is said with a grain of salt. My friends at Sonera that happen to mention issues about the iPhone that I posted here have equally as much credibility as any rumor, speculation, etc... than anyone else. The fact that you base the credibility of one isolated issue determine how you view friends further illustrates that you are a very lonely person with only your iPhone and computer to keep you company. I find it completely said that you can readily jump to a post that someone makes or has made weeks to months ago. There is this thing called "a life". I could be wrong but you might want to get one. Just a thought. You never know.

Once again, is there an end game with this? Are we done yet?