or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPod + iTunes + AppleTV › Report: Hon Hai to build Apple tablets as soon as September
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Report: Hon Hai to build Apple tablets as soon as September - Page 3

post #81 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post



Real production model might have a 'slight' bezel-size increase on both sides. But basically if the screen is 10.1", and I believe it will be, the device will be roughly this tall and wide. 14/15 mm thickness in the center, tapering outward slightly, with tough smooth rubber-ish grips on the rear right and left. And of course the oft-mentioned (by me) rear pop-out stand, for when at a desk for example.

How do you hold this?
post #82 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I'm saying "nay" to things that make no sense from the Apple perspective. Using an iPhone app on a larger device is a big nay.

I seriously doubt that Apple suffers from such limited thinking in regard to the iPhone OS.

From what I've read about iPhone app programming, apps are NOT tied to a specific screen resolution (320 x 480). That means, if properly written they should scale nicely to different sized screens.

If you're a developer and want your app to support different screen pixel-dimensions, you update it, or add a note saying what it will or won't run on. That would be similar to apps that require the specific hardware on an iPhone 3GS or iPod touch 2G, for instance.

I envision that eventually, you'll be able to run iPhone apps directly on your Mac, via iTunes or some kind of MacClassic-like virtual machine.... double-click and go. Eventually, I could see them running on an Apple TV as well.

Clearly Apple has a plan and there are lots of different parts in place that could mesh together very nicely over time.
Macintosh: It just WORKS!
Reply
Macintosh: It just WORKS!
Reply
post #83 of 202
A Word document with standard margins on 8-1/2" x 11" paper has 9.7" of text, measured diagonally. That screen size makes total sense if they are going after the e-book market.
post #84 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post

Hey Ireland, (and maybe wizard69, teckstud and a few others)

do y'all remember when the tablet was a crazy insane idea and it was only us in a future hardware section thread that would discuss it?

As I remember it we all had different ideas about what this device would be like. Ireland was always for the ten incher while I still have preferences for a smaller device. Others have also been vocal in their opinion.
Quote:
Every once in a while the occasional naysayer would stop by the thread just to make fun of us weird kooks talking about a product Apple would never....ever consider producing? For two long years this has been going on.

I became a believer with Touch & iPhone. The portability of those devices is why I prefer a smaller tablet. Even a ten inch device could have it's appeal if the aspect ratio is wide enough to support wide screen movies, 16:9 would be good but some of the cine ratios better. This would tend to make for a shorter and wider device that actually might remain useful as a portable device.

You see the big problem with a ten inch device is that you won't be using it hand held in the same way you can use an iPhone. This is why I still see a big appeal in a handheld Touch / iPhone MAXI. Something with a 5 to 7 inch screen.
Quote:

Now look. Now everybody and their grandmother can't wait to buy it. Who's da man now hmm naysayers? PWNED!

I wouldn't get to excited yet as Apple could blow this project just like they did with AIR. Get the feature set wrong and many people will be very put off be the device. Here is a list of things they could do to screw it up:
1.
Make it to heavy.
2.
Not enough computational power.
3.
Not enough secondary storage. This is actually my biggest fear as they may think of it as a network centric streaming device. I actually want bleeding edge, state of the art storage ideally starting at 256GB. At the rate things are going that would likely be low end as that can be had in a USB dongle.
4.
Short battery life. This of course operates against item #1 above. But we really need a run time that lasts beyound twelve hours.
5.
Lack of industry standard ports. No micro USB connectors or other crap. I want at least two standard USB ports on the device. I might settle for other ports like Firewire but I'm not sure they have a place on tablets. The trick of course is finding the right balance.
6.
No GPS or other navigating features. I'd say this would be a deal breaker for many.
7.
To little RAM. 1GB ought to be minimal.
8.
No SD slot. I think Apple is up to something here so this is likely a shoe in. An internal slot that goes with the external would be nice.
9.
It would be nice if the unit had a supplemental charging port beyound the traditional USB/ iPod port. The idea here is for a receptical that accepts a nominal 12VDC to allow for recharge from that volatge standard. We aren't taliking just cars here but solar panels and other 12 volt sources.
10.
No unencumbered model. That is one without a contract.

Ok so the above is of variable importance but each item means something to the potential user. The point is Apple could have a great concept and blow it just like they did with AIR. There is a vast difference between the concept and the implementation.
Quote:

EDIT: I'm not sure about techstud now that I think about it. Weren't you one of the naysayers techstud?

I don't know about techstud as I rarely concern myself with who has posted what. But let's just say people have raised valid concerns here. For example having the device completely tied to a service provider will kill it for many uses. In fact I went back and added it as item ten to my list. If I remember correctly techstud had valid concerns about iPhone / Touch too.

The thing here is I'm not convinced that the device we seem to be hearing about is a natural winner. There are many ifs and buts to consider. It wouldn't be to hard for Apple to deliver a device that people reject for the most part. It could be like AIR all over again, huge sale to early adopters and Apple fan boys for two or three months and then sales tank.

It all depends upon Apple hitting the right mixture of hardware and software features along with proper marketing. Like AIR they can get so close that it actually hurts.

I'm excited and hopeful but reserved because I've seen Apple blow it before. Plus I'm seeing a lot of unreasonable expectations in this forum.


Dave
post #85 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post

How do you hold this?

No kidding. It's too big to hold with one hand and too small to comfortably lock between wrist and elbow, which would be awkward anyway. Let's not even begin talking about ergonomic issues!

I was just playing around with Vectorworks...
Scaling up, using the same proportions as my iPod touch (dimensions rounded a bit)...

6" screen: 7.4" x 4" (retaining roughly the same width as current iPod touch)
6.5" screen: 8" x 4.25"
7" screen: 8 1/2" x 4 1/2"
7.5" screen: 9.1" x 5"
8" screen: 9.75" x 5.3"

7" or 7.5" looks like a pretty reasonable size. Easy to handle and pocketable.
If the pixel density were higher than the current iPhone/iPod touch (163±), say 200, it could be damn nice.

Ahh, but who knows. We're all pipe dreaming, no?
Macintosh: It just WORKS!
Reply
Macintosh: It just WORKS!
Reply
post #86 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

An elephant me.

Hmm? I don't get that.
post #87 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Baloney. Graphics created for the iPhone are recommended to be .PNGs, which are resolution specific. They are not vector graphics, which WOULD be resolution independent. If you use Adobe Illustrator you will recognize the difference.

You need to look into the SDK a bit as there is more to apps than pictures. You have heard of quartz haven't you. For that matter you have read about finding the screen resolution in the SDK. Frankly pictures have little to do with apps and even if important can either be scaled or supplied in different resolutions.

So open up the SDK documentation and if nothing else look at the examples.

Dave
post #88 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I'm saying "nay" to things that make no sense from the Apple perspective. Using an iPhone app on a larger device is a big nay.

*sigh* Sorry Spam. I'm afraid your going to be one of the ones left behind. The rocket ship is about to launch and escape the planet about to explode.

*SpamSandwich screams "WAIT!!" as ship leaves orbit*

......poor guy.
post #89 of 202
I would have thought that the simple solution - double the screen diagonal, increase the resolution to 960x640 (2x in each dimension) - would have been easiest.

However I would suspect that Apple might play with a 16:9 screen for media playback purposes, i.e., a different aspect ratio. Let's imagine a ~10" display with a 1366x768 (or 1280x720) display.

It must include a GPS chip and a front-facing camera.

It must also surely come with a stand/dock.

It had better support bluetooth keyboards!

But I still worry about convenience. It needs some form of grip for holding, even if Apple keep the weight under a pound.
post #90 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

As I remember it we all had different ideas about what this device would be like. Ireland was always for the ten incher while I still have preferences for a smaller device. Others have also been vocal in their opinion.

I became a believer with Touch & iPhone. The portability of those devices is why I prefer a smaller tablet. Even a ten inch device could have it's appeal if the aspect ratio is wide enough to support wide screen movies, 16:9 would be good but some of the cine ratios better. This would tend to make for a shorter and wider device that actually might remain useful as a portable device.

You see the big problem with a ten inch device is that you won't be using it hand held in the same way you can use an iPhone. This is why I still see a big appeal in a handheld Touch / iPhone MAXI. Something with a 5 to 7 inch screen.

I wouldn't get to excited yet as Apple could blow this project just like they did with AIR. Get the feature set wrong and many people will be very put off be the device. Here is a list of things they could do to screw it up:
1.
Make it to heavy.
2.
Not enough computational power.
3.
Not enough secondary storage. This is actually my biggest fear as they may think of it as a network centric streaming device. I actually want bleeding edge, state of the art storage ideally starting at 256GB. At the rate things are going that would likely be low end as that can be had in a USB dongle.
4.
Short battery life. This of course operates against item #1 above. But we really need a run time that lasts beyound twelve hours.
5.
Lack of industry standard ports. No micro USB connectors or other crap. I want at least two standard USB ports on the device. I might settle for other ports like Firewire but I'm not sure they have a place on tablets. The trick of course is finding the right balance.
6.
No GPS or other navigating features. I'd say this would be a deal breaker for many.
7.
To little RAM. 1GB ought to be minimal.
8.
No SD slot. I think Apple is up to something here so this is likely a shoe in. An internal slot that goes with the external would be nice.
9.
It would be nice if the unit had a supplemental charging port beyound the traditional USB/ iPod port. The idea here is for a receptical that accepts a nominal 12VDC to allow for recharge from that volatge standard. We aren't taliking just cars here but solar panels and other 12 volt sources.
10.
No unencumbered model. That is one without a contract.

Ok so the above is of variable importance but each item means something to the potential user. The point is Apple could have a great concept and blow it just like they did with AIR. There is a vast difference between the concept and the implementation.


I don't know about techstud as I rarely concern myself with who has posted what. But let's just say people have raised valid concerns here. For example having the device completely tied to a service provider will kill it for many uses. In fact I went back and added it as item ten to my list. If I remember correctly techstud had valid concerns about iPhone / Touch too.

The thing here is I'm not convinced that the device we seem to be hearing about is a natural winner. There are many ifs and buts to consider. It wouldn't be to hard for Apple to deliver a device that people reject for the most part. It could be like AIR all over again, huge sale to early adopters and Apple fan boys for two or three months and then sales tank.

It all depends upon Apple hitting the right mixture of hardware and software features along with proper marketing. Like AIR they can get so close that it actually hurts.

I'm excited and hopeful but reserved because I've seen Apple blow it before. Plus I'm seeing a lot of unreasonable expectations in this forum.


Dave

Your right. All the elements have to be just...right for the product to take off. And I'm aware of ALL the elements. Something tells me though that Steve Jobs has it right. He's been slaving away on this project and he seems to have been utterly meticulous about the details as he is with any project he takes seriously.

And about the air, I don't think it was blown. The first time I saw it I got the impression that it was an exploratory type of device so that certain technologies and form factors could be tested.

Now that all of that is done here comes the knock out blow from Apple.

EDIT: The one element that worries me the most though is how open this device will be. If it is more like a mac then you can install mostly the apps you want. But if it's only going to be draconian approved apps that take months to get approved if at all then it is going to be a problem. It may be ok for a cell phone but not for more of a personal computing device.
post #91 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drow_Swordsman View Post

Didn't Appleinsider post a lot of reasons why a tablet is more likely to run Snow Leopard than iPhone OS? I'd rather it run OSX, so its not so restricted. If iPhone and iPod Touch users are losing really innovative apps to Appstore Restrictions, why would you buy a full fledged (sort of, anyway) computer with those same software restrictions?

I'm not sure why iPhone OS is looked upon this way. It is not a restrictive platform to evolve an OS from. Rather it is a clean slate. A slate by the way that offers real advantages to the average user and developer. Frankly app store is huge for both users and developers.

Besides the real innovation in apps is actually happening on these devices. It is all about the fact that the environmet makes it possible for developers to be succcessful. This possibility for success drives app development that benefits the user greatly.

Is Apple perfect here, no but no company is or can be. Impart problems develop around Apple trying to slow developers down before they implement tech that isn't ready. Augmented reality is one example where Apple sees a future but needs to slow developers down until the APIs are stable and debugged.

Dave
post #92 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

I'm not sure why iPhone OS is looked upon this way. It is not a restrictive platform to evolve an OS from. Rather it is a clean slate. A slate by the way that offers real advantages to the average user and developer. Frankly app store is huge for both users and developers.

Besides the real innovation in apps is actually happening on these devices. It is all about the fact that the environmet makes it possible for developers to be succcessful. This possibility for success drives app development that benefits the user greatly.

Is Apple perfect here, no but no company is or can be. Impart problems develop around Apple trying to slow developers down before they implement tech that isn't ready. Augmented reality is one example where Apple sees a future but needs to slow developers down until the APIs are stable and debugged.

Dave

I've said it before and I'll say it again...

I'll betcha the OS is going to be a hybrid just watch!
post #93 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

I'm not sure why iPhone OS is looked upon this way. It is not a restrictive platform to evolve an OS from. Rather it is a clean slate. A slate by the way that offers real advantages to the average user and developer. Frankly app store is huge for both users and developers.

Besides the real innovation in apps is actually happening on these devices. It is all about the fact that the environmet makes it possible for developers to be succcessful. This possibility for success drives app development that benefits the user greatly.

Is Apple perfect here, no but no company is or can be. Impart problems develop around Apple trying to slow developers down before they implement tech that isn't ready. Augmented reality is one example where Apple sees a future but needs to slow developers down until the APIs are stable and debugged.

Dave

For the most part I agree with you, just for me personally I would have no interest in a tablet running a phone OS, even if iPhone OS is a very good one. While not being the most restrictive OS in the world, it certainly doesn't give me the feeling (though admittedly, I've only used iPod Touches, I've never owned one) that "I can do whatever I want on this device", that typically owning any full fledged computer (Mac or PC) gives me. But if people want it, they'll buy it!
post #94 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

I'm not sure why iPhone OS is looked upon this way. It is not a restrictive platform to evolve an OS from. Rather it is a clean slate. A slate by the way that offers real advantages to the average user and developer. Frankly app store is huge for both users and developers.

Besides the real innovation in apps is actually happening on these devices. It is all about the fact that the environment makes it possible for developers to be succcessful. This possibility for success drives app development that benefits the user greatly.

Absolutely!
The possibility of success for someone with talent and a good idea and NOT be some zillion dollar corporation is MASSIVE. There are some extremely cool, beautifully designed apps cooked up by one or two people or a small team that do well (ConvertBot, UpNext, iHandy Carpenter, Perpetuum, Brushes). Hopefully that will inspire others who want to produce something exceptional, rather than just make money with fart or cute girl apps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

Is Apple perfect here, no but no company is or can be. Impart problems develop around Apple trying to slow developers down before they implement tech that isn't ready. Augmented reality is one example where Apple sees a future but needs to slow developers down until the APIs are stable and debugged.

Apple has a reputation to keep up: seamlessness, elegance and "It just works".
If something doesn't live up to Apple's own hype (the Newton debacle) or is kludgy and sortof works (the entire Windows universe) then no matter HOW GOOD it is (or the idea behind it), once a product gets a bad rep (the Cube), that's it. DOOM.
Macintosh: It just WORKS!
Reply
Macintosh: It just WORKS!
Reply
post #95 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post

EDIT: I'm not sure about techstud now that I think about it. Weren't you one of the naysayers techstud?

No- not at all. I've always thought this would be Apple's answer to the small formed netbook/ ultra portable ever since I saw a Kindle. I never thought much of the MBA and think this will kill it but that it(MBA) helped in the R&D for this as other have noted. I'm very excited about it- I am now going to hold off on my 13"MBP purchase until after the Sept announcements. The smaller the form the better for me. I've wanted something between 7"- 12" for a very long time from Apple.
Does anyone think we'll be able to boot up Windows on it? Run parallels/bootcamp on it?
post #96 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by brucep View Post

DEAR virgil do you own an iphone ??

Not sure what you mean by that comment, but yes, since the very first day it was available to me I have had an iPhone. But that rather validates everything I said above (that you so cryptically responded to), not the reverse if that's indeed what you are thinking.

In Windows, a window can be a document, it can be an application, or it can be a window that contains other documents or applications. Theres just no consistency. Its just a big grab bag of monkey...
Reply
In Windows, a window can be a document, it can be an application, or it can be a window that contains other documents or applications. Theres just no consistency. Its just a big grab bag of monkey...
Reply
post #97 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffharris View Post

No kidding. It's too big to hold with one hand and too small to comfortably lock between wrist and elbow, which would be awkward anyway. Let's not even begin talking about ergonomic issues!

I was just playing around with Vectorworks...
Scaling up, using the same proportions as my iPod touch (dimensions rounded a bit)...

6" screen: 7.4" x 4" (retaining roughly the same width as current iPod touch)
6.5" screen: 8" x 4.25"
7" screen: 8 1/2" x 4 1/2"
7.5" screen: 9.1" x 5"
8" screen: 9.75" x 5.3"

7" or 7.5" looks like a pretty reasonable size. Easy to handle and pocketable.
If the pixel density were higher than the current iPhone/iPod touch (163±), say 200, it could be damn nice.

Ahh, but who knows. We're all pipe dreaming, no?

Where are you getting the dimensions from? You can't scale up the touch dimensions or you are going to have 2 inch+ bezels. Why would Apple do that?

You say the 7.5" screen would be alright. You could almost squeeze a device with a 10 inch screen into those dimensions (keeping the aspect ratio the same as that as the touch, a 10" screen would be 8.32" x 5.55"). Therefore, a device with a 10 inch screen with similar dimensions should be just fine by your standards, assuming that the longer dimension is what concerns you the most.

None of us have a clue what Apple is doing though.
The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
Reply
The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
Reply
post #98 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I don't believe it. If this imaginary device is to run App Store apps, none of them will work because they're all written for the wrong display size. If it is to run regular old OSX, then maybe.

I've read that for some time, Apple has told developers not to do that, but to write with the assumption that the rez may change. True or not, I don't know.

But most apps wouldn't have a difficult time of it, and the rest could get updates over a short time.
post #99 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by macosxp View Post

Apple schedules a conference hall for September 25, 2009.

*The meeting starts*

"Announcing your insanely great CEO, Steve Jobs!"

Steve Jobs walks on stage.

"Hello."

*crowd cheers*

"Snow Leopard is the next great thing. And it goes on sale, today."

WOOOOOOOOO

"One more thing."

*cheers*

"We have been looking at the iPhone, and we've been looking at the MacBook, and we've been wondering, 'People are taking these two portable devices with them everywhere. Is there some way we can put them together?' So we thought about it, and this is what we came up with. It's called the Apple MacBook Wave."

*cheers*

"It comes pre-loaded with Snow Leopard, and built-in GPS and 4G cellular capabilities. And it's going on sale today, for just $799. The most inexpensive MacBook ever."

BOOM

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOO

Doubt it.

First, Apple won't release a device that replaces other devices that they want you to buy. The tablet/pad/whatever will be a new category. Apple will have something up its sleeve to make this thing much more than a large iPhone/iPod touch or a touch screen MacBook.

Plus, "Steve walks out on stage" need to be changes to "Steve wheels himself out on stage."

-kpluck

Do you use MagicJack?

The default settings will automatically charge your credit card each year for service renewal. You will not be notified or warned in anyway. You can turn auto renewal off.

Reply

Do you use MagicJack?

The default settings will automatically charge your credit card each year for service renewal. You will not be notified or warned in anyway. You can turn auto renewal off.

Reply
post #100 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

What I was trying to say that it may not be physically possible to thumb type in portrait mode on such a large device. As your thumbs can't rest on the screen and your fingers wouldn't extend beyond the devices center of mass on the back side, the device would literally flip out of your hands if you tried to type. The only solution to that problem, as far as I can see is to bring the keyboard up higher, but then you lose the advantage of having extra screen real estate.

Whatever the case, I'm sure the input method will be fine, Apple wouldn't release it if it wasn't easy and intuitive to use.

I also wish there was better text editing software for the iphone.

Agreed. And I completely agree with the part I highlighted also, which is why I find the tablet news so confusing. A 10" screen would seem on the face of it to be a bad size for a device of this type, but it's unlikely Apple would make such a dumb mistake.

There is definitely something about the whole business that we don't know or can't see from the perspective of those not in the know about the device. Either it's not what we think it is, or it's multiple products, or there's some kind of magical UI or something. The facts just don't add up as it is right now.
In Windows, a window can be a document, it can be an application, or it can be a window that contains other documents or applications. Theres just no consistency. Its just a big grab bag of monkey...
Reply
In Windows, a window can be a document, it can be an application, or it can be a window that contains other documents or applications. Theres just no consistency. Its just a big grab bag of monkey...
Reply
post #101 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

Agreed. And I completely agree with the part I highlighted also, which is why I find the tablet news so confusing. A 10" screen would seem on the face of it to be a bad size for a device of this type, but it's unlikely Apple would make such a dumb mistake.

There is definitely something about the whole business that we don't know or can't see from the perspective of those not in the know about the device. Either it's not what we think it is, or it's multiple products, or there's some kind of magical UI or something. The facts just don't add up as it is right now.

I guess we will have to wait and see. Hopefully all these rumors do amount to something in the relatively near future.
The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
Reply
The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
Reply
post #102 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

Where are you getting the dimensions from? You can't scale up the touch dimensions or you are going to have 2 inch+ bezels. Why would Apple do that?

You say the 7.5" screen would be alright. You could almost squeeze a device with a 10 inch screen into those dimensions (keeping the aspect ratio the same as that as the touch, a 10" screen would be 8.32" x 5.55"). Therefore, a device with a 10 inch screen with similar dimensions should be just fine by your standards, assuming that the longer dimension is what concerns you the most.

None of us have a clue what Apple is doing though.

I could get by with the 8.32 x 5.55 maybe. If you add a bit for the inevitable bezel and call it 8.5 x 6, it could be light enough and just small enough to thumb type on if you don't have tiny hands.
In Windows, a window can be a document, it can be an application, or it can be a window that contains other documents or applications. Theres just no consistency. Its just a big grab bag of monkey...
Reply
In Windows, a window can be a document, it can be an application, or it can be a window that contains other documents or applications. Theres just no consistency. Its just a big grab bag of monkey...
Reply
post #103 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by walshbj View Post

I'd expect Apple to hold the tablet back for CES. Get some buzz when holiday sales wear off. Introduce it in September and every competitor has one at CES. Do it this way and Apple keeps the stage for their new CES presence.

It takes a company a good year to come out with a completely new product. If Apple has been working this for three years (at least) as reports have said, then it's very unlikely that someone can duplicate it by CES. And if some crummy device does come out, what would it be based upon? The same version of Windows tablet the others have been such a failure with.

It's not just hardware that made tablets a failure, though that's a big part of it. It's also the OS and programs.

Presumably, Apple has worked hard to overcome these problems.
post #104 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post

Your right. All the elements have to be just...right for the product to take off. And are of ALL the elements. Something tells me though that Steve Jobs has it right. He's been slaving away on this project and he seems to have been utterly meticulous abuot the details as he is with any project he takes seriously.

Let's hope so. I'm begining to wonder if two larger than Touch devices are coming.
Quote:

And about the air, I don't think it was blown. The first time I saw it I got the impression that it was an exploratory type of device so that certain technologies and form factors could be tested.

Exploratory devices belong in the lab not out on the sales floor. Let's face it AIR can barely manage thermally itself much less satisfy user needs for features.
Quote:

Now that all of that is done here comes the knock out blow from Apple.

Well we can hope so. I'm just a " I'll belive it when I see it" sort of guy. I'm just worried they will pull a big boner with the marketing of the device.
Quote:

EDIT: The one element that worries me the most though is how open this device will be. If it is more like a mac then you can install mostly the apps you want. But if it's only going to be draconian approved apps that take months to get approved if at all then it is going to be a problem. It may be ok for a cell phone but not for more of a personal computing device.

The openess issue is less of a worry for me. As long as I can get the apps I need or write my own I'll be happy. I'm not a massive consummer of apps anyways. The device will need multi tasking and a job scheduler though. It is a huge shortcoming on iPhone but I understand the logic somewhat.

For job scheduling here is an example, the device would be scheduled to download an entire paper every morning and likewise weekly and monthly publications. The web model is fine for certain news and events but falls flat for the limited circulation publications that need that subscription income. Which by the way means yes I hope Apple is working with publishers here. But there is more to job scheduling than that, any number of programs could benefit from periodic execution and a cron type facility ought to actually lower power demand for this sort of thing.

Likewise the device would need a scripting environment. I want them to skip bash though and go for python. Python would enable rapid adoption of the device for business and education as it is almost the ideal language for a platform in this power range.

In the end I can see evolving from iPhone OS and gaining more capability. It is better than evolving from Mac OS and loosing capability.


Dave
post #105 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffharris View Post

While that's an interesting concept, the docking station idea is one that has never really caught on. it's too complex to be an Apple idea, where simplicity is key. Docking stations, while useful for some, have VERY limited appeal to the broader market. Apple stopped making the Duo Docking station in 1995..

The iPad would have to be a single and at least 2X larger device than the iPod touch. A 6" or 7" screen, with a high pixel density, would be optimal, I think. Maybe they'd offer a larger screen later? If it's too big or heavy, I'd just carry my MBP.

A number of us have been calling for a device about the size you mention.

My thought has always been that if it can be worn on a belt, even if it's a bit big, like the old Newton, then people will always want to carry it with them.

But once they have to use a pouch with a shoulder strap, it becomes a nuisance. Then many people are going to be thinking before they leave their home; Do I want to carry this with me now? More and more, the answer will be no.

Perhaps women, who carry purses, wouldn't mind using a slightly bigger one, if they don't have a big enough one now, but men might not want to carry something extra like that.

But who knows? If this offers so much in a fairly lightweight (1.5 lbs, hopefully no more) package, people might change their habits.
post #106 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

I could get by with the 8.32 x 5.55 maybe. If you add a bit for the inevitable bezel and call it 8.5 x 6, it could be light enough and just small enough to thumb type on if you don't have tiny hands.

I think a lot of the worries are just due to the fact that 10" sounds really big. That extra digit really messes with peoples heads. There would be far fewer worries if the screen size was rumored to be 9". Luckily I have a pad of paper at my desk that is is 8.5" by 5.5" so it is like I'm staring at the smallest possible size of a potential 10" device. Personally I would be fine with it, but it would not be pocketable unless you had massive pockets.

People have in this thread have listed a lot of reasons why traditional tablets have failed in the past. But that is Apples specialty, take an existing concept and greatly improve on it. I have no doubt that they have surpassed the major hurdles.
The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
Reply
The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
Reply
post #107 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

As much as I've been looking forward to it, I have to admit I've had the same thought.
No doubt Apple has done tons of usability testing on it, but I'm trying to envision a comfortable use position for a 10" device.
If you multiply the weight of the iPhone by about 3 (which is what 10" seems to come out to) it feels a bit heavy to hold in one hand.
Laying flat on a table would seem to require that your eyes be pretty much right above it, which doesn't sound too ergonomic for the neck.
I can see bluetooth keyboard and some sort of built in stand, but at that point, what's the purpose? You just have a tiny desktop system.
I really am curious to see how they've approached this. Should be interesting.

I think the weight would have to be multiplied by five at least. Maybe as much as eight.

Remember that the current screen is only 3.5" diag. This would be 9.7". If you take four screens together, you only get 7" diag.

That's what I'd prefer, but a lot smaller than 9.7.

Depending on what they would do for a battery, we would see a large variation in the weight guesstimates.

I would like to see at least 10 hours internet use. 15 for reading books, magazines etc. over 10 hours for video. And at least 30 for music.

So I think we really need to talk specs.

What processor(s)? Graphics. I went through this in an early post here.

How much RAM for programs? Will this allow multitasking? How much main storage? What will it be, soldered Flash, or removable? External memory cards ala SD slot as we now see on the laptop line?

Any ports? USB 2, Mini Displayport? This begs for those.

If so, will be see HD video out? That's certainly possible with chips Apple will be using in the phone and Touch, how about here? What rez monitor or Tv? What would the rez of a 9.7" screen for this be? a mutiple of 480 x 320? That could be 2x at 960 x 640. Or to maintain the pixel density, 3x at 1440 x 960. Does that look familiar?

External drive storage via USB 2? Hey, what about a keyboard/mouse?

Network port? Maybe over USB 2 at least?

iPhone port? Hmm? That would be nice.
post #108 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

Exploratory devices belong in the lab not out on the sales floor. Let's face it AIR can barely manage thermally itself much less satisfy user needs for features.

Dave

Not necessarily, just call them a hobby and you got yourself covered- a la AppleTV.
If ever there was an exploratory Apple device that went out on the sales floor before it's time - here you are.
post #109 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post

Apple has no need to dominate CES, so I would be very surprised if it hit then. The FY/CY Q1 issue is moot; the driver is to have a great christmas lineup so they can have a blowout christmas quarter. The March quarter will be hyped by something else; iPod sales are dipping to the point that they want to compensate.

I'm surprised, but I am starting to believe the tablet is a reality at 10" and will ship this year...

There is something that we can think about, though it may have nothing to do with this device.

Jobs was asked a couple of years ago if he would ever attend a CES.

His answer was that he would, if they didn't schedule it during Macworld.

Guess what? There is no more Macworld.

So there is a possibility that, if it isn't too late, and he feels strong enough to do it, that for the first time, he could deliver the keynote at CES rather than Gates or Ballmer.

You can bet your bippy that they would rather Jobs do that than either of the dynamic duo.
post #110 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drow_Swordsman View Post

For the most part I agree with you, just for me personally I would have no interest in a tablet running a phone OS, even if iPhone OS is a very good one.

I don't think you understand what we are talking about here. The iPhone OS is the same as what is in Mac OS, it just has a different user API and security model. What we are saying is that it makes more sense to extend that model rather than to try to shoehorn Mac OS and all it's legacy APIs into the device.
Quote:
While not being the most restrictive OS in the world, it certainly doesn't give me the feeling (though admittedly, I've only used iPod Touches, I've never owned one) that "I can do whatever I want on this device", that typically owning any full fledged computer (Mac or PC) gives me.

Yes the OS on the current Touch devices is restrictive but that is done on purpose. For the most part it works really well given the limited hardware platform. The point is everyone is expecting the OS on the new device to be derived from that with the goal of addressing those limitations. It will likely pick up a lot of DNA from Snow Leopard too.

For example the new dock functionality could provide support for multitasking apps on the tablet. Especially a tablet that might not have extensive windowing support. Think about some of the SL dock demos and an OS that only allows on app at a time to own the screen. With a bit of time with a Touch device you discover that a crowded screen is not required for productivity. Yeah currently we are starting and stopping apps as we switch back and forth but it does take much to extend that to switching between active apps.

All I'm saying is think a little bit about how extending the current iPhone interface could lead to a better user experience on a Touch tablet.

By the way this doesn't include other features Apple could add to iPhone OS to make it a better tablet OS. Printing support is one example. The key here is that underneath you still have Apples implementation of BSD and a set of very similar user APIs. So porting should be no problem.
Quote:
But if people want it, they'll buy it!

Well most of us are in wait and see mode. The right combo of features and price would put me in buying mode though. The device certainly needs more features than what is in iPhone but not all of those features are in Mac OS anyways. Hopefully Apple has a good breeding program going and the best DNA from all it's ongoing projects will end up in the device.


Dave
post #111 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by AjitMD View Post

The current IPod Touch has approximately an external diagonal of 5" (2.5"x4.5")and a screen diagonal of 3.5 inches. If the device size got tripled 10" the device would measure something like 7.5"x13.5". It could be 9x heavier. Too big to carry in a lab coat pocket. The aspect ratio of the pixels would be messed up and existing apps would not utilize the screen area optimally. The 50,000 apps is what would drive the demand for this kind of device in addition to other apps like electronic books, education and apps that need more processing power and display.

What would make sense would be for the device to double the area to 7" diagonal, use multiple core version of the low battery consumption chips from Samsung, may with a higher clock speed, video processors, etc. The virtual keyboard would have double the size keys and the device could easily be held with one hand. Easier to type with larger keys. Not the best way to type a long paper... any laptop or a desktop would be better. Bluetooth keyboard would be an option.

SJ is into details and I doubt he would design brick that is too heavy, or cumbersome to carry. He is not into duds anymore like into old days.

You've got your sizing wrong.

That's much too big.

A screen that's 1.5:1 is a bit over 8" inches long by about 5" high.

Think about that. It's really fairly small.

A device made with that screen could be as small as, with room for a button or two, if needed, like the phone, 9" x6".

That's pretty small.

It might just squeak in as a beltable device if it doesn't weigh to much.
post #112 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

Not sure what you mean by that comment, but yes, since the very first day it was available to me I have had an iPhone. But that rather validates everything I said above (that you so cryptically responded to), not the reverse if that's indeed what you are thinking.


Well, I don't own an iphone .
I do own a 32g touch but it remains boxed.
I ask you this for a reason, because many people go on and on about some apple device for many days and many sleepless nights and then you see they don't even own it ......32 g


CONCERNING your iphone >>> you say very strongly that there is many silly apps but almost no top gun level type apps for the iphone.

But I thought there was some doctor /medical apps that can show real time HIGH QUALITY X-RAY pictures of sick/injured patients .

Look I don't have the full medical story .But I thought and I may be wrong but I thought there was a score or so of great doctor/nurse/EMS approved apps that have greatly helped them is many ways .

Word processing apps ?? Well, is there not a filemaker pro app and or a benito app or something ??Or M.Y.O.B APP ??
Seems like we can save lives with medical imaging but we can't do an apple works lick app ??
are you sure virgil ?


>>>>>>>>>
sorry for odd opening question >> Did not mean to offends you.

peace
9
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
post #113 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

[I

Real production model might have a 'slight' bezel-size increase on both sides. But basically if the screen is 10.1", and I believe it will be, the device will be roughly this tall and wide. 14/15 mm thickness in the center, tapering outward slightly, with tough smooth rubber-ish grips on the rear right and left. And of course the oft-mentioned (by me) rear pop-out stand, for when at a desk for example.

Ireland, welcome back. I didn't see your outsized post before I responded about the size of the tablet.
post #114 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by OC4Theo View Post


It always, almost sound like the Jehovah Witnesses, screaming that Jesus is coming.

He is, and He's bringing a mac tablet with Him!
post #115 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post

*sigh* Sorry Spam. I'm afraid your going to be one of the ones left behind. The rocket ship is about to launch and escape the planet about to explode.

*SpamSandwich screams "WAIT!!" as ship leaves orbit*

......poor guy.

Rocket man plays in the back ground....
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
post #116 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post

Hmm? I don't get that.

He's sometimes tough to get.
post #117 of 202
I know this has been debated ad nauseam as well, but given all this talk about a tablet and the potential for it to have 3G or 4G and that such a data plan has been rumored to be with Verizon - does anyone else find it interesting that today Verizon changed its position on free access to wi-fi hotspots for its FiOS and DSL customers? Coincidence? Or strategery?
post #118 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post


Perhaps women, who carry purses, wouldn't mind using a slightly bigger one, if they don't have a big enough one now, but men might not want to carry something extra like that.

Or soon, we may have to start carrying purses too.... how embarrassing!
post #119 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

Where are you getting the dimensions from? You can't scale up the touch dimensions or you are going to have 2 inch+ bezels. Why would Apple do that?

You say the 7.5" screen would be alright. You could almost squeeze a device with a 10 inch screen into those dimensions (keeping the aspect ratio the same as that as the touch, a 10" screen would be 8.32" x 5.55"). Therefore, a device with a 10 inch screen with similar dimensions should be just fine by your standards, assuming that the longer dimension is what concerns you the most.

None of us have a clue what Apple is doing though.

I was just playing around and quickly scaling up based on screen size.
I'm not getting paid for design development here!

Sure the bezels would be narrower... we would hope. But look at the MacBook Air! I HATE that bezel, it's WAAAAAY too wide.
Macintosh: It just WORKS!
Reply
Macintosh: It just WORKS!
Reply
post #120 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


Ex Let's face it AIR can barely manage thermally itself much less satisfy user needs for features.

I've read that it's very popular amongst business travelers.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPod + iTunes + AppleTV
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPod + iTunes + AppleTV › Report: Hon Hai to build Apple tablets as soon as September