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Cash for clunkers - Page 2

post #41 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:05am
Thread Starter 
I am now thinking I should buy up a few clunkers around town for 3k and turn them around and get a couple more cars for the kids.
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post #42 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:13am
Thread Starter 
One more observation. Mostly people with good credit or cash payer like myself buy new cars. This means that people who were holding out on purchases are now inspired to put their $ back into circulation. We talked to 2 couples a the dealership who loved their old cars but felt they just had to take advantage of this deal and get themselves into a less smelly ride. They all agreed that the upkeep and increasing number of problems with their older cars started to be annoying I would have held on to my van which I merely used to haul stuff around but now my wife won't take my Prius everywhere and I won't have to drive everywhere anymore. This means when we go out in our new ride, driven by the wife, I can have another beer or a Margarita.

I am just absolutely loving this.
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post #43 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:15am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

No, I'm afraid.

Typical.
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post #44 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:35am
I wonder how many people are going into debt for these new cars that otherwise would not have.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #45 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:44am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I wonder how many people are going into debt for these new cars that otherwise would not have.

We'll know soon.

However from my experience this program works to loosen the purse strings of people with purses. the jobless are not going to buy new cars but they might just get a job dismantling 1 million clunkers.
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post #46 of 337
8/6/09 at 9:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamac View Post

I am now thinking I should buy up a few clunkers around town for 3k and turn them around and get a couple more cars for the kids.

You must have owned your clunker for at least a year, and be able to prove it.
You must be able to show it was insured for the previous year.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/DOT...es/CARS_FR.pdf

If you're trading in an SUV or pickup and want to buy another similar vehicle, you get $3,500 even if it there's only a 1 mpg improvement. If there's a 2 or more mpg improvement, you get $4,500.
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post #47 of 337
8/6/09 at 9:14am
Is there anything to prevent people from turning around and selling or trading in their new cars and getting SUVs and muscle cars?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #48 of 337
8/6/09 at 9:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Is there anything to prevent people from turning around and selling or trading in their new cars and getting SUVs and muscle cars?

Obama hasn't passed a law against that yet.
The politics of charisma is so Third World. Americans were never going to buy into it for long. - Foudad Ajami
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The politics of charisma is so Third World. Americans were never going to buy into it for long. - Foudad Ajami
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post #49 of 337
8/6/09 at 11:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

And like any other unconstitutional government run program, it's poorly planned and managed (already ran out of money) and has unintended consequences.

And you want the government to run health care?

Except the moron from the CATO institute didn't do any basic research or he would have noted that the 2009 Cobalt LS will cost you $15K and sell on the used market for $10-12K.

So it's a good amount of effort to lose all your gains in fees, taxes and annoyance.
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post #50 of 337
8/6/09 at 11:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Except the moron from the CATO institute didn't do any basic research or he would have noted that the 2009 Cobalt LS will cost you $15K and sell on the used market for $10-12K.

So it's a good amount of effort to lose all your gains in fees, taxes and annoyance.

Not really. Depending on your situation and how you go about it, that extra $ could offset the bulk of the fees/taxes.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #51 of 337
8/6/09 at 11:35am
Jon stewart had a good piece on the link between the clunker program and health care, Faux Noise and Faux Viewers.

Faux is in a class of its own in being able to really twist things.

To appease any Jon bashers, the piece was accompanied by actual footage from Faux. Jon just put them together; it's not him, but Them.

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #52 of 337
8/6/09 at 11:41am
Thread Starter 
Republicans have just been deprived of one of their best cash cows: Car dealers!
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post #53 of 337
8/6/09 at 11:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamac View Post

I got my 4.5k yesterday.
No longer have my Dodge Grand Caravan with 135,712 miles.
Electric windows didn't work, many times the engine kept running after taking the key out.
dripping oil.
My city just made a couple, very badly needed, grand in sales tax. Maybe they can keep all the ambulances and fire trucks in service for a while longer or do not have to put them on rotation ever. The dealers are happy. I got a new Toyota Highlander Hybrid for the wife, she is happy. I got a write off for the biz, another tax break through the program, I am happy. The new car gets around 10 miles more per gallon. I feel I got something for the 6 figure taxes I pay each year.

And you SDW2001BC are by far the most intelligent person on this planet. Beyond anything anyone can imagine really.
Please name one person you know who is dependent on factory rebates and now hooked on government rebates.

Unfortunately the dealers now have an overwhelming amount of US cars to be destroyed. Astrovan is the number 1 clunker being returned to my dealer mostly older than 10 years.

Shit now the kids have to drive newer cars, they'll be so pissed driving around in a new Focus or such.


But why destroy that vehicle??

I could take it and invest a couple days and less than 2k (most likely MUCH less) and have it running like new. Even the "smell" you left behind can be got rid of.
Use it myself or sell it to someone for 3-4k that can't afford a NEW vehicle. (The local government already got your taxes for the new purchase, now they'd get a few MORE $ by my re-selling the "clunker" you failed to take care of.) Instead, manufacturers have to assemble a whole new vehicle from scratch to replace it ...
From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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post #54 of 337
8/6/09 at 12:13pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfSomewhereHot View Post

But why destroy that vehicle??

I could take it and invest a couple days and less than 2k (most likely MUCH less) and have it running like new. Even the "smell" you left behind can be got rid of.
Use it myself or sell it to someone for 3-4k that can't afford a NEW vehicle. (The local government already got your taxes for the new purchase, now they'd get a few MORE $ by my re-selling the "clunker" you failed to take care of.) Instead, manufacturers have to assemble a whole new vehicle from scratch to replace it ...

You should have told me. For 4,700 (total saving incl. tax savings) it could have been yours. BTW I took very good car of this car. Perfect maintenance record.
I thought this is a capitalist society. I guess only when it controlled by the right wing money is good. If I want to drive old cars I'd move to India.

This van absolutely deserved destruction. So you say you would have given me 4,700 for a car that's worth 500 at best. Than you would have spent a few days and maybe 1,200 bucks to fix the engine seals, the friggin wiring which is a bitch to fix, replaced most of the relays and fixed the peeling pain job (all Dodges and fords of the years 1990 to 1999 had horrible paint jobs) so you can drive it around and wait for something else to break. Congratulations you must be a business major. BTW the heater only worked on the driver's side.
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post #55 of 337
8/6/09 at 12:16pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taskiss View Post

You must have owned your clunker for at least a year, and be able to prove it.
You must be able to show it was insured for the previous year.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/DOT...es/CARS_FR.pdf

If you're trading in an SUV or pickup and want to buy another similar vehicle, you get $3,500 even if it there's only a 1 mpg improvement. If there's a 2 or more mpg improvement, you get $4,500.

Yeah, I just realized this. Bummer.
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post #56 of 337
8/6/09 at 12:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamac View Post

You should have told me. For 4,700 (total saving incl. tax savings) it could have been yours. BTW I took very good car of this car. Perfect maintenance record.

How can a car with a perfect maintenance record have busted windows, engine run on and leaking oil? Seems like a very imperfect maintenance record.

Your sloppy upkeep got bailed out by Obama.
The politics of charisma is so Third World. Americans were never going to buy into it for long. - Foudad Ajami
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The politics of charisma is so Third World. Americans were never going to buy into it for long. - Foudad Ajami
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post #57 of 337
8/6/09 at 12:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamac View Post

Yeah, I just realized this. Bummer.

Not only that, a person can only be on the title of one vehicle purchased in this program.
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post #58 of 337
8/6/09 at 12:29pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post

How can a car with a perfect maintenance record have busted windows, engine run on and leaking oil? Seems like a very imperfect maintenance record.

Your sloppy upkeep got bailed out by Obama.

The windows would work if you kicked the side panel a certain way. the perfect service refers to oil changes. Also the head lamps on these cars became milky since they used shitty plastic. I believe it is better for Dodge that the thing no longer is on the road.

What are you driving?
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post #59 of 337
8/6/09 at 1:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamac View Post

You should have told me. For 4,700 (total saving incl. tax savings) it could have been yours. BTW I took very good car of this car. Perfect maintenance record.
I thought this is a capitalist society. I guess only when it controlled by the right wing money is good. If I want to drive old cars I'd move to India.

This van absolutely deserved destruction. So you say you would have given me 4,700 for a car that's worth 500 at best. Than you would have spent a few days and maybe 1,200 bucks to fix the engine seals, the friggin wiring which is a bitch to fix, replaced most of the relays and fixed the peeling pain job (all Dodges and fords of the years 1990 to 1999 had horrible paint jobs) so you can drive it around and wait for something else to break. Congratulations you must be a business major. BTW the heater only worked on the driver's side.

A small part of that 4700 DID come from me... and from every other taxpayer (including yourself, I assume.) I guess I'm having a hard time figuring out why the federal government should be in the business of buying cars for people. (There's not even a requirement to be a US citizen to get this money as far as I can tell.)

And... "perfect maintenance record" involves a bit more than just changing the oil every now and then. A car that leaks oil, runs-on, windows don't work right, etc... is not a car that's been "taken very good care of." ... Perhaps a government mandated maintenance program, similar to that required of airplanes, would go a long way to improving overall efficiency and safety, while reducing our need to build as many brand-new vehicles and the associated use of raw materials and energy that goes along with that process.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder... just because YOU feel a car deserves destruction, doesn't mean it can't be fixed... or that it can't be a WAY more realistic car for someone other than yourself. WHY FORCE THESE CARS TO BE DESTROYED?? why not have the program and leave the cars intact for someone else to get some use out of them? (Efficiency doesn't play into that argument, as the people who would buy the used vehicles generally can't/shouldn't afford a brand-new one anyway!)
From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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post #60 of 337
8/6/09 at 1:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfSomewhereHot View Post

A small part of that 4700 DID come from me... and from every other taxpayer (including yourself, I assume.)

Don't worry, when the bill for all this comes due (just the economic stimulus part), I'm thinking it'll cost you more than you made on this transaction.

Quote:
The bill costs the average U.S. family about $3,300, and it raises the national debt by about $7,700 per family.

Let’s go through that.

The bill spends about $5,500 per family, or $1,750 per person.
It reduces taxes by about $2,200 per family, or $700 per person.
Total cost (using our methodology): $3,300 per family, or $1,050 per person.
Added to national debt: $7,700 per family, or $2,450 per person.

http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2009/...spending-bill/

I'm not holding out hope that taxes won't go up.
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post #61 of 337
8/6/09 at 3:56pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfSomewhereHot View Post

the federal government should be in the business of buying cars for people.

They buy cars FROM people.

You my friend are a true socialist. Love ya babes.

However I am a hard core capitalist enjoying reasonable wealth.
I just got a great deal. That's how $ is made. Just because you are grease monkey, I do not have to be.
My purchase has caused several others to make $ as well. My capitalistic freak out caused socialism to thrive on main street. Top down economics in shining armor.
Currently the interest rates are shit. My money is in better use giving me peace of mind and an enjoyable car.

You may now unscrew the cylinder head.
My van was a complete piece of shit.
No one should ever drive this car again.
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post #62 of 337
8/6/09 at 5:27pm
Given the apparent success of the Cash for Clunkers program and the obviously sound economic reasoning upon which it has been created, I've started thinking that this program really should be the prototype for a whole new round of similar programs that will undoubtedly have even greater economic stimulus effects and even some positive environmental advantages as well (since said environmental advantages of the Cash for Clunkers are really undebatable).

So here goes (please forgive my lame naming ability, I'm not a politician and unpracticed in the art of creating clever, cute and catchy slogans for vitally important economic policy programs):

- "Greenbacks for Gigabytes" -- Here an individual can get $1,000 to $2,000 for turning in any old computer (provided it is smashed and never resold or reused) to buy a brand new computer that has more computing power and is more energy efficient.

- "Dollars for Domiciles" -- You can get $50,000 to buy a new more energy efficient home provided that your old home get bulldozed and never occupied or used again.

- "Funds for Food" -- This program provides you with $200 to $500 to buy all new groceries (only healthy stuff please!) to fill your refrigerator and pantry as long as your existing food is thrown out and never eaten or consumed.

- "Dead Presidents for Duds" -- Persons applying to this program can receive up to $2,000 to buy all new clothing for their wardrobe as long as all of your old clothing is thrown out, shredded, burned or otherwise destroyed beyond use.

I'm sure there are many more possibilities. This is only a start on the pathway to economic recovery, vibrancy and success not to mention environmental salvation and even healthier diets. Through these innovative programs, the United States can establish its glory as one of the greatest nations on earth.
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post #63 of 337
8/6/09 at 5:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by involuntary_serf View Post

Given the apparent success of the Cash for Clunkers program and the obviously sound economic reasoning upon which it has been created, I've started thinking that this program really should be the prototype for a whole new round of similar programs that will undoubtedly have even greater economic stimulus effects and even some positive environmental advantages as well (since said environmental advantages of the Cash for Clunkers are really undebatable).

So here goes (please forgive my lame naming ability, I'm not a politician and unpracticed in the art of creating clever, cute and catchy slogans for vitally important economic policy programs):

- "Greenbacks for Gigabytes" -- Here an individual can get $1,000 to $2,000 for turning in any old computer (provided it is smashed and never resold or reused) to buy a brand new computer that has more computing power and is more energy efficient.

- "Dollars for Domiciles" -- You can get $50,000 to buy a new more energy efficient home provided that your old home get bulldozed and never occupied or used again.

- "Funds for Food" -- This program provides you with $200 to $500 to buy all new groceries (only healthy stuff please!) to fill your refrigerator and pantry as long as your existing food is thrown out and never eaten or consumed.

- "Dead Presidents for Duds" -- Persons applying to this program can receive up to $2,000 to buy all new clothing for their wardrobe as long as all of your old clothing is thrown out, shredded, burned or otherwise destroyed beyond use.

I'm sure there are many more possibilities. This is only a start on the pathway to economic recovery, vibrancy and success not to mention environmental salvation and even healthier diets. Through these innovative programs, the United States can establish its glory as one of the greatest nations on earth.

I think "Trade Up Your Talking Points" is the program you're looking for.
eye
bee
BEE
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post #64 of 337
8/6/09 at 5:44pm
involuntary_serf, you are a genius!

Here's one I just thought of:

Dough for Degrees - people can receive a $10,000 to $15,000 to go back to college and get a degree, provided they relinquish their old college degrees, which will be declared null and void. This will infuse our colleges and universities with much needed funds, and encourage education among the populace.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #65 of 337
8/6/09 at 5:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamac View Post

They buy cars FROM people.

No... You only get the $$$ (from the government ... not from another capitalist) if you buy a NEW car... They're not buying your old car from you ... they're giving you (my) money to buy a NEW car.


and if you need to quote me, at least don't take it out of context...


I'm glad you're doing well... I'm glad you feel you got an excellent deal by taking money from the taxpayers and adding to the national debt.
... And grease-monkey is what I do for fun... googling "Spec Miata" will give you an idea... genuine economy-spurring spending involved no government hand-outs allowed
From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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post #66 of 337
8/6/09 at 6:43pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfSomewhereHot View Post

No... You only get the $$$ (from the government ... not from another capitalist) if you buy a NEW car... They're not buying your old car from you ... they're giving you (my) money to buy a NEW car.


and if you need to quote me, at least don't take it out of context...


I'm glad you're doing well... I'm glad you feel you got an excellent deal by taking money from the taxpayers and adding to the national debt.
... And grease-monkey is what I do for fun... googling "Spec Miata" will give you an idea... genuine economy-spurring spending involved no government hand-outs allowed

The government is a democratically elected capitalist government. Last time I looked. Oh, do you live in the US?
Did you get the Bush rebates? $ 300 bucks?

I was going to put a 12 cyl engine in the van and pimp it out but I changed my mind.

3 bill dollar pale next to what we spent on killing people. I am sure that these 3 bill will make 30 bill for the government in just a few month.
New car taxes, license fees, registration fees, more jobs, more tax payments less people on welfare, more income tax next year, insurance companies, banks, whores, strip clubs, oil companies, gas stations, tire manufacturers, people feeling good, feeling like spending, pot dispensaries and condom sales..

If you don't want your kids to have to pay for this, go out and get a car...
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post #67 of 337
8/6/09 at 7:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Not really. Depending on your situation and how you go about it, that extra $ could offset the bulk of the fees/taxes.

Well prove it. Show me someone that has made a profit flipping a car on the cash for clunkers program. The way you describe it, it should be trivial to do so.

Given you lose an assload of value just driving the car off the lot any gains is going to be really marginal and you're going to need a real sucker to buy your flipped vehicle for $4.5K less than new from a private sale.

Possible I suppose given the number of suckers out there but you run a real risk of losing money on the deal or being stuck with a Cobalt.
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post #68 of 337
8/6/09 at 7:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfSomewhereHot View Post

A small part of that 4700 DID come from me... and from every other taxpayer (including yourself, I assume.) I guess I'm having a hard time figuring out why the federal government should be in the business of buying cars for people. (There's not even a requirement to be a US citizen to get this money as far as I can tell.)

The objective was to get cars sold and money moving around. It does that.

Quote:
WHY FORCE THESE CARS TO BE DESTROYED?? why not have the program and leave the cars intact for someone else to get some use out of them? (Efficiency doesn't play into that argument, as the people who would buy the used vehicles generally can't/shouldn't afford a brand-new one anyway!)

Because they want to reduce foreign oil dependence, and greenhouse gas emissions as part of the program.

Given the blood we've spent in the middle east for various oil reasons, I'm happy to destroy all old clunkers with crappy mileage. It's not like there won't be used cars with GOOD mileage out on the lots so what's your beef? Because the clunkers are largely american made POS from the three US makers?

The less oil we use, the better off our nation is militarily and economically.
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post #69 of 337
8/6/09 at 7:58pm
Quote:
According to the US Bureau of Transit Statistics for 2006 there are 250,851,833 registered passenger vehicles in the US. Out of these roughly 251 million vehicles, 135,399,945 were classified as automobiles, while 99,124,775 were classified as "Other 2 axle, 4 tire vehicles," presumably SUVs and pick-up trucks. Yet another 6,649,337 were classified as vehicles with 2 axles and 6 tires and 2,169,670 were classified as "Truck, combination." There were approximately 6,686,147 motorcycles in the US in 2006.

So at let's say $4000/clunker and $1B that removes ~250,000 old rundown automobiles from the market, or 0.1%/$1B.

OMFG, poor people can't find a used vehicle out of the 250M used vehicles still on the road today.

This has got to be the dumbest PO thread ever. \

The first page in nothing but mindless drive by posts by those passing on the right shoulder.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #70 of 337
8/6/09 at 7:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post


The less oil we use, the better off our nation is militarily and economically.

The less oil we use (everybody on the planet) the better of we all are for reasons bigger than the military and economy. But yes, you are right under the concept of this program.

Read somewhere that many of the new cars sold under the program are actually Hondas and Toyotas... because the Japanese have been focused on better mileage for a bit longer (understatement) than the Big Three that make Big Cars. Nissan is planning to put out five hybrids this fall and Mitsubishi will in the near future start selling a plug in all electric.

American car companies and magazines have focused for years on size, acceleration and top speed (and of course horse power). There are speed limits, nobody really need to go 0-60 in a split second and there tends to be a lot of empty space. We have the occasional Cadillac and Chrysler and even Hummer in town and boy do they look out of place. The Big Three said years ago that it would be very difficult to make blah blah blah, that electric cars lacked range and blah blah blah... Here! Have a monster!

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply
post #71 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Well prove it. Show me someone that has made a profit flipping a car on the cash for clunkers program. The way you describe it, it should be trivial to do so.

Given you lose an assload of value just driving the car off the lot any gains is going to be really marginal and you're going to need a real sucker to buy your flipped vehicle for $4.5K less than new from a private sale.

Possible I suppose given the number of suckers out there but you run a real risk of losing money on the deal or being stuck with a Cobalt.

I didn't say they'd make a profit. I said they could break even. Or they might even be willing to lose a bit if it meant getting into their dream car.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #72 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:09pm
I drive a 1993 Mercury Tracer wagon. I paid $950 CASH for it about 20 days ago. Under 100,000 miles on the odometer and gets 27+ mpg. Just passed emissions with flying colors. Runs beautifully.

I did it without government handouts. AND I bought it from a private seller, so I didn't have to pay sales tax.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #73 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I didn't say they'd make a profit. I said they could break even. Or they might even be willing to lose a bit if it meant getting into their dream car.

How on earth does losing money help you get your dream car? If you start with $10K and a clunker worth a $1K trade in + $4.5K of government money and end up with $10K after flipping a $15K Cobalt using a cash for clunkers deal you have no more money to buy your dream car with.

Show me someone with a lot more money after flipping than before. You know...like $2-3K more or something.
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post #74 of 337
8/6/09 at 8:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I drive a 1993 Mercury Tracer wagon. I paid $950 CASH for it about 20 days ago. Under 100,000 miles on the odometer and gets 27+ mpg. Just passed emissions with flying colors. Runs beautifully.

I did it without government handouts. AND I bought it from a private seller, so I didn't have to pay sales tax.

It's not a low-mileage clunker now is it? Instead it's a high mileage used car which is just fine as far as everyone is concerned. It wouldn't even qualify for the cash for clunkers program.

So what's your point?
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post #75 of 337
8/7/09 at 9:04am
My point is that during a time when we should be borrowing less, saving more, and living within our means (which is certainly doable), the government is instead giving incentives to people to save less, spend more, and borrow more.

The result? Short-term gain, long-term loss.

The government itself is flat broke, so it is printing money out of thin air and borrowing from China to subsidize this program.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #76 of 337
8/7/09 at 9:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Jon stewart had a good piece on the link between the clunker program and health care, Faux Noise and Faux Viewers.

Faux is in a class of its own in being able to really twist things.

To appease any Jon bashers, the piece was accompanied by actual footage from Faux. Jon just put them together; it's not him, but Them.

It's so cute when people get news from comedians.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I drive a 1993 Mercury Tracer wagon. I paid $950 CASH for it about 20 days ago. Under 100,000 miles on the odometer and gets 27+ mpg. Just passed emissions with flying colors. Runs beautifully.

I did it without government handouts. AND I bought it from a private seller, so I didn't have to pay sales tax.

In California, they'd conveniently charge you a 9% "fee" to cover the sales tax. Good job on the car find. I did the same thing about a year ago. I bought a 2002 Ford Escort for $2500. It has been very good to us so far. It is amazing how people think intentions can change reality. There is no free lunch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

It's not a low-mileage clunker now is it? Instead it's a high mileage used car which is just fine as far as everyone is concerned. It wouldn't even qualify for the cash for clunkers program.

So what's your point?

It shows how terrible the reasoning of the program happens to be. If considered from an emissions standpoint, I'm sure the car runs dirtier than a 2009 Ford Explorer. I don't begrudge him owning it nor would I begrudge anyone their auto of choice, but the program is just stealing demand from the future in the name of some vague good intentions.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #77 of 337
8/7/09 at 9:46am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

The less oil we use, the better off our nation is militarily and economically.

True, but the reality is:
The less babies we make ......
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post #78 of 337
8/7/09 at 9:59am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

It shows how terrible the reasoning of the program happens to be. If considered from an emissions standpoint, I'm sure the car runs dirtier than a 2009 Ford Explorer. I don't begrudge him owning it nor would I begrudge anyone their auto of choice, but the program is just stealing demand from the future in the name of some vague good intentions.

Wow, even for Republidiots you guys are over the edge. The lack of understanding of people and marketing is unbelievable, no wonder you drive museum pieces. This whole thing is about psychology, but to understand that it would take interconnected ganglia.

People in the US have the same amount of $ than last year when Bush's insanity finally scared them enough to hold on to every dime. This caused the recession, not AIG or GM or the banks. This is what froze credit and the flow of cash overall. As free market people the GOP is completely oblivious to free market concepts. For things to become better people have to feel better. Depression is a psychological disorder which caused recession. DUHHHHHHH.

GOP rule has caused an entire nation to become depressed and feel hopeless. Thus the guy selling hope won, another huge DUHHHHHHHHH

To call the GOP imbeciles is an insult to imbeciles.
A++++++++++++ for complete ignorance of all things human.
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post #79 of 337
8/7/09 at 10:11am
The cash for clunkers program is the typical ruse of tricking people out of their money and into debt with the claim of a getting a sale, a good deal, or a "limited time offer."

Anyone that would fall for it is an idiot. Anyone who would use it is worse.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #80 of 337
8/7/09 at 10:24am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

The cash for clunkers program is the typical ruse of tricking people out of their money and into debt with the claim of a getting a sale, a good deal, or a "limited time offer."

Anyone that would fall for it is an idiot. Anyone who would use it is worse.

trümpty,
obvioulsy you are happy having a collection of other people's farts under your ass when you drive around, all the best to you.

I love you because you're just sooo cute, bussi.
You are obviously against tricking people to spend their $, this means all advertisements should be outlawed. Call your GOP rep now to get this done.
How about tricking people to go to war, that's OK right?
How about telling people lies about other people for personal gain, that's OK right.

How about getting them to buy drugs they don't need, or houses, or... oh shit that's done by corps and banks and the unelected, that's much better.
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