Apple's tablet will be more than a niche product - report - Page 2

It would go where you would typically take a netbook, as it would be of a similar size and function. No a 10" device isn't something you would take everywhere with you, unless you always had a bag, that doesn't mean there isn't a market for it. Ultimately we would need to see the feature set to figure out where it would go and who would buy one.

That's true, but then is it that much different than taking your existing 13" or 15" MBP with you? I guess I'm trying to figure out if this device is going to be another Mac for those who want something portable and don't already have a MB or MBP. Or is it going to be something like an iPhone where everyone will want one and add it to their collection of computing equipment.

Then it would have to come with a glass 'glossy' screen.

Right now my MacBook Pro with the matte screen doesn't compare with my friend's glossy under the same conditions. It is amazing the difference running them side by side.

The real McCoy is a tablet with Mac OS X inside and video-out port for Keynote and PowerPoint presentations. The iPhone OS (OS X) is too limited.

I have just created a calendar event at the end of 2010, which says "Check Piper Jaffray's prediction on Apple Tablet, claiming that after one year about 2 million devices will be sold at an price of about $600 each". Those analysts predict so many things, and I have the feeling that nobody actually checks if the predictions have been correct. I will start with that now. For every prediction I read about in the news, I will create a calendar entry with what has been predicted, and I will then check if it was correct or not.

You'll hear from me in 2010!

Someone should set up a pool and take odds

My guesses

Price: $799; saying they won't sell if they're more than $599 is silly (quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten)
Real estate: 10" display
Weight: 1.5 pounds
Basic design: Slab, not clamshell
Cosmetics: Very similar to the current lineup of the pros and iPhone--black face rimmed in silver
Functions: ebook, TV, games, etc,
Chipset designed by PA semiconductor
Ports: MBA like; mini-DVI, USB2/3, audio jacks
Fantasies: USB3; OLED display
Battery: 10 hours
Memory: SSD 128-256Gb
Sales: 5 million within 12 months,
Launch: before christmas
Prediction Design flaw: the glass surface will be prone to breakage--if I understand it correctly, there is no way around this (thin glass used as a keyboard) short of putting struts in the middle of the screen. APple will be forced to supply all of their stores with fixit kits and charge more for Applecare

I'm going to side with Dave here (not to the point of calling you ignorant though). OSX on a tablet sounds good, but when you get down to it, it would be a nightmare in terms of usability. Programs on OSX such as Word are not touch friendly, and some never will be. As long as you have a tablet running an operating system intitially designed for point and click cursor operation, there will be programs (or portions of the OS) that are a pain to operate on a touch screen. This is one of the major reasons that tablets have never gained any traction.

iPhoneOS ensures that everything is touch friendly, and all that really limits the softwares potential is the hardware itself. There is no stopping Apple from creating a new Tablet only section of the App store. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that you would prefer a touch friendly version of word or pages if it had all the features you needed from the OSX version. There is no reason why Apple couldn't include (or provide Apps for) Time Machine and Drop Box, although I would consider both to be highly doubtful, and you would likely be stuck with itunes sync for somewhat similar functions. A tablet running iPhoneOS doesn't mean that it will be a big iPhone, it just means that it will have a clean, consistent, and touch friendly UI.

2001 was a strange movie. In anyevent I'm recalling a scene in that movie where a guy was sitting at a table using or looking at a tablet computer. It was a little on the big size but I'm hoping for something similar from Apple. That is something thin and wide screen format.

At least I'm hoping that was 2001. Getting old and mixing up movie scenes is a real possibility. Like wise if you watch Eureka they get most of the tablets wrong. Generally in Eureka they are to thick and squarish.

It would be interesting to see which movie or TV show people think best represents what a tablet should be.


Dave

+1

It's just a matter of making minor adaptations using Cocoa Touch. I bet Apple was already doing this during SL's development. And running iPhone OS on a 7-9" tablet is an UTTER waste of hardware.

Market research indicates that most people that buy netbooks buy them as secondary computers. A tablet running iPhone OS would fall into that same role as well. Obviously people without any form of portable computer would be more inclined to buy this, but if done right I could see many people buying this and a MBP. Keep in mind that many people use laptops like a desktop, but prefer the portability if they are not always staying in the same place.

I think the issue here is whether they are going to make OSX more touch friendly, or come out with an upgraded OS for the tablet based on the current iPhone OS. Each option clearly has problems.

If they made a separate section of the store for Tablet software, we would then have to wait for many of the existing software packages to come up with a Tablet version, and see how compromised they are for normal use before passing judgement on it. Its going to take forever to get that off the ground though for things like Office. Unfortunately, ease of use of Office docs is going to be a big issue.

However, I think it would be better to make the current desktop OS more touch friendly or at least allow people to run those applications if they want to. I for one would love a tablet that I could occasionally hook a wireless keyboard to in order to get some work done.

I think it really matters which direction they want this device to go - functional for many things, or really a media device that can also do some word processing/email, but that doesn't have all the features one would need to supplant a laptop.

I would be happier with an desktop OS based device that was tweaked for touch. Just my opinion. If you want a gaming, movie playing device that can also do some web-browsing, then the iTablet with iPhone OS is fine for you. I definitely need everything to sync quickly and easily so that I can work on documents, etc. quickly between different devices. This is one area the current iPhone based OS falls down completely - it has NO built-in file management system available to the user.

Different people have different needs, but I think the main OS is the most flexible, and we should have the option to run it. Actually - wouldn't it be cool if the customer could choose? Then we could both have what we want

All right this has gone too far. Apple hasn't even announced this product yet we have reports talking about a release date of early 2010, what OS it will be running, a price point of $600, and even how much it's going to sell in it's first year.

The product has not been announced.

We think ourselves an advanced civilization but here we are paying attention to these soothsayers predicting 2011 results for a product that does not officially exist.

People are WAY too anxious for this product and bound to be disappointed. In the past rumors have been believed and proven false when Apple never announced the product. Remember the iPhone nano? There is something troubling and sad about this level of speculation and immediate belief. Do we have no minds of our own? Are we so infantilized that we demand realization of our dreams for satisfaction?

Lets try not to fall into the hype and wait for an official announcement before speculating with this intensity.

Still sounds like a niche product to me.

Other than a larger screen there's nothing this tablet appears to do over an iPhone.
If it doesn't do doc creation and run standard Mac apps then what's really the point?

Apple's going to have to amaze to sell 2 million of this device at $600 a pop. The Apple TV sold but that's a product with a under 300 dollar pricepoint.

While so many rumors indicate a 10" screen and very flashy design with super thin trim around the big screen, I would, from a practical user point of view, prefer a smaller foot print for more practical daily use. An ideal size for me would be a 6" or 7" screen with a solid leather cover, like those on a quality paper organizer. So that I can toss it around in my hand bag, without the "professional" notebook case.

I am saying this because I use my NOKIA N810 MID on a daily basis and it is very handy to check RSS news, voip calls, email check, etc. Even its screen is just little over 4" in diagonal, its 800X480 display is close to what I expect.

A tablet with 10" will be too close to the 13" macbook and carniblization is unavoidable. It also demands similar care and carry, which sacrifices its portability and practicality. A 6" or 7" ipad can be perfectly positioned between the 4" iphone and 13" macboook and offer a perfect balance between function, feature, and practicality. Screen resolution of 1280X800 will be more than sufficient.

One more thing is the software, which is also Apple' strength. Iphone is a phone-centric and macbook is a conventional computer. The mid-size ipad can be MID, ebook reader, media player, GPS, PIM, so on and on. There is big room there to be covered. None of these functions can be better served by either the smaller iphone or ipod or the bigger macbook.

Last but not least, the price should also be competitive, like 699 or 749. Above 800 will be hard. Walmart is offering full spec 15" Vista HP notebook at 298USD. How can Apple sell a "less" device for 500USD more?

Yingkai

Sounds like you won't be buying one then.
The device will NOT be the magical desktop replacement you seem to want.

That would be nice, but I'd place my bets on the iPhoneOS being more popular.

Apple could already be working with some of the larger software companies (such as Microsoft) to ensure that there are some major tablet Apps available at launch.

I think you glossed over some of the point I was trying to make (or it was poorly explained on my part) though.

Things like multitasking, wireless keyboards, and current software functionality are not really limitations of iPhone OS but of the iPhone itself.

Hopefully this tablet does come to fruition so that we can find out how wrong we all were.

I think this is one of Apple's specialties, and am waiting to be impressed and surprised.

As for your point that those are limitations are the hardware, that is just not true. Apple could easily enable bluetooth functionality for the wireless keyboards on the iPhone, but have chosen not to at a software level. Same goes for multi-tasking (unless you are referring to battery life). If what you are saying is that the iPhone OS could do these things on a tablet as well, then I agree. I just don't want it to be limited. The poster above thinks it shouldn't be a magical desktop replacement. To which I say - why not? The hardware is capable - give us the option.

I think iPhone OS is quite capable of handling light word-processing, and plenty of apps now can sync very well. Apple could even make a lite version of iWork (Pages, Keynote, Numbers) that would sync perfectly with your home machine. I think the current iWork online beta service is a test bed for just that.

I hope they also expand the video, photo and audio editing capabilities so that it would be possible to actually put together a small blog or podcast.

The key point in using the iPhone OS is that lots of developers are already in the program and there are millions of users, both Mac and Windoze.

All I meant was that Apple chooses not to enable those features in the iPhone and they could chose to enable them on a tablet. People hear tablet running iPhoneOS and think just a big iPhone, that is the notion I am trying to overcome. I would consider iPhoneOS to be a much better jumping off point than OSX, for the usability reasons I have described. Apple is big on user experience, and I don't think desktop Apps would cut it.

I think in order to avoid the niche, it will have to use Intel's Pine Trail Atom processors at a minimum so it can run all current software. I just don't see people buying what would essentially be a $600 ipod touch.

I think it will be a big hit as a proper Mac though, especially among students. The CrunchPad gives a good idea of what to expect:

http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/06/03...nch-prototype/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEni3OmohP8

Apple's one should be very slim and the Pine Trail CPUs don't require a fan. Add in a 64-128GB SSD, 2GB Ram and it'll perform quite well.

+1 (minus the hand bag part )

I would get an iPod touch, but it's screen is just too small to be of much use other than for one-trick-pony apps. But 10" is too big to carry around on a regular basis, and a screen that size will be harder to protect from damage making it even less of a "go everywhere" device.

Good Grief!

Did even the iPhone garner as much speculation and debate prior to it's debut...and for so long? I doubt it.

I believe that an updated version of the iPhone OS will be what runs on the tablet, for these reasons:

1) iPhone OS is not limited to its present form. A tablet-appropriate update with additional capabilities is a no-brainer;

2) Contrary to popular opinion, including Leander Kahney's, iPhone app developers have always been instructed to make their apps work on larger screens than the iPhone's. This shows that Apple has been thinking ahead for some time now. Certainly, some apps will have to be updated, but I don't see how there will be an either/or distinction between iPhone and tablet apps;

3) iPhone OS and Snow Leopard are reportedly 85% similar; the dissimilarity is probably due to all the extra stuff in the desktop version. Nothing requires the APIs to be more than temporarily dissimilar, as MacBooks and even iMacs are perfectly capable of sprouting cellular connections, motion sensors, touch screens and GPS;

4) The principle obstacles to running Mac OS X on a tablet are battery life and app compatibility. Mac OS X drags in Carbon, which is a legacy API. Anything written in Carbon--Office, Adobe CS, and other behemoth cross-platform apps, plus a few others--will not automatically inherit touch-screen capabilities no matter how Apple bakes them in to the OS. There will have to be updates that explicitly add them. Anyone familiar with Microsoft and Adobe is aware that such updates don't exactly fly out the door. Adobe, in particular, is obsessed with the idea that its applications behave consistently across platforms to the extent possible, so it's almost certain that the Mac version will get touch sensitivity when the Windows version does and to the extent that the Windows version does, and following whatever rules Adobe writes for its own UI instead of the native behavior on either platform. Also, it's almost certain that this capability with be released some years down the road from now, perhaps with the next full release of the suite.

I would expect: iPhone OS 4.0, or maybe 3.5, with new capabilities appropriate to the new tablet and a few goodies thrown in for iPhone and iPod touch users; iLife and iWork, which are already either finger-friendly or nearly so; the same sort of support that iPhone has for Office documents, perhaps beefed up further, to make up for the lack of Office proper, and; some intelligent way to run iPhone apps without merely stretching the UI to an absurd size.

Although fun for us to speculate, it's unwise for an analyst to commit client dollars to an unsubstantiated product launch. It smacks of stock manipulation.

I can see from your first post (welcome!) that you're new here... With all of this being pure speculation, the only thing we can say for sure is: Apple is NOT getting into a pissing contest with walmart. not. gonna. happen. ever.

is that a serious question?

Indeed price is one of the major keys to flooding the market - but it also has to effectively bridge the gap betwen iPOD Touch and the entry level MacBook ($999.00). The challenge with tablets in the past (beside them running the Windows OS) is that they are usually MORE expensive then their laptop counterparts.

If Apple can accomplish real multitasking, touch screen and useful (I'm talking note taking & handwriting recognition) Apps AND keep it under the $999.00 mark it is no doubt that they will have a very solid winner on their hands.

Sign me up. (I above is true)

you take it around or do whatever like the iphone. why pay $2000 to Honda for a DVD system that costs them 1/10 the price you pay to install it? plus the tablet will play games. a lot of people are installing consoles into their cars and minivans for the kids on long drives.

except the tablet is cheaper and better

$1200 - $1800 will buy you 2-3 tablets to play games against each other for kids and parents via buetooth on long drives. or watch individual movies. and you can borrow DVD's from the library, rip them and import them to the iphone or tablet for a drive. or just rent via the cell network or wifi if it's there. a lot of hotels have free wifi and just leave the tablet overnight to download a movie. a lot better than taking a stack of movies and games with you.

i lost count how many of my CD's have been scratched up while in the army taking them out to the field, saudi arabia, africa, etc.

someone needs to look up the definition of a netbook.



actually i could see that price. for a low end model. with perhaps a slightly higher model at perhaps $200 more. like a 7 inch and a 10 inch model.


Agreed. I figure it will be around the thickness of a closed Air


I don't think 'touch' is the issue. purpose if the issue. if they are designing a replacement for the Air, it will likely be OSX. but if it is essentially a netbook with gaming and music, then Phone OS is a contender. they already have an imovie lite for the iphone, they could do the same with other apps, plus you have all the 3rd party games that could make adjustments etc.


with a bigger device and Apple's new batteries I suspect they are already thinking about that issue.

as for the multitasking issue, don't expect it to be as huge a capability as a full notebook. Because it is unlikely that they are trying to replace the whole notebook line with this device.

[/QUOTE]


You assume Apple has the grip. Don't forget that studios have much say in this concern. which is why, for example, hulu can only have 5 episodes at a time and why big networks like ABC only just not agreed to have their content included.

Also, just as many have said that the itunes store is all about selling ipods, so might this 'cobbled' AppleTV be about making sales in the itunes store.

Do you have a point you're trying to make (on an Apple rumor/fan site)?

Yeah, it gets better and better with each new product intro!

I'm also a bit dubious about this tablet device. It's going to have to bring something to the table that the iPhone and MacBooks don't or can't. Personally, having a larger version of an iPhone isn't of much interest, especially if it's only running a souped-up version of iPhone OS. The price will also have to be amazingly good to convince enough people to buy it. $600 sounds like a decent place to start, but, as netbooks are selling for less, it'll have to have a huge WOW factor if Apple expects these to fly off the shelves.

Yes, but how practical is that? I carry my iPhone everywhere. Home, work, bars, clubs, the grocery store...it's always in my pocket. Something in the 10" size you're going to be carrying it in a sleeve or something, just like any other notebook. And I definitely don't carry my MBP everywhere with me.

So I think a 10" device is just too big for a carry everywhere device like the iPhone. So it is going to be a niche product or something different for say, the home, that everyone would want to get?

I doubt most Americans will pay 600 for the tablet

I think apple will use it iPhone strategy... Pay 399 for the tablet and 30 to 45 quid per month for two years

verizon would pay anything to get their hands on this one

Is this for real? A stock analyst speculates out loud based on a rumor based on hearsay, his musings get picked up as if they're factual, and then everyone is talking about the price of a product that may not even exist.

Thank goodness fact and opinion never get mixed up in politics.

i've the work of some demographics people and we are supposed to be in the midst of another baby boom similar to post WW2. Seems to happen every other generation. there are going to be more ankle biters around and parents will pay dearly to shut them up and keep them entertained on long trips and out on the town or whatever.

anyone who has kids will tell you that you have to take a lot of crap with you whenever you take your kids somewhere. buying a tablet that will keep you from carrying around pounds of crap is well worth it

I'll second that! I would love, love, love to be able to use some version of Photoshop or Illustrator on a tablet like this.

Most Americans don't need to. A few hundred thousand would be just fine.

True, but it's Apple who won't put in a $10 DVD player so I can play my existing library of movies. And Apple who doesn't support the entire set of their QuickTime codecs. And Apple who doesn't allow AppleTV to access the Movies folder on my Mac to play the videos there (those unsupported QT movie formats, iMovie projects, video_TS folders which FrontRow plays just fine).

None of those things would have any appreciable impact on iTunes sales. I'm never going to re-buy a movie from iTunes if I already own the DVD, and none of that content in my Movies folder is available from iTunes at any price.

Imagine how spectacularly UNsuccessful the iPod would have been if you couldn't play any of your exsiting music on it and you had to repurchase it all from Apple! Obviously, Apple can't support ripping commercial DVDs due to the DRM (although maybe they could make a deal with the studios to allow ripping if they then wrapped the resulting file in FairPlay). But if FrontRow can play DVDs, there is no reason AppleTV shouldn't be able to do the same.

It's funny that you say this, at the starbucks where I live there is a woman who sets up her iMac at a table every day and uses it, and yes the large model, I don't know if she just moved here and doesn't have internet yet or what, but she has it in a suitcase with rollers and brings it in and sits there and works all day.

So never say never!

(I haven't seen her in a couple days, but if she is in again I'll be sure to get a pic on my iphone)

People said they would never pay 100s for a phone again, people said no one would pay that much for an iTouch ... etc., and so on.