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Apple accuses Psystar of destroying evidence in latest court filing - Page 2

post #41 of 108
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Originally Posted by MadisonTate View Post

http://www.kayako.com/solutions/supportsuite/

Wouldn't they have online logs?

They must be using the same e-mail vendor the White House used under Bush.

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post #42 of 108
Destroying evidence sounds like a criminal offense. If it turns out to be true,
some person(s) at Psystar could end up behind bars.
post #43 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

The results of this case should set precedent for all future EULA cases hopefully. A part of me wants Apple to win so they can put a company out of business that is knowingly reverse engineering and modifying OS X to install on their hardware, but the other part wants Psystar to win so there can be more competition and make Macs more affordable to all. However Psystar isn't helping their cause by some silly things they have been doing.




If someone can't afford a Mac (yet), then they should save up. It sounds crazy, I know, but just think about it. LOL

If you dont think it's worth it even if you DO have the money, then it comes down to a matter of personal taste. In which case you can do what you please.

Macs are as affordable or as expensive as the market can bear. That's all there is to it.

Seems to be working out just fine. People are buying and Apple's making its margins. Done. There's no reason for it to be any more complicated than that.

If there was an actual problem, we'd see Apple unable to sell their prodcuts and sharp drops in sales and revenue, and all the other obvious signs that something isn't right. We're not seeing any of that, especially in this recession (imagine how much more consumers will buy at these prices once we're out of the woods!) So Apple's prices are just fine. The company seems to know what it's doing.
post #44 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhowarth View Post

Why should Macs be affordable by all? All you need to do is replace "Mac" by a few other premium brand names like BMW, Rolex, Armani etc. to see how ludicrous the whole argument is. Are you saying these companies should be denied intellectual property protection just so you can afford to buy one of their products for less than you might otherwise? It's your choice - if you don't think the product is worth the price, don't buy it.

In any case, I'd argue against the assumption that Macs aren't affordable. They're not THAT expensive, and quite apart from the Mac Mini there are always plenty of offers on old stock when a new model is introduced, refurbished machines from Apple, etc. that can significantly reduce the cost. Macs tend to have a very long usable life, so you're not missing much if you can't justify paying for the latest and greatest top of the range model.

I agree, I don't want macs to be for everyone, I want macs to be amazing machines for those who can afford them (as you say they aren't that expensive anyway). A third party PC running OSX does not make a mac. Where is the machined aluminum case? Light weight? Thin profile? Hard drive drop sensor? Illuminated keyboard? Multitouch trackpad? Ambient light sensor? Slot loading drive? I also agree on the long life part. I've had my macbook pro longer than any PC I've ever owned.
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post #45 of 108
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Originally Posted by quinney View Post

Destroying evidence sounds like a criminal offense. If it turns out to be true,
some person(s) at Psystar could end up behind bars.

They're just lowlifes looking to profit from Apple's work. I'm not too worried about them. Their days of being in business are numbered, anyway. November is getting closer and closer.
post #46 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

I agree, I don't want macs to be for everyone, I want macs to be amazing machines for those who can afford them (as you say they aren't that expensive anyway). A third party PC running OSX does not make a mac. Where is the machined aluminum case? Light weight? Thin profile? Hard drive drop sensor? Illuminated keyboard? Multitouch trackpad? Ambient light sensor? Slot loading drive? I also agree on the long life part. I've had my macbook pro longer than any PC I've ever owned.

What if you don't want the aluminum case, the thin profile (overheating?) the illuminated keyboard, the multitouch trackpad, the light sensor, the slot drive, the isight? What if a person just wants OS X? That's the issue with some. I don't want any of those things. I want a desktop hard drive, a desktop processor that I can change out and over clock, I want standard drives and be able to install a blue-ray drive if i wish. I want to be able to upgrade to USB3 when it comes out, or install a new networking card. I want to be able to use a standard graphics card that isn't specially built for Mac, and more so I want SLI or CrossFire. I want this in a smallish desktop form factor. Apple doesn't sell this. I want all this AND OSX, but that's not a possiblitiy through Apple... so then what do I do?

Gotta do it myself.


And also, my PCs have lasted over 2 times longer than my MacBook Pro ever did (three of them). And when I sold the machine after 1.5 years, it was obsolete to the fact that it won't run some current Apple software. At least with my 300 dollar netbook, I can't complain that its slow or when it does die (which it is out lasting the MBPs and not showing any signs of dying) I can't complain that I didn't get my bang for my buck. For 2000 dollars, and the machine only lasts 8 months at the most, then yes, I can complain (three laptops, one lasted 3 weeks, the next 3 months, the final, 8 months, yay for going outside the warranty. Sad I couldn't afford the AppleCare be cause I saved up all my money for just the computer alone. It wiped me out.)


Some people want choice, and Apple doesn't give them too much choice. I'm not pro Psystar, but I'm pro happy consumers. And I know quite a few Apple consumers who are not happy. Myself included.
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post #47 of 108
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Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

If someone can't afford a Mac (yet), then they should save up. It sounds crazy, I know, but just think about it. LOL

If you dont think it's worth it even if you DO have the money, then it comes down to a matter of personal taste. In which case you can do what you please.

Macs are as affordable or as expensive as the market can bear. That's all there is to it.

Seems to be working out just fine. People are buying and Apple's making its margins. Done. There's no reason for it to be any more complicated than that.

If there was an actual problem, we'd see Apple unable to sell their prodcuts and sharp drops in sales and revenue, and all the other obvious signs that something isn't right. We're not seeing any of that, especially in this recession (imagine how much more consumers will buy at these prices once we're out of the woods!) So Apple's prices are just fine. The company seems to know what it's doing.

Perhaps the U.S. government will soon institute a "Pennies for PCs" program for people wishing to purchase a new Mac.

They can trade in their crappy Windows PCs (which will be promptly destroyed even if the hardware is in prime condition) and receive credit towards the Mac of their choice.

Nah. It'll never happen. Apple is actually a well-run, profitable, innovative company that doesn't need unconstitutional government intervention to stay afloat.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

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post #48 of 108
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Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

They're just lowlifes looking to profit from Apple's work. I'm not too worried about them. Their days of being in business are numbered, anyway. November is getting closer and closer.

I don't disagree with you, but I was just thinking of the scenario where the
people at Psystar are just paid stooges for some as yet unnamed third party
behind the scenes. When they started out, the masterminds might have
told the stooges, "don't worry, all the legal disputes we foresee will be
civil in nature, and we will pay for everything so you don't have to worry."
Now that there might be a criminal aspect to the dispute, the stooges might
end up spending some time in jail, which is something they may not have
thought possible. I think it would be poetic justice, plus it would provide
motivation for the stooges to identify the masterminds.
post #49 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

Well I completely disagree with how Pystar is selling their machines by hacking OS X and putting it on their machines. I think if Psystar wins, it creates better competition by selling OS X on machines with cheaper components. Do it the right way by legally winning this battle, and selling legit, unhacked OS X installs. As for as who is all, I am talking about the people who want to get a Mac computer, but are not able to pay $1,000 dollars for a model. I know the Mac Mini starts at $599, but most people I know want a laptop instead and Apple doesn't cut it at that price range. Also when they go into an Apple Store, the Mini isn't exactly displayed prominently like an iMac or portable solutions. For me, I think a $700 dollar MacBook type price point is a great starting price.

There are many things you must keep in mind of why PC laptops are so cheap and apple will NEVER be able to produce them.

1) Software companies pay the hardware companies to get their software on their machines. This helps lower costs.

2) The hardware companies use poorer components (plastic casings, cheaper power supplies, bottom of the barrel hard drives). This helps lower costs.

3) The hardware companies don't have much for research and development. A case design and they slap pre-made components inside the case. Apple does much more R&D than any other company. This helps the hardware companies lower costs.

4) The hardware companies don't have any software R&D. Apple invests a lot of money in developing OS X. They don't make that money from selling the upgrade copies for $130. They make it in their margins for their computers. The hardware companies just have to buy a copy of windows (FOR VERY VERY CHEAP). This helps the hardware companies lower costs.

 

 

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post #50 of 108
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Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

Some people want choice, and Apple doesn't give them too much choice. I'm not pro Psystar, but I'm pro happy consumers. And I know quite a few Apple consumers who are not happy. Myself included.

Well, as anyone who would bother to read my other postings would know, I'm all for consumer choice, but it's just not possible for Apple to make all computers for all people. And, as I pointed out in an early reply to this thread, the business model where Apple becomes a software company isn't really viable either. I think they've made the right choice for themselves to flourish by avoiding the low-end, low-margin market and focusing on higher margin products where there really isn't any competition.

It would be great if they could make everyone exactly the computer they want, at exactly the price they want, but, unfortunately, it's just not a realistic scenario.
post #51 of 108
^----- that. I wish I could quote that in my signature.

 

 

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post #52 of 108
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Originally Posted by bartfat View Post

I'm sick of people thinking that Macs have to be affordable.

Yes, because as is observed so frequently in today's society (e.g., this plaintiff and supporting posters), some distort reality/laws/sense to cover one's weaknesses in the irrational/lame attempt of behavior justification or making it appear as somebody else's fault/responsibility. As my parents were known to say, "The jails are full of them."
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post #53 of 108
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Originally Posted by bizwarrior View Post

Psystar has valid points and we should be supporting their efforts rather than fighting them!

Your being sarcastic aren't you?

Psystar are no better that chop shop car thieves or chinese electronic clone companies with no respect for anyones IP. More than that their dishonesty runs to destroying evidence. They are nothing more than common criminals and should be treated as such.
post #54 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by bartfat View Post

So true. I'm sick of people thinking that Macs have to be affordable. They aren't for everyone -- they provide a better experience because they're more expensive and therefore generally have higher quality hardware. And yes, they have higher profit margins, but they also deserve it, because their hardware and software work almost flawlessly. Not only that, they have to deal with the consumer if he/she has any problems because they're directly responsible. Try telling that to Microsoft or any of the PC makers...

If Apple decides it wants to be part of the market, NOT the whole market, so be it. Pystar shouldn't be allowed to force it to do otherwise .

To clarify that last part further, the courts should not be allowed to force Apple to do otherwise. Apple has not been found to be practicing anti-trust or anti-competitive business practices.
post #55 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

Well I completely disagree with how Pystar is selling their machines by hacking OS X and putting it on their machines. I think if Psystar wins, it creates better competition by selling OS X on machines with cheaper components. Do it the right way by legally winning this battle, and selling legit, unhacked OS X installs.

I really don't understand your position. On the one hand you seem to be saying that what Psystar has been doing IS wrong. ie Illegal. On the other hand you are telling them to legally win this 'battle'.

?
post #56 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

What if you don't want the aluminum case, the thin profile (overheating?) the illuminated keyboard, the multitouch trackpad, the light sensor, the slot drive, the isight? What if a person just wants OS X? That's the issue with some. I don't want any of those things. I want a desktop hard drive, a desktop processor that I can change out and over clock, I want standard drives and be able to install a blue-ray drive if i wish. I want to be able to upgrade to USB3 when it comes out, or install a new networking card. I want to be able to use a standard graphics card that isn't specially built for Mac, and more so I want SLI or CrossFire. I want this in a smallish desktop form factor. Apple doesn't sell this. I want all this AND OSX, but that's not a possiblitiy through Apple... so then what do I do?

Gotta do it myself.


And also, my PCs have lasted over 2 times longer than my MacBook Pro ever did (three of them). And when I sold the machine after 1.5 years, it was obsolete to the fact that it won't run some current Apple software. At least with my 300 dollar netbook, I can't complain that its slow or when it does die (which it is out lasting the MBPs and not showing any signs of dying) I can't complain that I didn't get my bang for my buck. For 2000 dollars, and the machine only lasts 8 months at the most, then yes, I can complain (three laptops, one lasted 3 weeks, the next 3 months, the final, 8 months, yay for going outside the warranty. Sad I couldn't afford the AppleCare be cause I saved up all my money for just the computer alone. It wiped me out.)


Some people want choice, and Apple doesn't give them too much choice. I'm not pro Psystar, but I'm pro happy consumers. And I know quite a few Apple consumers who are not happy. Myself included.

Most mac users are happy, in fact Apple tends to have a higher percentage of satisfied customers than most other pc manufactuers. I'm sorry that you had a bad experience, but that is not typical.

Honestly, what you want from a computer represents a very small market. While many people have asked for Apple to release a consumer desktop, I think Apple would only introduce one if they could do something truely innovative in that market, if not they would be stuck in the low margin high production business model that they don't want to follow (despite your experience, the low margin manufacturers still deliver lower quality products). Most people don't get desktops for their upgradability, most never open up their computers, they get them because they are cheap. Apple doesn't fit that model.

Lastly, Apple is under no obligation to allow OSX to be used with any computer and if they did, you should expect OSX to cost close to twice as much if they can't subsidize it through hardware sales.
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post #57 of 108
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Originally Posted by bizwarrior View Post

Psystar has valid points and we should be supporting their efforts rather than fighting them!

Really? Which "valid points" would those be?
post #58 of 108
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Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

Personally, I want linux to win.

Two thoughts: 1) Good luck with that 2) You'll get what you paid for
post #59 of 108
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Originally Posted by rhowarth View Post


...In any case, I'd argue against the assumption that Macs aren't affordable. They're not THAT expensive, and quite apart from the Mac Mini there are always plenty of offers on old stock when a new model is introduced, refurbished machines from Apple, etc. that can significantly reduce the cost. Macs tend to have a very long usable life, so you're not missing much if you can't justify paying for the latest and greatest top of the range model.

Since our first Mac, a Performa 630CD purchased in 1994, we've used each of our Macs at least 6 years or longer. Last week I just replaced our 9 year oldG4 Cube with a refurbished, current generation Mac Mini!
post #60 of 108
I wonder if Psystar is actually selling any Mac clones. Who would buy one with this pending legal situation? Where is their money coming from? How can they afford attorney fees and other court costs? They must have backers.
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post #61 of 108
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Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

What if you don't want the aluminum case, the thin profile (overheating?) the illuminated keyboard, the multitouch trackpad, the light sensor, the slot drive, the isight? What if a person just wants OS X? That's the issue with some.

Then I guess it sucks to be them.

While you are out there wishing for stuff, I want a pony too.

The Mac is special because of it's combination of hardware and software - OS X in and of it's self isn't that interesting. It's the Apple Way. If you don't like their model, there are plenty of other choices out there.

You keep saying you want a Mac and then immediately set about trying to change what makes the Mac a great platform. It's illogical. Your like the corporate raiders that buy a company because it's great and then immediately set about screwing up everything that made the company you just bought great. It makes no sense.

If your honest with yourself, you don't want a Mac. You want the Mac experience for free. You want something for nothing (or as close to nothing) as you can get. Again, I want a pony. Suck it up and buy a Mac or go buy something else, but stop whining like you are entitled to the Mac experience. You aren't. Having an "affordable" (whatever the heck that means) Mac experience not an inalienable right in the Declaration of Independence (it's the Pursuit of Happiness BTW).

If you don't have the money now, do what I and other responsible people do - save or do without.
post #62 of 108
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Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

The Mac is special because of it's combination of hardware and software - OS X in and of it's self isn't that interesting.

I would disagree with this. OS X is quite interesting in and of itself, much more interesting than the hardware. Not that the hardware isn't interesting, but...
post #63 of 108
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Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

If you don't have the money now, do what I and other responsible people do - save or do without.

Well said. That is afterall, the bottom line ... for adults.
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post #64 of 108
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Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

I think Psystar knows it's going down in flames and has decided to become a Kamikaze, trying to hit Apple somewhere before the end comes. This whole episode just confirms speculation that Psystar is a puppet whose strings are being pulled by someone else and I hope the truth comes out some day.

Just wanted to throw another log onto the "puppet master" conspiracy.

Maybe the secret source that's bankrolling Pystar is...

Micro$oft—in an attempt to taint the Apple brand. They want to take away Apple's advantage of making "the whole widget". And if that doesn't work, at least they'll keep Apple busy and/or pry into their business operations just a bit. Kinda like they did to Yahoo a little while back—when they were "considering a buyout" and looked at their books, then made a ridiculous low-ball offer.

Perhaps Pystar doesn't even know where the money's coming from, and they're just unwitting pawns trying to survive.

Just pulling stuff outta my a**. It's an intriguing idea though, don't you think?
post #65 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

Then I guess it sucks to be them.

While you are out there wishing for stuff, I want a pony too.

The Mac is special because of it's combination of hardware and software - OS X in and of it's self isn't that interesting. It's the Apple Way. If you don't like their model, there are plenty of other choices out there.

You keep saying you want a Mac and then immediately set about trying to change what makes the Mac a great platform. It's illogical. Your like the corporate raiders that buy a company because it's great and then immediately set about screwing up everything that made the company you just bought great. It makes no sense.

If your honest with yourself, you don't want a Mac. You want the Mac experience for free. You want something for nothing (or as close to nothing) as you can get. Again, I want a pony. Suck it up and buy a Mac or go buy something else, but stop whining like you are entitled to the Mac experience. You aren't. Having an "affordable" (whatever the heck that means) Mac experience not an inalienable right in the Declaration of Independence (it's the Pursuit of Happiness BTW).

If you don't have the money now, do what I and other responsible people do - save or do without.

very well said.

I want the Wii experience on my PC, they should offer it separately so everyone can put it on their PC. we deserve this right! heck, they should offer the PS3 experience for ALL PC users that way nobody has to buy that overpriced PS3. <sarcasim> who deserves IP? who deserves to make a profit anymore?

Sounds like Napster 1.0 and LimeWire fanboys thinking they deserve everything for nothing...
post #66 of 108
To say affordable Mac's is bogus.

In an earlier post there was the remark Apple needs to produce cheaper products in line with other manufactures because I want a laptop for $700.00 with OS X.

Does anyone ever take out the cost of OS X and iLife out of the price of the laptop not that it is a huge drop in price but that does factor in.

You are trying to define a Apple's product matrix you need to consider that the R&D, Design, Production, Marketing, establishing supply chain, warehousing, employee training, salaries, facility's including stores ect ect ect.

On top of all that it is there company that have poured years of late nights, lost sleep, and frustration to produce these products, not yours and there for you do not get a say so other than refusing to purchase there products.

There are so many factors in building, maintaining and growing a company that most people never know about and shouldn't and yet if said company DARES to try and generate profit based on what the market will bear then they or evil.

I never understand how people who put zero effort into a company producing a product to market complain so much and yet when a secondary company tries to STEAL there IP that they have spent YEARS developing people say it is fair.

Exactly how!
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post #67 of 108
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Originally Posted by DGNR8 View Post

To say affordable Mac's is bogus.

In an earlier post there was the remark Apple needs to produce cheaper products in line with other manufactures because I want a laptop for $700.00 with OS X.

Apparently, they don't. At all. Apple is selling a record number of Macs in this recession while keeping their margins up. There doesn't seem to be a reason to change anything.

There's a niche of Apple users (or Windows astroturfers, hackintosh users, whatever) on Mac sites that seem to know what Apple "needs", and then make predictions about how Apple will suffer and how Mac sales will tank in this recession, etc. . . . . and then Apple turns around and proves them all wrong. Consistently.

Most of these people who predict doom and gloom for Apple, who think their "secrecy" is their undoing, who think they know what consumers want, are actually the ones who are completely out of touch with the market.
post #68 of 108
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Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

I would disagree with this. OS X is quite interesting in and of itself, much more interesting than the hardware. Not that the hardware isn't interesting, but...

That may be, but it's not offered that way...
post #69 of 108
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Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

That may be, but it's not offered that way...

Well, yes, but we wouldn't want anyone to get the idea that it's not interesting.
post #70 of 108
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post #71 of 108
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Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"Defendant, Psystar Corporation, has destroyed relevant evidence that was legally required to preserve," the court document reads. "Specifically, Psystar has overwritten -- i.e. erased -- infringing versions of the software code used on computers sold to its customers."
......

"This discovery revealed that Psystar has erased prior versions of its software that Apple's experts independently found on defendant's computers," the document states.

The heavily redacted document conceals descriptions of the bootloader code used by Psystar, but asks the court to force the company to produce the software. One footnote in the document, referring to a redacted portion, reads: "Psystar's counsel stated that Psystar's e-mail and customer support software (SupportSuite) randomly 'deletes or loses' e-mails."

Seems like Dick Cheney's security consulting firm has a new client - Psystar.
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post #72 of 108
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Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Most of these people who predict doom and gloom for Apple, who think their "secrecy" is their undoing, who think they know what consumers want, are actually the ones who are completely out of touch with the market.

Apparently they don't subscribe to the maxim, "It is better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt."
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post #73 of 108
Apple... Don't change a thing.

Your doing it right when other companies are struggling.

I will continue to purchase your products.

Do I wish it was a little cheaper?

Well yes I am human, but I understand they have a product I love and want to purchase so I pay there asking price and do it gladly with the excitement of owning said product.

I think Apple should be Held up as a shining example of an American company that gets it.

All the complainers should make there own product by getting a distro of UNIX and creating there own desktop interface and design there own hardware to work with such a desktop.

But then again that takes years, capitol, personal, R & D, marketing and most of all luck.

If your lucky enough to be successful tell me if you want to give it away or make as much of a profit as the market will bear.

Flame On
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post #74 of 108
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Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Well, as anyone who would bother to read my other postings would know, I'm all for consumer choice, but it's just not possible for Apple to make all computers for all people. And, as I pointed out in an early reply to this thread, the business model where Apple becomes a software company isn't really viable either. I think they've made the right choice for themselves to flourish by avoiding the low-end, low-margin market and focusing on higher margin products where there really isn't any competition.

It would be great if they could make everyone exactly the computer they want, at exactly the price they want, but, unfortunately, it's just not a realistic scenario.


I understand that Apple cannot make computers for all people. I don't think they should make computers for everyone. No computer maker really does. I think a good idea would be to have two divisions. Apple computers just how they are now. Then the "build it yourself" model. You would have to buy the OS from them, no third parties are allowed to sell it unless authorized. Aka: No Dell, no HP, no Psystar. But allow the OS to run on generic hardware so others could use their OS. No support though. Apple should only support their own computers, but not block other machines outright. At least get us to the regular desktop booted, then let us worry about drivers and such. Niche market yes, but who knows, they may get sales where they wouldn't normally have sold even a whole computer. Is some better than none here?

But yeah, it wouldn't be good business for them I guess. Pigs in flight.
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post #75 of 108
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Originally Posted by bloggerblog View Post

Psystar is not a company trying to make a living. It is a "company" funded by other conspiring corporations to examine every possible angle of Apple's legal powers, for the purpose of discovering their strong and weak points. Once those points are discovered, Psystar or their conspiring partners can then use this data to maneuver through the legal system flawlessly and possibly dethrone Apple.
I call on Microsoft or Dell.

great, another Mulder. get some sleep, Fox!
post #76 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

Is some better than none here?
But yeah, it wouldn't be good business for them I guess. Pigs in flight.

In a focused, public, innovative tech company, that's referred to as a distraction. Successful companies eschew those. There are people eager, or desperate enough, to attempt to make a living by "bottom-feeding", but for a company such as Apple, they would agree with your latter comment, "It wouldn't be a good business for them...", and serious stakeholders appropriately would protest.
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post #77 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

I understand that Apple cannot make computers for all people. I don't think they should make computers for everyone. No computer maker really does. I think a good idea would be to have two divisions. Apple computers just how they are now. Then the "build it yourself" model. You would have to buy the OS from them, no third parties are allowed to sell it unless authorized. Aka: No Dell, no HP, no Psystar. But allow the OS to run on generic hardware so others could use their OS. No support though. Apple should only support their own computers, but not block other machines outright. At least get us to the regular desktop booted, then let us worry about drivers and such. Niche market yes, but who knows, they may get sales where they wouldn't normally have sold even a whole computer. Is some better than none here?

You mean just like Palm? Because that worked out so well for them.

Why does anyone think that competing with yourself is a good business strategy?
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #78 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

I understand that Apple cannot make computers for all people. I don't think they should make computers for everyone. No computer maker really does. I think a good idea would be to have two divisions. Apple computers just how they are now. Then the "build it yourself" model. You would have to buy the OS from them, no third parties are allowed to sell it unless authorized. Aka: No Dell, no HP, no Psystar. But allow the OS to run on generic hardware so others could use their OS. No support though. Apple should only support their own computers, but not block other machines outright. At least get us to the regular desktop booted, then let us worry about drivers and such. Niche market yes, but who knows, they may get sales where they wouldn't normally have sold even a whole computer. Is some better than none here?

But yeah, it wouldn't be good business for them I guess. Pigs in flight.

Those users are fully capable of making a hackintosh now. Even with a "no support" clause Apple will be exposing themselves to a world of trouble the moment they allow third party installs to any extent, for little gain.
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The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
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post #79 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

What if you don't want the aluminum case, the thin profile (overheating?) the illuminated keyboard, the multitouch trackpad, the light sensor, the slot drive, the isight? What if a person just wants OS X? That's the issue with some.

What if I desperately, desperately want a pink and yellow polka dot Armani suit, and they stubbornly refuse to make one because they claim it's not this year's colour??

That, surely, is their prerogative. All I can do in that case is vote with my feet and decide not to buy an Armani.
post #80 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

I think a good idea would be to have two divisions. Apple computers just how they are now. Then the "build it yourself" model.

Why? Why should they do it? Just because you want it?

That model makes no sense whatsoever. It's un-sustainable, low margin, high-grief. In a nutshell, it's the whole flawed windows industry. Why would Apple need (or even want to) lower themselves into such a market? If you want a crap Windows experience you can have it today - go mix your own box and throw Windows on it!

Other then shutting up the people who want cheap Mac's, what does your proposal bring Apple? It certainly won't help their brand - when reporting problems the press and internet wags won't bother to point out which Mac line is having the issue - just that "there goes that Apple again". Heck, people pull the "there is no difference between a PC or Mac" crap in here all the time. If there is no difference between a PC and a Mac, then what exactly is the difference that people are willing to pay the (if you believe the wags) vastly overrated Apple Tax? The sure sign they are desperate for any differentiation other then admitting that Apple may be better is when they argue people are stupid and buy just for "brand". Pretty pathetic but I've seen posters who are quite proud of themselves for defending such weak arguments.
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