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Steve Jobs talks iPod nano with camera, iPod touch without

post #1 of 93
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In a new interview, Apple co-founder Steve Jobs discusses a number of issues, including the new lineup of iPods, the Amazon Kindle, and his own health and weight.

Jobs spoke with David Pogue of The New York Times, and explained that the iPod touch, unlike the iPod nano, was not given a camera because the company wanted to focus on portraying the device as a gaming machine. Jobs said that the company's main goal was to lower the price of the iPod touch as much as possible, and he believes it achieved that with a 8GB model for $199.

"What customers told us was, they started to see it as a game machine," Jobs said. "We started to market it that way, and it just took off. And now what we really see is its the lowest-cost way to the App Store, and thats the big draw. So what we were focused on is just reducing the price to $199. We dont need to add new stuff. We need to get the price down where everyone can afford it."

Third-party cases with camera holes and even photos and video of an alleged prototype of a third-generation iPod touch with camera existed well before Wednesday's event, leading many to assume such a product would be announced. While Jobs said the reason was intentional, AppleInsider received word earlier this week that the camera was removed due to bad hardware.

The chief executive went on to explain that the iPod nano can record video, but cannot take still pictures, because the sensors required for pictures are too thick to fit into the .02-inch thick device.

He also vaguely hinted at products coming in the future. He said his absence from the company for several months did not prevent them from working on new products, and that Apple has "some really good stuff coming up." Among those products is expected to be Apple's long-rumored 10-inch touchscreen tablet device, expected to debut in early 2010.

Jobs also discussed his health, as Wednesday's appearance was his first official in public since receiving a liver transplant earlier this year. The executive told Pogue that he's eating "a lot of ice cream" to put on weight, and he probably needs to gain about 30 pounds.

The Apple co-founder also took a jab at Amazon's Kindle e-book reader. He said "dedicated devices" like the Kindle will always remain niche products, while multi-purpose devices "will win the day." Jobs noted that Amazon doesn't announce how many Kindles it has sold, suggesting the market for e-books is very small.

"Usually, if they sell a lot of something, you want to tell everybody," he said.

Jobs' return to the stage at Wednesday's keynote was a welcome surprise for Apple fans. He had returned to work at Apple full-time in June, following his liver transplant. In his introduction at the iPod event, he thanked members of the Apple community for their concern, and also expressed gratitude toward co-workers who filled in, in his absence.

Apple's media event with Jobs' keynote is available for stream from Apple via QuickTime.
post #2 of 93
Spin and nothing more or less.
post #3 of 93
1. Jobs doesn't ever tell the whole truth to the media. So take his explanations for what it's worth.

2. I'm sure Jobs has market research data about Kindle (and other ebook reader) sales. And the numbers are not that high.

3. Jobs always says there's good stuff coming. That's his job.

4. Did Apple spend the engineering resources to put a camera in the touch? Maybe not, and as some posters have said, the camera problem rumor could have had to do with nano still photos, not touch. But that doesn't explain away the cases. It's plausible that Apple only spent limited engineering resources on the touch this cycle, as it is has always been their habit (on both Mac and iPod) not to do major refreshes every year. (We get speed bumps in one, or more intervening refreshes.)

5. As for lowering prices, in Aug 2008, it costed $199 to buy an 8GB nano. In Sep 2009, it costs $199 to buy an 8GB touch. (Granted that I picked the end of one cycle, and the beginning of another. But still for the person who bought or almost bought in Aug 2008...
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post #4 of 93
Quote:
Jobs noted that Amazon doesn't announce how many Kindles it has sold, suggesting the market for e-books is very small.

"Usually, if they sell a lot of something, you want to tell everybody,"
he said.

So tells us Steve- How many AppleTV's has Apple sold?
post #5 of 93
A year from now, chances are we'll all see this as a smart move.
post #6 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

So tells us Steve- How many AppleTV's has Apple sold?

That's exactly what I was thinking.
post #7 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

So tells us Steve- How many AppleTV's has Apple sold?



At least its doing better than the iPod HiFi. And better than the Apple eMate, or QuickTake.
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post #8 of 93
"What customers told us"

They obviously aren't the same customers who contribute to these forums who have overwhelmingly expressed disappointment at the lack of a camera.

I think the iPod refresh being a damp squib was due to a diversion of resources to other projects within Apple. Probably the iTabbie.

I am more convinced than ever that Apple is purposefully holding back features from the Touch to ensure the iPhone is always a better proposition, and possibly also with regard the iTabbie.
post #9 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

So tells us Steve- How many AppleTV's has Apple sold?

Clearly, Apple made a major miscalculation with the AppleTV. I wonder what factors led them to go ahead into production back in 2006.

Looking back, the whole Internet industry miscalculated as to when and how Internet-carried video would become a big thing, including even Google's purchase of YouTube. Schmidt certainly played a role in moving AppleTV forward.
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post #10 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

"What customers told us"

They obviously aren't the same customers who contribute to these forums who have overwhelmingly expressed disappointment at the lack of a camera.

These forums are populated by techies and fanboys. The rest of the population looks nothing like this.

Quote:
I think the iPod refresh being a damp squib was due to a diversion of resources to other projects within Apple. Probably the iTabbie.

I am more convinced than ever that Apple is purposefully holding back features from the Touch to ensure the iPhone is always a better proposition, and possibly also with regard the iTabbie.

If you can get someone to pay you $400 for a 8GB iPhone 3G and $650 for a 32GB iPhone 3GS, or $200 for a 8GB touch and $300 for a 32GB touch, where your costs are maybe $100 less for the touch, which would you be trying to sell?
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post #11 of 93
I am thinking some case manufactures might have jumped the gun or speculated a camera was coming to the itouch and figure it was be located at the same spot as the iphone.

There is no way that Apple would have ramped up the itouch with camera then pulled it back in the last few weeks, that would have cost them millions since you know those product are already in the pipeline. If anything if it did have a camera at one time it was pulled months ago before they even ramp the product. Also, I do not believe the bad hardware thing, since you can guess the itouch camera CCD was either the one from the iphone or the nano, they would not want to source a 3rd CCD, that too would be too costly.
post #12 of 93
Quote:
"What customers told us was, they started to see it as a game machine," Jobs said. "We started to market it that way, and it just took off. And now what we really see is it’s the lowest-cost way to the App Store, and that’s the big draw. So what we were focused on is just reducing the price to $199. We don’t need to add new stuff. We need to get the price down where everyone can afford it."


"We need to get the price down where everyone can afford it"


Exactly.

After all one can get a much better camera as a separate device that if Apple included a crappy 2 or 3 mega pixel camera in the iPod Touch for $299, effectively pricing it out of the ideal $199 target people want to pay and essentially shutting down the App Store in the process, discouraging further development in Apple products.



One can get a 12 megapixel Kodak camera with zoom for $150 or so, look around!

http://www.electronista.com/articles....of.12mp.cams/



The higher the price a item is, the less people can afford to pay for it.

The object is to find the right balance of features, price and margins that the most people will fork their money over for so it makes the most money overall.

The Nano video camera is most likely not very good, and you can take a still frame off a video clip and use that as a picture.


Us geeks naturally want a swiss army device that does it all, but if it sells less because it's too expensive, then it's not profitable.
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post #13 of 93
Quote:
He said "dedicated devices" like the Kindle will always remain niche products

So why was the original iPod such a success? Oh, I forgot, it was also an address book and calendar.
post #14 of 93
See I was thinking it would be most logical for something like the ipod touch to have a camera. The guts don't need to contend with a radio for space.

If they made the touch as thick as the iphone just so they could fit a nice camera in, I really don't think anyone would complain since the iphone isn't that thick to begin with.

Oh well, maybe next year.
post #15 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

So tells us Steve- How many AppleTV's has Apple sold?

Thanks because apple said it a hobby business for them and said right up front they will not disclose the sales. They are testing the waters and market to understand what the product need to be to get it just right.

The fundamental problem with ereaders like the Kindles you have to buy books at full cost, you can not buy a used book like many people do today, and as many people who sell a book after they read it or give it to a friend to read. Once you on the electronic version of book it is yours for ever and ever never to be sold or loaned since it is locked to you kindle or your account.

This is great for book seller since they know their major competitor is the use book markets, this model there is not used books on the market to be sold,
post #16 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdasmith View Post

So why was the original iPod such a success? Oh, I forgot, it was also an address book and calendar.

post #17 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdasmith View Post

So why was the original iPod such a success? Oh, I forgot, it was also an address book and calendar.

I don't have a single friend who used those functions. The original was a success because mp3's were booming and people were getting sick of putting them on CDs to listen to them.

I remember being in 11th grade when I first saw an ipod and I thought to my self "FINALLY!" lol.
post #18 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

The fundamental problem with ereaders like the Kindles you have to buy books at full cost, you can not buy a used book like many people do today, and as many people who sell a book after they read it or give it to a friend to read. Once you on the electronic version of book it is yours for ever and ever never to be sold or loaned since it is locked to you kindle or your account.
,

That's funny- that sounds like every movie I've ever bought from iTunes for the AppleTV.
post #19 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by backtomac View Post

That's exactly what I was thinking.

At least one - mine
post #20 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

1. Jobs doesn't ever tell the whole truth to the media. So take his explanations for what it's worth.

I'll bet your parents have more incidences against you than you have on Steve.
post #21 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdasmith View Post

So why was the original iPod such a success? Oh, I forgot, it was also an address book and calendar.

That's right!!!!!!!
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post #22 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdasmith View Post

So why was the original iPod such a success? Oh, I forgot, it was also an address book and calendar.

A lot has changed in the past 8 years.
post #23 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

I'll bet your parents have more incidences against you than you have on Steve.

Good thing my parents don't ask me about much these days ... \
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post #24 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

I am thinking some case manufactures might have jumped the gun or speculated a camera was coming to the itouch and figure it was be located at the same spot as the iphone.

There is no way that Apple would have ramped up the itouch with camera then pulled it back in the last few weeks, that would have cost them millions since you know those product are already in the pipeline. If anything if it did have a camera at one time it was pulled months ago before they even ramp the product. Also, I do not believe the bad hardware thing, since you can guess the itouch camera CCD was either the one from the iphone or the nano, they would not want to source a 3rd CCD, that too would be too costly.


I agree with you, perhaps Apple was just trying to smoke out the moles or the rumor makers have gotten very good lately.
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post #25 of 93
The Kindle does one thing, it's a book reader. Book readers (people who read books) use the Kindle, if they buy one, cause all the want to do is read books on it. That said, I can see a lot of book readers (people who read books) preferring the tangible quality of a real book.

There'll come a time in the future when a Book Reader will come along that will become far more widely used than the Kindle I think, but that point is a few years away yet. Perhaps Apple will make it, and perhaps someone else will - who knows? It won't be the Apple tablet though, that's for sure. The Apple tablet will be a computer, not a Book Reader.

One thing I didn't see mentioned in this article, was the reason I think there's no video-camera in the touch. Apple want to keep the iPhone out on its own for longer, as I think they make more money from it. Giving the touch a video camera is one more reason to avoid going for an iPhone. I believe that's the real reason.

I use the term "touch" and not iPod touch only to annoy people
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post #26 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

That's funny- that sounds like every movie I've ever bought from iTunes for the AppleTV.

I guess the used book market is more substantial and popular than the used DVD/VHS market. In other words, very few people think about selling their used DVDs or used videotapes or buying such.
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post #27 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

JThe executive told Pogue that he's eating "a lot of ice cream" to put on weight, and he probably needs to gain about 30 pounds.

Interesting, I am pretty sure he used to be a vegan. Maybe his doctors told him he had to at least eat dairy?
post #28 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

I guess the used book market is more substantial and popular than the used DVD/VHS market. In other words, very few people think to sell their used DVDs or used videotapes.

Really- check eBay or Craigslist the last 10 years?
Also methinks swine flu will damper the used book market.
post #29 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zweben View Post

Interesting, I am pretty sure he used to be a vegan. Maybe his doctors told him he had to at least eat dairy?

What - no Tofutti?
post #30 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

Thanks because apple said it a hobby business for them and said right up front they will not disclose the sales. They are testing the waters and market to understand what the product need to be to get it just right.

No, the hobby comment was more Jobs spin just like the quotes in this article. It wasn't described as a hobby until it was released to the market and had less than stellar sales.
post #31 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdasmith View Post

So why was the original iPod such a success? Oh, I forgot, it was also an address book and calendar.


No the iPod was a success because one can store all their music on it, iTMS made it even better and the address book and calender was just extras and software based, which is a lot cheaper than adding new hardware features to a device.

Trust me, if we got a "iPhone without the 'phone' " it would be priced near $600 and people would scream, sales would drop.

Also Apple gets a kickback from the carriers monthly charging for the iPhone, not with the iPod Touch so that has it's influence on features for the device.

The iPod Touch is a gaming device and gaming devices are for kids and the cheaper the better.



Does the iPhone work without a carrier? That's the answer.

http://alexking.org/blog/2007/07/02/...ithout-service
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post #32 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zweben View Post

Interesting, I am pretty sure he used to be a vegan. Maybe his doctors told him he had to at least eat dairy?

I'm guessing the ice cream thing was just a joke. I made the same joke on these forums before the event!. LOL. That said, if he is/was vegan and is eating dairy now... no disrespect to my vegan friends... but my guess is that almost dying might change one's perspective on a few things.
post #33 of 93
"What customers told us" == Sales figures
post #34 of 93
8gb 199 32gb for 299 and 54gb for 399. How much can 8gb extra gb cost to make the 199 price point 16gb. The number just seems lopsided. And 8gb is not that much now especially when apple wants to highlight the touch as a game machine. I do agree with some of the other post on the iphone price as well. how are the touches so different in price from the no contract prices of the ipones.




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post #35 of 93
I think the eBook reader market might get some legs once Asus jumps into the fray:

http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/07/a...est-e-book-re/
post #36 of 93
WARNING! iTunes 9

Those who are used to using iTMS "shopping cart" and click "Buy" in iTunes 9 actually starts the purchase instead of placing the item in the shopping cart.

The shopping cart is replaced with the "Wish List" accessed from the menu next to "Buy" button.

Apple will fool a few million with that trick easy.
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post #37 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo View Post

I'm guessing the ice cream thing was just a joke. I made the same joke on these forums before the event!. LOL. That said, if he is/was vegan and is eating dairy now... no disrespect to my vegan friends... but my guess is that almost dying might change one's perspective on a few things.


Peanut butter and jelly sandwiches will put weight on him in a hurry.


And Steve has been photographed eating ice cream long before his surgery or health issues. (and I know where he goes too *smug*)

I assume Steve "starves" himself to keep himself motivated, if he was fat he would become a lazy, stupid idiot, like Steve Balmer.

(Just take your abuse Stevie B, don't throw a chair at me now lol)
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post #38 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

No, the hobby comment was more Jobs spin just like the quotes in this article. It wasn't described as a hobby until it was released to the market and had less than stellar sales.

Exactly. I never would have bought it in June 2007 if it had been thought of and discussed as a "hobby".
So now the "hobby" is in its 3rd year- what a joke! When was it's last major update?
I wonder what the average ATV owner has spent, in addition to the jukebox unit itself, on rentals and sales to iTunes?
post #39 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

So tells us Steve- How many AppleTV's has Apple sold?

When they call AppleTV a "hobby," it's not like they're pretending it's some huge seller
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post #40 of 93
".02-inch thick" - wow, that really is "wafer thin"!
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