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Broadway Apple Store flyover; Washington walk-out averted - Page 2

post #41 of 66
Quote:
The person said that employees are upset, some have contacted human resources, and some have quit.

Hey Microsoft. Sounds like your kind of people. . .

I wonder who is responsible for those employees not meeting the targets set. Maybe the management. I guess it would be nice to show up and not have any goals to strive for. I suspect that reaching those goals would lead to reward for the employees as well as the managers.
post #42 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregoriusM View Post


Apple stores are doing fantastically because in many ways they are the face of Apple. IF your assertion is that MOST Apple stores are being changed to have lesser qualified people, then it is only due to the recession, and I doubt it will stay that way as we move out of it. The general feeling that I get is that the Apple experience was and continues to be one of if not the best experience for buying at retail stores.

Greg

Well, I believe this whole story is suspect. None of it has been confirmed as factual. Local Apple store staff were informed that the rumor of a walk out was started by one disgruntled employee who was fired for cause. This employee started the rumor and typical of current day media the story took on a life of its own without any verification or fact checking. Apple corporate has very strict policies and will terminate an employee without hesitation if the employee does not conform to standard employee responsibilities. This is another case of a person not taking responsibility for their own actions and blaming their problems on the big bad corporation. This is also another example of supposed news based on nothing other then rumor and innuendo becoming a fact of life that is all to common in this world of instantaneous information.

As to stores cutting back and the lack of "knowledgeable staff" that's just full on crap. The local store here has actually been informed that they are being allotted additional man hours because the staff is working too hard. And the level of "Knowledge" at this store has always been high and continues to be excellent. So, before people start talking out some location other then their mouth they should actually confirm some of their information.
post #43 of 66
I can personally attest to the firing of higher paid employees at Apple retail stores. I worked in one of the flagship stores and saw many of our experienced genii fired for flimsy reasons or simply quit because there is no path out of the genius bar. While none of you know me or can take what I say at face value I can tell you that my own firing was unjustified. I also was one of the genii with the most seniority and had an otherwise clean work record, good attitude and good range of skills. Apple is instituting speed trap policies that make it easy for them to fire someone at will. The culture of the company is definitely changing and while they still talk a good game about their people being their most valuable asset sadly they are simply not living up to their own credo. I enjoyed my time with company but they really have decided to allow lower quality genii (and now 'Family Room Specialists, AKA recession genii) fill the roles former occupied by skilled staff. I don't know that I would blame the recession as the company has over 25,000,000,000 in cash sitting around. They are doing OK.



Quote:
Originally Posted by GregoriusM View Post

What? Microsoft is becoming the easier and happier place by comparison for people to work at?

For one, since we're talking about Apple stores here, and not other areas of each company, there aren't even any Microsoft stores open yet, let alone enough time to see if they are any better a place to work.

And Microsoft as done much the same thing in many places - firing people, moving out higher cost people, etc. to try and address the economic times we're in.

Most companies are doing it in one form other another - addressing the economic times.

Apple stores are doing fantastically because in many ways they are the face of Apple. IF your assertion is that MOST Apple stores are being changed to have lesser qualified people, then it is only due to the recession, and I doubt it will stay that way as we move out of it. The general feeling that I get is that the Apple experience was and continues to be one of if not the best experience for buying at retail stores.

Frankly, until I hear from a LOT of people who frequent the 250 stores that Apple has around the country, then I'll have some idea about whether you assertions are valid.

Have a nice day!

Greg
post #44 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by andyouare View Post

I can personally attest to the firing of higher paid employees at Apple retail stores. I worked in one of the flagship stores and saw many of our experienced genii fired for flimsy reasons or simply quit because there is no path out of the genius bar. While none of you know me or can take what I say at face value I can tell you that my own firing was unjustified. I also was one of the genii with the most seniority and had an otherwise clean work record, good attitude and good range of skills.

Well, I'm sorry to hear about your situation but I can say of the geniuses at the local store there hasn't been one fired in the history of the store. I know of one person that has pushed the envelope sooooo hard and the GM has worked and worked with the person in order to retain that person. In my mind, the rules that the store holds the employees to are completely fair and are nothing out of the ordinary for a standard work ethic. Be on time, don't miss work, don't miss and not call, attend meetings. That is completely in line and not a speed trap.
post #45 of 66
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Originally Posted by paxman View Post

I notice you said 'fairest' suggesting ambiguity. Because attacking both sides doesn't really make anything 'fair'. What's fair is to be critical, regardless. We know how hard that can be as it is far easier to be critical of something you intrinsically and philosophically dislike/ disagree with. And personally I think that is too tall an order for anybody. The worst is really one sided criticism purporting to be 'fair' (FOX news is an example). The Daily Show is also one sided but it doesn't present itself as 'balanced'. Anyway... back to the topic...

Having not yet seen Moore's movie, I only repeated what I've heard thus far. I'll be sure to check it out once it hits DVD.

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post #46 of 66
It's not "genii" (like the other wrong term, "virii"), it's "geniuses."
post #47 of 66
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Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Especially after the helicopter / plane crash here- right? How insensitive!

That is sarcasm, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpw View Post

Both of those statements could describe a situation truthfully without bias; it's the lack of information and the reader's assumptions that bring the reader's bias to the fore.

That's the problem, there was so little information about the circumstances that the current stories about it are pointless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

Yeah, my thought exactly - totally ott - on every level. Still, don't feel ashamed, feel good. It justifies the fact that you are even here when you clearly should be working. I mean, reading about this makes me feel so fucking sane and grounded its not even funny. Mind you, if he makes a living from flying his radio controlled helicopter, who am I to judge.

Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

Shooting videos and still media from remote helicopters is done all the time in situations where a full size helicopter is not deemed as safe ... what's wrong with that? ... sounds like the right thing to do to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

Hence the last sentence. Besides that you are either an übergeek or completely missing the point.

I don't see how you think you know so much about the person to make such a scathing (though oddly hedged) judgement having been given so very little information about them.
post #48 of 66
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Originally Posted by SlyRobber View Post

I coming from Canada, a place where the right of association is a protected right, though also constantly under attack, it always makes my head spin and my stomach queazy when I see and or interact with American worker and their "rights". The whole issue in the US has taken a very Orwelian discourse. An example is the term "right to work states", a more fitting description would be the German "Arbeite Macht Frei" yes. A major problem with the workplace and the worlds economies as a whole, especially in the United States, is that Capitalism has been left to be what it must be, unbridled and ultimately monopolistic where only the bottom line matters and managers are not there to really manage but to apply dictates from right-wing economic gurus in " capitalist stink tanks". The proper actions always seem to be squeeze the workers, get rid of their advantages and rights and get rid of the workers as soon as possible to be replaced by cheaper workers, etc. etc. If you resist this your are infringing the laws that protect the shareholders. To hell with different styles of management, original, progressive, imaginative, all must comply, even if this is counter productive for the long term viability of an enterprise. Only short term goals matter. anyhow I will finnish by encouraging everyone to go see Michael Moores latest film "Capatalism:A love story" Comming out next month. He explains this much bettor than I ever can.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhydyxRjujU

Of course, Michael Moore makes No money from any of his movies, and donates it all to charity. You don't think all of his movies since "Roger and Me" have been anything more than an opportunity to exploit the most recent and controversial subjects, with one thing in mind, to make a profit himself!

Listen, both in the US and Canada, high end retail stores pay their employees commissions on sales, and or bonuses on certain items. Although I have NO clue about this, my guess is the employees at Apple stores, also get bonuses based on their extended sales of Mobile Me, and other like items. Now, if the management receives the only bonus, and the employees receive none, thats just plain wrong. However, I sincerely doubt this is the case.
post #49 of 66
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Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post



Personal politics mean nothing when it comes to running a business and making money. Either you sell something that people want, or you don't. That's it. When government steps in, it introduces something other than a system of exchange that arises when people and companies are allowed to deal with each other peacefully. Government enables price imbalances, unfair competitive advantages, employment imbalances, and the list goes on. Also, I understand Moore's "Capitalism" movie is his 'fairest' yet, as it attacks Republicans and Democrats equally which only makes sense given the level of hypocrisy pouring out of Washington that favours financial institutions and corporations these days.

The problem with your thinking and the thinking of other capitalist-libertarians is that one is not satisfied with having a golden goose and waiting for it to lay it's next golden egg, we have to kill it and get the gold that's next in line, right away, regardless of the fact that this will be the last of it. Sure you get it now and a good meal to boot but what now? That's why society, in the form of government, has to step in to save the goose from the greedy monkey. Bad monkey!!



What would Ché do?
post #50 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlyRobber View Post

The problem with your thinking and the thinking of other capitalist-libertarians is that one is not satisfied with having a golden goose and waiting for it to lay it's next golden egg, we have to kill it and get the gold that's next in line, right away, regardless of the fact that this will be the last of it. Sure you get it now and a good meal to boot but what now? That's why society, in the form of government, has to step in to save the goose from the greedy monkey. Bad monkey!!



What would Ché do?

Ahh, your signature says it all. Time for you to read some definitive history. What would Che do? He would line everyone who had a business, or a phd up against the wall and execute them.
post #51 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

I don't see how you think you know so much about the person to make such a scathing (though oddly hedged) judgement having been given so very little information about them.

You mean my comment about the guy who spends his time writing about Apple retail stores? \ How much do you need to know? The article speaks for itself. But to be frank, my comment was kind of tongue in cheek. People do all sorts of weird stuff for a living and only when you dig deeper does it begin to make sense. (I won't tell you what I do cuz you'll smirk) But when you hire someone to fly a radio controlled helicopter to get shots of a roof under construction you have to be prepared to take some heat. If you fail to see how that exercise seems somewhat comic and lets face it, pointless, when reported on an Apple fan site, I'll have to start worrying about you, too. (just kidding, geeez!). For all I know the guy might primarily be researching from an architectural point of interest. I mean, I hope so. But whether he's a nut case or not, he's probably a very nice person. I really have no reason to think otherwise. Nutty? Sure, Nice? Why not?
The hedging was because I was kind of assuming he was not the helicopter guy himself but if he was and makes his primary living from flying radio controlled helicopters everything changes. Then the 'spying' on Apple retail stores under construction is just a hobby. Still crazy, but different.
Or did you mean my übergeek comment? Übergeek becasue he finds nothing odd about the story, Completely missing the point because he thought the comments (not just mine) was about the helicopter flying.
post #52 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkevwill View Post

Of course, Michael Moore makes No money from any of his movies, and donates it all to charity. You don't think all of his movies since "Roger and Me" have been anything more than an opportunity to exploit the most recent and controversial subjects, with one thing in mind, to make a profit himself!

Do you really believe that? I am sure he is concerned with the financial aspects of his moviemaking - after all the more successful his movies are the more independence he achieves. But if I read you right and you are suggesting he only does what he does to make a fat buck I think you are a sad cynic. And also a little ignorant. There is way too much passion in what MM does to be purely a moneymaking venture.
post #53 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

Do you really believe that? I am sure he is concerned with the financial aspects of his moviemaking - after all the more successful his movies are the more independence he achieves. But if I read you right and you are suggesting he only does what he does to make a fat buck I think you are a sad cynic. And also a little ignorant. There is way too much passion in what MM does to be purely a moneymaking venture.

There ya go. He has you exactly where he wants you.
post #54 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkevwill View Post

There ya go. He has you exactly where he wants you.

You sound like Sarah Palin
post #55 of 66
deleted
post #56 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

You mean my comment about the guy who spends his time writing about Apple retail stores? \ How much do you need to know? The article speaks for itself. But to be frank, my comment was kind of tongue in cheek. People do all sorts of weird stuff for a living and only when you dig deeper does it begin to make sense. (I won't tell you what I do cuz you'll smirk) But when you hire someone to fly a radio controlled helicopter to get shots of a roof under construction you have to be prepared to take some heat.

Don't quit or day job for comedy just yet.

I guess I really don't know for sure what you were writing about. I don't know the agenda of the ifoapplestore person, I don't read their site. Maybe there's money in it, I don't know if there is money in blogging like that or not. It is just a store, but who knows, people get excited about mundane things. Some people get really into watching others use little pieces of paper with red and black symbols on them. Others get really into watching a few people move a small leather ball up and down a strip of plastic grass.

But about the helicopter, the thing is, you have nothing to go on for your opinion other than a video and a few captures for the video and knowing an R/C helicopter was used. You don't know if money changed hands, or how much if money has changed hands, you don't know if it's just a hobbyist dong a favor for a friend, someone news video person using a news helicopter on his time off, or anything else for that matter. You're making assumption after assumption and then questioning their possible sanity as a result.
post #57 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

You sound like Sarah Palin

Re: M.Moore - Just because someone makes a decent living or is wildly successful from something they are passionate about doesn't mean their passion is disingenuous.
post #58 of 66
That's nearly $1 million per day - at one store. How is that even possible? That store has one of the world's greatest locations, but it's not really _that_ huge - and, once the awe over the glass cube subsides (as soon as you get through the door), there's nothing impressive about that particular store (other than the products, arguably) - you could even say it's a little monotone and claustrophobic, being underground. But whatever - $1 million is 500 X $2,000 computers, or 5,000 X $200 iPhones - that scale of volume just sounds outrageous.

I would LOVE to see a breakdown of how many of which products they are selling every single day, in order to reach $1 million/day, in ONE store.
post #59 of 66
crap... after reading this all I could say was "damn it.. now where do I go and buy my underwear??"

LOL it was too easy to say that.... giggle but no I don't wear women's undies..


rofl
post #60 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by resnyc View Post

That's nearly $1 million per day - at one store. How is that even possible? That store has one of the world's greatest locations, but it's not really _that_ huge - and, once the awe over the glass cube subsides (as soon as you get through the door), there's nothing impressive about that particular store (other than the products, arguably) - you could even say it's a little monotone and claustrophobic, being underground. But whatever - $1 million is 500 X $2,000 computers, or 5,000 X $200 iPhones - that scale of volume just sounds outrageous.

I would LOVE to see a breakdown of how many of which products they are selling every single day, in order to reach $1 million/day, in ONE store.

I'd be curios too. They probably make less on regular days and then make several million a day after events and near the holidays. I'd say the make a lot of their money on smaller items. All those things add up. 1M a day is crazy though.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #61 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlyRobber View Post

The problem with your thinking and the thinking of other capitalist-libertarians is that one is not satisfied with having a golden goose and waiting for it to lay it's next golden egg, we have to kill it and get the gold that's next in line, right away, regardless of the fact that this will be the last of it. Sure you get it now and a good meal to boot but what now? That's why society, in the form of government, has to step in to save the goose from the greedy monkey. Bad monkey!!

Not at all true. A business that wishes to survive takes really good care of the golden goose so that it may continue to lay golden eggs. In contrast, our government demands a golden goose bailout after foolish businesses have already killed their golden geese.

Also... ... "capitalist-libertarians"?...

If you function at any level in our society, that is to say, if you exchange "something" for "something" you are essentially involved a form of capitalism. However, as the dictionary defines it, capitalism is: "an economic and political system in which a country's trade and industry are controlled by private owners for profit, rather than by the state."

Then by that definition, we have never really enjoyed a purely capitalistic society, since governmental involvement and interference is evident in nearly everything we do.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #62 of 66
Political-economic talk is off topic. Please stop now.
post #63 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I dunno, but maybe this is just some new kind of generation gap issue... employees are expected to add value to the company they work for, not be coddled and treated like members of some kind of extended family. Employees and management should always be professional when they address each other, of course, but maybe the recognition of why they are there in the first place (to make money for Apple and provide customers with a positive perception of the company) needs to be spelled out.

It is spelled out. But if you want to make good sales it helps to retain good sales staff. This is true for pretty much all staffing.

Besides, I don't want a hard sell to be upsold to some dumbassed service I don't want. Ask once, if I say no, STFU about it. Something a harried Apple sales droid being pressured by their management to make quota is less likely to do and more likely to annoy me.
post #64 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by andyouare View Post

I can personally attest to the firing of higher paid employees at Apple retail stores. I worked in one of the flagship stores and saw many of our experienced genii fired for flimsy reasons or simply quit because there is no path out of the genius bar. While none of you know me or can take what I say at face value I can tell you that my own firing was unjustified. I also was one of the genii with the most seniority and had an otherwise clean work record, good attitude and good range of skills. Apple is instituting speed trap policies that make it easy for them to fire someone at will. The culture of the company is definitely changing and while they still talk a good game about their people being their most valuable asset sadly they are simply not living up to their own credo. I enjoyed my time with company but they really have decided to allow lower quality genii (and now 'Family Room Specialists, AKA recession genii) fill the roles former occupied by skilled staff. I don't know that I would blame the recession as the company has over 25,000,000,000 in cash sitting around. They are doing OK.

I agree. Former Genius here (left on good terms recently...) The concept of the FRS bugs me in that it is simply a method to get Geniuses on the cheap, plain and simple, much like "Trainers" are now budget Creatives. At the store I came from, they are not replacing Genius positions with true Genii - only part-time FRS.

The store I was at, it was despicable to see a concierge basically giving a one-to-one and then have a manager bust into the GR to see if someone could help sell an iPhone. WTF? I know Apple can spare a few bucks to hire someone...seriously.
post #65 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

It is spelled out. But if you want to make good sales it helps to retain good sales staff. This is true for pretty much all staffing.

Besides, I don't want a hard sell to be upsold to some dumbassed service I don't want. Ask once, if I say no, STFU about it. Something a harried Apple sales droid being pressured by their management to make quota is less likely to do and more likely to annoy me.

I agree. Personally I think for them most part people want to be left alone in these places. The staff should be there to look for the cues that "I'm needed now". Or even if they say it once: "just give me a sign and I'll be over if you need my help, besides that you'll be left to view at your own pace."

It's not an easy thing to do, but once they stick to a method that works the atmosphere should be nice.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #66 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

Political-economic talk is off topic. Please stop now.

Sure. Boy, things have sure changed around here.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

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