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Microsoft considers extending Zune services to Apple users - Page 2

post #41 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by souliisoul View Post

come lets not get carried away here, MS were the ones that were sued for their internet browser behavior, which affected numerous companies.

MS still has a great lead on Apple when it comes to killing competition, but I understand your point.

Microsoft was never sued for their internet browser. Ever. In fact, Microsoft has taken great care to make Windows 7 more modal, allowing users to completely uninstall any part of the operating system, including IE.

Hell, Microsoft caved to the European Union when they never really had to. So now, PC vendors can decide which browser to bundle with their computers (and which to take out), as well as presenting a ballot box for users to be able to download and install the latest version of any 3rd party browser.


Now look at Apple. You get.... Safari and iTunes. That's it. Whether you like it or not.... Which I certainly do not
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post #42 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Now look at Apple. You get.... Safari and iTunes. That's it. Whether you like it or not.... Which I certainly do not

What are you going on about?
If you don't like Safari, uninstall it and install something else.
If you don't like iTunes, uninstall it and install something else.
post #43 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

1.) The old Zune didn't get decent reviews.
2,) What are people using iPod HiFis these days for? Aren't they incompatible with today's iPods?

The Apple HiFis have a startlingly good sound. Frankly I wish I had bought one while they were still in production. They have digital audio in, so they aren't ever going to go obsolete -- they are ideal for deployment in different parts of your house, connected to an Airport Express via optical digital.

As for the Zune HD, judging by the Amazon sales charts, no it is not a hit. Very simple reason -- Apple's iPod Touch has double the capacity at 64GB, plus the App store. Microsoft is as usual competing with last year's model.
post #44 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

In what way has Microsoft tried to kill competition illegally? That's a pretty bold statement. And I suppose Apple's draconian control over the iPhone and app store, able to ban applications they consider "duplicating iPhone functionality" isn't stifling innovation or competition?

Apple does more to kill competition than Microsoft ever had. The different being that Apple isn't considered a monopoly, so they're allowed to do whatever they want, no matter how disgusting they may be. (And yes, I say that as an iPhone user).

I have been in the IT industry for over 23 years. And knew MS when they were a small 8 man band. Most Court records are probably not available, despite the internet, for you to see how many times they were taken to Court and lost for cheating, illegal business activities, stealing code, (they attempted to steal QuickTime code), when Apple took them to Court once. A lot of people seems to forget what MS did and still do. I can't remember MS winning any award for technical innovation, happy to be corrected if you can find one. Apple invented the iPhone and iPod Touch, so naturally want to promote their products over others. Google launched their Android plus store, Nokia did the same. They all copied ideas/products. Thats fine. So don't say its draconian, when you have a choice if you don't want to buy Apple products. MS have been copying for over 20 years, that will never stop. Well, sometimes copy-cats can't catch up, no matter what they try.
post #45 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted13 View Post

The Apple HiFis have a startlingly good sound. Frankly I wish I had bought one while they were still in production. They have digital audio in, so they aren't ever going to go obsolete -- they are ideal for deployment in different parts of your house, connected to an Airport Express via optical digital.

As for the Zune HD, judging by the Amazon sales charts, no it is not a hit. Very simple reason -- Apple's iPod Touch has double the capacity at 64GB, plus the App store. Microsoft is as usual competing with last year's model.

So now your comparing a gaming device to a music device- very uncool.
The Apple HiFi is notorious for having the sound of a SOny no a JVC BOOMBOX- get real. And extremely overpriced and yes-now obsolete. What model last year had OLED? What model last year had FMHD?
Why would you ever use Amazon to track electronics in the first place? AS if most people buy electronincs from Amazon?
Did you have a liquid lunch?
post #46 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

In what way has Microsoft tried to kill competition illegally?

Not always illegal but many times they settles with big payouts.

Microsoft - A History of Anticompetitive Behavior and Consumer Harm:
http://www.ecis.eu/documents/Finalve...hoicepaper.pdf
post #47 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

So now your comparing a gaming device to a music device- very uncool.
The Apple HiFi is notorious for having the sound of a SOny BOOMBOX- get real. And extremely overpriced and yes-now obsolete.
Why would you ever use Amazon to track electronics in the first place? AS if most people buy electronincs from Amazon?
Did you have a liquid lunch?

Just like in the thread where you brought up Al Gore out of nowhere, you bring up the Apple HiFi out of nowhere. And similarly, you blame and insult someone else for making the comparison. You know, I really try not to make personal attacks, but dude, is it any wonder why so many people on this forum find you annoying?
post #48 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beauty of Bath View Post

Not always illegal but many times they settles with big payouts.

Microsoft - A History of Anticompetitive Behavior and Consumer Harm:
http://www.ecis.eu/documents/Finalve...hoicepaper.pdf

Apple does the same thing. Settlements like those are all part of doing business. You read about it on this site all the time, about some new lawsuit against Apple for violating a patent and Apple settling out of court. In fact, I think there was one posted just today about that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post

What are you going on about?
If you don't like Safari, uninstall it and install something else.
If you don't like iTunes, uninstall it and install something else.

Believe me, I do. But I was referring to the Mac, specifically. Safari and iTunes/QuickTime are hooked into the operating system with no apparent way of removing them. Much like IE on Windows, I have to learn to simply remove all shortcuts to Safari.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fonejacker View Post

So don't say its draconian, when you have a choice if you don't want to buy Apple products. MS have been copying for over 20 years, that will never stop. Well, sometimes copy-cats can't catch up, no matter what they try.

You've mistaken my intents. You're correct in stating that I don't know all of Microsoft's past, but you can't have me believe that Apple doesn't have a few skeletons in its closet that they wouldn't want to be reminded of, either.

So what if Microsoft has a shady past? What company doesn't? I look at where these companies stand today and what products they have to offer. Windows 7? Awesome operating system. The iPhone? Fantastic device. Just because I hate iTunes and the restrictions of the app store doesn't mean I don't love the product they all tie into. I love my iPhone, which is why I'm especially critical of it. I want it to be a more open, transparent device, and competition from those other services are going to drive it in that direction. If, at some point, I feel there's a better alternative, like an open android market, I'll certainly move on then. I'll go with the best!
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post #49 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Not to mention that the software, if any, would be an optional download
(...)
Sad, really, that people have such loyalties to business. Praise the product, not the company.

Exactly. I don't like MS any more than the next person here. I feel they have poor business practices. However, when they do make good products (and yes, it DOES happen), then I praise those products. I also don't like Apple for their business practices (being very anti-competitive and closed) but when they have a good product, I'll praise it too. I like the hardware in the iPod Touch and think the device is wonderful. I however hate the OS and its limitations it puts on the hardware.

But yeah, if MS were to release the App, I'm sure people would do exactly as you said, install and delete without trying JUST to give MS a One Star... which has the effect of nothing against the company they hate so much.

BTW, after reading your other posts on the matter, I'm very glad someone have views like me around here.
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post #50 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Microsoft was never sued for their internet browser. Ever. In fact, Microsoft has taken great care to make Windows 7 more modal, allowing users to completely uninstall any part of the operating system, including IE.

Hell, Microsoft caved to the European Union when they never really had to. So now, PC vendors can decide which browser to bundle with their computers (and which to take out), as well as presenting a ballot box for users to be able to download and install the latest version of any 3rd party browser.


Now look at Apple. You get.... Safari and iTunes. That's it. Whether you like it or not.... Which I certainly do not

Perhaps you should research a little company called Spyglass that Microsoft "partnered" with.

And perhaps you should realize the reason why Microsoft stands to benefit from browser bundling, namely, defaulting the search to Bing and their default page being MSN.com, both with benefit them just like Google benefits from it being the default search engine and home page in Mozilla's FireFox.
post #51 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post

Just like in the thread where you brought up Al Gore out of nowhere, you bring up the Apple HiFi out of nowhere. And similarly, you blame and insult someone else for making the comparison. You know, I really try not to make personal attacks, but dude, is it any wonder why so many people on this forum find you annoying?

Dude - my response was to the poster prior to that comment who stated that last years Zunes were being used a door stops. READ dude and post something, anything, that's thread related rather than try to take me on.
Al Gore sits on the Board of Directors at Apple Inc. - haven't you READ that anywhere?
post #52 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fonejacker View Post

OK, Microshaft, how much do you want me to pay you, NOT to release any Zune services, software etc

We don't any bug ridden, user unfriendly software. I know its difficult to change a habit of lifetime, but people are fed up with your sub standard software. Thank You.

Come listed to a blinkered fanboy in full BS mode!

Try using the Zune software. It's very, very nice, and far better than the buggy bloatware that is iTunes.
post #53 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Right.... except Gates isn't in charge of Microsoft anymore, and Steve Jobs has been out of commission for the better half of a year at Apple.

So now you are an economic analyst who's able to look at data figures of total (presumably worldwide) sales of a device that is only available in *one* country, and through extensive calculations are able to conclude that a product highly rated, highly reviewed, and sells out in almost every retail market chain out there is, indeed, a "flop."

You know, if I'm not mistaken, I believe the first few iPods were considered a "flop" as well. Nothing really moved until the iPod nano, about six or seven generations and models in.

Facts are facts, and poor sales rankings are a sure indicator that a product is a flop. Short-supplying a product is deceptive, and something MS must have learned from those iBiquity scammers.
post #54 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by ulfoaf View Post

One word: History.
Windows 3 was pretty good, but those were simpler times.
Windows 9X and XP Home should not have been unleashed on the world without security measures. I believe they thought it too complex an issue for an average user, and chose to ignore the issue. Very arrogant.

The Windows 95 interface was nice, but they pretty much copied what Silicon Graphics was already doing.

I'll believe they can write good software when I see it. Windows 7 is being hyped now. Maybe they have been pushed by Apple. Nothing wrong with competition, Microsoft just isn't used to it!

I used Windows 3.0 and 3.1, and while it was good, it sucked compared to a Mac.
Win9x should have never been released, but you know, they had to come up with something while NT waited for more powerful hardware to come up (and it wasn't till 3 versions later, win2k, with 3.1 being the first, 4 being the second, that it was worth using).
post #55 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Dude - my response was to the poster prior to that comment who stated that last years Zunes were being used a door stops.

And this has nothing to do with the Apple HiFi.....which no one ever mentioned until YOU brought it up.

Quote:
Al Gore sits on the Board of Directors at Apple Inc. - haven't you READ that anywhere?

Yes, and this has nothing to do with the other thread either and no one ever mentioned his name until YOU did.
post #56 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post

And this has nothing to do with the Apple HiFi.....which no one ever mentioned until YOU brought it up.

If you can't see the connection between one obsolete product vs the other than it's not worth explaining to you. Good bye.

P.S.- I refuse to discuss the other thread's posts you're trying to egg me on for the sake of AI readers. Thank you.
post #57 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Believe me, I do. But I was referring to the Mac, specifically. Safari and iTunes/QuickTime are hooked into the operating system with no apparent way of removing them.

No, Safari and iTunes are not hooked into the operating system. It's called dragging them to the trash. QuickTime, which you didn't mention before, is another matter. iTunes and QT are not the same thing.

Quote:
Much like IE on Windows, I have to learn to simply remove all shortcuts to Safari.

On a Mac, not much to learn, just drag Safari off the Dock and *poof*, it's gone.
post #58 of 144
It'll be a cold day in hell....
A reputation is not built upon the restful domain of one's comfort zone; it is made out of stalwart exposition of your core beliefs, for all challenges to disprove them as irrelevant hubris.- Berp...
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A reputation is not built upon the restful domain of one's comfort zone; it is made out of stalwart exposition of your core beliefs, for all challenges to disprove them as irrelevant hubris.- Berp...
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post #59 of 144
What hasn't Microsoft thought of? Gosh, I'm impressed.
post #60 of 144
Well I suppose more choice is good, even if relatively few people will avail themselves of some of them.
post #61 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by sprockkets View Post

Perhaps you should research a little company called Spyglass that Microsoft "partnered" with.

And perhaps you should realize the reason why Microsoft stands to benefit from browser bundling, namely, defaulting the search to Bing and their default page being MSN.com, both with benefit them just like Google benefits from it being the default search engine and home page in Mozilla's FireFox.

Actually, Mozilla benefits more from Google by making them the default browser. Every time you make a search in that box, Mozilla gets paid. That's one possible reason why Google came out with their own browser, Chrome, to take back some of those searches while pushing for more advanced web standards (again, that benefit Google's future products).

Mozilla would use Bing.com as their default search if they thought their marketshare as a browser would grow, and they would get more money from Bing than from Google.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PocketRadio View Post

Facts are facts, and poor sales rankings are a sure indicator that a product is a flop. Short-supplying a product is deceptive, and something MS must have learned from those iBiquity scammers.

So, that's it? The product's been out for a month, available in only one country in the entire world, and someone with *NO* sales figures, *NO* marketing strategy, and *NO* indicators for the upcoming Christmas season has determined "Oh, its over. Its a flop. Guess we should give up now."

I'm going to assume you're ignorant about the business world, because calling you stupid would be insulting. Depending on what figures you're looking at, the Mac has 2-3% worldwide marketshare. Would you consider the Mac a flop as well? After all, it has only 2-3% of the total PC market. Its' *GOT* to be a flop, right?

...right?
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post #62 of 144
geez. it is funny how those that do not know history love to show their ignorance. try watching a program called "triumph of the nerds", you just might learn something as to who is an innovator and a copycat crapware vendor.
post #63 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

So, that's it? The product's been out for a month, available in only one country in the entire world, and someone with *NO* sales figures, *NO* marketing strategy, and *NO* indicators for the upcoming Christmas season has determined "Oh, its over. Its a flop. Guess we should give up now."

I'm going to assume you're ignorant about the business world, because calling you stupid would be insulting. Depending on what figures you're looking at, the Mac has 2-3% worldwide marketshare. Would you consider the Mac a flop as well? After all, it has only 2-3% of the total PC market. Its' *GOT* to be a flop, right?

...right?

Remember those lines around the block, when the iPhone first came out - that's called market BUZZ, and I'm not talking about HD Radio's IBUZZ!
post #64 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

In what way has Microsoft tried to kill competition illegally? That's a pretty bold statement.

Bold, or not, they have both tried and succeeded in killing anything resembling competition for years.

But if you were never an exhibitor at the MacWorld Boston or San Francisco, you may not have experienced it first hand.
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post #65 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post

On a Mac, not much to learn, just drag Safari off the Dock and *poof*, it's gone.

That's removing Safari from the OS?
post #66 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu View Post

Come listed to a blinkered fanboy in full BS mode!

Try using the Zune software. It's very, very nice, and far better than the buggy bloatware that is iTunes.

When you look up the word Bulls**t, it says "see Microsoft". PC users are full of BS. Can't handle the truth. Carry on using your bloated Windows (a copy of OS X), 8 billion viruses (uniquely Windows only), malware (windows only), crashes, file incompatibility, software incompatibility, even certain MS products aren't backward or forward compatible. The huge extra cost in staff wages to run networks, solve IT problems etc. iTunes is still nearly 90% of what it was when it was originally released. So not sure where you get bloatware from. It just works, unlike 90% of MS software. If Windows and Ms Office aren't bloatware, I don't know what is.

An ex PC User.
post #67 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by PocketRadio View Post

Remember those lines around the block, when the iPhone first came out - that's called market BUZZ, and I'm not talking about HD Radio's IBUZZ!

I recall a similar incident in Jonestown, South America - something about people waiting in line for a drink of -what was it now?
Oh whatever.
post #68 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

That's removing Safari from the OS?

No it's not.

It looks like someone needs to take their own advice and READ what statement I was actually responding to.
post #69 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by PocketRadio View Post

Remember those lines around the block, when the iPhone first came out - that's called market BUZZ, and I'm not talking about HD Radio's IBUZZ!

Hey, I'm not saying that the Zune HD is a hit or a success. I wouldn't even call the Xbox 360 a success, given the millions of dollars lost in RMA money due to red rings of death. Other than the desktop, Microsoft doesn't exactly equate to astounding success in the other fields it tries go enter.

However, the fact that they ARE doing all these other things is important in and of itself. Live cloud services and gaming and Zune media - they're doing anything they can do to stay relevant. The reason IBM became the almost-unknown services company that they are today is because they were once Top Dog and never felt they needed to change. Microsoft knows that a day will come when the operating system will become less relevant than it is today. Perhaps not for many decades, but it will happen. And when it does, they'll be more flexible to change than other companies who aren't getting involved now.

That's why I love the idea of Zune on my iPhone. Apple makes the hardware, Microsoft provides the service. Both companies are doing *exactly* what they're best at, and I as a consumer get all the benefits.
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post #70 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post

Exactly. I don't like MS any more than the next person here. I feel they have poor business practices. However, when they do make good products (and yes, it DOES happen), then I praise those products. I also don't like Apple for their business practices (being very anti-competitive and closed) but when they have a good product, I'll praise it too. I like the hardware in the iPod Touch and think the device is wonderful. I however hate the OS and its limitations it puts on the hardware.

But yeah, if MS were to release the App, I'm sure people would do exactly as you said, install and delete without trying JUST to give MS a One Star... which has the effect of nothing against the company they hate so much.

BTW, after reading your other posts on the matter, I'm very glad someone have views like me around here.

Lol, it just seems so obvious to me. Why would anyone be loyal to any corporate entity.
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post #71 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fonejacker View Post

When you look up the word Bulls**t, it says "see Microsoft". PC users are full of BS. Can't handle the truth. Carry on using your bloated Windows (a copy of OS X), 8 billion viruses (uniquely Windows only), malware (windows only), crashes, file incompatibility, software incompatibility, even certain MS products aren't backward or forward compatible. The huge extra cost in staff wages to run networks, solve IT problems etc. iTunes is still nearly 90% of what it was when it was originally released. So not sure where you get bloatware from. It just works, unlike 90% of MS software. If Windows and Ms Office aren't bloatware, I don't know what is.

An ex PC User.

Dude, I use Macs. I love them, frankly. And guess what? You *still* have malware, crashes, file incompaitibility, software incompatibility, even certain *APPLE* products are backward or forward compatible (see iMovie). Lol, Macs are simply computers, first and foremost. The operating system you're on won't mean much if you accidentally fall for a phishing scam in your email.

Windows 7 is far ahead of its Vista cousin by leaps and bounds, and that claim is backed by nearly every person who's used it. I often hear long-time Apple users praise how well Windows 7 functions, and how refreshing it is to see Microsoft take a different approach with its OS, opting for performance and stability over new features. True, there are things the Mac does better than Windows, but at this point, its almost a matter of personal taste. Do you prefer this OS, or this one?

Apple has done plenty of things some could consider "copying" from Microsoft - it isn't just a one-way street. Don't believe me? Ask anyone who had used the Zune 3.0 software for a while and have them take a look at iTunes 9.0. They'll tell you how very "Zune-like" the new iTunes has become
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post #72 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Lol, it just seems so obvious to me. Why would anyone be loyal to any corporate entity.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=fanboy
post #73 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by ulfoaf View Post

One word: History.
Windows 3 was pretty good, but those were simpler times.
Windows 9X and XP Home should not have been unleashed on the world without security measures. I believe they thought it too complex an issue for an average user, and chose to ignore the issue. Very arrogant.

The Windows 95 interface was nice, but they pretty much copied what Silicon Graphics was already doing.

I'll believe they can write good software when I see it. Windows 7 is being hyped now. Maybe they have been pushed by Apple. Nothing wrong with competition, Microsoft just isn't used to it!

Windows 3 wasn't a patch on Mac OS 7 I'm afraid (I used both extensively). Windows 95 was a catchup (and in some ways leap-frog) of Mac OS 8/9. Mac OS X raised the bar even further beyond what Microsoft can achieve.

Fire up an old Mac OS 9 system,, and see how much further the desktop paradigm has been pushed by Microsoft. Not much really. A Windows user would be far more comfortable with Mac OS 9 than they would be with Windows 3.

In a certain way (squint your eyes), you could even say that the iPhone/iPod Touch interface is simply a logical extension of Mac OS Classic (especially when you figure in the At Ease icon menu system).
post #74 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Okay, how about another history lesson. Remember IBM? They were the top dogs in the industry long before Microsoft had its reign. People laugh and point at Windows 95 as Microsoft's attempt to "catch up" to the rest of the world. Apple was laughing hysterically at Microsoft at the time, making fun of little facts like "Oh, now they can support long-format names, like we have been doing for 10 years."

No one had taken Microsoft seriously until Windows 95, and do you know why? Obviously someone liked it, because it fulfilled what the technology industry needed at the time in the consumer market, far superior to anything Apple or anything else had at the time.

Edit: I don't like defending any company based on its past or present history. Vista was atrocious, and Windows 7 is amazing. Just like Tiger was a mess and Leopard is terrific. If a company makes a good product, who cares about its past? Hell, Apple's OS 9 was utter crap. Are you telling me I should judge the company today based on something they made 10 years ago??

How about another history lesson? Microsoft lied, cheated and stole their way to a monopoly position, with not a superior product but a very mediocre one. People didn't buy it because they liked it so much but because they didn't have a choice. Nothing to be particularly proud of... Btw IBM was one of the companies screwed by Microsoft.
post #75 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Hey, I'm not saying that the Zune HD is a hit or a success. I wouldn't even call the Xbox 360 a success, given the millions of dollars lost in RMA money due to red rings of death. Other than the desktop, Microsoft doesn't exactly equate to astounding success in the other fields it tries go enter.

Try Billions!

Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

However, the fact that they ARE doing all these other things is important in and of itself. Live cloud services and gaming and Zune media - they're doing anything they can do to stay relevant. The reason IBM became the almost-unknown services company that they are today is because they were once Top Dog and never felt they needed to change. Microsoft knows that a day will come when the operating system will become less relevant than it is today. Perhaps not for many decades, but it will happen. And when it does, they'll be more flexible to change than other companies who aren't getting involved now.

Unknown? Maybe to you... IBM is a huge healthy company that knew how to continue to grow by adapting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

That's why I love the idea of Zune on my iPhone. Apple makes the hardware, Microsoft provides the service. Both companies are doing *exactly* what they're best at, and I as a consumer get all the benefits.

Clearly Microsoft is "best" with software given everything else they've touched has failed miserably. Apple is not a hardware company, it's a company that knows how to integrate software and hardware to make a compelling device. And the consumer gets all the benefits.
post #76 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fonejacker View Post

OK, Microshaft, how much do you want me to pay you, NOT to release any Zune services, software etc

We don't any bug ridden, user unfriendly software. I know its difficult to change a habit of lifetime, but people are fed up with your sub standard software. Thank You.

Better avoid getting an iPhone or the latest version of OS X. They've already been infected with Exchange!
post #77 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by timgriff84 View Post

Better avoid getting an iPhone or the latest version of OS X. They've already been infected with Exchange!

I have an iPhone with the latest software and Snow Leopard. I have NOT been infected, and neither has my company. So where is the problem? Could it be Exchange??? Isn't that piece of software from Microshaft??? The same company that thinks OS crashes is a feature, and an open barn door, it the height of security???? Maybe people and companies should stop using MS products, thats if they want a productive workforce, efficient, working network, without hidden IT costs, with an army of techies at the end of the line, in India. If not continue to buy mediocre overpriced software from MS.
post #78 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnyc View Post

Unknown? Maybe to you... IBM is a huge healthy company that knew how to continue to grow by adapting.

They're still only a shadow of the company they once were. Outside of infrastructure, IBM isn't a name that means anything to most people.

By contrast, there are kids today that associate the name "Microsoft" with things like Halo, Xbox and gaming. That type of mindshare is an invaluable asset if Microsoft wants to remain relevant going forward.

Quote:
Clearly Microsoft is "best" with software given everything else they've touched has failed miserably. Apple is not a hardware company, it's a company that knows how to integrate software and hardware to make a compelling device. And the consumer gets all the benefits.

No... Apple is a hardware company. Period. The reason they develop compelling software is to use it to drive hardware sales. Notice how Final Cut Studio has now been significantly reduced in price, undercutting Adobe and Avid's Pro Tools suites. Look how a full license for their latest operating system was sold for almost half what Microsoft's upgrade license cost during its best sale. *NO* software company would be so foolish to undercut themselves so much if they were not using the hardware to subsidize the costs.

Frankly speaking, Apple is just another PC company who sells computers capable of running Windows, or any other, operating system of choice. Mind you, they make some incredible packages to go with it, but the guts are practically nothing more than an ordinary PC inside a shiny enclosure.
Video editor, tech enthusiast, developer.

http://www.yuusharo.com
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Video editor, tech enthusiast, developer.

http://www.yuusharo.com
http://www.studioyuu.com
Reply
post #79 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

It just works is a joke. The last verison of itunes had several problems for people that had large libraries. Everytime Apple puts out a patch you have to pray to god you don't need a reinstall of the entire OS because OSX is not smart enough to backout updates. You download a bad patch from Apple your are stuck doing an Archive and Install. Its a joke.

What are you an ex pc user from 1970? I haven't had a virus in about 7 years. OSX can't even remotely network as well as Vista. Maybe your just not smart enough to know how to use a PC.

I like to have options like if I want to use a certain driver my entire computer is controlled by what Steve Jobs wants me to run. If I want to back something out I can without doing an entire reinstall of my OS. Apple puts in a patch and its bad which many times they are your pretty much screwed until they get around to figuring it out.

reinstall the entire os? do you have proof of the many users that had to do that?
post #80 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post

Frankly speaking, Apple is just another PC company who sells computers capable of running Windows, or any other, operating system of choice. Mind you, they make some incredible packages to go with it, but the guts are practically nothing more than an ordinary PC inside a shiny enclosure.

And what is wrong with that?

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

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Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

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