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Inside the Magic Mouse - Page 2

post #41 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post

Yeah, I really scoured Apple's website for some more in-depth info on the mouse. I'm sure support documentation will be added eventually. But at this point, I'm perplexed that they would eliminate the optional click abilities of the old mouse. I really need to be able to activate Spaces from the mouse.\

These complaints are like when people complained when the arc lamp was invented because they couldn't understand where the gas fuel went, nor could they service it like their old street lamps.

MIddle-click complainers, listen up. I'm not a graphic designer, I don't work on a computer for a living in the slightest sense. But obviously if there are now gestures, you will be able to completely rearrange (if you want to) your entire work style. Who needs a middle click when you could just pinch, or swipe, or whatever you want. There are third-party programs that allow you to any number of interesting, simple to contortionist-like gestures.

If you don't want to rearrange your work style to include these new multi-touch gestures...... then don't buy the multi-touch mouse.

Problem solved.
post #42 of 129
I know it's probably a bridge too far for most users, but I would KILL to have a desktop version of my aluminum MacBook's trackpad. Not a combined keyboard+trackpad, but a standalone trackpad with rubber feet to keep it in place. Three- and four-fingered gestures, pinch, zoom . . . all would be possible.
post #43 of 129
It is rather short-sighted of the reviewer (no pun intended) to describe zooming as a "fluff novelty" feature on the desktop. I beg to differ. Why is it any less necessary or useful on the desktop than it is on the iPhone? For someone who has always needed glasses and doesn't see well, the zoom feature on my Mac is one I use all the time. Print is often too small and I zoom in and out all the time. This is better than lowering the overall resolution of the display which would impact images and not just text...
post #44 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by emoeric87 View Post

These complaints are like when people complained when the arc lamp was invented because they couldn't understand where the gas fuel went, nor could they service it like their old street lamps.

MIddle-click complainers, listen up. I'm not a graphic designer, I don't work on a computer for a living in the slightest sense. But obviously if there are now gestures, you will be able to completely rearrange (if you want to) your entire work style. Who needs a middle click when you could just pinch, or swipe, or whatever you want. There are third-party programs that allow you to any number of interesting, simple to contortionist-like gestures.

If you don't want to rearrange your work style to include these new multi-touch gestures...... then don't buy the multi-touch mouse.

Problem solved.

And you can use your Madgec Mouse to just surf the web and read email then.
post #45 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by frugality View Post

hahaha.....there isn't enough real estate to swipe 4 fingers on this mouse, unless you're a 4-year-old. What do you expect?!?

I'd expect 2 fingers up and down to be programmable for things like Exposé and Dashboard. (Maybe hope for this in a future software update?)

Exposé is one of Apple's greatest innovations, which I use constantly, and I'd hate to give up the main way that I use it: keyboard free without even moving the mouse! Button or gesture--either way, I DO want Exposé on my mouse.

Too bad, because I really like the new shape and other features.
post #46 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by ex-Windows-Fanboy View Post

I know it's probably a bridge too far for most users, but I would KILL to have a desktop version of my aluminum MacBook's trackpad. Not a combined keyboard+trackpad, but a standalone trackpad with rubber feet to keep it in place. Three- and four-fingered gestures, pinch, zoom . . . all would be possible.

You don't have to kill anyone. It already exist and this is probably the 100th time the link was posted today.
post #47 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by ex-Windows-Fanboy View Post

I know it's probably a bridge too far for most users, but I would KILL to have a desktop version of my aluminum MacBook's trackpad. Not a combined keyboard+trackpad, but a standalone trackpad with rubber feet to keep it in place. Three- and four-fingered gestures, pinch, zoom . . . all would be possible.

That's what I was saying. Kill the mouse! Old technology- like an answering machine or something else no longer needed.
post #48 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTel View Post

Sounds interesting but I think I'll test drive one before I buy. I didn't care for the mighty mouse so it might be the same deal here.

Anyone love the mighty mouse?

When it worked.

Quote:
Originally Posted by krankerz View Post

No middle click is a big deal for me too.

As a 3D artist, middle click is essential and excluding this from the mouse's functionality is a huge problem. Apple needs to address this soon.

For 3d i always used one of these. Not that I was an artist or anything.

http://www.3dconnexion.com/3dmouse/spacenavigator.php

Seems like it lost a couple buttons though.

I also had one of these for my desktop:

http://www.3dconnexion.com/3dmouse/spacepilot.php
post #49 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post

Yeah, I really scoured Apple's website for some more in-depth info on the mouse. I'm sure support documentation will be added eventually. But at this point, I'm perplexed that they would eliminate the optional click abilities of the old mouse. I really need to be able to activate Spaces from the mouse.\

use hot corners and you can do that
post #50 of 129
My biggest problem with the Mighty Mouse (and presumably this mouse) is that in order to right click, you have to lift your left finger off the left side of the mouse, otherwise it registers as a left click. In the Mighty Mouse (and presumably the Magic Mouse) there is only one physical button, and it uses the touch-sensitive surface to detect whether there is a finger is on the left side of the mouse (left click), both sides (also left click), or right side only (right click). Having to lift the left finger to right click is awkward and I found it to be uncomfortable after a while. If you watch the new Magic Mouse video on the Apple site, it clearly shows the guy lifting his left finger off the mouse before right clicking.

Also, I think the lack of a middle click is a dealbreaker. You don't need to be a gamer or graphic designer or anything fancy to appreciate a middle click -- I middle click all the time while browsing the web to open links in a new tab. Without a middle click, that means I have to use the keyboard to command-click on links, which is also awkward and unnecessary.
post #51 of 129
Try installing boot camp without a wired keyboard and mouse. When MS is installing it does not find a wireless keyboard or mouse. Need to have that available for the installation so.

Anxious to try the mouse as my mighty mouse was on its last legs and the track ball was constantly sticky despite a no food policy near the iMac and a mouse pad...Great excuse now...glad I waited.

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post #52 of 129
Agree 100%!

Lack of left/right side buttons for Exposé is a complete dealbreaker for me. Its the one truly redeeming feature of the old Mighty Mouse (and is the reason I continue to use them).

Quote:
Originally Posted by nagromme View Post

I'd expect 2 fingers up and down to be programmable for things like Exposé and Dashboard. (Maybe hope for this in a future software update?)

Exposé is one of Apple's greatest innovations, which I use constantly, and I'd hate to give up the main way that I use it: keyboard free without even moving the mouse! Button or gesture--either way, I DO want Exposé on my mouse.

Too bad, because I really like the new shape and other features.

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post #53 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by nagromme View Post

Exposé is one of Apple's greatest innovations, which I use constantly, and I'd hate to give up the main way that I use it: keyboard free without even moving the mouse! Button or gesture--either way, I DO want Exposé on my mouse.

Expose is amazing, and I use it just as much, if not more, than the next guy, but to say it is Apple's innovation is wildly untrue. It has been in the Linux world for a much longer time than it has been in Apple's, although I do understand that people would not know that, seeing as how Linux has barely 1% of the computer market.
post #54 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B View Post

Agree 100%!

Lack of left/right side buttons for Exposé is a complete dealbreaker for me. Its the one truly redeeming feature of the old Mighty Mouse (and is the reason I continue to use them).

Come on guys, just set it up with a hot corner for Expose'. I've never seen so many hard- to-pleasers!!!!! If I were Steve, I'd be perplexed! I'm left handed and adapted to the right click after all. Give it a chance! MY!
post #55 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwfrederick View Post

am i the only one who thinks this mouse is amazing? ergonomic low profile.. aesthetically perfect.. simple intuitive gestures.. as is typical for mac, it doesnt try to do everything (no superfluous features), but what it does it does perfectly. this mouse epitomizes why i love apple products.

as usual there are whiners afraid of change, who lack vision, and who like to complain, but this is always the case, even with apple's best products. i think apple hit a home run with this one, and same goes for the rest of the products released today IMHO.

I ordered one, what the heck....

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post #56 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

Expose is amazing, and I use it just as much, if not more, than the next guy, but to say it is Apple's innovation is wildly untrue. It has been in the Linux world for a much longer time than it has been in Apple's, although I do understand that people would not know that, seeing as how Linux has barely 1% of the computer market.

You need to explain how Linux had expose before OSX, because OSX had desktop compositing in 2000, long before Linux did in 2006, or TheLookingGlass project before it, and of course, loser Vista.
post #57 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel001 View Post

The thing that worries me most about the new mouse (without having used it yet) is that there appear to be no middle clickwhich some people would regard as almost essential.

Unless I'm missing something, it would also be difficult to add this functionality later as it lacks physical markings to indicate where the middle button would be (i.e. you could easily right click instead of middle click by mistake).

But as Daniel points out in the article, Apple is obviously not cornering the market on mice when they are only offering essentially one high end offering. People who want unusual things like extra buttons and expose stuff can just buy another mouse.

The only programs I've ever run across that "need" the third button are arcane technical things and usually ports from some Linux based original like Blender or something. There's a second crowd that likes to have four or five button mouse so they can assign things to the other buttons like expose, but that's hardly the norm.

Where I work, whenever we handed out a new computer, 9 times out of 10 we had to *disable* the expose buttons on the side of the Mighty Mouse because it drove people crazy going into expose every time they picked up the mouse. Many users who have always used a Mac never even activate the right click function of the Mighty Mouse either as it ships with one button clicking by default and that's the way the majority of our users want it.
post #58 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

You don't have to kill anyone. It already exist and this is probably the 100th time the link was posted today.

I wish it was as good as Apple's...
post #59 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by samanjj View Post

use hot corners and you can do that

Sure; that's always an option. I prefer a hot-key to a corner for my alternate method, because I inadvertently mouse the corner when I don't intend to; and that gets irritating.
post #60 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

Come on guys, just set it up with a hot corner for Expose'. I've never seen so many hard- to-pleasers!!!!! If I were Steve, I'd be perplexed! I'm left handed and adapted to the right click after all. Give it a chance! MY!

Dude, I missed that part in your post; did you actually say that you use your mouse, set up as a right handed user.

"I'm left handed and adapted to the right click"
post #61 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol View Post

It's obviously not a mouse for you if you own an 8-button mouse. Sorry but this mouse isn't supposed to replace mouses that act like keyboards.

This mouse is for people that don't expect to use more than two buttons and still want an easy way to scroll content in a window. It also won't have buttons and scrollwheels that will gum up over time or cracks and crevices that will harbor bacteria. Don't get me wrong, I love those kinds of mouses too...I also own an 8-button Logitech mouse. They're comfortable and utilitarian...but, man, the printed logo and the printed back and forward arrows on the thumb buttons are faded, the scrollwheel is gummed beyond repair and the edges of the buttons are filthy.

i do like my Logitech mouse, even if it has five extra buttons i've never used once in 3 years. seriously, i doubt if more than 10% of consumers use any more than two buttons and one scroll wheel. ok, maybe it's 15%.
post #62 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel001 View Post

The thing that worries me most about the new mouse (without having used it yet) is that there appear to be no middle clickwhich some people would regard as almost essential.

Unless I'm missing something, it would also be difficult to add this functionality later as it lacks physical markings to indicate where the middle button would be (i.e. you could easily right click instead of middle click by mistake).

yeah. i'd miss that too, even though possibly exclusively for opening a link in a new tab in safari.
i wonder if a 'three fingered click' could be assigned to it...
post #63 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTel View Post

Sounds interesting but I think I'll test drive one before I buy. I didn't care for the mighty mouse so it might be the same deal here.

Anyone love the mighty mouse?

I do...I like the Mighty Mouse a lot! The wireless one never really worked right with my Macbook, but the wired full keyboard/Mighty Mouse combo has worked great for me! It now works just as good on my brand new shiny Macbook Pro! I have the full slim keyboard with Mighty Mouse combo (both USB) for my home office setup and the Bluetooth Mac keyboard and Microsoft Mouse for Mac in my work office. If I go to the Magic Mouse, I'd probably just transport that between offices and sell the wired Mighty Mouse. Center click is pretty big for me, however. That's a nice feature.
post #64 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B View Post

Agree 100%!

Lack of left/right side buttons for Exposé is a complete dealbreaker for me. Its the one truly redeeming feature of the old Mighty Mouse (and is the reason I continue to use them).

funny how wildly people's preferences differ. those buttons are always the first thing i turn off after an install. your 'redeeming feature' is my 'touch of evil'.

i work with somebody who feels the way you do, and i can't ever quickly jump in on his computer because his use of the squeeze buttons and hot corner drive me up the wall! of course he gets just as irritated on my machine and thinks i'm a heretic for having both turned off on my machine (I prefer to look at it as 'old school'.)

i wonder if your workflow could be re-established through the surface of the mouse. if it can sense where your fingers are, would it technically be possible to assign 'button 4' to a 'left-right squeeze'?
post #65 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyourownthing View Post


this is a deal breaker for me

"That's a deal breaker ladies".

I don't know. I really do like my mighty mouse. Maybe I wash my hands more than some but I definitely don't want anything less useful than the current mouse. The "nipple" (rollerball) was temperamental when it got dirty but it's still a great mouse compared to the crap Apple mice of the past.

Let's see what happens when the Magic Mouse comes out and people start using it. B-Tooth is kinda laggy, the shape doesn't really look ergonomic at first glance, gestures are cool, it's a breeze to keep clean without the "nipple" and at first I thought; third button? who needs one/ and then I remembered I use it all the time in Color. Maybe the problems won't be problems at all and the perks will overshadow any drawbacks, we'll have to see.

But if the lack of a 3rd button and BT tracking are the "deal breakers" then it's pretty much just the pro's who lose out and most buy 3rd party mice anyway. Otherwise it looks like a great office mouse for sure. It is packaged with a consumer computer after all.


Hmmmm... Pro's get tablets?
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post #66 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTel View Post

Sounds interesting but I think I'll test drive one before I buy. I didn't care for the mighty mouse so it might be the same deal here.

Anyone love the mighty mouse?

i do actually. i prefer the wired one - i find the bluetooth version just a touch to heavy, but maybe that's because i'm so used to my wired one.

i love the scroll ball - while it works. it has amazed and frustrated me that apple did not address the obvious problem with the inaccessible design of that nasty little dirt trap. i for one would have welcomed the return of the 'open-up-the-mouse-clean-the-rubber-ball' ritual of the adb era. it took a minute and always did the job. bringing a mighty mouse back to life from paralysis is more 'dark arts' than procedure - sometimes it takes a few tries and you're never sure how long it lasts.

i'd like to try this new mouse - i really can't judge a mouse from reading about it...

i do wish they had a wired option - i'm not a fan of buying batteries. when i plug a mouse in, i don't have to worry about keeping fresh batteries around. and they never seem to die when it's convenient.

also - my desktop didn't come with the bluetooth/airport kit and i seem to remember that apple doesn't offer it as an 'add-on-later'.
post #67 of 129
Can the Magic Mouse tell when the user has it oriented off by 180 degrees?
post #68 of 129
I did a review and dissection of the Mighty Mouse (it was defective anyway) when it was first released.

I took very detailed photographs and explained why the Mighty Mouse would fail.

It failed for those same exact reasons people echo today.

1: The scroll wheels will get clogged and impossible to clean without breaking the mouse open surgically.

2: The side clicks would be a pain to use, activating when you grab or move the mouse.

3: No real right click, having to lift the left finger first before using the right.

4: No real 360 degree scrolling, just left/right and up/down (which my left/right failed right off)


Now I must admit, reading the reviews of the latest Magic Mouse (very hippie) it seems Apple has really made a radical improvement for the better.

Apple could have avoided the whole abortion of the Mighty Mouse if it had people review the prospective mice (mouses?) before mass production. A mouse is a mouse, it comes with the machine, so it's not like a super trade secret, like China is going to copy it in five minutes and flood the market with clones sort of problem.

Now I see a problem with the average joe computer user freaking out that there is no cable to plug-in for the new keyboard or magic mouse, which is a security concern for some that their bluetooth keystrokes would be monitored by any bug planted in the room or even outside in the parking lot.

Then the problem with interference, and the fact is if your battery goes dead, so does your computer. If your having problems with your computer, anything wireless just makes it all that much harder to diagnoses because now you don't know if it's the mouse, the keyboard or the computer or interference or a dead battery and which ones. The reason being you can't easily verify with a wireless device if it's connected to the computer like a wired device is.


Battery terminal connections corrode and lose connections too. And another thing, bluetooth has to work properly BEFORE the computer boots, or we lose all our pre-boot key commands, like option boot, T boot and holding the mouse button down to eject a stuck disk and so on. I remember bluetooth only working correctly AFTER the OS has booted to insure user security needs etc. I had to use a wired keyboard and mouse to perform pre-boot commands. Perhaps this is not a problem with EFI Mac's.

I also wonder if bluetooth working without the OS being loaded is going to be a security concern, intercepted during pairing or something. Got to figure day after day of booting nearly the exact time everyday would give a hacker the opportunity to sniff out the encryption/pairing sequence and set up a "man in the middle attack" grabbing keyboard strokes and passwords.

Those Electronic Warfare techs the military uses are pretty darn good, and more of them are on the streets everyday with their free $60,000 government paid training.

Apple should have at least allowed the option to allow people to connect their keyboard and mouse with a wire for emergencies and to do pre-boot commands, at least for security and privacy concerns. Wireless anything is confusing to new users. I can see a lot of problems appearing for a lot of folks if the pairing process is not seamless and nearly effortless.

As a example, I have two PS3's and 2 wireless controllers which occasionally have to be connected physically to diagnose problems. Often to recharge as usual. So with no way to resort back to a wired connection, this could cause problems for people.

Another thing is to be seen if is the Apple keyboard firmware exploit still works or has that issue been resolved. If you don't know, if your Mac gets hacked either locally or via a network, a root-kit can be placed in nearly any recent Mac keyboard firmware that will survive a hard drive wipe. Very nasty.

I should get a Magic Mouse and do a review, however it might only work correctly after the OS had loaded on my slightly older and glorious matte screen MacBook Pro.

I would get a 27" iMac, but have to wait for the 27" anti-glare film to make it's appearance first.

And I really don't like not being able to open my machine, especially removing the hard drive before the geeks at the Apple Store copy all my music.

Apple should have taken the route of a rechargeable battery inside the keyboard and mouse with a wire to recharge or use if the battery goes dead or a defunct battery ruins the mouse/keyboard connections. Just like the PS3 controllers, then if people have a problem, they can quickly rule out the mouse and or keyboard by simply wiring them up.

At least they still could use their computers if the battery fails.
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post #69 of 129
It certainly looks very sleek. I wonder how long the battery lasts? I once had an infrared wireless mouse many moons ago but got rid of it due to how quick it went through batteries.

I do think they missed an opportunity in not having "pinch to zoom" though. That would have been sweet.
post #70 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

How do you know APple's is any good? Did you eat one for dinner?

Err, because I've tried their track pad on their MacBookPro vs. the bad reviews and someone here mentioning that the Wacom Bamboo pad stinks?
post #71 of 129
Removed
post #72 of 129
I really really like this - iPhone style controls on a mac! Perrrfict combination
post #73 of 129
I know it is needed for a Desktops, but... do we really need the new MM for laptops as long as now even the new white MB's TP can do all that stuff, even more?!

And btw: it's D@M expensive for a mouse with not even one button!!!
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post #74 of 129
... Windows drivers? ;-)
post #75 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

In typical Apple fashion, the new Magic Mouse now only comes in one form: a wireless Bluetooth version. If you want a USB-attached version, the only option is the old Mighty Mouse, which has been renamed Apple Mouse to avoid conflict with another vendor's trademark claim on the former name.

And that's why I won't buy one. Sorry, Steve, but I don't want a battery-operated mouse. Batteries run out. Batteries are expensive. Charging rechargeables is an annoyance. I had wireless Mighty Mice and I got rid of them in favour of the wired.

Needs a re-think, alas.
post #76 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol View Post

Sorry but this mouse isn't supposed to replace mouses that act like keyboards.

Isn't the plural of mouse => mice ?
post #77 of 129
Is there Windows compatibility, since BootCamp is an option?
post #78 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by emoeric87 View Post

if there are now gestures, you will be able to completely rearrange (if you want to) your entire work style. There are third-party programs that allow you to any number of interesting, simple to contortionist-like gestures.

I think you're right, 3rd party software will allow you to have custom gestures. Apple probably couldn't do this in case people screwed up the mouse so badly that they couldn't use the mouse to do basic things.

The fact you can switch the top corners for right-click depending on being right- or left-handed means you should be able to assign both corners and one of them being middle-click. Middle-clicks on mice usually suck anyway because they are part of the scroll-wheel so they are to stiff or they move the wheel.

I could see some modifications that would make this mouse very good though. If you can for example place very light stickers on it to mark out hot-zones, you could turn it into a numpad or a 20 button mouse for gaming. Think of having the top edge of the mouse with a 5x2 sticky paper grid with holes to tap the mouse. You could assign 5 weapons and 5 plasmids in Bioshock. Then use the lower surface for firing. Swipe left and right can be strafe.

With the right software, this could very well be a great mouse.
post #79 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nothlit View Post

My biggest problem with the Mighty Mouse (and presumably this mouse) is that in order to right click, you have to lift your left finger off the left side of the mouse, otherwise it registers as a left click. In the Mighty Mouse (and presumably the Magic Mouse) there is only one physical button, and it uses the touch-sensitive surface to detect whether there is a finger is on the left side of the mouse (left click), both sides (also left click), or right side only (right click). Having to lift the left finger to right click is awkward and I found it to be uncomfortable after a while. If you watch the new Magic Mouse video on the Apple site, it clearly shows the guy lifting his left finger off the mouse before right clicking.

Also, I think the lack of a middle click is a dealbreaker. You don't need to be a gamer or graphic designer or anything fancy to appreciate a middle click -- I middle click all the time while browsing the web to open links in a new tab. Without a middle click, that means I have to use the keyboard to command-click on links, which is also awkward and unnecessary.

Sadly, Engadget's hands-on confirms having to lift the left finger to achieve right click. What a waste of a beautiful design.

Third click is superfluous i think, but the single-button-type behaviour is not for me. It's obviously not possible to have two separate physical sides and surface gestures - so you have to choose. Are gestures on a mouse a gimmick or are they actually useful?
post #80 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwfrederick View Post

am i the only one who thinks this mouse is amazing? ergonomic low profile.. aesthetically perfect.. simple intuitive gestures.. as is typical for mac, it doesnt try to do everything (no superfluous features), but what it does it does perfectly. this mouse epitomizes why i love apple products.

as usual there are whiners afraid of change, who lack vision, and who like to complain, but this is always the case, even with apple's best products. i think apple hit a home run with this one, and same goes for the rest of the products released today IMHO.

Amen.
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