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Apple to spend $4 million on Chicago subway station renovations - Page 2

post #41 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

SHUT UP.

oK -zipped it. :
post #42 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Dude, that's last years losers. What's his popularity right now? Has he accomplished anything yet? Here's a refresher course for you:

http://politicalhumor.about.com/gi/o..._n_308979.html

Oh, I get it. Didn't see that you were being sarcastic.
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post #43 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

And why can't the Chicago subway system renovate it's own station?

I happen to know this, since I live here, but a quick bit of searching would have told you that the CTA is facing a HUGE shortfall in its budget, requiring not only increased rates but also significant cuts in personnel and services.

In that climate, spending to renovate what is a perfectly serviceable, if quaintly run-down and dingy, station is not going to happen. Apple wants that station to look nice, so Apple's willing to pay for that. That sounds like a perfectly reasonable choice to me.

If Apple wanted that station to look nice, and thus pressured the CTA to renovate it for them, using taxpayer's scarce resources to do so, THAT would be, well, crappy.

I'd rather live in a world where more corporations followed Apple's lead here: Apple wants some improvement to a public infrastructure, so they work with public entities by providing funding to improve that public infrastructure, rather than pressuring public sector entities, to spend money how the corporation wants it to.

Quote:
I'm now paying for renovations to a Chicago subway station that I will never use.

Not if you feel so strongly about this, that you choose to stop giving money to Apple.

Under the vision you suggest, instead, every citizen of Illinois would be paying for Apple to have better advertising. Apple employs several hundred people in Illinois, so only a few hundred of us would have any payback for that expenditure.


Quote:
Chicago's failure isn't our problem and we shouldn't be paying for it through higher costs for our computers.

I think it's important to note that the existing North & Clybourn station is perfectly serviceable, works fine, nothing WRONG with it at all-- it's just not very pretty. So, there's no impetus right now to update it, using public money-- there's nothing that needs fixing. So, there's no "Chicago's failure" here: nothing's failed about that station, it's just not AS PRETTY as Apple would like it to be.
post #44 of 124
This is Chicago. The four million dollars will run out quickly and the project will go over budget by about eight million dollars. The "Windy City" has very greasy palms, so don't think for a minute that four million will go very far.
post #45 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by benice View Post

Holy crap, is that like a photo from the 70s or something? Developing country? Everyone keeps telling me things there can look run down, but pretty startling to see the shot.

Hats of to Apple for getting involved in a little bit of urban regeneration to enhance the area for everyone. It's a good thing.

Great point! Maybe Apple can open a store at LAX and spruce up the airport as part of the bargain. That place is a disgrace to a world class city like Los Angeles. Check out Zurich--now that's a 21st century class act airport.
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post #46 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber View Post

Last time I checked those people in the White House won. McCain and Palin were the losers. Elections have consequences. Run a candidate who wins next time and you can have bragging rights for at least four years. Until then, deal with it.


Those people in the White House won because those in Congress were effective at shifting the blame of the failed attempt of their socialized sub-prime housing onto the outgoing administration which didn't defend itself.

Yes Greenspan created the real estate bubble for speculation and economic improvement, but the sub-prime mess of Freddie and Fannie was the Congress's fault. Congress makes up 2/3 of the power of our government. So essentially when that 2/3 shifted parties, all hell broke loose.

Greenspan taking over the corrupt, highly over leveraged, government run mortgage buyers Freddie and Fannie is proof of that.

Real estate bubbles happen and collapse eventually, but taking the sub-prime and the economy down with it wasn't part of the plan.

Banks and lending institutions that practiced the three C's; Credit, Collateral and Character. Are doing fine today.


Anyway what does this have to do about the topic?, it's economy and that effects what is going on with Apple and people's spending habits.

Apple is opening lot of fancy stores, in high priced locations to a market that might be disappearing here shortly.

It might not be the end of Mac's, Apple could always start selling Mac's with Windows 7 instead of OS X.

It's got it's toe in the water with Bootcamp, taking the temperature. Just like OS X being able to run on Intel processors was planned years in advance.
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post #47 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

With the success of Windows 7 ...

I'm unable to find any sales figures, yet (yeah, it's only been four days)-- could you cite something indicating that Windows 7 is successfully selling?
post #48 of 124
Tripper, seriously between these two posts you have demonstrated the most amazing lack of cognitive ability outside of a studlytech rant. It was a two-post single-handed demonstration of a complete lack of grasp of corporate operations, marketing property management and selection, advertising and politics all wrapped up in nicely spaced blocks of complete misunderstanding - bravo!

Most corporations, (which indeed includes Apple) have people who scout future sites years ahead of announced intent. The money involved in accomplishing what they are doing is largely written off as operational costs and reflects an amount per device that devolves to .0000000X or further in terms of price impact. An amount you wouldn't even know to look for, let alone feel impact from.

Likewise your touting of "wealthy people" not using computers is completely specious, and wildly inaccurate - so much so that it seems more about stereotyping than reality. Unless your are an avid viewer of reality TV. Regarding Apple Stores filled with people looking not buying - did you even notice the quarterly report filed by Apple and discussed in the forum here? Obviously not.

And finally your premature assessment of the relative success of Windows 7 reflect a prescience that most here cannot claim. I need some lottery numbers and a couple horse race W/P/S calls from you if your accuracy is as good as you seem to think. Or perhaps not.

Windows 7 appears to be everything Vista should have been on first release - which for Microsoft, staggering under its first significant quarterly loss very much needs to slow the bleeding. However consumers are now on their guard and suspicious - because they are being thrown the same level of marketing they were given for Vista - and we all know how that turned out. Redmond needs to blitz Windows 7 is every major way possible to overcome consumer reticence stemming from Vista.

I commend your attempts as valuable for personal opinion, and worthless as a real analysis of the situation reported in the article.
post #49 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by benice View Post

Holy crap, is that like a photo from the 70s or something? Developing country? Everyone keeps telling me things there can look run down, but pretty startling to see the shot.

Hats of to Apple for getting involved in a little bit of urban regeneration to enhance the area for everyone. It's a good thing.

There are several really good photo collections of abandoned buildings with fantastic architecture in Detroit and Chicago you might be interested in.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rickhar...7620856257576/

http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com...scrapers/16195

and an amazing number of pictures and history here:

http://www.forgottendetroit.com/index.html


I really find it all very interesting and then after awhile it makes me depressed that people and corporations abandon things like this so willingly. I understand there are circumstances that often necessitate it , but it just makes me sad.
post #50 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

I'm now paying for renovations to a Chicago subway station that I will never use.

Chicago's failure isn't our problem and we shouldn't be paying for it through higher costs for our computers.

And to boot Apple has to still pay for advertising which it should be getting for free for the 4 million.

Well that's one less Apple product I will buy now to make up for it.

What goes around comes around.

"The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." - Margret Thatcher

Don't be ridiculous, you aren't paying for the renovations. How much do you think 4 million is to a company that makes several billion a year? It's incredibly insignificant, and works out as cents, if that, per Apple fanboy.

Secondly, you have to spend money to make money. Are you suggesting that Apple doesn't ever spend anything? Perhaps you'd like them to employ three people and have them work in the dark on G5s? Or maybe they should cut their marketing budget to zero and close their website because it most likely costs them 400,000 a year to run.

Thirdly, you quoted one of history's most hated politicians who was single-handedly responsible for putting millions of people out of work, and whose middle aged daughter makes a living out of appearing on reality tv shows.
post #51 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

And why can't the Chicago subway system renovate it's own station?

Why do socialists always capitalize on successful capitalists? Like leaches or something.

Raise the subway fee's a little, renovate the station and rent out space. Be self sustaining or at least make a little profit on it's own merits, not on the backs of companies who will just pass those costs onto guess who?

Where do you think the $$$ apple is paying is going to? Not only that, in the same post you get pissed that "they" should rent the space out to earn revenue but when Apple leases it (The company reportedly paid $700,000 per year to lease the lot ) you get pissed at that too. Like a lot of people, sounds like you want the moon, and when nobody can give it to you, you lash out at everybody. Try looking inward .... there's the problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

I'm now paying for renovations to a Chicago subway station that I will never use.

A lot of taxpayers never have a fire, never need to call police, don't have children but still see tax $$$ support policeman, fireman and schoolteachers. Do you hear them bitching about socialism? No ... Time to think about the big picture instead of me, me, me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

Also flashy areas are just places people go to forget how bad the economy is and think they are wealthy. The Apple Stores are filled with lots of people looking, but not buying. That's why the prices have been lowered recently.

Guess you didn't get the memo re: record sales & profits, huh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

"The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." - Margret Thatcher

And the problem with Capitalism is you never run out of other people's money! Think billions of $$ of bailouts going to bankers and wall street types to cover their asses and "mistakes"!

How's that Capitalism thing working out for you?
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post #52 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

I understand MS is renovating and renaming the adjacent men's room for their store.

post #53 of 124
I'm loving all the expert opinion on Chicago from people who don't actually live here. Willis Group moved into Sears Tower and requested naming rights and got it. Was that Socialist too?

As for the Chicago having a direct line to the White House and this somehow being connected to that...that is by far the most idiotic statement I have ever heard.
post #54 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

I'm just coming off of novocaine- was at the dentist this morning. PLease excuse me, your excellency.


Ah, that would explain post #21 ... get well soon, I like Teckstud much better that TeckDud.
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post #55 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKWalsh4 View Post

As for the Chicago having a direct line to the White House and this somehow being connected to that...that is by far the most idiotic statement I have ever heard.

Oh then why did Obama fly to Stokholm and plead for the Olympics for Chicago? Certainly you're not suggesting that he was secrectly meeting the Nobel committee a week before the announcement of his winning?
Also, most of his staff is Chicago local yocals. His interests lie not far from where the Acorn drops.
post #56 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

And why can't the Chicago subway system renovate it's own station?

Why do socialists always capitalize on successful capitalists? Like leaches or something.

Raise the subway fee's a little, renovate the station and rent out space. Be self sustaining or at least make a little profit on it's own merits, not on the backs of companies who will just pass those costs onto guess who?

US. Yes US.

I'm now paying for renovations to a Chicago subway station that I will never use.

Uh, Apple isn't the government. If you don't like their investments in real estate, don't buy their computers. This has nothing to do with socialism, silly. It's much more about privatization of a small part of a socially subsidized transportation system that is as vital to the functioning of any city as roads, most of which are not maintained by user fees.
post #57 of 124
Living just blocks from this site, a lot more progress has taken place than is pictured above. For those of you not familiar with this area, you should understand its history. Just within the last 10 years or so has this area become a retail corridor for the residents of Lincoln Park. It used to be just blocks from the infamous Cabrini Green housing development, and in the 1990's, the neighborhood began re-gentrifying as mixed income developments began to spring up. Apple is smart for wanting to renovate the current red line stop because traveling to the area via car, and parking especially, is a hassle. Promoting shoppers to take the el to their store is only helping the the environment and I wouldn't be surprised if Apple plays that card. As for the city taking care of the renovations, its by far one of the nicer stops in Chicago. I am a tax payer and I'd only expect Apple to take care of the costs. They're the one who've decided to build on that lot. I would have been more annoyed if they built further up the street and put up a parking ramp or garage, which probably would be in excess of $4 million. The city isn't forcing apple to do this, and I for one would be angry with the increased car traffic in the area. So I applaud Apple for taking the initiative to spend a small amount of its assets to improve the area's shopping experience for everyone.
post #58 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowereastside View Post

Considering that Chicago is a direct line to the White House, it wouldn't be surprising to find that Apple's investment here pays for more than just a subway stop.

I don't get it
post #59 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber View Post

Last time I checked those people in the White House won. McCain and Palin were the losers. Elections have consequences. Run a candidate who wins next time and you can have bragging rights for at least four years. Until then, deal with it.

Well said!
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post #60 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntercr View Post

There are several really good photo collections of abandoned buildings with fantastic architecture in Detroit and Chicago you might be interested in.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rickhar...7620856257576/

http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com...scrapers/16195

and an amazing number of pictures and history here:

http://www.forgottendetroit.com/index.html


I really find it all very interesting and then after awhile it makes me depressed that people and corporations abandon things like this so willingly. I understand there are circumstances that often necessitate it , but it just makes me sad.

Some brilliant stuff there. Had a look at all the sites and commentary and it's hard not to think it's important to have some of these great old buildings, and other important areas in the city maintained properly. Funding of civic infrastructure is always a challenge (and is the same all around the world), but whilst Apple's involvement and investment is welcome, as a community we should expect that the real leadership (though not necessarily all the the funding) has to come from the city and the people.
post #61 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKWalsh4 View Post

I'm loving all the expert opinion on Chicago from people who don't actually live here. Willis Group moved into Sears Tower and requested naming rights and got it. Was that Socialist too?

As for the Chicago having a direct line to the White House and this somehow being connected to that...that is by far the most idiotic statement I have ever heard.

There was a report last week stating that the city (taxpayers) is paying for upgrades to that building and that Daley's brother has space in Willis Tower. Business as usual in Chicago.
post #62 of 124
On a side note, I would be interested in reading a report on how well Apple cleaned the site up. I know it would have been regulated by Fed and State requirements, but did they go the extra mile? After all, Apple touts itself for being environmentally responsible.
post #63 of 124
"Well maintained", like everything government touches -- just more proof government mismanages money and the CTA is LONG overdue to be in private hands instead of government. Why subsidize unprofitable routes?! Tired of government welfare/theft!
post #64 of 124
Chicago's failure to properly manage their subways is not my problem with my purchases of Apple products.
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post #65 of 124
dp, sorry.
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post #66 of 124
"Next stop: hands down, the best shopping experience we've ever made."

"We're really proud of this next stop."

/PA system

Jimzip
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post #67 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowereastside View Post

Considering that Chicago is a direct line to the White House, it wouldn't be surprising to find that Apple's investment here pays for more than just a subway stop.

Utter nonsense.
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post #68 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

Chicago's failure to properly manage their subways is not my problem with my purchases of Apple products.

You're ridiculous on so many levels. Apple is doing this IN THEIR OWN CORPORATE INTEREST. IT IS AN INVESTMENT THEY BELIEVE WILL PAY OFF IN INCREASED REVENUE AND PROFITS. IF APPLE SELLS MORE, THEY CAN CHARGE LESS (if they want.)

You're right that the fact that public infrastructure is crumbling around our ears demands a sustainable solution in which we shouldn't have to depend on the whims of corporations to maintain it for us when it suits them, but this solution IS A FORM OF SOCIALISM.

Are we clear?
post #69 of 124
This news story has nothing to do with Obama. Lincoln Park is a yuppie area on the north side of town. Obama and his friends are from the south side of Chicago. These are completely different neighborhoods and therefore, a different set of aldermen and local business interests would be represented. Indeed, half of the renovation costs may be "administrative" costs associated with greasing a lot of neighborhood palms.

A bigger problem for businesses such as Apple: Chicago did not get the Olympics because of traffic and congestion issues. Let's safely assume that very few apartments and only some neighborhood condos have a $30,000 deeded parking space. How would you like to live in a Chicago apartment or condo and be forced to drive around the neighborhood for 20-30 minutes in order to find street parking. And if successful, you may have to park one or two streets from your residence and walk. Imagine a visitor to a local neighborhood trying to find a parking space.

Renovating a station for $4 million is a nice idea. That facility would allow Apple to install technologies that showcase their products. I would be far more impressed if Apple could spearhead a campaign for the installation of attractive, *inexpensive* above-ground parking garages throughout the entire neighborhood. Forget that stupid argument that people cannot pay for new Ipods and MacBook Pros in this economy. Even the guy on welfare quickly pays his cable TV bill before considering any other bills. The focus should be: Who can afford to spend $10+ an hour just to park in a garage and browse the retail stores for less than one hour. In contrast to Michigan avenue, which draws a lot of traffic from tourists from out of town and who are more inclined to pay $25 for a couple of hours, the Lincoln Park store would be frequented by locals - many of whom do not own a car.

Why would any "upscale" retail establishment want to open a store next to a run-down public building. Apple is doing the right thing in renovating the station and keeping the 1940's look. Remember: "Retro is cool." The pre-1950 architecture is one big reason why so many young people and empty-nesters from across the country are attracted to Chicago. Because a place to park in most Chicago neighborhoods is hard to find, convenience to public transportation for residents is critical.

As an aside, Apple *owns* the portable device market. Who cares about Windows 7 when desktop sales remain flat. I hope that it is only a matter of time before M$ gets pushed out of the server room. (I cannot wait. I absolutely detest Exchange).
post #70 of 124
CTA confirms - Advertising "Station Domination," for Apple, naming rights remain with CTA. http://chicagoist.com/2009/10/26/app...n_cta_deal.php
post #71 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by benice View Post

Holy crap, is that like a photo from the 70s or something? Developing country? Everyone keeps telling me things there can look run down, but pretty startling to see the shot.

Hats of to Apple for getting involved in a little bit of urban regeneration to enhance the area for everyone. It's a good thing.

No, that's not an optical illusion you see. That's just the state of America these days, especially of the Chicago Transit Authority, which US regulators said had the worst conditions they'd seen on any US subway system after they investigated a serious fire during rush hour on the Blue Line a few years ago (only a VERY capable CTA driver prevented fatalities; he led the passengers out of the tunnel in thick smoke through a manhole cover he knew about that the CTA had failed to mark from the tunnel).

The $4 million should be comfortably enough to renovate the station headhouse and the site. New roof, windows, doors and completely gut and rehabilitate the building. Architecturally, it's worth it. This building is unique in the Chicago system -- it's the only above-ground headhouse for a CTA subway station. All the others, you go down a flight of stairs from the sidewalk before you reach the ticketing area. So this is more of a London kind of building than a Chicago one.

However, that amount of money won't do very much for the underground part of the station, where the CTA needs elevators, escalators, tunnel liners, new lighting, new platforms, etc. etc. in order to bring the station up to modern standards and clean it up. We might see some new signage and platform surfacing but you're certainly not going to see things like elevators for that price.
post #72 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

And why can't the Chicago subway system renovate it's own station?

Why do socialists always capitalize on successful capitalists? Like leaches or something.

Raise the subway fee's a little, renovate the station and rent out space. Be self sustaining or at least make a little profit on it's own merits, not on the backs of companies who will just pass those costs onto guess who?

Chicago's failure isn't our problem and we shouldn't be paying for it through higher costs for our computers.

And to boot Apple has to still pay for advertising which it should be getting for free for the 4 million. Well that's one less Apple product I will buy now to make up for it. What goes around comes around.

Also flashy areas are just places people go to forget how bad the economy is and think they are wealthy. The Apple Stores are filled with lots of people looking, but not buying. That's why the prices have been lowered recently.

The real wealthy types don't need or bother with computers (with their headaches and all) and there are not enough of them spending enough to make it worthwhile catering to their small market. If they use one it's only one computer just like most everyone else.

"The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money." - Margret Thatcher

1) Simple errors: It's Margaret, not Margret Thatcher; the possessive is "its", not "it's" (a contraction of "It is"); the plural of "fee" is "fees", not "fee's"; and the blood-sucking creature is a leech, not a leach.

2) Errors in logic: Margaret Thatcher is quite right. That is why the CTA is to be lauded for assembling a deal that simultaneously furthers its goals while affording companies opportunities they feel are worth their investment. Instead of simply sucking more money directly from city, state, and U.S. taxpayers to renovate the station in question, the CTA has found a company in Apple which believes that it is worth the money to make the approaches to its store match the quality image it projects.

There is no indication that there was anything coercive about convincing Apple to enter into this agreement, and so it could hardly be categorized as "on the backs" of companies. It's not a television commercial, true, but it's still advertising, plain and simple.

Further, with a projected $178 million deficit, the suggestion that increased rider fees, restructured service, and other fiscal measures are not imminent seems a little ... let's say naive. In short, if Apple -- or any other company -- decides its private or shareholder equity is wisely spent on such a deal, it's a win-win scenario.

Apple's recent fourth fiscal quarter results belie your assertion that Apple's retail stores are designed to delude the gullible masses into ignoring their financial hardship. It would seem instead that quite a few people have concluded that Apple's products are of high quality and reliability, and that they are in fact an excellent investment in difficult times.

Since I am not a medical professional, I am not qualified to address the underlying resentment you display toward the affluent.
post #73 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amorph View Post

A gas station? They're going to have to spend a lot more money digging up the tanks and cleaning the site up.

I can't really argue with the choice of location, though. Every penny they spend is worth it for that address.

The building's foundation is in and the frame is up. Construction on the project is well underway.
post #74 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Oh then why did Obama fly to Stokholm and plead for the Olympics for Chicago? Certainly you're not suggesting that he was secrectly meeting the Nobel committee a week before the announcement of his winning?
Also, most of his staff is Chicago local yocals. His interests lie not far from where the Acorn drops.


Did Rush tell you this?
post #75 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by themightyviking View Post

There was a report last week stating that the city (taxpayers) is paying for upgrades to that building and that Daley's brother has space in Willis Tower. Business as usual in Chicago.

I'm not saying Chicago isn't corrupt. Just that Apple getting the naming rights somehow is being Socialist is nuts. And this in any way being tied to the White House is nuts. Oh, and what you said had nothing to do with Willis getting the naming rights.
post #76 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by newbee View Post

The problem with Capitalism is you never run out of other people's money! Think billions of $$ of bailouts going to bankers and wall street types to cover their asses and "mistakes"!

How's that Capitalism thing working out for you?

Hard to tell: Spending and putting at risk hundreds of billions of public dollars to prop up companies which, thanks their managements' poor choices, would otherwise have failed is hardly capitalism. Sounds more like 1970s Communist Eastern Europe. How did those policies work out for them?
post #77 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKWalsh4 View Post

Did Rush tell you this?

Who's Rush?
post #78 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Who's Rush?

Your Lord and Savior, didn't you know? All that you believe has been passed down by him.
post #79 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntercr View Post

There are several really good photo collections of abandoned buildings with fantastic architecture in Detroit and Chicago you might be interested in.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rickhar...7620856257576/

http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com...scrapers/16195

and an amazing number of pictures and history here:

http://www.forgottendetroit.com/index.html


I really find it all very interesting and then after awhile it makes me depressed that people and corporations abandon things like this so willingly. I understand there are circumstances that often necessitate it , but it just makes me sad.

Thank you for sharing!
post #80 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

And why can't the Chicago subway system renovate it's own station?

Why do socialists always capitalize on successful capitalists? Like leaches or something.

Raise the subway fee's a little, renovate the station and rent out space. Be self sustaining or at least make a little profit on it's own merits, not on the backs of companies who will just pass those costs onto guess who?

US. Yes US.

I'm now paying for renovations to a Chicago subway station that I will never use.


r

Your name is very fitting.. although MacCrackhead would have been more appropriate.
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