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Apple begins shipping quad-core 27-inch iMac models - Page 3

post #81 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnmcboston View Post

Woo-hoo. Christmas for me :-) Now let's get some speed benchmarks to see if the i5/7 are worth the price before I shop for myself

Trust me, they will be.
post #82 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

I'm not giving anyone who likes glossy screens any grief. It's not like I'm campaigning to remove glossy in favor of matte.

WHATEVER! The point is you've high-jacked another thread! It is absolutely nauseating to read this same crap everywhere over and over again. I just want to read about people with shipping news here. Find the right thread and stay there if this is all you want to discuss! I'VE HEARD IT ALL. I GET IT!

THIS THREAD IS:
" Apple begins shipping quad-core 27-inch iMac models"

Come on! Please!
post #83 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Beatty View Post

I'm waiting for somebody to try hooking up a PS3 or dedicated Blu-ray player to the video INPUT of one of these. I'm guessing the display will show a 1920*1080 image with big black bars on the top, bottom, and sides. Or perhaps the screen has image scaling built-in and will stretch the image full-screen 2560*1440? Do any Blu-ray drives upscale to 2560*1440 because I'm dam near positive the PS3 doesn't. Am I missing something?

I'd be strongly tempted to get one of these 27" iMacs if I can hook up a PS3 (scaled to 2560*1440) or at least a Blu-ray player (scaled to 2560*1440).


If anyone does it, it will be done with a illegal HDMI chip for the HD resolution. The downgraded SD will work fine of course.

It's because for HDMI an especially HDCP to work, it has to "talk" to a chip in a HDMI compliant device first.

In order to produce a HDMI chip, you need a license. To get a license you need to pay fee's, royalties etc and adhere to rules.

Those rules dictate which devices the HDMI signal can be on and computers that are not HDMI compliant are off the approved list.

Mac's don't have HDMI, thus they can't display the HD content from a HDMI source and they don't have BlueRay either.


"Blueray is just a bag of hurt" says the big Steve, it's most likely the HDCP/HDMI compliance (and their control) that's the bag of hurt.

We could get BlueRay disk reading/burning, but no movies. Kind of half assed since everyone would be expecting their movies to play too.

And the rather large storage capacities of BlueRay puts it clearly in the professional category, a third party option most likely.


Why I say BlueRay isn't coming to Mac's in favor of cheaper and even higher capacity SDXC cards. One day the movie industry will realize they can sell a lot of content to Mac (and PC) owners with SD card slots.

This is where I see things going. Mechanical is going out.
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post #84 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Its a good thing your waiting. Ive read more than few comments about the DP in not working with video cards from machines that have DP out. Apple would be remiss to have this feature only with with their machines with DP. Id wager its not their intention, but a technical issue, hopefully resolved with a driver update.

I agree. My MBP and Dell 2407 are both DVI. Monoprice sells a MDP to DVI cable but it's wiser to wait. Sweet machine, though!
post #85 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by pocotequila View Post

WHATEVER! The point is you've high-jacked another thread! It is absolutely nauseating to read this same crap everywhere over and over again. I just want to read about people with shipping news here. Find the right thread and stay there if this is all you want to discuss! I'VE HEARD IT ALL. I GET IT!

THIS THREAD IS:
" Apple begins shipping quad-core 27-inch iMac models"

Come on! Please!

But they are glossy only.
post #86 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

If anyone does it, it will be done with a illegal HDMI chip for the HD resolution. The downgraded SD will work fine of course.

It's because for HDMI an especially HDCP to work, it has to "talk" to a chip in a HDMI compliant device first.

In order to produce a HDMI chip, you need a license. To get a license you need to pay fee's, royalties etc and adhere to rules.

Those rules dictate which devices the HDMI signal can be on and computers that are not HDMI compliant are off the approved list.

Mac's don't have HDMI, thus they can't display the HD content from a HDMI source and they don't have BlueRay either.


"Blueray is just a bag of hurt" says the big Steve, it's most likely the HDCP/HDMI compliance that's the bag of hurt.

We could get BlueRay disk reading/burning, but no movies. Kind of half assed since everyone would be expecting their movies to play too.

Bummer. Would have been cool to have this as a living room TV/MAC combo type thing. More or less. Razor sharp Blu-ray movies will be in my living room for Xmas one way or another. Though maybe it's for the best I spend the money on a 52" 1080P HDTV.
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post #87 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Beatty View Post

Bummer. Would have been cool to have this as a living room TV/MAC combo type thing. More or less. Razor sharp Blu-ray movies will be in my living room for Xmas one way or another. Though maybe it's for the best I spend the money on a 52" 1080P HDTV.

That's sounds amazing. Anything less than blu-ray on that is totally unacceptable. And now for $350 you get wireless blu-ray with blu-ray live, internet rentals, youtube ,and flickr.

I too would have sprung if it had blu. I will wait- it's bound to happen. I refuse to be manipulated by the dangling carrot.
post #88 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by pocotequila View Post

WHATEVER! The point is you've high-jacked another thread! It is absolutely nauseating to read this same crap everywhere over and over again. I just want to read about people with shipping news here. Find the right thread and stay there if this is all you want to discuss! I'VE HEARD IT ALL. I GET IT!

THIS THREAD IS:
" Apple begins shipping quad-core 27-inch iMac models"

Come on! Please!



You want us to discuss only what you want to read? I've hijacked nothing, you only perceive that because you want too.


I read the off topic ramblings of others, flame wars, politics, religion and so on and it doesn't bother me, why?


"If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself but to your own estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment." - Marcus Aurelius
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post #89 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Beatty View Post

Bummer. Would have been cool to have this as a living room TV/MAC combo type thing. More or less. Razor sharp Blu-ray movies will be in my living room for Xmas one way or another. Though maybe it's for the best I spend the money on a 52" 1080P HDTV.

SO IF ITS NOT THE "MATTE" CULT its THE BLU-RAY CULT! - THERE IS NOT A SAFE THREAD OUT THERE! YOU GUYS WIN - I'VE GOT BETTER THINGS TO DO!



ADIOS!
post #90 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

"If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself but to your own estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment." - Marcus Aurelius

So, as Marcus would tell you, just suck it up and deal with the gloss.
post #91 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

So, as Marcus would tell you, just suck it up and deal with the gloss.

LMFASSOFF

Walked into that one did I.
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post #92 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by pocotequila View Post

SO IF ITS NOT THE "MATTE" CULT its THE BLU-RAY CULT! - THERE IS NOT A SAFE THREAD OUT THERE! YOU GUYS WIN - I'VE GOT BETTER THINGS TO DO!



ADIOS!


Yes, you have issues. Perhaps a anger management course is in order.

Some nice meditation, chi tea, a enema?

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post #93 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

LMFASSOFF

Walked into that one did I.

I mean what does that guy want us to talk about -how fast UPS can make the shipments? Will Santa's sleigh get there on time?
post #94 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Beatty View Post

Bummer. Would have been cool to have this as a living room TV/MAC combo type thing. More or less. Razor sharp Blu-ray movies will be in my living room for Xmas one way or another. Though maybe it's for the best I spend the money on a 52" 1080P HDTV.


I would go with the new PS3 Slim or whatever it's called. Should get a included BluRay drive with that to watch content. (no burning though)

Plus the PS3 games are pretty good and Netflix is going to be able to stream to PS3's in a few months too. So for about $8 a month you can watch 12,000 or so movies anytime you want.

Apple is pushing it's own iTMS universe, which has it's limitations because Steve is on the board of Disney and their studios, nobody likes a monopoly, even content creators like Sony. (BluRay origin) Although the introduction of SD ports on Mac's does open the door for anyone to use.
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post #95 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

I mean what does that guy want us to talk about -how fast UPS can make the shipments? Will Santa's sleigh get there on time?


Guess he hijacked the thread now huh?
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post #96 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

Also you might want to wait until the 27" anti-glare films are available from third party sources, the reflections may murder your eyes.

or they may not. 2+ years of 50 hours per week on a glossy 24" iMac, no problems here. People should have a look for themselves before they take too much heed of the matte-brigade's alarmism.
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post #97 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by elroth View Post

How much time do you spend thinking about these fantasy scenarios? "It might be worthwhile to note..." - the only thing to note is you are speculating from somewhere in your mind. Please don't state things like they are facts when they are your fabrications.

Well I do have experience.

The jury will be in with a verdict when the benchmarks arrive.

Then you'll see I was right.
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post #98 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by sennen View Post

or they may not. 2+ years of 50 hours per week on a glossy 24" iMac, no problems here. People should have a look for themselves before they take too much heed of the matte-brigade's alarmism.

I didn't have problems at first with glossy CRT's back it the days neither, the problems showed up later with eyestrain, headaches and vision loss with continued use. (muscle fatigue)

Sort of like listening to loud music over the years, it eventually ruins your hearing.


People should be made aware if they have problems with glossy displays, either physical or just can't find a glare free location. They can get a anti-glare film and that they should find a source ahead of time for a 27" size to fit their new 27" iMac so they suffer the least.

The 27" iMac is a new machine and a new screen size, it might take a bit before third party sources come up with it.

Also each person's glare tolerance and their environment is different from others, be your own judge, But know there is a option and ask Apple to make changes if you have a problem with their displays.

I suggest Apple apply the films and advertise the fact so as to reduce returns and unhappy users.
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post #99 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You're making the mistake of forgetting what the 10.6 upgrade was all about. It WASN'T about making wide ranging feature upgrades to consumers. Those wide ranging feature upgrades were made for developers this time around. The streamlined OS is also a major feature upgrade, but you don't notice it as much.

What major upgrades did MS make for Win 7? I don't see any. Minor upgrades yes, such as what you've mentioned.

You also notice that Apple is charging a pittance for the upgrade, while MS is still charging full price for their too many versions, with overpriced consumer versions. Even their copying Apple with a family pack pricing is much higher than Apple's. And that $29 student pack upgrade doesn't seem to be working.

When 10.7 comes out, no doubt Apple will add all the features and consumer aware upgrades they held back from offering this time, as well as others made possible by what they DID do this time. And even at full price again, it will still cost much less than MS charges.

My brother, who attends SUNY, just upgraded to Win7 for $29 through the school. So by all accounts, the student pricing does seem to be working. And what is so difficult about 3 versions? The installation method is largely irrelevant, IMO. Are people that incapable of figuring out what version suits them best?
post #100 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Dim the sun with a window covering when you use the computer. I don't see what the problem is with this. No matter how high you set the brightness and contrast on your display, you're going to get a washed out image, more so with a matte screen than with a glossy one. All the high quality graphics monitor manufacturers sell, or include a monitor shield for this purpose, though they do say to use the monitor in a room with subdued light, with no light reflecting onto the screen. This is for matte monitors. It's the same for glossy models.

I spend enough time in Florida to know how much light you get, and how easy it is to subdue it. It's no excuse.

I just don't understand you guys.

I have a different problem, Mel. The backs of my monitors are facing a wall of glass sliding doors, so there is no reflection on my the monitors. However, even with dark vertical blinds, the light is so strong that it is constantly in my eyes. I wear a baseball cap with a visor to shield my eyes somewhat. I just bought a tarp that I'll use to cover the glass doors but haven't put it up yet. I hope that works.

I don't know what kind of shades, drapes, etc. will keep out the sun from the south.
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post #101 of 223
Well, my order was placed less than an hour after the one shown, and my 2.8 GHz i7 has not yet shipped. C'mon guys! I check my email several times a day, and this is no way for someone in his late 50s to act! \
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post #102 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

blah blah blah .... "If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself but to your own estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment." - Marcus Aurelius

Is that the guy from that Gladiator movie with Russell Crowe? Managing pain would be a good thing when you have a big spiky chain ball up your rear.
post #103 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by pocotequila View Post

WHATEVER! The point is you've high-jacked another thread! It is absolutely nauseating to read this same crap everywhere over and over again. I just want to read about people with shipping news here. Find the right thread and stay there if this is all you want to discuss! I'VE HEARD IT ALL. I GET IT!

THIS THREAD IS:
" Apple begins shipping quad-core 27-inch iMac models"

Come on! Please!

Although hopefully not as distressed as this bloke I didn't have much expectations for this thread. Especially with Teckstud around. Glossy, no BluRay, Apple sucks, too much heat, too thin, too slow, too expensive, never shipping, too Mac, who knows what else. It's getting old. No offense personally Mr. Stud, but really, you're one of the definite reasons I just skim through AppleInsider comments nowadays, and mainly read just the articles. It's thread rape, that's what it is.
post #104 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

... I refuse to be manipulated by the dangling carrot.

Then stop hanging around the forums licking the carrot and then telling everyone it tastes funny.
post #105 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by gabberattack View Post

How do you deal with glare?

It's easy if you ignore the Internet wingnuts who have never owned a glossy display
post #106 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by pocotequila View Post

Seriously, You matte people are like a religious cult! You pop up in every thread. This thread is about the quad cores shipping and yet, like so many others you've high-jacked, has degraded to pointless banter about your obvious agenda. Give it a rest! Or at least stay on topic!

Ya know, the ignore feature works perfectly as long as people don't quote the wingnuts.

So if you have to quote them, please keep it to a minimum.....
post #107 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You're making the mistake of forgetting what the 10.6 upgrade was all about. It WASN'T about making wide ranging feature upgrades to consumers. Those wide ranging feature upgrades were made for developers this time around. The streamlined OS is also a major feature upgrade, but you don't notice it as much.

What major upgrades did MS make for Win 7? I don't see any. Minor upgrades yes, such as what you've mentioned.

You also notice that Apple is charging a pittance for the upgrade, while MS is still charging full price for their too many versions, with overpriced consumer versions. Even their copy Apple with a family pack pricing is much higher than Apple's. And that $29 student pack upgrade doesn't seem to be working.

When 10.7 comes out, no doubt Apple will add all the features and consumer aware upgrades they held back from offering this time, as well as others made possible by what they DID do this time. And even at full price again, it will still cost much less than MS charges.

I know 10.6 wasn't about major consumer features, but I was saying they shouldn't have done that, because MS is not standing still. Drop-down menus with columns of text entries have been around since the very first GUIs, I don't think it's a minor thing to get rid of that. I think it was very brave of Microsoft.

But yes, it is good that Apple are charging such a low price. Hopefully it will encourage adoption which will in turn encourage developers to use the new frameworks. Of course Mac developers are pretty good at that sort of thing anyway.

Don't get me wrong, I would never go back to Windows, I just thought GUI was one of Apple's specialties, and it seems MS is now the one innovating in this area while Apple is focussing of programmer frameworks. Or at least - Apple's GUI innovation has shifted to touch screen.
post #108 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

Ya know, the ignore feature works perfectly as long as people don't quote the wingnuts.

Point Taken!

I recently saw this practice referred to with the cliché of "Don't Feed The Troll".

I get it now and realize this is all my post(s) accomplished.

I fed the Trolls. As a Forum newbie please consider it a rookie mistake. My apologies!
post #109 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

If anyone does it, it will be done with a illegal HDMI chip for the HD resolution. The downgraded SD will work fine of course.

It's because for HDMI an especially HDCP to work, it has to "talk" to a chip in a HDMI compliant device first.

In order to produce a HDMI chip, you need a license. To get a license you need to pay fee's, royalties etc and adhere to rules.

Those rules dictate which devices the HDMI signal can be on and computers that are not HDMI compliant are off the approved list.

Mac's don't have HDMI, thus they can't display the HD content from a HDMI source and they don't have BlueRay either.


"Blueray is just a bag of hurt" says the big Steve, it's most likely the HDCP/HDMI compliance (and their control) that's the bag of hurt.

We could get BlueRay disk reading/burning, but no movies. Kind of half assed since everyone would be expecting their movies to play too.

And the rather large storage capacities of BlueRay puts it clearly in the professional category, a third party option most likely.


Why I say BlueRay isn't coming to Mac's in favor of cheaper and even higher capacity SDXC cards. One day the movie industry will realize they can sell a lot of content to Mac (and PC) owners with SD card slots.

This is where I see things going. Mechanical is going out.

Good news!
All ATI HD 3XXX series, 4XXX series (which these Macs use), and 5XXX series have HDMI and HDCP built in by DEFAULT.

It's just part of the silicon design, Apple couldn't remove it if they wanted.

I built and am running two HDPCs using the older ATI HD 3870 cards for a couple of years now, and both play both BluRay and HD-DVD (now defunct format) great.

Since the "TV" in this case is the built in 27" screen, that should work, too.

The best way to really verify what is possible will be when someone sticks in one of those new BD drives and see what happens with Windows 7 in bootcamp, add a BD player software (like Power DVD) and trys to watch a movie.

I bet it would work.

Now returning to this thread - and still waiting for my i7 to ship, or at least notify of when!
post #110 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Yes I do - a proud owner of Discus. It actually sits adjacent to my iMac work station so I know what glare off a glass looks like.

I have four.
post #111 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Beatty View Post

Bummer. Would have been cool to have this as a living room TV/MAC combo type thing. More or less. Razor sharp Blu-ray movies will be in my living room for Xmas one way or another. Though maybe it's for the best I spend the money on a 52" 1080P HDTV.

We don't know if what he's said is correct though. Right now, there aren't any adapters. That doesn't mean that there won't, or can't be. It's too new.
post #112 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

I would go with the new PS3 Slim or whatever it's called. Should get a included BluRay drive with that to watch content. (no burning though)

Plus the PS3 games are pretty good and Netflix is going to be able to stream to PS3's in a few months too. So for about $8 a month you can watch 12,000 or so movies anytime you want.

Apple is pushing it's own iTMS universe, which has it's limitations because Steve is on the board of Disney and their studios, nobody likes a monopoly, even content creators like Sony. (BluRay origin) Although the introduction of SD ports on Mac's does open the door for anyone to use.

I don't know that's the case. Disney is the most popular DVD seller out there. If Apple and Disney can work this out, and it's successful, then others would follow.

I see it as an asset, not a limitation.
post #113 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by iReality85 View Post

My brother, who attends SUNY, just upgraded to Win7 for $29 through the school. So by all accounts, the student pricing does seem to be working. And what is so difficult about 3 versions? The installation method is largely irrelevant, IMO. Are people that incapable of figuring out what version suits them best?

What's not working is that many people buying that upgrade are finding that it doesn't work. They do the upgrade, and the machine flatlines.

http://techblips.dailyradar.com/stor...t-working-for/
post #114 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by sequitur View Post

I have a different problem, Mel. The backs of my monitors are facing a wall of glass sliding doors, so there is no reflection on my the monitors. However, even with dark vertical blinds, the light is so strong that it is constantly in my eyes. I wear a baseball cap with a visor to shield my eyes somewhat. I just bought a tarp that I'll use to cover the glass doors but haven't put it up yet. I hope that works.

I don't know what kind of shades, drapes, etc. will keep out the sun from the south.

All it needs to do is to dim the sun enough so that it isn't overpowering the monitor image, and eliminates the direct rays from impinging upon the screen.

In your case, staring into a bright background, you need to do what you're doing, and dim that light so that it's no brighter than the screen, or about the same, within a stop (half or double). That should be enough.

Having that bright light in your eyes will definitely lead to problems.

That's one thing some people here don't understand. Most monitors are set way too bright from the factory, and THAT, in addition to the very high white setting, usually around 9,300k, are what's leading to eyestrain.
post #115 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I know 10.6 wasn't about major consumer features, but I was saying they shouldn't have done that, because MS is not standing still. Drop-down menus with columns of text entries have been around since the very first GUIs, I don't think it's a minor thing to get rid of that. I think it was very brave of Microsoft.

But yes, it is good that Apple are charging such a low price. Hopefully it will encourage adoption which will in turn encourage developers to use the new frameworks. Of course Mac developers are pretty good at that sort of thing anyway.

Don't get me wrong, I would never go back to Windows, I just thought GUI was one of Apple's specialties, and it seems MS is now the one innovating in this area while Apple is focussing of programmer frameworks. Or at least - Apple's GUI innovation has shifted to touch screen.

Both Apple, with Copeland, and MS with Longhorn learned that you can't do everything at once. Something has to go.

You can't rework the internals in a major way, and add major new areas to the OS, while at the same time, overhauling major GUI features. It just can't be done. The GUI features will have to be based on the new internals. How can a company do both at once? It's impossible1 They would have to wait until the internal makeover was almost complete before doing any serious work on the feature set, and how much more time would that add to the wait? Another year? Two more years?

Apple did the right thing. They broke it down into two parts. 10.6 was the factory overhaul of the OS, and 10.7 will be the pimping out of the externals.

Win 7 meanwhile, as Ballmer himself said, is just "Vista done right". Nothing to brag about there. It's what they should have had over two years ago with their sweating and pushing out of Vista after a five year pregnancy, once aborted.

Now, we're reading that Win 7 might be the last major Windows upgrade, and that they have learned their lesson. From now on, the thinking goes, they will copy Apple's formula of making smaller upgrades, and more of them. We'll see. But Windows is also in terrible shape internally, which is why Longhorn was worked on. So maybe, Win 8 will see few features, and an internal reworking. But then, Win 7 saw few new features, so who knows?

But the OS is getting pretty creaky, and this is said by those who follow it. They may have problems adding much more to it as it is.
post #116 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

But [Windows] is getting pretty creaky, and this is said by those who follow it. They may have problems adding much more to it as it is.

This is actually a major problem for Microsoft. First, it would take years to develop a new core OS, and they would almost certainly have to go with some flavor of BSD, like Apple has done, since it would take even longer to develop something from scratch, with the danger that it turn out like Copeland, and Linux and the GPL are completely out of the question. (Wouldn't it be ironic if they went with Darwin.)

But, to do this, they have to break compatibility with existing software, a problem they can mitigate somewhat with something like the Classic environment, which would handle a lot of people's needs for running shrink-wrapped software, but might meet a lot of resistance from the enterprise crowd. Yet, to really modernize the system, they also need to revamp their APIs as well, and just looking at the resistance of some developers to moving from Carbon to Cocoa, that's also likely to be problematic.

The other option is just to develop a new OS and forget about compatibility, let people use virtualization software to run Old Windows, and gradually phase it out. But, this has a high risk of generating defections to other platforms.

It's something they are going to need to do eventually, it would have been better if they did it much earlier, and it's going to be a very painful experience for them.
post #117 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

This is actually a major problem for Microsoft. First, it would take years to develop a new core OS, and they would almost certainly have to go with some flavor of BSD, like Apple has done, since it would take even longer to develop something from scratch, with the danger that it turn out like Copeland, and Linux and the GPL are completely out of the question. (Wouldn't it be ironic if they went with Darwin.)

But, to do this, they have to break compatibility with existing software, a problem they can mitigate somewhat with something like the Classic environment, which would handle a lot of people's needs for running shrink-wrapped software, but might meet a lot of resistance from the enterprise crowd. Yet, to really modernize the system, they also need to revamp their APIs as well, and just looking at the resistance of some developers to moving from Carbon to Cocoa, that's also likely to be problematic.

The other option is just to develop a new OS and forget about compatibility, let people use virtualization software to run Old Windows, and gradually phase it out. But, this has a high risk of generating defections to other platforms.

It's something they are going to need to do eventually, it would have been better if they did it much earlier, and it's going to be a very painful experience for them.

Those are the problems. It's what they tried to do with Longhorn. But they had to cut so much out of it that they just dropped it and went to Server 2003 as their code base for Vista. They then bolted things on to that, which is not the best way to do it.

MS has a problem because Windows was never intended as a networking OS. Many of their problems derive from that, and the fact that they were never concerned with security. So they have things like Active X and Windows message passing that do no security checking.

They can't even fix that, because they pushed both as ways for software to collaborate easily. To fix it now would obsolete much software, and would complicate matters for users.

If they did what Apple did with NEXT, they would just screw themselves into the ground. The main reason why Windows is so dominant in business and government isn't because they like using it, but because their systems are so dependent of software written to it. Software that would cost tens of billions to re write.

If MS went to a new, non compatible OS, the defections would kill them. No one would have a reason to stay.

They have an XP compatibility window now. It seems strange that they would even need that, as it's just an older version of the same basic system. Win 7 isn't completely backwards compatible. This is why there is such a major headache upgrading from XP to 7. You need a $50 program from a third party to fix that. Why MS couldn't (or wouldn't) do it is odd, as most people upgrading to 7 will be doing so from XP. I guess MS is trying to force them to buy new hardware.

This is MUCH worse than what Apple does.
post #118 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I have four.

Cool- I have 2 and a pleco.
post #119 of 223
for what it's worth i ordered mine on Nov 3rd. order status shows "Ships in November". When i called the customer service number, i was told that the most likely shipping date is between Nov 28-30. Very annoying!
post #120 of 223
I also ordered my i7, and no shipping yet... I'm wondering if the extended wait could be because of both production processes and higher than expected demand... Judging only from the number of people on this forum I'd say they must have quite the back log.
Wonder how many i5+i7 they'll sell for Xmas... damn
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